Gladiator redux [Archive] - Wizards Community

Gladiator redux [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Banndon
08-19-06, 05:41 PM Hello everyone,

I'm back too get some feedback on an old thread (For a reforged gladiator).
We came up with a pretty decent alternative to the current gladiator.

Unfortunetly we didn't have the chance to playtest it. Our DM is always busy or making excuses....
(*poke to Grummore* :chicken: :D )

Please remember that the main idea is to represent a blood sport professionnal, not the ultimate warrior. The best fighting class is and should always be the fighter.

Special thanks to Kelsen for his wonderful ideas! :bow: :)

Gladiator
Hit Die: d10

Class Skills
The gladiator's class skills are Balance (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Craft (Int), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (local) (Int), Perform (Cha), Sense Motive (Wis) and Tumble (Dex).
Skill points at 1st level: (2 + Int modifier) x4
Skill points at each additionnal level: 2 + Int modifier

The Gladiator
Lvl BAB Fort Ref Will Special
1 +1 +2 +0 +0 Unarmed Strike
2 +2 +3 +0 +0 Improvised Weaponery
3 +3 +3 +1 +1 Combat Style
4 +4 +4 +1 +1 Mercy, Winning the Crowd (Supporters in the crowd)
5 +5 +4 +1 +1 Uncanny dodge, Armor Optimization +1
6 +6/+1 +5 +2 +2 Wounding, Mercy
7 +7/+2 +5 +2 +2 Improved Combat Style
8 +8/+3 +6 +2 +2 Booo!
9 +9/+4 +6 +3 +3 Personnal Style
10 +10/+5 +7 +3 +3 Armor Optimization +2
11 +11/+6/+1 +7 +3 +3 Superior Combat Style
12 +12/+7/+2 +8 +4 +4 Improved Uncanny dodge, The Favorite
13 +13/+8/+3 +8 +4 +4 Improved Wounding
14 +14/+9/+4 +9 +4 +4 Parry
15 +15/+10/+5 +9 +5 +5 Armor Optimization +3, Eternal Glory
16 +16/+11/+6/+1 +10 +5 +5 Combat Style Mastery
17 +17/+12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +5 Greater Wounding
18 +18/+13/+8/+3 +11 +6 +6 Improved Parry
19 +19/+14/+9/+4 +11 +6 +6 Bringing the House Down!
20 +20/+15/+10/+5 +12 +6 +6 Armor Optimization +4

Class Features
All the following are class features of the gladiator.

Weapons and Armor Proficiency: Gladiators are proficient with all simple weapons, marital weapons, and one exotic weapon of their choice. They are proficient with light and medium armor, and all shields except for tower shields.

Unarmed Combat: gains the Improved Unarmed Strike feat with no off-hand penalty. (same as the current DS3.5 rules)

Improvised Weaponery: A gladiator has to deal with the equipment he is given. At 3rd level the gladiator suffers only a –2 penalty (instead of a –4) to hit with improvised or unfamiliar weapons (for example exotic weapons).

Combat Style: When reaching the 3rd level a gladiator selects one of four combat styles: feints, wrestling, two weapon fighting or no mercy. This choice is permenent. When gaining the benefits of a feat, he does not require to qualify for prerequesites.
feints: gains the benefits of the Improved Feint feat.
wrestling: gains the benefits of the Improved Grapple feat.
two weapon fighting: gains the benefits of the Two Weapon Fighting feat.
no mercy: gains the benefits of the Cleave feat.

Improved Combat Style: At 7th level, a gladiator improves his chosen combat style.
feints: Arena Guile (half gladiator levels in bonus to bluff and sense motive in combat)
wrestling: gains the benefits of the Clever Wrestling feat (see Complete Warrior).
two weapon fighting: gains the benefits of the Two Weapon Defense feat.
no mercy: Improved Coup de Grace: The gladiator can make a coup of Grace as a standart action.

Superior Combat Style: At 11th level, a gladiator gains a superior understanding of his chosen combat style.
feint: Insightful feint:as no penalty feinting a non-humanoid or a non-sentient opponent.
wrestling: Choke Hold: When grappling if you pin an opponent for 3 rounds, the opponent must make a FORT save DC 10 + 1/2 gladiator lvl + str bonus, or become unconscious for 2d4 rds. Creatures with larger size than yours are immune to this effect.
two weapon fighting: gains the benefits of the Improved Two Weapon Fighting feat.
no mercy: gains the benefits of the Great Cleave feat.

Combat Style Mastery: At 16th level, a gladiator masters his chosen combat style.
feints: Master of Feints: the gladiator can feint as a free action.
wrestling: BreakSpine:If you pin an opponent for 3 rounds. the opponent must make a FORT save DC 10 + 1/2 gladiator lvl + str bonus or die.
two weapon fighting: gains the benefits of the Greater Two Weapon Fighting feat.
no mercy: Superior Coup de Grace: Whenever you reduces an opponent with negative hit points, you can make an coup of grace as a free action.

Mercy: no penalty to inflict non-lethal damage.

Winning the Crowd: As a move action the gladiator can make a perform (blood sport) check to get the crowd to fight on his side, to support his morale or to demoralize his opponent. Unless otherwise stated, this provokes attacks of opportunity. To use winning the crowd the gladiator has to fight for at least 25 spectators, that are not engaged in the combat (for example, casting a spell, shouting orders, etc). Each ability requires a minimum number of ranks in Perform (blood sport) to qualify. In addition, some abilities have special requirements to qualify or to show their effect.

Supporters in the crowd: A gladiator with 4 or more ranks in Perform (blood sport) can get the crowd to support him. The crowd must have a friendly or helpful attitude toward the gladiator. On a successful Perform (blood sport) check against DC 20 the crowd cheers for him. The gladiator gains a +1 moral bonus on his attack and damage rolls. This effect lasts until the end of the fight or until the crowd's attitude toward him is indifferent or worse.

Booooo!: A gladiator with 7 ranks in Perform (blood sport) and 3 ranks in Intimidate can shame his opponent and get the crowd hoot him down. To use this ability the crowd must have a helpful attitude toward the gladiator and a hostile attitude against his oppenent. The gladiator makes two Perform (blood sport) checks as a move action. The first one to get the crowd to attack his opponent with words and objects and the second to insult his opponent. If the gladiator succeeds his first Perform (blood sport) check against DC 22, his opponent suffers a -2 penalty on his attack rolls. This effect lasts until the crowd's attitude toward the gladiator is no longer helpful or the attitute toward his opponent is no longer hostile.

The Favorite: Your reputation as a gladiator has reached the most obscur places on Athas. And even if they don’t know your name, you look like a professionnal. Your very presence in the arena as an impact on the crowd. You can attempt to reset the crowd’s attitude toward you before the fight begins. The crowd has to see you.

Eternal Glory: A gladiator with 15 ranks in Perform (blood sport) can get the crowd to encourage him pushing himself to his limits. If the gladiator has less then 1/3 of his total hp, he can make a Perform (blood sport) against DC 28. If he succeeds his check he gains extra temporary hit points equal to his character level (as if his consitution modifier would have increased by one). In addition he can fight without penalties when reduced to 0 or less hit points (he still dies, if his hit points drop to -10 or less). This effect lasts until the end of the fight plus a number of rounds equal to 3 + his constitution modifier. A gladiator can use this ability only, if the crowd's attitude toward him is helpfull.

Bringing the house down!: A gladiator with 21 ranks in Perform (blood sport) can get the crowd to cheer for every successful strike. To use this ability the crowd's attitutde toward the gladiator must be helpful. If the gladiator succeeds a DC 30 Perform (blood sport) check and successfully hits his opponent in the same round he has started to bring the house down. This does not provide any benefits yet, but if he succeeds during the next 3 round another DC 30 Perform (blood sport) check and successfully hits the same opponent in one round, the gladitor can try to start a run of attacks that goes along with increasing support of the crowd. If the gladiator succeeds a third DC 30 Perform (blood sport) check and successfully hits the same opponent in one round, during the next 3 rounds after the second successful attempt, the galdiator gains a cumulative +2 circumstance bonus on his damage rolls on every time he hits his opponent. This effect lasts until the gladiator misses one attack or doesn't use at least one of his attacks for this opponent.

Wounding: Whenever the gladiator deals damage with a weapon with wich he is proficient, the wound bleeds for 1 point of damage per round thereafter until a Heal Check is made (DC 15), any cure spell is applied. Multiple wounds are cumulative, but creatures imunes to critical hits are imune to this effect. A gladiator can use this ability only once per round.

Improved wounding: wounding deals 2 dmg per rd. instead of 1.

Greater Wounding: wound deals 3 dmg per rd. instead of 2.

Uncanny dodge and Imporved Uncanny dodge: as barbarians and as in the current DS3.5 rules

Parry and Improved Parry: as in the current DS3.5 rules

Armor Optimization: A gladiator learns to optimize his armor when he reaches 5th level. He conditions himself to use his armor to its best advantage, dodging and moving his body in such a way that opponents are confounded by his armor and shield. This is a competence bonus to AC. This bonus as to be assigned to a specific opponent (like the Dodge feat). It can be divided between multiple opponents. To apply this bonus a gladiator must be aware of his opponents and must have an armor or a shield.

Personnal Style: Can ignore a single prerequisite when selecting a tactical feat or a weapon style feat.

New skills:
Perform (blood sport): It’s about sizing up the dramatic tension in a fight; to feel every wavering in the roar of the crowd. You know when to give your adversary those few seconds of rest so people can see both you panting, bleeding, analysing each other moves. You know how to stir or taunt the crowd. You also know when your victim is ripe for the finish…and the right move to do so. Use the same table as for the Diplomacy skill.
Synergy: 5 ranks in Sense Motive gives +2 synergy bonus in Perform (blood sport).
Take 10: A crowd can’t be manipulated with absolut certainty. You can’t take 10.
Take 20: You cannot take 20.
Special: You cannot use this skill out of combat exept if you got The Favorite ability.

At the beginning of each event determine the crowd’s attitude toward each opponent.
Crowd attitude vs Gladiator’s reputation
Hostile: Crowd throws stuff in the arena. The gladiator insults the crowd, has no respect for his adversaries or is unecessarly cruel.
Unfriendly: Crowd wishes you ill. The gladiator finishes fights too quickly, has no style, is indifferent to the crowd, has lost recent fights.
Indifferent: Crowd doesn’t much care. The gladiator is unknown
Friendly: Crowd wishes you well. The gladiator gives a good show, is on a winning streak, shows appreciation for the crowd.
Helpful: The crowd spontaniously cheers for you. The gladiator's a local favorite, is known for his distinctive style.

If the recent fights were particularly bad (too short or just boring), the attitude is one step down towards hostile for every participant in the next event.

Perform (weapon drill): It’s all about flashy moves and intimidation.
As a swift action (free action once per round):
If you can beat your adversary in an opposed Perform (weapon drill) vs Sense Motive he is so confused by what he’s seeing that he can’t adjust his defense: his AC is –1 until his next action.
Synergy: [/I] 5 ranks in Intimidation gives +2 synergy bonus in Perform (weapon drill).

Notes: An variant would be to take the Hit die down to D8 and give him a good reflex save.
Grummore
11-15-07, 11:10 AM Just pumping that version of the gladiator up since I found it very interesting! I see there are some discussion about gladiator at the moment sooo, why not having an eyes on it. :)
DarthAzazel
11-15-07, 06:31 PM I may try running an all Gladiator campaign using this revision of the Gladiator class. I think that you have really captured the essence of what the Gladiator is and I like his/her special abilities!

If you would reduce the hit dice to D8 what kind of a reflex save would you use??

AZAZEL
Chahir
11-16-07, 10:33 AM I like this gladiator concept and I think it is well executed. In fact, so much does perform (bloodsport) please me that Ive gone all rambly...:)

Despite my previously ingrained view that gladiators are just a kind of fighters and my instinctive revulsion towards fanboiz who seemed to believe that the regular fighter was only there to be outshone by countless Rikus clones, I believe this kind of glad interpretation really give it its own shtick, and one which is still reconcileable with the existence of other fighting styles WHICH ARE EQUALLY VIABLE IN THEIR RESPECTIVE CONTEXTS!

That said, I am also beginning to feel that this constant evolution and homebrew tinkering with mechanics and class balance are exactly what DS needs. It keeps it breathing, alive, finding ever more accurate ways to express itself through DMs and players.

In looking comparatively at the different gladiator versions presented by the OP, Kelsen and IIRC Seker a while back I see a growing consensus building on the mechanical interpretation of this elusive archetype.
This image of what a glad is (and almost more importantly what it is not) has grown organically on the boards, through debate and a constant back and forth of ideas, not been handed down piecemeal in an non negotiable form.
Many may disagree and not use the versions presented here, or will use their own unique take on the archetype, but that does not make the work done here any less valuable or appreciated by those who do find merit in them.

I have myself have used (and experimented with) many of the rules presented here and see that although there is a rather loosely based consensus around the athas.org rules (the foundation, if you will) and certain elements from Paizo.
However, almost everyone has some modifications they have made, and I think there should be an osmotic relationship between these modifications (many of excellent quality) and the 'canon' as it is expressed by athas.org or Paizo etc.
On issues like weapon quality, athasian armors and psionic combat, I feel that the doors of the Templarate could have been opened just a crack for new ideas and influences to penetrate :D

An 'official' position on how any one class niche works mechanically and how those mechanics interact with the already nebulous concept of canon (often creatively interpreted simply to drive one's particular POV across with little regard for setting integrity) Is good and bad. It provides a basis for the expression of a setting. But it can also, IMO, do a disservice to that setting if it is not receptive enough to reasoned (the operative word here) calls for modification. And by their very essence, institutions baring the moniker official tend to be a bit leery of change, reasoned or otherwise ;)

So what I am saying is nothing new. I just live in the hope of a day when there is some sort of procedure for the proposal and evaluation of new mechanics or alternatives to the old mechanics that would be judged on their own merits instead of being dismissed because they have stepped on the toes of an important templar.
Frankly, thats closer to Athasian life than Im ever willing to go ;)

Chahir
Banndon
11-17-07, 10:13 PM Thanks for the positive comments guys!
This version's play testing has been put on ice for quite a while and I'm really looking forward for some feedback and game reports!

To answer DarthAzazel: if you take D8 hit dice you get a good fort save and a good reflex save (like rangers).
Grummore
01-11-08, 12:08 PM Back on track with this one again for Zadnaar.
HuntmasterAvatar
01-11-08, 01:06 PM the Gladiator class is one that could have many variations. a gladiator from tyr (during kalaks days) won't be the same as a gladiator from balic or gulg. i think have multipul Glad builds would be a good idea. each focusing on differant aspects.
Zardnaar
01-11-08, 02:27 PM Back on track with this one again for Zadnaar.

No real point clogging up 2 threads. I could test it out in a non DS setting though.
Grummore
11-24-08, 01:28 PM I'd like to know peoples last though on this Gladiator Class before the r7 document is out.

Thanks!
Phoenix_M
11-27-08, 08:24 PM One of the concerns I've been hearing seems to be the "Gladiator, being better than the Fighter". One of the Ideas I came up with is base the Gladiator off the Monk rather than the Fighter (You know the only front line combatant without full BAB). With the loss of full BAB people can add all the little Arena tricks and the additional weapon profs. without over shadowing the main fighter types (Barbarian, Fighter, Ranger). As Gladiators are suppose to battle other Gladiators and beasts in long, drawn-out fights for entertainment of the masses - in minimal armor. Also I could see an argument for Fort and Ref saves being favored.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Banndon 08-19-06, 05:41 PM	Hello everyone, I'm back too get some feedback on an old thread (For a reforged gladiator). We came up with a pretty decent alternative to the current gladiator. Unfortunetly we didn't have the chance to playtest it. Our DM is always busy or making excuses.... (poke to Grummore :chicken: :D ) Please remember that the main idea is to represent a blood sport professionnal, not the ultimate warrior. The best fighting class is and should always be the fighter. Special thanks to Kelsen for his wonderful ideas! :bow: :) Gladiator Hit Die: d10 Class Skills The gladiator's class skills are Balance (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Craft (Int), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (local) (Int), Perform (Cha), Sense Motive (Wis) and Tumble (Dex). Skill points at 1st level: (2 + Int modifier) x4 Skill points at each additionnal level: 2 + Int modifier The Gladiator Lvl BAB Fort Ref Will Special 1 +1 +2 +0 +0 Unarmed Strike 2 +2 +3 +0 +0 Improvised Weaponery 3 +3 +3 +1 +1 Combat Style 4 +4 +4 +1 +1 Mercy, Winning the Crowd (Supporters in the crowd) 5 +5 +4 +1 +1 Uncanny dodge, Armor Optimization +1 6 +6/+1 +5 +2 +2 Wounding, Mercy 7 +7/+2 +5 +2 +2 Improved Combat Style 8 +8/+3 +6 +2 +2 Booo! 9 +9/+4 +6 +3 +3 Personnal Style 10 +10/+5 +7 +3 +3 Armor Optimization +2 11 +11/+6/+1 +7 +3 +3 Superior Combat Style 12 +12/+7/+2 +8 +4 +4 Improved Uncanny dodge, The Favorite 13 +13/+8/+3 +8 +4 +4 Improved Wounding 14 +14/+9/+4 +9 +4 +4 Parry 15 +15/+10/+5 +9 +5 +5 Armor Optimization +3, Eternal Glory 16 +16/+11/+6/+1 +10 +5 +5 Combat Style Mastery 17 +17/+12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +5 Greater Wounding 18 +18/+13/+8/+3 +11 +6 +6 Improved Parry 19 +19/+14/+9/+4 +11 +6 +6 Bringing the House Down! 20 +20/+15/+10/+5 +12 +6 +6 Armor Optimization +4 Class Features All the following are class features of the gladiator. Weapons and Armor Proficiency: Gladiators are proficient with all simple weapons, marital weapons, and one exotic weapon of their choice. They are proficient with light and medium armor, and all shields except for tower shields. Unarmed Combat: gains the Improved Unarmed Strike feat with no off-hand penalty. (same as the current DS3.5 rules) Improvised Weaponery: A gladiator has to deal with the equipment he is given. At 3rd level the gladiator suffers only a –2 penalty (instead of a –4) to hit with improvised or unfamiliar weapons (for example exotic weapons). Combat Style: When reaching the 3rd level a gladiator selects one of four combat styles: feints, wrestling, two weapon fighting or no mercy. This choice is permenent. When gaining the benefits of a feat, he does not require to qualify for prerequesites. feints: gains the benefits of the Improved Feint feat. wrestling: gains the benefits of the Improved Grapple feat. two weapon fighting: gains the benefits of the Two Weapon Fighting feat. no mercy: gains the benefits of the Cleave feat. Improved Combat Style: At 7th level, a gladiator improves his chosen combat style. feints: Arena Guile (half gladiator levels in bonus to bluff and sense motive in combat) wrestling: gains the benefits of the Clever Wrestling feat (see Complete Warrior). two weapon fighting: gains the benefits of the Two Weapon Defense feat. no mercy: Improved Coup de Grace: The gladiator can make a coup of Grace as a standart action. Superior Combat Style: At 11th level, a gladiator gains a superior understanding of his chosen combat style. feint: Insightful feint:as no penalty feinting a non-humanoid or a non-sentient opponent. wrestling: Choke Hold: When grappling if you pin an opponent for 3 rounds, the opponent must make a FORT save DC 10 + 1/2 gladiator lvl + str bonus, or become unconscious for 2d4 rds. Creatures with larger size than yours are immune to this effect. two weapon fighting: gains the benefits of the Improved Two Weapon Fighting feat. no mercy: gains the benefits of the Great Cleave feat. Combat Style Mastery: At 16th level, a gladiator masters his chosen combat style. feints: Master of Feints: the gladiator can feint as a free action. wrestling: BreakSpine:If you pin an opponent for 3 rounds. the opponent must make a FORT save DC 10 + 1/2 gladiator lvl + str bonus or die. two weapon fighting: gains the benefits of the Greater Two Weapon Fighting feat. no mercy: Superior Coup de Grace: Whenever you reduces an opponent with negative hit points, you can make an coup of grace as a free action. Mercy: no penalty to inflict non-lethal damage. Winning the Crowd: As a move action the gladiator can make a perform (blood sport) check to get the crowd to fight on his side, to support his morale or to demoralize his opponent. Unless otherwise stated, this provokes attacks of opportunity. To use winning the crowd the gladiator has to fight for at least 25 spectators, that are not engaged in the combat (for example, casting a spell, shouting orders, etc). Each ability requires a minimum number of ranks in Perform (blood sport) to qualify. In addition, some abilities have special requirements to qualify or to show their effect. Supporters in the crowd: A gladiator with 4 or more ranks in Perform (blood sport) can get the crowd to support him. The crowd must have a friendly or helpful attitude toward the gladiator. On a successful Perform (blood sport) check against DC 20 the crowd cheers for him. The gladiator gains a +1 moral bonus on his attack and damage rolls. This effect lasts until the end of the fight or until the crowd's attitude toward him is indifferent or worse. Booooo!: A gladiator with 7 ranks in Perform (blood sport) and 3 ranks in Intimidate can shame his opponent and get the crowd hoot him down. To use this ability the crowd must have a helpful attitude toward the gladiator and a hostile attitude against his oppenent. The gladiator makes two Perform (blood sport) checks as a move action. The first one to get the crowd to attack his opponent with words and objects and the second to insult his opponent. If the gladiator succeeds his first Perform (blood sport) check against DC 22, his opponent suffers a -2 penalty on his attack rolls. This effect lasts until the crowd's attitude toward the gladiator is no longer helpful or the attitute toward his opponent is no longer hostile. The Favorite: Your reputation as a gladiator has reached the most obscur places on Athas. And even if they don’t know your name, you look like a professionnal. Your very presence in the arena as an impact on the crowd. You can attempt to reset the crowd’s attitude toward you before the fight begins. The crowd has to see you. Eternal Glory: A gladiator with 15 ranks in Perform (blood sport) can get the crowd to encourage him pushing himself to his limits. If the gladiator has less then 1/3 of his total hp, he can make a Perform (blood sport) against DC 28. If he succeeds his check he gains extra temporary hit points equal to his character level (as if his consitution modifier would have increased by one). In addition he can fight without penalties when reduced to 0 or less hit points (he still dies, if his hit points drop to -10 or less). This effect lasts until the end of the fight plus a number of rounds equal to 3 + his constitution modifier. A gladiator can use this ability only, if the crowd's attitude toward him is helpfull. Bringing the house down!: A gladiator with 21 ranks in Perform (blood sport) can get the crowd to cheer for every successful strike. To use this ability the crowd's attitutde toward the gladiator must be helpful. If the gladiator succeeds a DC 30 Perform (blood sport) check and successfully hits his opponent in the same round he has started to bring the house down. This does not provide any benefits yet, but if he succeeds during the next 3 round another DC 30 Perform (blood sport) check and successfully hits the same opponent in one round, the gladitor can try to start a run of attacks that goes along with increasing support of the crowd. If the gladiator succeeds a third DC 30 Perform (blood sport) check and successfully hits the same opponent in one round, during the next 3 rounds after the second successful attempt, the galdiator gains a cumulative +2 circumstance bonus on his damage rolls on every time he hits his opponent. This effect lasts until the gladiator misses one attack or doesn't use at least one of his attacks for this opponent. Wounding: Whenever the gladiator deals damage with a weapon with wich he is proficient, the wound bleeds for 1 point of damage per round thereafter until a Heal Check is made (DC 15), any cure spell is applied. Multiple wounds are cumulative, but creatures imunes to critical hits are imune to this effect. A gladiator can use this ability only once per round. Improved wounding: wounding deals 2 dmg per rd. instead of 1. Greater Wounding: wound deals 3 dmg per rd. instead of 2. Uncanny dodge and Imporved Uncanny dodge: as barbarians and as in the current DS3.5 rules Parry and Improved Parry: as in the current DS3.5 rules Armor Optimization: A gladiator learns to optimize his armor when he reaches 5th level. He conditions himself to use his armor to its best advantage, dodging and moving his body in such a way that opponents are confounded by his armor and shield. This is a competence bonus to AC. This bonus as to be assigned to a specific opponent (like the Dodge feat). It can be divided between multiple opponents. To apply this bonus a gladiator must be aware of his opponents and must have an armor or a shield. Personnal Style: Can ignore a single prerequisite when selecting a tactical feat or a weapon style feat. New skills: Perform (blood sport): It’s about sizing up the dramatic tension in a fight; to feel every wavering in the roar of the crowd. You know when to give your adversary those few seconds of rest so people can see both you panting, bleeding, analysing each other moves. You know how to stir or taunt the crowd. You also know when your victim is ripe for the finish…and the right move to do so. Use the same table as for the Diplomacy skill. Synergy: 5 ranks in Sense Motive gives +2 synergy bonus in Perform (blood sport). Take 10: A crowd can’t be manipulated with absolut certainty. You can’t take 10. Take 20: You cannot take 20. Special: You cannot use this skill out of combat exept if you got The Favorite ability. At the beginning of each event determine the crowd’s attitude toward each opponent. Crowd attitude vs Gladiator’s reputation Hostile: Crowd throws stuff in the arena. The gladiator insults the crowd, has no respect for his adversaries or is unecessarly cruel. Unfriendly: Crowd wishes you ill. The gladiator finishes fights too quickly, has no style, is indifferent to the crowd, has lost recent fights. Indifferent: Crowd doesn’t much care. The gladiator is unknown Friendly: Crowd wishes you well. The gladiator gives a good show, is on a winning streak, shows appreciation for the crowd. Helpful: The crowd spontaniously cheers for you. The gladiator's a local favorite, is known for his distinctive style. If the recent fights were particularly bad (too short or just boring), the attitude is one step down towards hostile for every participant in the next event. Perform (weapon drill): It’s all about flashy moves and intimidation. As a swift action (free action once per round): If you can beat your adversary in an opposed Perform (weapon drill) vs Sense Motive he is so confused by what he’s seeing that he can’t adjust his defense: his AC is –1 until his next action. Synergy: [/I] 5 ranks in Intimidation gives +2 synergy bonus in Perform (weapon drill). Notes: An variant would be to take the Hit die down to D8 and give him a good reflex save.
Grummore 11-15-07, 11:10 AM	Just pumping that version of the gladiator up since I found it very interesting! I see there are some discussion about gladiator at the moment sooo, why not having an eyes on it. :)
DarthAzazel 11-15-07, 06:31 PM	I may try running an all Gladiator campaign using this revision of the Gladiator class. I think that you have really captured the essence of what the Gladiator is and I like his/her special abilities! If you would reduce the hit dice to D8 what kind of a reflex save would you use?? AZAZEL
Chahir 11-16-07, 10:33 AM	I like this gladiator concept and I think it is well executed. In fact, so much does perform (bloodsport) please me that Ive gone all rambly...:) Despite my previously ingrained view that gladiators are just a kind of fighters and my instinctive revulsion towards fanboiz who seemed to believe that the regular fighter was only there to be outshone by countless Rikus clones, I believe this kind of glad interpretation really give it its own shtick, and one which is still reconcileable with the existence of other fighting styles WHICH ARE EQUALLY VIABLE IN THEIR RESPECTIVE CONTEXTS! That said, I am also beginning to feel that this constant evolution and homebrew tinkering with mechanics and class balance are exactly what DS needs. It keeps it breathing, alive, finding ever more accurate ways to express itself through DMs and players. In looking comparatively at the different gladiator versions presented by the OP, Kelsen and IIRC Seker a while back I see a growing consensus building on the mechanical interpretation of this elusive archetype. This image of what a glad is (and almost more importantly what it is not) has grown organically on the boards, through debate and a constant back and forth of ideas, not been handed down piecemeal in an non negotiable form. Many may disagree and not use the versions presented here, or will use their own unique take on the archetype, but that does not make the work done here any less valuable or appreciated by those who do find merit in them. I have myself have used (and experimented with) many of the rules presented here and see that although there is a rather loosely based consensus around the athas.org rules (the foundation, if you will) and certain elements from Paizo. However, almost everyone has some modifications they have made, and I think there should be an osmotic relationship between these modifications (many of excellent quality) and the 'canon' as it is expressed by athas.org or Paizo etc. On issues like weapon quality, athasian armors and psionic combat, I feel that the doors of the Templarate could have been opened just a crack for new ideas and influences to penetrate :D An 'official' position on how any one class niche works mechanically and how those mechanics interact with the already nebulous concept of canon (often creatively interpreted simply to drive one's particular POV across with little regard for setting integrity) Is good and bad. It provides a basis for the expression of a setting. But it can also, IMO, do a disservice to that setting if it is not receptive enough to reasoned (the operative word here) calls for modification. And by their very essence, institutions baring the moniker official tend to be a bit leery of change, reasoned or otherwise ;) So what I am saying is nothing new. I just live in the hope of a day when there is some sort of procedure for the proposal and evaluation of new mechanics or alternatives to the old mechanics that would be judged on their own merits instead of being dismissed because they have stepped on the toes of an important templar. Frankly, thats closer to Athasian life than Im ever willing to go ;) Chahir
Banndon 11-17-07, 10:13 PM	Thanks for the positive comments guys! This version's play testing has been put on ice for quite a while and I'm really looking forward for some feedback and game reports! To answer DarthAzazel: if you take D8 hit dice you get a good fort save and a good reflex save (like rangers).
Grummore 01-11-08, 12:08 PM	Back on track with this one again for Zadnaar.
HuntmasterAvatar 01-11-08, 01:06 PM	the Gladiator class is one that could have many variations. a gladiator from tyr (during kalaks days) won't be the same as a gladiator from balic or gulg. i think have multipul Glad builds would be a good idea. each focusing on differant aspects.
Zardnaar 01-11-08, 02:27 PM	Back on track with this one again for Zadnaar. No real point clogging up 2 threads. I could test it out in a non DS setting though.
Grummore 11-24-08, 01:28 PM	I'd like to know peoples last though on this Gladiator Class before the r7 document is out. Thanks!
Phoenix_M 11-27-08, 08:24 PM	One of the concerns I've been hearing seems to be the "Gladiator, being better than the Fighter". One of the Ideas I came up with is base the Gladiator off the Monk rather than the Fighter (You know the only front line combatant without full BAB). With the loss of full BAB people can add all the little Arena tricks and the additional weapon profs. without over shadowing the main fighter types (Barbarian, Fighter, Ranger). As Gladiators are suppose to battle other Gladiators and beasts in long, drawn-out fights for entertainment of the masses - in minimal armor. Also I could see an argument for Fort and Ref saves being favored.