Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Werral 05-10-07, 06:02 PM	I read a short story many years ago in Dragon about wyvern hunters in aircraft. I wanted to make a campaign world based on a similar premise. I imagine: WW1 type technology - early aircraft, Sopworth Camels and other stuff Biggles would feel at home with. A kind of Lost World (The book)/ Indiana Jones style feel but with D&D elements thrown in. Low magic (maybe Cthulu system?) But magic is present though many people do not believe in it. Vaguely I have an idea of a past purge where wizards were slaughtered en masse at the beginning of an age of reason. The truth is that behind the purge was a cabal of wizards that created a secret monopoly and has been ruling the world from the background. Orcs as neanterthal man or similar, still around in some parts of the world and with N AL. Elves, Dwarves, gnomes and halfings all present and in all ethnic varieties. I'd imagine that elves in hot climates are blue because they use a different pigment to human melanine. All dwarves are white because they live underground (in fact the equilvent to the game world's Africa caled early settlers "tall dwarves" because of their skin tone. Gnolls exist too and are CN. I'd also like to have some artic elves as the equivelent to Drow (but pale and ice based hiding in the Artic wastes). The Ice Elves are biding their time waiting to challenge the Wzard Cabal, while most people are ignorant as to their existence. Some monsters, wyverns, dinosaurs, dragon turtles, dire animals, kraken and giant squid are part of the natural order and well known to scientists. Others like Dragons are considered legends (but exist!) But the big thing is Biplanes and aerial combat. I'd like to have a system where piloting skills could tie in with BAB and feats so that the same plane will vary quite a lot depending on who's piloting it (ie a plane flown by a high level fighter would have a better AC and attack rate. Any ideas out there for rules, stories, plot hooks?
queenfange 05-10-07, 07:05 PM	Gnoll sorcerers have found a spell that creates tiny beings called gremlings, partially independent beings, partially caster-controlled. While in the past, the gremlings served as spies or thieves during skirmishes, they recently discovered airplanes. They find wiring delicious. This causes problems when a gnoll tribe moves closer to a small airplane base designed to defend the county against the flying dinosaurs that live in the hills. OK, that plot hook may be totally nuts, but I think your ideas have some merit. Tying together the aerial combat, WWI era technology, different races, and "Lost World" ideas will likely be very challenging, but potentially quite rewarding.
Werral 05-11-07, 06:53 AM	I like gremlins. The way you describe it's almost as if they're like fleas - ie the gnolls might not be trying to sabotage planes but they're carriers for gremlins. I'm also thinking that plane proficiency would be like weapon proficiency - maybe simple (ie recreational aircraft), martial (fighters) and exotic (gyrocopters, gliders, zeppelins and other crazy stuff). There could be airborne rangers who could choose a flying combat style. Pilot would be a class much like fighter but with piloting feats. Other classes could buy piloting feats. Feather fall would be a very useful spell in this campaign!
queenfange 05-11-07, 07:12 AM	Have you looked into d20 Modern rules? There's a Drive skill, and information on more modern vehicles (perhaps planes; I haven't looked into it much). Some of it is available here http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/article/msrd, thanks to the Open Gaming License. There's also information about different technology levels, which could help you choose which aspects of each level of technology you want to pick out for your setting (which seems to have a blend of different technological levels). Perhaps you could take the Drive skill and alter it to be a skill called Pilot, which is a class skill for Pilots and a cross-class skill for others. It could be cool to have characters flying fairly low-tech planes and using pistols (you could substitute crossbows) to shoot targets on the ground, so both piloting and skills at ranged combat are important. Some sort of spell-launching device, either held by the pilot or a passanger or strapped onto the plane itself with a trigger in the cockpit, could also be used.
Werral 05-11-07, 12:51 PM	I've got stuff going on the combat/equipment pages for the mechanics. I guess as far as magic goes I'd say: HIgh power, low availability. It's something most people don't know about, many people do not believe exists but which is a big player both behind the scenes (A wizard cabal rules the world via puppet kings and republics - kinda like every consipiracy theory come true) and there are saveg lands with tribal shamans, the Ice Elves (maybe Norns after Tad Williams) building up a secret army of White Dragons, Frost Giants and stuff, sorcerers popping up with no idea how to control their powers and weird artifacts found in archaelogical sites. Adventure types: Conspiracy stuff Big Game Hunts (Wyverns, Dragon Turtles, Dinasaurs and such) Exploration (Strange Islands, plateaus, mountain valleys, Tundra, desert kingdoms) Criminal escapades Sorcerer encounters, Sorcerers are quickly hushed up by agents of the Cabal and often disapear or are sent to mental institutions and lobotomised or drugged. SOme PCs might be sorcerers on the run (with a cover identity) Wizards - most are considered cranks. The cabal floods the world with esoteric crap that makes no sense so those wishing to study magic learn lots of dretch, those that manage to find something real have to watch out lest the Cabal gets on to them (see sorcerers) These are the things that come to mind.
stargate525 05-11-07, 03:23 PM	Continuing on your sorcerer Idea, you might want to consider having a 'rival' group of sorcerers/rogue wizards whose job is like the witness protection program; keeping its members safe until they can take out the cabal. Who would suspect that the magician doing card tricks in the back lounge of the casino is ACTUALLY doing magic?
taradusis 05-11-07, 04:54 PM	What about divine magic?You'd have to postulate that it never existed,Any god tends to attract worshippers,there are humans who worship non-human deities.Are there devils or undead in this world?RANDOM THOUGHTS.
queenfange 05-12-07, 06:13 AM	Yeah, your ideas for sorcerers open up a lot of possibilities. It seems that since they are guaranteed trouble if they stay in society, a few would likely escape and live in the wild. Sorcerers riding flying dinosaurs could be a fun target for your biplane driving fighters. Anyway, this is quite cool; keep updating us as you flesh out more of your ideas!
Werral 05-12-07, 07:55 AM	Continuing on your sorcerer Idea, you might want to consider having a 'rival' group of sorcerers/rogue wizards whose job is like the witness protection program; keeping its members safe until they can take out the cabal. Who would suspect that the magician doing card tricks in the back lounge of the casino is ACTUALLY doing magic? Cool idea. So Sleight of Hand could be a class skill. What about divine magic?You'd have to postulate that it never existed,Any god tends to attract worshippers,there are humans who worship non-human deities.Are there devils or undead in this world?RANDOM THOUGHTS. Well I was thinking, tribal sorcerers (modified druids) and some adepts in far flung places. I was going to go with a "Believers create gods" rather than "Gods created the world" type cosmos - as worshippers were purged and belief riduculed during the Age of Reason the gods grew weaker and weaker until reaching near death. So I'd say no clerics, but maybe some half celestial/half fiend favoured souls - who are actually vestigal gods (yup, they've become so weak that they're 1st level FS). Kind of a Neil Gaiman type thing. They're even rarer (and more persecuted) than sorcerers.
stargate525 05-12-07, 10:01 AM	Cool idea. So Sleight of Hand could be a class skill. or Perform(magic act).
Werral 05-12-07, 03:30 PM	I think I'll also reflavour bards so that they're basically sorcerers who's innate magical abilities are focused by their performance. Mechanics wise they remain identical.
Hochiu 05-12-07, 04:01 PM	d20 Past has biplanes in it and rules for flying them.
stargate525 05-12-07, 04:42 PM	I think I'll also reflavour bards so that they're basically sorcerers who's innate magical abilities are focused by their performance. Mechanics wise they remain identical. so will the bards be your sorcerers, or will you have the sorcerer class as well?
Werral 05-15-07, 11:22 AM	They'll both be sorcerers of a different flavour.
Holy_Beholder 05-16-07, 08:46 PM	You could have a legendary dragon appear, along with the disappearance of several very prominent elite fighter pilots. So here are my ideas. Each plane has eight parts. Body: determines plane HP. Propellers: determines plane speed. Wing guns: determines damage. Back mounted gun: determines damage, second person. Wings: determines maneuverability. Plating: determines plane DR. Cockpit: determines people held. There would also be certain rare items, for instance jets instead of propellers. There would also be rare rockets that would track. In addition you could put in formations that give different advantages.
Werral 05-17-07, 08:15 AM	Interesting idea Holy Beholder, that way you can soup up planes. I'd probably give each plane basic stats without dividing the parts into stats ('cause it's not just the propellor that determines speed, but also the moter and general aerodynamics). Basically I was thinking of using something like the D20 vehicle stats and the flying rules from The Quintessential Elf (which are cool, really fast and loose). Those rules give each plane a manouverability rating. I'll read up on them and modify it. Also I guess pilots could get feats that improve the plane's AC, Attack bonus and stuff like that. The first one - works like Combat Expertise but applies to planes. Evasive Manouvers Prerequisite: Pilot 5 ranks The Pilot can trade up to 5 points of BAB for an equal bonus to the AC and Reflex saves of any plane the pilot is flying. BAB penalties are suffered by anyone firing from the same vehicle (due to the erratic evasive movements of the aircraft).
Werral 05-17-07, 10:31 AM	Oh and here's a link to a "biplane" dinosaur! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microraptor
ORC_Tao 05-17-07, 11:09 AM	Interesting idea. You might want to look at Iron Kingdoms and Eberron for ways to successfully integrate higher technology into a fantasy setting (My current campaign is an Eberron campaign set thousands of years after the Last War and incorporates a lot more steampunk into the setting. They are trying to develop airplanes as we speak :D .).
Ethandrul 05-17-07, 11:12 AM	Might I Suggest Checking Out The Olg Computr Game "arcanum" It Is Exactly What You Are Talking About!
taradusis 05-24-07, 12:59 PM	How well developed are blimps in your world?Could they be used to carry biplanes like an aircraft carrier?Are they used for passenger purposes?Suppose one of the PCs was the first dragon disciple ever?He could go on a quest to find a Dragon who reveals his his draconic heritage and awakens his ability to become a dragon disciple.Suppose there were huge rewards for bringing back unknown specimens alive and in good shape?I thinking of the scene in KING KONG where they bring him in on a cargo ship?RANDOM THOUGHTS
Evil DM Mk3 05-24-07, 01:29 PM	Interesting idea, what if there are certain relics of the more magical age you indicate might have existed? Iron Golems going on the rampage, Inteligent magic items, that kind of thing. IE the sort of thing people might be able to pass off as mundane.
Werral 05-26-07, 06:11 AM	Tarudisis, I really like your ideas. The Blimps make me think of Michael Moorcock's novel "The Warlord of the Air", where heavier than air flight had never been developed but there were flying warships. It was set in an alternate 1970's. My favourite has to be the Cryptozoology - bringing back strange creatures alive is a great adventure hook, and of course they'll have to ask the natives about the Lizard King or whatever. I like Evil DM's leftover magic stuff. Things that pass for mundane could be pretty useful (but they'd have to watch out for the Cabal's detect magic). Of course the PC's could be hired to destroy the evidence (or to save it on behalf of the sorcerers or other groups.)
taradusis 05-26-07, 08:13 AM	Maybe the Pcs could be like the M.I.B.(men in black).They are working for the cabal and have a device that blanks minds like a neurolyzer,only magical.Are the Pcs loyal and does the cabal deserve loyalty are something you could resolve in gameplay?
Holy_Beholder 05-26-07, 11:36 AM	Blimps could be weaker airplanes with more people and weapons. As for taking them alive, that is where some weapons come in. Blimps could be transports, for captive wyverns and stuff. Normal: Magical Missiles(This one is simple enough, just fire off magic missiles, that do fire damage, or go the animated object with suicide route) Crossbow Bolt machine guns Nonlethal: Floating nets which magnetically come together when it is stopped on something. Stunning missiles Sticky weights that can stop someone from flying. Special: Trailing retractable nets. Fuel that leaves sticky clouds that slow flight speed of things that go through them. Net gun
Werral 05-26-07, 05:24 PM	I think the PCs could go either way - helping to destroy the evidence, then helping to reveal it. No one works for the Cabal - noone knows it exists. The PC's might work for a cabal front group. (same difference to the DM, whole different thing for the PC's). New Spell: Conceal Magic (wizard/sorcerer 1st) Components: V,S Duration: 1hr per level. Saving Throw: NA Area of Effect: 1 item/spell/ creature The spell can conceal one spell effect/spell -like ability from Detect Magic or similar spells. The maximum caster level of the spell that can be concealed is equal to the caster's own caster level (so a 15th level caster can conceal a 15th or lower level effect). This is handy for sorcerers on the run or those trying to hide magical items from the Cabal's goons. On Blimps I was thinking about the early 19th Century UFO sightings -cigar shaped flying objects. Since the Fey are also hiding from the Cabal I was thinking that perhaps these UFO's might be Fey blimps. I'm thinking pretty dark Fey, not your classical comical pixies, but creatures that have been hunted by the most ruthless organisations for hundreds of years and act like it.
queenfange 05-26-07, 07:29 PM	Conceal magic sounds a lot like Nystul's magic aura (well, the version of that spell that does the opposite, that masks a spell aura instead of creating a fake one). I like your idea of dark, merciless, hunted fey. They could be lots of fun and very unique.
Werral 05-27-07, 06:33 PM	There's a school of thought that modern UFO sightings and medieval faerie sightings are one and the same, I guess that's where the dark fey come from. Yeah Conceal Magic is not a super original spell, but it's pretty damn handy when magic is forbidden. I was also going to add Detect Magic User (used by the Cabals agents), basically the same as Detect Evil/Good except that it uses spellcaster levels (any spellcaster levels) rather than Hit Die. Spellcasters without prepared spells don't show up though, so that gives them the possibility to "Lie low"
queenfange 05-27-07, 08:09 PM	I like detect magic user, so long as there's spells which are equivalent to hiding alignment spells that hide spellcaster levels. Cool idea.
Werral 05-28-07, 11:08 AM	Maybe spells, but they'd be short duration (1-2 rounds/level?) just enough to let the Spooks pass by... There could lots of suspense as they hope the duration doesn't run out.... The only way to hide for sure would be to not prepare any spells (spontaneous casters would have to volountarily repress their powers, being unable to cast any spells that day). I was also thinking of a Skill: Hide Aura:ì (Wis). CS All magic using classes Enables the character to conceal magical abilities as long as they don't actually cast a spell or use a spell-like ability. DC=5*Caster Level (so it gets harder to hide magical abilities as they get more powerful) If they are actually scanned by a Detect Magic User spell the searcher opposes their Spellcraft (with a circumstance bonus = to the caster level) against Hide Aura. Of course not everyone looking for magic users is part of the Cabal. Rebel groups would come looking for them too. Another thing I was thinking of giving vehicles a Leval Adjustment. For example wyverns should be a fair challenge for 1st level characters in biplanes even though those same characters couldn't handle them on foot.