Post/Author/DateTime	Post
imake13 03-11-07, 10:35 PM	Hey guys, It's been a while since I've posted here. I feel like lately I've been rolling alot of critical 1's IRL. But things are starting to turn up and now I'm looking to start the foundations of a campaign idea I've been working out in my head for a while now. I want to write a war campaign that brings characters from level 1-20 and allows for all sorts of gameplay. My biggest worry is that with a war campaign it will become far to hack and slashy and become tiresome. The other worry is I have is trying to find a way to make the battles seem epic and massive without downplaying the role of the heroes. One idea I had to do this would make battle an enviroment instead of playing it out... so players would have a chance to take damage for every round they were in that particular enviroment. Perhaps. Some movies that have inspired me lately: Kingdom of Heaven Band of Brothers The Lord of the Rings Brotherhood of the Wolf (not really for war, but I really like the indian character) I really want to give this a very old school feel. Perhaps lowish magic... not necessarily like tolkien's world, but I just am getting sick of how D&D increasingly revolves around magic and diseases and crazy abberations, etc. I want a medieval feel to this campaign. Magic should be present, I just want strength of arms to be the real threats. So as I brainstorm on this end, I would love to hear some of your ideas. Has anyone run something like this before? I'd love to hear what worked and hasn't worked well for you. Peace friends, Imake13
ericSHINRA 03-11-07, 11:07 PM	That sort of campaign is just what I've been working on of late and I feel the same way about your comment on magic in DnD. Sure, it has its place but things can get out of hand. The idea of battles being an environment similar to wetlands or desert is an interesting twist on the rules for combat. While it could help create a more compelling narative, it would be a difficult system to create, though easily managed I would think. The success of such a campaign greatly hinges on both your style and the style of your players but will be very rewarding if handled properly. If your players are going to begin at 1st level, they'll have the training but not the experience of more seasoned soldiers so I'd recomend their characters be either young men and/or women or citizens with occupations who've been drafted or volunteered for service. The idea of a flow chart for the outcome of battles might be of interest and I believe it's been featured in Heroes of Battle. What you want to maintain in this sort of campaign is a sense of signifigance for your PC's and that they have an impact on a series of events greater then themselves.
yellowdingo 03-11-07, 11:08 PM	Description: King Frank decides to log the Forest of Pern for charcoal (the seven thousand and fifty six square miles of hardwoods). he needs fuel to cook food and heat homes in his port city of Thenfish (POP.78,567). The initial logging camps are attacked by warbands of Red-Deer Riding Elves (Mounted Archers) who burn the camps down at night with a rain of fiery arrows (400 Mounted Archers). King Frank brings up Foresters (archers) to guard the Camps and put down the raiders (300 Archers). The Elves take out villages further in the Kingdom and poison their wells. Burn down their wheat crops and plunge the Kingdom into a Famine. The King declares the forest open to any mercenary who wants to be a Baron if they can secure and log fifty six square miles. THe Elves flush monsters out of their forest into the Kingdom. There are a number of undead. The King, confronted with famine in the capital turns fifteen thousand poor out of the capital and pushes them north to settle the entire Forest. A Rival Kingdom declares the forest to be a protectorate and provide the Elves with a force of 300 undead troops (Skeletons) as front line troops. King Frank brings up Steam Cannons by riverboat and places two at each of the Six reinforced Logging Camps that serve as the Strongholds for the New barons (450 mercenary light footmen, 300 Heavy cavalry).
imake13 03-11-07, 11:36 PM	Description: King Frank decides to log the Forest of Pern for charcoal (the seven thousand and fifty six square miles of hardwoods). he needs fuel to cook food and heat homes in his port city of Thenfish (POP.78,567). The initial logging camps are attacked by warbands of Red-Deer Riding Elves (Mounted Archers) who burn the camps down at night with a rain of fiery arrows (400 Mounted Archers). King Frank brings up Foresters (archers) to guard the Camps and put down the raiders (300 Archers). The Elves take out villages further in the Kingdom and poison their wells. Burn down their wheat crops and plunge the Kingdom into a Famine. The King declares the forest open to any mercenary who wants to be a Baron if they can secure and log fifty six square miles. THe Elves flush monsters out of their forest into the Kingdom. There are a number of undead. The King, confronted with famine in the capital turns fifteen thousand poor out of the capital and pushes them north to settle the entire Forest. A Rival Kingdom declares the forest to be a protectorate and provide the Elves with a force of 300 undead troops (Skeletons) as front line troops. King Frank brings up Steam Cannons by riverboat and places two at each of the Six reinforced Logging Camps that serve as the Strongholds for the New barons (450 mercenary light footmen, 300 Heavy cavalry). well this seems a little to fantastical for what I am going for. The first part is neat, but the the second part about undead etc. is to far away from the medieval war I'm going for.
imake13 03-11-07, 11:36 PM	That sort of campaign is just what I've been working on of late and I feel the same way about your comment on magic in DnD. Sure, it has its place but things can get out of hand. The idea of battles being an environment similar to wetlands or desert is an interesting twist on the rules for combat. While it could help create a more compelling narative, it would be a difficult system to create, though easily managed I would think. The success of such a campaign greatly hinges on both your style and the style of your players but will be very rewarding if handled properly. If your players are going to begin at 1st level, they'll have the training but not the experience of more seasoned soldiers so I'd recomend their characters be either young men and/or women or citizens with occupations who've been drafted or volunteered for service. The idea of a flow chart for the outcome of battles might be of interest and I believe it's been featured in Heroes of Battle. What you want to maintain in this sort of campaign is a sense of signifigance for your PC's and that they have an impact on a series of events greater then themselves. Thanks for the advice and encouragement. I agree the system would take some work, but it would become a really great asset to making things flow smoother.
GoriceXII 03-11-07, 11:47 PM	I also encourage you likewise. I'm doing pretty much the same thing too and while challenging I think its certainly possible. If you are interested in sharing some of my notes please let me know. It is fully possible to do spying missions, intrigues, diplomacy and missions to steal items and even people during a war campaign.
imake13 03-11-07, 11:51 PM	I would love to share notes with you. I have some ideas building. I really want my characters to have a sense of loss in this campaign. I find that the players I am building this for expect to win without to much challenge... I want to build a war where the heroes experience great loss before they earn victory.
GoriceXII 03-12-07, 12:05 AM	http://www.thecbg.org/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?24252 this is a link to a site that has most of the information on my campaign. I also have the City of Fineberg thread on here and "An Adventure for my War Campaign". It's interesting how different our player groups are. My players are kind of more caught up in things right now. then again though the first few adventures were done with war being a possibility, then a strong likelihood and finally inevitable.
imake13 03-12-07, 12:11 AM	Thanks for the link. After watching the directors cut of Kingdom of Heaven, I was really motivated to start work on this. Basically, the theatrical cut made the movie very hack'n'slash and the directors cut really developed it. I love the feel of the war there. The scenes where the heroes march to certain doom against much greater numbers because it is the right thing to do, and it will save the people... I dunno, it's very epic. I want that feel.
yellowdingo 03-12-07, 12:26 AM	well this seems a little to fantastical for what I am going for. The first part is neat, but the the second part about undead etc. is to far away from the medieval war I'm going for. Dont need to be undead for an ideal medieval low fantasy war. So The Ally of the elves provides 400 archers (Foresters) to counter the foresters of King Frank. In the Forest the deer riders are near impossible for heavy cavalry to engage in close combat. Currently you have three regions involved in the conflict: The Kingdom of Frank The Duchy of of Illwind The Forest of Pern The Kingdom of Frank marches troops through the "Neutral" Barony of Estwynd Who is drawn into the conflict for having allowed the Kindom of Frank to march 200 heavy footmen through it's territory. The Duchy of Illwind recognise Dobey Mandu of the Mandu family as the rightful Monarch of the Kingdom of Frank and pours 200 Medium horsemen into the Kingdom via the barony of Estwynd where they encounter the army of King Frank. The "Neutral" Barony of of Estwynd becomes a battleground. The Barony of Estwynd deploys its fifty heavy Horsemen to support King Frank's troops. While Mercenary Barons engage the elves and their forester support at the forest edge, there is a fully fledged war in the Neutral Barony next door. The Famine is now full on in the Kingdom of Frank (1000 peasants are dying each month) and has spread to the Barony of Estwynd. There is your first six months.
GoriceXII 03-12-07, 12:28 AM	Mine is in a large part about a siege. There was an interesting in character discussion where they were talking about a moment where during a truce to recover wounded one of the enemy officers said to one of the pcs in bewilderment, "Why don't you surrender? You know you're surrounded by superior numbers...that we have the troops and equipment to break open your city..why don't you give up now?" and the pc said "We'll NEVER surrender!" Honor did in spite of some evidence to the contrary occasionally play a big part in the lives of those who went on the Crusades. I know that some might say, rightly, that they were awful wars that shouldn't have been fought and they would be right. However there are such moments as you say, that are stirring.
imake13 03-12-07, 12:29 AM	Dont need to be undead for an ideal medieval low fantasy war. So The Ally of the elves provides 400 archers (Foresters) to counter the foresters of King Frank. In the Forest the deer riders are near impossible for heavy cavalry to engage in close combat. Currently you have three regions involved in the conflict: The Kingdom of Frank The Duchy of of Illwind The Forest of Pern The Kingdom of Frank marches troops through the "Neutral" Barony of Estwynd Who is drawn into the conflict for having allowed the Kindom of Frank to march 200 heavy footmen through it's territory. The Duchy of Illwind recognise Dobey Mandu of the Mandu family as the rightful Monarch of the Kingdom of Frank and pours 200 Medium horsemen into the Kingdom via the barony of Estwynd where they encounter the army of King Frank. The "Neutral" Barony of of Estwynd becomes a battleground. The Barony of Estwynd deploys its fifty heavy Horsemen to support King Frank's troops. While Mercenary Barons engage the elves and their forester support at the forest edge, ther is a fully fledged war in the Neutral Barony next door. Good ideas for drawing conflict together. I really like how you have created a bit of a "perfect storm" here.
yellowdingo 03-12-07, 12:48 AM	King Frank now faced with traitors in his own kingdom, and famine must bankrupt his kingdom to import fifty shiploads of grain. The Conflict in the Barony of Estwynd collapses as elf deer riders take out the Resupply wagons heading northwest into the Barony. Soldiers loot the harvested grain reserves of the Barony as they besiege Castle Estwynd and the surviving soldiers of King Frank. Peasants in Estwynd are forced to eat dead horses from the battlfield. A Plague spreads through the Barony. A Rebel army supporting Dobey Mandu attacks the Port to Secure the Grain now being offloaded only to find the ships have mercenary troops for the king. The Kingdom of Frank having lost its Army in conflicts, must now rely entirely on foreign troops. it despatches half its new grain reserve north-east with two hundred mercenary medium footmen. Now The troops from the Duchy of Illwind must settle into a siege of castle Estwynd as their own supply wagons catch up with the last of the Dukes soldiers (100 Light Footmen-recruited from Peasants). END OF YEAR ONE
imake13 03-12-07, 12:53 AM	I like the ideas. I however am more interested in creating a war that is over something more epic than a territory despute. I dunno, I want something like a crusade, or a defense against invaders coming to rape and pillage... something sort of dark.
imake13 03-12-07, 01:52 AM	I was just rewatching the "Bastogne" episode of band of brothers. It is a really hard and emotionally straining time for the featured company of soldiers. They have been ordered to defend a town, they are surrounded by the enemy, and it is the dead of winter. They are under constant shell bombardment, low on food, ammunition and lack proper winter clothing. The medics are almost out bandages and are using alcohol as a substitute for morphine. The littlest things like a half an hour of sleep, or a moment of warmth under a community blanket are precious. How can you make a group of players feel this way? I think it would add alot to the realism of war. Things do not always work out how you want. Sometimes you have to follow orders and don't get to plan things out.
imake13 03-12-07, 04:11 AM	I just checked out heroes of battle and it's great, thanks for the tip. It's helping me think out some ideas and giving me some great ideas like adventure maps and flow charts, etc. So while we continue to brainstorm ideas for the campaign as a whole, what is the best way to draw several first level PC's into wanting to go to war? Also, I really am interested in a reponse to my above post, so take a looksie. thanks guys.
GoriceXII 03-12-07, 05:02 AM	You need to create a context and atmosphere. You also need some idea of why the players are there. Are they typical D&D characters, totally mercenary wanderers? Are they going to start off as warriors or priests in some kind of religious order? Don't be shy of creating this character context and selling your players on it. Two of my players had vowed they'd never want to play in a military style campaign nor would they play soldiers--yet they're playing them happily now. I didn't force them but I told them that that was what I wanted to have for this particular campaign and urged them to try it for just a few sessions and then let me know how they liked it. Now they love their characters, love the campaign. Part of how I do this is to make any campaign regardless of the main plotline and theme as real as possible like an intense story in which they are the X factor. I try to make the places they come to seem real and interesting, create NPCs they can talk to and loathe or like. Draw them into your campaign world. In part you need to know what your players will enjoy. I know that for instance one of my players needs to feel that she is swept up into chivalrous romance and adventure; she wants to rescue the helpless and face villainy. Another loves mysteries, particularly ones that have a magical nature. You see in a way the plot is important but in a way not when it comes to making your players care and I think that is what you are perhaps talking about. BTW: I would recommend reading George R. R. Martin's "A Song of Ice and Fire" series of books as well, which have a nice magical yet grounded in a context of tough gritty reality feel to them, like an up to date Robert E. Howard. I liked the films you suggested as well btw. I recently got Brotherhood of the Wolf which impressed me.
yellowdingo 03-12-07, 07:33 AM	The Charcoal War ---------------------------------------- Year Two The Ongoing Siege in the Barony of Estwynd begins to turn as mercenary troops from the Kingdom of Frank push into the Barony over the winter. By Spring the Duchy of Illwind must pull back to the Border of the Duchy as over four hundred Mercenaries pour into the Barony of Estwynd. The Baron of Estwynd finds his barony under occupation as he is confined to a Tower cell, his few loyal troops with him. The population of the Barony are hunted down and herded into labour camps. He soon finds out that King Frank has annexed his Barony. The Mercenaries settle in abusing the Women of the Barony and mistreating the population at large as they build a fortified frontier in the northern edge of the Barony and begin raiding into the Forest for timber. King Frank’s Spies report the Duchy of Illwind is now poorly defended and if He were to pay The Bishopric of Gernau (located beyond the Duchy) to invade the Duchy, they might control between them the Timber of the Forest of Pern. As further enticement, King Frank offers the Bishopric State Religion Status. Bishop Gernau would be Archbishop of the Frankish Church of the Greater Kingdom of Frank. Bishop Gernau dispatches fifty Crusaders to Besiege the Dukes Castle. This breaks the Ducal Frontier Defences and Mercenaries (200 Heavy footmen) from the Estwynd Territories enter the Duchy to Support the Crusader Siege of Castle Illwind. The Fifty Heavy Footmen can hold out for several months more on Castle reserves While Mercenaries Pillage the Duchy. Warbands roam the Duchy and start occupying and fortifying villages as estates. The Bishopric of Gernau offers seed-grain for the territories in Estwynd and Illwind. By End of the new sewing season, the Forest of Pern is surrounded on three frontiers. Living off a rationed food supply, the populace settle in under the rule of many Baronies now under the control of Foreign Troops. They must settle in until harvest time so they can begin pushing into the Forest of Pern by winter of year two. Assailed on three sides, the elves have lost some of their forest to Mercenary Barons setting up in the southern edge of Pern Forest. There is also logging in the Western edge at the forest’s narrowest end. The Mercenaries must now build a fortified embankment around the edge of the forest to control raids by the elves. They cannot allow the elves to torch this year’s crops. The Kingdom has little money left and will no longer be able to support mercenaries beyond the end of year two. At the end of the growing season, the Elf deer riders begin torching crops. The dirt and timber palisade is intermittent and King Franks’ army is predominantly foot-soldiers. They are hard pressed to stop the raids but harvest most of the crop and press into the forest of Pern. By deep winter the mercenaries are prepared to raid the forest. King Frank can no longer pay the mercenaries their wages. -------------------------END OF YEAR TWO-----------------
yellowdingo 03-12-07, 07:36 AM	The Charcoal War ---------------------------------------- Year Three Many unpaid War-bands begin pillaging the Inner Kingdom of Frank. Order breaks down and The Kings own Barons are unable to defend themselves against Mercenary raiders. Once the Mercenaries raid the Capital, the King takes his two remaining steam cannons and one hundred loyal troops and flees by ship abandoning the kingdom to its new mercenary Barons. The Neutral Good Bishop of Gernau, and his Crusaders find themselves in the company of Lawful Evil Foreign Barons and their Mercenaries as the dream of becoming Archbishop of the Kingdom of Frank falls through. The Bishop falls back to the Bishopric and fortifies against the new threat. The Lawful Neutral King Frank has fled abroad and his Barons are fighting his unpaid mercenaries just to hold their own baronies, The mostly Chaotic good Elves of the forest of Pern (along with refugees and Foresters from the Duchy) are under Siege, The Neutral Barony of Estwynd has been subjugated and the Chaotic Neutral Duchy is partitioned into further baronies. Before the third year sewing season, there is a large “C”-shaped region Known as the Free Baronies ruled by Lawful Evil Barons. The Surrounding Neutral and Good Lands begin mobilizing for possible war as a refugee crisis spreads the problem beyond the Free Baronies. The lawful Evil barons begin rounding up half elves in their peasant population (even third generation elf will do) and start killing them. The Baron in occupation of the Port City declares that the population (56,000 people) of the Port city are to be sold to the Baronies as serf labour.
yellowdingo 03-12-07, 07:42 AM	A simple conflict over fuel escalates to become a foreign occupation. Sound Familiar? You are now on a slipperyslope to Armageddon.
Yakman 03-12-07, 12:16 PM	Also, because your characters are heroes, they are able to do things that regular forces cannot. When they start to shine (10th level or so), send them away, deep into some wilderness, or in some foreign adventure in an attempt to do something spectacular at relatively low costs (dead adventurers). If you want a nice sense of loss, have them out in the bush for a year or two, fighting for their cause. And when they get back home, triumphant, weary, and ready for a long nap, they find the enemy's flag flying over their capital...
Kadasbrass 03-12-07, 03:29 PM	If you want a war campaign I recommend Heroes of Battle. The book gives pointers and ideas for avoid having the players be in the heart of the battle. From my personal experience war campaigns are pretty unfun for players when they get thrown into an army unit and expected to fight in the war like regular soldiers. Best thing for a war campaign is to have the players do missions like sneaking into enemy controled area, stealing plans, blowing up a bridge, raiding supply lines, killing off a certain commander, freeding prisoners, invoking a revolt in a certain town. That is the best type of war campaign for players. A campaign that is almost no different then a regular campaign but no one realizes it. Battle in the field is a waste for players. Since their one of many their impact isn't as important for the war realisticly speaking. In the end you come too two different points: That the players had no impact because you planned on their side winning anyways so the impact the players had was negated by the fact you would of let them win the war even if they lost the battle. Or if you want the players to have a impact and let the war be decided on by their actions you end up with these epic battles where dice are rolled over and over but no one really has any fun, and it gets worse if you roll for the different units in a battle to determine which side wins. Both outcomes have the same effect of making the players feel very small in a very big picture. Instead of having the players part of the bg battle, you have them part of smaller battles instead. Hold a certain hill from the enemy so they can't get archers on it and shoot at the army while it passes through. Take a certain postition from the enemy so they can't hit the army's left side. Protect the supply lines from raiders. Protect a bridge from being destoryed. Scout for enemy postitions. Scout for enemy spys/scouts. Protect a general or messanger. Deliever messages to a certain commander. Lay traps behind a retreating army. War Campaigns can be more then just war. Armies do more then just battle, there is a ton of support that goes on that leads to victory.
Yakman 03-12-07, 03:58 PM	The one thing you can do in a major battle is combat with some enemy champion--a throwdown with a leveled troll commander or something like that. It changes the course of the battle--enemy armies tend to run when stuff like that happens, gives the players a feeling of importance, and makes for a great one-on-one fight encounter.
imake13 03-12-07, 04:05 PM	If you want a nice sense of loss, have them out in the bush for a year or two, fighting for their cause. And when they get back home, triumphant, weary, and ready for a long nap, they find the enemy's flag flying over their capital... I think it's really important to establish a sense of home for the characters. I am trying to decide how to do that. Thanks for all the help and comments so far, it has kept the creative juices flowing.
imake13 03-12-07, 04:10 PM	If you want a war campaign I recommend Heroes of Battle. The book gives pointers and ideas for avoid having the players be in the heart of the battle. From my personal experience war campaigns are pretty unfun for players when they get thrown into an army unit and expected to fight in the war like regular soldiers. Best thing for a war campaign is to have the players do missions like sneaking into enemy controled area, stealing plans, blowing up a bridge, raiding supply lines, killing off a certain commander, freeding prisoners, invoking a revolt in a certain town. That is the best type of war campaign for players. A campaign that is almost no different then a regular campaign but no one realizes it. Battle in the field is a waste for players. Since their one of many their impact isn't as important for the war realisticly speaking. In the end you come too two different points: That the players had no impact because you planned on their side winning anyways so the impact the players had was negated by the fact you would of let them win the war even if they lost the battle. Or if you want the players to have a impact and let the war be decided on by their actions you end up with these epic battles where dice are rolled over and over but no one really has any fun, and it gets worse if you roll for the different units in a battle to determine which side wins. Both outcomes have the same effect of making the players feel very small in a very big picture. Instead of having the players part of the bg battle, you have them part of smaller battles instead. Hold a certain hill from the enemy so they can't get archers on it and shoot at the army while it passes through. Take a certain postition from the enemy so they can't hit the army's left side. Protect the supply lines from raiders. Protect a bridge from being destoryed. Scout for enemy postitions. Scout for enemy spys/scouts. Protect a general or messanger. Deliever messages to a certain commander. Lay traps behind a retreating army. War Campaigns can be more then just war. Armies do more then just battle, there is a ton of support that goes on that leads to victory. This is alot of great advice and the reasons behind it. thanks so much man.
Yakman 03-12-07, 04:15 PM	A sense of home, a sense of cause, and a sense of fighting the good fight are essential for a war campaign. And remember, the "good guys" don't win every war... and this could tie in nicely to the second (or third) phase of a campaign--the PCs have to fight to liberate their country. Ideally, you could structure it like so: PCs are brought into the military--they fight small unit actions, acting as scouts or raiders PCs are singled out for their abilities and perform more important duties--spying, deep undercover work, some important thefts, etc. PCs become valuable assets to the cause--they are entrusted with a diplomatic mission (or escorts for a diplomatic mission) PCs are entrusted to a super important mission--deal a blow 'from behind' to the enemy--their duty is to encourage an invasion in the enemy's rear, or a revolt in some colony far away PCs succeed in mission (or fail), and head home, to find their nation defeated PCs are granted amnesty by the conquerors in exchange for fealty--the bad guys will relent on some aspects of conquest if the PCs will co-operate with them PCs become disenchanted with the enemy and raise the banner of revolt PCs organize a successful rebellion and become important figures in a second war--along with the allies they made on their journeys abroad\ PCs ultimately triumph, driving the enemy out of their homeland and perhaps overthrowing the evil rulers there
imake13 03-12-07, 05:57 PM	That's good. I really like that. My biggest fear here is that I have never run a campaign of my own before. I have always done prewritten adventures and even the shackled city adventure path... but as much as i love this idea, the thought of crafting all of it is a bit daunting. Hopefully I will get over it. Keep the juices flowing here though, this is great.
GoriceXII 03-12-07, 08:50 PM	Also consider picking up the Red Hand of Doom adventure. If nothing else it's a good template for how to run such a campaign. For instance there are a couple of points where the players are in the midst of a battle but are nevertheless given the chance to make their own decisions. However, a strong school of thought in D&D as posted above is that players are wasted in the field of battle. I actually disagree. Doing it over and over again might seem tiresome but think of films like 13th Warrior or Braveheart--sometimes players will enjoy being swept up in great events. I find that time and time again people SAY these things as players when in fact if the campaign is run well they will enjoy (not always but sometimes certainly) being caught up in something like a great battle.
yellowdingo 03-12-07, 09:22 PM	I think it's really important to establish a sense of home for the characters. I am trying to decide how to do that. Thanks for all the help and comments so far, it has kept the creative juices flowing. It depends. Mine was to have the war well underway befor the first level characters were even aware there was a war. They didnt find out until the warband torched their isolated village. they were the ones to carry the information to the nearest town only to find that something was wrong with the entire kingdom. When they went home to their farms at the end, they found others living on their land which really angered them. They had lost everything fighting for the kingdom and they still got shafted.
imake13 03-12-07, 10:45 PM	I think there should be some epic battles, but I agree that fighting 45345378 orcs over and over again would become just plain tiresome. I also like that you compared things to The 13th Warrior, cause I really love the climactic battle scene at the end. Norse warriors for the win. yellowdingo, I like your idea, I get the concept you are going to there. Part of me thinks that it would be neat to have my characters have a few adventures first before war breaks out, just to get a feel for my campaign world. Also, How would you guys go about doing a session that involves military training? I would like to do that.
GoriceXII 03-13-07, 03:21 AM	I thought you might find it interesting for me to share a bit of what went on during tonight's session of my game. Situation Overall: the city of Fineberg has been under siege for nearly a month now by a large force of barbarians, humanoids and mercenaries. The defenders have repelled two escalades so far and destroyed an enemy squadron that attempted to penetrate the harbour. Now an eerie game of mining and countermining, spying and scouting, under cloak of darkness and magic takes place... Player Character POV: Kallyn Finnhald is a ranger from a patrician family whose patron is Captain Loegaire. She is a Lieutenant in the Army of the Republic of New Edom, whose forces are sent to augment that of the militia of Fineberg. (note: fellow PCs were up to different non related stuff this evening) Start: Kallyn wakes and is assisted in washing, dressing and donning armor by her servant and lover Dassah. Breaking her fast with Dassah and other companions (the Pseudo Dragon Xanoth, the Cleric Mereka Fabian and the Psion Aevar Arnorsson) she then goes to inspect the training of her troops. She feels vaguely hungry; since the siege began food is rationed and the porridge of meal, nuts and dried fruit is not quite enough. She normally commands 11 Light Troops (Regular Republican Army unit of mounted scouts with light crossbows, spears and short swords under a Sergeant) but has been given temporary command of a group of militia from various villages and small towns that fled the enemy into Fineberg. She has been given a week to form them into a half-company that can mount a guard on the walls. Kallyn inspects the stable area and spends some time grooming and caring for her own horses in particular. She favours Chase, a sturdy bay who is also her Companion. Chase is being trained by her as she is being trained by her patron and Captain. Loegaire, an older more experienced ranger. Unlike herself Chase is not being rationed; no warhorses are lest they lose their conditioning. One of the soldiers given stablehand duty mutters, "damned horses eat better'n we do..." thinking Kallyn doesn't hear. The Colour-Sergeant sent to help her with the training has prepared a regimen which she approves: the troops are to be trained as a unit in climbing stairs rapidly and efficiently, repelling ladders, forming pike and crossbow formations and responding to drum and horn signals. The strength of the Republic lies in this drill, in infantry power. Kallyn never fails to impress upon them that the wall is the first line of defense now. Kallyn has an embarassing moment during one point of drill where the forest savages and hunters making up her own unit brutally try to attack the militiamen, getting carried away. Though valiant troops they tend to have trouble adapting to city life, as in a way does she. All would prefer to be out raiding the enemy rather than waiting... Speaking of which: Kallyn proposes to her captain that they start to plan their own raids and sorties. She understands the need to train the militia and man the walls but her own training suggests taking initiative, using her talents and those of her followers in stealth and surprise attack. Her Captain agrees. Kallyn persuades the Pseudo Dragon Xanoth to fly stealthily towards the enemy encampment. Through him she determines that four main units face hers. The enemy units consist of two companies of household bannermen of the enemy duke, a mercenary company and a company consisting of people from a barbarian tribe. A stream and a road run down to the rocky coast where another encampment exists to resupply the main body of troops. It is watched over by sentries but not patrolled in a way she finds threatening: the enemy patrols consist of mounted soldiers who are more to discourage enemy movements than genuine stealth. A scouting effort during the night reveals that camp followers, mercenaries (who come from various nations) mingle and wander in the mercenary encampment. Not far off from this division is the engineering area where hobgoblins and goblins are busy working on siege engines. Already they have erected a new siege tower and are finishing work on mangonels and rams. Hammering and sawing make a constant din. The enemy are eating well but surely a demoralizing series of blows will give them pause...the General's tactic of scorched earth has made it necessary to bring food by sea on a regular basis. Though sheep baa behind wicker enclosures and cattle low surely they must run out. Marking patches and badges, cloak designs and weapon styles, Kallyn notes how best to make use of the mercenaries to confuse the enemy about where loyalties lie and who is friend to who. Plans to stampede livestock, destroy stockpiles of arrows and spears, slit the throats of sentries are made. Kallyn after resting at midday discovers as she goes through the common room to the hall that leads to the private rooms upstairs one of the militiamen busy with one of the kitchenmaids, her skirt around her waist. Blushing and frowning she talks to Dassah about this and Dassah says it is not the first time it has happened. Some of the maids seem to spend half their time with one lad or another in fact, she says. Dassah asks incidentally if she can have some money to buy a lute. Kallyn counts out the gold for her and then goes to have a talk with the innkeep. It occurs to Kallyn that she's spent more than half the loot she got from the last venture before the siege started. The innkeep is a mournful woman who sighing tells her she had been meaning to bring it up with Kallyn--when will these people pay for the services rendered? After all her girls don't work for nothing... Kallyn, embarassed, says she will look into it. Talking with Captain Loegaire, who is busy grooming his horse (though a captain he is hands on with his animals) she explains the situation. He answers that the easiest way to deal with such matters is through her scribe, who can arrange accounts with regard to the soldiers' pay. Kallyn is a bit appalled but sees that she can either order them all to be celibate or deal with the situation in some fashion. Kallyn later sits down to a simple and somewhat inadequate meal of stringy mutton, parsnips and black bread washed down with thin ale with her friends to plan their raids on the enemy lines...
imake13 03-13-07, 04:25 AM	Awesome read man... i'll post my thoughts when my gf gets her computer necessary homework done.
yellowdingo 03-13-07, 08:43 AM	How would you guys go about doing a session that involves military training? I would like to do that. "Allright!" The Old Seargent Leaned out over the edge of the Flying Gondola and looked down at deepest Orcland far below. "We are now over the drop zone." The Halfling Recruits looked over the edge and puked in unison. The Seargent Smiled and shook his head. As your final test you must make it back across the Border into the Kingdom of Standsalone!" The Gondola swooped low over a muddy swamp and the instructors tossed the Halflings overboard Screaming. "Goodluck!" Seargent Bigbrassboots turned to the Helmsman. "Get us outa here before they kill us." "Ay Seargent!" The Gondola turned away from certain danger and headed home.
imake13 03-13-07, 12:58 PM	Hmm... now I love tossing small sized creatures as much as the next guy... but that might be what we here in the land of nod call a "bit" drastic. :P
bloodtalon 03-14-07, 08:46 AM	why not do it this way have them start out as gaurds for caravans for the front line troops or messengers. haveing to get from the king to the generals while the enemy send out interceptors to get the orders if they fail to reach the general i time bad things will fall the army or have them send dispactes from one unit to the other and if that unit fails to get the orders and dont move which means the flank is left open or the enemy gets the order was able to set up an ambuse and destory a company or 2. as they get higher make them into inflitrators. sneaking behind enemy lines to capture high ranking memebers of the enemey or spreading rumors about what they are planning to do next. then in the high levels make them like neavy seals. going in and setting up the way the forces will travel. scuring bridges, opening up draw bridges, rearriangeing signs to confuse the enmy, be dressed up like "captians and majors" and redirecting the reinforcements to areas where they would do no good.
imake13 03-15-07, 01:25 PM	I have been thinking lately... and one of the ideas I have been considering is some kind of parallel event that mimics our real history. Perhaps somekind of holocaust type thing, etc? Something that gets my players motivated to go to war. I dunno, what do you think?
imake13 03-15-07, 11:51 PM	Any thoughts on how to mimic something like the holocaust in D&D?
yellowdingo 03-16-07, 03:28 AM	Any thoughts on how to mimic something like the holocaust in D&D? Which Holocaust would that be? The Roman Invasion of Israel inwhich numerous tribes were slaughtered? The German Slaughter of Gypsies, Jews and Communists in ww2? The Christian Purges of Jews and Gipsies AD1000-AD1800? THe Turkish Slaughter of Armenians AD1914-18? The Genocidal rise of Religion in AMERICA 500AD-1500AD? The Slaughter of the Arab Upperclasses and abduction of the Artisans caste by the Mongols? The Fluffy Bunny incident of fifty-nine?
yellowdingo 03-16-07, 03:34 AM	So cook the Halflings in big Steam chambers. It is easy to make a religious holocaust. Clerics get their Spells based on the number of sacrifices they make anyhow.
imake13 03-16-07, 01:05 PM	Well I want something that is really going to connect with my players. They have really been into WWII lately... (as have I) and so I was thinking about how to mimic WWII a bit in a D&D setting. It would give me alot of room to make it epic and dark. what do you guys think?
imake13 03-16-07, 09:11 PM	I have been putting some thought into it, and after some discussion with my gf who is currently taking a history of the holocaust class in this semester, I have been thinking about putting some ideas down on paper. I think the high elves would be a perfect race to set up an ethnic cleansing with. We all know that there are WAAAAY many sub-races of the original high elf, including the half-elf, and the high elves are perfect candidates for creating a "pure-blooded" race. I think I want to start it subtly and see what the small racism and propaganda does for my players... It would be interesting to see them take sides. Thoughts?
bloodtalon 03-17-07, 04:55 PM	one promblem i have with the elves with your plan is that they are CG for something like what you want they would need to be LN or LE be easier to say a branch of dwarves did that say a ultra conservative branch of mountain dwarves decid all other types of dwarves are eveil and start geneocide to em elves are too forgiving unlesss it coems to dwarves to go that way hope that helps
imake13 03-17-07, 07:51 PM	Well if you look historically at germany at the time of the holocaust... they were absolutely convinced that what they were doing was both justified and necessary for the survival of their bloodline. I dunno... it seems right up the elves ally for me.
GoriceXII 03-18-07, 02:22 AM	Elves are the secret behind the scenes villains in my campaign. A faction of elves believe that humanity and other races have ruined the beautiful world that once was and that they have to be eliminated. According to legend the elvish people once posessed powerful weapons that were horrifyingly destructive, so much so that when tempted to use them outside of pure necessity wise elvish leaders used a powerful spell that obscured what precisely they were and hid them away using magic. While there are factions of elves that wish to increasingly retire to remote or wild places, and while others have begun living among more mortal races or resigining themselves to being slowly overwhelmed by them this cabal of evil elves has formed a plan whereby they will cause a number of terrible conflicts and dangers which ultimately must come to the doorstep of the elvish countries. Then their own people must face annihilation or undo the magics and thus enable themselves to become the most powerful race on the planet.
imake13 03-18-07, 03:18 AM	I think having elves as bad guys is a great idea... cause honestly... who expects it? Happy St. Patty's day!
GoriceXII 03-18-07, 04:35 AM	Thanks, happy Saint Paddy's to you too. My players btw know that there is SOME kind of elvish conspiracy--they just don't know enough to talk to anyone in authority without causing some kind of horrible paranoia, utter dismissal of their views or the like. Since they are busy with other stuff (like the war going on) they have put it on the back shelf for now. However I've noticed they already look at every elf they meet a bit askance now. They only met one plotter and she is now in a deep dark dungeon far away.