Magic vs Technology/Science [Archive] - Wizards Community

Magic vs Technology/Science [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Taliesin52
06-30-07, 07:34 PM I'm trying to work on a new campaign world where science and technology are just beginning to appear. The main hook is that magic and technology cannot coexist side by side. What's more, technology will be superior to magic, leading to the eventual (not necessarily during the campaign itself) decline and death of magic.

I want magic to be weaker when in the presence of technology. If a wizard wants to cast a spell next to a steam engine or in the presence of some rifles, I don't want it working as well. What I need is a measurable mechanic and a penalty. I assume the best penalty would be a CL penalty. But how do I decide what the penalty is? IE., when is it a -1 and when is it a -4 to CL? Clearly a steam engine or giant city clock will be more "technological" than a weathervane or pulley-lever contraption. But other than "DM's prerogative" on each thing my players come across.
Bedlamtom
06-30-07, 08:30 PM at heart technology will win out over magic even if magic is not inherantly weaker near the tech.

Any idiot can fire a blunderbus, but it takes years of study to learn to cast a magic missile.

All tech requires is cash. More folks have cash then have brains or dedication to study.
Adrez Nesnsid
06-30-07, 10:05 PM And arthur C. Clarke once commented that "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic", and I, personally, would like to add that any sufficiently internally consistent form of magic is basically indistinguishable from physics (although certainly not the ophysics of the real world).
Forfeit
07-01-07, 01:01 PM Agree, technology is just as magical as an artifact. Just get a cell phone, for example. You can talk in real time with someone in the other side of the earth.

Now, I dont know about rules, but there is some material you could look for some inspiration.

- Thief The Dark Project (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thief:_The_Dark_Project)
- Arcanum: Of Steamworks and Magick Obscura (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arcanum:_Of_Steamworks_and_Magick_Obscur a)
- Castle Falkenstein RPG (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_Falkenstein_%28role-playing_game%29)

In my opinion, steampunk settings are the best.
NorthWind
07-01-07, 03:11 PM Maybe you could leave whether or not magic or technology wins out up to the players, so that at the end of the campaign, you could explain to them how they changed the game world. But that's just an idea, I'm not sure how much you want to keep to the theme of dying magic.
Taliesin52
07-01-07, 06:33 PM Agree, technology is just as magical as an artifact. Just get a cell phone, for example. You can talk in real time with someone in the other side of the earth.

Now, I dont know about rules, but there is some material you could look for some inspiration.

- Thief The Dark Project (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thief:_The_Dark_Project)
- Arcanum: Of Steamworks and Magick Obscura (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arcanum:_Of_Steamworks_and_Magick_Obscur a)
- Castle Falkenstein RPG (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_Falkenstein_%28role-playing_game%29)

In my opinion, steampunk settings are the best.

Thanks I'll take a look at those. I want to strike a balance between steampunk fantastic creations and more historical inventions. On one hand the whole point of the setting is the move away from fantasy to a world founded in science (I eventually plan on many magical beasts and fantastic creatures going extinct) but on the other hands with dwarves and gnomes building machines, there will be a certain fantastic level to them.

Maybe you could leave whether or not magic or technology wins out up to the players, so that at the end of the campaign, you could explain to them how they changed the game world. But that's just an idea, I'm not sure how much you want to keep to the theme of dying magic.

I generally do like to leave things up to the players, but the transition from magic to technology is the heart of the world. Their actions may delay it or expedite it a bit, but it will happen one way or another, likely long after the campaign ends.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Taliesin52 06-30-07, 07:34 PM	I'm trying to work on a new campaign world where science and technology are just beginning to appear. The main hook is that magic and technology cannot coexist side by side. What's more, technology will be superior to magic, leading to the eventual (not necessarily during the campaign itself) decline and death of magic. I want magic to be weaker when in the presence of technology. If a wizard wants to cast a spell next to a steam engine or in the presence of some rifles, I don't want it working as well. What I need is a measurable mechanic and a penalty. I assume the best penalty would be a CL penalty. But how do I decide what the penalty is? IE., when is it a -1 and when is it a -4 to CL? Clearly a steam engine or giant city clock will be more "technological" than a weathervane or pulley-lever contraption. But other than "DM's prerogative" on each thing my players come across.
Bedlamtom 06-30-07, 08:30 PM	at heart technology will win out over magic even if magic is not inherantly weaker near the tech. Any idiot can fire a blunderbus, but it takes years of study to learn to cast a magic missile. All tech requires is cash. More folks have cash then have brains or dedication to study.
Adrez Nesnsid 06-30-07, 10:05 PM	And arthur C. Clarke once commented that "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic", and I, personally, would like to add that any sufficiently internally consistent form of magic is basically indistinguishable from physics (although certainly not the ophysics of the real world).
Forfeit 07-01-07, 01:01 PM	Agree, technology is just as magical as an artifact. Just get a cell phone, for example. You can talk in real time with someone in the other side of the earth. Now, I dont know about rules, but there is some material you could look for some inspiration. - Thief The Dark Project (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thief:_The_Dark_Project) - Arcanum: Of Steamworks and Magick Obscura (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arcanum:_Of_Steamworks_and_Magick_Obscur a) - Castle Falkenstein RPG (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_Falkenstein_%28role-playing_game%29) In my opinion, steampunk settings are the best.
NorthWind 07-01-07, 03:11 PM	Maybe you could leave whether or not magic or technology wins out up to the players, so that at the end of the campaign, you could explain to them how they changed the game world. But that's just an idea, I'm not sure how much you want to keep to the theme of dying magic.
Taliesin52 07-01-07, 06:33 PM	Agree, technology is just as magical as an artifact. Just get a cell phone, for example. You can talk in real time with someone in the other side of the earth. Now, I dont know about rules, but there is some material you could look for some inspiration. - Thief The Dark Project (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thief:_The_Dark_Project) - Arcanum: Of Steamworks and Magick Obscura (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arcanum:_Of_Steamworks_and_Magick_Obscur a) - Castle Falkenstein RPG (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Castle_Falkenstein_%28role-playing_game%29) In my opinion, steampunk settings are the best. Thanks I'll take a look at those. I want to strike a balance between steampunk fantastic creations and more historical inventions. On one hand the whole point of the setting is the move away from fantasy to a world founded in science (I eventually plan on many magical beasts and fantastic creatures going extinct) but on the other hands with dwarves and gnomes building machines, there will be a certain fantastic level to them. Maybe you could leave whether or not magic or technology wins out up to the players, so that at the end of the campaign, you could explain to them how they changed the game world. But that's just an idea, I'm not sure how much you want to keep to the theme of dying magic. I generally do like to leave things up to the players, but the transition from magic to technology is the heart of the world. Their actions may delay it or expedite it a bit, but it will happen one way or another, likely long after the campaign ends.