Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Koofoo95 07-30-07, 05:26 PM	So, in my setting there is a massive empire of six hundred million plus people. How its organized is this: The Emperor leads the empire(obviously) he divided the lands into ten provinces 10 Lords are in control of the provinces, they've divided the provinces into multiple communes A baron is in control of one commune and he in return divides the land into fiefs, appointing a vassal lord to run the fief the vassal lord governs the fiefdom and appoints plots of land to minor vassals and serfs Cities and towns are under the authority of the Baron, who appoints Lord Mayors to govern. Does this governmental system make sense and is it quasi realistic?
Rhineglade 07-30-07, 05:50 PM	Yes, what you have suggested is perfectly reasonable. It would technically by referred to as a "Feudal Empire." A few extra points: In such a land, essentially all of the country is the property of the Emperor. A "fief" is any landgrant between a "superior" and their "vassal." So the Emperor would also be granting a fief to his 10 Lords as well, and so on. Each successive "lord" could further subdivide their land and have vassals of their own all the way down to the peasant. The peasant would in effect be the "property" of their lord as would all of their property, surplus and buildings. The peasant would work the land for their lord in exchange for military protection. The Lord would likely be a vassal to a higher ranking noble who would either have to supply a certain number of soldiers OR to pay a corresponding tax in the form of either money or goods. The most general breakdown in social ranking is: Emperor Grand Duke Prince Archduke Duke Margrave Landgrave Count Viscount Baron Knight of the Manor Knight Freeman Serf Slave
ewancummins 07-30-07, 07:17 PM	Looks fine. Question: how does one become Emperor? Is it a hereditary office? Do the ten Lords elect an emperor to replace an old one that has died/been deposed?
Darth Syntax 07-30-07, 08:27 PM	It's certainly a possible form of governance, but given the population size (and the implied size) the government is going to have to have some means of maintaining a more direct control over the far-flung reaches of the empire. Unless the government is a very loose, decentralized sort of affair there is likely to be some kind of imperial civil service which is ostensibly loyal to the Emperor.
Koofoo95 07-31-07, 10:17 AM	Thanks for all the great replies they've helped alot. I hopefully wil be able to post a thread on the Empire itself(cultural workings, government, etc.) Thanks again.
Forfeit 07-31-07, 10:35 AM	I find it hard for such a huge population to live under a medieval government. Unless they area is very small. If its a huge area, the government will be very bureaucraty. And that means there will be a huge "middle class", which has a lot of power inside it.
queenfange 07-31-07, 12:32 PM	Only thing I have to say is that if the area is so huge (yes, it can be an empire- which is NOT medieval, even though some levels of feudalism exist in the imperial structure) is: How do the PCs fit in? If there's lots of monster disruptions, chaos will ensue and an empire couldn't hold- unless there are lots of adventuring groups. In that case, the adventuring groups would somehow need to be reckoned with by the government, who needs them to keep the world safe but yet not so powerful that they threaten the bureaucracy.
Koofoo95 07-31-07, 03:41 PM	I wasn't really going for pure medieval feel, more of, well, a feudal empire. The lands of the empire is very large(not sure square millage yet) but its big. The feel I was going for was ancient customs failing to meet modern requirements, so yes the Empire is on a down fall, decadence and corruption have bred internal chaos. I haven't thought of how the PC's are going to fit in, I'm just writing out nations and the like for my campaign setting. Monsters do exist in the more uncivilized areas of the empire but do not have the numbers or organization to pose a major threat. Local governments would be the ones responsible for dealing with such threats via militias, mercenaries(pc's?) or requisitioning military support. Hopefully by midnight tonight(central european) I will have more of an outline. Thanks again, the questions have really got me thinking!
Forfeit 07-31-07, 04:16 PM	I hope you know that in our middle ages, 600 million people was the entire population of the earth. In 1000 its estimated that there were about 310 million on earth. And as queenfange said, why would the adventurers be needed? They could easily assemble an army of 1000 soldiers and kill anything they wanted. And I really dont think you know what 600 million people mean. 600.000 is a lot of people already.
Koofoo95 07-31-07, 06:12 PM	Meh, I've always liked the idea of massive amounts of people in a vast area. To explain why the Empire just doesn't assemble vast amounts of soldiers to do its bidding: failed attempts at expansion into other territories has resulted in giving the empire many enemies. While geographically the empire is isolated(more on this later) the ever present threat of foreign invasion has spread the Imperial legion's soldiers across the vast borders.(or something like that) I'm beginning to doubt the size of it, I think I will drop its population down. But in the mean time.... comments/criticisms welcomed The Grand Empire of Pasval The Pasvalvian Empire at a glance: Population: 623,920,000 (90% Human, 5% Halfling, 5% Other) Government: Autocratic fiefdom, Emperor Juozapas Calamer XIV Fiefs, Rulers, and pronunciation: Lord Aras Gaulle ruler of Taurage (pronounced Toor-Age) Lord Mykolas Dwar ruler of Kalvarija (pronounced Kal-Var-iya) Lord Vadimas Nordman ruler of Raseinani (pronounced Raz-in-ani) Lady Gintare Eleina ruler of Kelme (pronounced Kell-may) Lord Herkus Menc ruler of Linkuva (pronounced Lin-KU-va) Lady Svajone Deam ruler of Visaginas(pronounced Vis-gin-eeas) Lord Jurgis Deam ruler of Naujoli (pronounced Now-holy) Lady Ona Anian ruler of Arigoloa (pronounced R-go-lo-ah) Lord Karolis Natin ruler of Rasvilikis (pronounced Rahz-veeli-kiss) Lord Algis Carmatin ruler of Tytuvenai (pronounced Tie-too-venee-i) Capital City: Pasval Major Religion: the Church of Kalkos, the Cult of the Ascenders, the Host of the Heavens (various local cults do exist but are too numerous to list) Government and economics: The awe inspiring vastness of the Grand Empire of Pasval can only truly be seen in the few maps of the world that exist. Over four million miles of territory are under the control of the Empire. These lands encompass rivers, seas, forests, and mountains. Every man, woman, and child that lives in the land between the Kalkonian peaks to the north, the Deamian Ocean to the east and south, and the Great wood to the west lives under the banner of Emperor Calamer. These lands are broken up into ten provinces. The provinces are massive areas of land governed by one of ten Noble families. The nobles must pay a yearly tithe in goods, coin, and soldiers for the Imperial Army. Nobles are expected to regulate the taxes, create military fortifications, and form province defense legions. The Nobles of the Empire are responsible for leading astronomical amounts of land, making it impossible for them to govern each part individually. They divide their lands up into Duchies and appoint a Duke to control the Duchy. The number of Duchies varies depending on the size of the province. Dukes are responsible for the public works, military fortifications, and training soldiers. The Dukes are responsible for paying a yearly tithe to the Nobility, some of the tithe is used to pay the Emperor, and the rest is used to line the nobility’s pockets. Duke’s attention can only go to some many projects at once, therefore a Duke divides his Duchy into Baronies, and the Baronies are under the control of an appointed Baron. Dukes also have the ability to appoint Counts. Counts are minor nobles who raise armies using their own wealth as a treasury as opposed to requisitioning funds from the Empire’s coffers. These Counts are given groups of Fiefs to increase their assets. They are essentially minor barons. The Baronies are smaller areas of land given to a Baron. The Baron’s are responsible for constructing cites, aiding in public works, and collecting taxes from the Lord Vassals. Barons also control the cities in their Baronies, to aid in governing they appoint a ruler to each town, the Lord Mayor. They also are required to create knightly orders and supply these orders with soldiers. Common payment for the knights is given them the title of Lord Vassal. Knight or not, the Barons give the title of Lord Vassal to their appointed rulers of fiefs. The Lord Vassal controls land that consists primarily of farms. They are responsible for creating villages, raising militias, and collecting taxes. The Lord Vassals distribute plots of land to Vassal Minors and Serfs who in return pay a tax of coin and a tithe of goods. Minor Vassals are free men who are given land in exchange for payment or as a reward. They work their land and sell their goods, but are forced to pay taxes and a small tithe. Serfs are essentially slaves who work the land given to them in return for protection or to pay off a debt. A serf’s debt is expected to be paid in coin; they don’t pay taxes, but are tithed heavily in goods. They must work the land until they can sell enough of whatever goods are left over after tithes and must use whatever coin is left after buying the necessities to pay off their debts. A debt is to a family and is passed down to children so it is possible for a debt to be in a family for generations. The Lord Vassal sends the taxes and tithes up the chain of command and can set tithe percents as they see fit.