+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class [Archive] - Wizards Community

+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Dracazar
11-12-05, 05:39 AM A Psion will gain "Power Points/Day" and "Powers Known" and "Maximum Power Level Known" if he takes ELDRITCH KNIGHT as prestige class?

ELDRITCH KNIGHT says "+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class"

Basically I dont' know if I can adapt core prestige classes to psionics classes, any hint?

Thanks
FriendlyBiscuit
11-12-05, 05:50 AM No.
Psionics/magic transparency is basically identical to divine/arcane transparency. Think of it as being arcane/divine/psionics, not magic/psionics. There are subtle differences, but treating them as arcane/divine/psionics is closest to the truth.
Esponer
11-12-05, 08:00 AM A Psion will gain "Power Points/Day" and "Powers Known" and "Maximum Power Level Known" if he takes ELDRITCH KNIGHT as prestige class?

ELDRITCH KNIGHT says "+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class"

Basically I dont' know if I can adapt core prestige classes to psionics classes, any hint?

Thanks

That's how you'd go about it if you wanted to house rule a psionic version of the class eldritch knight, yes. But it says "arcane spellcasting class", so the class itself doesn't let you.
Blaque
11-12-05, 11:08 AM Going to harp what the others have said...but , there is not much keeping you from just swapping that out , I think.

Namely since they've now have three versions of mystic theurge (psionic theurge on the website, and the simaller arcane/psionic PrC in the XPH). I'm on eo fthose "Sure, why not" sorta folks to be hoenst, htough, it would be really easy for psionic warriors to get into.

Stuff.
DarknessEternal
11-12-05, 12:17 PM The mechanics of Psionics really don't get along well with magic PrCs. For example, there are ZERO psionic PrCs that have full manifester progression. Psionics as a whole are more powerful than magic.
Molot
11-12-05, 12:29 PM A Psion will gain "Power Points/Day" and "Powers Known" and "Maximum Power Level Known" if he takes ELDRITCH KNIGHT as prestige class?Since he is technically unable to take that PrC at all the answer does not matter, does it?

Ok, he may qualify thanx to Wiz & Cleric levels, but then it is obvious that EK will give bonuses to Wiz & Clc, not psion.

But there are specific Psi/Div and Psi/Arc PrCs he may use...
Rulebook
11-12-05, 02:28 PM Molot, try to keep up here... we've already estabilshed he cant be an EK. the poster is asking if he can modify (home brew a prc in essence) a PrC functionally identical to the EK, but for Psionic types instead of arcane spellcasters.
Jaid
11-12-05, 02:44 PM The mechanics of Psionics really don't get along well with magic PrCs. For example, there are ZERO psionic PrCs that have full manifester progression. Psionics as a whole are more powerful than magic.no, actually, that is one of the reasons why psionics are *not* more powerful than magic, on the whole.

psionics is much more closely balanced than magic in general. pretty much every "exploit" i have ever seen with psionics can either be done better, faster, or more easily by using magic... or depends on the DM not knowing the rules, and is usually only brought up because the person who designed the exploit also doesn't know the rules.
Seeker of Undeath
11-12-05, 04:01 PM A Psion will gain "Power Points/Day" and "Powers Known" and "Maximum Power Level Known" if he takes ELDRITCH KNIGHT as prestige class?No, not as printed, but you should have a look at the Slayer PrC in the expanded psionics handbook. It's the same but with benefits.ELDRITCH KNIGHT says "+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class"Sadly a psion doesn't cast spells let alone arcane ones.Basically I dont' know if I can adapt core prestige classes to psionics classes, any hint?You could, but again I refer you to the Slayer (originally printed as Illithid Slayer. It's been redone in the SRD.)
DarknessEternal
11-12-05, 04:20 PM psionics is much more closely balanced than magic in general. pretty much every "exploit" i have ever seen with psionics can either be done better, faster, or more easily by using magic...

Pun-Pun is a psion. Synchronicity and Temporal Acceleration are powers.
Nephlite
11-12-05, 05:16 PM Pun-Pun is a psion. Synchronicity and Temporal Acceleration are powers.
Nope:

Pun-Pun is a level 5 Wizard if you want the faster way to Pun-Pun. The long way to Pun-Pun is Psionics (have to be at least 12th level).

Synchronicity is a Splatbook power, not XPH or core material. Do the smart thing, ban it.

Temporal Acceleration is no more powerful than Time Stop.

Psion will gain "Power Points/Day" and "Powers Known" and "Maximum Power Level Known" if he takes ELDRITCH KNIGHT as prestige class?

ELDRITCH KNIGHT says "+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class"

Basically I dont' know if I can adapt core prestige classes to psionics classes, any hint?

Easy: Change Prequisits of Eldritch Knight to manifesting powers.
Change bonus to manifesting to say: +1 level of existing psionic manifesting class.

Psion will gain "Power Points/Day" and "Powers Known" and "Maximum Power Level Known" if he takes ELDRITCH KNIGHT as prestige class?

If you chabe Eldritch Knight yes.
Just like a Sorceror gains:
More spells/day, more spells known, and more max spells known.
(Max spells known is listed under heafing spells known lol)

A Soecror could know less, but why would he want to.
Lord Schpungus
11-12-05, 10:11 PM The EK already loses a caster level, but if you make it psionic, I think it could use another level lost at least.

As for Pun-Pun, the trick is doable in arcane, as well, and much easier. The problem is not psionics, it's Serpent Kingdoms.
runestar
11-12-05, 10:27 PM How does the arcane punpun route go? I am only aware of the psionic version. :confused:
Jaid
11-12-05, 10:41 PM some faerun template that grants wild shape as an 11th level druid (divine minion or something?), Master of many forms at level 3-5 iirc. lets you wildshape into a 14 HD creature (ie a sarrukh) and you can then go from there.

synchronicity is ONE example of a power that is overpowered, and only because it is vaguely written. if you have it do what it is intended to do, most people will ignore it. any half-decent min/maxer will blow away what a psion can do, simply by using a cleric or druid, and even a wizard or sorceror is usually better.

temporal acceleration is a watered down version of time stop. and hey, guess what... by the time it does the *minimum* that time stop can do, it's an 8th level power by cost. to achieve the average of time stop, you must manifest it paying as much as if it were a 12th level power (23 PP) or 14th level power (27 PP). i don't see that as a major problem, considering for that level spell slot, you could manifest a maximised, or maximised empowered time stop.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Dracazar 11-12-05, 05:39 AM	A Psion will gain "Power Points/Day" and "Powers Known" and "Maximum Power Level Known" if he takes ELDRITCH KNIGHT as prestige class? ELDRITCH KNIGHT says "+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class" Basically I dont' know if I can adapt core prestige classes to psionics classes, any hint? Thanks
FriendlyBiscuit 11-12-05, 05:50 AM	No. Psionics/magic transparency is basically identical to divine/arcane transparency. Think of it as being arcane/divine/psionics, not magic/psionics. There are subtle differences, but treating them as arcane/divine/psionics is closest to the truth.
Esponer 11-12-05, 08:00 AM	A Psion will gain "Power Points/Day" and "Powers Known" and "Maximum Power Level Known" if he takes ELDRITCH KNIGHT as prestige class? ELDRITCH KNIGHT says "+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class" Basically I dont' know if I can adapt core prestige classes to psionics classes, any hint? Thanks That's how you'd go about it if you wanted to house rule a psionic version of the class eldritch knight, yes. But it says "arcane spellcasting class", so the class itself doesn't let you.
Blaque 11-12-05, 11:08 AM	Going to harp what the others have said...but , there is not much keeping you from just swapping that out , I think. Namely since they've now have three versions of mystic theurge (psionic theurge on the website, and the simaller arcane/psionic PrC in the XPH). I'm on eo fthose "Sure, why not" sorta folks to be hoenst, htough, it would be really easy for psionic warriors to get into. Stuff.
DarknessEternal 11-12-05, 12:17 PM	The mechanics of Psionics really don't get along well with magic PrCs. For example, there are ZERO psionic PrCs that have full manifester progression. Psionics as a whole are more powerful than magic.
Molot 11-12-05, 12:29 PM	A Psion will gain "Power Points/Day" and "Powers Known" and "Maximum Power Level Known" if he takes ELDRITCH KNIGHT as prestige class?Since he is technically unable to take that PrC at all the answer does not matter, does it? Ok, he may qualify thanx to Wiz & Cleric levels, but then it is obvious that EK will give bonuses to Wiz & Clc, not psion. But there are specific Psi/Div and Psi/Arc PrCs he may use...
Rulebook 11-12-05, 02:28 PM	Molot, try to keep up here... we've already estabilshed he cant be an EK. the poster is asking if he can modify (home brew a prc in essence) a PrC functionally identical to the EK, but for Psionic types instead of arcane spellcasters.
Jaid 11-12-05, 02:44 PM	The mechanics of Psionics really don't get along well with magic PrCs. For example, there are ZERO psionic PrCs that have full manifester progression. Psionics as a whole are more powerful than magic.no, actually, that is one of the reasons why psionics are not more powerful than magic, on the whole. psionics is much more closely balanced than magic in general. pretty much every "exploit" i have ever seen with psionics can either be done better, faster, or more easily by using magic... or depends on the DM not knowing the rules, and is usually only brought up because the person who designed the exploit also doesn't know the rules.
Seeker of Undeath 11-12-05, 04:01 PM	A Psion will gain "Power Points/Day" and "Powers Known" and "Maximum Power Level Known" if he takes ELDRITCH KNIGHT as prestige class?No, not as printed, but you should have a look at the Slayer PrC in the expanded psionics handbook. It's the same but with benefits.ELDRITCH KNIGHT says "+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class"Sadly a psion doesn't cast spells let alone arcane ones.Basically I dont' know if I can adapt core prestige classes to psionics classes, any hint?You could, but again I refer you to the Slayer (originally printed as Illithid Slayer. It's been redone in the SRD.)
DarknessEternal 11-12-05, 04:20 PM	psionics is much more closely balanced than magic in general. pretty much every "exploit" i have ever seen with psionics can either be done better, faster, or more easily by using magic... Pun-Pun is a psion. Synchronicity and Temporal Acceleration are powers.
Nephlite 11-12-05, 05:16 PM	Pun-Pun is a psion. Synchronicity and Temporal Acceleration are powers. Nope: Pun-Pun is a level 5 Wizard if you want the faster way to Pun-Pun. The long way to Pun-Pun is Psionics (have to be at least 12th level). Synchronicity is a Splatbook power, not XPH or core material. Do the smart thing, ban it. Temporal Acceleration is no more powerful than Time Stop. Psion will gain "Power Points/Day" and "Powers Known" and "Maximum Power Level Known" if he takes ELDRITCH KNIGHT as prestige class? ELDRITCH KNIGHT says "+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class" Basically I dont' know if I can adapt core prestige classes to psionics classes, any hint? Easy: Change Prequisits of Eldritch Knight to manifesting powers. Change bonus to manifesting to say: +1 level of existing psionic manifesting class. Psion will gain "Power Points/Day" and "Powers Known" and "Maximum Power Level Known" if he takes ELDRITCH KNIGHT as prestige class? If you chabe Eldritch Knight yes. Just like a Sorceror gains: More spells/day, more spells known, and more max spells known. (Max spells known is listed under heafing spells known lol) A Soecror could know less, but why would he want to.
Lord Schpungus 11-12-05, 10:11 PM	The EK already loses a caster level, but if you make it psionic, I think it could use another level lost at least. As for Pun-Pun, the trick is doable in arcane, as well, and much easier. The problem is not psionics, it's Serpent Kingdoms.
runestar 11-12-05, 10:27 PM	How does the arcane punpun route go? I am only aware of the psionic version. :confused:
Jaid 11-12-05, 10:41 PM	some faerun template that grants wild shape as an 11th level druid (divine minion or something?), Master of many forms at level 3-5 iirc. lets you wildshape into a 14 HD creature (ie a sarrukh) and you can then go from there. synchronicity is ONE example of a power that is overpowered, and only because it is vaguely written. if you have it do what it is intended to do, most people will ignore it. any half-decent min/maxer will blow away what a psion can do, simply by using a cleric or druid, and even a wizard or sorceror is usually better. temporal acceleration is a watered down version of time stop. and hey, guess what... by the time it does the minimum that time stop can do, it's an 8th level power by cost. to achieve the average of time stop, you must manifest it paying as much as if it were a 12th level power (23 PP) or 14th level power (27 PP). i don't see that as a major problem, considering for that level spell slot, you could manifest a maximised, or maximised empowered time stop.