4th party member suggestions [Archive] - Wizards Community

4th party member suggestions [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
john_bakken
02-12-07, 01:19 PM My group is starting a new campaign. There will be a scout, a poverty monk/kensai, and a bard. I would like your input on the 4th character. I am trying to decide between:

Warlock (all 20 levels)
Warlock/Cleric (going for eldricht disciple)
Dragon Shaman

What do you think?
MerrikCale
02-12-07, 01:21 PM dragon shaman
The_Shaman
02-12-07, 01:35 PM Cleric (possibly warlock/cleric) would be nice for the healing, support, and summons. I'm also not sure how your party will handle the lack of a full-time arcanist (though the bard could fill in the gap relatively well), but I guess you know the group best.

Dragon shaman could be good, but I'm not very familiar with how far its auras will compensate for proper spellcasting. Warlock could be useful too, but with 4 people it's good to aim for versatility.
john_bakken
02-12-07, 01:39 PM I thought about favored soul, but I really want to go for the warlock or dragon shaman. Can't do warlock/favored soul to get into the eldricht disciple, because you need turn undead.
gullas
02-12-07, 01:39 PM ...well I think a lvl 20 cleric is the best choice:D ....then again as so many times before I don't make any sense:rolleyes: , so a wizard/archmage could also be usefull:)

mabey a lvl 20 fighter ;)
john_bakken
02-12-07, 01:42 PM While I agree a level 20 cleric would be a good choice. I've played them so many times, that I want something new. Thus, not the best choice this time.
The_Shaman
02-12-07, 01:43 PM How about a psionicist, then? A wilder can be considered somewhat comparable to the warlock, if you want to try a class with a challenging spell selection.
Joseph_Silver
02-12-07, 01:44 PM Dragon shaman. They pwn.
crimsonwolf
02-12-07, 01:45 PM just by looking at your party style theres alot of stealth there... why not go for like a cleric of mask or something? go for teh tricky and shadows domain and be a gnome theif.... u want differnce there you go .. a holy rouge
BrazilRascal
02-12-07, 01:47 PM They need a tank/healer badly. I'd say go with a straight cleric of Pelor, or maybe a Crusader.
crimsonwolf
02-12-07, 02:00 PM well it relly depends ont he rp fluff going on .. i mean a heavy armored healer might pen point them out.. a healer yes but rember brazil not everything is the wizard healer rouge fighter...

what exactly is going on in the game?
Edea
02-12-07, 02:23 PM WotC seems to think so. As BrazilRascal said, your party needs a healer, (I think a primary arcanist), and a tank. This is not material for a triple threat build.

The easiest role to mimic using a nonstandard class assignment is tank. Spells can eventually turn any cleric or even wizard into a durability machine, and warlocks already get cold iron DR. The bard has some arcane/healing ability, but it definitely needs to be supplemented.

I'd say go for the Eldritch Disciple route. Divine magic is SORELY needed here, and that build choice is the best compromise without making you play the walking band-aid again. Then again, I'm not terribly familiar with Dragon Shaman, so I can't comment on it.
crimsonwolf
02-12-07, 02:47 PM am relly trying to stayt withen a stealth aspect...

Rogue 6/ Fighter 3/ Cleric of Mask 11/ Divine Agent 2.

rouge skills and stab.. fighter feats and bab.....cleric of mask is a prc gratns you stealth shadow steppin and helaing... agent is a healer upgrade
The_Shaman
02-12-07, 03:05 PM Well, just because a cleric can wear plate doesn't mean s/he must. If particular stealth is called for, a variant of the shadowbane stalker, a modified daggerspell cultist, or just a straight thief (or ranger, or ninja)/cleric or shaman could work.

And that's even before we consider druid, spirit shaman, shugenja and the like. Don't get me wrong, the group doesn't need a healer if they don't want one, but stealth and divine magic are not incompatible.
Johnny_Angel
02-12-07, 03:11 PM It seems as though your party is built more for stealth than for heavily armored fighting, so I am taking that into consideration a little bit.

One idea could be to go with a sorceror and take the feat from Complete Divine that allows an arcane caster to add a domain's spells to his/her spell list. I can't recall the name of the feat, but I'm sure somebody else will reply to this and know the name. Anyway, pick healing as the domain you can cast spells from. Now your have some arcane power, and you also have the ability to heal. Depending on which way your bard is built, they should be able to do a little bit of healing at some point as well. Between the two of you, you should be able to cover the party's healing needs.
Bard-of-all-trades
02-12-07, 03:15 PM How about going Druid/Wizard/Arcane Hierophant? Level as wanted. Lets the Bard back you up for healing and arcane spells and then focus on buffing the party. Plus this lets you stay "sneaky-sneaky" as well with that whole not wearing metal armor/arcane spell failure thing working there.
kadeity
02-12-07, 03:28 PM If your a dragon shaman, see if your dm will let you choose a dragon from this list ;) http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=11431436#post11431436

I created a list of variants that let you play any of the Gem dragons, Lung Dragons, Faerunian Dragons ect.

im not just saying that to toot my own horn; im saying it because these dragon choices make the shaman alot more fun.
crimsonwolf
02-12-07, 04:33 PM i will contiue with saying this... atleast a few levels of cleric.. invsiblity...or shadowcaster from ToB..oh and silent spell metafeat a must i would think for you..
Templario
02-12-07, 04:45 PM temple raider of olidammara is always a option to someone divine and tricksy
mittenninja
02-12-07, 04:50 PM go with the eldritch disciple, make sure you get the healing blast ability and the extra turning feat. Then guess what? HEALING FROM 250 FT AWAY LOTS OF TIMES PER DAY! (via. eldritch spear)
periscope
02-12-07, 06:27 PM http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?referrerid=406019&t=727364

Its a white mage you might like, that gives healing.

or this

http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=370164

this has a couple warlock variants in it you might like

the warlock can heal since they get UMD and I believe the ability to take 10 with it, as long as they stock up on scrolls and wands.

if you want a twist on the cleric, ask you DM if you can play a cleric that doesnt wear armor or use a shield as they say "my god/faith will protect me" and they gain a sacred bonus to ac equal to the wis or cha mod+1 per 4 or 5 levels (like the monk), in exchange your diety or the higher power your serve puts more power in your hands (you get 3 domains instead of 2). One of these can be the trickery domain (i think it gets you hide and move silently as class skills). If you manage to get the knock spell (dont know if its a cleric spell or on any domain list) you wont need to worry about picking locks. Heck take the magic domain with the trickery domain and you count as a wiz of half your levels for the use of magic item (wand of fireball anybody? DC 5 caster level check, in my sleep!).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
john_bakken 02-12-07, 01:19 PM	My group is starting a new campaign. There will be a scout, a poverty monk/kensai, and a bard. I would like your input on the 4th character. I am trying to decide between: Warlock (all 20 levels) Warlock/Cleric (going for eldricht disciple) Dragon Shaman What do you think?
MerrikCale 02-12-07, 01:21 PM	dragon shaman
The_Shaman 02-12-07, 01:35 PM	Cleric (possibly warlock/cleric) would be nice for the healing, support, and summons. I'm also not sure how your party will handle the lack of a full-time arcanist (though the bard could fill in the gap relatively well), but I guess you know the group best. Dragon shaman could be good, but I'm not very familiar with how far its auras will compensate for proper spellcasting. Warlock could be useful too, but with 4 people it's good to aim for versatility.
john_bakken 02-12-07, 01:39 PM	I thought about favored soul, but I really want to go for the warlock or dragon shaman. Can't do warlock/favored soul to get into the eldricht disciple, because you need turn undead.
gullas 02-12-07, 01:39 PM	...well I think a lvl 20 cleric is the best choice:D ....then again as so many times before I don't make any sense:rolleyes: , so a wizard/archmage could also be usefull:) mabey a lvl 20 fighter ;)
john_bakken 02-12-07, 01:42 PM	While I agree a level 20 cleric would be a good choice. I've played them so many times, that I want something new. Thus, not the best choice this time.
The_Shaman 02-12-07, 01:43 PM	How about a psionicist, then? A wilder can be considered somewhat comparable to the warlock, if you want to try a class with a challenging spell selection.
Joseph_Silver 02-12-07, 01:44 PM	Dragon shaman. They pwn.
crimsonwolf 02-12-07, 01:45 PM	just by looking at your party style theres alot of stealth there... why not go for like a cleric of mask or something? go for teh tricky and shadows domain and be a gnome theif.... u want differnce there you go .. a holy rouge
BrazilRascal 02-12-07, 01:47 PM	They need a tank/healer badly. I'd say go with a straight cleric of Pelor, or maybe a Crusader.
crimsonwolf 02-12-07, 02:00 PM	well it relly depends ont he rp fluff going on .. i mean a heavy armored healer might pen point them out.. a healer yes but rember brazil not everything is the wizard healer rouge fighter... what exactly is going on in the game?
Edea 02-12-07, 02:23 PM	WotC seems to think so. As BrazilRascal said, your party needs a healer, (I think a primary arcanist), and a tank. This is not material for a triple threat build. The easiest role to mimic using a nonstandard class assignment is tank. Spells can eventually turn any cleric or even wizard into a durability machine, and warlocks already get cold iron DR. The bard has some arcane/healing ability, but it definitely needs to be supplemented. I'd say go for the Eldritch Disciple route. Divine magic is SORELY needed here, and that build choice is the best compromise without making you play the walking band-aid again. Then again, I'm not terribly familiar with Dragon Shaman, so I can't comment on it.
crimsonwolf 02-12-07, 02:47 PM	am relly trying to stayt withen a stealth aspect... Rogue 6/ Fighter 3/ Cleric of Mask 11/ Divine Agent 2. rouge skills and stab.. fighter feats and bab.....cleric of mask is a prc gratns you stealth shadow steppin and helaing... agent is a healer upgrade
The_Shaman 02-12-07, 03:05 PM	Well, just because a cleric can wear plate doesn't mean s/he must. If particular stealth is called for, a variant of the shadowbane stalker, a modified daggerspell cultist, or just a straight thief (or ranger, or ninja)/cleric or shaman could work. And that's even before we consider druid, spirit shaman, shugenja and the like. Don't get me wrong, the group doesn't need a healer if they don't want one, but stealth and divine magic are not incompatible.
Johnny_Angel 02-12-07, 03:11 PM	It seems as though your party is built more for stealth than for heavily armored fighting, so I am taking that into consideration a little bit. One idea could be to go with a sorceror and take the feat from Complete Divine that allows an arcane caster to add a domain's spells to his/her spell list. I can't recall the name of the feat, but I'm sure somebody else will reply to this and know the name. Anyway, pick healing as the domain you can cast spells from. Now your have some arcane power, and you also have the ability to heal. Depending on which way your bard is built, they should be able to do a little bit of healing at some point as well. Between the two of you, you should be able to cover the party's healing needs.
Bard-of-all-trades 02-12-07, 03:15 PM	How about going Druid/Wizard/Arcane Hierophant? Level as wanted. Lets the Bard back you up for healing and arcane spells and then focus on buffing the party. Plus this lets you stay "sneaky-sneaky" as well with that whole not wearing metal armor/arcane spell failure thing working there.
kadeity 02-12-07, 03:28 PM	If your a dragon shaman, see if your dm will let you choose a dragon from this list ;) http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=11431436#post11431436 I created a list of variants that let you play any of the Gem dragons, Lung Dragons, Faerunian Dragons ect. im not just saying that to toot my own horn; im saying it because these dragon choices make the shaman alot more fun.
crimsonwolf 02-12-07, 04:33 PM	i will contiue with saying this... atleast a few levels of cleric.. invsiblity...or shadowcaster from ToB..oh and silent spell metafeat a must i would think for you..
Templario 02-12-07, 04:45 PM	temple raider of olidammara is always a option to someone divine and tricksy
mittenninja 02-12-07, 04:50 PM	go with the eldritch disciple, make sure you get the healing blast ability and the extra turning feat. Then guess what? HEALING FROM 250 FT AWAY LOTS OF TIMES PER DAY! (via. eldritch spear)
periscope 02-12-07, 06:27 PM	http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?referrerid=406019&t=727364 Its a white mage you might like, that gives healing. or this http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=370164 this has a couple warlock variants in it you might like the warlock can heal since they get UMD and I believe the ability to take 10 with it, as long as they stock up on scrolls and wands. if you want a twist on the cleric, ask you DM if you can play a cleric that doesnt wear armor or use a shield as they say "my god/faith will protect me" and they gain a sacred bonus to ac equal to the wis or cha mod+1 per 4 or 5 levels (like the monk), in exchange your diety or the higher power your serve puts more power in your hands (you get 3 domains instead of 2). One of these can be the trickery domain (i think it gets you hide and move silently as class skills). If you manage to get the knock spell (dont know if its a cleric spell or on any domain list) you wont need to worry about picking locks. Heck take the magic domain with the trickery domain and you count as a wiz of half your levels for the use of magic item (wand of fireball anybody? DC 5 caster level check, in my sleep!).