Post/Author/DateTime	Post
DemonMonkeyBoy 03-24-04, 06:02 AM	:b: A Warshaper is immune to Stunning and Crits, does this mean that there immune to SA as well? Most Creatures that are immune to Crits are not affected by SA either.
Hva 03-24-04, 08:12 AM	I would presume so if it states that they are immue to stun a dn crit, but I havent got the book in fromt of me so Ill have to check tonight. Does it state specifically that they get changes in their physical anatomy or that they lack anatomy?? If this is the case, then yes they would be immune to sneaks since they dont have any vulnerable spots. Ill check and post tonight :)
DemonMonkeyBoy 03-24-04, 09:37 AM	:b:It's do to the fact you can move your vitals around. If there not where they belong should a rogue still get SA?
Hva 03-24-04, 11:36 AM	Id rule no. If he dont know where your heart or veins are how is he going to aim for them?? (which essentially is what a sneak attack is) From the way you say it now its clear to me, but still ill check for myself tonight.
DemonMonkeyBoy 03-24-04, 03:02 PM	:b:Thanks Hva Does anyone else have an opinion?
AlienFromBeyond 03-24-04, 07:24 PM	I would say he is immune to sneak attacks. A critical and a sneak attack are very similar, a sneak attack is just a technique you can do over and over given circumstances. I don't think there is anything that is immune to crits but not SA, or vice versa. No precedent.
danman 03-24-04, 08:21 PM	Well, there is one now. I think if it was immune to sneak attacks (which would be a very powerful ability against rogues) it would have said so. Critical hits and sneak attacks may be similar, but unless they release some errata about it, I'd think that the designers had a reason for not making them immune to sneak attacks. Of course, you're free to house rule as you please.
Hope 03-24-04, 09:34 PM	Originally posted by DemonMonkeyBoy :b:Thanks Hva Does anyone else have an opinion? The SRD has one. "Any creature that is immune to critical hits is not vulnerable to sneak attacks." That's all there is to it.
DemonMonkeyBoy 03-25-04, 03:44 AM	:b: Thanks Hope I'll have to find that quote. [edit] OK now I'm feeling Blind I can seem to find that Quote. Maybe I'm looking in the wrong book. Please help!
Neonsamurai 03-25-04, 09:57 AM	http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/rogue.html look there under the description of sneak attacks.
DemonMonkeyBoy 03-25-04, 02:10 PM	:b: Yea I looked there, but now when I read it again I think danman is right. SRD "A rogue can sneak attack only living creatures with discernible anatomies—undead, constructs, oozes, plants, and incorporeal creatures lack vital areas to attack." I have a discernible anatomy, it's just the vital places are in the wrong places for a human. When I think about it Crits are can of a lucky hit to a vital and SA you're aiming for a vital. I just seems silly that one would work and not the other. Anyone else know where hope quote is found? Thanks
Hope 03-25-04, 07:03 PM	Originally posted by DemonMonkeyBoy :b: Yea I looked there, but now when I read it again I think danman is right. SRD "A rogue can sneak attack only living creatures with discernible anatomies—undead, constructs, oozes, plants, and incorporeal creatures lack vital areas to attack." I have a discernible anatomy, it's just the vital places are in the wrong places for a human. When I think about it Crits are can of a lucky hit to a vital and SA you're aiming for a vital. I just seems silly that one would work and not the other. Anyone else know where hope quote is found? Thanks Oh, for crying out loud, people. It's on the same page as what you just quoted. Here's the entire entry, which can be found at http://www.wizards.com/d20/files/v35/ClassesII.rtf : Sneak Attack: If a rogue can catch an opponent when he is unable to defend himself effectively from her attack, she can strike a vital spot for extra damage. The rogue’s attack deals extra damage any time her target would be denied a Dexterity bonus to AC (whether the target actually has a Dexterity bonus or not), or when the rogue flanks her target. This extra damage is 1d6 at 1st level, and it increases by 1d6 every two rogue levels thereafter. Should the rogue score a critical hit with a sneak attack, this extra damage is not multiplied. Ranged attacks can count as sneak attacks only if the target is within 30 feet. With a sap (blackjack) or an unarmed strike, a rogue can make a sneak attack that deals nonlethal damage instead of lethal damage. She cannot use a weapon that deals lethal damage to deal nonlethal damage in a sneak attack, not even with the usual –4 penalty. A rogue can sneak attack only living creatures with discernible anatomies—undead, constructs, oozes, plants, and incorporeal creatures lack vital areas to attack. Any creature that is immune to critical hits is not vulnerable to sneak attacks. The rogue must be able to see the target well enough to pick out a vital spot and must be able to reach such a spot. A rogue cannot sneak attack while striking a creature with concealment or striking the limbs of a creature whose vitals are beyond reach. Last paragraph, second sentence. Is that explicit enough for you?
Shadow_Bomber 03-26-04, 12:35 AM	It says right in the Rogue description of Sneak Attack that any creature that is immune to crits is immune to SA.