A armour question.... [Archive] - Wizards Community

A armour question.... [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Gagnrath
06-15-05, 09:34 PM A dwarf isn't slowed down by heavy armour.
A barbarian looses his fast movement when he's wearing heavy armour.
Which one wins out?

This could go in class race or equipment forums. so I put it here.
Darkmeer
06-15-05, 10:12 PM The dwarf isn't slowed by the armor, but the barbarian is, hmmmm...

I'd rule on the dwarf's side. Heck, a 30' move isn't a whole lot in my games. But, some DM's rule by the book and nothing but the book. I don't. I think it'd be cool for a raging dwarf to be faster than the raging fiend human, just on flavor alone. That would be enough to send some foes packing.
But this would be something to bring to your DM's attention (unless, of course, you are the DM).

:twocents:
Disco
06-15-05, 10:26 PM uhh but doesn't the dwarf move at 20ft unmodified but the barbarian moves at 40ft which would then be modified to 30ft?

So barbarian would still be moving at 10ft faster than dwarf????
Jaid
06-15-05, 10:49 PM well, if i'm not mistaken, the barbarian's ability does not say they are slowed down by the armor, but that they lose the ability when they are in the armor.

so, they lose the ability, but are not otherwise slowed down (which, of course, results in the same effect as if they were slowed down by the armor, but that's beside the point).

anyways, RAW that's how it works, i think.
Tony Vargas
06-16-05, 01:09 PM A dwarf isn't slowed down by heavy armour.
A barbarian looses his fast movement when he's wearing heavy armour.
Which one wins out? Neither, they both aply. A Dwarf Barbarian has Fast Movement, which /isn't useable in heavy armor/, so he doesn't get to use it, and his move is 20. That move is not reduced by the armor, so it stays at 20.

uhh but doesn't the dwarf move at 20ft unmodified but the barbarian moves at 40ft which would then be modified to 30ft? Not quite: Yes, the dwarf moves at 20' and medium or heavy armor don't reduce that. OTOH, A barbarian with a base 30 move does move at 40 when his Fast Movement aplies - so would have a 40 move in light armor, 30 in medium (reduced by armor), and 20 in heavy (no Fast movement, and base 30 move reduced by armor).
Gagnrath
06-16-05, 02:50 PM Hi
jaerad
06-16-05, 03:13 PM Neither, they both aply. A Dwarf Barbarian has Fast Movement, which /isn't useable in heavy armor/, so he doesn't get to use it, and his move is 20. That move is not reduced by the armor, so it stays at 20.

Not quite: Yes, the dwarf moves at 20' and medium or heavy armor don't reduce that. OTOH, A barbarian with a base 30 move does move at 40 when his Fast Movement aplies - so would have a 40 move in light armor, 30 in medium (reduced by armor), and 20 in heavy (no Fast movement, and base 30 move reduced by armor).

What about a Dwarf in medium armor? Is their speed reduced or not?

From what I've seen, it comes down to some semantics. When it talks about Dwarven BLS, it mentions that they can move "this speed" even while encumbered. If you interpret "this speed" to mean their BLS - then they have a 30' movement in medium armor w/ Fast Movement (Barb at least). If you interpret "this speed" to mean 20', a Dwarfs BLS, then Dwarven non-encumberance means diddly to Fast Movement.

Personally, I think it's cool if you want a fast Dwarf who can bolt around in mithral FP. I have no problem letting a Dwarf move at 50' or more while encumbered [50' comes from 20' Dwarf, +10' Fast Movement, +10' Boots*, +10' trait from UA].

*Oh ya, that reminds me. An interesting note is that Barb. Fast Movement is the only one that works in medium armor (I think, Scouts are only Light I think) and it is the ONLY one that is not an enchantment bonus - ie, it is the only one that stacks with Boots of Strizziding.
Tony Vargas
06-16-05, 04:27 PM What about a Dwarf in medium armor? Is their speed reduced or not? A dwarf's speed is not reduced by armor. If the dwarf is a barbarian, his fast movement works in medium armor.

From what I've seen, it comes down to some semantics.Not really. Fast Movement is pretty clear: you don't get the bonus in heavy armor, in light/medium/no armor you get a +10.

When it talks about Dwarven BLS, it mentions that they can move "this speed" even while encumbered. If you interpret "this speed" to mean their BLS - then they have a 30' movement in medium armor w/ Fast Movement (Barb at least). If you interpret "this speed" to mean 20', a Dwarfs BLS, then Dwarven non-encumberance means diddly to Fast Movement.Either way, a dwarf barbarian in medium armor is going to be moving at 30. Either his move is 20 + 10 = 30, and not reduced by armor or his move is 20, not reduced by armor, and you add 10 to it, making it 30.
D.K.R.
06-16-05, 04:49 PM uhh but doesn't the dwarf move at 20ft unmodified but the barbarian moves at 40ft which would then be modified to 30ft?

So barbarian would still be moving at 10ft faster than dwarf????
No - a barbarian moves at +10 ft - a character with 20' base move (i.e. Dwarf, small creatures) who is a barbarian only gets 30' move, and only in light/medium/no armor.

A character with a natural speed higher than 30, like 40' or 60' would get +10' too, making them 50' or 70' (again, light, medium, or no armor).
jaerad
06-17-05, 03:33 AM Either way, a dwarf barbarian in medium armor is going to be moving at 30. Either his move is 20 + 10 = 30, and not reduced by armor or his move is 20, not reduced by armor, and you add 10 to it, making it 30.

Hmm. I'll have to think about this a little more, there may be something I'm missing. I forget who told me about the Dwarven speed problems, but I seem to remember it coming from a reliable poster here. But as far as I can tell atm, it sure sounds like you kicked my thoughts to the curb.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Gagnrath 06-15-05, 09:34 PM	A dwarf isn't slowed down by heavy armour. A barbarian looses his fast movement when he's wearing heavy armour. Which one wins out? This could go in class race or equipment forums. so I put it here.
Darkmeer 06-15-05, 10:12 PM	The dwarf isn't slowed by the armor, but the barbarian is, hmmmm... I'd rule on the dwarf's side. Heck, a 30' move isn't a whole lot in my games. But, some DM's rule by the book and nothing but the book. I don't. I think it'd be cool for a raging dwarf to be faster than the raging fiend human, just on flavor alone. That would be enough to send some foes packing. But this would be something to bring to your DM's attention (unless, of course, you are the DM). :twocents:
Disco 06-15-05, 10:26 PM	uhh but doesn't the dwarf move at 20ft unmodified but the barbarian moves at 40ft which would then be modified to 30ft? So barbarian would still be moving at 10ft faster than dwarf????
Jaid 06-15-05, 10:49 PM	well, if i'm not mistaken, the barbarian's ability does not say they are slowed down by the armor, but that they lose the ability when they are in the armor. so, they lose the ability, but are not otherwise slowed down (which, of course, results in the same effect as if they were slowed down by the armor, but that's beside the point). anyways, RAW that's how it works, i think.
Tony Vargas 06-16-05, 01:09 PM	A dwarf isn't slowed down by heavy armour. A barbarian looses his fast movement when he's wearing heavy armour. Which one wins out? Neither, they both aply. A Dwarf Barbarian has Fast Movement, which /isn't useable in heavy armor/, so he doesn't get to use it, and his move is 20. That move is not reduced by the armor, so it stays at 20. uhh but doesn't the dwarf move at 20ft unmodified but the barbarian moves at 40ft which would then be modified to 30ft? Not quite: Yes, the dwarf moves at 20' and medium or heavy armor don't reduce that. OTOH, A barbarian with a base 30 move does move at 40 when his Fast Movement aplies - so would have a 40 move in light armor, 30 in medium (reduced by armor), and 20 in heavy (no Fast movement, and base 30 move reduced by armor).
Gagnrath 06-16-05, 02:50 PM	Hi
jaerad 06-16-05, 03:13 PM	Neither, they both aply. A Dwarf Barbarian has Fast Movement, which /isn't useable in heavy armor/, so he doesn't get to use it, and his move is 20. That move is not reduced by the armor, so it stays at 20. Not quite: Yes, the dwarf moves at 20' and medium or heavy armor don't reduce that. OTOH, A barbarian with a base 30 move does move at 40 when his Fast Movement aplies - so would have a 40 move in light armor, 30 in medium (reduced by armor), and 20 in heavy (no Fast movement, and base 30 move reduced by armor). What about a Dwarf in medium armor? Is their speed reduced or not? From what I've seen, it comes down to some semantics. When it talks about Dwarven BLS, it mentions that they can move "this speed" even while encumbered. If you interpret "this speed" to mean their BLS - then they have a 30' movement in medium armor w/ Fast Movement (Barb at least). If you interpret "this speed" to mean 20', a Dwarfs BLS, then Dwarven non-encumberance means diddly to Fast Movement. Personally, I think it's cool if you want a fast Dwarf who can bolt around in mithral FP. I have no problem letting a Dwarf move at 50' or more while encumbered [50' comes from 20' Dwarf, +10' Fast Movement, +10' Boots, +10' trait from UA]. Oh ya, that reminds me. An interesting note is that Barb. Fast Movement is the only one that works in medium armor (I think, Scouts are only Light I think) and it is the ONLY one that is not an enchantment bonus - ie, it is the only one that stacks with Boots of Strizziding.
Tony Vargas 06-16-05, 04:27 PM	What about a Dwarf in medium armor? Is their speed reduced or not? A dwarf's speed is not reduced by armor. If the dwarf is a barbarian, his fast movement works in medium armor. From what I've seen, it comes down to some semantics.Not really. Fast Movement is pretty clear: you don't get the bonus in heavy armor, in light/medium/no armor you get a +10. When it talks about Dwarven BLS, it mentions that they can move "this speed" even while encumbered. If you interpret "this speed" to mean their BLS - then they have a 30' movement in medium armor w/ Fast Movement (Barb at least). If you interpret "this speed" to mean 20', a Dwarfs BLS, then Dwarven non-encumberance means diddly to Fast Movement.Either way, a dwarf barbarian in medium armor is going to be moving at 30. Either his move is 20 + 10 = 30, and not reduced by armor or his move is 20, not reduced by armor, and you add 10 to it, making it 30.
D.K.R. 06-16-05, 04:49 PM	uhh but doesn't the dwarf move at 20ft unmodified but the barbarian moves at 40ft which would then be modified to 30ft? So barbarian would still be moving at 10ft faster than dwarf???? No - a barbarian moves at +10 ft - a character with 20' base move (i.e. Dwarf, small creatures) who is a barbarian only gets 30' move, and only in light/medium/no armor. A character with a natural speed higher than 30, like 40' or 60' would get +10' too, making them 50' or 70' (again, light, medium, or no armor).
jaerad 06-17-05, 03:33 AM	Either way, a dwarf barbarian in medium armor is going to be moving at 30. Either his move is 20 + 10 = 30, and not reduced by armor or his move is 20, not reduced by armor, and you add 10 to it, making it 30. Hmm. I'll have to think about this a little more, there may be something I'm missing. I forget who told me about the Dwarven speed problems, but I seem to remember it coming from a reliable poster here. But as far as I can tell atm, it sure sounds like you kicked my thoughts to the curb.