A choice... the Duskblade or the Spellsword? [Archive] - Wizards Community

A choice... the Duskblade or the Spellsword? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
igotsmeakabob!!
05-09-06, 11:32 PM Alright, my friend is starting a campaign when he gets back from college. We're starting at 4th level, and we'll probably make it to 11th or 12th by the end of the summer.

I was originally going to play a spellsword, either 1 ftr/6 wiz or 2 ftr/4 wiz. But then the Players Handbook II arrived at my house today, and I saw the duskblade. Now I have to choose, and its a tough choice.

With the Practiced Spellcaster feat from CA and CD, the Spellsword is pretty powerful IMO. Please note that I don't want to go for ridiculously cheesily powerful, that'll **** off the DM. I wouldn't mind being a little powerful though.

Anyway, with a feat from the CA or CW (not sure which), at 4th level the duskblade can be using heavy armor... but I don't know which to choose.

So I need some advice. Duskblade or Spellsword?

P.S. I'd be choosing wizard, not sorc, for my spellsword.
Lawrence
05-09-06, 11:42 PM Duskblades are a genuine hybrid - giving you combat and magic along with a few special abilities that are Duskblade specific.

Obviously spell sword comes later, and you start out mage or fighter firsthand. While it does give you more spell options later, the other class benefits are a tad more limited.

Still, using spellsword gives you extra feats from fighter if you take more than a couple levels, and You do have more spell options even if you are 5fighter/5wizard/sorcerer/10 spellsword. It may be 5th level spells too, but again, more options for decisions.

You could do well either way. Duskblade is newer of course, so it might irk your DM a bit if it surprises him.
StruckingFuggle
05-10-06, 12:34 AM Spellsword.

MUCH greater versatility.

Also: Channeled Spell: Prismatic Sphere.

"I'm sorry, you were alive?"
inthesto
05-10-06, 09:24 AM Unless you want to give your target an absolutely awesome defense, Prismatic Sphere is not a good combination to go with Channel Spell. Not to mention that it's a ninth level spell, so good luck on getting that with levels in fighter and half caster progression.
igotsmeakabob!!
05-10-06, 10:05 AM Please keep in mind that the game is going to a max of 13th level, probably lower. Right now I'm leaning toward Spellsword, but Duskblade gave me a 2nd choice... still not sure.
inthesto
05-10-06, 10:18 AM Right, I knew I forgot to answer something.

Although I don't know much about the Duskblade, a Spellsword is always a solid choice. Whether you choose Wizard or Sorceror for the caster component is up to you, as both have their ups and downs, but I think that Sorceror is generally the easier option. Try building the character so that it focuses on damage through melee combat and using magic to augment that. There are plenty of low-level spells that complement close quarters combat (True Strike, Bull's Strength, etc), and a slightly sub-par AC can be acceptable if you also invest in defensive spells (Shield, Mirror Image).

Of course, the biggest problem you'll face is the fact that you can still only take one standard action a turn, which means that you'll have to spend the initial few rounds of combat buffing up. Then again, this is a problem with any character that tries to split its focus.

Also, be sure to check out the Suel Arcanamach in Complete Arcane. Takes the fighter/caster idea in a different direction, and while its flavor is fairly narrowly defined, you can probably rework it with the help of your DM.

PS - As a casting fighter, never ever forget your hidden best friend: Enlarge Person.
Dessirris
05-10-06, 10:25 AM It depends on how you prefer to play your casters.

Prefer single-minded blasters who can shred enemies in combat, but run into trouble if they're out of combat, because they don't prepare utility spells, go duskblade.

Prefer just about any style of casting, enchanter, illusionist, abjurer, etc, go spellsword.
igotsmeakabob!!
05-10-06, 10:51 AM Yeah, right now it looks like I'll be going spellsword.
igotsmeakabob!!
05-10-06, 10:58 AM Although I'll still get plenty of use out of the PHB II... Channelled Pyroburst looks like an awesome spell, especially with a Sudden Maximize... mmm....
StruckingFuggle
05-10-06, 11:29 AM Unless you want to give your target an absolutely awesome defense, Prismatic Sphere is not a good combination to go with Channel Spell. Not to mention that it's a ninth level spell, so good luck on getting that with levels in fighter and half caster progression.

"Awesome Defense"? When you channel it on them, it's like they ran straight from the outside to the middle - all nine "this happens when you walk into them"s trigger at once on them.

Also works with Prismatic Wall ... though most every spellsword I've seen has 9th level spells by the end of their career. o.o
moriarty13
05-10-06, 11:36 AM For your situation Duskblade seems the best choice by a long shot. Sure, you don't get to choose your spells from the Spell Compendium and you will never have some of the neatest and most powerful arcane spells. But playing a spellsword starting at level 4 is hard. No armor, low hit points, few spells, bad BAB. It all hurts.

With Duskblade you can be a casting fighter at level 1. It will be weaker than a true Gish at level 20, but you aren't going there anyway.
WombleHunter
05-10-06, 12:32 PM Seconded - for play of levels 4-12, I would imagine you'd get much more love out of a Duskblade. At 4th level, you've still got to wait 2 levels or so until you can use any kind of armoured spellcasting, and then a reduced spellcasting advancement will hurt. Generally, you'd only miss out at higher levels, when you could otherwise be pulling down high level spells - but you won't be reaching those levels anyway. I would seriously recommend the Duskblade in your circumstances.

Besides, who can resist the lure of a shiny new class? And you've got to come back and tell the rest of us about it! ;)
igotsmeakabob!!
05-11-06, 12:24 AM After considering everything, I think I'll be shooting for the Spellsword... I know that the Duskblade would probably be the better choice but I think the Spellsword is just a cool thing... if he dies, I'll definitely give the Duskblade a try.

Now I have to decide what 2 fighter feats I'll be taking.
inthesto
05-11-06, 12:39 AM I suggest either Combat Expertise + Improved Trip, or Power Attack + Improved Overrun, mostly because they both work well with Enlarge Person.
Wyrd Bearer
05-11-06, 01:09 AM Good choice with the spellsword. If you ever get to cast 5th level spells, try a channeled cloud kill: 1d4 Con damage/round or half of that on a successful Fort save. Oh yeah, and the spell lasts for 1 minute/level. That is a minimum of 112 Con damage over the full 9 minutes, which is the time it'll last when you can first cast it, and that's with them succeeding at their Fort save the entire time. "I'm sorry, do you have more than 100 in your Constitution score?"

As for the fighter feats, it depends on your playing style, but I do reccommend taking Arcane Strike eventually, regardless of what style you plan to go with.
Mystyc
05-11-06, 03:03 AM though most every spellsword I've seen has 9th level spells by the end of their career. o.o
You need at least 17th level wizard casting to get 9th level spells. A spellsword only has half progression, so even if you didn't take a single non-wizard level, you top out at casting like a 15th level wizard.
Vaelan
05-11-06, 04:58 AM You need at least 17th level wizard casting to get 9th level spells. A spellsword only has half progression, so even if you didn't take a single non-wizard level, you top out at casting like a 15th level wizard.
It is entirely possible that he has only seen people that take it for 3-5 levels.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
igotsmeakabob!! 05-09-06, 11:32 PM	Alright, my friend is starting a campaign when he gets back from college. We're starting at 4th level, and we'll probably make it to 11th or 12th by the end of the summer. I was originally going to play a spellsword, either 1 ftr/6 wiz or 2 ftr/4 wiz. But then the Players Handbook II arrived at my house today, and I saw the duskblade. Now I have to choose, and its a tough choice. With the Practiced Spellcaster feat from CA and CD, the Spellsword is pretty powerful IMO. Please note that I don't want to go for ridiculously cheesily powerful, that'll **** off the DM. I wouldn't mind being a little powerful though. Anyway, with a feat from the CA or CW (not sure which), at 4th level the duskblade can be using heavy armor... but I don't know which to choose. So I need some advice. Duskblade or Spellsword? P.S. I'd be choosing wizard, not sorc, for my spellsword.
Lawrence 05-09-06, 11:42 PM	Duskblades are a genuine hybrid - giving you combat and magic along with a few special abilities that are Duskblade specific. Obviously spell sword comes later, and you start out mage or fighter firsthand. While it does give you more spell options later, the other class benefits are a tad more limited. Still, using spellsword gives you extra feats from fighter if you take more than a couple levels, and You do have more spell options even if you are 5fighter/5wizard/sorcerer/10 spellsword. It may be 5th level spells too, but again, more options for decisions. You could do well either way. Duskblade is newer of course, so it might irk your DM a bit if it surprises him.
StruckingFuggle 05-10-06, 12:34 AM	Spellsword. MUCH greater versatility. Also: Channeled Spell: Prismatic Sphere. "I'm sorry, you were alive?"
inthesto 05-10-06, 09:24 AM	Unless you want to give your target an absolutely awesome defense, Prismatic Sphere is not a good combination to go with Channel Spell. Not to mention that it's a ninth level spell, so good luck on getting that with levels in fighter and half caster progression.
igotsmeakabob!! 05-10-06, 10:05 AM	Please keep in mind that the game is going to a max of 13th level, probably lower. Right now I'm leaning toward Spellsword, but Duskblade gave me a 2nd choice... still not sure.
inthesto 05-10-06, 10:18 AM	Right, I knew I forgot to answer something. Although I don't know much about the Duskblade, a Spellsword is always a solid choice. Whether you choose Wizard or Sorceror for the caster component is up to you, as both have their ups and downs, but I think that Sorceror is generally the easier option. Try building the character so that it focuses on damage through melee combat and using magic to augment that. There are plenty of low-level spells that complement close quarters combat (True Strike, Bull's Strength, etc), and a slightly sub-par AC can be acceptable if you also invest in defensive spells (Shield, Mirror Image). Of course, the biggest problem you'll face is the fact that you can still only take one standard action a turn, which means that you'll have to spend the initial few rounds of combat buffing up. Then again, this is a problem with any character that tries to split its focus. Also, be sure to check out the Suel Arcanamach in Complete Arcane. Takes the fighter/caster idea in a different direction, and while its flavor is fairly narrowly defined, you can probably rework it with the help of your DM. PS - As a casting fighter, never ever forget your hidden best friend: Enlarge Person.
Dessirris 05-10-06, 10:25 AM	It depends on how you prefer to play your casters. Prefer single-minded blasters who can shred enemies in combat, but run into trouble if they're out of combat, because they don't prepare utility spells, go duskblade. Prefer just about any style of casting, enchanter, illusionist, abjurer, etc, go spellsword.
igotsmeakabob!! 05-10-06, 10:51 AM	Yeah, right now it looks like I'll be going spellsword.
igotsmeakabob!! 05-10-06, 10:58 AM	Although I'll still get plenty of use out of the PHB II... Channelled Pyroburst looks like an awesome spell, especially with a Sudden Maximize... mmm....
StruckingFuggle 05-10-06, 11:29 AM	Unless you want to give your target an absolutely awesome defense, Prismatic Sphere is not a good combination to go with Channel Spell. Not to mention that it's a ninth level spell, so good luck on getting that with levels in fighter and half caster progression. "Awesome Defense"? When you channel it on them, it's like they ran straight from the outside to the middle - all nine "this happens when you walk into them"s trigger at once on them. Also works with Prismatic Wall ... though most every spellsword I've seen has 9th level spells by the end of their career. o.o
moriarty13 05-10-06, 11:36 AM	For your situation Duskblade seems the best choice by a long shot. Sure, you don't get to choose your spells from the Spell Compendium and you will never have some of the neatest and most powerful arcane spells. But playing a spellsword starting at level 4 is hard. No armor, low hit points, few spells, bad BAB. It all hurts. With Duskblade you can be a casting fighter at level 1. It will be weaker than a true Gish at level 20, but you aren't going there anyway.
WombleHunter 05-10-06, 12:32 PM	Seconded - for play of levels 4-12, I would imagine you'd get much more love out of a Duskblade. At 4th level, you've still got to wait 2 levels or so until you can use any kind of armoured spellcasting, and then a reduced spellcasting advancement will hurt. Generally, you'd only miss out at higher levels, when you could otherwise be pulling down high level spells - but you won't be reaching those levels anyway. I would seriously recommend the Duskblade in your circumstances. Besides, who can resist the lure of a shiny new class? And you've got to come back and tell the rest of us about it! ;)
igotsmeakabob!! 05-11-06, 12:24 AM	After considering everything, I think I'll be shooting for the Spellsword... I know that the Duskblade would probably be the better choice but I think the Spellsword is just a cool thing... if he dies, I'll definitely give the Duskblade a try. Now I have to decide what 2 fighter feats I'll be taking.
inthesto 05-11-06, 12:39 AM	I suggest either Combat Expertise + Improved Trip, or Power Attack + Improved Overrun, mostly because they both work well with Enlarge Person.
Wyrd Bearer 05-11-06, 01:09 AM	Good choice with the spellsword. If you ever get to cast 5th level spells, try a channeled cloud kill: 1d4 Con damage/round or half of that on a successful Fort save. Oh yeah, and the spell lasts for 1 minute/level. That is a minimum of 112 Con damage over the full 9 minutes, which is the time it'll last when you can first cast it, and that's with them succeeding at their Fort save the entire time. "I'm sorry, do you have more than 100 in your Constitution score?" As for the fighter feats, it depends on your playing style, but I do reccommend taking Arcane Strike eventually, regardless of what style you plan to go with.
Mystyc 05-11-06, 03:03 AM	though most every spellsword I've seen has 9th level spells by the end of their career. o.o You need at least 17th level wizard casting to get 9th level spells. A spellsword only has half progression, so even if you didn't take a single non-wizard level, you top out at casting like a 15th level wizard.
Vaelan 05-11-06, 04:58 AM	You need at least 17th level wizard casting to get 9th level spells. A spellsword only has half progression, so even if you didn't take a single non-wizard level, you top out at casting like a 15th level wizard. It is entirely possible that he has only seen people that take it for 3-5 levels.