A Druid, but what Race? [Archive] - Wizards Community

A Druid, but what Race? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Disco
06-12-05, 02:19 AM Okay, didn't know whether to put this down as Race or Class forum, but assume it doesn't matter too much.

Question is simple: if you were to go a druid, what race would you be better suited for? Human, Elf or Half-Elf.

Human's have an extra feat, which can be useful to optimuse the Druid's spell casting ability. Elf and Half Elf's have low light vision which is damn handy early in levels. I lean away from Elves, because although Dexterity is a druids second most important stat, I feel that constiution is equal second with dex and its not really worth it.

Hard to say though, and I've only been playing for 9 months so I'm far from expert. What do you guys think?
Quirriff
06-12-05, 02:26 AM Well any of them, I have a rule of thumb, if you can't choose a race be a human.
Manyfist
06-12-05, 02:46 AM Wrong forum dude. Also if you can't pick a race fall back on humans, theirs Infin. customization of a Human. :D
BlaineTog
06-12-05, 02:51 AM Human. Most of the races' ability mods don't matter (since you'll be shapechanged a lot later on), but those skill points and extra feat can always be useful. Not half-elf, because low light vision is really quite useless. I mean, it's possible for the DM to make it an issue, but it almost never is.
Nayk
06-12-05, 12:17 PM In my opinion it really depend on the type of druid you would like to play, there is also some alternate level for some race in the various books of race if you didn't stopped yet on human/elf/half-elf.

for example, I currently play a small goblin (due to DM campaign) and use a part of alternate halfling in races of the wild. Compared to a normal druid, I'm a lot more sneaky, more skilly, but a lot less offensive in fighting.

There is also other more offensive traits to a druid like half-orc druid (w alternate levels)

But as you talked about human/elf/half-elf:

Human get you a bonus feats and + 1skill per level which is very nice if you like skilly PC, it may help you with your spell casting abilities if you take the right feat. If may be good to go with augment summon spell, right at first level. Your summoned wolves will be a lot more powerful then normal. Better on higher level when you get more rounds to play with them however. One thing to consider is that you can choose any elemental language with your INT bonuses at start. It may be good when using some summon II to summon an elemental that can understand you and obey any order other than attacking foes.

Elf give you free proficiency w/ weapons, low-light vision(w/ spot is really good). It will help you to use bows, and fall off on swords. You also need only 4hours sleep; this make you the best guard on nights with your bonuses on spots and the ranks in it (druids don't need 8hours of rest, but fixed time of day to pray)
While elf give you -2 to CON, that +2 do DEX may be the thing that will avoid you loose HP before getting wildshaped, which will make you CON absolete anyway. (because you get +1 to your AC)
I also makes you increadibly resistant to any charm spells with their bonuses and your will and wisdom bonuses.

Half-elf is good if you plan to multi-class, plan to be a part of your party face with diplomacy and with their low-light vision. The languages bonuses may help as well.

My opinion would be to take either human or elf. Human is better for spell casting and wide skill. And Elf is better for the range type of play without being wildshaped and sneaky parts.

Hope that helps

Nayk
SmiloDan
06-12-05, 01:18 PM I play an elf druid 16 that I've played from level 1. I've only died 2 or 3 times and have only lost 3 or 4 animal companions, so I think it's a pretty good build. My original concept was an archer druid, so I have Point Blank Shot and Rapid Shot. At 6th level I took Natural Spell because it's the law. Seriously, it's the best feat for druids because it lets you be the dire bear tank AND the flame strike chucking blaster all at the same time (well, switching from tank to blaster round by round, unless you have quickened spell or something...). I then took Craft Wands because we lacked a cleric, and needed CLW wands (campaign is war-torn and there were towns to buy stuff at). At 12th, I took Empower Spell because Empowered Flame Strikes are SO nice! At 15th, I took Improved Counterspell because we go up against a lot of spell chuckers.
Another nifty thing about the elven druid are the Listen and Spot checks. Wisdom is likely your highest ability, and Listen and Spot are class skills, and with the elven bonuses, you can easily get close to +10 on listen and spot at 1st level. It only gets better from there. I maxed out Concentration and Spellcraft, kept Listen, Spot, and Survival pretty high, put a fair number of points in Handle Animal and Knowledge arcana (cross-class, but help with Spellcraft, and I was considering Energy Substitution at one point), a scattering of skills in Knowledge nature, Swim, Ride, Profession Sailor, Diplomacy, and the elemental languages.

Human is also an excellent choice. At 1st level, you can take Spell Focus conjuration and Augment Summoning. AND you get 4 extra skill points, that you can spend on 2 elemental languages...plus any bonus languages you get for high Int. Being able to speak Terran allowed me to recently tell my earth elemental to earth glide up the wall, into the ceiling, and then drop 50 feet onto the BBEG. It was a huge Earth Elemental, so it weighed 48,000 according to the MM. According to the DMG, a falling object causes 1d6 points of damage per 200 pounds....that's 240d6!!!!! More, for falling more than 10 feet...but that's just sick. And if I couldn't speak Terran, I wouldn't have been able to tell the EE to do that.

Another possiblity is a small druid that rides his animal companion. That can be fun too.
Norhg
06-12-05, 02:07 PM I've only died 2 or 3 times and have only lost 3 or 4 animal companions, so I think it's a pretty good build. I suggest you study the art of fleeing, or did you die from instant death spells?

Anyway, SmiloDan's suggestions are pretty good.
Race doesn't matter much, you will see no real differences with a druid. You might curse having one feat too little at times and you will hate yourself for being human when missing ranged attack rolls by one.
-But that is the nature of the game.
SmiloDan
06-12-05, 02:57 PM I died once when I failed to cast defensively to heal my wardog animal companion...I was hit with a crit by a greataxe at 3rd or 4th level, when I was already wounded a bit...I think I went from 4 to -40!

The second time I died, it was from friendly fire...an energy admixture maximized acid ball....I failed my reflex save....and I had a Major Ring of Acid Resistance on...and I was near to full hit points at the time. When I died, my animal companion ceased being an animal companion and lost all his extra hit dice, and since he was wounded, got himself perished. I forget the 3rd time I died....maybe it only was twice.

I'm all about the fleeing. But there's this world that needs saving, and it's the only one I live on, so I sometimes gotta do the stand-up thing.

Of course, I've been known to inhale a vampire in gaseous form so it won't escape....and then have it re-materialize in my lungs. Thank you Con boost from wildshape! My DM rolled ALL of his dice for damage...
Drizzt do' Urden
06-12-05, 02:57 PM I think that human is the best because it gets a loto of bonus features and skill points
ILL34GL3
06-12-05, 10:29 PM I'm voting human too. I'm playing a 4th level human druid right now. I spent the extra feat on track. With the Knowledge(Nature) synergy, Nature Sense class ability, high wisdom and assistance from my wolf companion, my character is by far the best tracker.

I also suggest taking Spell Focus(Conjuration) and Augment Summoning to provide more frontline punch.

The elf seems like a decent pick too. Low light vision and proficiency with those bows (Much better than a sling) and swords (of which the magical variety seems to be more plentiful in most campaigns than scimitars) make for great benefits.

I put all of my best abilities in the mental stats as Wild Shape will eventually make his physical ability scores a moot point. Because of his high intelligence, my druid fills many roless: the eyes and ears, the diplomat, the outdoor expert and tracker.

He's also the summoner, the buffer, the secondary healer and he even provides melee support with his companion. Just wait until he learns to Wildshape.

In my party, the human druid is definitely the star of the show.
Paxbot
06-14-05, 09:58 AM Depending on what races are available in your campaign, there may be other options. For instance, I play a 7th level Wild Elf Druid in a Forgotten Realms campaign. Wild Elves give up INT for DEX instead of CON. That would certainly solve your worry about the lowered CON for elves.... but you really give up a lot of skill points compared to a human. I compensated for this by taking some more flavourful feats like Stealthy, etc. to boost some skills. It's not the most powerful way to build a charater, but my sneaky Wild Elf is great for RP.
Beamup
06-14-05, 12:03 PM Human, definitely. Unless the campaign is going to remain very low-level (pre-wildshape).

Once you can use wildshape extensively, your physical stats are almost irrelevant, so bonuses to them are pointless. You won't be using bows anyway while wildshaped, and you will have low-light vision in any case.

The only race of the three that gives you any major benefit while wildshaped is human, so that's clearly mechanically superior.
Elendur
06-14-05, 12:18 PM Mechanically both elves and humans are fine. You should go with whatever race you think will be more fun to play.
Fuzzy_Logic
06-14-05, 12:32 PM out of the three you mentioned, Human.

for a druid, the elven stat mods are no real benefit, and while the proficiencies are nice at low level, at high level your weapons probably become irrelevant. skill bonuses and the like are nice, but humans bonus skills and feats counteract them.

however, I strongly suggest that you consider dwarf and halfling.
dwarf druids are very difficult to kill, with the whole suite of dwarven features and access to hide armor without slowing down. once you get wildshape, you low racial speed becomes unimportant, and because HP aren't affected by wildshape you retain the benefit of your high CON score.

Halfligns are good too, very resilient in humanoid form and able to wildshape to compensate for their low STR and speed, but wildhsaping causes them to lose their high DEX.
Elendur
06-14-05, 04:18 PM once you get wildshape, you low racial speed becomes unimportant, and because HP aren't affected by wildshape you retain the benefit of your high CON score.
.You take the CON score of whatever form you take when you wildshape, so your HP can go up and down accordingly. That's why physical ability scores aren't as important in the long run for druids.
Fuzzy_Logic
06-14-05, 04:46 PM was this changed in 3.5?

i remeber from my 3.0 days that although your CON score changed, your hp total did not.
Count Arioch the 28th
06-14-05, 08:03 PM Yes, it was changed. Druids higher level than 5 only need one good ability score now, Wisdom, and they're good to go.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Disco 06-12-05, 02:19 AM	Okay, didn't know whether to put this down as Race or Class forum, but assume it doesn't matter too much. Question is simple: if you were to go a druid, what race would you be better suited for? Human, Elf or Half-Elf. Human's have an extra feat, which can be useful to optimuse the Druid's spell casting ability. Elf and Half Elf's have low light vision which is damn handy early in levels. I lean away from Elves, because although Dexterity is a druids second most important stat, I feel that constiution is equal second with dex and its not really worth it. Hard to say though, and I've only been playing for 9 months so I'm far from expert. What do you guys think?
Quirriff 06-12-05, 02:26 AM	Well any of them, I have a rule of thumb, if you can't choose a race be a human.
Manyfist 06-12-05, 02:46 AM	Wrong forum dude. Also if you can't pick a race fall back on humans, theirs Infin. customization of a Human. :D
BlaineTog 06-12-05, 02:51 AM	Human. Most of the races' ability mods don't matter (since you'll be shapechanged a lot later on), but those skill points and extra feat can always be useful. Not half-elf, because low light vision is really quite useless. I mean, it's possible for the DM to make it an issue, but it almost never is.
Nayk 06-12-05, 12:17 PM	In my opinion it really depend on the type of druid you would like to play, there is also some alternate level for some race in the various books of race if you didn't stopped yet on human/elf/half-elf. for example, I currently play a small goblin (due to DM campaign) and use a part of alternate halfling in races of the wild. Compared to a normal druid, I'm a lot more sneaky, more skilly, but a lot less offensive in fighting. There is also other more offensive traits to a druid like half-orc druid (w alternate levels) But as you talked about human/elf/half-elf: Human get you a bonus feats and + 1skill per level which is very nice if you like skilly PC, it may help you with your spell casting abilities if you take the right feat. If may be good to go with augment summon spell, right at first level. Your summoned wolves will be a lot more powerful then normal. Better on higher level when you get more rounds to play with them however. One thing to consider is that you can choose any elemental language with your INT bonuses at start. It may be good when using some summon II to summon an elemental that can understand you and obey any order other than attacking foes. Elf give you free proficiency w/ weapons, low-light vision(w/ spot is really good). It will help you to use bows, and fall off on swords. You also need only 4hours sleep; this make you the best guard on nights with your bonuses on spots and the ranks in it (druids don't need 8hours of rest, but fixed time of day to pray) While elf give you -2 to CON, that +2 do DEX may be the thing that will avoid you loose HP before getting wildshaped, which will make you CON absolete anyway. (because you get +1 to your AC) I also makes you increadibly resistant to any charm spells with their bonuses and your will and wisdom bonuses. Half-elf is good if you plan to multi-class, plan to be a part of your party face with diplomacy and with their low-light vision. The languages bonuses may help as well. My opinion would be to take either human or elf. Human is better for spell casting and wide skill. And Elf is better for the range type of play without being wildshaped and sneaky parts. Hope that helps Nayk
SmiloDan 06-12-05, 01:18 PM	I play an elf druid 16 that I've played from level 1. I've only died 2 or 3 times and have only lost 3 or 4 animal companions, so I think it's a pretty good build. My original concept was an archer druid, so I have Point Blank Shot and Rapid Shot. At 6th level I took Natural Spell because it's the law. Seriously, it's the best feat for druids because it lets you be the dire bear tank AND the flame strike chucking blaster all at the same time (well, switching from tank to blaster round by round, unless you have quickened spell or something...). I then took Craft Wands because we lacked a cleric, and needed CLW wands (campaign is war-torn and there were towns to buy stuff at). At 12th, I took Empower Spell because Empowered Flame Strikes are SO nice! At 15th, I took Improved Counterspell because we go up against a lot of spell chuckers. Another nifty thing about the elven druid are the Listen and Spot checks. Wisdom is likely your highest ability, and Listen and Spot are class skills, and with the elven bonuses, you can easily get close to +10 on listen and spot at 1st level. It only gets better from there. I maxed out Concentration and Spellcraft, kept Listen, Spot, and Survival pretty high, put a fair number of points in Handle Animal and Knowledge arcana (cross-class, but help with Spellcraft, and I was considering Energy Substitution at one point), a scattering of skills in Knowledge nature, Swim, Ride, Profession Sailor, Diplomacy, and the elemental languages. Human is also an excellent choice. At 1st level, you can take Spell Focus conjuration and Augment Summoning. AND you get 4 extra skill points, that you can spend on 2 elemental languages...plus any bonus languages you get for high Int. Being able to speak Terran allowed me to recently tell my earth elemental to earth glide up the wall, into the ceiling, and then drop 50 feet onto the BBEG. It was a huge Earth Elemental, so it weighed 48,000 according to the MM. According to the DMG, a falling object causes 1d6 points of damage per 200 pounds....that's 240d6!!!!! More, for falling more than 10 feet...but that's just sick. And if I couldn't speak Terran, I wouldn't have been able to tell the EE to do that. Another possiblity is a small druid that rides his animal companion. That can be fun too.
Norhg 06-12-05, 02:07 PM	I've only died 2 or 3 times and have only lost 3 or 4 animal companions, so I think it's a pretty good build. I suggest you study the art of fleeing, or did you die from instant death spells? Anyway, SmiloDan's suggestions are pretty good. Race doesn't matter much, you will see no real differences with a druid. You might curse having one feat too little at times and you will hate yourself for being human when missing ranged attack rolls by one. -But that is the nature of the game.
SmiloDan 06-12-05, 02:57 PM	I died once when I failed to cast defensively to heal my wardog animal companion...I was hit with a crit by a greataxe at 3rd or 4th level, when I was already wounded a bit...I think I went from 4 to -40! The second time I died, it was from friendly fire...an energy admixture maximized acid ball....I failed my reflex save....and I had a Major Ring of Acid Resistance on...and I was near to full hit points at the time. When I died, my animal companion ceased being an animal companion and lost all his extra hit dice, and since he was wounded, got himself perished. I forget the 3rd time I died....maybe it only was twice. I'm all about the fleeing. But there's this world that needs saving, and it's the only one I live on, so I sometimes gotta do the stand-up thing. Of course, I've been known to inhale a vampire in gaseous form so it won't escape....and then have it re-materialize in my lungs. Thank you Con boost from wildshape! My DM rolled ALL of his dice for damage...
Drizzt do' Urden 06-12-05, 02:57 PM	I think that human is the best because it gets a loto of bonus features and skill points
ILL34GL3 06-12-05, 10:29 PM	I'm voting human too. I'm playing a 4th level human druid right now. I spent the extra feat on track. With the Knowledge(Nature) synergy, Nature Sense class ability, high wisdom and assistance from my wolf companion, my character is by far the best tracker. I also suggest taking Spell Focus(Conjuration) and Augment Summoning to provide more frontline punch. The elf seems like a decent pick too. Low light vision and proficiency with those bows (Much better than a sling) and swords (of which the magical variety seems to be more plentiful in most campaigns than scimitars) make for great benefits. I put all of my best abilities in the mental stats as Wild Shape will eventually make his physical ability scores a moot point. Because of his high intelligence, my druid fills many roless: the eyes and ears, the diplomat, the outdoor expert and tracker. He's also the summoner, the buffer, the secondary healer and he even provides melee support with his companion. Just wait until he learns to Wildshape. In my party, the human druid is definitely the star of the show.
Paxbot 06-14-05, 09:58 AM	Depending on what races are available in your campaign, there may be other options. For instance, I play a 7th level Wild Elf Druid in a Forgotten Realms campaign. Wild Elves give up INT for DEX instead of CON. That would certainly solve your worry about the lowered CON for elves.... but you really give up a lot of skill points compared to a human. I compensated for this by taking some more flavourful feats like Stealthy, etc. to boost some skills. It's not the most powerful way to build a charater, but my sneaky Wild Elf is great for RP.
Beamup 06-14-05, 12:03 PM	Human, definitely. Unless the campaign is going to remain very low-level (pre-wildshape). Once you can use wildshape extensively, your physical stats are almost irrelevant, so bonuses to them are pointless. You won't be using bows anyway while wildshaped, and you will have low-light vision in any case. The only race of the three that gives you any major benefit while wildshaped is human, so that's clearly mechanically superior.
Elendur 06-14-05, 12:18 PM	Mechanically both elves and humans are fine. You should go with whatever race you think will be more fun to play.
Fuzzy_Logic 06-14-05, 12:32 PM	out of the three you mentioned, Human. for a druid, the elven stat mods are no real benefit, and while the proficiencies are nice at low level, at high level your weapons probably become irrelevant. skill bonuses and the like are nice, but humans bonus skills and feats counteract them. however, I strongly suggest that you consider dwarf and halfling. dwarf druids are very difficult to kill, with the whole suite of dwarven features and access to hide armor without slowing down. once you get wildshape, you low racial speed becomes unimportant, and because HP aren't affected by wildshape you retain the benefit of your high CON score. Halfligns are good too, very resilient in humanoid form and able to wildshape to compensate for their low STR and speed, but wildhsaping causes them to lose their high DEX.
Elendur 06-14-05, 04:18 PM	once you get wildshape, you low racial speed becomes unimportant, and because HP aren't affected by wildshape you retain the benefit of your high CON score. .You take the CON score of whatever form you take when you wildshape, so your HP can go up and down accordingly. That's why physical ability scores aren't as important in the long run for druids.
Fuzzy_Logic 06-14-05, 04:46 PM	was this changed in 3.5? i remeber from my 3.0 days that although your CON score changed, your hp total did not.
Count Arioch the 28th 06-14-05, 08:03 PM	Yes, it was changed. Druids higher level than 5 only need one good ability score now, Wisdom, and they're good to go.