Post/Author/DateTime	Post
cthascott 12-13-06, 11:50 AM	Hey folks, it's been paining me to be looking through my DnD books and seeing alot of great ideas for classes getting bogged down by less than stellar execution (most likely due to time constraints). I've already started a few re-builds but I wanted to present this to the board. As always, constructive criticism is appreaciated though drastic changes will take careful consideration. I hope you all enjoy and if you do not like what I've presented, I hope that you can at least appreciate it. Hexblade Alignment: Any non-good Hit Dice: d8 Base Attack Bonus: Fighter (1:1) Saves: Good Fortitude and Will, poor Reflex Skills: Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Decipher Script (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Gather Information (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (Arcana) (Int), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Sense Motive (Wis), Spellcraft (Int) and Use Magic Device (Cha) Skill Points: 4 + Int mod (x 4 at 1st level) 1. Hexblade's Cursed Aura (Least) 2. Arcane Resistance 3. Mettle 4. Dark Companion 5. Bonus Feat, Hexblade's Cursed Aura (Lesser) 6. Armored Mage (Medium) 7. Hexblade's Cursed Aura improvement (Initiative) 8. Aura of Unluck (Minor) 1/day (10%) 9. Hexblade's Cursed Aura (Greater) 10. Bonus Feat 11. Steal Luck 1/day 12. Aura of Unluck 2/day (20%) 13. Hexblade's Cursed Aura (Dark) 14. Hexblade's Cursed Aura improvement (Difficult Terrain) 15. Bonus Feat, Steal Luck 2/day 16. Aura of Unluck (Dire) 3/day (30%) 17. Hexblade's Cursed Aura (Vile) 18. Aura of Unluck improvement (Enemy Spell Failure) 19. Steal Luck 3/day 20. Bonus Feat, Aura of Unluck (Legendary) 4/day (40%) Weapon and Armor Proficiencies: All simple and martial weapons and with light and medium armors. Due to the simplicity of the Hexblade's spells, he may cast spells derived from this class in light armor without the chance of spell failure. Hexblade's Cursed Aura:As a free action on his turn, a Hexblade can unleash a baleful aura centered upon him that affects all enemies within the aura's radius. Those affected by the cursed aura must make a Will save (DC 10 + 1/2 the Hexblade class levels+Hexblade's Cha modifier) or be cursed with a -2 penalty to all attack, damage, ability, and skill check rolls made within the aura. A successful save halves the curse affect (-1) as the waves of negative energy still create minor unluck. The radius of the aura starts at 10ft. at 1st level and advances to 5ft./3 Hexblade levels(i.e. 15ft. at 4th level, 20ft. at 7th level, etc. Max 50ft. at 20th level). The aura lasts for as long as the Hexblade has it active. When an enemy leaves the area affected by the Hexblade's Cursed Aura or after the Hexblade turns off the aura, the aura persists upon the enemy for a number of rounds equal to half the Hexblade's class levels(minimum 1, max 5). At 5th level, the aura becomes a more sinister threat and increases to a -3 penalty (-1 if save is successful). At 9th level, a -4 penalty (-2 if save is successful). At 13th level, a -5 penalty (-2 if save is successful). At 17th level, a -6 penalty (-3 if save is successful). Due to the negative energy the Hexblade projects with his auras, he cannot project any other auras derived from another class that provide any positive bonus' or effects to him or his allies at the same time. Arcane Resistance: As per Hexblade class description. Mettle: As per Hexblade class description. Dark Companion: As per Hexblade class description in the PHB II. Spells and spells known: As per Hexblade class description. Bonus Feat: At 5th, 10th, 15th, and 20th levels, the Hexblade receives a bonus feat which is chosen from the Wizards bonus feat list and any Reserve feat from the Complete Mage. The Hexblade must still qualify for his bonus feat by meeting the prerequisites. Armored Mage: At 6th level, the Hexblade gains the ability to wear medium armor without the chance of spell failure. Hexblade's Cursed Aura improvement: At 7th level, the Hexblade's Cursed Aura also affects an enemy's Initiative roll. At 14th level, the area of a Hexblade's Cursed Aura is considered to be difficult terrain for an opponent who has failed the save against the curse. Aura of Unluck: At 8th level, once per day, the Hexblade can project another baleful aura, the Aura of Unluck (minor). When activated, any melee or ranged attack made against the Hexblade has a 10% miss chance. The aura can be activated on the Hexblade's turn as a free action and lasts for a number of rounds equal to 1 + the Hexblade's Cha modifier (min 1). Unlike the Hexblade's Cursed Aura, the Aura of Unluck does not persist after it's duration is over. This aura is centered on the Hexblade and affects only the Hexblade, not his square or the area around him. At 12th level, the Aura of Unluck's miss chance increases to 20%. At 16th level, the Aura of Unluck becomes Dire and the miss chance increases to 30%. At 20th level, the Aura of Unluck becomes Legendary and the miss chance increases to 40%. Steal Luck: At 11th level, the Hexblade can begin to affect opponents that have failed to fully shake off his Cursed Aura. Once per day during the Hexblade's Cursed Aura duration, the Hexblade may choose any opponent who has failed against his Cursed Aura and is currently in it's affected area to re-roll any successful roll they had just made. At 15th level, the Hexblade may use Steal Luck 2/day and at 19th level may Steal Luck 3/day. Aura of Unluck improvement: At 18th level, the Hexblade's Aura of Unluck affects all Arcane spells and spell like abilities that are cast against him by his enemies at a miss chance equal to that of his Aura of Unluck. Enjoy. Looking forward to your responses. Peace. CthaS
RobbyPants 12-13-06, 11:59 AM	Looks nice. I'll have to get out my CW book to compare the old vs the new on this for specifics. I like that he gets both Fort and Will as primary saves. The drop in hit dice might be a good balancing factor.
Aryxbez 12-13-06, 05:39 PM	Sounds nice, has some dead levels it seems though. I prefer the aryxbezian hexblade I kinda mad me self. You should check it out, It is in my sig
cthascott 12-13-06, 05:57 PM	Thanks Robbypants, tell me what you think after you check out the CW Hexblade. Checked it out Aryxbez, not too shabby. I prefered to stick to one hex that can do multiple things so it improves over time and doesn't have overlapping penalties. But it's not a bad thing to have an arsenal.
Neofish 12-13-06, 06:38 PM	This is actually a really neat and fresh take on the Hexblade, the idea that he has a bad luck aura is cool, I like it.
cthascott 12-14-06, 11:20 PM	Thank you Neofish, I really dig the aura too. It really has playtested well and it truly only gets better as you go which means this is a class that someone would actually play through 20 levels. A dead concept, I know, but one can dream right? I've a new Favored Soul for the masses coming soon. Keep those replies coming.
cthascott 12-16-06, 04:40 PM	I wonder if just going ahead and giving the Hexblade his curse as an aura that's usable whenever, like the Marshal, would be better than a per day ability. What do you think?
cthascott 12-19-06, 12:22 PM	I updated the Hexblade's Cursed aura to be an actual aura instead of a use/day effect. I also added an extra use of Steal Luck and moved the Aura of unluck from 11th to 12th level to keep consistency.
DwarfPcfan 12-19-06, 12:40 PM	The only beef I have is the alignement requirement It did'nt make sense in the CW, it still does'nt make sense Bad Luck is not evil, magic is not evil. Impeding your enemies is not evil. So far nobody has ever given me a logical explanation why hexblades should be non-good...
cthascott 12-19-06, 01:46 PM	It doesn't say you have to be evil. It just says non-good. So Lawful-nuetral, chaotic-nuetral, true nuetral, and any evil. It's just due to the negative energy flowing from the Hexblade would make it a little wierd to have a good Hexblade. Alignment in my games is just a guidline and not a hardcore rules set to how your character has to act. Some DMs do it diferentely and you could just say that there are no alignment restrictions to the Hexblade.
Otto the Bugbear 01-07-07, 01:34 PM	Pretty good overall. The d8 hit die is really going to suck, with not being able to use a shield adn stuck in light armor. Hexblade's Cursed Aura: ... The radius of the aura is 5ft/2 Hexblade levels(Max 50ft at 20th level). Too small at low levels. Make it start at 10 feet, and increase by 5 ft. every 3 levels (15 ft. at level 4, 20 ft. at level 7, etc.) Due to the negative energy the Hexblade projects with his auras, he cannot project any other auras derived from another class that provide any positive bonus' or effects to him or his allies at the same time. Good thinking. Hexblade's Cursed Aura improvement: At 7th level, the Hexblade's Cursed Aura also affects an enemy's Initiative roll. This one is almost meaningless. It's basically forcing a very minor delay to an enemy one time. At 14th level, the area of a Hexblade's Cursed Aura is considered to be difficult terrain for an opponent who has failed the save against the curse. Those enemies who successfully saved against the curse are not allowed to run or charge into, out of, or through the area of a Hexblade's Cursed Aura though they do not treat the area as difficult terrain and may still move up to their base land speed. Just make it diffucult terrain for those that fail their save. Simple and it gets the same effect without those extra caveats. Aura of Unluck improvement: At 18th level, the Hexblade's Aura of Unluck affects all Arcane spells and spell like abilities that are cast against him by his enemies at a miss chance equal to that of his Aura of Unluck. This is confusing. With is Aura of Unluck, spells requiring a to-hit roll are already affected. Spells that don't (fireball, etc.) still aren't affected by anything. Unless you mean the hexblade has a chance equal to his Unluck percentage of ignoring spell effects when he is in the area of effect? So, overall, pretty minor stuff. The rest of the class featurs are really well done. The class looks really good and almost complete. :clap: Cheers Otto :)
Teh_username 01-07-07, 03:37 PM	So far nobody has ever given me a logical explanation why hexblades should be non-good... You honestly can't see the difference in a quick, clean stab with a sword/magic missle and cursing someone so that their body slowly gives out, stretching their torment out until they are so weak that you can wander up to them and slit their throat? Not that I'm saying that's the default behaviour of Hexblades, it's just the "quick & clean" versus "slow and agonising" philosophy coming into play
NineInchNall 01-08-07, 12:31 AM	But a Hexblade doesn't have to behave in the manner you describe. Debuffing is a standard tactic of at least half the classes out there, good or not. Why should the Hexblade's debuffs require a specific alignment? They're certainly not powerful enough to justify some silly restriction.
Valdrax 01-08-07, 02:25 PM	Two critiques: Hexblade's Cursed Aura is too "bookkeepy" for my tastes. Drop the saving throw for all enemies, drop the persistence effects once an enemy steps out of the aura, and halve the penalties to compensate. Then it becomes a wider area of effect version of the Blackguard's Aura of Despair and much simpler to adjudicate. Aura of Unluck is ridiculously overpowered. A persistent blur or displacement level effect? Maybe if you halved the miss chance. A 40% miss chance against all physical attacks, spells, and SLAs that cannot be negated unlike incoporealness and etherealness? That's just ridiculous. The only beef I have is the alignement requirement It did'nt make sense in the CW, it still does'nt make sense Flavor, pure and simple. Hexblades are warriors that toss around curses and enchantment and necromancy spells. It's got a definite "dark" vibe coming off of it. They're the same as warlocks in that respect. Also, to NineInchNail, I'd like to point out that while debuffing is a common tactic, the hexes and curses flavor of the Hexblade is definitely non-good. Plus, don't they have some Evil spells on their spell list?
cthascott 01-08-07, 02:57 PM	Thanks for the replies all! Otto, I changed the aura's radius(that always bugged me too to have that short of a range at early levels) and the difficult terrain to only affect those that fail their saves. I gave the Hexblade armored mage at 6th level for medium armor to help compensate for the drop in HD that I felt was necessary. I think that the loss of place in initiative is a big thing because now your allies have a chance to go before the enemy and either kill him or get more healing and many other examples that make this a worthwhile ability. The aura of unluck (legendary) is made so that arcane spells cast against you have a miss chance as though the caster was wearing armor with an arcane spell failure chance equaling you aura of unluck. Even though the duration was short I now realize that the duration needs to be a little shorter than 3+Cha mod due to the power of the ability. I'll try 1+Cha mod and see how that goes. Valdrax, I'm changing the duration of the aura of unluck due to the power of the ability. It has a short duration and only last for so long in the first place. Remember that spell and sla miss chance is a capstone ability. Thanks all! Peace. CthaS
okaynowa 01-08-07, 04:32 PM	A very workable idea for the aura-- I like it. I wonder-- would it be worth the effort to replace the hexblade's spells with warlock-style invocations? While figuring the right number and level of invocations would take some testing, such a class feature would put a little distance between the hexblade and the duskblade (or even between the hexblade and the paladin and ranger, the other spell-casting warriors). The invocations already fit the hexblade's selfish style of spellcasting, for the most part...
NineInchNall 01-08-07, 06:41 PM	Also, to NineInchNail, I'd like to point out that while debuffing is a common tactic, the hexes and curses flavor of the Hexblade is definitely non-good. Plus, don't they have some Evil spells on their spell list? Meh, the mechanics of the class speak nothing of being necessarily nongood. Wizards have tons of evil spells on their spell list; by the rationale that makes the Hexblade nongood, so too must the Wizard and Sorcerer. Regardless of the flavor of the class, since the class's mechanics could be used to represent a character who does not follow the "flavor" of the class, there should be no alignment requirement. I hate the way WotC has developed a tendency to write flavor text for classes that essentially says, "You're not playing the class correctly if you don't roleplay it as such." That's BS. The worst offender in recent memory is the Warblade, the description of which foists this utterly stupid glory hound persona upon the character and player. I determine my character's personality and morality, not you, WotC, so lay off the crappy writing by people who want to be authors but lack the skill or talent.
cthascott 01-09-07, 12:02 AM	Okaynowa, Otto the Bugbear and Gideon Gideonson have made a Hexblade that has invocations instead of spells http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=713830. I enjoy the fact that our Hexblades have very different class features but still work under the same guise. Although, I will admit that I think that a Hexblade like mine with a hex repetoire of Otto and Gideon's would be the ultimate Hexblade.
cthascott 01-20-07, 06:41 PM	Update: Changed the Summon Famliar to the Dark Companion fro the PHB II and added to the bonus feat list with Reserve feats. Peace. CthaS
Spikes01k 01-20-07, 09:04 PM	Personally I liked the 1D10 HD, other than that, not bad.
danielinthewolvesden 01-20-07, 11:22 PM	Hexblade is very worth playing for 4 levels. And the Familiar, along with that Feat in PHII that allows your familiar to take a hot for you (or the other way around) makes the familiar well worth it. They have to have D10 or they die. I agree with the 2 good saves.:cool: My only other change is giving them a larger choice of bonus feats- most Fighter bonus feats, many wizard feats and all the familiar feats. Giving them one Invocation or Dragon Shaman Aura every 5 levels or something would do.
cthascott 01-21-07, 01:29 AM	Thanks for checking it out guys. Even though they never had too much in the first place, I've given the Hexbalde a big step in the right direction. I liked all of the changes made yet I had to compensate somehow and this ended up being the HD. Down by a maximum 2 hit points isn't too bad considering the boost of power. I also gave him medium armor proficiency and armored mage(medium) to help compensate. I pretty much equate the Hexblade to being the arcane Ranger who also has the d8. Peace. CthaS
Roland_of_the_Eld 01-21-07, 01:42 AM	The only beef I have is the alignement requirement It did'nt make sense in the CW, it still does'nt make sense Bad Luck is not evil, magic is not evil. Impeding your enemies is not evil. So far nobody has ever given me a logical explanation why hexblades should be non-good... Its less of an evilthing and more of an evil fighting evil thing. Hexblades do whatever it takes to further their goals. As such, they often end up taking actions that others see as evil. Just look at the description in PHBII.
cthascott 01-22-07, 02:55 AM	Plus, wielding negative energy to produce cursing effects isn't a good act.:schemes: Peace. CthaS
NineInchNall 01-22-07, 12:10 PM	Its less of an evilthing and more of an evil fighting evil thing. Hexblades do whatever it takes to further their goals. As such, they often end up taking actions that others see as evil. Just look at the description in PHBII. Do the mechanics of the class (other than the alignment requirement) make it so that one has to play Hexblades in that manner? No? Then leave off the alignment requirement.
cthascott 01-22-07, 03:39 PM	A Cleric decides at 1st level whether to wield positive or negative energy and this choice reflects their alignment. Since the Hexblade had no choice in the matter as the class is resticted to only wielding negative energy, then the alignment restrictions is obvious. Peace. CthaS
Bard-of-all-trades 02-02-07, 01:19 PM	In defense of this and the Complete Warior Hexblade, if you really look closely this is a base class that is an "anti-Paladin" class. The spells progressions are the same. The HD are the same. They have comparable abilities, just on the flipside of the same coin. Not everyone plays goodie-two-shoes characters in their games and this allows them to really ham it up for the bad guys. Like the change to aura as opposed to use per day. Don't like the drop from d10 to d8 just to get two good saves. I say drop the spells and tack on a few more aura/class abilities. Cool stuff.
NineInchNall 02-02-07, 01:41 PM	A Cleric decides at 1st level whether to wield positive or negative energy and this choice reflects their alignment. Since the Hexblade had no choice in the matter as the class is resticted to only wielding negative energy, then the alignment restrictions is obvious. Peace. Really? I'm gonna call BS on that. The Hexblade has as much choice about wielding negative energy as a Wizard. Good Clerics and Wizards can use negative energy all they want. Just look at enervation. Neutral Clerics choose at first level whether to channel positive or negative energy, and neither choice has an effect on their alignment. That one can make a Sorcerer/Paladin/Spellsword who does nearly everything that the Hexblade - and does so while remaining Lawful Good - should be an indication of the ludicrous nature of the alignment restriction.
cthascott 02-02-07, 02:35 PM	While I generally regard alignment as a guidline more than a hardline, some of the basic game mechanics rely on the alignment system. For example, good Clerics turn undead and spontaneously cast cure spells, evil Clerics rebuke undead and spontaneously cast inflict spells, and nuetral Clerics choose and once they have chosen, they can't reverse it. So alignment does have a part to play in regards to wielding negative or positive energy. Peace. CthaS
NineInchNall 02-02-07, 02:56 PM	Um ... You missed the point. A neutral Cleric's choice of whether to channel positive or negative energy has no impact on his alignment. Yes, channeling negative energy is considered evil, so good Clerics cannot do so. Whoop. However, simply wielding (your word) negative energy has no alignment repercussions. It is an unaligned action. As I said, look at enervation. It is a spell that hits the target with negative energy, yet it is not forbiddent o good Clerics. Look to bestow curse, which is unaligned. Look to unluck, which is unaligned. That a Lawful Good Ranger/Sorcerer/Master of the Yuirwood can mechanically represent everything for which the Hexblade is known (save the +20 BAB) should tell you something. Namely, it should tell you that the alignment restriction is poop.
cthascott 02-03-07, 08:38 AM	NineInchNail: Thanks for checking out the class. I'm sorry that the alignment restriction doesn't sit well with you. Unlike a Wizard or Cleric, the Hexblade uses nothing but negative energy, which is an inherently evil thing, so the alignment restriction is an annoying but necessary thing. This rule, like all of the other rules in the game, does not have to get used when you play. Peace. CthaS
cthascott 02-11-07, 01:50 PM	I'd like some more analysis. :bump:
EvilIdiot 02-15-07, 03:27 PM	Really good job, I like healer as well :clap: . Just a little question: are you really sure about d8? It could even not be a mechanical problem, a matter of weakness, just flavour: the Hexblade should still be a first-line char, and these ones have d10. I can't say that having d8 makes your fix underpowered, likely in a minimal way, nor that d10 would make it overpowered...
cthascott 02-15-07, 04:58 PM	Really good job, I like healer as well :clap: . Just a little question: are you really sure about d8? It could even not be a mechanical problem, a matter of weakness, just flavour: the Hexblade should still be a first-line char, and these ones have d10. I can't say that having d8 makes your fix underpowered, likely in a minimal way, nor that d10 would make it overpowered... Hey, thanks for checking out both classes. I really appreciate that! It seems that most of the folks that have checked out the class are of the mind to have the d10 back. Looking at it some more, you're right, it most likely doesn't have a huge impact on the game as a whole. So d10s for everyone! Peace. CthaS
dragynson1 03-07-07, 05:37 PM	I would love to see a hexblade with invocations, i check edout the one otto made and im not sure if its not a super class. Ill have to test it out some , but giving a half caster access to dark invocations seems excessivein and of itself. I like your remake, i would like to copy it if you dont mind and see what my dms think? I will anyway but i figured i would at least make a show of askin:D
cthascott 03-13-07, 07:16 PM	I would love to see a hexblade with invocations, i check edout the one otto made and im not sure if its not a super class. Ill have to test it out some , but giving a half caster access to dark invocations seems excessivein and of itself. I like your remake, i would like to copy it if you dont mind and see what my dms think? I will anyway but i figured i would at least make a show of askin:D Of course you can use it if you want! I've checked out Otto and Gideon's Hexblade remake and while I can agree with the hexes they added onto it, I can't agree with the invocations. The hexes replace the hex spells that comprised the original Hexblades spells list. But then they tacked on invocations and I think that that's a bit much. Peace. CthaS
taylors005 03-15-07, 08:50 PM	i'm posting simply to get a subscription to this tread but i read any tread about rangers hexblades warlocks druids undead necromancers and fey
Otto the Bugbear 03-15-07, 09:27 PM	I would love to see a hexblade with invocations, i check edout the one otto made and im not sure if its not a super class. Ill have to test it out some , but giving a half caster access to dark invocations seems excessivein and of itself. I like your remake, i would like to copy it if you dont mind and see what my dms think? I will anyway but i figured i would at least make a show of askin:D The newest one is in my sig now, on my homepage. I went and changed the Dark Companion to actually make a little more sense. Now it's a summoned creature from the Plane of Shadow instead of an illusion that doesn't act like an illusion. I've checked out Otto and Gideon's Hexblade remake and while I can agree with the hexes they added onto it, I can't agree with the invocations. The hexes replace the hex spells that comprised the original Hexblades spells list. But then they tacked on invocations and I think that that's a bit much. Peace. Actually, the expanded Hexes were meant only to expand the base, boring hex that it gets. The Invocations were meant to replace the spells. But I digress. I understand that some people will find it too much. It's all according to taste. For what it's worth, I stand by my earlier statements concerning the hexblade cthascott posted; :clap: . I feel like, at this stage, there are so many variants of every class running around that it just requires a little digging and someone will find something that already fits their ideal to a :mrt: , or they'll be able to change it around slightly to accommodate their vision. :D
cthascott 03-16-07, 12:20 AM	The newest one is in my sig now, on my homepage. I went and changed the Dark Companion to actually make a little more sense. Now it's a summoned creature from the Plane of Shadow instead of an illusion that doesn't act like an illusion. I checked it out and this is a nice change! Actually, the expanded Hexes were meant only to expand the base, boring hex that it gets. The Invocations were meant to replace the spells. But I digress. I understand that some people will find it too much. It's all according to taste. For what it's worth, I stand by my earlier statements concerning the hexblade cthascott posted; :clap: . Coming from someone on these boards whose opinion that I value, thank you very much Otto. :D I feel like, at this stage, there are so many variants of every class running around that it just requires a little digging and someone will find something that already fits their ideal to a :mrt: , or they'll be able to change it around slightly to accommodate their vision. :D And I hope that this rebuild is one that some poeple find to their taste. Peace. CthaS