A question on warblades [Archive] - Wizards Community

A question on warblades [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
ambu
10-26-06, 04:33 AM I have recently bought the Book of Nine Swords, which I have enjoyed immensely. However, there is a thing bugging me about the warblade and I would like some help understanding:

A warblade recovers all expended maneuvers with a swift action accompanied by an attack or a standard action doing nothing. Since warblades usually attack in combat :) doesn't that mean that they recover maneuvers constantly? What's the point then? Might as well say that they have an unlimited supply ( I know that in greater levels that means they lose secondary attacks but still...)

Thanks for your time anyway
Osedox
10-26-06, 11:15 AM Well the recovery does prevent them from making a full attack, but as long as you are willing to only make a single swipe a turn you can recover as many times as you want.
Repeekluos
10-26-06, 11:18 AM The real point, is to make sure that they cant use their favorite, and most broken maneuver every round. It limits them to every other round.
Rerednaw
10-26-06, 12:27 PM As they are the class with the least amount of maneuvers at their disposal, having one of the easiest recovery methods seems to be in order.

Of course with the Adaptive Style feat the sword sage can use their favorite every other round as well. Only the crusader with their random granted mechanic cannot.
Neutronium_Dragon
10-26-06, 03:17 PM A Warblade can recover maneuvers with a full attack. The requirement is that they make an attack, which is accomplished with a full attack action just as well as a standard attack action.

What doesn't work is using a strike, so they have to forego one during the recovery round.
Tyraxus
10-26-06, 03:34 PM But a full attack is a full round action, right? So if you use a full attack, you don't get a swift action with which to refresh your maneuvers. Or am I misreading something?
strenoth
10-26-06, 10:16 PM But a full attack is a full round action, right? So if you use a full attack, you don't get a swift action with which to refresh your maneuvers. Or am I misreading something?

Swift actions can be done in conjunction with full round actions. You do a boost, then make a full attack after all.

Swift actions are sort of a sub-category of free action
Neutronium_Dragon
10-26-06, 10:31 PM As above. What you can't do is perform a full attack and take a move action in the same round. However, a swift action is in addition to your move/standard or full-round action, each round.
Osedox
10-27-06, 01:58 AM I think the text states a standard action or a swift action and a single attack.
TekknoMancer
10-27-06, 02:32 AM Osedox
The recovery mechanic says a swift action followed by a melee attack or a standard action doing nothing. Thus the idea is to prevent using maneuvers & switching stances. There is nothing in here to suggest disallowing a full attack. However, the wording does seem to indicate that you can't use the standard action and then move. Thus if there is no one in melee range to attack, you can't move or do anything else that round. Am I reading it correctly?

Another thing not clear to me is if you can ready the same maneuver multiple times. With spell slots, you can ready multiple uses of the same spell. Nothing in ToB explicitly states whether this is allowed or not (or I missed it if it does).
Salla
10-27-06, 02:43 AM Another thing not clear to me is if you can ready the same maneuver multiple times. With spell slots, you can ready multiple uses of the same spell. Nothing in ToB explicitly states whether this is allowed or not (or I missed it if it does).

You can't ready multiples of maneuvers. This is one reason why the ToB classes have in-battle recovery mechanisms, I suspect; you can't just ready 4 Elder Mountain Hammers and call it a day. You *have* to diversify, even if you'd rather not. :)

But, heck, since we're kind of doing general ToB questions here ... is it legal to use/remain in a stance out of combat, since you don't ready or expend them?
Bryan_0697
10-27-06, 03:04 AM But, heck, since we're kind of doing general ToB questions here ... is it legal to use/remain in a stance out of combat, since you don't ready or expend them?

Yes, it says that right in the stance rules.
Neutronium_Dragon
10-27-06, 07:56 AM > I think the text states a standard action or a swift action and a single attack.

It says that you must make a melee attack. It doesn't specify how you do this, or limit you to making only one.
Archangel62
10-27-06, 08:16 AM The real point, is to make sure that they cant use their favorite, and most broken maneuver every round. It limits them to every other round.

And which one would this be oh declarer of everything being broken?
periscope
10-27-06, 02:07 PM And which one would this be oh declarer of everything being broken?

probably the one that lets them do an extra 100 points of damage along with their regular weapon damage.
TekknoMancer
10-27-06, 05:11 PM Or how about White Raven Tactics, I hear that one is quite open to abuse.
Osedox
10-27-06, 07:36 PM I think that white raven tactics is wayyyyy better, but im more of a Iron Hearted Stone Dragon myself.
Archangel62
10-28-06, 01:26 AM yes, but that 100 is at 17th level...I can handle that to one target compared to meteor swarm.
Eyeless Blond
10-28-06, 03:25 AM Meteor swarm is ~84 damage to one target, or much less to a moderate area. You're usually better off with an Empowered Cone of Cold.
Archangel62
10-28-06, 03:34 AM Meteor swarm is ~84 damage to one target, or much less to a moderate area. You're usually better off with an Empowered Cone of Cold.

Sorry, just going for what I remembered off the top of my head. I just find it funny that the minute melee can be effective people scream broken.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
ambu 10-26-06, 04:33 AM	I have recently bought the Book of Nine Swords, which I have enjoyed immensely. However, there is a thing bugging me about the warblade and I would like some help understanding: A warblade recovers all expended maneuvers with a swift action accompanied by an attack or a standard action doing nothing. Since warblades usually attack in combat :) doesn't that mean that they recover maneuvers constantly? What's the point then? Might as well say that they have an unlimited supply ( I know that in greater levels that means they lose secondary attacks but still...) Thanks for your time anyway
Osedox 10-26-06, 11:15 AM	Well the recovery does prevent them from making a full attack, but as long as you are willing to only make a single swipe a turn you can recover as many times as you want.
Repeekluos 10-26-06, 11:18 AM	The real point, is to make sure that they cant use their favorite, and most broken maneuver every round. It limits them to every other round.
Rerednaw 10-26-06, 12:27 PM	As they are the class with the least amount of maneuvers at their disposal, having one of the easiest recovery methods seems to be in order. Of course with the Adaptive Style feat the sword sage can use their favorite every other round as well. Only the crusader with their random granted mechanic cannot.
Neutronium_Dragon 10-26-06, 03:17 PM	A Warblade can recover maneuvers with a full attack. The requirement is that they make an attack, which is accomplished with a full attack action just as well as a standard attack action. What doesn't work is using a strike, so they have to forego one during the recovery round.
Tyraxus 10-26-06, 03:34 PM	But a full attack is a full round action, right? So if you use a full attack, you don't get a swift action with which to refresh your maneuvers. Or am I misreading something?
strenoth 10-26-06, 10:16 PM	But a full attack is a full round action, right? So if you use a full attack, you don't get a swift action with which to refresh your maneuvers. Or am I misreading something? Swift actions can be done in conjunction with full round actions. You do a boost, then make a full attack after all. Swift actions are sort of a sub-category of free action
Neutronium_Dragon 10-26-06, 10:31 PM	As above. What you can't do is perform a full attack and take a move action in the same round. However, a swift action is in addition to your move/standard or full-round action, each round.
Osedox 10-27-06, 01:58 AM	I think the text states a standard action or a swift action and a single attack.
TekknoMancer 10-27-06, 02:32 AM	Osedox The recovery mechanic says a swift action followed by a melee attack or a standard action doing nothing. Thus the idea is to prevent using maneuvers & switching stances. There is nothing in here to suggest disallowing a full attack. However, the wording does seem to indicate that you can't use the standard action and then move. Thus if there is no one in melee range to attack, you can't move or do anything else that round. Am I reading it correctly? Another thing not clear to me is if you can ready the same maneuver multiple times. With spell slots, you can ready multiple uses of the same spell. Nothing in ToB explicitly states whether this is allowed or not (or I missed it if it does).
Salla 10-27-06, 02:43 AM	Another thing not clear to me is if you can ready the same maneuver multiple times. With spell slots, you can ready multiple uses of the same spell. Nothing in ToB explicitly states whether this is allowed or not (or I missed it if it does). You can't ready multiples of maneuvers. This is one reason why the ToB classes have in-battle recovery mechanisms, I suspect; you can't just ready 4 Elder Mountain Hammers and call it a day. You have to diversify, even if you'd rather not. :) But, heck, since we're kind of doing general ToB questions here ... is it legal to use/remain in a stance out of combat, since you don't ready or expend them?
Bryan_0697 10-27-06, 03:04 AM	But, heck, since we're kind of doing general ToB questions here ... is it legal to use/remain in a stance out of combat, since you don't ready or expend them? Yes, it says that right in the stance rules.
Neutronium_Dragon 10-27-06, 07:56 AM	> I think the text states a standard action or a swift action and a single attack. It says that you must make a melee attack. It doesn't specify how you do this, or limit you to making only one.
Archangel62 10-27-06, 08:16 AM	The real point, is to make sure that they cant use their favorite, and most broken maneuver every round. It limits them to every other round. And which one would this be oh declarer of everything being broken?
periscope 10-27-06, 02:07 PM	And which one would this be oh declarer of everything being broken? probably the one that lets them do an extra 100 points of damage along with their regular weapon damage.
TekknoMancer 10-27-06, 05:11 PM	Or how about White Raven Tactics, I hear that one is quite open to abuse.
Osedox 10-27-06, 07:36 PM	I think that white raven tactics is wayyyyy better, but im more of a Iron Hearted Stone Dragon myself.
Archangel62 10-28-06, 01:26 AM	yes, but that 100 is at 17th level...I can handle that to one target compared to meteor swarm.
Eyeless Blond 10-28-06, 03:25 AM	Meteor swarm is ~84 damage to one target, or much less to a moderate area. You're usually better off with an Empowered Cone of Cold.
Archangel62 10-28-06, 03:34 AM	Meteor swarm is ~84 damage to one target, or much less to a moderate area. You're usually better off with an Empowered Cone of Cold. Sorry, just going for what I remembered off the top of my head. I just find it funny that the minute melee can be effective people scream broken.