Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Hennet 04-06-06, 01:34 AM	As a class feature a Dread Necromancer (Heroes of Horror, page 84) becomes a lich at 20th level. It says: ...they change their type to undead and they gain all the traits of the undead (see page 317 of the Monster Manual and also says that: ...She no longer has a Constitution score, all her existing Hit Points become d12s, and she must reroll her hit points. So, do they only gain those abilities mentioned above and the traits on page 317 of the Monster Manual OR do they gain any of abilities of a Lich on page 167 of the Monster Manual. I know that most of the abilities are the same, though the Lich also gains things like: +5 Natural Armor, their touch attack, Fear Aura, Paralyzing Touch, the Turn Resistance, Damage Resuction 15/ Bludgeoning, and the Ability score increase to Intelligance, Wisdom, and Charisma. (the Lich, Monster Manual, page 167) and Would their alignment automatically change to an evil alignment once they become a Lich, because Dread Necromancers do not have to be evil normally. So what exactly do they get?
Slashatme 04-06-06, 01:52 AM	I'd assume they would get all the lich abilities. At the same time you'd be able to go with any alignment since "always x" means almost but with the exception a few. And I'm sure if there was the idea that you didn't want to be a lich (against your god's beliefs or something) your DM could arrange a Will save so you wouldn't change.
Archmagi1976 04-06-06, 02:55 AM	One, since I do not have access to Heroes of Horror, I can not say for sure. Looking at what you stated earlier I almost want you to write the info part of the dread necromancer here if it was not a copy write issue. I would look at what it states dirrectly. If it states that you gain the lich template stated on page 167 then I would say you gain all those abilities. If it states you gain all the undead traits on page 317. Then I would look at it as it stands. There are many classes that give you the undead traits, these traits seem to balance them selves out if many classes have access to them given time. Just my personal view but it seems to be clear if what you presented is close. Sorry... :(
Shedeo 04-06-06, 03:32 AM	Since I think that by level 20, they basically have all the other stuff that the Lich gets anyways,... All that's left is becoming Undead, but that's just my $0.02.
Apollo's Lyre 04-06-06, 05:37 PM	Since I think that by level 20, they basically have all the other stuff that the Lich gets anyways,... All that's left is becoming Undead, but that's just my $0.02. Naah, you still need get ability score increases, natural armor, and a ton more DR than a DN has at that point in order to have all the lich stuff. I assume you get all the stuff you don't already have...
General_Ridley 04-06-06, 08:39 PM	I asked this last November. the response was a resounding: "Improve all abilities that are exactly the same as those granted by Lich to the levels of the Lich, and add all other abilities missing (ability score increases, full fear aura, paralyzing touch, etc.)"
Hennet 04-06-06, 09:01 PM	I asked this last November. the response was a resounding: "Improve all abilities that are exactly the same as those granted by Lich to the levels of the Lich, and add all other abilities missing (ability score increases, full fear aura, paralyzing touch, etc.)" HUH???????????? What does that mean? Could someone translate that into english, please?
Archmagi1976 04-06-06, 10:42 PM	They are trying to say everything goes up to you being a full blown lich.