"endurance" charges instead of per encounter abilities? [Archive] - Wizards Community

"endurance" charges instead of per encounter abilities? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Bladesinger Boy
08-02-07, 10:39 PM Okay, I haven't actually looked in the Tome of battle: Book of Nine Swords myself, but I have heard a lot about it. Besides getting into a power level argument or thinking what new maneuvers people can come, I was thinking about the whole "X uses per encounter" thing some classes use.

First of all, I don't think this is a good way to do abilities. Classes need to moderate their abilities per I believe, and an attack roll will always be an attack roll at those same pluses all day long, but per encounter uses seems... inconsistent to me. But, for now, they're on the game a bit, so maybe a better mechanic is needed.

I was thinking that the the only abilities that seems to be continually renewing all day long are:
1) healing 1 pt nonlethal per hour
2) be able to run or hold one's breath for x2 con score

So, if I were calling the shots, I'd say these abilities that are right now consider "per encounter" abilities should either inflict nonlethal damage to the user and/or be consider endurance-draining in that they are consuming effect rounds one can hold their breath for. Perform enough of these in an encounter and you become fatigued or even exhausted.

So, thoughts? Any ToB fanboys actually like this better, think it
is more balanced?
InkBlot
08-03-07, 01:40 AM You should get Tome Of Battle before trying to make any changes to it.

First of all, each maneuver is "once per encounter." Never more and never less. Second of all, it's not really "once per encounter." It's actually, "once until you spend an action to catch your breath, or practically at-will outside of combat."
fatal error
08-03-07, 03:33 AM Well, something this doesn't address at all, at least for ToB, is the fact that you can't use the same maneuver multiple times before re-readying, which has become one of my favorite features of that system. Keeps the combats varied each round.

Furthermore, if you based it upon nonlethal damage, your uses of these abilities would increase as you leveled, but that wouldn't increase the cost of using one action, you'd just be able to do that one action more often as you level. Which is useless unless running out of "endurance" is common in combats.

Finally, if you went off nonlethal damage, it would be increasingly difficult to pull high level stunts as a combat goes on, which is generally the opposite of what happens at the climactic battles of book and movie fame. In those, opponents generally start with high power attack, slip down to mid and lower power ones, and then finish it with another series of high power moves.

Out of curiosity, why do you find Per Encounter to be "inconsistent?" Is it because they are always ready for an encounter, whether it be the first or the eleventh? However, since you can recover these abilities in combat, it doesn't seem far fetched to have recovered them between encounters.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Bladesinger Boy 08-02-07, 10:39 PM	Okay, I haven't actually looked in the Tome of battle: Book of Nine Swords myself, but I have heard a lot about it. Besides getting into a power level argument or thinking what new maneuvers people can come, I was thinking about the whole "X uses per encounter" thing some classes use. First of all, I don't think this is a good way to do abilities. Classes need to moderate their abilities per I believe, and an attack roll will always be an attack roll at those same pluses all day long, but per encounter uses seems... inconsistent to me. But, for now, they're on the game a bit, so maybe a better mechanic is needed. I was thinking that the the only abilities that seems to be continually renewing all day long are: 1) healing 1 pt nonlethal per hour 2) be able to run or hold one's breath for x2 con score So, if I were calling the shots, I'd say these abilities that are right now consider "per encounter" abilities should either inflict nonlethal damage to the user and/or be consider endurance-draining in that they are consuming effect rounds one can hold their breath for. Perform enough of these in an encounter and you become fatigued or even exhausted. So, thoughts? Any ToB fanboys actually like this better, think it is more balanced?
InkBlot 08-03-07, 01:40 AM	You should get Tome Of Battle before trying to make any changes to it. First of all, each maneuver is "once per encounter." Never more and never less. Second of all, it's not really "once per encounter." It's actually, "once until you spend an action to catch your breath, or practically at-will outside of combat."
fatal error 08-03-07, 03:33 AM	Well, something this doesn't address at all, at least for ToB, is the fact that you can't use the same maneuver multiple times before re-readying, which has become one of my favorite features of that system. Keeps the combats varied each round. Furthermore, if you based it upon nonlethal damage, your uses of these abilities would increase as you leveled, but that wouldn't increase the cost of using one action, you'd just be able to do that one action more often as you level. Which is useless unless running out of "endurance" is common in combats. Finally, if you went off nonlethal damage, it would be increasingly difficult to pull high level stunts as a combat goes on, which is generally the opposite of what happens at the climactic battles of book and movie fame. In those, opponents generally start with high power attack, slip down to mid and lower power ones, and then finish it with another series of high power moves. Out of curiosity, why do you find Per Encounter to be "inconsistent?" Is it because they are always ready for an encounter, whether it be the first or the eleventh? However, since you can recover these abilities in combat, it doesn't seem far fetched to have recovered them between encounters.