Any Dwarf Paladin advice? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Any Dwarf Paladin advice? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
happycows
02-08-05, 11:09 AM I plan to be a dwarf paladin probably +2con -2 cha. I asked my dm for the +2 con -2 dex varient in the DM and he okayed it. I still want the -2 charisma instead of dex.

I was thinking of using a sword and a shield. Turning seems so useless and I'll lose out some on all the charisma benefits that a paladin gets. I figured I'd multiclass out keeping my lawfull good nature.

Perhaps shadowbane inquisitor? Any suggestions?
Platinumwarlock
02-08-05, 11:49 AM In playing a paladin, one of your greatest benefits is your ability to wear heavy armor and uphold Divine Grace. Built correctly, your AC and saves should be better than any other character in the game, except perhaps those of a monk. As such, I would take the -2 Dex and run with it, even if you were planning on getting into Shadowbane Inquisitor. Why, you ask? Divine Power and Divine Shield, from Complete Warrior. They'll allow you to add your Cha bonus to both damage rolls and your AC by spending turning attempts. As such, having a high Cha is extremely important for you. Yes, you'll take the penalty to Dex, but you'll also be wearing the heaviest, most protective fullplate available. Don't skimp on that armor...

If you're really dead set on multiclassing, Shadowbane Inquisitor isn't bad, but there are other choices you may want to think of. Kensai is pretty spiffy, as well as some of the classes from Complete Divine. Just take a look around.
Ringrose
02-08-05, 11:53 AM I would go Dwarf Cleric instead...some nice turning Feats (Command/Rebuke Earth) feats in races of stone (like the immovable one where no spell/effect or creature can move you from your spot). Also some really nice Armor Proficiencies as well...I would take at least one level of Psychic Warrior so you can take the Psionic Focusing feats in Races of Stone (mainly the onesthat adds your Armor bonus to your ranged touch attack and increase your shield bonus by +1 as long as your focused) as well as getting the Martial Weapons proficiency...
happycows
02-08-05, 12:13 PM I'd rather fast healing 3 times a day is also good if I don't plan on being too charismatic.

I have a 17, 16, 14, 12, 12, & 10. I was planning on 10 wis, 12int, 12 cha, 14 dex, 17 str, 16 con. Get that mithrall fullplate or something. then racial modifiers kick in...

In this case I think I am leaning more towards rogue/paladin/shadowbane.

Wasn't there a feat from the complete adventurers that let rogue levels stack with paladin levels to determine abilities for paladins?

Maybe I'll be a rogue palaidn.

I just want a good melee paladin is all. I'll go look at the kensai.

paladin 3/fighter 2/ ??? kensai ??? idk
Kanne
02-08-05, 05:19 PM The feat your thinking of is for monk/rouges there isnt any rouge/paladan ones...
In my opinion a rouges abbilities dosent mesh well with the paladans anyway. flavor wise, it might look kinda weird. dwarf Pal/Rog.
If you want to Multiclass i would grab the Kensai, as already mentioned or the Dwarven Defender.

As far as your stats go, this is what i would do:
Str-16, Dex-12, Con-17(+2), Int-10, Wis-12,-Cha 14(-2)

-My personal preference is lots of Hp, so i always put my highest stat on con, plus being a dwarf gives you a +4 right away (lv4 bump this to 20 for +5)

-Str is a good second so it gets the next highest stat to bash the baddies better. :D

-*You had 14 on dex but if your going to be wearing full plate you really only need 12 to get the best results.

-The paladan dosent get too many good skills to begin with so i would leave the 10 there. and get by with only 2 skills.

-The 12 on your wisdom gets you an extra 1st lv spell wich could prove useful --cure light! :ayyyy!:

-I know you said you didnt care if you were charismatic or not but i would still put a 14 here to get some extra turning. being a dwarf and all you get a -2 here but you'll still get something out of it.

*If your planning on getting some Mitheral Armor then i suggest putting that 14 in dex and the 12 on cha.
-Mith Plate costs, 9500gp? with +8ac +3dex and counts as a Medium armour?-
happycows
02-09-05, 12:19 AM You are correct but it's a +2dex bonus I think. Plus heavy armor is expensive so I'll be armed with a shield and a medium armor untill then. Chainmail is not so bad.
CzarGarrett
02-09-05, 08:53 AM I'd definately go with the variant for the -2 Dex, or at least put the 10 in Dex. Then go with the heaviest armor you can. I'd see a Dwarven Paladin as a mini-tank that can rip through evil beings.

As per your multiclass- if you can due to the idea of Paladin orders (depending on campaign world), then a Cleric might be a good choice. You don't lose much on hp or attack, and you gain extra spells, which could be damn good for buffing. Don't worry abour a PrC yet.
Cardinal Teplin
02-09-05, 09:27 AM The feat you are thinking of is in Complete Adventurer. It doesn't allow class levels to stack (that is for monks) , but it does daze opponents if you smite them and sneak attack them at the same time. Trouble is, the save DC for this is effect is based off... charisma. Still worth getting though.

Kensai is a very useful class, particularly in those games where magic items and gold are hard to come by. Some kind of double weapon - like the dwarven urgosh - really does help here, and you can simply use it as two-handed weapon, reversing it to get an alternate set of weapon powers, until you can get the two weapon fighting feats with the help of some stat bost items. A single level dip into exotic weapon master would also net you an extra attack.

I'd also recommend occult slayer, and pious templar (gets you mettle, weapon specialistion, DR and 2nd level paladin spells, all within 3 levels.) I'm not personally a fan of the shadowblade prestige classes in complete adventurer, but if you want a sneak attacking paladin, they are probably the way to go. A little different is the Justicar prestige class, that give you sneak attack bonuses when striking to subdue. Well worth a look.

From the sound of it, though, you may be better off as a cleric? Similar BAB, more spells, and with suitable time to buff up you'll be more than a match for a straight fighter. Certainly, if you don't like turn undead, I'd really suggest taking at most only two levels in paladin before going off into something else.
Platinumwarlock
02-09-05, 03:03 PM The feat your thinking of is for monk/rouges there isnt any rouge/paladan ones...
In my opinion a rouges abbilities dosent mesh well with the paladans anyway. flavor wise, it might look kinda weird. dwarf Pal/Rog.
If you want to Multiclass i would grab the Kensai, as already mentioned or the Dwarven Defender.

No, there is actually a feat in CAdv that is meant for Paladin/Rogue hybrids. It allows you to multiclass between the two freely and, if you Smite Evil on a Sneak Attack, gives you a chance to daze an opponent.

*shrug* If anything a Pal/Rog is a unique concept and works somewhat like a Solomon Kane-type of character; relentlessly devoted to hunting evil, but using questionable means to do so.

However, I do agree with you on Kensai and Dwarven Defender. Just be careful to note that Kensai does not get full BAB progression. It gets 3/4.
Kanne
02-09-05, 06:08 PM No, there is actually a feat in CAdv that is meant for Paladin/Rogue hybrids. It allows you to multiclass between the two freely and, if you Smite Evil on a Sneak Attack, gives you a chance to daze an opponent.
oops, my mistake. It's called "Ascetic Rouge" from CAdv, dont know how i missed it :P

But ya, flavorwise a: Dwarven, Paladan/Rouge might look a bit odd.
Really only because your a Dwarf
I just can't see a dwarf sneeking about...
Nuntius128
02-09-05, 06:14 PM Go with a Gold Dwarf Paladin :D Penalty to Cha becomes penalty to Dex.

Also, go Dwarven Waraxe instead of sword. For flavor, and is roughly as useful.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
happycows 02-08-05, 11:09 AM	I plan to be a dwarf paladin probably +2con -2 cha. I asked my dm for the +2 con -2 dex varient in the DM and he okayed it. I still want the -2 charisma instead of dex. I was thinking of using a sword and a shield. Turning seems so useless and I'll lose out some on all the charisma benefits that a paladin gets. I figured I'd multiclass out keeping my lawfull good nature. Perhaps shadowbane inquisitor? Any suggestions?
Platinumwarlock 02-08-05, 11:49 AM	In playing a paladin, one of your greatest benefits is your ability to wear heavy armor and uphold Divine Grace. Built correctly, your AC and saves should be better than any other character in the game, except perhaps those of a monk. As such, I would take the -2 Dex and run with it, even if you were planning on getting into Shadowbane Inquisitor. Why, you ask? Divine Power and Divine Shield, from Complete Warrior. They'll allow you to add your Cha bonus to both damage rolls and your AC by spending turning attempts. As such, having a high Cha is extremely important for you. Yes, you'll take the penalty to Dex, but you'll also be wearing the heaviest, most protective fullplate available. Don't skimp on that armor... If you're really dead set on multiclassing, Shadowbane Inquisitor isn't bad, but there are other choices you may want to think of. Kensai is pretty spiffy, as well as some of the classes from Complete Divine. Just take a look around.
Ringrose 02-08-05, 11:53 AM	I would go Dwarf Cleric instead...some nice turning Feats (Command/Rebuke Earth) feats in races of stone (like the immovable one where no spell/effect or creature can move you from your spot). Also some really nice Armor Proficiencies as well...I would take at least one level of Psychic Warrior so you can take the Psionic Focusing feats in Races of Stone (mainly the onesthat adds your Armor bonus to your ranged touch attack and increase your shield bonus by +1 as long as your focused) as well as getting the Martial Weapons proficiency...
happycows 02-08-05, 12:13 PM	I'd rather fast healing 3 times a day is also good if I don't plan on being too charismatic. I have a 17, 16, 14, 12, 12, & 10. I was planning on 10 wis, 12int, 12 cha, 14 dex, 17 str, 16 con. Get that mithrall fullplate or something. then racial modifiers kick in... In this case I think I am leaning more towards rogue/paladin/shadowbane. Wasn't there a feat from the complete adventurers that let rogue levels stack with paladin levels to determine abilities for paladins? Maybe I'll be a rogue palaidn. I just want a good melee paladin is all. I'll go look at the kensai. paladin 3/fighter 2/ ??? kensai ??? idk
Kanne 02-08-05, 05:19 PM	The feat your thinking of is for monk/rouges there isnt any rouge/paladan ones... In my opinion a rouges abbilities dosent mesh well with the paladans anyway. flavor wise, it might look kinda weird. dwarf Pal/Rog. If you want to Multiclass i would grab the Kensai, as already mentioned or the Dwarven Defender. As far as your stats go, this is what i would do: Str-16, Dex-12, Con-17(+2), Int-10, Wis-12,-Cha 14(-2) -My personal preference is lots of Hp, so i always put my highest stat on con, plus being a dwarf gives you a +4 right away (lv4 bump this to 20 for +5) -Str is a good second so it gets the next highest stat to bash the baddies better. :D -You had 14 on dex but if your going to be wearing full plate you really only need 12 to get the best results. -The paladan dosent get too many good skills to begin with so i would leave the 10 there. and get by with only 2 skills. -The 12 on your wisdom gets you an extra 1st lv spell wich could prove useful --cure light! :ayyyy!: -I know you said you didnt care if you were charismatic or not but i would still put a 14 here to get some extra turning. being a dwarf and all you get a -2 here but you'll still get something out of it. If your planning on getting some Mitheral Armor then i suggest putting that 14 in dex and the 12 on cha. -Mith Plate costs, 9500gp? with +8ac +3dex and counts as a Medium armour?-
happycows 02-09-05, 12:19 AM	You are correct but it's a +2dex bonus I think. Plus heavy armor is expensive so I'll be armed with a shield and a medium armor untill then. Chainmail is not so bad.
CzarGarrett 02-09-05, 08:53 AM	I'd definately go with the variant for the -2 Dex, or at least put the 10 in Dex. Then go with the heaviest armor you can. I'd see a Dwarven Paladin as a mini-tank that can rip through evil beings. As per your multiclass- if you can due to the idea of Paladin orders (depending on campaign world), then a Cleric might be a good choice. You don't lose much on hp or attack, and you gain extra spells, which could be damn good for buffing. Don't worry abour a PrC yet.
Cardinal Teplin 02-09-05, 09:27 AM	The feat you are thinking of is in Complete Adventurer. It doesn't allow class levels to stack (that is for monks) , but it does daze opponents if you smite them and sneak attack them at the same time. Trouble is, the save DC for this is effect is based off... charisma. Still worth getting though. Kensai is a very useful class, particularly in those games where magic items and gold are hard to come by. Some kind of double weapon - like the dwarven urgosh - really does help here, and you can simply use it as two-handed weapon, reversing it to get an alternate set of weapon powers, until you can get the two weapon fighting feats with the help of some stat bost items. A single level dip into exotic weapon master would also net you an extra attack. I'd also recommend occult slayer, and pious templar (gets you mettle, weapon specialistion, DR and 2nd level paladin spells, all within 3 levels.) I'm not personally a fan of the shadowblade prestige classes in complete adventurer, but if you want a sneak attacking paladin, they are probably the way to go. A little different is the Justicar prestige class, that give you sneak attack bonuses when striking to subdue. Well worth a look. From the sound of it, though, you may be better off as a cleric? Similar BAB, more spells, and with suitable time to buff up you'll be more than a match for a straight fighter. Certainly, if you don't like turn undead, I'd really suggest taking at most only two levels in paladin before going off into something else.
Platinumwarlock 02-09-05, 03:03 PM	The feat your thinking of is for monk/rouges there isnt any rouge/paladan ones... In my opinion a rouges abbilities dosent mesh well with the paladans anyway. flavor wise, it might look kinda weird. dwarf Pal/Rog. If you want to Multiclass i would grab the Kensai, as already mentioned or the Dwarven Defender. No, there is actually a feat in CAdv that is meant for Paladin/Rogue hybrids. It allows you to multiclass between the two freely and, if you Smite Evil on a Sneak Attack, gives you a chance to daze an opponent. shrug If anything a Pal/Rog is a unique concept and works somewhat like a Solomon Kane-type of character; relentlessly devoted to hunting evil, but using questionable means to do so. However, I do agree with you on Kensai and Dwarven Defender. Just be careful to note that Kensai does not get full BAB progression. It gets 3/4.
Kanne 02-09-05, 06:08 PM	No, there is actually a feat in CAdv that is meant for Paladin/Rogue hybrids. It allows you to multiclass between the two freely and, if you Smite Evil on a Sneak Attack, gives you a chance to daze an opponent. oops, my mistake. It's called "Ascetic Rouge" from CAdv, dont know how i missed it :P But ya, flavorwise a: Dwarven, Paladan/Rouge might look a bit odd. Really only because your a Dwarf I just can't see a dwarf sneeking about...
Nuntius128 02-09-05, 06:14 PM	Go with a Gold Dwarf Paladin :D Penalty to Cha becomes penalty to Dex. Also, go Dwarven Waraxe instead of sword. For flavor, and is roughly as useful.