Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Nivek Loneshadow 02-28-07, 06:00 PM	Archer This is another attempt to make a good archer core class for DnD. posted one version a short time ago in another thread. (It's still linked in my sig) I thought i was making progress but i tried to post the class at another site as well. There is ran into more dispute. IH (Iron Heroes by Mark Mearls) has an archer class in it. It uses a new concept of an Aim Pool. IH is a system based off the idea of chars not needing magic items. Therefore they get far far more feats and feat masteries to balance. Here I have combined what I had with many ideas and better wording taken from the IH class. The Iron Heroes Archer (http://www.montecook.com/cgi-bin/page.cgi?mpress_IL_excerpt3) I would like people to rate the class on balance and how fun it would be to play this class. I don't want to here anything about fighters and rangers making good archers. Please judge this class on what you have here. Thank you for your help. Archer Hit Dice: d8 Lvl BAB FS RS WS Special 1 +1 +0 +2 +0 Aim Pool, Ranged Mastery 2 +2 +0 +3 +0 Bonus Feat 3 +3 +1 +3 +1 - 4 +4 +1 +4 +1 Ranged Mastery 5 +5 +1 +4 +1 Bonus Feat 6 +6/+1 +2 +5 +2 Close Combat Shot 7 +7/+2 +2 +5 +2 Ranged Mastery 8 +8/+3 +2 +6 +2 Bonus Feat 9 +9/+4 +3 +6 +3 Called Shot 10 +10/+5 +3 +7 +4 Improved Aim Pool, Ranged Mastery 11 +11/+6/+1 +3 +7 +5 Bonus Feat 12 +12/+7/+2 +4 +8 +4 Evasion 13 +13/+8/+3 +4 +8 +4 Ranged Mastery 14 +14/+9/+4 +4 +9 +4 Bonus Feat 15 +15/+10/+5 +5 +9 +5 Greater Aim Pool 16 +16/+11/+6 +5 +10 +5 Ranged Mastery 17 +17/+12/+7 +5 +10 +5 Bonus Feat 18 +18/+13/+8 +6 +11 +6 - 19 +19/+14/+9 +6 +11 +6 Ranged Mastery 20 +20/+15/+10/+5 +6 +12 +6 Bonus Feat Class Skills: Balance (Dex), Climb (Str), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Hide (Dex), Move Silently (Dex), Ride (Dex), Spot (Wis), Survival (Wis), Tumble (Dex) Skills at 1st Level: (4 + Intelligence bonus) x4 Skill points at Higher Levels: 4 + Intelligence bonus Class Features Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Archers are proficient with all simple weapons, all thrown and projectile martial weapons, and light armor. Aim Pool: The archer's class abilities revolve around access to the aim token pool. The aim pool represents an archer's genius at locking onto one target, taking careful aim, and firing a single arrow with incredible precision. A skilled archer not only hits her target, she strikes him at the exact point she chooses. At the start of your turn, you may designate a single opponent that you can see (a creature or object) as the target of your aim token pool. You earn 1 aim token against him if you spend a move action doing nothing but aiming at him. You earn 2 aim tokens if you spend a standard action doing nothing but aiming at him. You earn 4 aim tokens if you spend a full-round action drawing a bead on him, doing nothing but aiming. In addition, you automatically earn an additional aim token if your target did not move between your last action and your current one. You can take aim against a motionless enemy with ease. You gain this token at the start of your action. You spend aim tokens to power various archer class abilities, described below. The longer you aim, the better your shot. In other words, if you spend more aim tokens on an attack, it garners more powerful effects. You keep building up aim tokens until you select a different opponent as the target for your aim pool. You can never have more tokens than 10 + your level in a pool at once. You lose any extra tokens you build up above this limit. At some point, additional aiming fails to improve your accuracy. When you select a new foe as your target, you lose the aim tokens you have built up and must start accruing them again. Aim tokens that go unspent upon a particular target grant you no special benefits; you must discard them and may begin accumulating new tokens against a different target. You cannot carry aim token pools against more than one target at the same time. Action Spent Aiming Aim Tokens Gained Move 1 Standard 2 Full-round 4 Opponent remains still 1 Ranged Mastery: Each time you gain ranged mastery (at 1st level and then every three after), you select a new ability from those listed below. Each ranged mastery ability costs a number of aim tokens to use. You spend aim tokens as a free action and apply the effects to the shots you take for the rest of your turn. You can complete this free action before taking a shot, but you cannot use aim tokens to benefit more than one ranged mastery ability in a given attack. You can spend more than required aim tokens on a single ability to gain its benefits multiple times. For example, if you spend 4 tokens on distant shot, you reduce the range penalty to your attacks by 4. You cannot reduce a penalty beyond 0 to turn it into a bonus. Where noted below, certain abilities are not available to use more than once in a single attack. Unless otherwise stated, a ranged mastery ability inflicts normal damage in addition to the effect described below. You can gain the benefits of ranged mastery abilities only against the target of your aim pool. Accurate Shot: You take aim at the smallest bit of an exposed foe, hitting him despite cover. Accurate shot reduces your opponent's defense bonus due to cover by 4 points for each token spent. You cannot reduce the defense bonus of an opponent who enjoys full cover from you if that cover blocks your line of sight to him. Armor Piercing Shot: You take aim at a chink in your opponent's armor, hoping to overcome his defenses by hitting a poorly defended spot. Your shot inflicts a -1 penalty to your foe's armor bonus for every 2 tokens spent. You may only reduce your foes AC by the total AC bonus of the armor its wearing. Natural armor may also be reduced, However the bonus from a shield cannot be unless the target is unaware of the shot. Deadly Shot: You target a particularly sensitive or vulnerable area on your opponent's body, such as the eyes. By spending 4 aim tokens, your attack grants you a bonus to damage equal to half your Dexterity bonus. You cannot use this ability more than once on a given attack. Distant Shot: Even at long range, your shots hit with uncanny accuracy. You reduce the range penalty to your attacks by 4 points per token spent. Critical Shot: You may improve your chances of a critical by spending aim tokens. For every 4 tokens you spend you can increase the threat range by 1. This stacks with the Improved Critical Feat. Confirmed Critical Shot: If you take careful aim against an opponent, you can make a deadly shot to his eyes, throat, or other vulnerable spot. With some luck, you can strike a foe dead in one shot. Using this ability requires an expenditure of 16 aim tokens. Make a single attack as a full-round action. If your attack succeeds, you automatically cause a critical hit. You cannot use this ability more than once on a given attack. Prerequisites: Critical Shot, Improved Aim Pool Improved Deadly Shot: By spending 4 aim tokens, you gain a bonus to damage equal to your Dexterity bonus on all your ranged attacks against your target. This bonus lasts until your next action. You cannot use this ability more than once on a given attack. Prerequisites: Deadly Shot, Improved Aim Pool Sneaky Shot: When your target is flanked or denied his active bonus to defense, you can inflict extra damage if you are within 30 feet of him. For every 4 aim tokens spent, your attack causes +1d6 points of damage. Do not multiply this damage on a critical hit. Creatures immune to criticals are also immune to this ability. Sniper Shot: By spending 2 additional aim tokens you may double your sneak attack range to 60ft. Prerequisites: Sneaky Shot Bonus Feats: At 2nd, 6th, 10th, 14th, and 18th levels, you gain a bonus feat from the following list Alertness, Blind Fighting, Combat Reflexes, Dodge (Mobility), Deadeye Shot**, Improved Critical, Improved Initiative, Improved Mounted Combat*, Improved Rapid Shot*, Mounted Combat (Mounted Archery), Penetrating Shot**,Point Blank Shot (Far Shot, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot, Manyshot, Shot on the Run, Improved Precise Shot), Quick Draw, Telling Blow**, Weapon Focus (greater), Weapon Specialization (greater) *From CW, **From PHB II Close Combat Shot: By level 6 the archer has learned to overcome his greatest weakness; melee combat. You can shoot arrows with a bow while in a threatened square and not provoke an attack of Opportunity. Called Shots: At level 9 the archers abilities to aim at certain small target increases. He becomes so confident in his targeting skills that he can “call” his shots or aim at specific items. The archer gains all the of the called shots listed below. Daunting Shot: You fire an arrow that nicks a creature's ear, creases his skull, sticks directly in the center of his coat of arms, or otherwise demonstrates your uncanny accuracy. Your target must make a Will save (DC 10 + half your archer level +1 for every two tokens spent) or become shaken for 2d4 rounds. You cannot use this ability to impose a condition worse than "shaken" upon a creature. Disrupting Shot: You shoot an arrow at an opponent's hand, weapon, talon, or paw to disrupt his attacks. Rather than inflict damage, you cause him to suffer a -1 penalty to his attacks until the end of his next action for every two tokens spent, unless he succeeds in a Fortitude save (DC equal to your attack's result) Hamstring Shot: To use this ability, ready an action to fire at your target when he moves. If your readied attack hits, your opponent must succeed at a Fortitude save (DC 10 + half your archer level +1 for every two tokens spent on this shot) or move at half his normal speed until the end of his current action. Disarming Shot: You fire an arrow to knock a weapon from an opponent's hand. Spend 8 aim tokens and make a single attack as a standard action; your foe makes an opposed attack. If your result is higher, you knock his weapon to the ground in his current space. The target gains a +4 bonus if his weapon is two-handed. If his weapon is larger than yours, he gains an additional +4 bonus for each size category of difference between his weapon and yours. You do not gain a benefit if you wield a larger weapon. You cannot use this ability more than once on a given attack. Sundering Shot: You can shoot small items off a creature's body, cut belts, and destroy similar little items. By spending 8 aim tokens, you may make an attack against a single item carried by your target; the item must have a hardness of 2 or lower. Your shot suffers a -4 penalty. On a success, you damage the item as normal. You can choose to damage an item directly, thus possibly destroying it, or sever a belt or pouch to knock it to the ground at the target's feet. You cannot use this ability more than once on a given attack. Improved Aim Pool: You can now fill your aim pool faster than before, as you quickly assess a target and prepare to fire; see the table below for the improved token values for time spent aiming. Note that you can take a free action to aim only once per round. Action Spent Aiming Aim Tokens Gained Free 1 Move 2 Standard 3 Full-round 5 Opponent remains still 2 Evasion (Ex): a rogue can avoid even magical and unusual attacks with great agility. If she makes a successful Reflex saving throw against an attack that normally deals half damage on a successful save, she instead takes no damage. Evasion can be used only if the rogue is wearing light armor or no armor. A helpless rogue does not gain the benefit of evasion. Supreme Aim Pool: As with the improved aim pool ability, above, you gain even more tokens for spending actions to aim, as shown in the following table. Action Spent Aiming Aim Tokens Gained Free 2 Move 4 Standard 6 Full-round 10 Opponent remains still 4
Nivek Loneshadow 03-01-07, 06:03 PM	Any thoughts on this version? I've been thinking of trying a Sublime version for the specials as well. Would that be a better way to go instead of adding the IH mechanic?
Sines 03-01-07, 08:15 PM	Very interesting. However, the aim points must provide a benefit to make not attacking worth it. Otherwise people would just take thier move action (And thier free action once they get it), as taking a standard or full action should give enough of a benefit to justify not attacking that round. A Full Round Aim should provide a benefit greater than taking a full round action to attack. Basically, any round spent aiming (Aiming as Standard or Full Action) should provide something like a x1.2 to x1.5 effectiveness to your action the next round. Still, I like the concept.
Darkness is good 03-03-07, 10:15 PM	It really shows how much of a anime nerd I am when I clicked on this class expecting Archer from fate/stay night.......I am the bone of my sword, ect. Sigh I like your class tho'
Bhaal006 03-03-07, 10:42 PM	Very interesting. However, the aim points must provide a benefit to make not attacking worth it. Otherwise people would just take thier move action (And thier free action once they get it), as taking a standard or full action should give enough of a benefit to justify not attacking that round. A Full Round Aim should provide a benefit greater than taking a full round action to attack. Basically, any round spent aiming (Aiming as Standard or Full Action) should provide something like a x1.2 to x1.5 effectiveness to your action the next round. Still, I like the concept. other than this, i think its awesome, i like the aim pool its a cool mechanic.
HomebrewedMonster 03-03-07, 10:58 PM	Not a big fan of the aim pool nor all the class features that are already feats, but too each their own.
tombowings 03-04-07, 12:48 AM	In gerneral I like the class Not a big fan of the aim pool nor all the class features that are already feats, but too each their own. I will agree with half of this (class features that are already feats). I think that it makes the feats you can take too restrictive (if you wanted to take one earlier that the ablity). Maybe you should have them offered earlier than the feat can be taken.
Nivek Loneshadow 03-04-07, 04:20 PM	Glad to see some feedback coming in. Specials = Feats Disarming Shot = Ranged Disarm Over all I don't like the CW feats that well. Ranged Disarm at level 5 to me just seems to soon. So I combined it in with the later stuff. Accurate shot = Improved Precise shot? Also it's like sharpshooter from CW. Same thoughts on CW feats but here the logic is that you can get the improvements without have to take a feat like sharpshooter and then IPS again later to improve your chances. Plus some might not qualify for IPS Distant Shot = Far Shot. Many people don;t like far shot as a feat because it's not that good. This seems to be a way to spend a couple aim tokens to improve your odds when it counts but to have better feats available. Accurate shot and Far Shot. I see your points here. Perhaps they should be combined into a way to "Modify" your shots with aim. Perhaps they could both just be given at level 1 with part of the aim pool concept. Aim Pool There are many ways to use the Aim Pool. Sneaky shot is a good example of waiting more than 1 round Before level 10 for example. You could wait two rounds and gain +2d6 sneak attack. +3d6 for waiting another round. Also a concept that isn't made clear here. I've learned to don't have to shoot at the same target your gathering tokens on. You might fire at a few meaningless thugs for a couple rounds while saving up aim tokens against a leader that is well covered and far away. Then when you have enough tokens built up you spend them to fire a very well place shot into him. I'll keep working on the details and making refinements. Thanks again for quality feedback and not comments like just play a fighter.
DamD 03-04-07, 04:46 PM	Would the aim pool be considered as the archer settling into combat, by not moving the archer has set markers to the path of the arrows (gaining aim points by the way the arrows fly past a certain tree, statue)? As you said firing quick shots at the thugs, while concentrating on the leader.
Nivek Loneshadow 03-04-07, 04:52 PM	If I follow that question correctly. Yes thats one way to look at it.