Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Dread_Pirate_Dan 01-23-07, 10:14 PM	Very simple: whats the best way to go for the quintisential heroic fantasy archer?
Jaxgaret 01-23-07, 10:17 PM	quintessential heroic fantasy archer Describe what you mean by this phrase, and we might be able to give you an answer.
Tim4488 01-23-07, 10:20 PM	Fighter or Ranger.
Dread_Pirate_Dan 01-23-07, 10:22 PM	quin·tes·sence –noun 1. the pure and concentrated essence of a substance. 2. the most perfect embodiment of something. i'm pretty sure people on here would know what heroic fantasy is :)
Jaxgaret 01-23-07, 10:38 PM	quin·tes·sence –noun 1. the pure and concentrated essence of a substance. 2. the most perfect embodiment of something. i'm pretty sure people on here would know what heroic fantasy is :) Okay then... so you're telling me that the builds and flavor for the Green Arrow, William Tell, Legolas, and Robin Hood are going to be exactly the same? They're all quintessential heroic fantasy archers. Yes, I know that one or two of those may have really existed. In their legends, however, they are most certainly heroic fantasy characters.
Zanny 01-23-07, 10:40 PM	See, the problem with that is, we don't know what kind of "quintessential" character you want. A close-range archery specialist, darting in and out of combat while peppering enemies with arrows? A sniping, high damage/long range marksman hiding in the forest? Somebodies that just walks over to them and smacks them with an arrow? :confused: You see my point?
scienceman47 01-23-07, 10:41 PM	Ranger. There, were done. Heroic fantasy archers get a sudden inexplicable urge to go live in the woods as soon as they pick up a bow. I don't know why, so don't ask. Fighters and rangers make the best archers. You can make an archer with damn near anything though. Just keep in mind that barbarians and rangers are inclined towards straight melee, clerics and druids benefit from complete divine cheese, and a monk archer will be kinda weird.
Jaxgaret 01-23-07, 10:43 PM	War Clerics make the best archers. Just tidying up a bit :)
Dread_Pirate_Dan 01-23-07, 11:37 PM	Okay then... so you're telling me that the builds and flavor for the Green Arrow, William Tell, Legolas, and Robin Hood are going to be exactly the same? They're all quintessential heroic fantasy archers. Yes, I know that one or two of those may have really existed. In their legends, however, they are most certainly heroic fantasy characters. i may not have been as clear as i should have with the first posting. I don't have an absolutely specific character build in mind, i was hoping people might come up with their own definitions of the quintissential heroic fantasy archer. And yes, the Green Arrow, William Tell, Legolas, and Robin Hood are all fine examples any of which would be perfectly suited to answering the question. As far as stright Rangers and Fighters go, i've seen no end of posts where rangers are described as "subpar" and fighters are considered redundant past 4th level
Warlord_Draco 01-23-07, 11:42 PM	scouts make sweet archers.. if you want to be a sniper/sneaky type theres rogue. Robin hood would probably be ranger/rogue, no animal companion though..
Avalongod 01-23-07, 11:51 PM	Scouts and fighters would probably be the best options for you. Scouts would add skirmish damage and get a decent amount of bonus feats, fighters: feats, feats, feats, feats, and then more feats. Take all of 'em in archery skills and you should be able to manage some neat archery tricks.
Jaxgaret 01-23-07, 11:52 PM	As far as stright Rangers and Fighters go, i've seen no end of posts where rangers are described as "subpar" and fighters are considered redundant past 4th level Compared to casters, yes. The best archer build is a War Cleric, going strictly by a power comparison.
Warlord_Draco 01-23-07, 11:54 PM	I don't think cleric really fits with quintessential heroic fantasy archer..
Jaxgaret 01-23-07, 11:57 PM	I don't think cleric really fits with quintessential heroic fantasy archer.. Why does praying for a god's munificence to lay waste to thine enemies not jive with your vision of a heroic fantasy archer? It's just another way of going about it. Gods have good aim, I hear. For reference, think of the sniper character from Saving Private Ryan.
Avalongod 01-24-07, 12:00 AM	I think because the original post was essentially referring to an archer like character that fit the archtypes set forth by cinema. There are no "praying archer" archtypes in cinema (perhaps the closest would be Henry V, although he told English archers when to fire, more than actually fired a longbow himself, and some may doubt his religious sincerity). Nothing wrong with a cleric/archer (although favored soul might make a better choice), just not the "Archtype"
Warlord_Draco 01-24-07, 12:03 AM	Why does praying for a god's munificence to lay waste to thine enemies not jive with your vision of a heroic fantasy archer? It's just another way of going about it. Gods have good aim, I hear. For reference, think of the sniper character from Saving Private Ryan. never saw that movie and probably never will.... but most fantasy archer heroes don't cast tons of spells...
kadeity 01-24-07, 12:11 AM	well i absolutely love archers. that said... there are dozens of ways to do them. Fighter Alot of people are lazy and go straight Fighter... and prestige into Order of the bow Initiate...which isnt exactly a bad option. Ranger Some people Do the ranger thing, then Prestige class into Deepwood sniper, or even waste a level on Sorcerer so they can get Arcane Archer. the phb2 variant ranger gets distracting attack, which makes someone count as flankedfor the rest of the round if you hit them with an attack... which makes a ranger rogue team a nasty duo. Cleric War Domain Clerics can play archers really well, especially if your dm lets you just grab whatever domains from whatever setting, as you can practically use domains as feats that way. Druid druids are good at everything. Even bows. So sayeth nature. Scout Scouts are relatively new on the scene, and are pretty much archers who run in circles pumping arrows into you... all the while getting alot of damage from their skirmish ability. Rogue Rogues make better crossbow archers imho... since sneak attack is a withing 30ft thing, and the Crossbow sniper feat lets you extend that to 60ft. Also theres a "sniping mastery" ability that halfling rogues can get as a substitution level at level 10 (if you use races of the wild) Monk monks with Zen archery are fun, sicne they can use that wisdom to feed you arrows... but they arent so great. Paladin Some crazy elf paladins take the substitution levels or the feat that lets you use smite at a range. Thats wierd, and suboptimal. Artificer Something i really havent seen done very much is an Artifcer Archer, which i think would be pretty awesome...since you can craft the crap out of stuff, and you can put fun infusions on your bow as needed to make it whatever sort of arrow machine you need that day. Soulknife Probably the least conventional archer out there is the soulknife prestige class called Soulbow. Its a psionic class and It doesnt actually use a bow. they just shoot arrows from the palm, of their hands... which makes them not so much an archer as a Lazer-pew-pew-dude. BUT ME? i made a beautiful one man volley of arrows build ... which you can find here. http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=11264261#post11264261 This is what I PLAY. and i LOVE IT.
Zanny 01-24-07, 01:19 AM	Personally, I like a mix of Fighter, Order of the Bow Initiate, and scout. Spend most of your feats getting extra attacks, improving your to hit, and keeping some miscellaneous options (varies depending on campaign). Add a speed bow, and you've got some devent damage on a full attack, especially if you have high strength and a mighty composite bow. Edit: Okay, never mind. I just looked at kadeity's volley build, and it's honestly much better. Kudos, kadeity! You're the first person to ever give me a reason to play a Ranger!
kadeity 01-24-07, 03:23 AM	Edit: Okay, never mind. I just looked at kadeity's volley build, and it's honestly much better. Kudos, kadeity! You're the first person to ever give me a reason to play a Ranger! LMAO. yeah, i absolutely love it. Being able to crit-the-un-critable is really really nice.... and when you realize i can spit one shot, four arrows to deal 8d8+ 28d6 damage.... well it just makes me feel like christmas.
kadeity 01-24-07, 03:25 AM	The best archer build is a War Cleric, going strictly by a power comparison. except next to mine. Seriously, look. http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=11264261#post11264261