Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Aryxbez 12-05-06, 10:59 PM	Aryxbezian Hexblade I love the hexblade, and I always wanted to play one. Except their class is bad and can't do some things that made me dissapointed (can't use shields). Also I find Otto's hexblade he has on his thread not to my liking. eldritch blasts? and invocations I saw as a maybe, but doesn't quite fit for me. I find hexblades to be the types who debuff by using bad luck and cursing people and then as a warrior type, beats them into the ground. Also think they should be all about curses and debuffing spells Also could someone Please show me their great spell selections for the hexblade only from the PH,PH2,complete warrior,complete arcane, and Bonus feats as well I wish to make this as balanced as possible, please let me know if it is and what changes to be made, and REASONS for saying so. I also wish to stick with this cursing theme. Note: most of this is not my work,most of it is the ideas of Kadasbrass Also I am not really good at balancing spells so if you can show me a better spell progression, that would also be appreciated as well Thanks to anyone who posts The Hexblade Hit Die: d10 Base Attack Fort Ref Will Level Bonus Save Save Save Special 1st +1 +2 +0 +2 Hexblade's curse 1/day 2nd +2 +3 +0 +3 Arcane resistance 3rd +3 +3 +1 +3 Mettle 4th +4 +4 +1 +4 Dark Companion 5th +5 +4 +1 +4 Hexblade's curse 2/day 6th +6/+1 +5 +2 +5 Mass curse 7th +7/+2 +5 +2 +5 Greater hexblade's curse, Curse of Guided Strikes 8th +8/+3 +6 +2 +6 Duel Hex 9th +9/+4 +6 +3 +6 Hexblade's curse 3/day 10th +10/+5 +7 +3 +7 Penetrating Curse 11th +11/+6/+1 +7 +3 +7 Curse of Slowness 12th +12/+7/+2 +8 +4 +8 Aura of Unluck 1/encounter 13th +13/+8/+3 +8 +4 +8 Hexblade's curse 4/day 14th +14/+9/+4 +9 +4 +9 15th +15/+10/+5 +9 +5 +9 Curse of Spellbane 16th +16/+11/+6/+1 +10 +5 +10 Aura of Unluck 2/encounter 17th +17/+12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +10 Hexblade's curse 5/day Dire Hexblade curse 18th +18/+13/+8/+3 +11 +6 +11 Improved Mettle 19th +19/+14/+9/+4 +11 +6 +11 20th +20/+15/+10/+5 +12 +6 +12 Aura of Unluck 3/encounter Table: Hexblade Spells Per Day Level 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 1st — — — — 2nd — — — — 3rd — — — — 4th 0 — — — 5th 1 — — — 6th 1 — — — 7th 1 — — — 8th 1 0 — — 9th 1 1 — — 10th 1 1 — — 11th 1 1 0 — 12th 1 1 1 — 13th 2 1 1 — 14th 2 1 1 0 15th 2 2 1 1 16th 2 2 1 1 17th 3 2 2 1 18th 3 3 2 1 19th 3 3 3 2 20th 3 3 3 3 Table: Hexblade Spells Known Level 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 1st — — — — 2nd — — — — 3rd — — — — 4th 2 — — — 5th 3 — — — 6th 3 — — — 7th 3 — — — 8th 3 2 — — 9th 3 3 — — 10th 4 3 — — 11th 4 3 2 — 12th 4 3 3 — 13th 4 4 3 — 14th 4 4 3 2 15th 4 4 4 3 16th 5 4 4 3 17th 5 5 4 4 18th 5 5 5 4 19th 5 5 5 5 20th 5 5 5 5 Class Features All of the following are class features of the hexblade. Class Skills The hexblade’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Appraise (Int), Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disguise (Cha), Gather Information (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Sense Motive (Wis), Spellcraft (Int), and Use Magic Device (Cha). skillpoints 4+int modifier Alignment: Any nongood. Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A hexblade is proficient with all simple and martial weapons. A hexblade is proficient with light armor,medium armor and all shields.(except Tower shields) Because the somatic components required for hexblade spells are simple, a hexblade can cast hexblade spells while wearing light armor without incurring the normal arcane spell failure chance. However, like any other arcane spellcaster, a hexblade wearing medium or heavy armor incurs a chance of arcane spell failure if the spell in question has a somatic component (most do). A multiclass hexblade still incurs the normal arcane spell failure chance for arcane spells received from other classes. Hexblade's Curse (Su): Hexblade gets 1/day at 1st level and gets a extra one per day per every 4 levels Also gains extra amount of curses per day equal to his charisma modifier. so if the aryxbez the 1st level hexblade has 16 charisma,(+3 mod) gain 3 extra curses per day equaling 4 per day. As a Swift action, a hexblade can unleash a curse upon a foe. The target must be visible to the hexblade and within 60 feet. The target of a hexblade's curse takes a -2 penalty on attacks, saves, ability checks, skill checks, caster level checks, and weapon damage rolls for 1 hour thereafter. A successful Will Save (DC 10 + 1/2 hexblade's class level + hexblade's Cha modifier) reduces the effects and duration by half. Multiple hexblade's curses don't stack, however can apply Alternate Hexes. So a foe can be under the effects of Hexblades curse and under a Alternate Hex such as Curse of Slowness. Any effect that removes or dispels a curse eliminates the effect of a hexblade's curse. Arcane Resistance (Su): At 2nd level, a hexblade adds 1 point of Charisma bonus (if any) per hexblade level on saving throws against spells and spell-like effects. Mettle (Ex): At 3rd level and higher, a hexblade can resist magical and unusual attacks with great willpower or fortitude. If he makes a successful Will or Fortitude save against an attack that normally would have a lesser effect on a successful save (such as any spell with a saving throw entry of Will half or Fortitude partial), he instead completely negates the effect. Dark Companion: At 4th level, gain a dark companion, described in the PH2. Except the shadowy illusion form can look like whatever you wish. So it could be a bull, or a dog if you prefer. (Don't want Drizzt elements in this hexblade!) Spells: Beginning at 4th level, a hexblade gains the ability to cast a small number of arcane spells, which are drawn from the hexblade spell list. He can cast any spell he knows without preparing it ahead of time, just as a sorcerer can. To learn or cast a spell, hexblade must have a Charisma score equal to at least 10 + the spell. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against a hexblade’s spell is 10 + the spell level + the hexblade’s Charisma modifier. Like other spellcasters, a hexblade can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. His base daily spell allotment is given on Table: Hexblade Spells Per Day. In addition, he receives bonus spells per day if he has a high Charisma score. When Table: Hexblade Spells Per Day indicates that the hexblade gets 0 spells per day of a given spell level, he gains only the bonus spells he would be entitled to based on his Charisma score for that spell level. The hexblade’s selection of spells is extremely limited. A hexblade begins play knowing no spells, but gains one or more new spells at certain levels, as indicated on Table: Hexblade Spells Known. (Unlike spells per day, the number of spells a hexblade knows is not affected by his Charisma score; the numbers on Table: Hexblade Spells Known are fixed.) Upon reaching 8th level, and at every hexblade level after that, a hexblade can choose to learn a new spell in place of one he already knows. In effect, the hexblade “loses” the old spell in exchange for the new one. The new spell’s level must be the same as that of the spell being exchanged, and it must be at least one level lower than the highest-level hexblade spell the hexblade can cast. A hexblade may swap only a single spell at any given level, and must choose whether or not to swap the spell at the same time that he gains new spells known for the level. As noted above, a hexblade need not prepare his spells in advance. He can cast any spell he knows at any time, assuming he has not yet used up his allotment of spells per day for the spell’s level. Alternate Hexes (Su): As a Hexblade gains levels, they learn new curses they can inflict on their foes. When a Hexblade uses their curse they may choose to use their original curse or one of the alternate curses instead. Creatures that pass their saving throw against any of the Hexblade’s curses can’t be affected by the same curse for 24 hours, but may be targeted again by a different curse. Curse of Paranoia: At level 3 a Hexblade can use their curse of paranoia to increase the attack bonus creatures receive for flanking the target. The attack bonus of flanking increase by +2, for the Greater Curse the benefits increase by +4, for the Dire Curse the benefits increase by +6. Mass curse At 6th level the hexblade can instead expend 2 uses of Hexblades curse, and a curse affects all foes within a 30 ft radius burst of the hexblade. Curse of Guided Strikes: At level 7 a Hexblade learns how to curse their foes so that oncoming blows seem to be guided to weak points in their defenses. Curse of Guide Blades applies a penalty to the targets AC equal to the penalty of the Hexblade Curse (the targets AC cannot be reduced below 1). The AC penalty applies to all attacks made against the target. Duel Hex:At level 8, darn ye... what does it do?!! Penetrating Curse:At level 10, darn ye... must figure out what this ability does.. Ideas? Curse of Slowness: At level 11 a Hexblade learns how to slow the movement of their foes. The speed of the target for all types of movement is reduced by half. As a Dire Curse, the target can only take a single move action or standard action in a round, and a five-foot step is considered a move action. Curse of Spellbane: At level 15 a Hexblade learns the ability to hamper spell-casting abilities of his foes. The target of a Curse of spellbane must now make a concentration check to cast the spell. A DC (20 +spell level) and once it becomes Dire,(30 +spell level) Aura of Unluck (Su): Once per encounter, a hexblade of 12th level or higher can create a baleful aura of misfortune. Alls attacks made against the hexblade while this aura of unluck is active have a 50% miss chance. Activating the aura is a immediate action aura lasts for the same round it was activated The effects of this ability stack with any other spell, effect, or circumstance that causes a miss chance (roll each miss chance separately). At 16th level and every four levels thereafter, a hexblade gains the ability to use his aura of unluck an extra time per day. Dire Hexblade's Curse (Su): When a hexblade attains 17th level, the penalty on attacks, saves, ability checks, skill checks, caster level checks, and weapon damage rolls incurred by a target of the hexblade's curse becomes -6 instead of -4. Improved Mettle (Ex): At 18th level, a hexblade's mettle ability improves. He still negates all effects on a successful Will or Fortitude saving throw against attacks, but henceforth, he only suffers a lesser effect on a failed save. If an attack (such as the wail of the banshee spell) does not have a lesser effect (half or partial), then he still suffers the full effect on a failed save. HEXBLADE SPELLS CW Spells from Complete Adventurer added, per note at the bottom of page 139. Spells from Complete Arcane added, per note at the bottom of page 94, including Unluck as 4th. And then, all of those Complete Adventurer and Complete Arcane spells were replaced by Spell Compendium versions, per Dispel Confusion, Vol. 2, No. 1 and LGCS 5. However, even though the Spell Compendium changed the level of Unluck for other classes, Unluck did not change level for the Hexblade spell list. 1ST-LEVEL HEXBLADE SPELLS Alarm: Wards an area for 2 hours/level. Arcane Mark: Inscribes a personal rune (visible or invisible). Augment Familiar: Your familiar becomes more powerful. SpC Backbiter F: Cause melee weapon to strike is wielder. SpC Cause Fear: One creature of 5 HD or less flees for 1d4 rounds. Charm Person: Makes one person your friend. Detect Magic: Detects spells and magic items within 60 ft. FAQ Distract Assailant: Swift. One creature is flat-footed for 1 round. SpC Disguise Self: Changes your appearance. Entropic Shield: Ranged attacks against you have 20% miss chance. Expeditious Retreat: Your speed increases by 30 ft. Identify M: Determines properties of magic item. Costs 100 gp. FAQ Light: Object shines like a torch. Magic Weapon: Weapon gains +1 bonus. Mount: Summons riding horse for 2 hours/level. Nystul’s Magic Aura: Alters object’s magic aura. Phantom Threat: One creature thinks it’s flanked. SpC Prestidigitation: Performs minor tricks. FAQ Protection from Chaos/Evil/Good/Law: +2 to AC and saves, counter mind control, hedge out elementals and outsiders. [Lawful] [Good] [Evil] [Chaotic] Read Magic: Read scrolls and spellbooks. Sleep: Put 4 HD of creatures into comatose slumber. Tasha's Hideous Laughter: Subject loses actions for 1 round/ level. Undetectable Alignment: Conceals alignment for 24 hours. Unseen Servant: Invisible force obeys your commands. 2ND-LEVEL HEXBLADE SPELLS Blindness/Deafness S: Makes subject blind or deaf. Bull’s Strength: Subject gains +4 to Str for 1 min./level. Critical Strike S: Swift. For 1 round you gain +1d6 damage, doubled threat range, and +4 on attack rolls to confirm critical threats on flanked or denied-Dex foes. SpC, Notes Darkness S: 20-ft. radius of supernatural shadow. Eagle’s Splendor: Subject gains +4 to Cha for 1 min./level. FAQ Enthrall: Captivates all within 100 ft. + 10 ft./level. False Life: Gain 1d10 temporary hp +1/level (max +10). Notes Glitterdust: Blinds creatures, outlines invisible creatures. Invisibility: Subject is invisible for 1 min./level or until it attacks. FAQ Invisibility, Swift S: Swift. Invisibility lasts 1 round. SpC Mirror Image: Creates decoy duplicates of you (1d4 +1 per three levels, max 8). LGCS Clarification, FAQ Phantasmal Assailants: Phantasm deals 8 Wis damage and 8 Dex damage. SpC Protection from Arrows: Subject immune to most ranged attacks. Rage: Gives +2 morale bonuses to Str and Con, +1 on Will saves, -2 to AC. Resist Energy: Ignores 10 (or more) points of damage/attack from specified energy type. See Invisibility: Reveals invisible creatures or objects. Spider Climb: Grants ability to walk on walls and ceilings. Suggestion S: Compels subject to follow stated course of action. Summon Swarm: Summons swarm of bats, rats, or spiders. Touch of Idiocy: Subject takes 1d6 points of Int, Wis, and Cha damage. Whirling Blade F: Make an attack on a line of foes with your slashing weapon. SpC 3RD-LEVEL HEXBLADE SPELLS Arcane Sight: Magical auras become visible to you. FAQ Charm Monster: Makes monster believe it is your ally. Confusion: Subjects behave oddly for 1 round/level. Deep Slumber: Puts 10 HD of creatures to sleep. Dispel Magic: Cancels spells and magical effects. PH Errata, FAQ Hound of Doom: Creates shadowy protector for 1 min/level. CW Invisibility Sphere: Makes everyone within 10 ft. invisible. Magic Weapon, Greater: +1 bonus/four levels (max +5). Nondetection M: Hides subject from divination, scrying. Costs 50 gp. Phantom Steed: Magic horse appears for 1 hour/level. Poison: Touch deals 1d10 Con damage, repeats in 1 min. Protection from Energy: Absorb 12 points/level of damage from one kind of energy. Repel Vermin: Insects, spiders, and other vermin stay 10 ft. away. Slow: One subject/level takes only one action/round, -1 to AC, reflex saves, and attack rolls. Spectral Weapon: Swift. Use quasi-real weapon to make touch attacks. SpC Stinking Cloud: Nauseating vapors, 1 round/level. Vampiric Touch: Touch deals 1d6/two levels damage (max 10d6); caster gains damage as hp. Notes Wind Wall: Deflects arrows, smaller creatures, and gases. 4TH-LEVEL HEXBLADE SPELLS Baleful Polymorph: Transforms subject into harmless animal. PH Errata, LGCS Clarification, FAQ Break Enchantment: Frees subjects from enchantments, alterations, curses, and petrification. Contact Other Plane S: Lets you ask question of extraplanar entity. Cursed Blade S: Swift. Wounds dealt by weapon can’t be healed without remove curse. SpC Detect Scrying: Alerts you of magical eavesdropping. Dimension Door S: Teleports you short distance. Dominate Person: Controls humanoid telepathically. FAQ Enervation: Subject gains 1d4 negative levels. FAQ Fear: Subjects within cone flee for 1 round/level. Invisibility, Greater: As invisibility, but subject can attack and stay invisible. FAQ Phantasmal Killer: Fearsome illusion kills subject or deals 3d6 damage. Scrying F: Spies on subject from a distance. PH Errata, FAQ Sending: Delivers short message anywhere, instantly. Shadow Form: Gain +4 on Hide, Move Silently, and Escape Artist checks, and concealment; you can move through obstacles if you have ranks in Escape Artist. SpC Solid Fog: Blocks vision and slows movement. Unluck: Target remakes all rolls, uses worse result for 1 round/level. SpC
Spec_Specter 12-05-06, 11:13 PM	wow, I like it not much of a change, but still a change in all the right spots :) yeah, Otto's Hexblade with eldritch blasts didn't suit to well with me eather <.<
Aryxbez 12-06-06, 05:15 PM	Glad someone likes it I thought I was the only one who thought the ottos hexblade was odd
Gideon_Gideonson 12-06-06, 06:18 PM	Well, my Hexblade was the base for Otto's, and I must say I didn't like his addition of Eldritch Blast. This is more to my liking, with a few exceptions: Hex should be a swift action...no hexing everyone on one turn. What do you mean by extra hexes based on Charisma? Please explain in more detail And the Invocations made the guy more versitle, and darker. I think that's the way to go, but we'd need new invocations (especially debuffs/curses). But this is great.
Aryxbez 12-06-06, 06:43 PM	Thank you gideon, I am surprised people are actually liking my creation! Originally posted by Gideon_Gideonson Hex should be a swift action...no hexing everyone on one turn. Well I might actually do that, If i get enough input and votes to say so Originally posted by Gideon_Gideonson What do you mean by extra hexes based on Charisma? Please explain in more detail You get extra amount of curses per encounter equal to your charisma mod so if aryxbez the 1st level hexblade has a chrisma score of 16 (+3 modifier) he would have 4 curses per encounter and even more with the extra curse feat=+1 curse per encounter and can be taken multiple times
Gideon_Gideonson 12-06-06, 09:19 PM	The extra hexes is nice. Now that I understand it, it seems like a good idea. And of course I like it. i love the hexblade, and this is a more carefully thought out version of my own.
Neofish 12-06-06, 10:58 PM	And the Invocations made the guy more versitle, and darker. I think that's the way to go, but we'd need new invocations (especially debuffs/curses). But this is great. If your really want'in to go down that route, i'd just turn the Hexblade's curse ability (and all of it's variants) into invocations. That solves the limited use factor and the confusion and kinda cuts down on having to keep track of multiple abilities (streamlined is the way to go). Just make it a free (or mandatory) 1st level invocation, exclusive to the hexblade (kinda how the dragonfire adept has exclusive invocations).
Spec_Specter 12-06-06, 11:14 PM	I was always fond of the Hexblade being a spellcaster rather then casting invocations... it made him seem more... worldly <.<
Aryxbez 12-06-06, 11:46 PM	Originally Posted by Gideon_Gideonson the extra hexes is nice. Now that I understand it, it seems like a good idea. And of course I like it. i love the hexblade, and this is a more carefully thought out version of my own. Wow, I did not even know, funny enough I didn't really think it out that deeply and It is mostly kadasbrass creation, I just put it together and such Also I was thinking as a 6th level ability: Mass curse spends 2 curses, and curse affects all foes within a 30 radius of the hexblade So what do you think? Good idea?
Gideon_Gideonson 12-07-06, 03:11 PM	Given the large number of curses a high Cha hexblade will have, i'd have to say no.
dark_nony 12-07-06, 03:22 PM	I say his familier needs to be a weapon familier. An intelligent item that maybe gets the ability to magic himself.
Repeekluos 12-07-06, 03:37 PM	The shadow familiar out of phb2 is awesome. As far as the the class itself, I think that he has way too many Curses. If you kept it one a day, and then gave him more based on Cha, that's one thing. Giving him 1/encounter, and additional based on Cha? That's a little much. He will effectively never run out. I would say just keep the 1/encounter, then add more through levels. I also agree with G_G, curses should be a Swift action. Other than that, it seems OK. The alternate curses are alright. Dragon Magazine created feats for the HB that added effects to their curses. You might want to look those up for more ideas.
Hanniball 12-07-06, 04:20 PM	Hexblade's Curse (Su):curses are now per encounter and refresh themselves after 1 minute of resting after combat That is way too many curses, IMO. Cutting it down to per encounter makes that particular ability more useful, sure, but with their other class features taken into account it seems like overkill. Consider a hexblade running through a dungeon, encountering creature after creature, but resting for a minute prior to each encounter. This could potentially give the Hexblade hundreds of uses each day and, with the potency of the ability, that is unbalanced. You also made it save for half as opposed to save negates. This makes the ability far too potent, especially considering the amazing list of curses you now give them. Arcane Resistance (Su): Love it. It promotes taking a large number of levels, as opposed to the infamous "dip" and makes the character more powerful as he gains levels instead of all in one shot. Aura of Unluck (Su): Again, once per encounter is too many uses, IMO. This is an extremely powerful ability that should definitely be limited to uses/day. Also, I'm going to assume you were thinking about finishing the description with "even when it's not your turn." Don't. Immediate action, supernatural concealment, useable every encounter is broken. Unless it only lasts for like a round or something. (You didn't include a duration) Otherwise, a great writeup. I especially like the new curses. Kudos! I was always fond of the Hexblade being a spellcaster rather then casting invocations... it made him seem more... worldly <.< Really? (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=751638) *plug plug*
Kadasbrass 12-07-06, 05:54 PM	I will point that this is based on a early draft I had posted as a reply in a thread. Which was based quite a bit on the suggests and ideas of others, including Dragon Mag, (which had a issue with a number of hex feats. The Alternate Hexes were based on thoses as a replacement for their bonus feats). Sometime I'll get around to posting a recent version of my changes.
Aryxbez 12-07-06, 05:58 PM	Update: I gave Aryxbezian hexblade 4+int to skillpoints curses are per day instead of per encounter No more refreshes (which I totally agree to get rid of) Aura of Unluck has been given a duration and still in use per encounter Also, to note, this ability does NOT get any extra curses from the charisma modifier or any at all except every 4 levels Also curses are now swift actions Originally Posted by Repeekluos The alternate curses are alright. Dragon Magazine created feats for the HB that added effects to their curses. You might want to look those up for more ideas. I actually own that magazine issue, In fact some of the abilities were inspired by the feats Also I was thinking as a 6th level ability: Mass curse spends 2 curses, and curse affects all foes within a 30 radius of the hexblade So what do you guys think? Good idea? and please give reasons for saying so.
Repeekluos 12-07-06, 06:04 PM	Mass curse spends 2 curses, and curse affects all foes within a 30 radius of the hexblade So what do you guys think? Good idea? and please give reasons for saying so. I dont think its a bad idea. It doesn't scream over powered.
Aryxbez 12-14-06, 06:07 PM	So, is there anyone else who thinks Mass Curse is a good idea? that is balanced for the class? Mass curse spends 2 curses, and curse affects all foes within a 30 radius of the hexblade Also I thought of a filler for 14th level Piling Curse at 14th lv when using the hexblade curse ability, you can spend 2 extra curses to make a special curse that stacks with itself. so if you spent 4 curses using this ability =2 curses which their penalties would stack = -8 penalty however, for every curse applied over the 1st, the curse duration is equal to the hexblades level in rounds instead of one hour or day. (with extend curse feat) Also does anyone have an idea for a filler for 19th level? that would be approiate? Also I am in Dire need of a awesome Hexblade spell list that I have heard a mass of DMs have made themselves. I want the spells to focus on debuffing I am not big judge on spells, since I never play characters with spells and even more rare to use monsters with spells. So what do you guys think? and please give reasons for your opinion
Aryxbez 12-22-06, 06:03 PM	I have yet to hear from anyone on these two curses mass for 6th and piling for 14th
Spikes01k 04-29-07, 03:03 PM	The curse of paranoia could be expanded on just a little. Maybe make the greater or dire have the option of taking only +2 and surpassing their Unncany Dodge so that rogues can the sneak attack them.
Aryxbez 04-29-07, 09:29 PM	well it only gives a flanking bonus, why would the hexblade be at danger of being sneak attacked? If you meant the enemy, well rogues have ways of getting around creatures immune to crits.
Spikes01k 06-13-07, 08:22 AM	I noticed that you got two good saves, full bab, and a D10 hit die. This is just broken, no class has all that. Get ride of the saves, or reduce the bonuses to fort saves, but with all you added power wise, get ride of the good fort saves entirely.
Jell_Moo 06-13-07, 08:31 AM	I noticed that you got two good saves, full bab, and a D10 hit die. This is just broken, no class has all that. Get ride of the saves, or reduce the bonuses to fort saves, but with all you added power wise, get ride of the good fort saves entirely. The Samurai from OA has 2 good saves, a d10 and a full BAB. This is far from broken.
Omnirahk, half-Rahkshi 06-13-07, 08:55 AM	I noticed that you got two good saves, full bab, and a D10 hit die. This is just broken, no class has all that. Get ride of the saves, or reduce the bonuses to fort saves, but with all you added power wise, get ride of the good fort saves entirely. Check again. The paladin gets two good saves and d10 hit die. Plus CHA to all saves, not just against spells. It'll make a difference against that dragon. I like it. I'm a little lost on curse of spellbane. I think you may have accidentally cut part of it out during an editing. What does it do?
Spikes01k 06-13-07, 09:00 AM	Check again. The paladin gets two good saves and d10 hit die. Plus CHA to all saves, not just against spells. It'll make a difference against that dragon. I like it. I'm a little lost on curse of spellbane. I think you may have accidentally cut part of it out during an editing. What does it do? I just checked that again, I got the book right in front of me. 3.5 DnD pg 43. Good fort saves, poor will and ref.
Spikes01k 06-13-07, 09:03 AM	The Samurai from OA has 2 good saves, a d10 and a full BAB. This is far from broken. OA is 3.0 not 3.5. OA is not a valid point sense last I checked this is for 3.5.
Omnirahk, half-Rahkshi 06-13-07, 09:37 AM	I just checked that again, I got the book right in front of me. 3.5 DnD pg 43. Good fort saves, poor will and ref. I guess I was wrong then. I really, really could've sworn the paladin had good fortitude and will. Checking again, it was the cleric. Druid is the same. Ranger also has two good saves. I was wrong. Sorry.
Jell_Moo 06-13-07, 09:46 AM	OA is 3.0 not 3.5. OA is not a valid point sense last I checked this is for 3.5. OA was updated to 3.5 in a Dragon article. Either way, the point remains, unless you contend that the OA Samurai is broken.
Aryxbez 06-13-07, 10:14 AM	I like it. I'm a little lost on curse of spellbane. I think you may have accidentally cut part of it out during an editing. What does it do? Glad you like it, Yes it was an error I did not notice, I thank you for letting me know, since it has been a long time since I have updated this class at all. Curse of Spell bane is pretty much a replica of a Hexblade curse feat from the Dragon Magazine Issue 339, Effect: In order for a spellcaster to cast a spell, they must now make a concentration check to cast the spell. DC(15+ spell level) at greater becomes (20+spell level) and once it becomes Dire,(25+spell level) This I'm sure of what it does. I noticed that you got two good saves, full bab, and a D10 hit die. This is just broken, no class has all that. Get ride of the saves, or reduce the bonuses to fort saves, but with all you added power wise, get ride of the good fort saves entirely. You are joking right? If anything, this class is now actually something to be played, I mean this class is nothing when compared to the Spellcasters, and them mighty martial adepts. Also I am glad for all who posted, since I haven't gotten anyone to post on this thread for a long while.
Aryxbez 10-14-07, 01:38 PM	As 6th level is the level which area effects are more common place, I'm going to give the Aryxbezian Hexblade Mass Curse Mass curse at 6th level the hexblade cans instead expend 2 curses, and curse affects all foes within a 30 radius of the hexblade. Also as an added why not, I will also give the class for 14th, Piling curse Piling Curse at 14th lv when using the hexblade curse ability, every curse cost 2 uses, however they stack. So with Greater Hex curse, they would both stack for -8 penalty. This also allows you to use more than one Hex a round, and apply a alternate hex such as Curse of Paranoia,Curse of guided strikes, and so on. For every curse applied over the 1st, the curse duration is equal to the hexblades level in rounds instead of one hour or day*. (*with extend curse feat) Also although it says multiple don't stack. I am going to word it where it also states that other curese such as Curse of Paranoia, Curse of Spellbane can also be active on the same target, as well as the normal hexblade curse. I'm sure it was implied, however I wish to ensure less confusion as possible. Hexblades curse will be a swift action as well now. Now I must figure something out for 19th level, any suggestions?
Spikes01k 10-14-07, 02:55 PM	Glad you like it, Yes it was an error I did not notice, I thank you for letting me know, since it has been a long time since I have updated this class at all. Curse of Spell bane is pretty much a replica of a Hexblade curse feat from the Dragon Magazine Issue 339, Effect: In order for a spellcaster to cast a spell, they must now make a concentration check to cast the spell. DC(15+ spell level) at greater becomes (20+spell level) and once it becomes Dire,(25+spell level) This I'm sure of what it does. You are joking right? If anything, this class is now actually something to be played, I mean this class is nothing when compared to the Spellcasters, and them mighty martial adepts. Also I am glad for all who posted, since I haven't gotten anyone to post on this thread for a long while. Personally I would just give them battle fortitude, the scout class ability, instead of the full save.
bkdubs123 10-14-07, 03:06 PM	I really dislike Piling Curse. First because it makes you spend 2 curses to use 1 everytime, but also because it becomes incredibly, incredibly crippling. It would end up making a BBEG encounter completely one-sided and a landslide PC victory. I have my own ideas of how a Hexblade should function, and I might get around to working mine out, but not today, and not for a while. I have too much on my plate for now.
Aryxbez 10-14-07, 06:24 PM	Personally I would just give them battle fortitude, the scout class ability, instead of the full save. Don't know what the ability does, otherwise, is it truly that big of a deal? I mean Clerics get 2 good saves, same with Druid, and they are the best classes in the game. So why not give a class that is weak, two good saves? I really dislike Piling Curse. First because it makes you spend 2 curses to use 1 everytime, but also because it becomes incredibly, incredibly crippling. It would end up making a BBEG encounter completely one-sided and a landslide PC victory. I have my own ideas of how a Hexblade should function, and I might get around to working mine out, but not today, and not for a while. I have too much on my plate for now. Well the two curses is indeed costly, however the crippling part, that is point of their role. Their role is to debuff a foe to the point where the Hexblade can then lay the smackdown on his foes. Besides, if he is truly a BBEG, he shouldn't be failing Will saves. At least enough saves to kill himself. Besides, Spellcasters can do far worse, as they can one side the fight in one round. If you don't like my Hexblade, that is fine, I'm sure we all have our views of classes and such. This just happens to be mine. Also the only reason I added those two abilities because for the longest time, no one would actually answer my questions on it. So I just said whatever and included it.
Lokathor 10-18-07, 11:28 PM	Few points: *Spell Failure: you give out shield proficiency, but then you make Shields cause spell failure. That's silly. Just make shields not cause spell failure for Hexblades. Hexblades could not have spell failure in any kind of armor ever and they'd still be balanced. *Dark Companion: You're missing the ability description. You should at least mention to look in the PHB2. *Hexblade's Curse: Hexblade gets 1/day at 1st level and gets a extra one per day per every 4 levels Also gains extra amount of curses per day equal to his charisma modifier. so if the aryxbez the 1st level hexblade has 16 charisma,(+3 mod) gain 3 extra curses per encounter equaling 4 per encounter as a Swift action, a hexblade can unleash a curse upon a foe. --Well which is it? Per day or per encounter? *Curse of Guided Strikes: You give up all the normal curse effects for just an AC penalty? That doesn't seem very good except for people with absurdly high AC. *Curse of Slowness: The dire version seems too good. People should be able to take a Standard Action or Move Action. *Piling Curse: This should definitely be an optional ability, not an automatic one. I would consider giving out more spells per day. Perhaps each level would follow the wizard pattern of "1, 2, 2, 3, 3, 3, 4, 4, 4, 4, 5, ..." so that you'd have about double the number of spell slots total each day. Don't know what the ability does, otherwise, is it truly that big of a deal? I mean Clerics get 2 good saves, same with Druid, and they are the best classes in the game. So why not give a class that is weak, two good saves? Battle Fortitude +X (Ex): Add X to all Fortitude saves and Initiative checks you make. Scouts get +1, and it advances up to +3 at the highest point, similar to the Swashbuckler's "Grace" ability.
Aryxbez 10-19-07, 12:12 AM	Few points: *Spell Failure: you give out shield proficiency, but then you make Shields cause spell failure. That's silly. Just make shields not cause spell failure for Hexblades. Hexblades could not have spell failure in any kind of armor ever and they'd still be balanced. *Dark Companion: You're missing the ability description. You should at least mention to look in the PHB2. *Hexblade's Curse: Hexblade gets 1/day at 1st level and gets a extra one per day per every 4 levels Also gains extra amount of curses per day equal to his charisma modifier. so if the aryxbez the 1st level hexblade has 16 charisma,(+3 mod) gain 3 extra curses per encounter equaling 4 per encounter as a Swift action, a hexblade can unleash a curse upon a foe. --Well which is it? Per day or per encounter? *Curse of Guided Strikes: You give up all the normal curse effects for just an AC penalty? That doesn't seem very good except for people with absurdly high AC. *Curse of Slowness: The dire version seems too good. People should be able to take a Standard Action or Move Action. *Piling Curse: This should definitely be an optional ability, not an automatic one. I would consider giving out more spells per day. Perhaps each level would follow the wizard pattern of "1, 2, 2, 3, 3, 3, 4, 4, 4, 4, 5, ..." so that you'd have about double the number of spell slots total each day. Battle Fortitude +X (Ex): Add X to all Fortitude saves and Initiative checks you make. Scouts get +1, and it advances up to +3 at the highest point, similar to the Swashbuckler's "Grace" ability. I apologize for my mistakes, I will go and make the fixes. Supposed to be per day, also as far as Piling curse goes, since no one would tell me whether or not to get rid of it, or filler for 14th level, I just added it, without the need for others comments. I thank you pointing these out to me, and for posting in this thread. EDIT: I would like to see that spell progression in chart form. Or I can figure it out myself, fine either way.
Lokathor 10-19-07, 01:50 AM	As an example, this chart is what I always use for the 'half-caster' rate. This chart begins 1st level spells at 4th, then adds a spell level every 3 levels until there are no more new levels to grant. If you want to use the printed rate of spell level gaining (4th, 8th, 11th, 14th) then just delay each column until that point. Level --- Spells --- 1st - - - - 2nd - - - - 3rd - - - - 4th 0 - - - 5th 1 - - - 6th 2 - - - 7th 2 0 - - 8th 3 1 - - 9th 3 2 - - 10th 3 2 0 - 11th 4 3 1 - 12th 4 3 2 - 13th 4 3 2 0 14th 4 4 3 1 15th 5 4 3 2 16th 5 4 3 2 17th 5 4 4 3 18th 5 5 4 3 19th 5 5 4 3 20th 6 5 4 4 And for Piling curse, I'd definitely kill it or make it optional if the curses are per day. Remember that you don't need to give out an ability every single level. That kind of design can make classes that are just clogged with options. The warlock, for example, just has small boosts spread all over and only a few actual big things that the player needs to keep extra track of. The 14th level ability could always be to improve the dark companion's effect by 1 or 2 points. Get it at 4th and get an improvement at 14th seems logical enough.
cooperflood 01-03-08, 06:23 PM	I really like this version of the Hexblade, it a shame I just now noticed it. The best alternate Hexblade I had seen till now was Otto's, which is OK but not my thing. I'm going to have to agree with most of the other posters on Piling Curse though, I just don't like it. It doesn't really feel right and mechanically it's a little awkward. Why don't you change the Hexblade curse to a four step progression instead of a three step, Hexblade curse (-2), Lesser Curse (-4), Greater Curse (-6), and Dire Curse (-8). This progression accomplishes a similar goal as Piling Curse, but does it in smother, more natural manner. I see no problem with making Fortitude a good save unlike many of the other posters, in fact that is one of several changes D&D designer Mearls suggested be done to improve the Hexblade. Nitpicks -You have Duel Hex listed at 8th level, but no description of the class feature. -You have Penetrating Curse at 10th level, but no description of the class feature. -Mass Curse’s description should read “At 6th level the hexblade can instead expend 2 uses of Hexblades curse, and a curse affects all foes within a 30 ft radius burst of the hexblade.”
Aryxbez 01-03-08, 07:36 PM	I really like this version of the Hexblade, it a shame I just now noticed it. The best alternate Hexblade I had seen till now was Otto's, which is OK but not my thing. I'm going to have to agree with most of the other posters on Piling Curse though, I just don't like it. It doesn't really feel right and mechanically it's a little awkward. Why don't you change the Hexblade curse to a four step progression instead of a three step, Hexblade curse (-2), Lesser Curse (-4), Greater Curse (-6), and Dire Curse (-8). This progression accomplishes a similar goal as Piling Curse, but does it in smother, more natural manner. I see no problem with making Fortitude a good save unlike many of the other posters, in fact that is one of several changes D&D designer Mearls suggested be done to improve the Hexblade. Nitpicks -You have Duel Hex listed at 8th level, but no description of the class feature. -You have Penetrating Curse at 10th level, but no description of the class feature. -Mass Curse’s description should read “At 6th level the hexblade can instead expend 2 uses of Hexblades curse, and a curse affects all foes within a 30 ft radius burst of the hexblade.” Golly, Glad you like the class, there is something you and I see as one! 4 progression sounds like a decent idea, it would certainly force me to update some of the other abilities. So what level intervals do you think the better curse versions should come at? 7(lesser) ,12(Greater) ,and 17(Dire) ? I apologize for the empty descriptions, I might have included them at one time. However the Post deleted a certain amount of stuff a long time ago. So I will be certain to add them now. These Hex abilities were really just pretty much ripped off of the Dragon magazine that had Hexblade Feats (issue 339) Duel Hex, I believe what it does is that you can apply two different curses, with the cost of one? It was something like that I think. 10th, Penetrating Curse I don't know anymore, It sounds like it might have something to do with DR or SR, but spellbane fills the spellcasting role. So if you got an idea on this, let me know. Also I will be sure to add your description of the Mass curse, being more accurate is always good to do. The only reason I used Piling curse, was to come up with a semi unique ability , and to fill the 14th level slot, as no class should have empty levels (Spellcasters go by this, as spells make up for no abilities). So I guess I will remove the piling curse, however still need a ability for 14th. So if you have any ideas for abilities to fill the Empty slot, be my guest and share your ideas. Sorry for the lack of help I was able to give to you, and I thank you for posting in this thread.
cooperflood 01-03-08, 09:48 PM	This thread really got me thinking about the Hexblade. I took most of Aryxbez changes to the hexblade, rearranged some things, and added a few ideas of my own. Essentially I regrouped things to incorporate a four step progression and then I made it so you gain a new curse at every even level starting at fourth level. I also ended up rewriting the Aura of Unlock to work as a curse. For the four step progression I simply used the Warlock's acquisition of new invocations as a guide. It may seem like a radical improvement at first, but I think it works well. The original Hexblade's curse improved at level 7 then not again until level 19, a twelve level wait for what should be the main class feature of the class. Hexblade Revised Keeps all the features of Aryxbezian Hexblade (Saves, Hit Die, Skill Points, ect...) except as noted here. Level Class Feature 1st Hexblade's Curse 1/day 2nd Arcane Resistance 3rd Mettle 4th Dark Companion, Curse of Paranoia 5th Hexblade's Curse 2/day 6th Curse of Guided Strikes 7th Lesser Hexblade Curse 8th Curse of Blunted Attacks 9th Hexblade's Curse 3/day 10th Mass Curse 11th Greater Hexblade Curse 12th Curse of Slowness 13th Hexblade's Curse 4/day 14th Curse of Spellbane 15th Dire Hexblade Curse 16th Curse of Unluck 17th Hexblade's Curse 5/day 18th Double Trouble 19th Improved Mettle 20th Eternal Curse The parts in bold are significantly changed from the original Hexblade's Curse (Su): Hexblade gets 1/day at 1st level and gets a extra one per day per every 4 levels. Also gains extra amount of curses per day equal to his charisma modifier. so if the aryxbez the 1st level hexblade has 16 charisma,(+3 mod) gain 3 extra curses per day equaling 4 per day. As a Swift action, a hexblade can unleash a curse upon a foe. The target must be visible to the hexblade and within 60 feet. The target of a hexblade's curse takes a -2 penalty on attacks, saves, ability checks, skill checks, caster level checks, and weapon damage rolls for 1 hour thereafter. A successful Will Save (DC 10 + 1/2 hexblade's class level + hexblade's Cha modifier) reduces the effects and duration by half. Multiple hexblade's curses don't stack, however can apply Alternate Hexes. So a foe can be under the effects of Hexblades curse and under a Alternate Hex such as Curse of Slowness. Any effect that removes or dispels a curse eliminates the effect of a hexblade's curse. Lesser Hexblade's Curse (Su): When a hexblade attains 7th level, the penalty on attacks, saves, ability checks, skill checks, caster level checks, and weapon damage rolls incurred by a target of the hexblade's curse becomes -4 instead of -2. Greater Hexblade's Curse (Su): When a hexblade attains 11th level, the penalty on attacks, saves, ability checks, skill checks, caster level checks, and weapon damage rolls incurred by a target of the hexblade's curse becomes -6 instead of -4. Dire Hexblade's Curse (Su): When a hexblade attains 15th level, the penalty on attacks, saves, ability checks, skill checks, caster level checks, and weapon damage rolls incurred by a target of the hexblade's curse becomes -8 instead of -6. Curse of Paranoia: At level 4 a Hexblade can use their curse of paranoia to increase the attack bonus creatures receive for flanking the target. The attack bonus of flanking increase by +2, for the Greater Curse the benefits increase by +4, for the Dire Curse the benefits increase by +6. Curse of Guided Strikes: At level 6 a Hexblade learns how to curse their foes so that oncoming blows seem to be guided to weak points in their defenses. Curse of Guide Blades applies a penalty to the targets AC equal to the penalty of the Hexblade Curse (the targets AC cannot be reduced below 1). The AC penalty applies to all attacks made against the target. Curse of Blunted Attacks: At level 8 a Hexblade learns how to curse their foes so that their blades seem to lose their edge. Curse of Blunted Attacks applies a penalty to the targets damage equal to the penalty of the Hexblade Curse (the targets damage cannot be reduced below 1). The damage penalty applies to all attacks (Weapons or Spells) made by target that do hitpoint damage. Mass curse: At level 10 the hexblade can instead expend 2 uses of Hexblades curse, and a curse affects all foes within a 30ft radius burst of the hexblade. Curse of Slowness: At level 12 a Hexblade learns how to slow the movement of their foes. The speed of the target for all types of movement is reduced by half. As a Dire Curse, the target can only take a single move action or standard action in a round, and a five-foot step is considered a move action. Curse of Spellbane: At level 14 a Hexblade learns the ability to hamper spell-casting abilities of his foes. The target of a Curse of spellbane must make a DC 30+Spell Level concentration check to cast the spell. Curse of Unluck: At level 16 a Hexblade learns to how make his foes question their luck. All foes with in 30ft must succeed on a will save to hit the hexblade. This save is made after each attack roll. This effect lasts for one minute. Double Trouble: At level 18 a Hexblade can force a foe to save twice on a Hexblade Curse. The target must make two successful will saves to negate the effect of a Hexblade Curse. Eternal Curse: At level 20 a Hexblade’s curse has serious staying power. An Eternal Curse has a duration of Permanent and can only be removed by a Wish or Miracle Spell. I want to empasise that this is really Aryxbez's baby and all these are ideas that I think that build on his basic rewrite. However if others feel that this post doesn’t belong in this thread I’m sorry and will happily remove it.
Aryxbez 01-03-08, 10:38 PM	My baby eh? Forget not that Kadasbrass is to be given credit as well. As it was his ideas for the abilities that allowed me to build the class. Otherwise I have no true problem with you posting it. If you feel it warrants it's own thread, tis fine. Curse of Blunted Attacks, kinda pointless, as the Hexblades curse already lowers damage rolls, says right in my description for it. Unless of course you take that part out. Eternal curse isn't bad, as a 20th level ability is just supposed to be nifty anyhow. Making two saves for one curse is ok, but personally I don't like it too much. I really need to figure out what Duel hex and Penetrating Curse do though.
cooperflood 01-03-08, 10:59 PM	Your right Curse of Blunted Attacks is a complete waste, I completly missed that. I simply liked the progression of a new curse at every even level starting at fourth and pulled it from the dragon magazine feats to fill a level. My personal favorites are Double Trouble and Eternal Curse; although eternal curse isn't nearly as powerful as it seems, because your going to kill 95% of everything you kill within an hour. It's more for flavor and roll playing than anything. I was curious about what you thought of the Curse of Unluck. I think mechanically it's a bit ackward and still needs some work. One last thought, do you think improving the Dark Companion by say plus one at every five levels or even letting it improve at the same rate as your Hexblade curse is balanced? It just seems that the Dark Companion feature is nice at low level, but later you would be much better off to have a familiar(Hexblade familiars are amoung the most powerful in the game, particularly if you take Improved Familiar).
Aryxbez 01-03-08, 11:12 PM	Every 5 levels, that would net about -6 AC and saves? around 20th level, so I guess that could work. A little iffy from what it sounds to me, although the -6 AC I personally find righteous against the big monsters you face, those guys got to have something to fear vs Hexblade. Although vs NPC's, they would likely fail the saves vs the curses and definitely be beaten down by the mighty hexblade. Really on Class balance I'm not your best person to ask, so I'm a guessing it's fine. On the Aura of luck, I think it would just be good to use the one that I use/Hexblade uses anyway. Otherwise looks to me to simply be the near equivalent of an Arcane Sanctuary spell, pretty decent, fair I suppose. It should probably have a duration, 3+cha mod works I guess. Assuming it would make a difference anyhow to have a duration of rounds vs 1 minute.