Ascetic Monk [Archive] - Wizards Community

Ascetic Monk [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Splitter
07-28-05, 05:19 PM I'm sure this ones been covered before but without a search engine I don't know how to find it.

What are anyone's (everyone's) thoughts on a Human Monk taking the Sacred Vow and Vow of Poverty at first level. It seems to me - having never played a monk (I'm usually the spell caster in the group - either divine or arcane) that it would be a fun role playing challenge and still be a roll playable character. If anyone knows of previous threads, could you kindly post them for me - I'd like to read up on it. Also, let me know of any drawbacks (besides the obvious no magic items) that I may be missing.

Thanks in advance for all your input
Splitter
Nephlite
07-28-05, 05:38 PM I'm sure this ones been covered before but without a search engine I don't know how to find it.

What are anyone's (everyone's) thoughts on a Human Monk taking the Sacred Vow and Vow of Poverty at first level. It seems to me - having never played a monk (I'm usually the spell caster in the group - either divine or arcane) that it would be a fun role playing challenge and still be a roll playable character. If anyone knows of previous threads, could you kindly post them for me - I'd like to read up on it. Also, let me know of any drawbacks (besides the obvious no magic items) that I may be missing.

Thanks in advance for all your input
Splitter

Drwabacks:
You have to be Exalted as well as good.

Being good is easy but exalted is hard. This why Book of Exalted Deeds is rated Mature because it is hard being Exalted.

You can have money, but you can't use it to buy stuff other than food and ammo(ammo for a simple weapon of course like a crossbow).

You can drink potions and have spells cast on you. But you can't own potions and stuff.

You can sell stuff and carry it to be sold, but remember your money is only for ammo + food. The rest of money is usually given to charity (party members don't count as charity).

You can't spend money on a room at the inn. So you might be sleeping outside unless you can find a nice person to let you sleep somewhere for free.
Verdaloth
07-28-05, 06:11 PM Actually, if you want to actually roleplay it and not use stupid RAW. Then you are POOR meaning you cant have anything but the clothes on your back...which must be rags and food to keep you alive. So you cant have crossbows are anything like that. And if you actually obey it 100% then they suck later cause you cant touch balors and such. and its not rated mature cause its hard, its rated mature cause there is nudity in the book along with drugs and such. Hope i helped at all.
Chris
OracleYori
07-28-05, 06:19 PM i have played a VoP monk before- it was quite fun- he was a zealot of righteousness

and you can carry around a staff or two, as walking sticks- also nice if touching something is a bad idea-

and dont forget that rocks make good projectile weapons-

now though there is a little way around the no magical items- you can have someone graft you, but since you can only carry 10 cp, you have to mooch off of an ally, but trust me, if you play with friends, the grafting will be cheap to the benefit of having a very powerful and good ally-

Nymph's kiss at first level is a must!- then you can skill yourself up-
but remember, you have to donate your share of treasure to the deities of good, or to charity- and always carry a ration around, even if you dont need to eat, because it can come in handy a lot of the time-

i believe that 10cp and a ration in a bag are the limit of carrying around normally, with your walking stick/staff

but IMO- playing a VoP paladin was a bit more rewarding, helping people with LoH a lot of the time-

Edit: If you are going to play monk, Improved Natural Weapon(unarmed) is an insane bonus-remember though, that playing an exaulted, you should always try to find a non-combatative way of getting past an issue- if that doesnt work, being able to flurry with very powerful weapons doesnt hurt-

and dress in colorful clothes- you are restricted to simple clothes, but helping people for a new shirt or pants isnt bad-

my paladin (female) dressed in several very long strips of cloth wrapped around her body- it seemed like she wore very powerful magical items though- it was very amusing- and being able to whip off your clothing for a very long and sturdy rope is also extremely handy
Verdaloth
07-28-05, 06:21 PM On the Note, the coolest class I have ever played was a VoP Ninja+Monk, sure i didnt do all that much dmg, but i was like robin hood, very fun :D
Splitter
07-28-05, 08:12 PM Thank you for your ideas and suggestions - the VoP Paladin does sound interesting - but I think I'll stick with the monk for now. As for playing Exalted - thats what I find to be the exciting part, talking to every foe you meet instead of an all out attack, subbdual damage when ever possible, convincing the party not to kill the unconscious assasin. Thats a role playing challenge I look foward to sinking my teeth into (softly, of course, so as not to draw blood!)
As to Improved Natural Weapon (unarmed) - I have heard that there is a debate going on that the monks unarmed attack is not considered a Nataral Weapon. The argument is that with Improved Unarmed Strike the monk is considered armed and is therefore not using a natural weapon. Does anyone know the offical rulling on this?

Keep the ideas coming - anyone have any negative feedback on the subject?

Thanks again
Splitter
OracleYori
07-28-05, 08:18 PM i believe RAW the unarmed strike of a monk is considered both a natural and a manufactured weapon

and remember- just because you dont kill the assassin, doesnt mean you cant restrain him and make sure that he has no weapons on him before talking to him again-

From SRD
Unarmed Strike

At 1st level, a monk gains Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat. A monk’s attacks may be with either fist interchangeably or even from elbows, knees, and feet. This means that a monk may even make unarmed strikes with her hands full. There is no such thing as an off-hand attack for a monk striking unarmed. A monk may thus apply her full Strength bonus on damage rolls for all her unarmed strikes.

Usually a monk’s unarmed strikes deal lethal damage, but she can choose to deal nonlethal damage instead with no penalty on her attack roll. She has the same choice to deal lethal or nonlethal damage while grappling.

A monk’s unarmed strike is treated both as a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons.

I am fairly certain that a feat is an effect-
Verdaloth
07-28-05, 08:25 PM It does work, as a DM and as many other DMs that i know have ruled it too. AN unarmed atk is a natural atk. The only reason why you are considered armed is beacause your hands are deadly weapon.
Splitter
07-28-05, 08:43 PM Well, that makes an easy choice of feat for me at thrid level. Thank you both for your input. I think I'm ready to be the best damn Acestic Monk I can be.

Splitter

PS - How about Ability Focus for my Stunning Fist? Is That one legal?
Vaelan
07-28-05, 08:52 PM A lot of odd misconceptions on what a VoP character is allowed to do.

The feat explicitly states the restrictions.

You may not own or use any material possessions, with the following exceptions.

1. You may carry and use ordinary simple weapons.
2. You may wear simple clothing.
3. You may carry enough food to sustain you for one day in a simple sack or bag.
4. You may carry and use a spell component pouch.

You can have money, but you can't use it to buy stuff other than food and ammo(ammo for a simple weapon of course like a crossbow).
You can have and use simple weapons and food. You cannot buy simple weapons and food. The only time you can deal with money at all is when you're donating it to the poor. You cannot buy food, and you cannot buy weapons.

now though there is a little way around the no magical items
Doesn't work. There is a list of what you are allowed to own and, more importantly, use. I don't see a graft on the list of possessions that are explicitly allowed. Also, anybody who willfully tried to "get around" their vow should lose it.

I am fairly certain that a feat is an effect-
Don't start this here. There are plenty of other threads for you to find logically incorrect support for your case and nobody wants to hear about it anymore.
OracleYori
07-28-05, 08:52 PM yuppers- the ability focus is a very powerful with stunning fist-

Don't start this here. There are plenty of other threads for you to find logically incorrect support for your case and nobody wants to hear about it anymore.

you arent very nice... could you please not direct such an obvious bash at me? and how am i logically incorrect?
(not trying to start a fight, but if i am incorrect, tell me why, and i will revoke my previous statements)

and i didnt willfully try to get around it- it was suggested by the party members- they needed the blows to be stronger for the fight with the BBEG- and then i discussed it with the DM-
he said it would be fine...
SwiftFox
07-28-05, 09:56 PM I recently considered building an ascetic monk... i mean, for a monk theres really very few drawbacks to VoP as you dont use armor or weapons anyway, right?

I suggest the following race/feat profile

Half-orc Monk
lvl Feats
1 sacred vow, stunning fist
2 combat reflexes
3 vow of poverty
4 touch of golden ice
5
6 nimbus of light, improved trip, fists of iron
7
8 holy radiance
9 rapid stunning
10 sanctify ki strike
11
12 holy ki strike, fist of the heavens

I normally suggest human characters as that bonus 1st level feat is usually priceless, but not so much for a monk, however in this case a half-orc works really well with monk, as monks dont need the int/cha and benefit greatly from str.
For a monk, i DONT suggest being human to take the VoP @ 1st level, as you quickly run out of bonus exalted feats that are useful to monks... there are a few of them, but most only become available at higher levels...
I weighed up the pros and cons of taking the vow of non-violence/peace, but frankly you have more to gain from being able to beat the crap out of really evil stuff and not just do subdual all the time, such as holy damage, touch of golden ice, iron fist etc.
Note that a couple of these feats are from complete warrior(i think).
I havent considered improved natural weapon, I didnt realise that could be done, and im still not sure it can... not 100% sure a monks unarmed strikes count as 'natural' attacks... sounds a bit dodgy to me.
Splitter
07-28-05, 10:37 PM Swift Fox - your feat tree looks much the same as I imagined mine until I heard about the Improved Natural Attack and Ability Focus feats (I'll have to discuss them with my DM). My only problem with the Half Orc is that several of the availibe Exalted Feats require a CHR 15. Not easy with a Half Orc's penalties considering the need for high WIS, DEX for AC and CON for HP. I was considering Extra Stunning instead of Rapid stunning and the Intutive Strike at second (WIS instead of STR to att bonus). I was unaware that you could take Exalted Feats (your Fist of the heavens at 12th) as a general feat choice. I'll have to re-read the Exalted Feat section.

Thanks again everyone
Splitter
Verdaloth
07-28-05, 11:02 PM Well, that makes an easy choice of feat for me at thrid level. Thank you both for your input. I think I'm ready to be the best damn Acestic Monk I can be.

Splitter

PS - How about Ability Focus for my Stunning Fist? Is That one legal?

Yes
Red_Bird_of_Chaos
07-29-05, 12:13 AM Well, that makes an easy choice of feat for me at thrid level. Thank you both for your input. I think I'm ready to be the best damn Acestic Monk I can be.

Splitter

PS - How about Ability Focus for my Stunning Fist? Is That one legal?
you can't take "improved natural attack" at 3rd level it requires a base attack bonus of +4 and you won't have that till 6th level

A monk’s unarmed strike is treated both as a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons.

does this mean i can place permanent enchantments on my fist if i make them masterwork items. +20 fist of holy/shocking/flaming/icyburst would be nice!!!!!! :) :) :)
OracleYori
07-29-05, 12:20 AM how could you possibly make them masterwork?
SwiftFox
07-29-05, 12:30 AM Swift Fox - your feat tree looks much the same as I imagined mine until I heard about the Improved Natural Attack and Ability Focus feats (I'll have to discuss them with my DM). My only problem with the Half Orc is that several of the availibe Exalted Feats require a CHR 15. Not easy with a Half Orc's penalties considering the need for high WIS, DEX for AC and CON for HP.Dont forget that VoP gives you stat bonuses, and I think the feats that need CHA are the high level ones so that problem should sort itself out as long as you are aware of it.

I was considering Extra Stunning instead of Rapid stunning and the Intutive Strike at second (WIS instead of STR to att bonus). I was unaware that you could take Exalted Feats (your Fist of the heavens at 12th) as a general feat choice. I'll have to re-read the Exalted Feat section.Certainly you can, how else would you get them then, except via VoP? the important thing to remember is that you cant get NORMAL feats via VoP :D Thats a bit of a n00b mistake I see occasionaly with the fighter's bonus feats too, but perfectly understandable.
Red_Bird_of_Chaos
07-29-05, 12:30 AM how could you possibly make them masterwork?

having a high level necromancer craft a clone of me of such exelence and expense(embeding jewls in its flesh) that it considered to be masterwork. then have the clone enchanted with the full range of weapon enchantments. then i kill myself and take possession of the clone.
OracleYori
07-29-05, 12:44 AM i see crazy ducky...

that would work, and in that case, have them craft your whole body like that so you can just have your whole body enchanted-that way, unarmed could be anything-
Golem1972
07-29-05, 01:44 AM As long as you're going with the whole ascetic monk and looking for loopholes, you might as well take a dip into Kensai for the weapon enhancement class ability. It does say in the description that a monk/kensai (or anyone with improved unarmed strike for that matter) can imbue their unarmed attack (just an xp cost). It has been said that VoP + Monk + Kensai is legal, but against the spirit of the rules.

I posted this enhancement combo on another thread, but it's silly enough to repeat. Use the Kensai's ability to enchant your improved unarmed strike with throwing, returning (this parts important), and distance. A lot of people seem to like the idea of a monk using his Ki to hit people from across the room. Exit wound and speed are also nice additions.

On a more serious note, it might be nice to go with a combo like Holy, Undead Bane, (and/or) Outsider (evil) Bane, and Mage Bane.

Sure striking and Metalline will take care of most of your DR nightmares (as well as making sundering easier (and digging out of anything).

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Splitter 07-28-05, 05:19 PM	I'm sure this ones been covered before but without a search engine I don't know how to find it. What are anyone's (everyone's) thoughts on a Human Monk taking the Sacred Vow and Vow of Poverty at first level. It seems to me - having never played a monk (I'm usually the spell caster in the group - either divine or arcane) that it would be a fun role playing challenge and still be a roll playable character. If anyone knows of previous threads, could you kindly post them for me - I'd like to read up on it. Also, let me know of any drawbacks (besides the obvious no magic items) that I may be missing. Thanks in advance for all your input Splitter
Nephlite 07-28-05, 05:38 PM	I'm sure this ones been covered before but without a search engine I don't know how to find it. What are anyone's (everyone's) thoughts on a Human Monk taking the Sacred Vow and Vow of Poverty at first level. It seems to me - having never played a monk (I'm usually the spell caster in the group - either divine or arcane) that it would be a fun role playing challenge and still be a roll playable character. If anyone knows of previous threads, could you kindly post them for me - I'd like to read up on it. Also, let me know of any drawbacks (besides the obvious no magic items) that I may be missing. Thanks in advance for all your input Splitter Drwabacks: You have to be Exalted as well as good. Being good is easy but exalted is hard. This why Book of Exalted Deeds is rated Mature because it is hard being Exalted. You can have money, but you can't use it to buy stuff other than food and ammo(ammo for a simple weapon of course like a crossbow). You can drink potions and have spells cast on you. But you can't own potions and stuff. You can sell stuff and carry it to be sold, but remember your money is only for ammo + food. The rest of money is usually given to charity (party members don't count as charity). You can't spend money on a room at the inn. So you might be sleeping outside unless you can find a nice person to let you sleep somewhere for free.
Verdaloth 07-28-05, 06:11 PM	Actually, if you want to actually roleplay it and not use stupid RAW. Then you are POOR meaning you cant have anything but the clothes on your back...which must be rags and food to keep you alive. So you cant have crossbows are anything like that. And if you actually obey it 100% then they suck later cause you cant touch balors and such. and its not rated mature cause its hard, its rated mature cause there is nudity in the book along with drugs and such. Hope i helped at all. Chris
OracleYori 07-28-05, 06:19 PM	i have played a VoP monk before- it was quite fun- he was a zealot of righteousness and you can carry around a staff or two, as walking sticks- also nice if touching something is a bad idea- and dont forget that rocks make good projectile weapons- now though there is a little way around the no magical items- you can have someone graft you, but since you can only carry 10 cp, you have to mooch off of an ally, but trust me, if you play with friends, the grafting will be cheap to the benefit of having a very powerful and good ally- Nymph's kiss at first level is a must!- then you can skill yourself up- but remember, you have to donate your share of treasure to the deities of good, or to charity- and always carry a ration around, even if you dont need to eat, because it can come in handy a lot of the time- i believe that 10cp and a ration in a bag are the limit of carrying around normally, with your walking stick/staff but IMO- playing a VoP paladin was a bit more rewarding, helping people with LoH a lot of the time- Edit: If you are going to play monk, Improved Natural Weapon(unarmed) is an insane bonus-remember though, that playing an exaulted, you should always try to find a non-combatative way of getting past an issue- if that doesnt work, being able to flurry with very powerful weapons doesnt hurt- and dress in colorful clothes- you are restricted to simple clothes, but helping people for a new shirt or pants isnt bad- my paladin (female) dressed in several very long strips of cloth wrapped around her body- it seemed like she wore very powerful magical items though- it was very amusing- and being able to whip off your clothing for a very long and sturdy rope is also extremely handy
Verdaloth 07-28-05, 06:21 PM	On the Note, the coolest class I have ever played was a VoP Ninja+Monk, sure i didnt do all that much dmg, but i was like robin hood, very fun :D
Splitter 07-28-05, 08:12 PM	Thank you for your ideas and suggestions - the VoP Paladin does sound interesting - but I think I'll stick with the monk for now. As for playing Exalted - thats what I find to be the exciting part, talking to every foe you meet instead of an all out attack, subbdual damage when ever possible, convincing the party not to kill the unconscious assasin. Thats a role playing challenge I look foward to sinking my teeth into (softly, of course, so as not to draw blood!) As to Improved Natural Weapon (unarmed) - I have heard that there is a debate going on that the monks unarmed attack is not considered a Nataral Weapon. The argument is that with Improved Unarmed Strike the monk is considered armed and is therefore not using a natural weapon. Does anyone know the offical rulling on this? Keep the ideas coming - anyone have any negative feedback on the subject? Thanks again Splitter
OracleYori 07-28-05, 08:18 PM	i believe RAW the unarmed strike of a monk is considered both a natural and a manufactured weapon and remember- just because you dont kill the assassin, doesnt mean you cant restrain him and make sure that he has no weapons on him before talking to him again- From SRD Unarmed Strike At 1st level, a monk gains Improved Unarmed Strike as a bonus feat. A monk’s attacks may be with either fist interchangeably or even from elbows, knees, and feet. This means that a monk may even make unarmed strikes with her hands full. There is no such thing as an off-hand attack for a monk striking unarmed. A monk may thus apply her full Strength bonus on damage rolls for all her unarmed strikes. Usually a monk’s unarmed strikes deal lethal damage, but she can choose to deal nonlethal damage instead with no penalty on her attack roll. She has the same choice to deal lethal or nonlethal damage while grappling. A monk’s unarmed strike is treated both as a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons. I am fairly certain that a feat is an effect-
Verdaloth 07-28-05, 08:25 PM	It does work, as a DM and as many other DMs that i know have ruled it too. AN unarmed atk is a natural atk. The only reason why you are considered armed is beacause your hands are deadly weapon.
Splitter 07-28-05, 08:43 PM	Well, that makes an easy choice of feat for me at thrid level. Thank you both for your input. I think I'm ready to be the best damn Acestic Monk I can be. Splitter PS - How about Ability Focus for my Stunning Fist? Is That one legal?
Vaelan 07-28-05, 08:52 PM	A lot of odd misconceptions on what a VoP character is allowed to do. The feat explicitly states the restrictions. You may not own or use any material possessions, with the following exceptions. 1. You may carry and use ordinary simple weapons. 2. You may wear simple clothing. 3. You may carry enough food to sustain you for one day in a simple sack or bag. 4. You may carry and use a spell component pouch. You can have money, but you can't use it to buy stuff other than food and ammo(ammo for a simple weapon of course like a crossbow). You can have and use simple weapons and food. You cannot buy simple weapons and food. The only time you can deal with money at all is when you're donating it to the poor. You cannot buy food, and you cannot buy weapons. now though there is a little way around the no magical items Doesn't work. There is a list of what you are allowed to own and, more importantly, use. I don't see a graft on the list of possessions that are explicitly allowed. Also, anybody who willfully tried to "get around" their vow should lose it. I am fairly certain that a feat is an effect- Don't start this here. There are plenty of other threads for you to find logically incorrect support for your case and nobody wants to hear about it anymore.
OracleYori 07-28-05, 08:52 PM	yuppers- the ability focus is a very powerful with stunning fist- Don't start this here. There are plenty of other threads for you to find logically incorrect support for your case and nobody wants to hear about it anymore. you arent very nice... could you please not direct such an obvious bash at me? and how am i logically incorrect? (not trying to start a fight, but if i am incorrect, tell me why, and i will revoke my previous statements) and i didnt willfully try to get around it- it was suggested by the party members- they needed the blows to be stronger for the fight with the BBEG- and then i discussed it with the DM- he said it would be fine...
SwiftFox 07-28-05, 09:56 PM	I recently considered building an ascetic monk... i mean, for a monk theres really very few drawbacks to VoP as you dont use armor or weapons anyway, right? I suggest the following race/feat profile Half-orc Monk lvl Feats 1 sacred vow, stunning fist 2 combat reflexes 3 vow of poverty 4 touch of golden ice 5 6 nimbus of light, improved trip, fists of iron 7 8 holy radiance 9 rapid stunning 10 sanctify ki strike 11 12 holy ki strike, fist of the heavens I normally suggest human characters as that bonus 1st level feat is usually priceless, but not so much for a monk, however in this case a half-orc works really well with monk, as monks dont need the int/cha and benefit greatly from str. For a monk, i DONT suggest being human to take the VoP @ 1st level, as you quickly run out of bonus exalted feats that are useful to monks... there are a few of them, but most only become available at higher levels... I weighed up the pros and cons of taking the vow of non-violence/peace, but frankly you have more to gain from being able to beat the crap out of really evil stuff and not just do subdual all the time, such as holy damage, touch of golden ice, iron fist etc. Note that a couple of these feats are from complete warrior(i think). I havent considered improved natural weapon, I didnt realise that could be done, and im still not sure it can... not 100% sure a monks unarmed strikes count as 'natural' attacks... sounds a bit dodgy to me.
Splitter 07-28-05, 10:37 PM	Swift Fox - your feat tree looks much the same as I imagined mine until I heard about the Improved Natural Attack and Ability Focus feats (I'll have to discuss them with my DM). My only problem with the Half Orc is that several of the availibe Exalted Feats require a CHR 15. Not easy with a Half Orc's penalties considering the need for high WIS, DEX for AC and CON for HP. I was considering Extra Stunning instead of Rapid stunning and the Intutive Strike at second (WIS instead of STR to att bonus). I was unaware that you could take Exalted Feats (your Fist of the heavens at 12th) as a general feat choice. I'll have to re-read the Exalted Feat section. Thanks again everyone Splitter
Verdaloth 07-28-05, 11:02 PM	Well, that makes an easy choice of feat for me at thrid level. Thank you both for your input. I think I'm ready to be the best damn Acestic Monk I can be. Splitter PS - How about Ability Focus for my Stunning Fist? Is That one legal? Yes
Red_Bird_of_Chaos 07-29-05, 12:13 AM	Well, that makes an easy choice of feat for me at thrid level. Thank you both for your input. I think I'm ready to be the best damn Acestic Monk I can be. Splitter PS - How about Ability Focus for my Stunning Fist? Is That one legal? you can't take "improved natural attack" at 3rd level it requires a base attack bonus of +4 and you won't have that till 6th level A monk’s unarmed strike is treated both as a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons. does this mean i can place permanent enchantments on my fist if i make them masterwork items. +20 fist of holy/shocking/flaming/icyburst would be nice!!!!!! :) :) :)
OracleYori 07-29-05, 12:20 AM	how could you possibly make them masterwork?
SwiftFox 07-29-05, 12:30 AM	Swift Fox - your feat tree looks much the same as I imagined mine until I heard about the Improved Natural Attack and Ability Focus feats (I'll have to discuss them with my DM). My only problem with the Half Orc is that several of the availibe Exalted Feats require a CHR 15. Not easy with a Half Orc's penalties considering the need for high WIS, DEX for AC and CON for HP.Dont forget that VoP gives you stat bonuses, and I think the feats that need CHA are the high level ones so that problem should sort itself out as long as you are aware of it. I was considering Extra Stunning instead of Rapid stunning and the Intutive Strike at second (WIS instead of STR to att bonus). I was unaware that you could take Exalted Feats (your Fist of the heavens at 12th) as a general feat choice. I'll have to re-read the Exalted Feat section.Certainly you can, how else would you get them then, except via VoP? the important thing to remember is that you cant get NORMAL feats via VoP :D Thats a bit of a n00b mistake I see occasionaly with the fighter's bonus feats too, but perfectly understandable.
Red_Bird_of_Chaos 07-29-05, 12:30 AM	how could you possibly make them masterwork? having a high level necromancer craft a clone of me of such exelence and expense(embeding jewls in its flesh) that it considered to be masterwork. then have the clone enchanted with the full range of weapon enchantments. then i kill myself and take possession of the clone.
OracleYori 07-29-05, 12:44 AM	i see crazy ducky... that would work, and in that case, have them craft your whole body like that so you can just have your whole body enchanted-that way, unarmed could be anything-
Golem1972 07-29-05, 01:44 AM	As long as you're going with the whole ascetic monk and looking for loopholes, you might as well take a dip into Kensai for the weapon enhancement class ability. It does say in the description that a monk/kensai (or anyone with improved unarmed strike for that matter) can imbue their unarmed attack (just an xp cost). It has been said that VoP + Monk + Kensai is legal, but against the spirit of the rules. I posted this enhancement combo on another thread, but it's silly enough to repeat. Use the Kensai's ability to enchant your improved unarmed strike with throwing, returning (this parts important), and distance. A lot of people seem to like the idea of a monk using his Ki to hit people from across the room. Exit wound and speed are also nice additions. On a more serious note, it might be nice to go with a combo like Holy, Undead Bane, (and/or) Outsider (evil) Bane, and Mage Bane. Sure striking and Metalline will take care of most of your DR nightmares (as well as making sundering easier (and digging out of anything).