Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Mercer 11-16-05, 01:14 PM	I'm sure that this exists somewhere else on the boards, but I couldn't find them while digging through pages, so... What exactly are the balancing factors for the Monk, Druid, Favored Soul, and (to a lesser extent) Cleric? I can see why a player would choose a Fighter over a Barbarian, but I'm not seeing why someone interested strictly in power level would ever choose a Fighter, Barbarian, Ranger, or Paladin over a Monk. Similarly, the Druid seems just totally overpowered to me and the Favored Soul seems more powerful than the Cleric (who looks to be above the power curve when compared to the other classes). This has been a subject that's been bothering me for a while, and now we've got some new players joining our group that have... interesting... ideas on game balance. I'm trying to get a feel for what the balancing factors are on those classes so that we're not dismissing any character concepts unfairly. Like I said, I know this is an old topic, but, c'mon, I post on these boards, like, once a year.
Thorak 11-16-05, 01:18 PM	I'm sure that this exists somewhere else on the boards, but I couldn't find them while digging through pages, so... What exactly are the balancing factors for the Monk, Druid, Favored Soul, and (to a lesser extent) Cleric? I can see why a player would choose a Fighter over a Barbarian, but I'm not seeing why someone interested strictly in power level would ever choose a Fighter, Barbarian, Ranger, or Paladin over a Monk. Similarly, the Druid seems just totally overpowered to me and the Favored Soul seems more powerful than the Cleric (who looks to be above the power curve when compared to the other classes). This has been a subject that's been bothering me for a while, and now we've got some new players joining our group that have... interesting... ideas on game balance. I'm trying to get a feel for what the balancing factors are on those classes so that we're not dismissing any character concepts unfairly. Like I said, I know this is an old topic, but, c'mon, I post on these boards, like, once a year. Casting characters have an acknowledged power advantage. The tradeoff is, supposedly, that it's a limited power. A Fighter's feats are always on, whereas a spellcaster's spells are cast and gone. As for the monk, take a closer look. The monk is absolutely inferior to any other melee-focused class. I absolutely guarantee I can take a Fighter and outfight a Monk any day of the week. And the Fighter is seen as underpowered. The monk simply cannot keep up on damage per round, damage per blow, AC, hitpoints, BAB, etc. The monk's only true advantages are speed, high saves, and SR. Which are nothing to sneeze at. I'm not saying the monk's a bad class. Just that they're a primary melee combatant the same way a rogue is.
Nephlite 11-16-05, 01:22 PM	I'm sure that this exists somewhere else on the boards, but I couldn't find them while digging through pages, so... What exactly are the balancing factors for the Monk, Druid, Favored Soul, and (to a lesser extent) Cleric? I can see why a player would choose a Fighter over a Barbarian, but I'm not seeing why someone interested strictly in power level would ever choose a Fighter, Barbarian, Ranger, or Paladin over a Monk. Similarly, the Druid seems just totally overpowered to me and the Favored Soul seems more powerful than the Cleric (who looks to be above the power curve when compared to the other classes). This has been a subject that's been bothering me for a while, and now we've got some new players joining our group that have... interesting... ideas on game balance. I'm trying to get a feel for what the balancing factors are on those classes so that we're not dismissing any character concepts unfairly. Like I said, I know this is an old topic, but, c'mon, I post on these boards, like, once a year. Not balanced: Druid and Cleric. They were made unbalanced so one would chose them because WOTC thought everyone dislikes being the healer. Balanced: Favored Soul and kinda Monk. Monk's are skirmishers and sometimes (if enemies CR is lower) full attackers.
Majin_Tenshi 11-16-05, 03:22 PM	I feel I should remind everyone that divine mages are the devout of the devout. They gain their powers from faith and devotion to their god/nature. (Unless they're a cleric without a god, but thats just cheap). Its not as clear cut as the allignment restriction on a Paladin, but if you actualy roleplay it, it should count for a bit.
Thorak 11-16-05, 03:55 PM	For instance, my late half-orc Cleric of Garagos, who was doctrinally forbidden from fleeing battle, for any reason, especially survival. The doctrine was, if you're worthy of Garagos, he will give you the strength to win. Amusingly enough, he didn't die in battle, but to acting a wee bit too hastily in trying to cross a bridge that happened to be trapped.
CzarGarrett 11-17-05, 08:51 AM	Monks can be an interesting character to play in a more urban, societal setting. When entering a Lord/merchant/etc home, a lot of the time, you can't wear weapons. When you are a monk, you ARE the weapon. Monks have enough abilities that should they be stripped of all possessions, they are still a dangerous foe. Casters without foci and spell components can't cast spells. Fighters and Barbarians might be able to hit you with their fist, but without a sword/axe/etc, they are much less dangerous. A naked monk can kill you with his hands/feet and if high enough, be able to shrug off magic. And as Thorak mentioned, they are adequate secondary/tertiary fighters. Clerics have the benefit of extra domain spells to work with. I'm not entirely familiar with the Favored Soul, but it seems as if its balanced enough.