Bard Countersong ability [Archive] - Wizards Community

Bard Countersong ability [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
imperialjunkie
12-26-05, 10:08 AM Hi. One of the bard's song abilities that I never ever use is the Countersong. At lower levels I usually use Inspire Courage almost exclusively with a few uses of Fascinate. But I'd like to learn some ways to use Countersong.

What are some situations where this ability would come into use? There don't seem to be many language dependent or sonic spells. Am I wrong in observing that there aren't many uses of the ability?
BardicEvil
12-28-05, 09:09 PM One of the uses of this is that it counters any sonic based spell. This includes Wail of the Banshee. Great way to keep the wizard/sorcerer and theif alive when the BBEG whips out that one!
Pliskit
12-29-05, 12:21 AM Our bard had never used it as far as I know, untill recently we ran into a couple of beasties that were all sonic attack. Forgot their names, but they had 2 or 3 different attacks to destroy body, mind or objects.
That would have been a real tough one hadn´t it been for our bards countersong, which gave us all a reflexsave of 45 or so :)
TheGogmagog
12-29-05, 12:14 PM I was wondering about that too, I was considering playing a bard mostly for the skills+casting. I figured the bard song would be more of thing for out of combat or when I don't have anything to directly contribute to the combat. Not to say the + to hit across 3 or 4 fighters won't add up to it's own contribution.

You don't see counterspell used very often, and the countersong is even more limiting. I would guess it would be used more when a creature with sonic attack is present, than in the hopes of a sonic spell being cast. It might be worth it if it were reactive, or there were a feat to make it reactive.

What about at higher levels? Does inspire courage fall to the side of haste and other spells? Any other bard song ablilities that can compete with saves, resistances and immunities?
Dark Voivode
12-29-05, 12:31 PM I'm in the process of collecting material (bard songs) for a project I'm working on to make the Bard more like the warlock. Bardic songs are the perfect fit for the invocation system introduced by the Warlock. My point being; I would also like to hear some stories about bardic abilities and the countersong ability in action. Here's hoping this thread sees more posts.
Alac Luin
12-29-05, 01:43 PM Well, I used it to counter a Harpy's Captivating Song once.

It can also be used agienst a Ghost's Frightful Moan, gibbering mouther's Gibbering, allip's Babble, (in theory) a Trumpet Archon's Trumpet paralyzing awe power, a Cloaker's Moan, a vrock's Stunning Screech, a destrachan's Destructive Harmonics.

The list goes on, and these are just a sampleing from the Monsters in the SRD.
This does not include spells and such.
Alac Luin
12-29-05, 02:24 PM Also,

Dragonne's Roar, frost worn's Trill, krenshar's Scare (when using the screech), Leonal's Roar, satyr’s Pipes, Shadow mastiff's Bay, androsphinx's Roar, Grig's Fiddle, vargouille's Shriek, and yeth hound 's Bay

still, only those from the SRD. This does not count spells and such.
Evandar_TAybara
12-29-05, 02:52 PM This intrigued me enough to do a word search on the whole spell section of the SRD, so here's a list of all spells that can be affected by countersong (i.e. those which are sonic or language-dependent). I doubt you'd ever see countersong used against some of these (Speak with Dead for example), but many of them are nasty buggers which countersong is very useful against.

Hope it's of some use :)

Evan.

Sonic and language-dependent spells which are affected by countersong are:
Animal Trance
Blasphemy (only vs the banishment aspect of the spell)
Command
Command, Greater
Dictum (only vs the banishment aspect of the spell)
Enthrall
Geas, lesser
Glyph of Warding (sonic blast glyph only)
Holy Word (only vs the banishment aspect of the spell)
Shatter
Shout
Shout, Greater
Song of Discord
Sound Burst
Speak with Dead
Suggestion
Suggestion, Mass
Sypathetic Vibration
Wail of the Banshee
Word of Chaos (only vs the banishment aspect of the spell)

Sonic and language-dependent spells which are not affected by countersong (because they do not allow a saving throw) are:
Geas/Quest
Message
Dark Voivode
12-29-05, 03:20 PM That's actually a huge help to me. Thanks tons!
Evandar_TAybara
12-29-05, 04:12 PM Glad to help :)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
imperialjunkie 12-26-05, 10:08 AM	Hi. One of the bard's song abilities that I never ever use is the Countersong. At lower levels I usually use Inspire Courage almost exclusively with a few uses of Fascinate. But I'd like to learn some ways to use Countersong. What are some situations where this ability would come into use? There don't seem to be many language dependent or sonic spells. Am I wrong in observing that there aren't many uses of the ability?
BardicEvil 12-28-05, 09:09 PM	One of the uses of this is that it counters any sonic based spell. This includes Wail of the Banshee. Great way to keep the wizard/sorcerer and theif alive when the BBEG whips out that one!
Pliskit 12-29-05, 12:21 AM	Our bard had never used it as far as I know, untill recently we ran into a couple of beasties that were all sonic attack. Forgot their names, but they had 2 or 3 different attacks to destroy body, mind or objects. That would have been a real tough one hadn´t it been for our bards countersong, which gave us all a reflexsave of 45 or so :)
TheGogmagog 12-29-05, 12:14 PM	I was wondering about that too, I was considering playing a bard mostly for the skills+casting. I figured the bard song would be more of thing for out of combat or when I don't have anything to directly contribute to the combat. Not to say the + to hit across 3 or 4 fighters won't add up to it's own contribution. You don't see counterspell used very often, and the countersong is even more limiting. I would guess it would be used more when a creature with sonic attack is present, than in the hopes of a sonic spell being cast. It might be worth it if it were reactive, or there were a feat to make it reactive. What about at higher levels? Does inspire courage fall to the side of haste and other spells? Any other bard song ablilities that can compete with saves, resistances and immunities?
Dark Voivode 12-29-05, 12:31 PM	I'm in the process of collecting material (bard songs) for a project I'm working on to make the Bard more like the warlock. Bardic songs are the perfect fit for the invocation system introduced by the Warlock. My point being; I would also like to hear some stories about bardic abilities and the countersong ability in action. Here's hoping this thread sees more posts.
Alac Luin 12-29-05, 01:43 PM	Well, I used it to counter a Harpy's Captivating Song once. It can also be used agienst a Ghost's Frightful Moan, gibbering mouther's Gibbering, allip's Babble, (in theory) a Trumpet Archon's Trumpet paralyzing awe power, a Cloaker's Moan, a vrock's Stunning Screech, a destrachan's Destructive Harmonics. The list goes on, and these are just a sampleing from the Monsters in the SRD. This does not include spells and such.
Alac Luin 12-29-05, 02:24 PM	Also, Dragonne's Roar, frost worn's Trill, krenshar's Scare (when using the screech), Leonal's Roar, satyr’s Pipes, Shadow mastiff's Bay, androsphinx's Roar, Grig's Fiddle, vargouille's Shriek, and yeth hound 's Bay still, only those from the SRD. This does not count spells and such.
Evandar_TAybara 12-29-05, 02:52 PM	This intrigued me enough to do a word search on the whole spell section of the SRD, so here's a list of all spells that can be affected by countersong (i.e. those which are sonic or language-dependent). I doubt you'd ever see countersong used against some of these (Speak with Dead for example), but many of them are nasty buggers which countersong is very useful against. Hope it's of some use :) Evan. Sonic and language-dependent spells which are affected by countersong are: Animal Trance Blasphemy (only vs the banishment aspect of the spell) Command Command, Greater Dictum (only vs the banishment aspect of the spell) Enthrall Geas, lesser Glyph of Warding (sonic blast glyph only) Holy Word (only vs the banishment aspect of the spell) Shatter Shout Shout, Greater Song of Discord Sound Burst Speak with Dead Suggestion Suggestion, Mass Sypathetic Vibration Wail of the Banshee Word of Chaos (only vs the banishment aspect of the spell) Sonic and language-dependent spells which are not affected by countersong (because they do not allow a saving throw) are: Geas/Quest Message
Dark Voivode 12-29-05, 03:20 PM	That's actually a huge help to me. Thanks tons!
Evandar_TAybara 12-29-05, 04:12 PM	Glad to help :)