Battle Sorcerer vs. Warmage [Archive] - Wizards Community

Battle Sorcerer vs. Warmage [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Tweedledope
09-25-04, 03:06 PM I'm going all out for a true hell-on-wheels battle caster but I can't really decide between the Warmage or the Battle Sorcerer from the UA. I like the Warmage/Rainbow Servant build (to Munchkinize my character). I saw a build on the Optimization thread for a Spellstaff which I really took a liking too.

So, my question is...for true battle carnage with spells, which would be better? The Warmage or the Battle Sorcerer? Opinions with backup would be greatly appreciated.

-=Tweedledope=-
Ardent
09-25-04, 04:53 PM Well, I happen to like the battle Sorceror because it's such a huge improvement on the original sorceror, but they lack a lot of flexibility...OTOH they often don't have high Int scores, making good caster PrCs tricky to get access to. So it's a real tradeoff...the Battle Sorc as written in the UA is still somewhat weak, unless you optimize them for self-enhancement. In which case they work almost as well as Clerics. If you try to mix their mediocre melee abilities with touch magic, you tend to get a dead Sorc, and it's not much better trying to use ranged and artillery magic together.
Engilbrand
09-25-04, 08:42 PM I love the Warmage. If throw down in mediu armor and just destroy things. I also think that the Havoc Mage was designed just for the Warmage. Fun combo. There's a feat you could take that would give you access to all martial weapons. Do that to get into the Eldrtich Knight. You'd give up access to 9th level spells, but you could walk up to someone in melee, use whatever large weapon you're using, and smash them in the head while you use Greater Shout or something right in their face. The optimization boards are probably a better place to put this. Maybe take a deity and the feat that gives you access to said diety's domain. The only problem there is that you would want everything to be a high score. Except Dex if you went with Mithril Fullplate. HAHAHA.
Kary Wanzer
09-26-04, 01:08 AM :u: Well hon, in my group we give the Sorceror 4 + Int skill points/level and a few more Cha-based skills on his list just because we feel that having Cha instead of Int or Wis as a primary stat is just that punishing.

I can't really comment about the Warmage right now since I don't have a MiniHB on me, but as far as the Battle Sorceror variant is concerned, yeah, I have to agree with Ardent that he's still a little too weak because of the price he pays... honestly, a sorc normally can only know 36 spells (not counting cantrips), but limit him further to just 27 known spells? Not to mention only being able to cast as few spells as a wizard (well, a specialist wizard anyway).

If your DM will allow, try asking him if instead of losing a spell known and spell per day of every level, you could perhaps just lose access to 2-3 schools of magic? Or if he thinks that's cheating (since a sorc normally has to abandon many schools of magic anyway), see if he'll give you proficiency with more than just a single martial weapon, or if he'll even allow the Battle Sorceror to gain a good Fort save like a cleric?

Good luck with your choice and I hope you have fun dear. :g:
Quietus_Silivren
09-26-04, 01:27 AM I know what the Battle Sorcerer is, but what is the Warmage?
Kary Wanzer
09-26-04, 01:36 AM The Warmage is one of those extra new base classes (20 levels from 1st to 20th) that can be found in the Miniatures' Handbook.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Tweedledope 09-25-04, 03:06 PM	I'm going all out for a true hell-on-wheels battle caster but I can't really decide between the Warmage or the Battle Sorcerer from the UA. I like the Warmage/Rainbow Servant build (to Munchkinize my character). I saw a build on the Optimization thread for a Spellstaff which I really took a liking too. So, my question is...for true battle carnage with spells, which would be better? The Warmage or the Battle Sorcerer? Opinions with backup would be greatly appreciated. -=Tweedledope=-
Ardent 09-25-04, 04:53 PM	Well, I happen to like the battle Sorceror because it's such a huge improvement on the original sorceror, but they lack a lot of flexibility...OTOH they often don't have high Int scores, making good caster PrCs tricky to get access to. So it's a real tradeoff...the Battle Sorc as written in the UA is still somewhat weak, unless you optimize them for self-enhancement. In which case they work almost as well as Clerics. If you try to mix their mediocre melee abilities with touch magic, you tend to get a dead Sorc, and it's not much better trying to use ranged and artillery magic together.
Engilbrand 09-25-04, 08:42 PM	I love the Warmage. If throw down in mediu armor and just destroy things. I also think that the Havoc Mage was designed just for the Warmage. Fun combo. There's a feat you could take that would give you access to all martial weapons. Do that to get into the Eldrtich Knight. You'd give up access to 9th level spells, but you could walk up to someone in melee, use whatever large weapon you're using, and smash them in the head while you use Greater Shout or something right in their face. The optimization boards are probably a better place to put this. Maybe take a deity and the feat that gives you access to said diety's domain. The only problem there is that you would want everything to be a high score. Except Dex if you went with Mithril Fullplate. HAHAHA.
Kary Wanzer 09-26-04, 01:08 AM	:u: Well hon, in my group we give the Sorceror 4 + Int skill points/level and a few more Cha-based skills on his list just because we feel that having Cha instead of Int or Wis as a primary stat is just that punishing. I can't really comment about the Warmage right now since I don't have a MiniHB on me, but as far as the Battle Sorceror variant is concerned, yeah, I have to agree with Ardent that he's still a little too weak because of the price he pays... honestly, a sorc normally can only know 36 spells (not counting cantrips), but limit him further to just 27 known spells? Not to mention only being able to cast as few spells as a wizard (well, a specialist wizard anyway). If your DM will allow, try asking him if instead of losing a spell known and spell per day of every level, you could perhaps just lose access to 2-3 schools of magic? Or if he thinks that's cheating (since a sorc normally has to abandon many schools of magic anyway), see if he'll give you proficiency with more than just a single martial weapon, or if he'll even allow the Battle Sorceror to gain a good Fort save like a cleric? Good luck with your choice and I hope you have fun dear. :g:
Quietus_Silivren 09-26-04, 01:27 AM	I know what the Battle Sorcerer is, but what is the Warmage?
Kary Wanzer 09-26-04, 01:36 AM	The Warmage is one of those extra new base classes (20 levels from 1st to 20th) that can be found in the Miniatures' Handbook.