Bear Warrior and Lycanthropes [Archive] - Wizards Community

Bear Warrior and Lycanthropes [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
zavin
02-28-06, 08:58 PM Would the Bear Warrior's rage bonuses stack on top of a hybrid forms?
Frugal
02-28-06, 09:04 PM I'd say no, the bear warrior's bonuses are all based on assuming a bear form, you're getting the bonuses because you've turned into a bear (or dire bear). If you're in hybrid form then you're not in bear form anymore so you shouldn't get any of those bonuses.
rampant
03-01-06, 12:47 AM Technically they the stack.

Since no rule prevents a hybrid from raging, and the abilities description specifically mentions increasing the scores rather than having a set value, you get one very scary bear.

Now things like wings go bye-bye.

I'm not saying it should work that way, not saying it shouldn't. I'm saying that the rules as written allow it.

Trust me it could be worse if it keeps them from going frenzied berserker, i'd be inclined to allow it.
zavin
03-01-06, 10:27 AM yea, that's what I'm trying to do, keep them out of Frenzied Berserker, a Frenzied Berserker werewolf just seems too scary to me
Frugal
03-01-06, 12:18 PM I'm not saying it should work that way, not saying it shouldn't. I'm saying that the rules as written allow it.

I'm going to have to double check the rules. I'm not really up on the lycanthrope rules and I've only briefly looked at the bear warrior rules.

My understanding is that in you start with a humanoid form. As a bear warrior you change into a bear when you go into rage and get bonuses because of this (which replace your normal rage and/or frenzy bonuses). Those bonuses are based on the form you've assumed.

For a lycanthrope, I think it works the same way. You're a humanoid and you gain bonuses when you assume your animal or hybrid forms.

The way I see it, both have bonuses which are based on alternate form which are both derived from your original humanoid form. If I'm a werebear bear warrior then I should have humanoid form, animal form (from lycanthrope), hybrid form and bear form (while in rage). If I'm in hybrid form and then rage I change into whatever bear form my levels of bear warrior allow me to become. I'm no longer in my hybrid form so why should I derive any bonus from that form?

A similar question would be if I'm a druid/barbarian/bear warrior does my wild shape stack with my bear form while in rage? I'd argue no.
Frugal
03-01-06, 12:36 PM Well I don't have rule books with me but a quick trip to d20srd gave me the following:

Abilities

All lycanthropes gain +2 to Wisdom. In addition, when in animal form, a lycanthrope’s physical ability scores improve according to its kind, as set out in the table below. These adjustments are equal to the animal’s normal ability scores -10 or -11. A lycanthrope in hybrid form modifies its physical ability scores by the same amount.

I'll have to wait until I get home to check the bear warrior description but I think the bonuses are arrived at in a similar way in which case I'd say they definitely don't stack.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
zavin 02-28-06, 08:58 PM	Would the Bear Warrior's rage bonuses stack on top of a hybrid forms?
Frugal 02-28-06, 09:04 PM	I'd say no, the bear warrior's bonuses are all based on assuming a bear form, you're getting the bonuses because you've turned into a bear (or dire bear). If you're in hybrid form then you're not in bear form anymore so you shouldn't get any of those bonuses.
rampant 03-01-06, 12:47 AM	Technically they the stack. Since no rule prevents a hybrid from raging, and the abilities description specifically mentions increasing the scores rather than having a set value, you get one very scary bear. Now things like wings go bye-bye. I'm not saying it should work that way, not saying it shouldn't. I'm saying that the rules as written allow it. Trust me it could be worse if it keeps them from going frenzied berserker, i'd be inclined to allow it.
zavin 03-01-06, 10:27 AM	yea, that's what I'm trying to do, keep them out of Frenzied Berserker, a Frenzied Berserker werewolf just seems too scary to me
Frugal 03-01-06, 12:18 PM	I'm not saying it should work that way, not saying it shouldn't. I'm saying that the rules as written allow it. I'm going to have to double check the rules. I'm not really up on the lycanthrope rules and I've only briefly looked at the bear warrior rules. My understanding is that in you start with a humanoid form. As a bear warrior you change into a bear when you go into rage and get bonuses because of this (which replace your normal rage and/or frenzy bonuses). Those bonuses are based on the form you've assumed. For a lycanthrope, I think it works the same way. You're a humanoid and you gain bonuses when you assume your animal or hybrid forms. The way I see it, both have bonuses which are based on alternate form which are both derived from your original humanoid form. If I'm a werebear bear warrior then I should have humanoid form, animal form (from lycanthrope), hybrid form and bear form (while in rage). If I'm in hybrid form and then rage I change into whatever bear form my levels of bear warrior allow me to become. I'm no longer in my hybrid form so why should I derive any bonus from that form? A similar question would be if I'm a druid/barbarian/bear warrior does my wild shape stack with my bear form while in rage? I'd argue no.
Frugal 03-01-06, 12:36 PM	Well I don't have rule books with me but a quick trip to d20srd gave me the following: Abilities All lycanthropes gain +2 to Wisdom. In addition, when in animal form, a lycanthrope’s physical ability scores improve according to its kind, as set out in the table below. These adjustments are equal to the animal’s normal ability scores -10 or -11. A lycanthrope in hybrid form modifies its physical ability scores by the same amount. I'll have to wait until I get home to check the bear warrior description but I think the bonuses are arrived at in a similar way in which case I'd say they definitely don't stack.