Bear Warrior rules contradiction? Pls help [Archive] - Wizards Community

Bear Warrior rules contradiction? Pls help [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Vikingchris
03-08-05, 11:12 AM So, I don't seem to be able to search the forums. I'm wondering what the ruling for bear warrior is. The first paragraph says that you are only limited by how many times you can rage a day. The paragraph under brown bear description says you can only turn into a brown bear once per day. So, which is it? Has there been any sage advice on this?
Grynn
03-08-05, 01:37 PM So, I don't seem to be able to search the forums. I'm wondering what the ruling for bear warrior is. The first paragraph says that you are only limited by how many times you can rage a day. The paragraph under brown bear description says you can only turn into a brown bear once per day. So, which is it? Has there been any sage advice on this?

As a DM I'd rule that it can be used with every rage, since you don't get that many uses of rage per day anyway.
Clawhound
03-08-05, 01:44 PM I've played a bear warrior. (They're great fun, btw.)

Choose whichever is lower. If I have one rage, but can become a bear twice per day, then I am limited by rage. If I have many rages, then I am limited by bear/day.

The shapechanging rules for bear warrior are a mess. They're about as clear as Guiness. In our campaign, we house ruled the form change to "wildshape without the healing." This one change saved us many rule arguments. We never found a full wildshape unbalancing, as most adventures required some change of shape at least once. That, and the bear warrior loses the benefits of all his equipment.

It is unclear whether you rage and turn into a bear, or turning into a bear costs a rage, and then you can rage on top of that. In the end, we settled on the idea that changing into a bear costs a rage.

The stat changes between raging, bear, bear raging, etc. required a spreadsheet to keep track of. So many numbers change, which affects other numbers, that you NEED a spreadsheet to make quick sense of it in a game. The whole class is a mess and needs a rewrite focusing on clarity. (Crazy, but true. It's one of the most unreadable classes that I've ever seen.)
Barloch
03-08-05, 04:19 PM I think that most likely your rage ability merely shifts into bear shape and whenever you rage, unless you want to supress it, you turn into a bear. The thing about 1 bear shape a day is pry just an oversight on the writers part and wasn't meant to be included. Thats how I use bear warriors anyway.
Vikingchris
03-08-05, 05:50 PM Thank you so much for the responses. I appreciate the help. I wonder when WOTC will get to the errata and FAQ on Complete Warrior.
Clawhound
03-09-05, 11:14 AM There's been no errata so far. I really don't expect any to show. It had no revisions in the CW.

The though of a VoP Bear Warrior just hit me. That's broke. That's wayyyyy broke. DM's, don't let bear warriors go there. You can't be holy AND bite people's heads off at the same time. Trust me. Bad idea.
Nyferto
03-09-05, 12:20 PM The one who mentioned the lowest was right, I think this was actually covered in a FAQ (take it or leave it).

Your ability to turn into a bear is limited by your ability to Rage, because you can't turn into a bear without raging first.

However the number of times you can turn into a bear is limited by the class anyway.

So if you can't Rage, then you can't turn into a bear, and if you can't turn into a bear, then you can't turn into a bear.
Callista
03-09-05, 12:24 PM I'm also considering the Bear Warrior PrC for one of my characters, a barbarian who's really more of an animal than a human, at least in battle (in society she acts like the 14 year old girl she was when she went feral... that's another story though.)

If I wanted to keep my armor, could I use a wilding clasp to keep my AC at decent levels? I don't want to have such a low AC that I end my rage as a dead bear...
Nyferto
03-09-05, 12:37 PM If Wilding clasps are what I think they are, then that would work.

Alternatively just get Wild Armour.

Some Dm's let Beards wear armour because equipment melds to the new form if it could fit.
Clawhound
03-09-05, 03:51 PM When I played a bear warrior, there was no "wild" armor yet. Yes, you do want AC when being a bear warrior. No AC = BAD.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Vikingchris 03-08-05, 11:12 AM	So, I don't seem to be able to search the forums. I'm wondering what the ruling for bear warrior is. The first paragraph says that you are only limited by how many times you can rage a day. The paragraph under brown bear description says you can only turn into a brown bear once per day. So, which is it? Has there been any sage advice on this?
Grynn 03-08-05, 01:37 PM	So, I don't seem to be able to search the forums. I'm wondering what the ruling for bear warrior is. The first paragraph says that you are only limited by how many times you can rage a day. The paragraph under brown bear description says you can only turn into a brown bear once per day. So, which is it? Has there been any sage advice on this? As a DM I'd rule that it can be used with every rage, since you don't get that many uses of rage per day anyway.
Clawhound 03-08-05, 01:44 PM	I've played a bear warrior. (They're great fun, btw.) Choose whichever is lower. If I have one rage, but can become a bear twice per day, then I am limited by rage. If I have many rages, then I am limited by bear/day. The shapechanging rules for bear warrior are a mess. They're about as clear as Guiness. In our campaign, we house ruled the form change to "wildshape without the healing." This one change saved us many rule arguments. We never found a full wildshape unbalancing, as most adventures required some change of shape at least once. That, and the bear warrior loses the benefits of all his equipment. It is unclear whether you rage and turn into a bear, or turning into a bear costs a rage, and then you can rage on top of that. In the end, we settled on the idea that changing into a bear costs a rage. The stat changes between raging, bear, bear raging, etc. required a spreadsheet to keep track of. So many numbers change, which affects other numbers, that you NEED a spreadsheet to make quick sense of it in a game. The whole class is a mess and needs a rewrite focusing on clarity. (Crazy, but true. It's one of the most unreadable classes that I've ever seen.)
Barloch 03-08-05, 04:19 PM	I think that most likely your rage ability merely shifts into bear shape and whenever you rage, unless you want to supress it, you turn into a bear. The thing about 1 bear shape a day is pry just an oversight on the writers part and wasn't meant to be included. Thats how I use bear warriors anyway.
Vikingchris 03-08-05, 05:50 PM	Thank you so much for the responses. I appreciate the help. I wonder when WOTC will get to the errata and FAQ on Complete Warrior.
Clawhound 03-09-05, 11:14 AM	There's been no errata so far. I really don't expect any to show. It had no revisions in the CW. The though of a VoP Bear Warrior just hit me. That's broke. That's wayyyyy broke. DM's, don't let bear warriors go there. You can't be holy AND bite people's heads off at the same time. Trust me. Bad idea.
Nyferto 03-09-05, 12:20 PM	The one who mentioned the lowest was right, I think this was actually covered in a FAQ (take it or leave it). Your ability to turn into a bear is limited by your ability to Rage, because you can't turn into a bear without raging first. However the number of times you can turn into a bear is limited by the class anyway. So if you can't Rage, then you can't turn into a bear, and if you can't turn into a bear, then you can't turn into a bear.
Callista 03-09-05, 12:24 PM	I'm also considering the Bear Warrior PrC for one of my characters, a barbarian who's really more of an animal than a human, at least in battle (in society she acts like the 14 year old girl she was when she went feral... that's another story though.) If I wanted to keep my armor, could I use a wilding clasp to keep my AC at decent levels? I don't want to have such a low AC that I end my rage as a dead bear...
Nyferto 03-09-05, 12:37 PM	If Wilding clasps are what I think they are, then that would work. Alternatively just get Wild Armour. Some Dm's let Beards wear armour because equipment melds to the new form if it could fit.
Clawhound 03-09-05, 03:51 PM	When I played a bear warrior, there was no "wild" armor yet. Yes, you do want AC when being a bear warrior. No AC = BAD.