Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Damned slayer 02-25-08, 07:39 PM	what would be your best 2 classes to put in the combo?? (for a blaster type) Warmage is nice I think with the edge and spontaneous huge spell list Wizard or Wu-jen?? or should I look for an other charisma base caster class? make combos and please tell why (and if you see a race that fits put it in)
HolyGrenadeFrenzy 02-25-08, 08:00 PM	what would be your best 2 classes to put in the combo?? (for a blaster type) Warmage is nice I think with the edge and spontaneous huge spell list Wizard or Wu-jen?? or should I look for an other charisma base caster class? make combos and please tell why (and if you see a race that fits put it in) I have only tried the most basic Sorcerer/Wizard and it cleans up rather nicely. I will give a few others a go and let you know.
dman11235 02-25-08, 08:06 PM	Beguiler/Wizard works well.
Damned slayer 02-25-08, 08:35 PM	the point is I need to be a damage dealer cause we got a ranger 2weapon with 20str bash well but 23Hp at lvl 3 (only+1 or +2 constitution) a warlock who fears to go near mele a cleric of Lathender a Binder 1 lvl behind and me currently playing an abjurer which might die because he's a little stuburn and too sure of his powers
MongooseFamiliar 02-25-08, 08:56 PM	the point is I need to be a damage dealer cause we got a ranger 2weapon with 20str bash well but 23Hp at lvl 3 (only+1 or +2 constitution) a warlock who fears to go near mele a cleric of Lathender a Binder 1 lvl behind and me currently playing an abjurer which might die because he's a little stuburn and too sure of his powers Well, work on getting the ranger and cleric buffed up so they can take a few hits without dying, and you and the warlock can stand in back and sling magic for dps. If you want to be a blaster, why did you pick abjurer and why go Ultimate Magus? You're giving up some caster levels and delaying your higher-level spells. Straight Wizard maybe into Focused Specialist and then Archmage might get you where you want to go. If you are going to go Ultimate Magus, Beguiler/Wizard is pretty nice, since you'll have only one spellcasting stat, tons of skill points, and trapfinding. Beguilers also get some nice utility spells that they can cast spontaneously, freeing your Wizard up for other spells. Once you get into Ultimate Magus, you will probably mostly use the Beguiler spells to power your metamagics, so the restricted spell list doesn't matter as much at that point. That said, let me ask you something - do you want to be a blaster or do you want to help your party survive and succeed? These two questions will not necessarily give you the same answer.
Damned slayer 02-25-08, 09:00 PM	1st the current character I'm playing is heading toward initiate of 7feil vold This character will surely die So I want a backup that isn't the same type of character
MongooseFamiliar 02-25-08, 10:24 PM	1st the current character I'm playing is heading toward initiate of 7feil vold This character will surely die So I want a backup that isn't the same type of character In that case, I suggest Beguiler for the first level, then a conjurer specialist for a while. Read the Beguiler Handbook, Ultimate Magus Handbook, and Treantmonk's Guide to Being a God for pointers. If you want raw arcane power, go for a conjurer.
StevenO 02-25-08, 11:12 PM	The BEST classes for an Ultimate Magus are Wizard and either Sorcerer or Beguiler. If you really just want a blaster then a single class caster (take your pick) would work best. Generally the only way I'd play a Warmage in a UM build is if I planned to go the inefficent route and play the Spontaneous casting side as the "good" side. This ultimately gets you casting with a 17/10 split with the 10 wizard casting levels offering support for all your blasting. I don't like making Warmage to "low" side because all of its damage dealling spells really don't stand out anymore than selecting a damaging spell or two with your sorcerer choices.
MongooseFamiliar 02-25-08, 11:20 PM	The BEST classes for an Ultimate Magus are Wizard and either Sorcerer or Beguiler. If you really just want a blaster then a single class caster (take your pick) would work best. Generally the only way I'd play a Warmage in a UM build is if I planned to go the inefficent route and play the Spontaneous casting side as the "good" side. This ultimately gets you casting with a 17/10 split with the 10 wizard casting levels offering support for all your blasting. I don't like making Warmage to "low" side because all of its damage dealling spells really don't stand out anymore than selecting a damaging spell or two with your sorcerer choices. Read the "Warmages blow goats for pocket change" thread before you commit to one...
dman11235 02-25-08, 11:35 PM	Not this again... It has been proven that the Warmage is a useful class doing what it does, and just because the Sorcerer might do it better doesn't mean that the warmage is underpowered. In fact it means the sorcerer is overpowered. And if you allow warmages to swap up some spells on their list, they become better than the sorcerer at filling the archer slot. Consider this the last post on the subject. Not that you will listen. Warmage/wizard would be an interesting build. Un-optimized use of UM, but interesting all the same.
Krusk 02-25-08, 11:43 PM	In that case, I suggest Beguiler for the first level, then a conjurer specialist for a while. Exactly what i was going to suggest. Wizard (conj specialist) 3/ beguiller1/ Ultimate magus 10/ master specialist 6 Int synergy and you get some beguiller stuff thrown in for fun. As for being the melee guy, throw some summons in there and let them do it, then go back to what whatever you feel like. Any race with +Int is probably a good idea. High elf isn't too terrible, just avoid combat. - is there a reason you are set on ultimate magus? it isnt very good. -dman, warmage = archer. If you want to play an archer that is fine, but his group does not need one.
MongooseFamiliar 02-25-08, 11:44 PM	Not this again... It has been proven that the Warmage is a useful class doing what it does, and just because the Sorcerer might do it better doesn't mean that the warmage is underpowered. In fact it means the sorcerer is overpowered. And if you allow warmages to swap up some spells on their list, they become better than the sorcerer at filling the archer slot. Consider this the last post on the subject. Not that you will listen. Warmage/wizard would be an interesting build. Un-optimized use of UM, but interesting all the same. Sorcerers overpowered? Compared to what, I wonder? Anyway, my biggest problem with warmages is that awful, awful picture in the warmage entry. :P
dman11235 02-25-08, 11:52 PM	I know that warmage=archer. I said so in my post. I was just defending them as a viable class. I wasn't suggesting it for this at all. Also, most (re: almost all) dual-casting combos are weaker than straight casting. The one exception which comes to mind is druid/wizard/MT/Arcane Heirophant. 9th level spell in two classes. And even then, you don't even get 8th level spells until a straight caster gets 9. Sorc>any non-caster, a lot of full casters, and all psionics. They rank in the top 10, I think they were at 7 or 8. Of 54. Underpowered compared to the big 5.
StevenO 02-25-08, 11:55 PM	Read the "Warmages blow goats for pocket change" thread before you commit to one... I've never said the Warmage is a good class but it does have some uses if you are willing to accept its limited versatility. I would never play one in a UM build (or probably anytime) but if I were to use it in a UM build I'd try to maximize its spells. The Warmage gives you a variety of different damage spells to use but the only time that variety really helps much is at the highest levels so do what you can to keep those spells coming to bear. Having Warmage high also lets you canablize its spells to use Augmented Casting on you lower level wizard support spells; canablize a 6th level Warmage slot and Persisting a wizard spell of 5th level or lower works a lot like DMM Persistent Spell does for clerics. Don't forget the OP said he was looking for a Blaster UM build and blast is all the Warmage is really good for. Ok Krusk, what underhanded (and possibly illegal or at least dissallowed by most DMs) method are you using to get into UM off of Wizard3/Beguiler1? That may meet the casting requirements but it is a little difficult to get the 8 skill ranks need when the max skill ranks for a 4th level character is only 7.
Krusk 02-26-08, 04:46 PM	Ok Krusk, what underhanded (and possibly illegal or at least dissallowed by most DMs) method are you using to get into UM off of Wizard3/Beguiler1? That may meet the casting requirements but it is a little difficult to get the 8 skill ranks need when the max skill ranks for a 4th level character is only 7. The underhanded method is forgetting about skill requirements and not looking them up. Change it to... wizard 3/master specialist 1/ beguiller 1/ UM 10/ master specialist 5 works out the same in the end.
Lotus Crane 03-02-08, 10:13 AM	I personally prefer beguiler 1/conjurer 3/spellthief 1/Ultimate Magus X myself. Beguiler should go first, if only for the extra hit and skill points, and the reason you take spellthief is to be able to take the Master Spellthief feat at 6th level. Other than playing as an illumian with the correct sigils, it's the best loophole to get past the Ultimate Magus's "advance your gimpier spellcasting progression at 1st/4th/7th" limitation. Because Master Spellthief makes your default (ie, before applying arcane spell power) caster level for all arcane spellcasting classes equal to the total number of your arcane spellcasting class levels (so in this case, your character level), you can always choose to advance wizard instead of beguiler, thus still obtaining 9th level wizard spells by 19th character level. Granted, this means that you'll only ever cast 4th level beguiler spells pre-epic, but 9th wizard/4th beguiler is still more powerful overall than 8th wizard/6th beguiler.