Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Alsark 06-08-05, 07:54 PM	I'm a bit new to Dungeons and Dragons. I have two other characters... both of which were rangers. I wanted to try something different from being a ranger for my third character though, so I decided I wanted to make a spellcaster. I made a thread asking for the "best possible spellcaster" earlier... you might have seen it. I wasn't very detailed on my question though... so here it goes: I would like to know what the best class if for dealing out the most damage with spells. At first I was going to go with a wizard when I hadn't read up the classes much, but then the sorcerer started to appeal more to me. My problem, I think, with the wizard would be is that I'd run out of spells. Would this be the case or am I just worrying myself? I wouldn't think the sorcerer would have this problem... but then, I'm just a newbie, so I wouldn't know. So basically, what I'm asking is what is the best spellcasting class if I just want to deal huge amounts of damage (but still want quite a few spells to cast per day)? Also, I'm thinking about adding ten levels of Incantatrix and four of Archmage (to sorcerers - but five to wizards). Would these prestige class additions further achieve my goal for doing massive amounts of damage or are there better prestige classes for that?
Borris 06-08-05, 08:09 PM	Warmage is by very far the best base class for a damage-dealing spellcaster. Since you add your Intelligence bonus to damage, a 1st-level warmage with 18 Int and 12 Cha can cast four magic missiles per day that deal 1d4+5 points of damage each.
Jell_Moo 06-08-05, 08:37 PM	Hands down the award goes to the Wilder when it comes to sheer amount of damage down in one spell/power. If you really want to get technical, a Cleric with Divine Metamagic (Quicken) would come out on top in all likelihood, although a Wilder with the Quicken metapsionic feat could potentially match and surpass. A Warmage really isn't the best choice for direct damage spells. He's better than most at early levels, but the Wilder still whoops him. The best a 1st level Warmage can do is 1d4 +1 + Int Mod with a Magic Missile. A Wilder could wild surge a Mind Thrust for 2d10 damage. Avg for the Wilder: 11 points of damage. Avaerage for a Warmage: 3.5 + Int Mod. So the Warmage needs a +8 Int mod to meet the average damage of a Wilder. Unlikely for a 1st level character. Now, there are advantages and disadvantages to each, but damage wise, the Wilder is pretty much king of the castle unless you *really* start to trick out.
AngryJoe 06-08-05, 08:41 PM	Warmage is by very far the best base class for a damage-dealing spellcaster. Since you add your Intelligence bonus to damage, a 1st-level warmage with 18 Int and 12 Cha can cast four magic missiles per day that deal 1d4+5 points of damage each. Although I would not recommend putting a 12 into CHA. It's the Warmage's primary spellcasting stat. You'll never get higher than 2nd level spells. Can't do much damage with those lol. Most arcane casters get a similar list of spells. You want to look more into the metamagic aspect of spellcasting. Wizards can get more metamagic feats (with bonus feats), plus the ability to quicken spells (meaning you can cast multiple spells in one round--loads of damage that way)... but they have to prepare them that way ahead of time. If you don't have the right type of spells prepared, you're kinda hosed (i.e memorized fireball when fighting fire elementals... not good). Now sorcerers are a little different, they get MORE spells per day, but they have limited spells known. They don't get to quicken, but they don't have to prepare metamagicked spells ahead of time, they can to it on the fly... nice flexibility there. Now, if you're looking at non core casters...well... let's see. The Wu Jen out of Complete Arcane is like a wizard, but different. Kinda cute spell list. I personally don't like them. Warmage is kinda neat, ALL they have is damage spells. And they're missing some of the better damage spells, but not all of them. Stay away from Warlock... he's good, don't get me wrong, I wouldn't rely on him for raw damage though. Loads of good utility. These are basic classes. If you want some Prestige Class maddness, go bug the nice folks over on the Character Optimization boards. But do a search for it first. If you don't find anything, then post your question. They're going to tell you things that will make your ears bleed. Good luck! :D
Shaken, not Stunned 06-08-05, 08:49 PM	I think psionic casters are the best blasters. They may not be able to deal the most damage with a single attack, but generally speaking they lay down the death more consistently than anyone else.
cowdragon 06-08-05, 09:02 PM	Warmage is probably the best for dealing damage. If you still want some versatility though, the sorcerer with a couple metamagic feats would be your best bet. Wizards are cool too and a bit more forgiving if you make poor spell selections in your career... however you always have to decide what spells to memorize for the day. A sorcerer can take a couple attack spells and the rest buffing, or support spells and can always cast what he/she needs from his list. Another option would be the battle Sorcerer. This gives you the D8 hit points you're used to playing with. A clerics base attack bonus. Light Armour usage and one light or one-handed martial weapon. You lose one spell per spell level known, and one spell slot per spell level. It's kinda hefty, but worth it if you want some fighting ability. I personally love this option because I love wading into melee with touch spell. I once had a 3rd level Battle Sorcerer who (along with my raven familiar) killed a bullet, with chill touch. Poor DM dice rolls not included. ;) Monster Summon Spells are great too, especially if you take Augment Summoning. A wizard can learn a new one each level. A sorcerer can learn a new one and unlearn an old one. The best option here is to learn Summon 1, then Summon 3, then 5, 7, and finally 9. Don't forget to forget forget the lower ones when you get the newer ones. A sorcerer or specialist wizard should be able to summon ALOT of monsters in a day if needed. Good Luck. The Cowdragon :mage:
Damien_Blood 06-08-05, 09:03 PM	Granted, Psions are the best damage-dealers, as far a spellcasters the warmage starts off better and need not worry as much about support spell choices, as that is limited and even zero in most respects. Other arcane spellcasters can do some pretty heavy damage at later levels, but there is the need to pay atleast a small amount of attention to non-combat spells
SnipingRanger07 06-08-05, 09:04 PM	here is a nice idea, the great Warlock. Unlimited casting of invocations, then eldricht blast. I think this gives freedom to do a lot. Then get invocations that affect the blast or that will aid you in your troubles. Plus, the UMD skill allows you to use scrolls to burn holes if you feel the need. YEAH WARLOCKS!
Todd 06-08-05, 09:41 PM	True that Kineticist Psions beat out just about all spellcasting damage dealers in a single fight or for two ... but over the course of a day with 4 encounters the Sorcerers and Warmages will be doing a lot more damage overall. Warmage is good if you just want to do damage, but Sorcerer is more flexible and nearly as good damage wise. Warlock is good if you want damage all day long and not have to worry about running out of spells but he will never do nearly as much as a Sorcerer or Warmage. Level's 1-7 he might be a better damage dealer but after that the balance of power starts to shift and the other Casters will start to equal and then outshine him. Ironically Bards can make *very* good blasters too if you go for Seeker of the Song. Nearly all of the seeker songs are SU and thus ignore SR ... and they use bardic music instead of spell slots. You can burn feats to increase bardic music uses turning these guys into amazing damage dealers at high levels. Good BAB too. One build I've been considering is Bard-4 / Paladin-6 / Seeker of the Song-10 with the Devoted Perfomer feat from the Complete Arcane. Add Snowflake Wardance, Arcane Strike, and some Extra Song feats ... and you have one very stong gish like character who can deal out massive damage either with songs or in melee.
Weapons Lord 06-08-05, 09:52 PM	You could try the Havoc Mage prestige class from the minatures handbook. They can battle cast without worrying about attacks of opportunity and swing a weapon in the same round. It's only a 5 level progression, but it's great if you like a spell caster who can take care of themselves with a weapon as well as with a spell.
Killer8539 06-08-05, 10:19 PM	It might take awhile but my friend did this. I dont know exactly how to do it so if i am wrong sorry. At level 35 my friend was able to do maybe 1000 damage in a single blast of some lightning spell. This attack has no spell resistance so even epic monsters are effected by it and can easily take them down. If you want to know more then just ask and ill get the detials but he did something that always ****** off the DM.....kill every monster that was thrown at him :) .
Praedoran 06-08-05, 10:36 PM	is in Instant kills :P Level 1: Sleep, Level 2: Ghoul Touch, Level 3: Deep Slumber, etc. Sleep = Death, Paralysis = Death, Polymorph = Death. Damage is all fluff and fun to roll, but just get some decent strength, a scythe, and crank up your Save DCs for damage that's always just enough. Non Core? Wilder is awesome (except for those days when you screw up your 10% Enervation chance... twice!) and with Psionic Shot, Greater Psionic Shot, Empower Power, Quicken Power, Maximize Power, Twin Power, and many others, you've got the simplest and most powerful damage dealer you can. Optimization boards have also posted many others for just about every class, and each one have its own pros and cons. Base Core? Go Wizard. He can Empower spells a little easier than the Sorcy. But a Soceror can really bring it in terms of damage over the long run. Sometimes throwing that extra fireball is more important than a little more damage. It's also really intoxicating to have that much power to burn (especially if you play a generalist wizard for a while)
theOne333 06-08-05, 10:49 PM	here is a nice idea, the great Warlock. Unlimited casting of invocations, then eldricht blast. I think this gives freedom to do a lot. Then get invocations that affect the blast or that will aid you in your troubles. Plus, the UMD skill allows you to use scrolls to burn holes if you feel the need. YEAH WARLOCKS! The eldritch blast only deals 9d6+invocations damage at 20th level. Any full spellcaster can top that without thinking. Warlocks really aren't designed with uber-damage-dealing in mind; they're more about stealth, defense, generally useful tricks, miscellaneous stuff, etc. The eldritch blast is strong at low levels, but at high levels is very much outclassed.
Kadasbrass 06-08-05, 11:06 PM	A Wilder using Mind Thrust may be great at damage on paper, but the problem is that its all or nothing, at lest other spells that have a save do at lest half to most creatures. If all your looking for is someone that can dish out damage and nothing else then the Warmage is your answer, acid, fire, cold, sonic, force, ligthing, saves and no saves, spell resistant and no spell resistant, autohits, touch attacks, areas effects, cones, bolts and single targets (Could make this into a song). You can go days without using the same spell again or you can turn every spell you got into a magic missile. If you want some (or alot of) damage spells and some other spells on the side, then you should go with a Sorcerer or an Evoker, all ya gotta do is grap one (or two) evocation spell each spell level and you can choose some other good spells along with it for support, fireball at 3rd, arc of ligthing at 4th and cone of cold at 6th and you have room for some other good spells for the side.
Killer8539 06-09-05, 01:15 AM	arc of ligthing that is it!!!!!!!!!!!! It has no spell resistance and with the feat substitute energy it can be anything you want, fire, acid, etc. You can also twin it and maximize it. The best for this would be a wizard because if your a sorcerer and you use metamagic then it slows down the casting time which really sucks (especially if a guy with really high health is coming at you and you have little time to cast a spell). other than that arc of lightning with lots of feats is really good.....
Kadasbrass 06-09-05, 02:28 AM	Woops mis type Arc of ligthing and cone of cold are both 5th level spells for Wiz/Sorc. Druid does get it at 4 tho. Just on a side not, picking a few conjuration spells will allow you to by pass spell resistence, such as Arc of Ligthing and the Orb Spells, and the orb spells don't even make a save for half damage (save vs some sideffect like sickness or deafness), just requires a ranged touch attack. As for dealing 1000 from a Arc of Ligthing, by itself it deals 15d6 max, using the maximize feat brings ua to 90, empowered + max deals 135, max + empower + twin brings us to 270. Using the one epic feat from Complete Arcane to increase number of dice will bring us to 25d6, maxed 150, max + empower 225, twin brings us to 450. You sure it was arc of ligthing? What other feats can be used to increase damage? Only other one I can think of is the energy addmixtures.
Particle_Man 06-09-05, 12:06 PM	You need to decide for how many rounds per day you need to do damage. If a few, then those classes that can pump up the damage (like Kineticist or Wilder) would serve. If more, then you are looking at Warmage, Sorceror, and Wizard. If almost continuous, then Warlock looks more attractive. How many fights per day do you expect to get in, and how long are those fights likely to last? That will tell you how many rounds per day of damage you need, which can guide your class choice.