Best Necromancer [Archive] - Wizards Community

Best Necromancer [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
molten_dragon
11-27-07, 08:19 AM I've always wanted to play a necromancer, but it never quite fit in with any of the parties I was playing with. However, one of my groups decided to end an old campaign and start a new one which a necromancer will fit right in with. So I finally have the opportunity to make one. However, I was wondering what the best class or classes are to make a great necromancer. I like the look of the dread necromancer prestige class and the true necromancer base class, but I'm not really sure which is better or more fun to play since I don't know anyone who has played either. Can I get some advice?
DiceGolem
11-27-07, 08:59 AM Don't you mean Dread Necromancer base class and True Necromancer prestige?

The Dread Necro's 8th level ability to control literal tons of undead makes it better in my book, even though your spell list is going to suffer. I'd suggest only playing a True Necro if you're willing to be a necromancy-flavored Mystic Theurge.

If you and the DM are willing to do a little leg-work, you could just be both. :D
Climhazzard
11-27-07, 09:09 AM I recommend the Dread Necromancer or a Cleric if you want to be a competent necromancer. The True Necromancer PRC is something you do NOT want.

Finally, take a look at K's Revised Necromancer's Handbook (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=599129&page=1&pp=30).
Barloch
11-27-07, 10:26 AM The answer to all necromancer related questions shall forever be "dread necro." Seriously, its a great base class, tons of solid aiblities, damage reduction, a nice array of spells including several save or die nukes, and at 20th level lichdom for free.
Krusk
11-27-07, 10:33 AM If you want to be an undead focused necromancer i would suggest Cleric and whatever prestige class you want so long as it gives full rebuke undead and spells.

Dread necro is great, but it is more for going into melee alongside your undead, whereas cleric stands in back dropping AOE spells or buffing the undead.

That said do not go into true necromancer, it makes you terrible at necromancy.

Read over K's handbook as previously mentioned, its well written and actually helpful. Unfortunatly it hasnt been updated in a bit.
Averroes
11-27-07, 10:48 AM In my campaign I'm actually running 3 necro's right now.
Wizard/Cleric/True Necro
Pure Wizard Necro
Cleric/Master of Shrouds

From the 3 missions we've played I can tell you that so far the True Necro does have problems (I'm actually giving him an item that will help bring him up to power) Mainly the True Necro looks good, however when you realise that you can't control the undead you can create it does make things kind of weak. With poor spellcasting levels.
The Wizard necro is actually really pretty powerful. With a good mind for spell selection and using the Unearthed Arcana alternate rule with replacing the Familiar with a Skeletal minion he's actually pretty powerful before he can even cast animate dead. The minion is pretty powerful as it has the same HD a the wizard (d12 with no con mod) and well geared with armor and weapons its almost like an additional, albeit stupid, PC in the group.
The Cleric Master of Shrouds is also not without its power. By multi classing early you can become a master of shrouds very early giving him access to shadows at a pretty low level.

We don't have the book with the Dread Necro so I can't really compare it with the others. But I think if I had to pick between the three the Wizard Necro seems like the most fun to me, except you do lose out on minions by not having the Rebuke, but there are some Wizard spells that the clerics don't get, namely one that makes all corpreal undead do an additonal 2d6 dmg to living creatures, and that minion is so nice. especially with the Bonecrafter feat.

I think its a matter of personal taste. Pure numbers and the cleric wins out. True Necro is pretty weak. But has good flavor. And I'm just partial to the Wizards.
The_Shaman
11-27-07, 11:35 AM I think a wizard/pale master can do pretty well. Pale Master is an okay PrC, but it's first level is horrendous: you get nothing. No spellcasting progression and no ability. I always thought that lost spellcasting levels should be compensated by good, or at least ok, abilities - like that Sand Shaper 1st level.
DreamerInsane
11-27-07, 01:09 PM For undead control, dread necro and cleric are hard to beat.

Wizard necromancers are more about the life-drainy killing side of necromancy, not so much about undead hordes. Of course, there's the Wizard-based Uttercold Assault necromancer concept which has a small group of undead that it sends to battle. Then it throws AoE damage spells that deal half negative energy, half cold damage into the melee, thus damaging enemies and healing his minions.
Averroes
11-27-07, 01:20 PM Wizard necromancers are more about the life-drainy killing side of necromancy, not so much about undead hordes. Of course, there's the Wizard-based Uttercold Assault necromancer concept which has a small group of undead that it sends to battle. Then it throws AoE damage spells that deal half negative energy, half cold damage into the melee, thus damaging enemies and healing his minions.

That uttercold idea seems pretty neat. What feats/PrC is that from?
RobbyPants
11-27-07, 01:34 PM All in all, I say cleric is the superior choice.

If your DM allows it, however, a dread necromancer with the Tomb Tainted Soul feat (Libris Mortis) can have unlimited healing out of battle. That's a pretty nice incentive, plus the dread necromancer has some pretty cool flavor.
The_Shaman
11-27-07, 04:35 PM That uttercold idea seems pretty neat. What feats/PrC is that from?

I thought it was a feat from CArcane. Lord of the Uttercold iirc.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
molten_dragon 11-27-07, 08:19 AM	I've always wanted to play a necromancer, but it never quite fit in with any of the parties I was playing with. However, one of my groups decided to end an old campaign and start a new one which a necromancer will fit right in with. So I finally have the opportunity to make one. However, I was wondering what the best class or classes are to make a great necromancer. I like the look of the dread necromancer prestige class and the true necromancer base class, but I'm not really sure which is better or more fun to play since I don't know anyone who has played either. Can I get some advice?
DiceGolem 11-27-07, 08:59 AM	Don't you mean Dread Necromancer base class and True Necromancer prestige? The Dread Necro's 8th level ability to control literal tons of undead makes it better in my book, even though your spell list is going to suffer. I'd suggest only playing a True Necro if you're willing to be a necromancy-flavored Mystic Theurge. If you and the DM are willing to do a little leg-work, you could just be both. :D
Climhazzard 11-27-07, 09:09 AM	I recommend the Dread Necromancer or a Cleric if you want to be a competent necromancer. The True Necromancer PRC is something you do NOT want. Finally, take a look at K's Revised Necromancer's Handbook (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=599129&page=1&pp=30).
Barloch 11-27-07, 10:26 AM	The answer to all necromancer related questions shall forever be "dread necro." Seriously, its a great base class, tons of solid aiblities, damage reduction, a nice array of spells including several save or die nukes, and at 20th level lichdom for free.
Krusk 11-27-07, 10:33 AM	If you want to be an undead focused necromancer i would suggest Cleric and whatever prestige class you want so long as it gives full rebuke undead and spells. Dread necro is great, but it is more for going into melee alongside your undead, whereas cleric stands in back dropping AOE spells or buffing the undead. That said do not go into true necromancer, it makes you terrible at necromancy. Read over K's handbook as previously mentioned, its well written and actually helpful. Unfortunatly it hasnt been updated in a bit.
Averroes 11-27-07, 10:48 AM	In my campaign I'm actually running 3 necro's right now. Wizard/Cleric/True Necro Pure Wizard Necro Cleric/Master of Shrouds From the 3 missions we've played I can tell you that so far the True Necro does have problems (I'm actually giving him an item that will help bring him up to power) Mainly the True Necro looks good, however when you realise that you can't control the undead you can create it does make things kind of weak. With poor spellcasting levels. The Wizard necro is actually really pretty powerful. With a good mind for spell selection and using the Unearthed Arcana alternate rule with replacing the Familiar with a Skeletal minion he's actually pretty powerful before he can even cast animate dead. The minion is pretty powerful as it has the same HD a the wizard (d12 with no con mod) and well geared with armor and weapons its almost like an additional, albeit stupid, PC in the group. The Cleric Master of Shrouds is also not without its power. By multi classing early you can become a master of shrouds very early giving him access to shadows at a pretty low level. We don't have the book with the Dread Necro so I can't really compare it with the others. But I think if I had to pick between the three the Wizard Necro seems like the most fun to me, except you do lose out on minions by not having the Rebuke, but there are some Wizard spells that the clerics don't get, namely one that makes all corpreal undead do an additonal 2d6 dmg to living creatures, and that minion is so nice. especially with the Bonecrafter feat. I think its a matter of personal taste. Pure numbers and the cleric wins out. True Necro is pretty weak. But has good flavor. And I'm just partial to the Wizards.
The_Shaman 11-27-07, 11:35 AM	I think a wizard/pale master can do pretty well. Pale Master is an okay PrC, but it's first level is horrendous: you get nothing. No spellcasting progression and no ability. I always thought that lost spellcasting levels should be compensated by good, or at least ok, abilities - like that Sand Shaper 1st level.
DreamerInsane 11-27-07, 01:09 PM	For undead control, dread necro and cleric are hard to beat. Wizard necromancers are more about the life-drainy killing side of necromancy, not so much about undead hordes. Of course, there's the Wizard-based Uttercold Assault necromancer concept which has a small group of undead that it sends to battle. Then it throws AoE damage spells that deal half negative energy, half cold damage into the melee, thus damaging enemies and healing his minions.
Averroes 11-27-07, 01:20 PM	Wizard necromancers are more about the life-drainy killing side of necromancy, not so much about undead hordes. Of course, there's the Wizard-based Uttercold Assault necromancer concept which has a small group of undead that it sends to battle. Then it throws AoE damage spells that deal half negative energy, half cold damage into the melee, thus damaging enemies and healing his minions. That uttercold idea seems pretty neat. What feats/PrC is that from?
RobbyPants 11-27-07, 01:34 PM	All in all, I say cleric is the superior choice. If your DM allows it, however, a dread necromancer with the Tomb Tainted Soul feat (Libris Mortis) can have unlimited healing out of battle. That's a pretty nice incentive, plus the dread necromancer has some pretty cool flavor.
The_Shaman 11-27-07, 04:35 PM	That uttercold idea seems pretty neat. What feats/PrC is that from? I thought it was a feat from CArcane. Lord of the Uttercold iirc.