Blackguard as a standard PC class? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Blackguard as a standard PC class? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Avvarroch
08-17-05, 09:43 AM Hello All.

Sorry if I'm asking something that has been answered before, but I couldn't find anything.

Has anybody converted the blackguard from a prestige class to an standard
class? I'm thinking of it as the total opposite of the paladin, so there
should be some symmetry between the two. Base attacks, saves and spells per day can be the same with the paladin's class. Skills seem balanced as well
(same number of class skills, many the same). Fiendish servant seems to be
working in almost the same way.

My problem is mostly with the spells (the paladin has access to way more
spells than the blackguard) and less with the class characteristics. Any
assistance on the matter will be much appreciated.

Friendly, Kostas.
Venom of the Yuan Ti
08-17-05, 09:45 AM The most dread of all tombes (unearthed Arcana) has a paladin for LE, CE and CG.
Alternitavley switch all good for evil, all evil for good, remove deease for contagoen, cure for inflice, lay on hands for harm with hands ect.
Quirriff
08-17-05, 09:53 AM Most paladin spells have opposites, and give them the opposite instead of the Good/Lawful ones, Cure Wounds spells however can stay.
Kurama Youko
08-17-05, 01:52 PM They actually have the Chaotic Evil, Lawful Evil and Chaotic Good Paladin classes on the SRD website somewhere with all the other variant rules.
Shadowfax7
08-17-05, 07:50 PM BLACKGUARD¹

The Blackguard’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Handle Animal (Cha), Heal (Wis), Hide (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (religion) (Wis), Profession (Wis) and Ride (Dex).

The Blackguard’s class features are the same as the Paladin’s except for the following changes:

1) Can choose any evil alignment
(Code of Conduct doesn’t apply and can associate with any alignment)
2) Aura of Evil (replaces Aura of Good)
3) Detect Good (replaces Detect Evil)
4) Poison Use: Blackguards are skilled in the use of poison and never risk accidentally poisoning themselves when applying poison to a blade
5) Smite Good (replaces Smite Evil)
6) Dark Blessing (renamed version of Divine Grace)
7) Deadly Touch (Su): Inflicts 10 hp/level up to 150 on a successful touch attack with a Will save for ½ damage (cannot reduce hit points to less than 1) and is only usable 1/day (replaces Lay on Hands)
8) Aura of Despair (replaces Aura of Courage except that the Blackguard is still immune to fear)
9) Dark Constitution (renamed version of Divine Health)
10) Cause Disease (Sp): as per the spell Contagion (replaces Remove Disease)

¹Blackguards always suffer the –2 penalty for cruelty when determining the effective Leadership score to recruit a cohort or followers

BLACKGUARD SPELL LIST

1st level: Bane, Cause Fear, Corrupt Weapon, Cure Light Wounds, Curse Water, Death Watch, Doom, Endure Elements, Inflict Light Wounds, Magic Weapon, Protection from Chaos/Good/Law, Ray of Enfeeblement, Read Magic, Summon Monster I
2nd level: Bull’s Strength, Cure Moderate Wounds, Darkness, Death Knell, Eagle’s Splendor, Inflict Moderate Wounds, Resist Energy, Shatter, Summon Monster II, Undetectable Alignment
3rd level: Bestow Curse, Blindness/Deafness, Cure Serious Wounds, Deeper Darkness, Dispel Magic, Greater Magic Weapon, Inflict Serious Wounds, Magic Circle against Chaos/Good/Law, Protection from Energy, Summon Monster III
4th level: Cure Critical Wounds, Deathward, Dispel Chaos/Good/Law, Fear, Inflict Critical Wounds, Poison, Summon Monster IV, Unholy Sword
Manyfist
08-17-05, 09:04 PM :BLACKGUARD¹

The Blackguard’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Handle Animal (Cha), Heal (Wis), Hide (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (religion) (Wis), Profession (Wis) and Ride (Dex).

The Blackguard’s class features are the same as the Paladin’s except for the following changes:

1) Can choose any evil alignment
(Code of Conduct doesn’t apply and can associate with any alignment)
2) Aura of Evil (replaces Aura of Good)
3) Detect Good (replaces Detect Evil)
4) Poison Use: Blackguards are skilled in the use of poison and never risk accidentally poisoning themselves when applying poison to a blade
5) Smite Good (replaces Smite Evil)
6) Dark Blessing (renamed version of Divine Grace)
7) Deadly Touch (Su): Inflicts 10 hp/level up to 150 on a successful touch attack with a Will save for ½ damage (cannot reduce hit points to less than 1) and is only usable 1/day (replaces Lay on Hands)
8) Aura of Despair (replaces Aura of Courage except that the Blackguard is still immune to fear)
9) Dark Constitution (renamed version of Divine Health)
10) Cause Disease (Sp): as per the spell Contagion (replaces Remove Disease)

¹Blackguards always suffer the –2 penalty for cruelty when determining the effective Leadership score to recruit a cohort or followers

BLACKGUARD SPELL LIST

1st level: Bane, Cause Fear, Corrupt Weapon, Cure Light Wounds, Curse Water, Death Watch, Doom, Endure Elements, Inflict Light Wounds, Magic Weapon, Protection from Chaos/Good/Law, Ray of Enfeeblement, Read Magic, Summon Monster I
2nd level: Bull’s Strength, Cure Moderate Wounds, Darkness, Death Knell, Eagle’s Splendor, Inflict Moderate Wounds, Resist Energy, Shatter, Summon Monster II, Undetectable Alignment
3rd level: Bestow Curse, Blindness/Deafness, Cure Serious Wounds, Deeper Darkness, Dispel Magic, Greater Magic Weapon, Inflict Serious Wounds, Magic Circle against Chaos/Good/Law, Protection from Energy, Summon Monster III
4th level: Cure Critical Wounds, Deathward, Dispel Chaos/Good/Law, Fear, Inflict Critical Wounds, Poison, Summon Monster IV, Unholy Sword
Why not just use the Evil Paladins in the SRD?
Ioreck
08-17-05, 09:07 PM Anti Paladin
ragingmaro
08-17-05, 09:19 PM :
Why not just use the Evil Paladins in the SRD?

Ar we atlking 3.0 SRD? Because I can't seem to find it in 3.5 SRD.
Manyfist
08-17-05, 09:41 PM Ar we atlking 3.0 SRD? Because I can't seem to find it in 3.5 SRD.
Oops, not the SRD. Crystal Keep. http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/
Manyfist
08-17-05, 09:41 PM Ar we atlking 3.0 SRD? Because I can't seem to find it in 3.5 SRD.
Oops, not the SRD. Crystal Keep. http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/
Nephlite
08-17-05, 10:15 PM BLACKGUARD¹

The Blackguard’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Handle Animal (Cha), Heal (Wis), Hide (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (religion) (Wis), Profession (Wis) and Ride (Dex).

The Blackguard’s class features are the same as the Paladin’s except for the following changes:

1) Can choose any evil alignment
(Code of Conduct doesn’t apply and can associate with any alignment)
2) Aura of Evil (replaces Aura of Good)
3) Detect Good (replaces Detect Evil)
4) Poison Use: Blackguards are skilled in the use of poison and never risk accidentally poisoning themselves when applying poison to a blade
5) Smite Good (replaces Smite Evil)
6) Dark Blessing (renamed version of Divine Grace)
7) Deadly Touch (Su): Inflicts 10 hp/level up to 150 on a successful touch attack with a Will save for ½ damage (cannot reduce hit points to less than 1) and is only usable 1/day (replaces Lay on Hands)
8) Aura of Despair (replaces Aura of Courage except that the Blackguard is still immune to fear)
9) Dark Constitution (renamed version of Divine Health)
10) Cause Disease (Sp): as per the spell Contagion (replaces Remove Disease)

¹Blackguards always suffer the –2 penalty for cruelty when determining the effective Leadership score to recruit a cohort or followers

BLACKGUARD SPELL LIST

1st level: Bane, Cause Fear, Corrupt Weapon, Cure Light Wounds, Curse Water, Death Watch, Doom, Endure Elements, Inflict Light Wounds, Magic Weapon, Protection from Chaos/Good/Law, Ray of Enfeeblement, Read Magic, Summon Monster I
2nd level: Bull’s Strength, Cure Moderate Wounds, Darkness, Death Knell, Eagle’s Splendor, Inflict Moderate Wounds, Resist Energy, Shatter, Summon Monster II, Undetectable Alignment
3rd level: Bestow Curse, Blindness/Deafness, Cure Serious Wounds, Deeper Darkness, Dispel Magic, Greater Magic Weapon, Inflict Serious Wounds, Magic Circle against Chaos/Good/Law, Protection from Energy, Summon Monster III
4th level: Cure Critical Wounds, Deathward, Dispel Chaos/Good/Law, Fear, Inflict Critical Wounds, Poison, Summon Monster IV, Unholy Sword

What happens if I turn good or non-evil (neutral)? Do I lose Class features like a Paladin?
Do I therefore have a similar Code of Conduct that I must be evil and can't be good/vice versa?
Chimaera2000
08-17-05, 11:03 PM If you're looking for something to fulfill the dark knight archetype, take a look at my shadowknight base class (link in signature). It's well-balanced and possibly even more flavorful than the blackguard.

Also, Dragon Magazine did a pair of articles covering paladins of other alignments, including evil alignments. I can't remember the specific issue, but they had the despot, corruptor, and anti-paladin base classes (LE, NE, and CE, respectively) in the issue. They could be worth a look as well.
Melpomene
08-17-05, 11:07 PM Well, of course UA has the variant paladins, which are all very good. AEG also has a LN paladin variant.
Shadowfax7
08-18-05, 01:11 PM What happens if I turn good or non-evil (neutral)? Do I lose Class features like a Paladin?
Do I therefore have a similar Code of Conduct that I must be evil and can't be good/vice versa?
I would rule that if you were forcefully changed to a good alignment, you would lose all the abilities listed except for Poison Use as all of the other abilities are evil (note that Deadly Touch is from a source other than the 3.5 DMG, but you could replace it w/Sneak Attack as per the Blackguard PrC and thus it wouldn't be a lost ability).

If you were forcefully changed to a neutral alignment (on the good-evil axis) I might rule that you lose no abilities.

An evil Special Mount might not serve a non-evil Blackguard anymore.

Command Undead would be lost by a good Blackguard or changed to Turn Undead, whichever the DM felt was appropriate.
Avvarroch
08-19-05, 05:09 AM Thanks to everybody for your replies. I think I'll go for Shadowfax7's version. It seems closer to what I had in mind.

Friendly, Kostas.
Surreal
08-19-05, 11:48 AM Just take some levels in Hexblade to qualify for Blackguard. You get the full BAB, better saves overall (good Fort and Will, which is wonderful with the Hexblade's Mettle ability), and get to apply your Cha modifier *twice* against spells.
Kurama Youko
08-19-05, 12:00 PM Its not so much the point of qualifying for the prestige class Surreal as oppose he's trying to make a base class out of it.

This always a bad idea in my opinion, look at the CV Ninja, and the Mind Blade. In this case the Blackguard was never balanced as a 20 level class in terms of what abilities it got, how can you justify Poison use as a Vaild class feature in a class that gets everything a paladin gets in 10 lvs but is clearly has a advantage?

Not to mention his Touch replacement is totally out of whack against Lay on Hands.

Real balance would come in the form of any of the other alignment based Paladins from UA.
Koga:The ninja trick
08-19-05, 12:33 PM There's a paladin of tyranny and slaughter which might be to your liking, as for spells, The Koga never thought they should have spells to begin with. So the tweaked versions have no spells and just gain double the smites per day..

Though unless they're npcs or the campaighn is based around an evil party, the "blackgaurd" varaints will hardly compare to the paladin or freedom paladin.. Sense evil tends to be more rampant then good..

The Koga did make a "Team Rocket" like set with a paladin of tyranny, a paladin of slaughter, and a pseudodragon mount who can talk. Neither one knows who's mount it is because they.. gave into thier passions.. one night and the pseudodragon knocked on thier windiw and ruined it for them proclaiming that some evil god sent him to be the chosen one's cohort. Obviously the tyrant believes it's him cause hey, he could play wordly dictator, and the slaughter girl thinks it's her cause.. well cause she said so.. :P
Shadowfax7
08-19-05, 12:53 PM Not to mention his Touch replacement is totally out of whack against Lay on Hands.
That is true as the actual ability I based that on is Deadly Touch from UA. Either that ability or Sneal Attack as per the DMG should be used in my version for normal campaigns.

The reason I have such a more powerful ability listed is that Paladins in my campaign heal fully 1/day instead of the usual Lay on Hands ability and cannot use the ability to damage undead. This is balanced among the other classes in my campaign, but might not be in someone else's campaign.

I also only allow the Blackguard class as an NPC class, but that is because I don't allow evil alignments for starting characters.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Avvarroch 08-17-05, 09:43 AM	Hello All. Sorry if I'm asking something that has been answered before, but I couldn't find anything. Has anybody converted the blackguard from a prestige class to an standard class? I'm thinking of it as the total opposite of the paladin, so there should be some symmetry between the two. Base attacks, saves and spells per day can be the same with the paladin's class. Skills seem balanced as well (same number of class skills, many the same). Fiendish servant seems to be working in almost the same way. My problem is mostly with the spells (the paladin has access to way more spells than the blackguard) and less with the class characteristics. Any assistance on the matter will be much appreciated. Friendly, Kostas.
Venom of the Yuan Ti 08-17-05, 09:45 AM	The most dread of all tombes (unearthed Arcana) has a paladin for LE, CE and CG. Alternitavley switch all good for evil, all evil for good, remove deease for contagoen, cure for inflice, lay on hands for harm with hands ect.
Quirriff 08-17-05, 09:53 AM	Most paladin spells have opposites, and give them the opposite instead of the Good/Lawful ones, Cure Wounds spells however can stay.
Kurama Youko 08-17-05, 01:52 PM	They actually have the Chaotic Evil, Lawful Evil and Chaotic Good Paladin classes on the SRD website somewhere with all the other variant rules.
Shadowfax7 08-17-05, 07:50 PM	BLACKGUARD¹ The Blackguard’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Handle Animal (Cha), Heal (Wis), Hide (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (religion) (Wis), Profession (Wis) and Ride (Dex). The Blackguard’s class features are the same as the Paladin’s except for the following changes: 1) Can choose any evil alignment (Code of Conduct doesn’t apply and can associate with any alignment) 2) Aura of Evil (replaces Aura of Good) 3) Detect Good (replaces Detect Evil) 4) Poison Use: Blackguards are skilled in the use of poison and never risk accidentally poisoning themselves when applying poison to a blade 5) Smite Good (replaces Smite Evil) 6) Dark Blessing (renamed version of Divine Grace) 7) Deadly Touch (Su): Inflicts 10 hp/level up to 150 on a successful touch attack with a Will save for ½ damage (cannot reduce hit points to less than 1) and is only usable 1/day (replaces Lay on Hands) 8) Aura of Despair (replaces Aura of Courage except that the Blackguard is still immune to fear) 9) Dark Constitution (renamed version of Divine Health) 10) Cause Disease (Sp): as per the spell Contagion (replaces Remove Disease) ¹Blackguards always suffer the –2 penalty for cruelty when determining the effective Leadership score to recruit a cohort or followers BLACKGUARD SPELL LIST 1st level: Bane, Cause Fear, Corrupt Weapon, Cure Light Wounds, Curse Water, Death Watch, Doom, Endure Elements, Inflict Light Wounds, Magic Weapon, Protection from Chaos/Good/Law, Ray of Enfeeblement, Read Magic, Summon Monster I 2nd level: Bull’s Strength, Cure Moderate Wounds, Darkness, Death Knell, Eagle’s Splendor, Inflict Moderate Wounds, Resist Energy, Shatter, Summon Monster II, Undetectable Alignment 3rd level: Bestow Curse, Blindness/Deafness, Cure Serious Wounds, Deeper Darkness, Dispel Magic, Greater Magic Weapon, Inflict Serious Wounds, Magic Circle against Chaos/Good/Law, Protection from Energy, Summon Monster III 4th level: Cure Critical Wounds, Deathward, Dispel Chaos/Good/Law, Fear, Inflict Critical Wounds, Poison, Summon Monster IV, Unholy Sword
Manyfist 08-17-05, 09:04 PM	:BLACKGUARD¹ The Blackguard’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Handle Animal (Cha), Heal (Wis), Hide (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (religion) (Wis), Profession (Wis) and Ride (Dex). The Blackguard’s class features are the same as the Paladin’s except for the following changes: 1) Can choose any evil alignment (Code of Conduct doesn’t apply and can associate with any alignment) 2) Aura of Evil (replaces Aura of Good) 3) Detect Good (replaces Detect Evil) 4) Poison Use: Blackguards are skilled in the use of poison and never risk accidentally poisoning themselves when applying poison to a blade 5) Smite Good (replaces Smite Evil) 6) Dark Blessing (renamed version of Divine Grace) 7) Deadly Touch (Su): Inflicts 10 hp/level up to 150 on a successful touch attack with a Will save for ½ damage (cannot reduce hit points to less than 1) and is only usable 1/day (replaces Lay on Hands) 8) Aura of Despair (replaces Aura of Courage except that the Blackguard is still immune to fear) 9) Dark Constitution (renamed version of Divine Health) 10) Cause Disease (Sp): as per the spell Contagion (replaces Remove Disease) ¹Blackguards always suffer the –2 penalty for cruelty when determining the effective Leadership score to recruit a cohort or followers BLACKGUARD SPELL LIST 1st level: Bane, Cause Fear, Corrupt Weapon, Cure Light Wounds, Curse Water, Death Watch, Doom, Endure Elements, Inflict Light Wounds, Magic Weapon, Protection from Chaos/Good/Law, Ray of Enfeeblement, Read Magic, Summon Monster I 2nd level: Bull’s Strength, Cure Moderate Wounds, Darkness, Death Knell, Eagle’s Splendor, Inflict Moderate Wounds, Resist Energy, Shatter, Summon Monster II, Undetectable Alignment 3rd level: Bestow Curse, Blindness/Deafness, Cure Serious Wounds, Deeper Darkness, Dispel Magic, Greater Magic Weapon, Inflict Serious Wounds, Magic Circle against Chaos/Good/Law, Protection from Energy, Summon Monster III 4th level: Cure Critical Wounds, Deathward, Dispel Chaos/Good/Law, Fear, Inflict Critical Wounds, Poison, Summon Monster IV, Unholy Sword Why not just use the Evil Paladins in the SRD?
Ioreck 08-17-05, 09:07 PM	Anti Paladin
ragingmaro 08-17-05, 09:19 PM	: Why not just use the Evil Paladins in the SRD? Ar we atlking 3.0 SRD? Because I can't seem to find it in 3.5 SRD.
Manyfist 08-17-05, 09:41 PM	Ar we atlking 3.0 SRD? Because I can't seem to find it in 3.5 SRD. Oops, not the SRD. Crystal Keep. http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/
Manyfist 08-17-05, 09:41 PM	Ar we atlking 3.0 SRD? Because I can't seem to find it in 3.5 SRD. Oops, not the SRD. Crystal Keep. http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/
Nephlite 08-17-05, 10:15 PM	BLACKGUARD¹ The Blackguard’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Handle Animal (Cha), Heal (Wis), Hide (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (religion) (Wis), Profession (Wis) and Ride (Dex). The Blackguard’s class features are the same as the Paladin’s except for the following changes: 1) Can choose any evil alignment (Code of Conduct doesn’t apply and can associate with any alignment) 2) Aura of Evil (replaces Aura of Good) 3) Detect Good (replaces Detect Evil) 4) Poison Use: Blackguards are skilled in the use of poison and never risk accidentally poisoning themselves when applying poison to a blade 5) Smite Good (replaces Smite Evil) 6) Dark Blessing (renamed version of Divine Grace) 7) Deadly Touch (Su): Inflicts 10 hp/level up to 150 on a successful touch attack with a Will save for ½ damage (cannot reduce hit points to less than 1) and is only usable 1/day (replaces Lay on Hands) 8) Aura of Despair (replaces Aura of Courage except that the Blackguard is still immune to fear) 9) Dark Constitution (renamed version of Divine Health) 10) Cause Disease (Sp): as per the spell Contagion (replaces Remove Disease) ¹Blackguards always suffer the –2 penalty for cruelty when determining the effective Leadership score to recruit a cohort or followers BLACKGUARD SPELL LIST 1st level: Bane, Cause Fear, Corrupt Weapon, Cure Light Wounds, Curse Water, Death Watch, Doom, Endure Elements, Inflict Light Wounds, Magic Weapon, Protection from Chaos/Good/Law, Ray of Enfeeblement, Read Magic, Summon Monster I 2nd level: Bull’s Strength, Cure Moderate Wounds, Darkness, Death Knell, Eagle’s Splendor, Inflict Moderate Wounds, Resist Energy, Shatter, Summon Monster II, Undetectable Alignment 3rd level: Bestow Curse, Blindness/Deafness, Cure Serious Wounds, Deeper Darkness, Dispel Magic, Greater Magic Weapon, Inflict Serious Wounds, Magic Circle against Chaos/Good/Law, Protection from Energy, Summon Monster III 4th level: Cure Critical Wounds, Deathward, Dispel Chaos/Good/Law, Fear, Inflict Critical Wounds, Poison, Summon Monster IV, Unholy Sword What happens if I turn good or non-evil (neutral)? Do I lose Class features like a Paladin? Do I therefore have a similar Code of Conduct that I must be evil and can't be good/vice versa?
Chimaera2000 08-17-05, 11:03 PM	If you're looking for something to fulfill the dark knight archetype, take a look at my shadowknight base class (link in signature). It's well-balanced and possibly even more flavorful than the blackguard. Also, Dragon Magazine did a pair of articles covering paladins of other alignments, including evil alignments. I can't remember the specific issue, but they had the despot, corruptor, and anti-paladin base classes (LE, NE, and CE, respectively) in the issue. They could be worth a look as well.
Melpomene 08-17-05, 11:07 PM	Well, of course UA has the variant paladins, which are all very good. AEG also has a LN paladin variant.
Shadowfax7 08-18-05, 01:11 PM	What happens if I turn good or non-evil (neutral)? Do I lose Class features like a Paladin? Do I therefore have a similar Code of Conduct that I must be evil and can't be good/vice versa? I would rule that if you were forcefully changed to a good alignment, you would lose all the abilities listed except for Poison Use as all of the other abilities are evil (note that Deadly Touch is from a source other than the 3.5 DMG, but you could replace it w/Sneak Attack as per the Blackguard PrC and thus it wouldn't be a lost ability). If you were forcefully changed to a neutral alignment (on the good-evil axis) I might rule that you lose no abilities. An evil Special Mount might not serve a non-evil Blackguard anymore. Command Undead would be lost by a good Blackguard or changed to Turn Undead, whichever the DM felt was appropriate.
Avvarroch 08-19-05, 05:09 AM	Thanks to everybody for your replies. I think I'll go for Shadowfax7's version. It seems closer to what I had in mind. Friendly, Kostas.
Surreal 08-19-05, 11:48 AM	Just take some levels in Hexblade to qualify for Blackguard. You get the full BAB, better saves overall (good Fort and Will, which is wonderful with the Hexblade's Mettle ability), and get to apply your Cha modifier twice against spells.
Kurama Youko 08-19-05, 12:00 PM	Its not so much the point of qualifying for the prestige class Surreal as oppose he's trying to make a base class out of it. This always a bad idea in my opinion, look at the CV Ninja, and the Mind Blade. In this case the Blackguard was never balanced as a 20 level class in terms of what abilities it got, how can you justify Poison use as a Vaild class feature in a class that gets everything a paladin gets in 10 lvs but is clearly has a advantage? Not to mention his Touch replacement is totally out of whack against Lay on Hands. Real balance would come in the form of any of the other alignment based Paladins from UA.
Koga:The ninja trick 08-19-05, 12:33 PM	There's a paladin of tyranny and slaughter which might be to your liking, as for spells, The Koga never thought they should have spells to begin with. So the tweaked versions have no spells and just gain double the smites per day.. Though unless they're npcs or the campaighn is based around an evil party, the "blackgaurd" varaints will hardly compare to the paladin or freedom paladin.. Sense evil tends to be more rampant then good.. The Koga did make a "Team Rocket" like set with a paladin of tyranny, a paladin of slaughter, and a pseudodragon mount who can talk. Neither one knows who's mount it is because they.. gave into thier passions.. one night and the pseudodragon knocked on thier windiw and ruined it for them proclaiming that some evil god sent him to be the chosen one's cohort. Obviously the tyrant believes it's him cause hey, he could play wordly dictator, and the slaughter girl thinks it's her cause.. well cause she said so.. :P
Shadowfax7 08-19-05, 12:53 PM	Not to mention his Touch replacement is totally out of whack against Lay on Hands. That is true as the actual ability I based that on is Deadly Touch from UA. Either that ability or Sneal Attack as per the DMG should be used in my version for normal campaigns. The reason I have such a more powerful ability listed is that Paladins in my campaign heal fully 1/day instead of the usual Lay on Hands ability and cannot use the ability to damage undead. This is balanced among the other classes in my campaign, but might not be in someone else's campaign. I also only allow the Blackguard class as an NPC class, but that is because I don't allow evil alignments for starting characters.