Post/Author/DateTime	Post
AramilWindwalker 02-05-05, 08:47 PM	Blade Oracle Blade oracles are drawn to the way of the sword from an early age, as with the paladin, it is usually a calling, not a choice, although someone can train under a natural Blade Oracle to be one. To them, swordplay is an art, as well as a fighting style, and may challenge each other to showy duels of skill. This does not make them not serious fighters however. Adventures: Most Blade oracles adventure to further their skills, and take dangerous missions to test their limits. Some, however, become skilled bodyguards or mercenaries, or use their skills to purge the world of those lacking the finesse and skill they possess. Evil Oracles use their skills to frighten and intimidate others, while good ones protect the innocents. Characteristics: Blade Oracles are much like swashbucklers, for they use flashy but effective sword techniques. They typically only train in the use of swords and other blades, and wear only light armor for the best mobility. As they gain experience, they increase their abilities to look fancy and deal tremendous damage as well. They are mostly melee fighters, but some use daggers and throw with deadly accuracy. Alignment: Blade Oracles often prefer the freedom of chaos, but can encompass both good and evil just as equally. Races: Almost all races can feel the calling of Blade Oracle, but humans, goblins, and elves respond to the call most often, as their natural abilities match with the necessary skills better than half orcs or Dwarves. Other classes: A blade Oracle appreciates the ranger, rogue, and many fighters for their finesse and skill with blades. They are wary of the mages, and skeptical of the piety of the clerics and Paladins. But, like fighters, they know the value of teamwork, even if they can't help but show off a little. Role: Most often, the Blade Oracles serve as secondary melee fighters and pop in and out of combat like the rogue, not preferring long periods of tight combat, as their fortitude is not as strong as most fighters. Game Rule Information Blade Oracles have the following game statistics Abilities: Dexterity is the most vital stat for a Blade Oracle, as it fuels their ability to hit, and counterblow, and since they wear light armor helps their AC. Constitution is second, as their style of fighting needs decent HP but not as important as avoiding the damage entirely, unlike most melee fighters, a high strength score is almost never necessary as their style uses their speed and skill to damage, not brute strength. Intelligence increases their amount of counterblows, their imp weapon finesse damage, and access to more skills. Alignment: any Hit Die: D8 BAB + Saves: BAB full(as fighter), fort poor, ref good, will poor. Class Skills Balance, Concentration, Craft, Escape Artist, Jump, Listen, Move Silently, Profession, Spot, Tumble. Skill points: 2+int modifier (*4 at level one) Class features: Weapon and armor Proficiency: Proficient with all simple and martial weapons, and with light armor, but not shields. All the Blade oracles' abilities are only useable while wearing light or no armor, not carrying a shield, only carrying a light load, and weilding a sword one-handed 1 Weapon finesse, Counterblow 2 3 Deep focus+1 4 Dancing blade, Evasion 5 Bonus fighter feat, Deep focus+2, first extra finessable weapon 6 Counterblow expertise+1 7 Deep focus+3 8 Bonus fighter feat 9 Deep focus+4 10 Improved weapon finesse, counterblow expertise+2 11 Bonus fighter feat, Deep Focus+5 12 Combat reflexes 13 deep focus+6 14 Improved Counterblow, counterblow expertise+3, bonus fighter feat 15 deep focus+7, second extra finessable weapon 16 17 deep focus+8, bonus fighter feat 18 counterblow expertise+4 19 Deep focus+9 20 Greater counterblow, bonus fighter feat, Weapon Finesse : At first level, a Blade oracle gains Weapon finesse as a bonus feat. At fifth level, and and again at 15th, you may select a nonfinessable one-handed or lighter sword to apply this bonus to as well. Swords that are one handed exotic, or two handed martial(like the bastard sword) can only be selected if the appropriate EWP feat is taken. Counterblow : At first level, they gain the ability to parry and counter an enemy's attacks. Once per round, after an attack roll is made against a blade Oracle, they are allowed a reflex save (DC:attack roll(includes their bonuses)) to parry the blow, they are then allowed one attack at their highest BAB against the attacker. This counts as a use of an AoO for that round. He must be aware of the attack and be able to react (if helpless or flat-footed, then he cannot use this this ability). you cannot use an ability(such as Karmic strike) to get hit, then negate it with counterblow, then gain the extra attack from karmic strike, because counterblow parries the blow so you don't actually get hit, so they do not stack. A counterblow is only usable on an attack that would otherwise hit, and may be used to deflect ranged weapons that are reasonably sized(IE, it can deflect an arrow or dagger, but not a boulder). Deep Focus : At third level, as a standard action, a Blade Oracle may focus his energy so his next attack has more grace and precision. The next attack he makes (including AoOs and counterblows) gets +1 to hit and to damage. If attacked and damaged before this attack, must make a concentration check (DC:10 + damage dealt) or lose this focus. At 5th level and every 2 levels after (7th, 9th, etc), this bonus increases by 1. Dancing blade : Starting at 4th level, a Blade Oracle has increased his skill and speed to be able to make, in a full attack, one additional attack at highest BAB. This attack and all subsequent attack made that round (including counterblows and AoOs) are at a -3 penalty. Evasion: gains evasion, as the rogue ability at 4th level. Bonus Feat :At 5th level and every 3 levels after (8,11,14,17,20) Blade oracles gain a bonus feat from the fighter lists of feats, and although they must meet all requirements for these feats, Blade oracle levels stack with and count for fighter levels for greater weapon focus, specialization etc. Counterblow Expertise : At 6th level, a Blade Oracle has gained lithe agility in parrying blows. They gain a +1 bonus to the reflex save made to parry (this bonus increases to +2 at 10th level, and increase by one every 4 levels after.)This Bonus is gained only when the BO has his dex bonus to AC. Improved Weapon Finesse : At 10th level, all weapons you have finessed may add the intelligence bonus for damage rolls in addition to strength, because they learn that where to hit may be more important than how hard you hit. The damage is multiplied on criticals, and can affect creatures immune to criticals, as though it were an addition to the strength bonus. Combat reflexes : At 12th level, Blade Oracles gain Combat reflexes as a bonus feat, if they have already gained this feat, they may also add their intelligence modifier to the number of AoOs they may make in a round. Improved Counterblow : At 14th level, a Blade Oracle may use the counterblow a number of times per round equal to his intelligence modifier+1, although he is only allowed one attempt per person (ex, if one person attacks with bonuses +13/+8/+3, you may attempt to parry one of them, not all.) Each time still counts as an AoO use that round. Greater counterblow : At 20th level, a BO is allowed to make a parry for each of an opponents attacks, up to his limit of AoOs per round, but the second one takes a -2 penalty, third a -4 penalty, 4th a -6 penalty, etc. Each successive counterstrike attempt is made at an attack bous 5 lower, to a lowest of your lowest BAB(IE, if your BAB is 20/15/10/5 then the first is at +20, then +15, +10 and all the rest are at +5)
AramilWindwalker 02-06-05, 07:24 PM	I'm astounded Is there nothing to be said about this class, or is it too terrible for words. I'm frightened... Someone please point out something wrong with it...
Jarlaxle_The_Rogue 02-06-05, 08:49 PM	Its just not terribly interesting. I didn't even bother to read through it all. Even the name is lacking.
Alienfreak 02-06-05, 08:51 PM	Looks even weaker than the Fighter :D Lower BAB Lower HP Only proficent with light armor Better Ref Worse Fort No Bonus Feats at all Only negative up to here The Abilities looks quite fair, but only when going straight forward in that class, nothing for multiclassing. You get one attack less but get 1 due to your special thing, but with an -3 to all attacks. There are 2 ways coming up in my mind at this time (quite late where i live): 1: I would give him 5-7 Bonus Feats through the Career and also give him the Fighter Blook(ex) ability to enable him to use Feats as if he was an fighter (weapon spez) 2. Fighter Blook(ex) ability to enable him to use Feats as if he was an fighter (weapon spez) combined with an Full BAB.
Wildonion 02-06-05, 08:57 PM	Looks pretty good, put the counterblow seems a little to powerful. I suggest raising the DC t0 10+the opponents attack roll. EDIT: Whoops! Almost Forgot! The class otherwise seems balanced and pretty cool! Good job! :ayyyy!:
AramilWindwalker 02-06-05, 09:19 PM	I thank everyone for their constructive critisism and hope this class isn't too bad, and if it isn't i will try to convince my DM to at least look at it. The changes have made it almost too much like the fighter though...
ShiverTheBard 02-06-05, 10:44 PM	I see utmost perfection in a speedy lightly armored fighter. I am so tired of playing and get overshadowed by anyone with a high strength score and a greatsword. Frankly, I see 2h weapons as unbalanced the way they are now. With a rapier, I could hit someone about 12 times before they could hit me once with a lumbering greatsword. 3.5 is so biased toawards 2h weapons its sick.
Alienfreak 02-07-05, 06:37 AM	I would suggest to create an table, like those for all other classes. Its ... yeah ... better? And with the Feats it looks perfectly balanced to me. Or at least, worth a try.
heretic888 02-07-05, 10:59 AM	Following advice that was given to me concerning my Shinobi no Bushi class, I would highly suggest dropping Improved Weapon Finesse in lieu of another ability. It is, in my opinion, very unbalancing. Basically, you would have a character that uses a single ability score --- Dexterity --- to enhance Reflex saves, Armor Class, attack rolls, damage rolls, and over 75% of his class skills (Move Silently, Tumble, Balance, and Escape Artist). What's worse, this class has a high BAB (upping the Dex-based attack bonus even more), can apply Weapon Finesse to d10 weapons (upping the Dex-based attack bonus even more), and can apply Reflex saves to a block-then-counterattack move. Should I also mention this class can apply Power Attack to its finesse-able weapons (such as a MWP bastard sword)?? No detriment whatsoever, considering the high BAB and One Attribute Dependency of the class... On top of all this Dexterity-stacking, we also see a d8 hit die and a high Fortitude save. Thus, while a good Constitution would be nice, the class wouldn't be terribly lacking without one. Honestly, I would seriously drop Improved Weapon Finesse. Barring that, I would at least make the class seriously Constitution-dependent, with a d6 hit die and low Fortitude save. Just my thoughts... although, to tell you the truth, I'm quite frankly surprised no one else noticed any of this.
Alienfreak 02-07-05, 11:31 AM	Make the Fort a bad save. The Improved Finesse ability is a 10th level ability, so you have to go 10 levels into that class to get that bonus. Not very easy to get. At first level, a Blade oracle gains Weapon finesse as a bonus feat, except that it may be applied to any one-handed or lighter sword-like weapon (ex:Longsword). due to extensive training with blades, they are more agile with more weapons than most. What about this only as powerful as the Feat, but WITH an longsword? Would quite balance it. Otherwise even Monkey Gripped two handed weapons would work with that. Improved Counterblow : At 12th level, a Blade Oracle may use the counterblow as many times per round as there are attacks against him, although he is only allowed one attempt per person (ex, if one person attacks with bonuses +13/+8/+3, you may attempt to parry one of them, not all.) Make that Dex Bonus +1 times per round. I would also lower the DC again. You easily have an +18 attack bonus at 10th level. An Reflex save of an average of 38 is just IMPOSSIBLE at 10th level. You would have: +14 or so on the save. With DC 5+ attack roll its quite ... possible. (still 33 ^^)
heretic888 02-07-05, 12:18 PM	The Improved Finesse ability is a 10th level ability, so you have to go 10 levels into that class to get that bonus. Not very easy to get. It has nothing to do with how "easy" it is to get. It has to do with how balanced it is. Having one ability score determine attack bonus, damage bonus, Armor Class, the primary saving throw bonus, and the bulk of skill bonuses is an unbalanced condition --- regardless of what level we're talking about. When you add in the ability to apply Weapon Finesse to Power Attack-able d10 weapons (such as a Martial Weapon Proficiency bastard sword), a high BAB, and a Reflex-based counterblow ability, well... What about this only as powerful as the Feat, but WITH an longsword? Would quite balance it. Otherwise even Monkey Gripped two handed weapons would work with that. Upon reflection, I would work the Weapon Finesse abilities like this... At first level, the class receives the Weapon Finesse feat for free. In addition, the class can apply Weapon Finesse to a single one-handed, non-finessable weapon of choice (such as the longsword) at fifth, tenth, fifteenth, and twentieth level. This ability cannot be applied to off-hand attacks. I would drop Improved Weapon Finesse altogether. This would leave the ultimate Weapon Finesse class, able to finesse things such as the bastard sword, katana, and longsword --- but without the breaking ability of applying Dexterity to damage rolls. Although, even then, I would keep the restriction preventing this ability to being applied on off-hand attacks. You could have some nasty combinations with the TWF feat chains and this class... Make that Dex Bonus +1 times per round. I would also lower the DC again. You easily have an +18 attack bonus at 10th level. An Reflex save of an average of 38 is just IMPOSSIBLE at 10th level. You would have: +14 or so on the save. With DC 5+ attack roll its quite ... possible. (still 33 ^^) I'm inclined to agree with the above suggestions. Laterz.
AramilWindwalker 02-07-05, 06:32 PM	Thanks all :D . The weapon finesse thing, i hope it is better now, monkey gripped or EWP Bastard swords don't count, if anyone has better wording, that would be nice. I think adding intelligence as a more important ability also helps to balance it, even if it isn't needed until higher levels. Is the HD drop too much for the class?
Alienfreak 02-07-05, 06:40 PM	D6 is really hard for an melee type. But since he has one more attack than the fighter, it could be balanced. Has to be tested :)
heretic888 02-07-05, 07:20 PM	Thanks all :D . The weapon finesse thing, i hope it is better now, monkey gripped or EWP Bastard swords don't count, if anyone has better wording, that would be nice. I think adding intelligence as a more important ability also helps to balance it, even if it isn't needed until higher levels. Is the HD drop too much for the class? As the class is now --- with Intelligence being used on Improved Weapon Finesse and limiting how many times per day you can use Improved Counterblow --- I think it is mostly well-balanced. In fact, considering this is a melee class, I would change the hit die back to d8. However, I still must add that I believe making d10 weapons finessable at first level is a rather bad idea. All I need do is take Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Bastard Sword at first level as my feat, and I'm in business. The Iaijutsu Master from Oriental Adventures gains Weapon Finesse to katanas at first level. Problem is its a prestige class, and you can't even qualify for it until around 6th or 7th level. I would suggest changing the class's Weapon Finesse ability to the revision I described in my last post, in which you can apply Weapon Finesse to one non-finessable, one-handed weapon at every fifth level. I also think it should be restricted from off-hand attacks, as you could easily do some nasty damage with TWF combinations (the class already gets one more attack plus a high BAB). Laterz.
AramilWindwalker 02-17-05, 10:51 AM	Thanks for the help, yes, this is a bump.
-Defiler of Souls- 02-17-05, 02:05 PM	counterblow and imp counterblow are both WAY to powerful, i'd suggest AT LEAST taking imp counter blow out altogether, moving counter blow to level 10 and change it's effect to that of the similer ability that bravo blade gets(i forget the name of it right now) other then that it looks good
pc_shadows 02-17-05, 03:11 PM	eh its not the greatest i my self didnt look threw it all but the concept is good just needs work. the counter blow i think should be replaced with a feat from the mongoose book of ultamit feats. its a feat called "let him go by" or something like that basicly every time some one attacks you and misses you can do a reflex save dc 15 and hit him its not an attack of op tho but you do need combate reflexes but as a class ability i think it should be just take it even if you dont meet the prerecs like the rangers two weapon fighting and as the name black "orical" way way later on i think he should maybe even get the true stick one a day or week something like that. that would be pretty awesome. think it over bud and you might even come up a really sweet(but not broken) character.
heretic888 02-17-05, 05:15 PM	Wow. I think I damaged my eyes trying to read that last post. :P
AramilWindwalker 02-20-05, 08:04 PM	I took your idea, Heretic888, i hope i did it correctly.
Nephlite 02-20-05, 08:57 PM	Blade Oracle Blade oracles are drawn to the way of the sword from an early age, as with the paladin, it is usually a calling, not a choice, although someone can train under a natural Blade Oracle to be one. To them, swordplay is an art, as well as a fighting style, and may challenge each other to showy duels of skill. This does not make them not serious fighters however. Adventures: Most Blade oracles adventure to further their skills, and take dangerous missions to test their limits. Some, however, become skilled bodyguards or mercenaries, or use their skills to purge the world of those lacking the finesse and skill they possess. Evil Oracles use their skills to frighten and intimidate others, while good ones protect the innocents. Characteristics: Blade Oracles are much like swashbucklers, for they use flashy but effective sword techniques. They typically only train in the use of swords and other blades, and wear only light armor for the best mobility. As they gain experience, they increase their abilities to look fancy and deal tremendous damage as well. They are mostly melee fighters, but some use daggers and throw with deadly accuracy. Alignment: Blade Oracles often prefer the freedom of chaos, but can encompass both good and evil just as equally. Races: Almost all races can feel the calling of Blade Oracle, but humans, goblins, and elves respond to the call most often, as their natural abilities match with the necessary skills better than half orcs or Dwarves. Other classes: A blade Oracle appreciates the ranger, rogue, and many fighters for their finesse and skill with blades. They are wary of the mages, and skeptical of the piety of the clerics and Paladins. But, like fighters, they know the value of teamwork, even if they can't help but show off a little. Role: Most often, the Blade Oracles serve as secondary melee fighters and pop in and out of combat like the rogue, not preferring long periods of tight combat, as their fortitude is not as strong as most fighters. All that Core information is good. Some people forget to make it. Game Rule Information Blade Oracles have the following game statistics Abilities: Dexterity is the most vital stat for a Blade Oracle, as it fuels their ability to hit, and counterblow, and since they wear light armor helps their AC. Constitution is second, as their style of fighting needs decent HP but not as important as avoiding the damage entirely, unlike most melee fighters, a high strength score is almost never necessary as their style uses their speed and skill to damage, not brute strength. Intelligence increases their amount of counterblows, their imp weapon finesse damage, and access to more skills. Alignment: any Hit Die: D8 BAB + Saves: BAB full(as fighter), fort poor, ref good, will poor. So its Rogue with better HD, less skills, more weaponry kinda, better bab, and no sneak attack. I say Rogue because of Reflexes. Class Skills Concentration, Escape Artist, Jump, Move Silently, Tumble, Balance, Spot, jump, balance, listen Skill points: 2+int modifier (*4 at level one) *Gets on Soapbox* I am firm in the belief that this class should have both Craft and Profession! Its not a Fighter. I mean come on. Thank you. *gets off Soapbox* Class features: Weapon and armor Proficiency: Proficient with all one handed or lighter simple and martial swords (daggers, shortswords, and the like), and with light armor, but not shields. Weapon Finesse : At first level, a Blade oracle gains Weapon finesse as a bonus feat, and may select one simple or martial one-handed sword-like weapon to apply this bonus to as well, and they gain another one at 5th level, and at every 5 BO levels afterward How about crossbow or sling? I mean some ranged simple weaponry... But I like the ability to treat 1 weapon as if finessible. Counterblow : At first level, they gain the ability to parry and counter an enemy's attacks. Once per round, after an attack roll is made against a blade Oracle, they are allowed a reflex save (DC:5+ attack roll) to parry the blow, they are then allowed one attack at their highest BAB against the attacker. This counts as a use of an AoO for that round. Cool, so what is a Natural 20 counted as? A 30 or just a 20? Decent ability, useful with their low AC. Deep Focus : At third level, as a standard action, a Blade Oracle may focus his energy so his next attack has more grace and precision. The next attack he makes (including AoOs and counterblows) gets +1 to hit and to damage. If attacked and damaged before this attack, must make a concentration check (DC:10 + damage dealt) or lose this focus. At 5th level and every 2 levels after (7th, 9th, etc), this bonus increases by 1. Kinda useful, so he charges his blade with his focus and strikes with all his might. I like it. Dancing blade : Starting at 4th level, a Blade Oracle has increased his skill and speed to be able to make, in a full attack, one additional attack at highest BAB. This attack and all subsequent attack made that round (including counterblows and AoOs) are at a -3 penalty. Bonus Feat :At 5th level and every 3 levels after (8,11,14,17,20) Blade oracles gain a bonus feat from the fighter lists of feats, and although they must meet all requirements for these feats, Blade oracle levels stack with and count for fighter levels for greater weapon focus, specialization etc. Okay so its kinda like Flurry of Blows but worse penalty. So he can get Weapon Specialization, awesome. Counterblow Expertise : At 6th level, a Blade Oracle has gained lithe agility in parrying blows. They gain a +1 bonus to the reflex save made to parry (this bonus increases to +2 at 10th level, and increase by on every 4 levels after.) So he parrys a tiny bit better. Improved Weapon Finesse : At 10th level, all weapons you have finessed may use the intelligence bonus for damage rolls instead of strength, because they learn that where to hit may be more important than how hard you hit. Okay so a BO needs to have decent Int to use this. Late ability but good possibly. Combat reflexes : At 12th level, Blade Oracles gain Combet reflexes as a bonus feat, if they have already gained this feat, they may also add their intelligence modifier to the number of AoOs they may make in a round. Improved Counterblow : At 14th level, a Blade Oracle may use the counterblow a number of times per round equal to his intelligence modifier + 1, although he is only allowed one attempt per person (ex, if one person attacks with bonuses +13/+8/+3, you may attempt to parry one of them, not all.) Each time still counts as an AoO use that round. Names still needed, and I chose to use intelligence for imp counterblow and imp weapon finesse, because they kind of make sense, and it makes another ability more vital. I made Counterblows count as a use of an AoO in the round, it makes sense. Improved is cool. Make a Table. Example one: Only going up to LV 10 (you can rest yuorself) 1. Counterblow, Weapon Finesse(1 weapon also) 2. 3. Deep Focus 4. Dancing blade 5. Bonus Feat, Weapon Finesse(new one), Deep Focus+1 6. Counterblow Expertise+1, 7. Deep Focus+2 8. Bonus Feat 9. Deep Focus+3 10. Improved Weapon Finesse, Counterblow Expertise+2, Weapon Finesse(another one) Level 2 seems empty.
Encard 02-20-05, 09:03 PM	Hmm... A couple thing comes to mind: - This class has no actual armor restrictions on its abilities... This seems odd considering the flavor given for the class. You might want to make most of their abilities (the Counterblow chain, Dancing Blade, and Improved Weapon Finesse) specifically work only while wearing light or no armor. - There seems to be little point in taking this class past 14th level. Your bonus with Deep Focus increases a bit and you get 2 bonus feats, but I don't think this really stacks up well against, say, using those last 6 levels for Swashbuckler 3/Fighter 2/xxxx 1. The first 14 levels are nice, but not unbelievably awesome. This is particularly true if you do choose to take my advice about armor restrictions on abilities. Some things I'd suggest considering: - Canny Defense similar to what the Duelist, Invisible Blade, and some other PrCs get, letting the character add his Int mod (up to a max of half his class level) to his AC. Possibly this could be accompanied by/replaced with a straight-up AC bonus that increases with level. - The ability to use (Improved) Counterblow against more than one attack from the same enemy, gained at level 20 (or around there). You'd have to be careful not to overpower this sort of thing, of course... Possibilities for that: #Make the max number of counterblows per opponent be Int mod or Int mod - 1 (minimum 1). #Make each successive counterblow against the same opponent take a penalty... Possibly just a simple cumulative -2 penalty or some such (-2 on the second Counterblow against the same opponent, -4 on the third, -6 on the fourth, etc). #Let the character make a choice: either use it against any number of opponents but with a max of 1 Counterblow per opponent, or use it against a single opponent but with no cap besides his number of AoOs per round. Admittedly, I'd not sure whether these are such great ideas or not, but it might be worth looking into something of this nature. *shrug* - Some bonus when fighting defensively. I'd hesitate to just take the Duelist's Elaborate Parry, but maybe just bump up the AC bonus by 3 or something. Hmm... Another possibility would be to give an attack bonus on the round after the character uses total defense. - Can you use Counterblow against ranged attacks? As written, a character with a bow who's attacked at range could make the Ref save and attack return the attack with their bow (since the Counterblow as written only counts as/uses up your AoO for the round, it isn't actually your AoO for the round)... Sounds rather nice for a 1-level dip, especially since there's a decent chance the archer will have a good Ref save even if they don't continue in this class. I'd recommend specifying that the character needs to be wielding a finessable weapon in order to use this ability. Anyway, I hope some of this helps. Frankly, I see 2h weapons as unbalanced the way they are now. With a rapier, I could hit someone about 12 times before they could hit me once with a lumbering greatsword. Actually, that's not true. Large swords were a lot more graceful and quick than their popular portrayal would have people think, and rapiers a lot less so.
AramilWindwalker 02-21-05, 09:37 PM	Thank you Nephlite, You are the first to comment on the Deep focus ability, i wasn't sure if it was good or not, I changed it so their abilities only work while the BO is in light or no armor. I will add a table soon too. Would giving them evasion or uncanny dodge be too much?