Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Kanachi 06-07-06, 08:45 PM	Created by Kanachi and Frasmage Bellow is a now heavily amended verion of a new prestige class. In the post immediately following this one I discuss any additional rules and offer advice on how players may wish to organise the many poisons this class may possess at any one time. All opinions and suggestions are more than welcome!! :) Blight Arrow Sniper Merging precision archery and the fine craft of poison making the Blight Arrow Sniper is able to weaken, capture and ultimately kill their quarry in ways as numerous as the many poisons they have mastered. These specialist archers are often heard of scouting remote and well protected targets for prolonged periods of time with faultless discipline and patience, laying in wait for they best possible opportunity to deliver their deadly craft. Hit Dice: D8 Prerequisites: Any Non-Good Bace attack bonus +3 Either Skirmish (+2d6, +1 AC) or Sneak Attack (+3D6) or Ranger (lvl 5) Hide (8 Ranks) Craft - Poison Making (8 Ranks) or Craft - Alchemy (8 Ranks) Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot Class Skills: A Blight Arrow Snipers class skills are Balance (Dex), Clime (Str), Craft (Poison Making) (Int), Craft (Alchemy) (Int), Craft (Bowmaking) (Int), Disable device (Int, Hide (Dex), Jump (Str), Knowlage (Geography) (Int), Knowlage (Nature) (Int), Knowage (Architecture) (Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Ride (Dex), Search (Int), speak Language (N/A), Spot (Wis), Survival (Wis), Swim (Str), tumble (Dex) and Use Rope (Dex). Skill Points Per Level: 6+Int Modifier. Progression Table: level BAB Fort Ref Will Special 1st +1 +2 +2 +0 Poison Use, Snipers Aim (1 Mark), Snipers Relocation 2nd +2 +3 +3 +0 Potency (+1), Snipers Precision (+1D8) 3rd +3 +3 +3 +1 Camouflage, Master of Poisons 4th +4 +4 +4 +1 Quicken Poison, Snipers Aim (2 Marks) 5th +5 +4 +4 +1 Potency (+2), Snipers Precision (+2D8) 6th +6 +5 +5 +2 Improved Poison Use, Poison Alteration 7th +7 +5 +5 +2 Snipers Aim (3 Marks) 8th +8 +6 +6 +2 Hide in Plain Sight, Snipers Precision (+3D8), Potency (+3) 9th +9 +6 +6 +3 Detect Poison 10th +10 +7 +7 +3 Poison Splicing, Snipers Aim (4 Marks) Class Features Poison Use (Ex): Starting at 1st level a Blight Arrow Sniper may craft and use poisons without fear of poisoning themselves. This includes applying a poison onto a weapon. If the character already has this ability (assassin, page 180 Dungeon Masters Guide) they gain the Improve Poison Use ability (see bellow). Snipers Aim (Ex): Beginning at 1st level a Blight Arrow Sniper may, if hidden, study an opponent within the first range increment of their bow as a 3 round action (18 seconds). After this time the target is considered Marked. When sniping, a sniper gains a bonus to his attack roll equal to his intelligence modifier (+1 minimum). In order to gain this bonus in subsequent rounds the sniper must move at least 10 feet after the sniping attack and perform a successfully hide check (see the snipers relocation class feature listed bellow). A Blight Arrow Sniper gains the ability to Mark 2 targets simultaneously at 4th level and an additional target every 3 levels there after (3 at 7th level and 4 at 10th). Selecting multiple marks does not stack the time which it takes to successfully mark a target (thus it never exceeds a 3 round action). A Snipers Mark may be removed from a target at any time but it will require a 3 round action before the mark can successfully move onto a new target. A snipers Mark lasts for 8 hours after which time a target must be marked again if the sniper wishes to keep the target as their mark. If a target leaves the snipers sight for over 1 hour the sniper will also loose his mark upon the target. A Blight Arrow Sniper's mark is far removed from any other method of marking and therefor does not stack witho those of any other class that uses marks (such as the Bloodhound) The Sniper looses this ability when wearing medium or heavy armour or when carrying a medium or heavy load. Snipers Relocation (Ex): Starting at 1st level a Blight Arrow Sniper gains the ability to covertly relocate from one possible sniping position to another. To use this ability, you must declare your intention to launch a sniping attack (players hand book page 76). After (and only after) the attack you may make a single move action and take your hide check in your new location. If successfully it will be possible to make another sniping attack next round where upon the process may be repeated until you are successfully spotted. The Sniper looses this ability when wearing medium or heavy armour or when carrying a medium or heavy load. Potency (Ex): A Sniper of 2nd level or higher has learned to greatly improve the potency of their poisons and thus all who try to resist their effects must do so at +1 DC. This effect increases to +2 at 5th level and +3 at 8th Level. Potency only effects poison crafted by the Sniper. Snipers Precision (EX): Starting at 2nd level a Sniper may make a single precisely aimed attack against his mark (and only his mark) with a ranged weapon as a standard action, if the attack hits successfully it deals 1D8 points of additional damage. When making such an attack the Sniper must be within 60 feet of his target. A snipers precision attack is only effective against living creatures with discernable anatomies. A creature that is immune to critical hits (such as oozes, undead and constructs) is also immune to the additional damage caused by a Snipers precision attack. Unlike with a rouge’s sneak attack a Sniper’s target does not have to be flat footed or denied its dexterity bonus in order for a snipers precision attack to have effect. However if the target is denied its dexterity bonus this damage may stack with that of a sneak attack, but only if the sneak attack is also within range. Treat a snipers precision attack as a sneak attack in all other ways. Snipers Precision stacks with the Snipers Aim ability as long as both abilities circumstantial criteria are met. The Snipers bonus to damage increases to 2D8 at 5th level and 3D8 at 8th level. The Sniper looses this ability when wearing medium or heavy armour or when carrying a medium or heavy load. Camouflage (Ex): At 3rd level or higher a Blight Arrow Sniper may use the hide skill in any sort of natural terrain (see page 48 of the player’s handbook). The Sniper looses this ability when wearing medium or heavy armour or when carrying a medium or heavy load. Master of Poisons (Ex): At 3rd Level or higher, a Sniper gains a +1 competency bonus to all Craft (Poison Making) and Craft (Alchemy) checks when constructing poisons for each level of Blight Arrow Sniper (thus at 3rd level the bonus is +3, at 4th level +4 and so forth). A Blight Arrow Sniper only gains this bonus when crafting poisons or anti-toxins, ultimately your DM will decide if a master of poisons bonus is applicable to situations beyond poison or anti-toxin construction. Quicken Poison (Ex): Upon attaining 4th level a Bight Arrow Snipers poisons can be made to function far more rapidly. When crafting a poison the sniper may accept a +10 DC to his check in order to reduce the delay between a poisons initial and secondary damage to 1+D3 rounds. Improved Poison Use (Ex): Beginning at 6th level a Sniper may apply poison to a weapon as a move action rather than a standard action (see page 9 of the complete adventurer). Poison Alteration (Ex): At 6th level and beyond the Sniper may attempt a Craft (Poison Making) or Craft (Alchemy) check in an attempt to construct a poison with a differing method of delivery (such as ingested, injury or contact). The tasks DC is equal to the poisons standard craft DC + an additional modifier for the desired delivery method (+1 for ingestion, +4 for injury, +10 for contact and +20 for inhaled). Poison Alteration requires 2 hours of uninterrupted work. The Sniper must also use or have access to an alchemists lab throughout this period. Failure to construct an Alteration Poison always results in the materials used during the attempt to be destroyed. Hide in Plain Sight (Ex): Beginning at 8th level a Blight Arrow Sniper may use the hide skill in natural terrain even while being observed (see page 48 of the player’s handbook). Detect poison (Ex): At level 9 the sniper is always aware of any successfully spotted substance, material, object or odder that’s poisonous. When triggered the sniper must succeed in making a DC 20 spot check on any visible surface, material or odder that’s poisonous or venomous, if successful the poison can be identified. Some poisons are so unique in either their delivery or manufacture that it’s impossible for the sniper to have knowledge of them, in such cases no spot check may be possible, other situation may require a check of higher difficulty (should the poison be unusual, totally unexpected or delivered via some exotic means). Detect poison may inform a Blight Arrow Sniper of any poisons or venoms a creature may poses. Detect poisons cant however detect creatures that are hidden only the fact that something poisonous is located in that location. Once spotted a Blight Arrow Sniper may attempt to keep up their detection of a poisonous creature in situations where it would not normaly be posible. A creatures invisability or concealment will not descise the fact they are poisonous. An Arrow Blight Sniper will always know the manufacture of any poison or venom they have fallen victim to or at the very least they will be aware that they are indeed effected. Diseases and similar inflictions are not necessarily regarded as poisons and the DM will have to adjudicate if it’s possible for the sniper to be aware of them. Poison Splicing (Ex): Upon reaching 10th level a sniper may attempt to merge two poisons sharing the same delivery method together on a successful Craft (Poison Making) or Craft (Alchemy) check with a DC equal to both poisons craft DCs combined. Two poisons with differing delivery methods may not be spliced together. Alteration poisons (see above) that have changes to one or both the poisons delivery methods (thus making two poisons of normally differing delivery types the same) may indeed be spliced together. The effects of poison splicing basically result in the swapping of secondary effects between the two chosen poisons to concoct 2 new unique blends of poision. The DC to resist each of the newly crafted poisons is always equal to the DC of the poison used to form its Initial damage plus any potency bonuses the sniper may have (poisons already benifiting from the potency ability do not gain a second bonus as a result of splicing). The Market Price of each poison is equal to both poisons Prices added together and divided by 2. It is very unlikely that any of these rare poisons would be on sale at any conventional (if such things exist) poison store. In the example bellow Lidda successfully manages to splice the Black Adder Venom and Blue Whinnis poisons together, and thus constructs both Poison A and B (Bellow) Poison A: Blue Adder Venom Initial Damage: 1 Con Secondary Damage: 1D6 Con DC to Resist: 14 + Potency Bonus Price: 120gp Poison B: Black Whinnis Initial Damage: 1D6 Con Secondary Damage: Unconsciousness DC to Resist: 12 + Potency Bonus Price: 120gp The Process of Splicing two poisons together takes 2 hours of uninterrupted work. The Sniper must also use or have access to an alchemist’s lab throughout this period. Failure to spice two poisons together by more that 5 always results in irreparable damage to both poisons, otherwise both poisons remain undamaged but must be left to settle for a full day before they can be used or another attempt can be made to splice them together. A spliced poison may in turn be spliced again however a +5 penalty is added to the craft DC check on each occation.
Kanachi 06-07-06, 08:46 PM	Additional Rules New Equipment Listed here are any new items which you may wish to include in your adventure that are specifically invented for use by the Blight Arrow Sniper some however may interest characters of other classes. Poison Crafters Lab This set of equipment includes many of the necessities required to mix, blend and brew poisons. Unlike an Alchemist’s lab a Poison Crafters Lab can only be used on Craft (Poison Making) checks or on Craft (Alchemy) checks when constructing either poisons or antitoxins. The lab offers a +2 circumstance bonus to both these checks yet this bonus will not stack with that provided by Alchemist’s Lab. A Poison Crafters Lab may be used by a Blight Arrow Sniper to splice and alter their poisons while also offering a +2 circumstance bonusas though they were using a full alchamist's lab. Cost: 350gp Weight: 25 lb New Poisons The table bellow details the function of several new poisons which you may wish to use within your adventures. A separate post specificly aimed at addressing these new poisons can be found here. (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=9503358#post9503358) NAME TYPE RESIST CRAFT INITIAL SECONDARY PRICE DC DC DAMAGE DAMAGE Flesh Boil Contact 17 20 1d6 hp + 2d6 hp + 585gp Paste 1d6 Cha 1d4 Cha Stumble Root Contact 24 25 Sickened (1d4 Unconsciousness 2,310gp Oil hours) Truth Powder Ingested 26 20 Nauseated (1d4 Tell Truth (1 hour) 870gp rounds) Terror Dust Inhaled 14 20 Cowering (1d4 - 1,000gp rounds) Gut Sunder Inhaled 15 20 Sickened (1d4 - 700gp Fumes rounds) Eye Rot Inhaled 16 20 Dazed (1 round) Blinded (1 hour) 1,400gp Kalivara Injury 12 15 Blinded (1 hour) - 120gp Root Fire Blood Injury 16 20 2d12 hp 3d12 hp 580gp Shadow Ink Injury 18 20 Dazed (1 round) Sickened (1d4 260gp Venom rounds) Fumble Ear Injury 18 20 1d4 Wis Deafened (1 hour) 300gp Magefoil Injury 18 20 +50% arcane 1d6 Int 420gp spell failure Lie Blight Injury 22 20 Nauseated (1d4 Tell Truth (1 hour) 1,340gp rounds) Nightmare Injury 23 20 - Blinded (1 hour) 1,500gp Poison + Deafened (1 hour) + Cowering (1d4 rounds) Dormant Toxins Dormant toxins are created from the mergence of two separate and otherwise harmless components. A knowledgeable student in the art of poison making may attempt to unlock the hidden potency of these components and from them brew a potentially lethal dose of poison. Searching For Components If the poison crafter has 8 or more ranks in Craft [Poison Making] or Craft [Alchemy] they may they may search for dormant poison components. These components are only found in specific environments upon a successful Survival skill check of DC 20 within the relevant terrain type. In certain locations (such as a craven of mainly molten rock) the dungeon master may rule it impossible to perform such a search. Players with 5 or more ranks in the skills listed bellow gain a +2 competency bonus to this check. SKILL BONUS WHEN IN LOCATION Knowledge [Geology] Plains, Mountains Knowledge [Nature] Forests, Mashes Knowledge [Dungeonearing] Underground In addition should a Character have 3 or more levels in the Ranger, Druid, Scout or some other nature related prestige class they gain a +2 competency bonus. This is bonus does not increase if a character has 3 or more levels in multiple nature classes. Construction of a Dormant Toxin Only a poison crafter with 8 or more ranks in Craft [Poison Making] or Craft [Alchemy] can attempt to construct a dormant toxin. The character must also have 2 hours of uninterrupted time with access to an alchemy lab (or poison makers lab). Components listed on the table bellow firstly have both their craft DCs added together which the character must successfully pass in order to construct 1 dose of poison. Should this Craft [Alchemy] or Craft [Poison Making] check be failed by over 5 both prospective components are destroyed. All dormant toxins are crafted as injury poisons but may also be crafted with differing delivery methods if the following modifiers are applied to the craft DC. DELIVERY DC MARKET VALUE METHOD MODIFIER MODIFIER Ingest -5 -20gp Contact +5 Total x 2gp Inhaled +10 Total x 3gp Once successfully crafted the character may chose which of the two components take the primary or secondary damage positions within the newly crafted poison. Should the crafter wish to use a component that has a price listed under the ‘Cost if Initial’ column as an initial component within their poison they will have to purchase the necessary supplies (available in any basic alchemy stall) equal to that value before compleation of the poison is possible. Some components, such as Geddin Seeds, can be applied to a dormant toxin in greater quantity which will increase the potency of the poison. Buying and Selling Dormant Toxins and Components. The components used to craft a dormant toxin are rarely found in settlement though may occasionally catch a fortunate poison makers eye. These components may be purchased individually for a 10th of the market value listed bellow (as if it were being used as an initial component). These components may also be sold by players to vendors with ease for a 20th of the market value given bellow (also as if it were being used as an initial component). If finding a vendor willing to sell poisons is rare then finding one selling a dormant toxin is highly unlikely, however it is not entirely impossible. To calculate the market values of dormant toxins add the listed values of the initial and secondary components (as see in the table bellow) together. Players selling dormant toxins do so at a quarter of the poisons total market value. Table of Dormant Toxin Components MARKET PRICE NAME QUANTITY DAMAGE CRAFT DC RESIST DC WHERE FOUND COST INITIAL/SECONDARY Geddin 1 1 Str 6 6 Underground 0gp +80gp/+60gp seeds 2 1d4 Str 8 7 - 50gp +160gp/+120gp 3 1d6 Str 10 8 - 100gp +240gp/+180gp 4 2d6 Str 14 10 - 200gp +780gp/+640gp Crown Of 1 1 Dex 7 6 Mountain 0gp +100gp/+80gp Mirridon (Flower) 2 1d4 Dex 9 7 - 50gp +200gp/+160gp 3 1d6 Dex 11 8 - 100gp +300gp/+240gp 4 2d6 Dex 15 10 - 200gp +920gp/+780gp Dukes 1 1 Con 7 6 Forest 0gp +100gp/+80gp Crest Root 2 1d4 Con 9 7 - 50gp +200gp/+160gp 3 1d6 Con 11 8 - 100gp +300gp/+240gp 4 2d6 Con 15 10 - 200gp +920gp/+780gp Yaba-Yada 1 1 Int 6 6 Marshes 0gp +80gp/+60gp Oil 2 1d4 Int 8 7 - 50gp +160gp/+120gp 3 1d6 Int 10 8 - 100gp +240gp/+180gp 4 2d6 Int 14 10 - 200gp +780gp/+640gp Ikoshinda 1 1 Wis 6 6 Forest 0gp +80gp/+60gp (Fruit) 2 1d4 Wis 8 7 - 50gp +160gp/+120gp 3 1d6 Wis 10 8 - 100gp +240gp/+180gp 4 2d6 Wis 14 10 - 200gp +780gp/+640gp Gudd Weed 1 1 Cha 6 6 Plains 0gp +70gp/+60gp 2 1d4 Cha 7 7 - 50gp +140gp/+120gp 3 1d6 Cha 8 8 - 100gp +210gp/+180gp 4 2d6 Cha 10 10 - 200gp +710gp/+640gp Dagger Moth 1 1d6 Hp 6 6 Underground 50gp +100gp/+70gp Chrysalis 2 1d12 Hp 7 7 - 100gp +200gp/+140gp 3 2d12 Hp 8 8 - 200gp +360gp/+240gp Stradin 1 None 6 12 Plains 0gp +420gp/+700gp Weed Dalla Spawn 1 Dazed 6 7 Marsh 0gp +120gp/+100gp Goldglade 1 Blinded 10 8 Plains 100gp +280gp/+200gp (Flower) Quinells 1 Deafened 8 7 Underground 50gp +200gp/+140gp Moss Moi-Moi 1 Nauseated 8 6 Marsh 0gp +80gp/+60gp Spores Riggran 1 Cowering 9 8 Forest 50gp +240gp/+180gp Juice Kurn Leaf 1 Sickened 7 7 Forest 0gp +120gp/+100gp Wode Root 1 Unconscious 10 8 Mountain 100gp +320gp/+220gp Carbid 1 Paralysis 9 7 Plains 100gp +280gp/+180gp Weed New Skills Listed here are any new skills that may be of use to the Blight Arrow Sniper, some may also be of use to members of other classes. Delay Poison A delay poison acts far more slowly than a normal poison, its often useful for assassins who desire a chance to deliver their craft upon a target and still have time to vanish from the scene before a poisons effects become obvious. A delay poison takes 2 hours of uninterrupted work to craft and requires access to an alchemist (or poison makers) lab. If successfully crafted a delayed poison may have a time increment of up to 8 hours between its different damages come into play. All saves made against the poison are however made at +1 per hour of delay. A delayed poison is extremely hard to detect and healers and victims will have to succeed on a DC30 heal check before they can identify the actual cause of the illness/damage. Keeping Track of Poisons. As a Blight Arrow Sniper formulates new poisons through the use of their poison splicing and poison alteration abilities it becomes imperative for the player to keep record of which poisons are effected and any bonuses to resistance DC they may have. It will likely prove necessary for a Sniper to keep track of their poisons (and their effects) on a separate list from their normal equipment. Bellow is one method of keeping track of your poisons list. Keeping Track of... Potency A poison’s with a particular bonus to potency should have it listed to save confusion. Simply adding the (DC +2 = result) symbol after the poisons name should prove more than adequate in this regard. It’s also important to remember that a poison retains its potency from the time it was constructed so any upgrade in the snipers potency ability will only affect poisons crafted after that time. If Lidda crafts some Oil of Taggit with her +3 potency bonus it could be recorded as: [INDENT]Oil of Taggit (DC +3 = 18). Keeping Track of... Quickened Poisons When a quickened poison is crafted it is important to keep track of this feature upon the poison. This can be done simply by applying the (Quickened) statement after the poisons name. So for example if Lidda crafts some Lich Dust and tries to empower it with the quickened quality it could be recorded as: Lich Dust (DC + 3 = 20, Quickened) Keeping Track of... Poison Alteration Standard poisons that have had their delivery methods altered should always have these amendments listed. This can be done simply by applying (Delivery = Injury) after their name. If Lidda where to use her poison alteration upon a Burnt Othur Fumes poison and successfully craft it as a Contact poison it could be recorded as so: Burnt Othur Fumes (DC +3 = 21, Delivery = Contact) Keeping Track of... Poison Splicing Spiced poisons should always be named and have their new effects listed. The naming of the poison may be as simple as merging the two poisons titles together. So for example a mergence of Oil of Taggit and Lich Dust may be named as Lich Oil and Taggit Dust. The naming of poisons however is largely a matter of personal preference. Spliced poisons should have their full effects listed bellow their name to help keep track of their mechanics. So if the above spliced poisons were crafted by Lidda they could be documented as so: Lich Oil Price: 145gp Type: Ingested DC to Resist: 17 (+3 = 20) Initial Damage: 2D6 Str Secondary Damage: Unconsciousness And Taggit Dust Price: 145gp Type: Ingested DC to Resist: 15 (+3 = 18) Initial Damage: 0 Secondary Damage: 1D6 Str Food for a Dungeon Masters Thoughts. As a Dungeon Master you may choose to punish players who don’t correctly label or keep track of their poisons, perhaps they might mistakenly apply the wrong poison to their weapon. This could also be a plausible role-playing habit for the less intelligent or wise Sniper. Similarly a clear and concise poison list or an ingenious use of symbols to denote differing poisons and their effects may also play into the hands of the Sniper, perhaps such use of symbols allows them to clear their wares through guarded check points far more clearly than obvious “POISON” labels. Such decisions are ultimately yours to make and are by no means necessary or required.
frasmage 06-07-06, 10:10 PM	I just have t say, really, really cool class. Great idea :D I just feel you gave it too much. Look, it has full BAB, two good saves, and endless class abilities. Though I will grant that the vast majority of the abilities are fitting, there are just far too many. Here is my opinion on what you should keep and what to change camouflage: Ok, fitting for a sniper poison use: definitely snipers aim: good idea, this bonus to attack is good Master of Poisons: though fitting, this can go Potency: This is a massive bonus. It would increase the DC too much, too fast. I would suggest spreading this out over the class, not just all at once Snipers Precision: Hmm, sounds like order of the bow initiate. This is decent, but not as necessary. If nothing I would say this can only be applied to marks Poison Fortitude: Taking after the assassin, eh? Not quite necessary Snipers Relocation: I don't know what to think of this one. No comment either way for now Poison Sense: Not necessary in my opinion. sense poison within 5' maybe, but that is still weird. the rest are all available through other means: antitoxin already exists, easy craft alchemy check and +5 save. The inform thing is not that great, just aid another. Plus heal can be used to ID a poison. Poison Splicing: Nice idea, but a bit more powerful than you are giving it credit for, maybe raise the level. Please specify you may not splice two of the same poison (double black lotus - ouchie) Piece the Foliage: I think you mean PIERCE the foliage. Not necessary, just take imp precise strike, which you can get by that level. Improved Poison Use: Of course Poison Alteration: This is cool, but the only thing anyone will make is touch poison, its the best one by far. Maybe change the DC increase depending on what form it is changing to (+1 swallowed, +4 wound, +7 inhaled, +10 touch) . Snipers Patience: A bit weird. Simplify to does not need to sleep. will not unbalance. This can be put to a lower level. Hide in Plain Sight: Ok, its at a high enough level to be acceptible Extend Poison: Ok, I guess. But make this your 10th level ability Blindsight: No need, this is one of those "just too much" ones. SO, try putting the changes I said. It should balance a little. I will look over it again and help you come to full balance :)
Ziggaraut 06-07-06, 10:17 PM	How much Sneak Attack? The way this one looks, you can get the prerequisites at level 2! Fix that, and fix the sblocks, they aren't working.
Reversefigure4 06-07-06, 11:01 PM	Can't read the spoiler blocks either, so I won't comment too much on the class. Still, the prereqs are ridiculously low. 1 level of Rogue, one level a martial class, and you're onto a PrC by 3rd level! (or alternatively, 3 levels of Rogue and take Weapon Prof: Longbow as a feat). For a PrC with a good hit dice, full BAB (apparently, can't read it), and EIGHT skill points a level... ouch.
DarkRhystar 06-07-06, 11:23 PM	Wow. Way too powerful. This guy = Bloodhound + Order of the Bow Initiate + "I make poison" + High level Ranger with high HP, BAB, two major saves, and 8 skills per level. This guy is easily the most powerful archer prestige class I've ever seen. There is enough material to make 3 different classes (the OotBI, Poison Crafter of some sort, Ranged Bloodhound). The only archer prestige class that comes even close to this thing's power is the Deepwood Sniper of 3.0... but I think this one even beats that. Suggestions Drop the Skills to 4 + Int modifier Drop the Ranged (Sniper) Precision Cap the intelligence bonus to AB at the Sniper's character level Sniper's Patience just doesn't feel right, I can just see the guy dying of dehydration Drop Blindsight Even at this, it still feels like this class is trying to do way way more than it should be.
Kanachi 06-07-06, 11:59 PM	Hiya Frasmage!! Thank you so much for the reply... I was starting to think no one would reply or be interested in a class like this (which struck me as strange because even if my rules are a little soggy I think its a good concept). anyway to answer some of your questions... Potency: This is a massive bonus. It would increase the DC too much, too fast. I would suggest spreading this out over the class, not just all at once I agree... I shall try spreading it out.. at the moment I’m making the bonus +1 at 2nd level, +2 at 5th level and +3 at 8th level. I think this also makes the class have a far greater sense of progression. Good Point! Snipers Precision: Hmm, sounds like order of the bow initiate. This is decent, but not as necessary. If nothing I would say this can only be applied to marks Yup! it is very similar to the order of the bow ability... this however has a range of 60 feet rather than 30 (much more fitting for a sniper). To answer the main point of your question I did intend the rules to make clear that this ability could indeed only be used on the snipers mark... perhaps I should re-phase it to make this clearer? Poison Fortitude: Taking after the assassin, eh? Not quite necessary I Agree with this also the fortitude save increases at a good enough rate to make this pointless. Snipers Relocation: I don't know what to think of this one. No comment either way for now Just so you know this is basic a slightly improved version of 1/3rd of the woodland archer feat found in races of the wild. So I don’t really believe it to be to over powering. Poison Sense: Not necessary in my opinion. sense poison within 5' maybe, but that is still weird. the rest are all available through other means: antitoxin already exists, easy craft alchemy check and +5 save. The inform thing is not that great, just aid another. Plus heal can be used to ID a poison. Once again I agree. Though I do think its important to the class that he has enough knowledge concerning poisons to know when one is present, therefore I’ve replaced this with a Detect Poison ability at level 9 that basically allows the player to make a DC 20 spot check on an visible surface, material or odder that’s poisonous or venomous. If successful the poison can be identified, though in unique circumstances the DM may rule that the poison is so unique or well crafted that high level DC checks are required. Even if He can’t identify the poison the sniper will always know a substance is dangerous. This ability also puts something in the otherwise blank 9th level. Poison Splicing: Nice idea, but a bit more powerful than you are giving it credit for, maybe raise the level. Please specify you may not splice two of the same poison (double black lotus - ouchie) This is probably my favourite ability in the class. I want to make clear though that basically all this lets you do is take two poisons and switch their secondary effects with one another... therefore taking two identical poisons would be pointless as you would merely great the exact same poisons again. Considering the chance of failure and the cost of producing or making the poisons in the first place I don’t really think it’s overpowered. Piece the Foliage: I think you mean PIERCE the foliage. Not necessary, just take imp precise strike, which you can get by that level. Once more I agree :) so I’ve removed this feature from the list. Poison Alteration: This is cool, but the only thing anyone will make is touch poison, its the best one by far. Maybe change the DC increase depending on what form it is changing to (+1 swallowed, +4 wound, +7 inhaled, +10 touch) . Your 100% right and I also owe you a BIG thank you for your suggestion here... with your permission I’d like to implement this exact mechanic into the rules as I think it fit perfectly. Snipers Patience: A bit weird. Simplify to does not need to sleep. will not unbalance. This can be put to a lower level. To be honest with you I really struggled with this feature, it’s something I would love to see in the class though. Basically I think its important to note that any sniper is capable of tremendous feats of concentration and there for may forego sleep for far longer than a human would in other circumstances... In DnD I can’t find exact rulings on what happens to party members if they keep watch over an area for an extended period of time, surely there would be some form of detriment to the average party members concentration and awareness? At any rate I want to make clear that the sniper would be immune to this detrimental effect for a greater period of time. Any Ideas or suggestions on this matter would be greatly appreciated!! For now though I’ve removed this feature from this list. Extend Poison: Ok, I guess. But make this your 10th level ability Done! Blindsight: No need, this is one of those "just too much" ones. Hmmm I don’t know really why I stuck this in, what I was actually intending to put in was the See Invisibility feature that the Bloodhound gains at 6th level to see his mark even if they attempt to become invisible. Must have been some random oversight on my part.. Once again thank you so much for reading though the class I will post an amended version of the class taking into consideration all these changes ASAP!!
Kanachi 06-08-06, 12:37 AM	How much Sneak Attack? The way this one looks, you can get the prerequisites at level 2! Fix that, and fix the sblocks, they aren't working. Good Point!! lol, i've changed this so that a rouge or scout would only be able to get their first level in the class at upon reaching 6th level.
Kanachi 06-08-06, 12:38 AM	I have adjusted the mechanics of the class from this pojtn on acording to the aulterations i listed above
frasmage 06-08-06, 07:57 AM	1. Your stats blocks are not working. Maybe its just the comp I'm currently on, but I think not. 2. Reduce the study time for marking. Look, an assassin who gets an instant kill only has to study for three rounds. 10min - 100 rounds is far too long. I would word the bonus this way - when sniping, a sniper gains a bonus on his or her attaack roll against a mark equal to her class level, up to a maximum of her intelligence modifier. 3. Raise camouflage to 3rd level, no other class combo can get it before 8th (I may be wrong, but thats what i think) 4. Raise the skill prereqs to 8 ranks (what you would have by fifth level) 5. I don't think scout really fits this description. They are based on movement, not slowly taking aim. I guess what I am saying id we don't really need to allow the skirmish prereq option. 6.Make master of poisons (I see you kept it) +1 on the check per class level. 7. potentcy needs to be reworded, as it stands it looks like the sniper gains the save. I would say: the save DC against any poisons crafted by the blight-arrow sniper are increased... (so on) 8. for the splicing, I think it should specify that the first/secondary effects only trigger if they are applied to the target in a way that would normally allow the orginal poison to work. What I mean is having part inhaled posion, part injury poison should not really work well together, one would not work in the method of injection. However if you had a touch poison and an injury poison they would both apply to an arrow wound (for example). 9. How would we handle an extended spliced poison? edit: 10. decrease HD by one step. This is a rogue progression. Even assassin, who gets slightly less stuff from the class has d6 HD
Jaeron Dalur 06-08-06, 02:00 PM	I like this class. Other than just to throw my support in I don't have much to say. About the sblocks: In my experience, every sblock problem can be traced to an improperly closed tag (almost always not an sblock tag).
Kanachi 06-08-06, 03:09 PM	I like this class. Other than just to throw my support in I don't have much to say. About the sblocks: In my experience, every sblock problem can be traced to an improperly closed tag (almost always not an sblock tag). I'm really pleased that people do like this class, it was inspired by playing ElderScrolls: Oblivion (a PC and Xbox 360 game where players can play a class very similar to this). Thankyou for your suport! :D
DarkRhystar 06-08-06, 04:00 PM	Ack. Post ninja-ed. Read up. Hey Fras, check out the Bloodhound of the Complete Adventurer. Marking is a 10 minute activity... although the bloodhound only gets skill bonuses IIRC.
Kanachi 06-08-06, 04:01 PM	Thanks once again for your ideas Frasmage, your a massive help!! some responses to the tings you said... 1. Your stats blocks are not working. Maybe its just the comp I'm currently on, but I think not. they were working fine for me.. hmm but i'm a noob.. anyway i removed the blocks and just put them inside CODE lines.. i hope this helps 2. Reduce the study time for marking. Look, an assassin who gets an instant kill only has to study for three rounds. 10min - 100 rounds is far too long. I would word the bonus this way - when sniping, a sniper gains a bonus on his or her attaack roll against a mark equal to her class level, up to a maximum of her intelligence modifier. Very much agreed on the reduction of the time to mark... I think a full round action is actually ok in retrospect, as the bonus though useful is hardly going to bring down a fleet of dragons. hehe I don’t really agree with the idea of allowing the bonus against target of only the same level or lower as i believe snipers often target those who may be far beyond their own means in differing combat situations... this however is open for debate. 3. Raise camouflage to 3rd level, no other class combo can get it before 8th (I may be wrong, but thats what i think) Done! and agreed 4. Raise the skill prereqs to 8 ranks (what you would have by fifth level) Done! and agreed once again 5. I don't think scout really fits this description. They are based on movement, not slowly taking aim. I guess what I am saying id we don't really need to allow the skirmish prereq option. Actually i kinda disagree here.. for me a sniper and a scout are very similar, both move ahead of the main unit and both in essence scout the enemy either for strength, numbers or strategy. I do however agree that the class as it looked did not meld very well with this ethos, there fore i believe the reduced time required to mark in conjunction with the need for the sniper to relocate after each shot in order to gain his snipers aim bonus makes this a far stronger scout orientated class. 6.Make master of poisons (I see you kept it) +1 on the check per class level. Done! though i have limited the bonus to circumstances where poisons or anti-toxins are being made, otherwise it could be easily abused for other means that are obviously not fitting. 7. potentcy needs to be reworded, as it stands it looks like the sniper gains the save. I would say: the save DC against any poisons crafted by the blight-arrow sniper are increased... (so on) I've re-worded this feature once again, hopefully it will make the bonus clearer. I believe however that we both (at least) understand what i'm getting at. lol 8. for the splicing, I think it should specify that the first/secondary effects only trigger if they are applied to the target in a way that would normally allow the original poison to work. What I mean is having part inhaled poison, part injury poison should not really work well together, one would not work in the method of injection. However if you had a touch poison and an injury poison they would both apply to an arrow wound (for example). Actually that’s kind of what i had written, though my wording may not have made it clear. I have however gone a step further and only allowed the sniper to splice two poisons that share an identical delivery method. If someone really wants to spice two poisons with differing delivery methods they will first have to use the poison alteration feature gained latter in the class... that is after all what poison alteration is for. 9. How would we handle an extended spliced poison? A great question.. I've tried to re-word the description to give a better explanation of how i believe this should function. Basically when a sniper wishes to splice an extended poison he may do so, but only with another extended poison. The result is that the secondary effects of the two poisons switch places (as normal) and the sniper may choose which of the 2 newly formed poisons gains the 2 remaining tertiary effects.... Its really hard to word correctly. lol but i hope that makes sense of how i see it. If you have a better way of wording this or a better idea of how it should function i would love to hear it. edit: 10. decrease HD by one step. This is a rogue progression. Even assassin, who gets slightly less stuff from the class has d6 HD To be honest the class is actually based on the scout class and not the rogue, therefore i think the D8 is appropriate here. This is open to debate however, though i'm loathed to change it. Hope all this helps! and thanks once again!
Kanachi 06-08-06, 04:07 PM	Ack. Post ninja-ed. Read up. I think this class is very different to the ninja.. sure they both use poisons, but you wont see this guy turning invisable or dashing in and out of melee combat this is a ranged skirmish build with poison use abilities effectivly.
frasmage 06-08-06, 04:38 PM	a full-round to mark is too low. I would say maybe three rounds, like death attack requires. And rhystar, a bloodhound can study anything of the mark (clothes, picture, etc.), they don't have to be actively looking at the target to mark them. Also bloddhounds gain the ability to pinpoint a mark and the marked status stays for a while. As for BAS (mind if I abbreviate the clas name?), they only gain a bonus to attack and damage, but only as long as no one notices. If spotted, the bonuses vanish. And I think my last post was misleading in one aspect -> about the att bonus vs. a mark, I meant that your bonus is your int, but cannot be greater than your BAS class level, not that you can only snipe lower level foes. Sorry if that was misworded before And as for splicing, it should still work if you mix a touch and an injury, as an injury still requires the weapon touching the foe. don't need to do this, it would be more complicated. PS: I think what he meant by ack ninja, is that you said poison use as a ninja. If anything you should reference the assassin, as that is freely available information (SRD)
DarkRhystar 06-08-06, 05:02 PM	It's an old term from another board. :) This occurs when two or more posters post at the same time or when one or more posters post while another is working on a reply to an earlier post resulting in one or more posts being ignored or redundant. Fras, you're partially wrong (and partially right). Mark (Ex): A bloodhound can target, or mark, an individual humanoid or monstrous humanoid foe to better hunt that enemy. To do so, the bloodhound must focus on a foe who is present and visible, or on the depiction or description of one who is not, for 10 minutes. I think this part of the description should be included in the archer's Mark ability. I already mentioned the class stuff, but I'll requote my post for clarity. Wow. Way too powerful. This guy = Bloodhound + Order of the Bow Initiate + "I make poison" + High level Ranger with high HP, BAB, two major saves, and 8 skills per level. This guy is easily the most powerful archer prestige class I've ever seen. There is enough material to make 3 different classes (the OotBI, Poison Crafter of some sort, Ranged Bloodhound). The only archer prestige class that comes even close to this thing's power is the Deepwood Sniper of 3.0... but I think this one even beats that. Suggestions Drop the Skills to 4 + Int modifier Drop the Ranged (Sniper) Precision Cap the intelligence bonus to AB at the Sniper's character level Sniper's Patience just doesn't feel right, I can just see the guy dying of dehydration Drop Blindsight Even at this, it still feels like this class is trying to do way way more than it should be.
Kanachi 06-08-06, 05:16 PM	your probably right about the 3 rounds thing. The issue becomes the power of the abilitys. Sniping and remaining hidden requires quite some luck + a very good hide skill (sniping is a -20 penalty after all) so the chances of you remaining hidden for longer than a few rounds against anything with half a brain is quite low. Dont want to nerf the class to hell. death strike in comparison is a far more potent ability Anyway, i do agree to a point and have thus changed it to 3 rounds to aquire a new mark for now. Additionally i've taken away the ability for an ABS's mark to stack with other forms of mark, it didn't feal nessisary. I've also referanced the assasin rather than the ninja. Sorry for miss understanding that one. Oh, nice abreviation by the way! :)
Kanachi 06-08-06, 05:18 PM	DarkRhystar: its been nerfed alot since then dude...
Kanachi 06-08-06, 07:04 PM	I think this part of the description should be included in the archer's Mark ability. I've tried to take steps to seperate this mark from a blood hounds mark. So the two dont really share any similarities any more. To be honist i use the word mark fr want of a better word (plus i also think there was some mark ability in WoW that i played that was mildly similar to this). The Mark basicly is a way of limiting the bonuses (to hit chance and later to damage) the ABS is capable of. For this reason the snipers additional damage cant be considered as a rival to the Order of the Bow precision damage which effects all those it targets, even at 10th level you can only use this on 4 marks (thats asuming you have even had time to mark them!). I've allso reduced the class's skill points as well as removed or limited a whole load of the class features. I hope some of these amendments make the class more viable. My intention was never to make a powergaming class, i just wanted to forfill what i think could be a really interesting class to play as best as possible. Thankyou loads for your advice though, i've tried were possible to do what i could.
frasmage 06-08-06, 08:52 PM	AH, RUN, its the Xmas colored board! :uh-huh: Anyways, looking pretty god for the rest of the class. 1. Please avoid using slang :P, just a few spots. and I might suggest tossing through a spell-checker 2. I was wondering, should we limit the daily uses of marking? A bloodhound does, but the assassin doesn't. Somethig to consider, but my vote is to leave as is
Kanachi 06-08-06, 11:25 PM	Thanks Frasmage, i'm glad you approve :) i was wondering as you have contributed so much to this class would you like to be credited as co-creator to it? Depending on if its the kind of thing you would want to put your name to, lol! Let me know anyway, and thankyou for all your help ironing the hell out all the bugs of this one.
frasmage 06-09-06, 07:21 AM	Of course, I'd love to be honored I guess its easiest to just say created by kanachi and frasmage we did well, the class looks good!
Kanachi 06-09-06, 10:58 PM	Cool added you as a co-creator of the class.. I've also added a section for advising players how to keep track of their poisons and a new item of equipment, opinions are more than welcome :) I'm glad you like the class, think we are on a winner here :D thank you!!
frasmage 06-10-06, 11:15 AM	Thats a really good idea, the siplification text. BTW, would you mind changing the xmas colored chart to maybe balck and green or yellow green and green. It really doesn't matter, ut it kinda bugs me :rolleyes: Other than that, i'd say its done And Kanachi, you can put the class in your sig
Kanachi 06-10-06, 07:58 PM	Done and Done! :) Also if anyone else has oppinions about the class i would love to hear from you :D I hope this proves of use to people!!
belthazzar1113 06-11-06, 04:44 AM	a poison arrow specilist isn't a bad idea. but there are two things the class is missing. first a price break crafting poisions. i don't think it would be overpowered to offer a 10% price break for every other level of this class when crafting poisons. at tenth level thats 50% off which magic items crafters can get through their PrC. otherwize this stuff can get expensive. second. as nice as i think that third round of poison can be... in most encounters even the secondary effect never gets seen. things just die too fast. My suggestion would be that rather than being able to add another round of damage that won't be used, you can up the poison craft dc to lower the time between inital and secondary damage. this would allow you to make fast acting poisons that might see those secondary damages in the typical combat. mabey something along the lines of +5 on the dc for every round saved between inital and secondary damage. thats just a guess, tinker with the numbers and mabey make it a function of class level... those are just my ideas, but its nice to see a poison spec PrC... though the alignment might need to be changed to non-good since most every dnd book i have seen has said "the use of poison is an evil act" and they do include afflictions as an alternative to poisions.
Kanachi 06-11-06, 08:16 AM	Good point i may put some kind of price reduction in there as this stuff can indeed get expensive fast! as for an alingement restriction... well to be honist thats never really something i agree with doing on many classes, after all cant an assassin be sent after an evil lord whos removal is actually for the greater good? (evil only.. pah!) The great thing about D&D is the ability to play against the norm (a Tiefling who has a good heart or an Aasimar who is evil). So personally i disagree with rules that take freedom of choice and chance away from the player. An adventurer is by their nature an exceptional individual and therefor defies any attempt at pigeon holing... Thats just my feeling on the matter at any rate. I dont see poison use as something evil, though it would often be used to evil ends. Thanks for the ideas + review though!! :)
frasmage 06-11-06, 10:36 AM	thanks for your ideas, Belthazzar As for the price reduction, i think 50% is way too much, because remember when crafting poison you need only pay between 1/4 and 3/4 of the cost of the poison for the raw materials, depending on rarity. If you reduce that by 50% you are paying only 1/8 to 3/8 of the cost. If you were to find someone to sell that to (propably criminals, but still) that would give you a practically infinite profit. There is a reason they never reduce the cost of magic items to a given character by more than 10% That said, I think it is a good idea. We just need to keep it balanced. I would say maybe 10% reduction at 3rd level and 20% reduction at 7th level. This bonus shoudl come from your ability to craft poison more effectively, requiring less raw materials. This bonus only applies when buying raw materials and not finished poisons. however, it may be possible to say somewhere that a BAS has knowledge of where to find any posion, allowing finding them easier (which may again reduce the cost). Maybe this could go with posion sense. I think I see your point with the slow effects of poison. I wouldn't mind replacing extend posion with "quicken poison". I would say +5 craft DC to reduce the secondary effects to 5 rounds and +10 to reduce it to the round after the initial effects. +5 per round is too much. Also, I just noticed you have already put this in Kanachi, but it needs to have an effect on the craft DC, your can't quite "inspire" your poisons to be faster. This should also replace something, we can't just keep adding stuff. I would suggest extend poison I agree that it should have non-good. That desn't mean it has to be evil, but a good person would not use posion if they had a choice.
belthazzar1113 06-11-06, 12:35 PM	-50% isn't too much of a price break actually... the magic item crafting PrC gets -25% on top of the feat that gives -20%.... i don't see why the poison crafting PrC, which is effectivly what this class is, should be any worse. Since your not spending xp and there isn't a feat to reduce the cost this would be about the only ability to lower the pricetag on poison. However if your using the rules about harvesting from creatures getting price breaks then knocking the ability down to -5% per level is acceptable. Your not going to have near infinite profits from a criminal organization because it still takes time to craft poisons the same as everything else. Yes you can make money, but no more so than engaging in most other ILLEGAL activities. +10 to the dc for two round poison is far far far too easy. i would say +10 would buy you double time poision (init, 5 rounds, secondary) and +20 would buy you three round poison (init, 2 rounds, secondary) and thats as fast as you can get. even then your stretching out and vastly increaing the amount of poison your useing... another decent way to go might be to say you can combine two does of poison at their craft dc +10 to get one does of quickened venom, and you can combine two does of quickened venom at +10 (with the other +10) to get one does of three round doom. This would put a price tag on that fast acting venom and make you really think how strong you need to make your poison for each creature. ANd it would make the price break class feature usefull too. -25% cost means for the price of three venoms you get one really fast acting potent venom. as far as the alignment thing goes, you might not agree with it but thats the dnd standard. exceptions are for individual games. Assasins are evil because murder is evil and assasins have to commit one cold blooded murder just to get in the class, and the class is designed to commit more. thats evil. This is a class designed around using poison to great effect and killing people with it. Thats evil. i think non good is the least strict alignment requirment you could have. The only reason its not worse is because you don't have to kill someone to get in the class so your free to play someone that uses poison to kill monsters only. But the use of poison causes suffering and is an evil act as defined by WotC and the DND religions. can't get around that. Its your class and your free to ignore it, but i don't think any DM would let this in the game for a good aligned character.
Kanachi 06-11-06, 01:18 PM	I've removed extend poison (which in retrospect is probably the least well thought out feature of the class) and replaced it with quicken poison. I think that two subsiquent rounds of poison would be over powered but perhaps a single DC +10 check to reduce the time between initial and secondary damage to 1+D3 rounds would be more suitible? this would offer the opportunity for a poison that could be anywhere between 2-4 rounds after the initial damage, which also helps with the idea that poison craft is by no means a precicely prodicable science. I'm also begining to think that perhaps quicken poison and poison splicing should swap places on progression table. I believe this because the poison splicing ability will likely serve little use untill the sniper can reduce the delay between initial and secondary effects. I've left out price reductions for now.. i'm thinking that something should probably be tied into the poison mastery class feature that covers this.
frasmage 06-11-06, 02:25 PM	maybe you are right about the poison cost. But we need to put it there in a way that does not overpower the clas. Remember it already has tons of stuff, we might need to replace something else with this. Now that I think of it, 2 round poison is far too fast. Ya, 5 rounds seems good. And as I said, yes, it should be non-good
Kanachi 06-11-06, 02:43 PM	added the "any non-good" prerec
belthazzar1113 06-11-06, 05:19 PM	after getting back from lunch, my friend and i decided that as good as this class is, there really need to be a flat out poision master class. so we are working on the Venomancer (sweet name isn't it?) who will be the end all be all master of poision :) for the blight arrow guy you might want to leave some of the nifty poision stuff out and focus a bit more on the arrow part of it. i think the class features you have are good, and barring a lille moving around of abilities things look good.
Kanachi 06-11-06, 10:52 PM	lol fare enough, good luck with your class as well :) i'll pop in and take a look when your done. The two classes might end up sitting really well together side by side :D
Cynical1 06-12-06, 12:34 PM	I want to be the first one thank both of you for the creation of this wonderfull class. I am currently DM'ing a desert campaign with a "poisons are deadly" sub-theme. One of my PCs (an archer)was looking around for a good PrC to go with archery, and we were thinking of making a desert sniper class. Anyway, I took one look at this bad-boy and I am immediatly incorporating them into my campaign setting as the warriors of the desert elf tribes. kudos to both of you :D
Kanachi 06-12-06, 02:12 PM	hehe, really pleased that you like the class, i think its basicly just about finished. Please write back and tell us how it work out for you within your game!! :)
Kanachi 06-12-06, 10:48 PM	UPDATE: we have swapped the order of quicken poison and splice poison.. so you get splice poison at lvl 10 and quicken poison at lvl 4.. this makes the class far more workable. I've also re-writen the post following the class to contain new advice on how to keep track of your poisons. as far as i can tell at this point the class is done. So i hope you all enjoy it!! :D
Kanachi 06-23-06, 11:14 AM	As reviews of classes are often quite hard to get on here with the hustle and bustle of constantly flowing posts i've decided to quote the following review by KingNeo made in the "any archer classes" topic here (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=656275) . Quote from KingNeo Its a pretty good prestige class, of course I don't like using poison too much though. I pretty much perfer shoting an arrow in an enemy's crotch and making him scream in terror, pinning him to a tree using my arrows, or having him charge thinking he is going to slash my head off and shooting his sword out of his hand and into a river 300 ft. below. But again good though, especially if you say wanted to apply oh some drow sleeping poison and have the enemy lose its balance and fall off a cliff.
Kanachi 06-28-06, 08:31 PM	At this point i've added a number of new poisons originally discussed here (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=9503358#post9503358) to the post following the class's details. If anyone would like to put forward their views on either the class or the poisons i would love to hear what you think. Thankyou
Kanachi 06-29-06, 09:15 PM	I've now added craft DC's to all the new poisons mentioned above. :)
Kanachi 07-01-06, 10:06 PM	I've now also added my Dormant Toxins (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=9527754#post9527754) rules to the post immediately following the class. Any opinions any of you have regarding either the class or the dormant toxins would be greatly appreciated. Thankyou!
Kanachi 07-02-06, 08:48 PM	I just wanted to give this class a bump as i'de really like to see what people think of it. It seems really hard to get any opinions on the class and i just wanted to make sure people were aware that i'de be interested in what they have to say. So yer.. i guess i'm begging for comments... sorry about that. I'm at a bit of a loss as to how i can get my posts more noticed, several posts seem to get hundreds of responces (good and bad) while i dont seem to be able to draw any to mine. I hope i've not deluded myself into being the only one who thinks my work on poison use (this class and my other posts) could be of interest. I'm sorry if bumping like this annoys people or is against the rules. Thankyou all!
Kanachi 07-10-06, 02:30 PM	I've now allowed rangers (lvl 5) access into the Prc as well as removing the weapon restrictions. I've also upped the DC of the poison splicing ability as well as upped the DC of creating an inhaled alteration toxin.