Post/Author/DateTime	Post
zelvious 01-23-04, 11:54 AM	i have always been a dm in specific times, but recently my older cousin quit dungeons and dragons, who was a really good dm. but my cousins and me still wanna play, though i have a problem i wanna play, but i will have to be the dm, my question was, can dm's still play with the players? because i really still wanna play instead of just designing missions and all that, yes, i will still be the dm, but i was wondering if i could make me a charecter and place it in with them. though i do realize i wont be able to go up behind doors and open them if i know i put a treasure in or something like that. but i was wondering if somone could give me some feedback on this. and if i cant put a charecter in with them does anyone possibly know where d and d meeting's are? i live in oklahoma. thanks.......
Ithilorien 01-23-04, 12:01 PM	DMPCs (a character played by a DM) are almost always a bad idea as they tend (however unintentionally on the DMs part) to be uber-characters who hog the spotlight and "magically" know everything. If you're going to DM, shy away from a DMPC. As for other D&D games, check the wanted boards under d20, as well as any posting boards that you may find in your local book, game, hobby, and rpg stores (if any, god knows in Oklahoma). ;)
zelvious 01-23-04, 12:05 PM	then is it possible just to fight, becuase im made a rouge 1st level. and just kinda hang around and not say anything, and not know everything?
Korasukage 01-23-04, 12:11 PM	Hi zelvious in regards to your question, "....i will still be the dm, but i was wondering if i could make me a charecter and place it in with them." I believe that that should not be a problem at all. I have had my own pc in most of the games that I have run(as I am usually the dm) and it has never caused any kind of trouble. In fact my players usually find them very cool and interesting even going so far as to sacrifice themselves in order to save them. I think that the most important things are 1) your pc shouldn't outshine the player characters. 2) Give your pc a personality and traits that make him unique. For example in the campaign that I am running right now the pc that I have is a cleric that worships a god of retribution, that also has a gambling problem that the player characters just found out about. This is only a small example of how you can make your pc interesting and fun to play. So in the end yeah I think its fine if you have your own pc when you are also the dm:) Anyway if needed your pc can be the perfect cannon fodder when you want to make a point about how dangerous something is. Hope ths helps.
zelvious 01-23-04, 12:15 PM	thanks for your help,lol i really needed it:)
bolobaby 01-23-04, 12:16 PM	The previous poster is right - DM PCs are almost always a nightmare... *especially* for the regular PCs. One of the main reasons for this is that a DM will shy away from situations that punish his own PC. A normal DM will think "gee, what he did right there was dumb, I think I'll lay on some bad consequences." This just doesn't happen with DM PCs usually. Also, DMs are often unwilling to kill off their own PCs which results in monsters acting inappropriately - not taking the coup de grace action against your fallen PC, for example. Take it from an experienced DM... just because you DM doesn't mean you stop playing. In fact, you get to "play" more than the players do! You control every other person in the entire world - and that can be a real blast. I've often played NPCs that will join up with the party for specified periods of time. For example, when the party needed a guide through the swamp, they picked up an NPC ranger to take them through. He stayed with them for the majority of the mission. BUT... he was an NPC, so I played him with a certain sense of apathy regarding his fate as a DM. He also didn't receive any share of the treasure, only the agreed upon wages he was supposed to earn. (Now, mind you, an NPC hireling can try to renegotiate his wages if he sees the party is getting supper rich with his help...) Don't do it... just be the DM, not a PC. You might find it is more fun than playing a PC anyway.
zelvious 01-23-04, 12:23 PM	i know i sound like a mumbling monkey, but im forced to be the dm and i really enjoy the player more and my cousins just dont wanna be a dm, becuase i by all the books and stuff. and i mean i basically just wanna have fun to, yes being a dm can be fun but i have alot more fun being the player, because i get to expiernce the traps. get the loot. kill the stuff, i guess im getting nowhere though............
Korasukage 01-23-04, 12:35 PM	Hey zelvious if you really want to have a dmpc I really don't see the problem with it. Though I can understand what the other posters are saying in regards to it being a bad idea. But trust me as somebody thats been judging for quite some time that a dmpc can be really fun for both you and your players. Like I said just don't make him uberpowerful and don't forget to give him a fully developed personality and some quirks. My dmpcs are usually for comic relief so I tend to give them some funny habits and/or traits. What it all comes down to is what you feel comfortable with. If you want to use a dmpc then use one and if you are really worried then after a while ask your players how they feel about him/her. If they are ok with it then don't worry but if they have a problem then re-examine the situation to see if you should keep your dmpc-cheers:)
zelvious 01-23-04, 12:41 PM	i just wanted to think everyone's feed back with the dm problem i am having, i would like to think the following people- korasakage, bolobaby, and ithilorien. i hope i will see you all agian some time on my next posts or others, thanks agian zelvious:)
SureFoot 01-23-04, 12:46 PM	this is really a pet peeve of mine. There is no such thing as a "DMPC." The DM is the DM, not a player. The two are mutually exclusive. Therefore, the DM cannot have a PC (Player Character). Any character the DM uses is, by definition, an NPC. That being said, you probably *should* have NPCs in the group, particularly if your group is "understaffed." Recurring NPC allies are a good thing, as long as you follow the suggestions above (don't continually make them outshine the PCs).
D_Martin 01-23-04, 01:13 PM	I have never had a problem with DMNPC's. We only have 3 people in our group currently. My DMPC is the Clr/Ftr/HoL, with the other 2 being a Rgr/Abj and a Dru. Because of her(DMNPC) high Cha, I could have easily made her the focus of the party. But I have not. I even suggested the leadership feat to the Rgr/Abj with far less Cha. She does not make decisions for the party, nor does she hog any spotlight. She has input... no more, no less(and she is a Clr of Trithereon, a very outspoken faith). You just have to be objective. Treat that NPC like you treat the players. ALL Character usually die sometime, somewhere. If I was just a player, that PC would be more vocal about possible leadership-type roles in the party. You really can't do that as a DM.
zelvious 01-23-04, 01:26 PM	everyone has gave me very good hints about it, i think i will make a dmpc though, when i played in my cousins campiagn before he quit, he had made a dmpc and it worked out fine, because he dint hog the spotlight he was just really there he never gave any hints or anything. he fought sometimes with us, he never took the loot we would all divide it amoung us. the only problem i have now i have made a level 1 rouge, in my campaign and will i be able to disable traps, or get a little treasure, you see the people playing there ages are 13, 14 , and me i am 13, my little cousin wants to play and he a little kid who is 6 and is no problem. but we are ''understaffed'', and they never wanna be a rouge. so am i able to steal things from people, get a little loot but not give a major mission point away? because as a rouge i dont really wanna fight to much i wanna explore my dungeons i make with my cosouins is this alright? because my older cousiun who left was 18, and taught me all i knowin d and d and gave me a few books, and i think i know how to have a dmpc without being a hog, or being really uber-powerful.
RLWilde 01-23-04, 08:08 PM	I've had a "DMPC" before, and been in campaigns with them. The hardest part is keeping "DM" and "PC" knowledge separate... if you think that may be difficult but want to try it anyway, I'd recommend "playing" a Bard or a spellcaster concentrating on Divinations... that way, at least there's an in-game reason for thr character to know some things. Make sure to talk things over with the others in your group, and make sure that they know the character isn't an avatar of the gods... he won't always know which way to turn at a dungeon intersection or be able to solve every riddle... heck, sometimes the information the character has is wrong. Another difficult part can be combat... ask yourself, "am I prepared to kill my own character, if that's what the NPCs the party is fighting would do?" If your honest answer is "no", or even "I don't know", then I recommend against playing a "DMPC"; your character has to be treated no differently than any of the others in the group.
zelvious 01-24-04, 12:16 AM	i think i know what you mean you have a excellent point i cant't be way to overpowered, like what you said a avatar of the gods. if i can be the rouge and be with the party and basically be silent, and not give all the knoweledge away. and not any really because that is the player's fun. i think you and everyone who has helped me, what my ultimate is to fight with the team nothing more, i think this is a way to pull this off. all major treasures i will not get unless the team wants me to i think everyone for the support in this issue i called for help on. my question has been answered and with everyone's help i will be able to pull this off. thank you once agian everyone,sincerly zelvious peace all
Jkol the Butcher 01-24-04, 12:52 AM	I must say, In recent memory I have dmed mostly for only 1 or 2 players. I almost always have had a "DMPC" -- In fact I always have. I find that most often now, I am a little harsh on the little guys. I have been known to go through three or more a session (then again, sometimes I go through tree or more parties/session:P ) It has gotten to the point such that when my NPC is about to die -- I have players saying -- dude just fudge the roll... Having a devoted NPC(DMPC) can be a very valuable addition to the gaming experience. It has been, bar none the best way for me to actually start roleplaying. Some of my memorable DMPCs In an epic campaign -- Psionic Seer (Wis), Half Air elemental. Boy was he funny. The description of Half AE said that they were "flighty" so he often found himself daydreaming about flying. It also provided a good way to seperate DM and DMPC knowledge The psion possesed the most powerful psionic divinations available if the party asked. But if they were asking advice after a DM description ten to one he was distracted and completely unaware of the situation -- ADD. It got so bad, that when He divined a great campaign secret for them and went insane, the party went to leave with him. the caretakers at the temple said: "You can't take him...he's insane.." and in one of the proudest moments of my DMing life my players replied... "It makes a difference?" My latest funny one - was a Human barbarian. He rolled really odd scores (none below 10) He had a INT score of 13, Wis 12, and Cha 10. It turned out really funny because he spoke very broken english... "Humie Spek" but had been taught Elven by a wandering adventurer... And when he would switch between elven (translated back to english for the sake of us non elven speakers) it sounded like proper (british) english -- the transition between the two never failed to cause an uproar. In conclusion (yes there is a point), A DMPC is what you make of it. Remember this one simple rule, when someone is getting a disproportional (read larger) share of someone they will probably feel that the division is fair. You are going to have to be tougher on the DMPC than on the PCs. Give them some quirks and make them memorable while they last...