Can you stack Flurry of blows and TWF... [Archive] - Wizards Community

Can you stack Flurry of blows and TWF... [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
MasterOfPsychic
12-14-05, 09:33 AM I read on the forum that you CAN, but I would find that wrong... I mean, FoB is already fighting with two, even three weapons...
Adam Smite
12-14-05, 09:43 AM You can, but the extra attacks from TWF are subject to normal TWF rules, unlike FoB. 1/2 strength mod to damage, and you'll need to be using a light weapon in your off hand. And the -2 from TWF applies to every attack, including those from FoB. You'll gets a whole lot of innaccurate attacks. Really good for fighting someone with an insane AC though.
Xeraph
12-14-05, 09:51 AM Really good for fighting someone with an insane AC though.
:rofl:
Puca
12-14-05, 10:01 AM You get up to three extra attacks, but theyll all suffer the penalties for two-weapon fighting and the penalties (while they exist) for flurrying.

At level 20, you monk will have +13/+13/+13/+7/+3, +13/+7/+3. Thats a ton of attacks, but really not much chance of landing any of them.

Look at a fighter of the same level with TWF:
+18/+13/+8/+3, +18/+13/+7

Thats only one attack fewer than the monk, but with a much better possibilty of landing a couple.
nonsi
12-14-05, 10:15 AM I gotta ask, where in any of the rulebooks is it written that you can stack FoB with TWF ?

Even with monk weapons, none of the examples in the PHB even hint that such a thing is possible.
Xeraph
12-14-05, 10:22 AM Where does it say or hint that it doesn't work? In the Official FAQ are a couple of examples of monks with twf.
Its just not very duable in the long run. If you want many attacks be a Thri-kreen Fighter/ Dervish with two Scimitars.
Puca
12-14-05, 10:36 AM I gotta ask, where in any of the rulebooks is it written that you can stack FoB with TWF ?

Even with monk weapons, none of the examples in the PHB even hint that such a thing is possible.
From the FAQ:
Can a monk fight with two weapons? Can she combine
a two-weapon attack with a flurry of blows? What are her
penalties on attack rolls?
A monk can fight with two weapons just like any other
character, but she must accept the normal penalties on her
attack rolls to do so. She can use an unarmed strike as an offhand
weapon. She can even combine two-weapon fighting with
a flurry of blows to gain an extra attack with her off hand (but
remember that she can use only unarmed strikes or special
monk weapons as part of the flurry). The penalties for twoweapon
fighting stack with the penalties for flurry of blows.
For example, at 6th level, the monk Ember can normally
make one attack per round at a +4 bonus. When using flurry of
blows, she can make two attacks (using unarmed strikes or any
special monk weapons she holds), each at a +3 bonus. If she
wants to make an extra attack with her off hand, she has to
accept a –4 penalty on her primary hand attacks and a –8
penalty on her off-hand attacks (assuming she wields a light
weapon in her off hand).
If Ember has Two-Weapon Fighting, she has to accept only
a –2 penalty on all attacks to make an extra attack with her off
hand. Thus, when wielding a light weapon in her off hand
during a flurry of blows, she can make a total of three attacks,
each at a total bonus of +1. At least one of these attacks has to
be with her off-hand weapon.
A 20th-level monk with Greater Two-Weapon Fighting can
make eight attacks per round during a flurry of blows.
Assuming she wields a light weapon in her off hand, her three
off-hand weapon attacks are at +13/+8/+3, and she has five
attacks (at +13/+13/+13/+8/+3) with unarmed strikes or any
weapons she carries in her primary hand. If the same monk also
has Rapid Shot and throws at least one shuriken as part of her
flurry of blows (since Rapid Shot can be used only with ranged
attacks), she can throw one additional shuriken with her
primary hand, but all of her attacks (even melee attacks) suffer
a –2 penalty. Thus, her full attack array looks like this:
+11/+11/+11/+11/+6/+1 primary hand (two must be with
shuriken) and +11/+6/+1 off hand.
Thorak
12-14-05, 01:16 PM I gotta ask, where in any of the rulebooks is it written that you can stack FoB with TWF ?

Even with monk weapons, none of the examples in the PHB even hint that such a thing is possible.
Even aside from the other arguments, how on earth would you get the impression they don't? I can Flurry with a single kama. Why can't I get more attacks if I'm using two?

Flurry grants extra attacks due to being a monk. It has nothing to do with fighting with multiple weapons.

TWF grants extra attacks due to multiple weapons.

Arguing they don't stack is like arguing that Haste doesn't stack with either; if you're going to claim something that significant, you better have some backup.
ArochanoX
12-14-05, 03:57 PM Well some eagle calw (from sandstorm) and the feat from that book that grants extra attack with that weapon and exotic weapon flurry and dervish, you can have full attack progression of:

+16/+16/+16/+16/+16/+16/+11/+11/+11/+11/+6/+6/+6/+6/+1/+1

if I remember correctly. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
MasterOfPsychic 12-14-05, 09:33 AM	I read on the forum that you CAN, but I would find that wrong... I mean, FoB is already fighting with two, even three weapons...
Adam Smite 12-14-05, 09:43 AM	You can, but the extra attacks from TWF are subject to normal TWF rules, unlike FoB. 1/2 strength mod to damage, and you'll need to be using a light weapon in your off hand. And the -2 from TWF applies to every attack, including those from FoB. You'll gets a whole lot of innaccurate attacks. Really good for fighting someone with an insane AC though.
Xeraph 12-14-05, 09:51 AM	Really good for fighting someone with an insane AC though. :rofl:
Puca 12-14-05, 10:01 AM	You get up to three extra attacks, but theyll all suffer the penalties for two-weapon fighting and the penalties (while they exist) for flurrying. At level 20, you monk will have +13/+13/+13/+7/+3, +13/+7/+3. Thats a ton of attacks, but really not much chance of landing any of them. Look at a fighter of the same level with TWF: +18/+13/+8/+3, +18/+13/+7 Thats only one attack fewer than the monk, but with a much better possibilty of landing a couple.
nonsi 12-14-05, 10:15 AM	I gotta ask, where in any of the rulebooks is it written that you can stack FoB with TWF ? Even with monk weapons, none of the examples in the PHB even hint that such a thing is possible.
Xeraph 12-14-05, 10:22 AM	Where does it say or hint that it doesn't work? In the Official FAQ are a couple of examples of monks with twf. Its just not very duable in the long run. If you want many attacks be a Thri-kreen Fighter/ Dervish with two Scimitars.
Puca 12-14-05, 10:36 AM	I gotta ask, where in any of the rulebooks is it written that you can stack FoB with TWF ? Even with monk weapons, none of the examples in the PHB even hint that such a thing is possible. From the FAQ: Can a monk fight with two weapons? Can she combine a two-weapon attack with a flurry of blows? What are her penalties on attack rolls? A monk can fight with two weapons just like any other character, but she must accept the normal penalties on her attack rolls to do so. She can use an unarmed strike as an offhand weapon. She can even combine two-weapon fighting with a flurry of blows to gain an extra attack with her off hand (but remember that she can use only unarmed strikes or special monk weapons as part of the flurry). The penalties for twoweapon fighting stack with the penalties for flurry of blows. For example, at 6th level, the monk Ember can normally make one attack per round at a +4 bonus. When using flurry of blows, she can make two attacks (using unarmed strikes or any special monk weapons she holds), each at a +3 bonus. If she wants to make an extra attack with her off hand, she has to accept a –4 penalty on her primary hand attacks and a –8 penalty on her off-hand attacks (assuming she wields a light weapon in her off hand). If Ember has Two-Weapon Fighting, she has to accept only a –2 penalty on all attacks to make an extra attack with her off hand. Thus, when wielding a light weapon in her off hand during a flurry of blows, she can make a total of three attacks, each at a total bonus of +1. At least one of these attacks has to be with her off-hand weapon. A 20th-level monk with Greater Two-Weapon Fighting can make eight attacks per round during a flurry of blows. Assuming she wields a light weapon in her off hand, her three off-hand weapon attacks are at +13/+8/+3, and she has five attacks (at +13/+13/+13/+8/+3) with unarmed strikes or any weapons she carries in her primary hand. If the same monk also has Rapid Shot and throws at least one shuriken as part of her flurry of blows (since Rapid Shot can be used only with ranged attacks), she can throw one additional shuriken with her primary hand, but all of her attacks (even melee attacks) suffer a –2 penalty. Thus, her full attack array looks like this: +11/+11/+11/+11/+6/+1 primary hand (two must be with shuriken) and +11/+6/+1 off hand.
Thorak 12-14-05, 01:16 PM	I gotta ask, where in any of the rulebooks is it written that you can stack FoB with TWF ? Even with monk weapons, none of the examples in the PHB even hint that such a thing is possible. Even aside from the other arguments, how on earth would you get the impression they don't? I can Flurry with a single kama. Why can't I get more attacks if I'm using two? Flurry grants extra attacks due to being a monk. It has nothing to do with fighting with multiple weapons. TWF grants extra attacks due to multiple weapons. Arguing they don't stack is like arguing that Haste doesn't stack with either; if you're going to claim something that significant, you better have some backup.
ArochanoX 12-14-05, 03:57 PM	Well some eagle calw (from sandstorm) and the feat from that book that grants extra attack with that weapon and exotic weapon flurry and dervish, you can have full attack progression of: +16/+16/+16/+16/+16/+16/+11/+11/+11/+11/+6/+6/+6/+6/+1/+1 if I remember correctly. Please correct me if I'm wrong.