Check This Out [Archive] - Wizards Community

Check This Out [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Peregrine_Wolf
06-21-07, 10:54 PM My friend came up with a class that we wanted to test out in a campaign, and I know he isn't trying to make it broken or anything, but I jsut want to get the opinions from the boards about it. I'm pretty sure something like this exists already, but he insisted on messing with it a little bit. Anyways, here it is.

Mageknight

Hit Dice: D6
Skills: As a Wizard.

BAB Fort. Ref. Will Class Abilities
1. +0 +2 +0 +2 Spells,
2. +1 +3 +0 +3
3. +2 +3 +1 +3
4. +3 +4 +1 +4
5. +3 +4 +1 +4 Bonus Feat
6. +4 +5 +2 +5
7. +5 +5 +2 +5
8. +6/+1 +6 +2 +6
9. +6/+1 +6 +3 +6
10. +7/+2 +7 +3 +7 Bonus Feat
11. +8/+3 +7 +3 +7
12. +9/+4 +8 +4 +8
13. +9/+4 +8 +4 +8
14. +10/+5 +9 +4 +9
15. +11/+6/+1 +9 +5 +9 Bonus Feat
16. +12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +10
17. +12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +10
18. +13/+8/+3 +11 +6 +11
19. +14/+9/+4 +11 +6 +11
20. +15/+10/+5 +12 +6 +12 Bonus Feat

Weapon and Armor Proficiencies: Mageknights are proficient with all Martial and Simple weapons, and with Light Armor.

Class Abilities:

Warcasting: A Mageknight can decrease the Arcane Spell Failure of any light armor s/he is wearing by 10%. Also, a Mageknight may not apply metamagic feats to his/her spells. Also, a Mageknight may deliver Touch spells with his/her weapon.

Spells: A Mageknight casts spells from the Sorcerer/Wizard Spell list. A Mageknight uses Intelligence as it's casting ability. Mageknights prepare spells like a Wizard, but have spells known and spells per day as a Sorcerer, but gets 1 less/level spells/day than the Sorcerer.

Bonus Feat: Mageknights gain Fighter Bonus Feats at every 5 levels starting at level 5.

Tell me what you think.
Muktar
06-21-07, 11:01 PM He should look at the Duskblade. Which I think is actually superior to what you posted.
Peregrine_Wolf
06-21-07, 11:07 PM I know, another player suggested it, but none of us own that book adn he doesn't like some of it's abilities.....
SilentOne
06-21-07, 11:16 PM Wait... it's a sorcerer that gives up spontaneous casting to get full BAB, a bump to their hit dice, the ability to wear armor when casting, and another good save plus a full complement of bonus feats as a wizard (though alot of people think they should get this anyway)?

This is a pretty sweet base gish, considering they give up nothing to multiclassing, and can easily go into the same prestige classes like Abjurant Champion.

Unless I'm missing something, it's too powerful. Maybe limit the spells known and spell/day to the bard list, including the maximum of 6th level known eventually?
Macrovore
06-21-07, 11:23 PM it's not as bad as the Lightning Warrior, but it's close. You give it so much and take away so little, if anything.
Fireclave
06-22-07, 01:47 AM it's not as bad as the Lightning Warrior, but it's close. You give it so much and take away so little, if anything.
Aye. Something's gotta give. If you're more powerful than the Battle Sorcerer (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#sorcererVari antBattleSorcerer) varient, you've probably gone too far.
Peregrine_Wolf
06-22-07, 07:40 AM Yeah...I told him to take a Fighter Bonus Feat at level 1 and then get Casting at level 4 as a Wizard/Sorcerer 3 levels lower. He also tried to throw in something like- they can't wear medium or heavy armor- but I told him that if some people like there casters in full plate.
Shadowfax7
06-22-07, 09:16 AM IMO it's doable . . . but the ASF reduction should be 10% max because it will stack with other methods of reducing it.

The HD should be D8 or you would not be an effective fighter and BAB should be 3/4.

The spells known should be limited as the Sorcerer, but spells/day should be 1 less/level as the Sorcerer.
Tolzair
06-22-07, 09:16 AM Also, battlecast is already an ability that havoc mages get.

Battlecast 2 allows them to cast a level two spell, and make a melee attack as a full action. This should just be something like Overcome Arcane Spell Failure, 15%. And maybe a 3/4 BAB instead of a full one?
Peregrine_Wolf
06-22-07, 02:13 PM Also, battlecast is already an ability that havoc mages get.

I did not know that, I just came up with a word that might descrice it as I typed it up. Thanks for the input, I'm showing him what has been tinkered with when he comes over a little bit later.
Flamewarrior
06-22-07, 02:50 PM First, is that really intended to cast up to 9th-level spells? If so, the problem is very simple: it took the wizard (you know, one of the "big five") and layered a little more on top. Also, this (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=12609975#post12609975) may be of interest, having a similar idea but very different execution (and already has the weaker spellcasting it should). Finally, whatever you decide to do, there's no reason at all to make it have a narrow list of spells known and spell preparation, since the idea behind the preparation is to narrow wizard/cleric/druid's wide lists, while the sorcerer's is small already - unless, of course; that could have been a power-up if it was actually able to use metamagic, since it does benefit from preparation.
Peregrine_Wolf
06-22-07, 03:02 PM TY that is great...he thinks it might be what he is looking for.
Flamewarrior
06-22-07, 03:11 PM Go nuts, the both of you. But I've been having problems to playtest things myself; if that gets played, an account (or any feedback you both happen to have by now, by the way) would be much appreciated.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Peregrine_Wolf 06-21-07, 10:54 PM	My friend came up with a class that we wanted to test out in a campaign, and I know he isn't trying to make it broken or anything, but I jsut want to get the opinions from the boards about it. I'm pretty sure something like this exists already, but he insisted on messing with it a little bit. Anyways, here it is. Mageknight Hit Dice: D6 Skills: As a Wizard. BAB Fort. Ref. Will Class Abilities 1. +0 +2 +0 +2 Spells, 2. +1 +3 +0 +3 3. +2 +3 +1 +3 4. +3 +4 +1 +4 5. +3 +4 +1 +4 Bonus Feat 6. +4 +5 +2 +5 7. +5 +5 +2 +5 8. +6/+1 +6 +2 +6 9. +6/+1 +6 +3 +6 10. +7/+2 +7 +3 +7 Bonus Feat 11. +8/+3 +7 +3 +7 12. +9/+4 +8 +4 +8 13. +9/+4 +8 +4 +8 14. +10/+5 +9 +4 +9 15. +11/+6/+1 +9 +5 +9 Bonus Feat 16. +12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +10 17. +12/+7/+2 +10 +5 +10 18. +13/+8/+3 +11 +6 +11 19. +14/+9/+4 +11 +6 +11 20. +15/+10/+5 +12 +6 +12 Bonus Feat Weapon and Armor Proficiencies: Mageknights are proficient with all Martial and Simple weapons, and with Light Armor. Class Abilities: Warcasting: A Mageknight can decrease the Arcane Spell Failure of any light armor s/he is wearing by 10%. Also, a Mageknight may not apply metamagic feats to his/her spells. Also, a Mageknight may deliver Touch spells with his/her weapon. Spells: A Mageknight casts spells from the Sorcerer/Wizard Spell list. A Mageknight uses Intelligence as it's casting ability. Mageknights prepare spells like a Wizard, but have spells known and spells per day as a Sorcerer, but gets 1 less/level spells/day than the Sorcerer. Bonus Feat: Mageknights gain Fighter Bonus Feats at every 5 levels starting at level 5. Tell me what you think.
Muktar 06-21-07, 11:01 PM	He should look at the Duskblade. Which I think is actually superior to what you posted.
Peregrine_Wolf 06-21-07, 11:07 PM	I know, another player suggested it, but none of us own that book adn he doesn't like some of it's abilities.....
SilentOne 06-21-07, 11:16 PM	Wait... it's a sorcerer that gives up spontaneous casting to get full BAB, a bump to their hit dice, the ability to wear armor when casting, and another good save plus a full complement of bonus feats as a wizard (though alot of people think they should get this anyway)? This is a pretty sweet base gish, considering they give up nothing to multiclassing, and can easily go into the same prestige classes like Abjurant Champion. Unless I'm missing something, it's too powerful. Maybe limit the spells known and spell/day to the bard list, including the maximum of 6th level known eventually?
Macrovore 06-21-07, 11:23 PM	it's not as bad as the Lightning Warrior, but it's close. You give it so much and take away so little, if anything.
Fireclave 06-22-07, 01:47 AM	it's not as bad as the Lightning Warrior, but it's close. You give it so much and take away so little, if anything. Aye. Something's gotta give. If you're more powerful than the Battle Sorcerer (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#sorcererVari antBattleSorcerer) varient, you've probably gone too far.
Peregrine_Wolf 06-22-07, 07:40 AM	Yeah...I told him to take a Fighter Bonus Feat at level 1 and then get Casting at level 4 as a Wizard/Sorcerer 3 levels lower. He also tried to throw in something like- they can't wear medium or heavy armor- but I told him that if some people like there casters in full plate.
Shadowfax7 06-22-07, 09:16 AM	IMO it's doable . . . but the ASF reduction should be 10% max because it will stack with other methods of reducing it. The HD should be D8 or you would not be an effective fighter and BAB should be 3/4. The spells known should be limited as the Sorcerer, but spells/day should be 1 less/level as the Sorcerer.
Tolzair 06-22-07, 09:16 AM	Also, battlecast is already an ability that havoc mages get. Battlecast 2 allows them to cast a level two spell, and make a melee attack as a full action. This should just be something like Overcome Arcane Spell Failure, 15%. And maybe a 3/4 BAB instead of a full one?
Peregrine_Wolf 06-22-07, 02:13 PM	Also, battlecast is already an ability that havoc mages get. I did not know that, I just came up with a word that might descrice it as I typed it up. Thanks for the input, I'm showing him what has been tinkered with when he comes over a little bit later.
Flamewarrior 06-22-07, 02:50 PM	First, is that really intended to cast up to 9th-level spells? If so, the problem is very simple: it took the wizard (you know, one of the "big five") and layered a little more on top. Also, this (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=12609975#post12609975) may be of interest, having a similar idea but very different execution (and already has the weaker spellcasting it should). Finally, whatever you decide to do, there's no reason at all to make it have a narrow list of spells known and spell preparation, since the idea behind the preparation is to narrow wizard/cleric/druid's wide lists, while the sorcerer's is small already - unless, of course; that could have been a power-up if it was actually able to use metamagic, since it does benefit from preparation.
Peregrine_Wolf 06-22-07, 03:02 PM	TY that is great...he thinks it might be what he is looking for.
Flamewarrior 06-22-07, 03:11 PM	Go nuts, the both of you. But I've been having problems to playtest things myself; if that gets played, an account (or any feedback you both happen to have by now, by the way) would be much appreciated.