Cleric Class Wimpy? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Cleric Class Wimpy? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
BLusk
12-08-05, 10:26 PM Howdy, all!

I'm usually the one in my groups that plays the Cleric, since they are so very unpopular with the masses these days. I think I do a fair job of being an effective cleric, but I've noticed that compared to the other classes with the all their special class abilities or multiple feats or other things that make their classes special, the cleric seems a bit left out in the cold. About all clerics have is an instant built-in Band-Aid(r) Box and the ability to turn undead.

So, tell me... am I missing something? Again, I've been playing Clerics for quite some time, and I just want to make sure I take advantage of the unique abilities of my class.

So, is the Cleric class left out? Or am I missing something?

Sincerely,
Brian
Seerow
12-08-05, 10:30 PM You obviously haven't been playing very well if you think Cleric is underpowered...
Argamoth
12-08-05, 10:32 PM Clerics are considered one of the most poewerful classes. They have good armor, base attack, and excelent spells. NEVER prepare a healing spell at the start of the day, just convert them to healing spells.
Milo HoBo
12-08-05, 10:34 PM Take Divine Metamagic(from complete divine?) and your favorite metamagic feat. Poof, your magic is stronger already. The advantages of a cleric (or any class for that matter) are shown best by the Character Optimization boards. Though I don't particularly enjoy optimization, I don't want someone thinking a cleric is weak either. Knowlegde is power. Good gaming.
Jell_Moo
12-08-05, 10:37 PM Wow... This is something you don't see very often. Clerics are generally viewed as being one of the most powerful classes.

Here's a few tips:

Take a look at some of the Cleric buff spells like Divine Favor, Divine Might, and Righteous Might. Spells like these allow the Cleric to match the combat ability of the warrior classes.

Domain selection is very important. Look at what spells are on each domain list. Domains like Magic and Trickery offer a lot of spells that clerics don't typically get.

If you use other supplemental books, look through Complete Divine. Inside there are a series of feats known as Divine Metamagic. These allow you to exchange uses of Turn Undead for free metamagic on your spells.

Cleric's gain good offensive magic a little later than Wizards/Sorcerers, but when they get it, they get really sweet stuff. Spells like the Blasphemy/Holy Word line of spells are absolutely brutal if tricked out.

Ultimately, realize that as a Cleric, you have a ton of options other characters don't have. You can buff, you can heal, you can charge into melee, you can use offensive spells...
Professor29
12-08-05, 10:38 PM Don't forget about the Cleric's obvious advantages over the undead. Depending on their alignment they can either control them or destroy them, plus their spells they can abort to only enhance this fact. Also, the cleric gets access to 2 domains, each of which grants a powerful ability (such as being able to ignore hold person for a while), or adding a spell to your spell list you normally wouldn't have (such as fly).

Also, everyone wants the cleric to live...unless you make them mad you can consider the entire group to be your bodyguards, simply because you can keep them from dying if it gets bad. :D
nastynate
12-08-05, 10:39 PM What!!!! you must be crazy. Clerics are second only to druids among the core classes in RAW power level. With a simple casting of divine power, you all but trump every warrior class. You have both defensive and offensive spells, two good saves, much better hit points than every other spell casting class, and you can wear armor without penalty. Missing nifty class specific abilites...nope; you can turn undead and get two domain powers. You don't even need to memorize healing spells because you can just dump whatever you already have for a healing spell when you need it. Clerics rock.

You are likely to find youself very much alone in this opinion. Anyone with common sense can see the power of this class. You should have one of the more powerful characters in your party, by using nothing but the players handbook. Warriors need splatbook for prestige classes just to keep up with higher level clerics and wizards.

Druids on the other hand, are even worse than clerics because they get more special abilites, and wildshape which is the most powerful core class ability of them all. No warrior class can match the raw power of a dire bear. Druids make warrior classes look silly, once they get a few levels under their belt.
ragingmaro
12-08-05, 10:43 PM No Clerics are not wimpy. I'm not going to waste my time justiying it. Since it seems everyone else is going to do that.
danielinthewolvesden
12-08-05, 10:46 PM According to the Consensus:
http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=369436

Cleric ranks # 3 in power- Druid is #1.

Cleric does rate only 13th in "fun to play" however.
BLusk
12-08-05, 10:50 PM Perhaps the title is a bit misleading, however, it does seem that the cleric lacks much "variety". Thanks for the prompt slapping upside the head. ;)

I guess I gotta stop listening to all the people who rag on the cleric class online.

Sincerely,
Brian
Quirriff
12-08-05, 11:16 PM Well, I find that you shouldn't let other players/characters coerce you in what to do with your cleric, otherwise they are boring and unvariable.
farfairer
12-08-05, 11:38 PM Variety in a cleric comes mostly from 3 things (IMO)

Deity, Domains and style.

Deity is the first thing you choose, but not always the easiest. The diffences between a devoted worshiper of even similar faiths like St Cuthbert and Heironeous are huge.

Domains are the easy part. Every Domain has a different ability it grants. So just by picking different domains two clerics of the same deity can be increadible different.

Style is a little harder, but it often works hand in hand with the domains you pick.

Clerics have more variety of styles than almost any other class save Rogue. You have everything from your full-plate armor wearing holy knight type, to your no-armor wearing healer type.

You get characters who preach, characters who teach faith by example, and characters who convert by the sword.

Clerics are also the class with the most PRCs available to them, and (probably) the most feats devoted specificly to them (most fighter feats can be taken by anyone).

So just by PRCs you have hundreds of varieties of cleric.

The knowedgable reaserch priest Loremaster.

The Undead hunting Sacred Exocist.

The battle hardened Warpriest.

The Combat Medic.

The esoteric Contimplative.

I could go on and on.

If your stuck on ideas for a different kind of cleric look at the information on the deities in the game world you play. Try picking a less popular (not unliked but lesser known) Deity, take different Domains than usual, or experiment with some non-standard spells from books other than the PHB. Try a PRC that you haven't seen used. These all lead to tons of variety in clerics.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
BLusk 12-08-05, 10:26 PM	Howdy, all! I'm usually the one in my groups that plays the Cleric, since they are so very unpopular with the masses these days. I think I do a fair job of being an effective cleric, but I've noticed that compared to the other classes with the all their special class abilities or multiple feats or other things that make their classes special, the cleric seems a bit left out in the cold. About all clerics have is an instant built-in Band-Aid(r) Box and the ability to turn undead. So, tell me... am I missing something? Again, I've been playing Clerics for quite some time, and I just want to make sure I take advantage of the unique abilities of my class. So, is the Cleric class left out? Or am I missing something? Sincerely, Brian
Seerow 12-08-05, 10:30 PM	You obviously haven't been playing very well if you think Cleric is underpowered...
Argamoth 12-08-05, 10:32 PM	Clerics are considered one of the most poewerful classes. They have good armor, base attack, and excelent spells. NEVER prepare a healing spell at the start of the day, just convert them to healing spells.
Milo HoBo 12-08-05, 10:34 PM	Take Divine Metamagic(from complete divine?) and your favorite metamagic feat. Poof, your magic is stronger already. The advantages of a cleric (or any class for that matter) are shown best by the Character Optimization boards. Though I don't particularly enjoy optimization, I don't want someone thinking a cleric is weak either. Knowlegde is power. Good gaming.
Jell_Moo 12-08-05, 10:37 PM	Wow... This is something you don't see very often. Clerics are generally viewed as being one of the most powerful classes. Here's a few tips: Take a look at some of the Cleric buff spells like Divine Favor, Divine Might, and Righteous Might. Spells like these allow the Cleric to match the combat ability of the warrior classes. Domain selection is very important. Look at what spells are on each domain list. Domains like Magic and Trickery offer a lot of spells that clerics don't typically get. If you use other supplemental books, look through Complete Divine. Inside there are a series of feats known as Divine Metamagic. These allow you to exchange uses of Turn Undead for free metamagic on your spells. Cleric's gain good offensive magic a little later than Wizards/Sorcerers, but when they get it, they get really sweet stuff. Spells like the Blasphemy/Holy Word line of spells are absolutely brutal if tricked out. Ultimately, realize that as a Cleric, you have a ton of options other characters don't have. You can buff, you can heal, you can charge into melee, you can use offensive spells...
Professor29 12-08-05, 10:38 PM	Don't forget about the Cleric's obvious advantages over the undead. Depending on their alignment they can either control them or destroy them, plus their spells they can abort to only enhance this fact. Also, the cleric gets access to 2 domains, each of which grants a powerful ability (such as being able to ignore hold person for a while), or adding a spell to your spell list you normally wouldn't have (such as fly). Also, everyone wants the cleric to live...unless you make them mad you can consider the entire group to be your bodyguards, simply because you can keep them from dying if it gets bad. :D
nastynate 12-08-05, 10:39 PM	What!!!! you must be crazy. Clerics are second only to druids among the core classes in RAW power level. With a simple casting of divine power, you all but trump every warrior class. You have both defensive and offensive spells, two good saves, much better hit points than every other spell casting class, and you can wear armor without penalty. Missing nifty class specific abilites...nope; you can turn undead and get two domain powers. You don't even need to memorize healing spells because you can just dump whatever you already have for a healing spell when you need it. Clerics rock. You are likely to find youself very much alone in this opinion. Anyone with common sense can see the power of this class. You should have one of the more powerful characters in your party, by using nothing but the players handbook. Warriors need splatbook for prestige classes just to keep up with higher level clerics and wizards. Druids on the other hand, are even worse than clerics because they get more special abilites, and wildshape which is the most powerful core class ability of them all. No warrior class can match the raw power of a dire bear. Druids make warrior classes look silly, once they get a few levels under their belt.
ragingmaro 12-08-05, 10:43 PM	No Clerics are not wimpy. I'm not going to waste my time justiying it. Since it seems everyone else is going to do that.
danielinthewolvesden 12-08-05, 10:46 PM	According to the Consensus: http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=369436 Cleric ranks # 3 in power- Druid is #1. Cleric does rate only 13th in "fun to play" however.
BLusk 12-08-05, 10:50 PM	Perhaps the title is a bit misleading, however, it does seem that the cleric lacks much "variety". Thanks for the prompt slapping upside the head. ;) I guess I gotta stop listening to all the people who rag on the cleric class online. Sincerely, Brian
Quirriff 12-08-05, 11:16 PM	Well, I find that you shouldn't let other players/characters coerce you in what to do with your cleric, otherwise they are boring and unvariable.
farfairer 12-08-05, 11:38 PM	Variety in a cleric comes mostly from 3 things (IMO) Deity, Domains and style. Deity is the first thing you choose, but not always the easiest. The diffences between a devoted worshiper of even similar faiths like St Cuthbert and Heironeous are huge. Domains are the easy part. Every Domain has a different ability it grants. So just by picking different domains two clerics of the same deity can be increadible different. Style is a little harder, but it often works hand in hand with the domains you pick. Clerics have more variety of styles than almost any other class save Rogue. You have everything from your full-plate armor wearing holy knight type, to your no-armor wearing healer type. You get characters who preach, characters who teach faith by example, and characters who convert by the sword. Clerics are also the class with the most PRCs available to them, and (probably) the most feats devoted specificly to them (most fighter feats can be taken by anyone). So just by PRCs you have hundreds of varieties of cleric. The knowedgable reaserch priest Loremaster. The Undead hunting Sacred Exocist. The battle hardened Warpriest. The Combat Medic. The esoteric Contimplative. I could go on and on. If your stuck on ideas for a different kind of cleric look at the information on the deities in the game world you play. Try picking a less popular (not unliked but lesser known) Deity, take different Domains than usual, or experiment with some non-standard spells from books other than the PHB. Try a PRC that you haven't seen used. These all lead to tons of variety in clerics.