Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Jprostovich 09-22-06, 10:39 PM	My cleric has come to a crossroads in his life. While he has done nothing to warrant needing attonement, I am thinking of multiclassing him for a level or two (pretty much for story purposes only) In effect he has lost his faith. So does he loose his powers? If he did not go against his alignment or his patron deity's doctrine, does he still have to attone? Any guidance would be helpful
CryoSilver 09-22-06, 10:41 PM	He keeps his powers.
Mitchell 09-22-06, 10:49 PM	It depends on how the whole cleric-diety relationship works in that world. If, as is the case in the Forgotten Realms, every cleric must have a diety from which they recieve their spells, then it is entirely possible that they wuld lose them. If they are not required to have a diety, then they may not lose them, since they could draw them from wherever non-diety clerics draw their spells from, though they would lose or change domains if they had a diety previously. Really, this is a question that you should be asking your DM, as only they can tell you how this will work in your game.
Jprostovich 09-22-06, 10:54 PM	Really, this is a question that you should be asking your DM, as only they can tell you how this will work in your game. That's the problem...I am the DM, I just want to make sure everything is fair. Normally I don't like to DM and play but my game group started small...then almost overnight it got huge...and alas, I am not ready to give up playing.....
Salla 09-22-06, 10:58 PM	By the RAW (as well as common sense), Multiclassing does not indicate any lapse in faith or anything of the sort. A fighter/cleric (or whatever) is just as devout as a pure cleric. He's done nothing wrong, and has no need to atone.
Tempest Stormwind 09-22-06, 11:02 PM	Multiclassing in and of itself (provided there are no alignment problems) is not a crime, even if the other class or classes aren't divine. I could easily play a cleric/rogue, for instance (note that a rogue isn't a thief -- I could show you, RP-wise, how that approach could work with ANY deity. The most obvious is Olidammara), and continue to cast spells as a cleric or gain more cleric levels. If he's lost his faith, that depends on the setting. If all he's doing is wanting to explore other career paths (though still remain venerating the same deity), congratulations, he's fine. If he's giving up the clerical mantle for good (i.e. never intending to return to the Cleric class), then you might have some problems. If the problem is with the church, not the deity, he may retain his powers even if he's kicked out of the church itself. If you're in Eberron, who cares, the gods may or may not exist, and even corrupt clerics with different alignments can still cast spells from that faith. The simple solution here: Don't think of multiclassing as abandoning the faith, but DO ask the cleric what his reason for the choice is.
pukunui 09-22-06, 11:05 PM	That's a bit of a tricky one. I want to say yes, he would lose his powers, but because religion works differently in d&d, I'm not sure that he would. Faith in a d&d religion isn't as subjective as faith in a real world religion because in d&d the gods are very definitely there. You can't really be agnostic (I'm not sure if the gods exist) or atheistic (the gods don't exist) because they most definitely do and they make sure people know. As a result, I'd say it all depends on the deity. Take Boccob, for instance. He's meant to be an indifferent deity, so he probably doesn't really care whether his clerics really "believe" in him or not, so long as they follow whatever dogma his church requires or whatever. Again, in d&d it doesn't really matter so much whether your cleric believes in his deity or not. Belief doesn't really come into it. It's more a matter of devotion than belief. If your cleric's not feeling devoted to his god anymore, then he may well lose his powers. If not, then he probably won't use them because he can't be bothered asking for them ... So what I think you need to do is look at it from the deity's perspective.
Mitchell 09-22-06, 11:06 PM	That's the problem...I am the DM, I just want to make sure everything is fair. Normally I don't like to DM and play but my game group started small...then almost overnight it got huge...and alas, I am not ready to give up playing..... Then err on the side of caution. Personally, I see more problems coming from this sort of scenario than I see solutions (though admittedly, people generally come here with problems, not stories of how great things are :)), and I am opposed to the concept of a "DMPC". You want to make sure that the other players don't see you as playing favorites, strip yourself of spellcasting until you resolve this crisis. (It isn't just about multiclassing, it is about a crisis of faith, and if you don't believe in the power of <insert source of spells>, then <insert source of spells> will likely no longer give you any, or at least you would probably no longer bother asking. How many people who don't believe in a diety will pray to that diety?)
Jprostovich 09-22-06, 11:17 PM	Thank you all for your advice so far. Perhaps I should further illustrate the given situation. I play in the Forgotten Realms Campaign setting. My cleric worships Tempus. He happens to be a halfling. As such he differs from others of his kind in that he has long thought the wars of heroes and myth were mighty things to live up to. He thought is his goal to lead armies. He learned the art of war and from his studies of Tempus. Thus devoted he set out to support other warriors in their conquests. However during one battle he thought to prove his might, and the might of his god (who he assumed was behind him) and charged headfirst into battle. His good friend followed him and was cut down, dead. Since then he has felt himself not worthy of or perhaps not in clear communication with Tempus. So as it sounds, it would seem he would loose his powers due to little more than his own self doubt. As for DMPCs, most of my players are newbies (i've been playing one RPG or another since I could roll, not chew, dice) I wanted to encourage roll playing so I use my character as an example, never focusing the story on him as to draw away from the crowd. Soon I hope one of the other players will pick up the mantle of DM and I can progress as I see fit. Thanks again for your help.