Post/Author/DateTime	Post
MindWandererB 01-23-08, 04:44 PM	Please don't edit the sheet after the deadline or you will lose the match. Rules of Gladius All that you need to know is written in the Rules of Gladius. It could be useful also to give a look to the Court Decisions Part 1 and Part 2. Please do not make fake accounts or insult the Elders. Pairings GM MindWandererB will pair the active Characters of Gladius after the deadline. Link to pairings. Make sure that your character is not in prison. Pitlording You should use the CoCo Dice Roller (http://www.hwx.it/wizards.com) for the fight. If you need it, there is a nice template ready to use that will help. You could find the Battle Map Tag Generator (http://www.hwx.it/coco) for dynamic Maps very useful. You must post a link to your fight in this thread when it is complete. If you need a quick and dirty tool to calculate distances between two points (in 2-D or 3-D), this tool (http://wormhole.ath.cx/coco/coco_dist.php) should suffice. Another useful link is the Quick Access tables for XP and Gold. If a fight needs to be rerun, the Pitlord has to inform the Pitlords account. He cannot react to requests from Players because the other player and the pitlord might disagree. He has no time to read the fight and the discussion. Please keep that in mind. PMs from players with rerun requests won't have an impact. Comments & Concerns Post any comments or concerns for this weeks fights in this thread. Be kind and courteous to your fellow posters, and don't feed the pitlords. Please remember that they do hard work and consume a lot of time to let you play. Above all, have FUN! If you have questions or comments on any of the changes, please make your posts be heard in the Council of Gladius!
MindWandererB 01-23-08, 04:44 PM	Pairings are done. Credits: CrazyArtificer F2 Q-1 dulsi F1 Durzulgor F1 lonewolf F2 McJarvis F2 Salrantol F1 Sjiggie F2 TelinArtho F1 A-1 Q-1 templer10 F2 whitebaron F1 Q2 MindWandererB A2 SauroGrenom A1 The Dread Dormammu Q-1 Key: F=Fight, Q=Quest, C=Campaign, G=Guildmaster, A=Admin or Active Characters
Zevox 01-23-08, 04:47 PM	Cool - Istima gets a monster fight (about time all those knowledge skills of his came in handy for something other than RP), and Arden gets a wierd-but-interesting match with a Shadow. @ My pitlords - expect tactics tomorrow evening. Except of course templer10, who already has Mithos' tactics from last week. Zevox
templer10 01-23-08, 04:52 PM	MWB - 4 fights? IAm pretty sure i asked for 3.
Hirumajoe 01-23-08, 04:54 PM	@MWB: Just a note, Altair fought Thorell last week, admittedly in the Temple as opposed to the arena. Not sure if this weeks fight should be changed around or not. Although McJarvis might like the chance to get back at Altair...
MindWandererB 01-23-08, 04:55 PM	MWB - 4 fights? IAm pretty sure i asked for 3. Yes--you have two new ones, and two holdovers you didn't do last week. @MWB: Just a note, Altair fought Thorell last week, admittedly in the Temple as opposed to the arena. Not sure if this weeks fight should be changed around or not. Although McJarvis might like the chance to get back at Altair...It's a significantly different map, so I'll leave it as is.
lonewolf 01-23-08, 04:55 PM	Morro vs Korwald again?? we´ve had this fight twice already and for Morro this would be 3 out of total 5 battles against Korwald. Any chance for a change there?
templer10 01-23-08, 04:57 PM	Yes--you have two new ones, and two holdovers you didn't do last week. Well the fact i didnt do them last week Since my computer was out for 3 days doesnt mean i can do 4 this week... And those 2 holdevers are hard to run 2. I would really prefer to lose 1 of the new ones.
lonewolf 01-23-08, 05:02 PM	Had I seen that Longshot is active, I would have activated Samuel also. A shame... Istimas Monster Info: 1 Phrenic Rakshasa have fun
whitebaron 01-23-08, 05:03 PM	Lelenia leveled to ECL4 - seems to be paired in the wrong league.
hogarth 01-23-08, 05:04 PM	Well the fact i didnt do them last week Since my computer was out for 3 days doesnt mean i can do 4 this week... And those 2 holdevers are hard to run 2. I would really prefer to lose 1 of the new ones. I'll take "Darian Thorne vs. Monster" if you like.
templer10 01-23-08, 05:06 PM	I'll take "Darian Thorne vs. Monster" if you like. have fun.
MindWandererB 01-23-08, 05:07 PM	Morro vs Korwald again?? we´ve had this fight twice already and for Morro this would be 3 out of total 5 battles against Korwald. Any chance for a change there?All right--I'll mix it up with the aforementioned.Well the fact i didnt do them last week Since my computer was out for 3 days doesnt mean i can do 4 this week... And those 2 holdevers are hard to run 2. I would really prefer to lose 1 of the new ones.Okay. Vivi (Dr.Funk) vs. Durzulgor I (Durzulgor) : TelinArtho [Plains] Morro Earthshaker (dulsi) vs. Altair (Hirumajoe) : CrazyArtificer [Arena] Korwald Barandar (lonewolf) vs. Thorell Runesmith (McJarvis) : Durzulgor [Temple]
MindWandererB 01-23-08, 05:10 PM	Lelenia leveled to ECL4 - seems to be paired in the wrong league. Not according to her fight record, she didn't. In her last fight, she had 4736/6000 XP and earned 1152, bringing her to 5888/6000. Edit: Ah, now I see the mistake--you hadn't added in her last fight's XP at the time. Hold on, I'll move stuff around. Edit 2: S'lertak Ssilva (TelinArtho) vs. Unknown Monster : CrazyArtificer [Arena] Morro Earthshaker (dulsi) vs. Altair (Hirumajoe) vs. Lelenia Rovan (whitebaron) : CrazyArtificer [Arena] [All-vs-All]
whitebaron 01-23-08, 05:24 PM	Edit: Ah, now I see the mistake--you hadn't added in her last fight's XP at the time. Hold on, I'll move stuff around. yep, thats what prevented me last week from editing her on time - i missed the xp on top of the sheet, but they were in the accounting already correct. when i calculated the new, i saw that i should level and wondered...
McJarvis 01-23-08, 05:50 PM	Damn...if I had gotten in on that 3-player ffa I might have garnered enough xp to level up. ;) edit- and good grief, I think I've fought in the temple every round so far. Not that I'm complaining about that- but I'd like some more variety...
lonewolf 01-23-08, 05:53 PM	Damn...if I had gotten in on that 3-player ffa I might have garnered enough xp to level up. ;) shut up and be satisfied with your near-auto win... :embarrass
McJarvis 01-23-08, 05:55 PM	shut up and be satisfied with your near-auto win... :embarrass I'm not gonna let such fancy talk lull me into a sense of security again. I'd wager half of thorell's losses have been against "near-auto wins" ;)
Sjiggie 01-23-08, 06:21 PM	Monster Knowledge for Flutterthought. 2 Medium Monsters
Rauul 01-23-08, 06:37 PM	Damn...if I had gotten in on that 3-player ffa I might have garnered enough xp to level up. ;) edit- and good grief, I think I've fought in the temple every round so far. Not that I'm complaining about that- but I'd like some more variety... Oh hush... my poor half-orc vs a T10 monster and a Psion.... in the City no less.. Guess i will get busy on these Looser Tactics... will be fast
McJarvis 01-23-08, 06:42 PM	Rule #1 of CoCo: ALWAYS complain about your matchup. :)
Rauul 01-23-08, 07:11 PM	Rule #1 of CoCo: ALWAYS complain about your matchup. :) I don't complain much... I take my wins and many many Loses and only complain about you :)
CrazyArtificer 01-23-08, 07:18 PM	I suppose that if we need to send tactics to dulsi we are free to change them, right MWB? note to my players. I got an exam on Friday and one on Tuesday. The sooner I get the tactics, the better.
MindWandererB 01-23-08, 07:24 PM	I suppose that if we need to send tactics to dulsi we are free to change them, right MWB? Correct, although I haven't looked at the ones you posted. Speaking of which... tactics sent.
hogarth 01-23-08, 07:26 PM	So templer10 is running "Darian Thorne vs. Monster", not me, correct?
lonewolf 01-23-08, 07:26 PM	So templer10 is running "Darian Thorne vs. Monster", not me, correct? I think that at least templer is under the impression that you are running it...
CrazyArtificer 01-24-08, 04:48 AM	S'lertak Ssilva is going to fight a Tiny monster.
templer10 01-24-08, 06:01 AM	Oh hush... my poor half-orc vs a T10 monster and a Psion.... in the City no less.. Guess i will get busy on these Looser Tactics... will be fast IAm betting on the psion with Ton of pps on this one...
templer10 01-24-08, 06:02 AM	I think that at least templer is under the impression that you are running it... I still am? err sec - Semms i Am - Lonewolf - monster has been rolled - 3 fiendish harpies.
CrazyArtificer 01-24-08, 06:05 AM	@dulsi: tactics sent from me too.
whitebaron 01-24-08, 08:08 AM	@ca: tactics for lelenia in the ffa sent.
CrazyArtificer 01-24-08, 09:00 AM	@ca: tactics for lelenia in the ffa sent. Clarification request sent.
dulsi 01-24-08, 09:04 AM	@ca: Morro's tactics have been sent and I got your tactics. @mwb: Got your tactics as well. Do Morro's opponents really feel they need to try him again at ECL4? :) Since it is my first ffa, it's a bit different than Lelenia by herself but still. (Though of doing up another comment from his slave masters but don't feel creative enough at the moment.) BTW if anyone is interested I'm thinking of having Morro take on his slave masters as a quest after his fight cycle and probably one crafting week for mithral armor (back to 30 move and more dex bonus). I'd welcome an additional ally and will need someone to run the quest.
CrazyArtificer 01-24-08, 09:16 AM	I'd like to try a quest with Eland or Varuxor, depending on who you think may be more useful to you. Check also the Prison thread, there's a minor mistake on Morro.
Stormwind 01-24-08, 09:16 AM	@whitebaron: tactics for Varjo on her least favorite map sent.
Stormwind 01-24-08, 09:18 AM	BTW if anyone is interested I'm thinking of having Morro take on his slave masters as a quest after his fight cycle and probably one crafting week for mithral armor (back to 30 move and more dex bonus). I'd welcome an additional ally and will need someone to run the quest. @dulsi, CrazyArtificer: I'm always happy to run quests/miniquests. Just let me know when you want it to start. @CrazyArtificer: Varuxor would probably be a better ally in this case ... more options :D
CrazyArtificer 01-24-08, 09:24 AM	@dulsi, CrazyArtificer: I'm always happy to run quests/miniquests. Just let me know when you want it to start. @CrazyArtificer: Varuxor would probably be a better ally in this case ... more options :D Yes, but the poor Eland needs some XP :)
whitebaron 01-24-08, 10:25 AM	@dulsi: well, it will go entirely different than the last fight ;) @ca: reply sent. i believe FFA leaves open some rules-loopholes, which might have to be fixed sometime. @stormwind: varjos tactics received. you are wrong on one part though.
TelinArtho 01-24-08, 10:31 AM	@crazy artificer - tactics for S'lertak have been sent. Working on Kraegin's tactics now.
TelinArtho 01-24-08, 11:16 AM	Kraegin's tactics have been sent to lonewolf. Good luck to MWB. templer10's monster info for Lord Lorian has been sent.
dulsi 01-24-08, 12:00 PM	@CrazyArtificer: Varuxor would probably be a better ally in this case ... more options :D Perhaps but one should keep in mind that Morro doesn't speak a lot of languages. Varuxor doesn't know any language Morro speaks.
lonewolf 01-24-08, 12:05 PM	Perhaps but one should keep in mind that Morro doesn't speak a lot of languages. Varuxor doesn't know any language Morro speaks. well, you could hire a 1st level human expert as translator for the quest. :D
MindWandererB 01-24-08, 03:22 PM	Kraegin's tactics have been sent to lonewolf. Good luck to MWB. templer10's monster info for Lord Lorian has been sent. I'm actually just going to surrender this one. After poring over Kraegin's sheet, I just don't see winning this one to be a possibility. Kraegin and Kervan are reasonably well-matched one-on-one, but the air elemental will be up in my face by the end of round 1, and with no buff time, beating it alone would be moderately challenging. I have no reasonable chance against the both of them together.
templer10 01-24-08, 03:26 PM	Mcjarvis - Tactics for the dark one are out - have fun.
TelinArtho 01-24-08, 03:27 PM	Really? Well I guess if that's the way you feel - I didn't actually feel I had that good of a shot. Ironic how that goes I suppose... Kraegin just gets to have so much fun on fight 3 then...
CrazyArtificer 01-24-08, 04:00 PM	The battle of the 2 lizards is up (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14907736&postcount=1675) @Hirumajoe. Got your tactics
TelinArtho 01-24-08, 05:16 PM	@CA - there's a couple of issues and I'm not sure of the ramifications yet. First off - with a monster fight - you should still have tactics written out. Secondly, when entangled - the dragon cannot do a dive (because its movement is hampered). Thirdly, I don't understand why S'lertak just loses an action in round 1. It seems that you are having me delay (where a ready seems more appropriate) - and then proceed to my round 2 tactics after the delay. Strike that last one - I think that's more a deficiency of my tactics - I just assumed I would have sight of my opponent for some reason.
CrazyArtificer 01-24-08, 05:21 PM	@CA - there's a couple of issues and I'm not sure of the ramifications yet. First off - with a monster fight - you should still have tactics written out. Oh.. I didn't do that in my last monster fight and noone told me, so I thought they weren't needed. Secondly, when entangled - the dragon cannot do a dive (because its movement is hampered). ok. That wouldn't change much. I'm going from memory, but he never hit you diving and you hit him with AoO he would have provoked anyway even without diving (as the proper action) Thirdly, I don't understand why S'lertak just loses an action in round 1. It seems that you are having me delay (where a ready seems more appropriate) - and then proceed to my round 2 tactics after the delay. Strike that last one - I think that's more a deficiency of my tactics - I just assumed I would have sight of my opponent for some reason. Yes, that's what I noticed and I made you act accordingly
templer10 01-24-08, 06:06 PM	Kracknol vs 3 hag sorcerers 9 is up (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14911975&postcount=1677). Sauro- i had you surrender when you had 4 negetive levels, and 13 Str Dmg - i wanted to save you those powerstones of body purification - they wouldnt have made a diffrence anyway at this point. If you want me to use them anyway and fight to the bitter end i will.
lonewolf 01-24-08, 06:51 PM	I'm actually just going to surrender this one. After poring over Kraegin's sheet, I just don't see winning this one to be a possibility. Kraegin and Kervan are reasonably well-matched one-on-one, but the air elemental will be up in my face by the end of round 1, and with no buff time, beating it alone would be moderately challenging. I have no reasonable chance against the both of them together. And the surrender is up.
Rauul 01-24-08, 07:01 PM	@McJarvis, Tactics for Graashnak sent.. PM me with any Questions... I would Love for an Upset and Not Loose... but not expecting much
Rauul 01-24-08, 07:18 PM	@Sjiggie tactics for Wolf-claw sent.. any questions.. Pm me
SauroGrenom 01-24-08, 07:24 PM	Kracknol vs 3 hag sorcerers 9 is up (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14911975&postcount=1677). Sauro- i had you surrender when you had 4 negetive levels, and 13 Str Dmg - i wanted to save you those powerstones of body purification - they wouldnt have made a diffrence anyway at this point. If you want me to use them anyway and fight to the bitter end i will. A couple things... First the Force Cage is one of those options for a Covey of Hags. When three of them work together, they get special abilities including Force Cage. Not that that changes anything, it just answers your question. Second is that Greater Concealing Amorphia grants Total Concealment, so no targeted spells can be used against Kracknol. This effects the dispel, but it didn't dispel anything... so that doesn't help. The only thing is that Kracknol has 2 psionic foci, so he can spend a bit less time refocusing and a bit more time attacking at some point. Also Kracknol can "see" his foes with Touchsight. So they provoke AoO's in round 9. Aside from that, Kracknol's screwed. Three foes who all have more HP than him, better BAB than he has, higher AC, and 9 caster levels on top of special abilities. I should have worked out the stats on those hags before I wrote tactics, and surrendered. Regardless, I have trouble believing that's an ECL13 encounter. I'd judge it as easily ECL16-18. I figure those three would have a decent chance of slaying a Formian Queen. Oh, well.
templer10 01-24-08, 07:30 PM	A couple things... First the Force Cage is one of those options for a Covey of Hags. When three of them work together, they get special abilities including Force Cage. Not that that changes anything, it just answers your question. Second is that Greater Concealing Amorphia grants Total Concealment, so no targeted spells can be used against Kracknol. This effects the dispel, but it didn't dispel anything... so that doesn't help. The only thing is that Kracknol has 2 psionic foci, so he can spend a bit less time refocusing and a bit more time attacking at some point. Also Kracknol can "see" his foes with Touchsight. So they provoke AoO's in round 9. Aside from that, Kracknol's screwed. Three foes who all have more HP than him, better BAB than he has, higher AC, and 9 caster levels on top of special abilities. I should have worked out the stats on those hags before I wrote tactics, and surrendered. Regardless, I have trouble believing that's an ECL13 encounter. I'd judge it as easily ECL16-18. I figure those three would have a decent chance of slaying a Formian Queen. Oh, well. You might have had a shot if those 9 extra levels would have been 9 levels of fighter, becuase you can deal a lot of damage But adding a caster Based on Charisma to SLA's already based on charisma is just mean...
SauroGrenom 01-24-08, 07:54 PM	You might have had a shot if those 9 extra levels would have been 9 levels of fighter, becuase you can deal a lot of damage But adding a caster Based on Charisma to SLA's already based on charisma is just mean... No Doubt... There is something to the complaints from some people about the monster fights being unreasonable. There are some monsters that are just obscene when combined in the right ways. The Phrenic template added onto monsters with Cha based SLA's is one example. These hags are pushing the envelope. Clearly someone didn't consider that Sorcerer levels were an associated class for a Hag, otherwise each Hag would be CR14 by itself. Instead someone thought these guys were only CR10 each. I think this one got CR calculated incorrectly. For a monster with Cha based SLA's and special monster abilities, the Cha based caster is realistically an associated class. Technically a caster class is only associated if the base monster has casting ability in the class, but this is stretching it. I'm considering appealing this to a higher power, at least to get this monster taken off the list... although I'd like to see looser rewards for the CR17 encounter I just lost. Edit: You know that these monsters should have been... 3 5th level fighter green hags. Fighter would be an associated class, and the hags would be down 9 levels of casting ability, -2 on the strength drain attack DC and -4 HD. That would produce a much more thematically appropriate monster of appropriate difficulty.
MindWandererB 01-24-08, 08:12 PM	I don't really see the SLAs as making a difference here--all they used was Invisibility. Had they been any other monster with a halfway decent Cha--such as mummies or hieracosphinxes--I think the result would have been the same. @Telin: With those tactics, I'm glad I surrendered. That would have been a slaughter.
templer10 01-24-08, 08:14 PM	I don't really see the SLAs as making a difference here--all they used was Invisibility. Had they been any other monster with a halfway decent Cha--such as mummies or hieracosphinxes--I think the result would have been the same. @Telin: With those tactics, I'm glad I surrendered. That would have been a slaughter. You might have not Noticed - but the Str dmg attack is based of charisma - Fort DC 24 for 2d4 Str damage is nasty.
TelinArtho 01-24-08, 08:15 PM	Hmm - maybe I just overestimate my opponent and his abilities then... Do note that you shorted yourself some spells though. I was a little surprised to see you had so few spell levels per fight in comparison to Kraegin and it turns out that you are missing a few. Hopefully they'll help in the future...
TelinArtho 01-24-08, 08:24 PM	That "overpowered" touch attack actually should be DC19 - not 24. The DC is based off of the racial HD - not the total HD. When a special ability allows a saving throw, the kind of save and the save DC is noted in the descriptive text. Most saving throws against special abilities have DCs calculated as follows: 10 + 1/2 the attacker’s racial Hit Dice + the relevant ability modifier.
SauroGrenom 01-24-08, 08:28 PM	I don't really see the SLAs as making a difference here--all they used was Invisibility. Had they been any other monster with a halfway decent Cha--such as mummies or hieracosphinxes--I think the result would have been the same. The point is that by using a "non-associated class" the pitlord doubles the number of bonus HD the monster has. With all those extra HD comes more HP, better saves, better attacks, better BAB, more feats, stat boosts, more class levels and associated abilities and so on. The racial special attacks are further enhanced by making the "non-associated class" be one that uses the stat associated with the special ability. In this case, the difference between an 5th level Fighter Hag and a 9th level Sorcerer Hag is a +4 DC on the racial weakness ability (from focus on Cha above normal), and 9 levels of casting ability. Those 9 levels of casting ability figured large in this battle as 4 negative levels on Kracknol (with a -4 on all saves, attacks and skills). That's a total spread of -7 on dealing with the weakness attack. I'd totally be in favor of forcing all monsters with class levels to be required to have "associated" class levels. This technique of using "non-associated" class levels causes monsters with wildly diverse abilities and twice the number of bonus HD as would otherwise be the case.
McJarvis 01-24-08, 09:31 PM	I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility to have a CoCo house rule that all PC-class levels are associated for monsters, given the difficulty there seems to be in determining whether they are associated in the first place.
TelinArtho 01-24-08, 10:44 PM	You guys do realize that this was already decided on for the redesign of the monster tables... right?
Sjiggie 01-24-08, 11:07 PM	Except nobody came to the point of actually redesigning them... right? ;)
TelinArtho 01-24-08, 11:20 PM	Not quite actually - it just takes time... and something that I don't always have.
Zevox 01-24-08, 11:22 PM	@ lonewolf - Tactics for Istima (vs Phrenic Rakshasa) have been PMed. Now theres an easy monster fight - Istima may as well be custom-designed to beat that thing, and the fact that he has plenty of pp left from his last match only makes it even more lopsided. @ whitebaron - Tactics for Arden Tarmik (vs Varjo) have been PMed. Thats a battle that will be decided by the dice, no two ways about it. Either incorporeality will save Varjo and friends or they'll die in a stroke or two each. Interesting how much is riding on that match for Arden - if Arden wins, he goes into Great Reknown and Varjo drops out of it, plus Arden levels up; if Varjo wins, pretty much the reverse happens. Heres hoping... Zevox
Sjiggie 01-24-08, 11:26 PM	Not quite actually - it just takes time... and something that I don't always have. Well I wasn't blaming you for it, I remember myself for designing one of the higher league tables when they opened up and it took a lot of time to find create a challenging encounter. But I don't know the exact guidelines for the redesigning of the monster tables or I and perhaps others can take a look at it and propose some new tables for the monster encounters.
Stormwind 01-25-08, 03:36 AM	@ whitebaron - Tactics for Arden Tarmik (vs Varjo) have been PMed. Thats a battle that will be decided by the dice, no two ways about it. Either incorporeality will save Varjo and friends or they'll die in a stroke or two each. Interesting how much is riding on that match for Arden - if Arden wins, he goes into Great Reknown and Varjo drops out of it, plus Arden levels up; if Varjo wins, pretty much the reverse happens. Heres hoping... Zevox Yeah, if it had been any other map then Varjo and friends might have been able to gain some advantage through maneuvering, but with the plains map it's just not really possible. I think I can safely say that of all the maps, the plains map is the one that is quickly becoming Varjo's least favorite place to fight (2/3 losses have been on the plains). The incorporality of Varjo and her shadows is definitely going to be the deciding factor in this matchup ... either it will save her ... or it won't ... fingers crossed. ;)
Durzulgor 01-25-08, 07:32 AM	@Sjiggie: Tactics for Undurion sent @Telin: Tactics for Durzulgor I sent
TelinArtho 01-25-08, 10:33 AM	@lonewolf - can you adjust Kraegin's rewards to note the prebuffs he had: Recall Flame Strike with a PoP (5th) and Sanctuary with a PoP (1st) Thanks.
CrazyArtificer 01-25-08, 10:54 AM	OMG I didn't know my opponent could do THAT to me (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14917132&postcount=1681) is up.
McJarvis 01-25-08, 10:57 AM	tactics have been sent for thorell
TelinArtho 01-25-08, 11:10 AM	OMG I didn't know my opponent could do THAT to me (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14917132&postcount=1681) is up. Since Dulsi is watching my kids at the moment, I'll speak up for him. In round 5, the AC cannot charge Morro. In order to execute a charge you must do the most direct line and have at least 10ft to move in. Likewise, the AC wouldn't have drawn an AoO from Morro for moving out of the cover of the rock (can't execute an AoO against something behind cover). Also - though I don't think it matters on the first set of trip rolls - Morro is a dwarf and has stability (+4 to defend vs trips). The big thing here though is that the initial hit would have missed.
whitebaron 01-25-08, 11:53 AM	btw: how did morro do an AoO with his bow? he has no umarmed strike feat. about the charge: the construct could have easily charged if it was placed a bit more to the left, since dulsi did say to take cover, but not to break charging lines. else, i naturally have no objections yet - lelenia thus far did not have to get her hands dirty.
TelinArtho 01-25-08, 12:00 PM	He has armor spikes.
CrazyArtificer 01-25-08, 12:02 PM	Since Dulsi is watching my kids at the moment, I'll speak up for him. In round 5, the AC cannot charge Morro. In order to execute a charge you must do the most direct line and have at least 10ft to move in. Maybe this is a mistake from our TT adventure, but we always charged in any straight line which ends near a square occupied by the victim If it's actually different, let me know and I'll just allow the Astral construnct to stop in a different position in round 4. Likewise, the AC wouldn't have drawn an AoO from Morro for moving out of the cover of the rock (can't execute an AoO against something behind cover). Probably another problem with my understanding of the rules. I always thought you can AoO someone which has not full cover. Also - though I don't think it matters on the first set of trip rolls - Morro is a dwarf and has stability (+4 to defend vs trips). The big thing here though is that the initial hit would have missed. Yep, I remembered Morro is a dwarf after rolling. However, even adding a +4 he is tripped anyway. So, in the end this is how it should have gone if all points you raise are correct. AC ends movement in round 4 a square left. AC charges in round 5. Fight goes ahead as it already did. @wb. Morro has Armor Spikes, and those can be used for AoO.
TelinArtho 01-25-08, 12:07 PM	Cover and Attacks of Opportunity: You can’t execute an attack of opportunity against an opponent with cover relative to you. Movement During a Charge: You must move before your attack, not after. You must move at least 10 feet (2 squares) and may move up to double your speed directly toward the designated opponent. You must have a clear path toward the opponent, and nothing can hinder your movement (such as difficult terrain or obstacles). Here’s what it means to have a clear path. First, you must move to the closest space from which you can attack the opponent. (If this space is occupied or otherwise blocked, you can’t charge.) Second, if any line from your starting space to the ending space passes through a square that blocks movement, slows movement, or contains a creature (even an ally), you can’t charge. (Helpless creatures don’t stop a charge.) If you don’t have line of sight to the opponent at the start of your turn, you can’t charge that opponent. You can’t take a 5-foot step in the same round as a charge. If you are able to take only a standard action or a move action on your turn, you can still charge, but you are only allowed to move up to your speed (instead of up to double your speed). You can’t use this option unless you are restricted to taking only a standard action or move action on your turn. Just to clear up those rules. I will let dulsi speak to the rest.
CrazyArtificer 01-25-08, 12:11 PM	Seems you are right. Anyway I don't think it'll change the outcome, as stated above ;)
TelinArtho 01-25-08, 01:55 PM	Lord Lorian (templer10) vs Corean Proudfoot, Halfing Rogue 14 (Unknown Monster) is up. I have removed the "errors on Lord Lorian's sheet" to here because it wouldn't fit otherwise. I also removed the stats for the three horses on Lord Lorian's sheet that he didn't use. @t10 - your sheet is a real mess and is painful to work with - I wish you would spend some serious time trimming it down and making it more friendly for your pitlords. That said - when you moved all of the equipment from Super Wing to Wing - you incorrectly updated Wing's HP (should be +16 hp from Con, not +20 - so 38 total). Also, Wing and Super Wing require Exotic Military saddles - costing 60gp and weighing 40lbs each. On Wing's encumbrance, you don't list the weight of the armor, the weight of the saddle or anything - but it comes out below the 300lbs anyways (but should still be there in case of enfeeblement and such). Horseshoes of Speed, by the way, weigh 12lbs not 0lbs. Lastly, please remember that all creatures that have an ECL affect rewards in that fashion. So listing your pegasi' CR is actually counterproductive and misleading - as it should list the ECL of those 2 (which is 7 for Super Wing and 6 for Wing).
dulsi 01-25-08, 02:29 PM	OMG I didn't know my opponent could do THAT to me (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14917132&postcount=1681) is up. Yup didn't notice that ability. Glad Telin took a look at the fight since I wouldn't of noticed the problems. Still don't think it will save me in the end.
Hirumajoe 01-25-08, 05:10 PM	@CrazyArtificer: Thanks for the run. I agree, without Touchsight there's little Altair can do against an invisible foe. Next level though... You've got Telin's comments, and I don't really see anything else wrong with the fight. On the bright side, I get to summon two level 3 Constructs next fight. :)
templer10 01-25-08, 05:20 PM	WW vs mithos is Up (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14920142&postcount=1683).
lonewolf 01-25-08, 05:38 PM	WW vs mithos is Up (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14920142&postcount=1683). thanks for running! You missed the stone of offensive precognition (and the one missed arrow) in Falkos rewards section. ty
McJarvis 01-26-08, 02:00 AM	My Free For All (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14923582&postcount=1686) is up.
Rauul 01-26-08, 04:53 AM	My Free For All (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14923582&postcount=1686) is up. Not going to Complain Much... but why the heck did you double move Graashnak... why.. is all i ask.. he is one of the fastest thing on the map without double moves... Granted Graashnak had a snowballs chance on the 8th level of hell in this Match... once you double moved his chance of survival dropped 100 fold... (I specifically said single move 2 times)
Salrantol 01-26-08, 06:57 AM	My Free For All (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14923582&postcount=1686) is up.Paralyzed: A paralyzed character is frozen in place and unable to move or act. A paralyzed character has effective Dexterity and Strength scores of 0 and is helpless, but can take purely mental actions. A winged creature flying in the air at the time that it becomes paralyzed cannot flap its wings and falls. A paralyzed swimmer can’t swim and may drown. An creature can move through a space occupied by a paralyzed creature ally or not. Each square occupied by a paralyzed creature, however, counts as 2 squares.Manifesting a psionic power is a purely mental action, so Felice still has three rounds to kill off The Dark One as he approaches.
hogarth 01-26-08, 10:02 AM	My Free For All (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14923582&postcount=1686) is up. Just a note that a paralyzed character has an effective Dex of 0, so that certainly has an impact on Reflex save modifiers.
McJarvis 01-26-08, 10:11 AM	Not going to Complain Much... but why the heck did you double move Graashnak... why.. is all i ask.. he is one of the fastest thing on the map without double moves... Granted Graashnak had a snowballs chance on the 8th level of hell in this Match... once you double moved his chance of survival dropped 100 fold... (I specifically said single move 2 times) Your last instruction was to "move out towards center" - and you didn't specify single move. I'm not sure why you think that single moving would give you a better chance of survival anyway- it's not like you were readying an action to do anything. Manifesting a psionic power is a purely mental action, so Felice still has three rounds to kill off The Dark One as he approaches. Ok- I will revise the fight as soon as templer gets online & makes any comments himself. Thanks for hitting that- I knew I missed something last night. Just a note that a paralyzed character has an effective Dex of 0, so that certainly has an impact on Reflex save modifiers. Again, thanks for referencing that. I'll see if it changed anything after templer comes on. [though I think you were just letting me know- I doubt graas's ref save losing even more would matter] though that certainly will have an effect on the energy retorts I forgot.
Rauul 01-26-08, 11:35 AM	Your last instruction was to "move out towards center" - and you didn't specify single move. I'm not sure why you think that single moving would give you a better chance of survival anyway- it's not like you were readying an action to do anything. Whatever and only time i said to double move was if below 10 hps.. Your correct I wasn't reading an action... I was DELAYING.. T10 , Salrantol are Known for their long Buff times.. why would i want to run in a circle around the center while they buffing (and delaying) Post the looser Awards so i can update the character for next week.. Not gonna argue (want to get him to ecl 7 so i can retire him with a BIG Failure tag)
templer10 01-26-08, 11:59 AM	Ok- I will revise the fight as soon as templer gets online & makes any comments himself. Thanks for hitting that- I knew I missed something last night. He does have a chance to Kill me - if i counted right i have 33 HP including false life after losing 11 from the first energy missle. note the ghouls touch still possibly disrupts the Energy missile - he need to make a DC 23 concetration check since it counts as a distracting spell - DC of concetration check is DC of the spell (23). The thing that Isnt clear is how many PPS felice has And whether or not she used Energy missiles from memory Before So she might not have enough PPS for many more energy missiles, And she cant use the Dorja since she can't point it at anyone. Note - That i have a second false life Scroll to be used when needed. Note 2 - If i see felice still dangrous i should be using that hideous laughter at her i think. EDIT - 2 things more - Yu do remmber the dark one has Exp retreat going - If it's relevent for movement, and 2 - after Round 9 i should have gaas's Axe In hand so i should be using that to CDG felice - which is X3 not X2 - so an extra D8 should be rolled in round 12 which unless 1 is rolled means felice fails on the first Fort save.
McJarvis 01-26-08, 12:45 PM	It's done. I accidently used your CL on the first false life as 5 instead of 3, so that affected things a little. Most of all, though- you just didn't have the time you needed to CDG. Graas had a significant impact on this one since he ended up being a road block for your cohort. I'll post rewards tonight after ya'll get another chance to look through it.
TelinArtho 01-27-08, 02:07 PM	Vivi vs Durzulgor I is up. Nice for me to have a fight with just one attack and damage roll. Too bad for Vivi though...
lonewolf 01-28-08, 03:24 AM	Istima vs Phrenic Rakshasa is up. It never stood a chance. Note that ally penalties for the pegasus are calculated based on the ECL of the pegasus(6) and not the CR3.
Zevox 01-28-08, 01:32 PM	Istima vs Phrenic Rakshasa is up. It never stood a chance. Note that ally penalties for the pegasus are calculated based on the ECL of the pegasus(6) and not the CR3. That must have been changed when we were doing revisions to the ally rules then, because I distinctly recall a clause in the purchased ally rules making them always use CR, and it doesn't appear to be there now. In any event, thanks for the run. Glad it was quick for you. Zevox
templer10 01-28-08, 02:50 PM	darian vs 3 fiendish harpies is up (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14944888&postcount=1689), nothing 2 unpredictable.
TelinArtho 01-28-08, 04:49 PM	That must have been changed when we were doing revisions to the ally rules then, because I distinctly recall a clause in the purchased ally rules making them always use CR, and it doesn't appear to be there now. In any event, thanks for the run. Glad it was quick for you. Zevox Actually - this was one of the rules that was always done "wrong" but was discovered as such during your break. Essentially the rules always stated to use ECL if there was one and just about everyone read that as "use ECL only for mercenaries and cohorts" It still comes up because I think a lot of people still don't realize it - but it is there. I can look up the conversation about it if you like later - but your pitlord is correct.
Zevox 01-28-08, 05:04 PM	Actually - this was one of the rules that was always done "wrong" but was discovered as such during your break. Essentially the rules always stated to use ECL if there was one and just about everyone read that as "use ECL only for mercenaries and cohorts" It still comes up because I think a lot of people still don't realize it - but it is there. I can look up the conversation about it if you like later - but your pitlord is correct. No, I already knew about that aspect of the ally rules too. I'm just certain there was at one point a sentence in the purchased ally rules that said they used only CR - I recall it was brought up at one point while Diplomacy allies were still being discussed, because since it was there they were the only allies that actually used ECL other than leadership. Perhaps it was changed even earlier and we simply missed it for a while? Zevox
whitebaron 01-28-08, 06:36 PM	Arden vs. Varjo's Miss Chances is up. - or would be up, if gleemax would not strike again and don't let me upload it.
Zevox 01-28-08, 06:46 PM	Arden vs. Varjo's Miss Chances is up. - or would be up, if gleemax would not strike again and don't let me upload it. Only thing thats jumping out at me is that the rewards need to be adjusted for Varjo's allies - 21.42% penalty to her, the same as a bonus to Arden. Other than that I'm not entirely sure about the AoO Varjo supposedly got in round 7, since 5' steps don't provoke AoOs, but its irrelevant given the outcome. Zevox
lonewolf 01-28-08, 07:11 PM	darian vs 3 fiendish harpies is up (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14944888&postcount=1689), nothing 2 unpredictable. thanks for running! Please add the running Share Pain to the result section and add Darians political career. For future reference: harpys have only average maneuverability and thus have to spend at least one move action for movement each round => they cannot shoot and reload their crossbows in one round. No need to fix it for this fight.
whitebaron 01-28-08, 07:22 PM	this was already factored in when i tried to edit it again - for 5 minutes or so. about the AoO: when you leave or enter an occupied square, you provoke, no matter what kind of movement you did.
Stormwind 01-28-08, 07:35 PM	Arden vs. Varjo's Miss Chances is up. - or would be up, if gleemax would not strike again and don't let me upload it. @Zevox: Congrats. Arden was the clear favorite of the dice gods on this one. @whitebaron: Thanks for the fight ... pity that it didn't go Varjo's way. There are a few minor points with the fight. I mention them below, but given Varjo's lack of luck with the dice on this one, I see no point in an edit: Round 7 Given Varjo's tactics, she should have attacked Arden with the dagger and not sundered until 'after her first attack' as stated in her tactics. Round 9 Pitkä should have a +1 height bonus to attack due to being able to take a move action prior to her attack. This would mean her attack would have hit (and depending on str damage, Arden's attack may have missed). Round 10 Varjo tactics instructed her to 'attack full out' at this stage, not to bother with sundering or anything else. Thus she would not have provoked an AoO. Round 11 Varjo should have a +1 height bonus to attack due to being able to take a move action prior to her attack. This would mean her attack would have hit.
Salrantol 01-28-08, 08:01 PM	@McJarvis: Are rewards forthcoming for the FFA?
whitebaron 01-28-08, 08:18 PM	@stormwind: thnx for mentioning those points, but i see one thing that is not as clear: the movement part. the same applies for arden, as well. and if arden moves up first, then varjo cannot move up to gain the bonus. i decided to give that kind of movement bonus to nobody, since both of you did not specify this explicit movement. (thats why i dislike flying battles, too - even if its a stational fight, they would rise and rise and rise just to gain that +1 bonus) @round 7: seems i had problems to read your tactics properly there. maybe you could try and structure them a bit more for cases where there are two options on how to attack? Or give a round-by-round order, like: R1 : attack and try to dispel (try again immediately if it fails) R2 : try to sunder (try again once if it fails) R3+ : continue with touch attacks actually, i believe this is much easier to read than lots of text. since i'm doing tactics like this, i hardly have to complain about how my character was run...
Zevox 01-28-08, 08:26 PM	A note: I'm fairly certain its impossible for anyone with less than perfect maneuverability to do a 5' step upwards while flying, since movement costs double while ascending with any other maneuverability, which makes 5' steps impossible. Zevox
McJarvis 01-28-08, 11:34 PM	@McJarvis: Are rewards forthcoming for the FFA? Oops! I forgot- see what happens when you don't send reminder PMs? ;) I've been a little distracted (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14606380&postcount=1275) Will post those in the morning.
dulsi 01-29-08, 01:26 AM	Gimrel Sithraldor vs. Sunstroke Reborn is up. I had some trouble with the fight. Gimrel doesn't have a Dorje of Skate. Ignored and used the powerstone. Sunstroke is manifesting defensive precognition twice. That seems like a typo since they don't stack. I used offensive precognition instead. Now onto the more problematic stuff. I took "Sunstroke Reborn will likely crawl" to mean that Gimrel didn't realize Sunstroke had skate available and didn't expect him to show up in round 4. Once grappled Gimrel is screwed. Let me know if you have a problem with anything.
CrazyArtificer 01-29-08, 02:16 AM	Gimrel Sithraldor vs. Sunstroke Reborn is up. I had some trouble with the fight. Gimrel doesn't have a Dorje of Skate. Ignored and used the powerstone. Sunstroke is manifesting defensive precognition twice. That seems like a typo since they don't stack. I used offensive precognition instead. Now onto the more problematic stuff. I took "Sunstroke Reborn will likely crawl" to mean that Gimrel didn't realize Sunstroke had skate available and didn't expect him to show up in round 4. Once grappled Gimrel is screwed. Let me know if you have a problem with anything. Yes, I got confused with another characther of mine about the dorje thing:rolleyes: However the line just under 4) If I think I'm spotted (he's coming towards me) run in the opposite direction and start hiding in one of the other four pillar clusters. has been wrote just in case he'll show up instead than crawling forward, but probably it wasn't too clear. Will check on map position for hiding later EDIT: Checking this better, in round 2 I autospot Sunstroke. From the line above I should have run to the farthest pillar cluster in my opinion. http://www.hwx.it/coco/coco.php;v=1;map=arena;a=gm,S,30,55;b=su n,M,55,35,51,34;los=30,55,51,34,1 Also, in round 3 I moved closer to Sunstroke, while I should have kept distance, if I wanted to snipe. This is also my fault, as I apparently forgot to mention in my tactics where I wanted exactly to stay. Last thing, I assume in round 4 I could have simply moved away after stowing the stone, staying hidden at the same time (within 5' from cover) In the end, I'd like a rerun from round 2 possibly.
Stormwind 01-29-08, 07:15 AM	@stormwind: thnx for mentioning those points, but i see one thing that is not as clear: the movement part. the same applies for arden, as well. and if arden moves up first, then varjo cannot move up to gain the bonus. i decided to give that kind of movement bonus to nobody, since both of you did not specify this explicit movement. (thats why i dislike flying battles, too - even if its a stational fight, they would rise and rise and rise just to gain that +1 bonus) Regarding the movement thing, you had Arden doing full attacks which means that even if he could take 5ft steps upwards, there is no way he could prevent Varjo (or her shadows) using a move action before attacking from above and thus gaining the height advantage. If Arden only made a single attack per round, then your reasoning would be correct and they should be even. Regarding tactics, thanks for the comments. I'm planning on revising how I write Varjo's tactics slightly so as to hopefully eliminate that sort of uncertainty ;)
CrazyArtificer 01-29-08, 09:48 AM	OMG I didn't know my opponent could do THAT to me (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14917132&postcount=1681) is up. And rewards are up!
dulsi 01-29-08, 10:08 AM	If I think I'm spotted (he's coming towards me) run in the opposite direction and start hiding in one of the other four pillar clusters. Your right. I was thinking it said something else when I read it. Guess I needed sleep. I'll see what I can do to fix the fight.
McJarvis 01-29-08, 11:27 AM	rewards are up for my FFA.
Durzulgor 01-29-08, 12:36 PM	damn, I won't make it till the deadline today, but I'll do it in the night. McJ & Lonewolf: Sorry, but you'll get it.
dulsi 01-29-08, 01:11 PM	Gimrel Sithraldor vs. Sunstroke Reborn has been fixed. Gimrel almost had him. Unfortunately Sunstroke's speed and the limited places to hide, made him unable to avoid grappling.
CrazyArtificer 01-29-08, 02:28 PM	Gimrel Sithraldor vs. Sunstroke Reborn has been fixed. Gimrel almost had him. Unfortunately Sunstroke's speed and the limited places to hide, made him unable to avoid grappling. Well, I might still say that instead of sniping in round 6 I could have run into another place (note that Gimrel runs at 4*35 compared to 3*35 of Sunstroke), and use the extra round to draw the greatsword and manifest force screen (as in tactics) avoiding being grappled without AoO. If you have time please fix it, otherwise I'd prefer a loss over a fight carried over again.
dulsi 01-30-08, 08:10 AM	Well, I might still say that instead of sniping in round 6 I could have run into another place (note that Gimrel runs at 4*35 compared to 3*35 of Sunstroke), and use the extra round to draw the greatsword and manifest force screen (as in tactics) avoiding being grappled without AoO. If you have time please fix it, otherwise I'd prefer a loss over a fight carried over again. If you look at Sunstroke's tactics he would have sundered the greatsword before attempting the grapple. All the grab checks to start grapples would have succeed regardless of the force shield. BTW can a grapple be done as an AoO?
CrazyArtificer 01-30-08, 10:24 AM	Well, he still has to manage sundering a greatsword.. It's not the easiest thing to do :) It was a +18 vs +10 check, and the greatsword gets hardness 10. Maybe it would have taken 2-3 rounds to sunder it, enough to try to hit AC 19 a few times (with Psionic Weapon for 2d6 more damage). And yes, a grapple attempt can be made as an AoO, but I was referring to the fact that he would have provoked one grabbing me without Improved Grapple feat. BTW, I already edited Gimrel sheet, so it really doesn't matter :)
Rauul 01-30-08, 10:38 AM	held over fights don't cost us Credits if we have 2 active does it (i think wolf-claw will probably be held over..)
dulsi 01-30-08, 10:48 AM	And yes, a grapple attempt can be made as an AoO, but I was referring to the fact that he would have provoked one grabbing me without Improved Grapple feat. BTW, I already edited Gimrel sheet, so it really doesn't matter :) Well, my reading of your tactics still would have done the shot in round 6. I could see moving farther down the pillar he is behind. That would have forced Sunstroke to double move to base. I'd then have Grimel run away since he could escape and therefore not activate that condition of your tactics. Which is why I asked about grappling as an AoO. Sunstroke would have initiated the grapple as before and won.
CrazyArtificer 01-30-08, 10:51 AM	Well, my reading of your tactics still would have done the shot in round 6. This proves I must be more clear in my tactics :)
templer10 01-30-08, 11:44 AM	held over fights don't cost us Credits if we have 2 active does it (i think wolf-claw will probably be held over..) no it doesnt. You even you a full activity for free.
Durzulgor 01-30-08, 11:46 AM	The two riders... (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14953553&postcount=1691) its finally up!
McJarvis 01-30-08, 12:09 PM	The two riders... (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=14953553&postcount=1691) its finally up! Heh. In round 7 Thorell was supposed to get a full-power attack true-striked AoO against Korwald as Korwald moves away. That was the point of basing him :) [and probably would have made the fight shorter for you- only 6ish rounds] There are a few others that probably would have saved you some time. [like when Thorell casts web & opponent 5' steps towards him, this provokes an AoO I believe. I didn't check the roller, but I don't see you notating anything for my opponent being entangled during all of this either- which would have lowered his AC] Nothing that needs to be edited, though.
lonewolf 01-30-08, 02:15 PM	Damn, I should have Korwald heal himself. congrats to Thorell.
Durzulgor 01-31-08, 11:12 AM	Heh. In round 7 Thorell was supposed to get a full-power attack true-striked AoO against Korwald as Korwald moves away. That was the point of basing him :) [and probably would have made the fight shorter for you- only 6ish rounds] well, you took out your Axe andthus had no reach => he withdrew so he wasn't provoking AoOs for the first 5' he was leaving. There are a few others that probably would have saved you some time. [like when Thorell casts web & opponent 5' steps towards him, this provokes an AoO I believe. I didn't check the roller, but I don't see you notating anything for my opponent being entangled during all of this either- which would have lowered his AC] Nothing that needs to be edited, though. yup, I forgot the AoO there, but I figured in the entangled condition in the AC (at least Ithink I did! ^^) sorry again that it took me so long
McJarvis 01-31-08, 12:30 PM	well, you took out your Axe andthus had no reach => he withdrew so he wasn't provoking AoOs for the first 5' he was leaving. But he double-moved away- he didn't withdraw. No problem on taking long on my end. I'm so busy this week I didn't have time to pitlord _or_ activate characters.
MindWandererB 02-01-08, 12:20 PM	And yes, a grapple attempt can be made as an AoO, but I was referring to the fact that he would have provoked one grabbing me without Improved Grapple feat.Actually, Sunstroke can't grapple as an AoO--he doesn't threaten with his unarmed strike (no Improved Unarmed Strike).