Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Sindorin 05-25-05, 03:42 PM	Editing deadline is in 15 minutes!!!
Pittbull 05-25-05, 05:34 PM	@Pitlord: Didn't you see that Laph is ECL7? You paired him against Mer-Man.
Jindl 05-25-05, 05:41 PM	@Pitlord: Didn't you see that Laph is ECL7? You paired him against Mer-Man. There aren't any active ECL7's. JotHF is crafting, Lance and the Elder are still unresolved, and Luken was not set ready. That's mostly because we are all tired of the repeated rematches. -Jindl
Pittbull 05-25-05, 05:44 PM	@Mer-Man: "If you want the fight, you get it!"
Pitlords 05-25-05, 05:54 PM	Pairings Done Here's the procedure again: Send your tactics to your Pitlord ...who hopefully runs your fight asap Pitlords may begin running fights without tactics on saturday Late penalties due Tuesday 8 AM GMT (Western Europe) Missing penalties if not posted at all Any concerns? Post it here. Credits: +4: King Uther +3: Sindorin, Huan +2: Pittbull, Cerebus, Zyme +1: Cellardweller, Kaigan, Zerone, Xanadu +0: Jindl, Arti, Malither, Caterane -1: Spasheridan Credits for running fights: +2: Pittbull, Cerebus, Zyme +1: Caterane, Jindl, Cellardweller, Sindorin, Huan, Kaigan, Zerone, Arti, Xanadu, Malither Credits for quests: +4: King Uther +2: Sindorin (3-1), Huan -1: Jindl, Arti, Malither, Spasheridan Special Credits: +1: Caterane (admin) -2: Caterane (active PCs) I have bolded the powerlevel number on the Roster so that it's easier to look for suitable opponoments in case of interleague fights. I've also added a new tag behind the character info which looks like that [Q:1]. Q = Quests and the number is how many Quests and Miniquests you had. If this number is incorrect please tell me so that I can correct it. There's a new poll: the election (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=435939) of the new secretary of agriculture which has the pleasure of being assassinated by Ensidious Nyte sooner or later. The poll will close automatically in 5 days. You may only vote once. I am also glad to see that the number of Pitlords has risen above the critical level. Still, any new Pitlord is most welcome. And we should also be grateful for our Questlords! I have completed another section of the Campaign FAQ as well as the Campaignlording FAQ. I hope we see Campaigns soon (about 2-4 weeks). If you are interesting in running a campaign, please tell me. That's all for now Cat @Pittbull: You are the Pitlord for Rin vs Guts. Please use the fight Tagg posted (incl rolls). Just correct the mistakes and add a round by round summary. Shouldn't be too difficult. About Laph, didn't see that but if you want to fight Merman, he is ready. We have to meet sooner or later anyway. @Jindl: I suggest to make one or two new characters who step in if the others have to sit out because there are no new opponoments.
Jindl 05-25-05, 06:01 PM	I have bolded the powerlevel number on the Roster and added a new tag behind the character info which looks like that [Q:1]. Q = Quests and the number is how many Quests and Miniquests you had. If this number is incorrect please tell me so that I can correct it. JotHF has been on a quest. @Jindl: I suggest to make one or two new characters who step in if the others have to sit out because there are no new opponoments. I'm okay with Anna on a quest and JotHF crafting this week. I do have a new low-level character in the works, which will either debut next week, or possibly this week (if there are any pc's sitting out who want to fight). -Jindl
Megrim_Lord 05-25-05, 07:14 PM	oh great, Trokk gets to lose twice in a row... maybe
Salrantol 05-25-05, 07:31 PM	@Salzorin: Is it just coincidence that you debut Mataichi the week Meinrad the Many-Fisted moved up to the ECL4 league? @xanadu: Tactics for Barak Brigandslayer, who thanks whatever gods preside in Gladius for the Nimbus this week, sent via PM. @Zyme86: Tactics for Meinrad the Many-Fisted sent via PM.
Caterane 05-25-05, 07:34 PM	Tactics for Indri, Uhmentarymster, and Ixenthor sent. Merman is a more complicated matter though...
Megrim_Lord 05-25-05, 07:34 PM	@ Sindorin: tactics sent
Huan 05-25-05, 07:50 PM	@Caterane Tactics for Ixenthor recieved, thank you. Yeah, I simply did not have any time recently to get any of my characters ready, so... sorry if it caused any complications in terms of rematches.
Salzorin 05-25-05, 07:57 PM	@Salrantol: Actually it is a coincidence... I switched Mataichi just a couple days ago from what used to be a Use Magic Device rogue build that was just a bit too costly when I figured out the numbers...
Sindorin 05-25-05, 09:51 PM	Tactics have been received for Uhmentarymster and for Trokk. Are you sure you guys don't need to know your start positions??? ;) I'll run the fight if I get home in time, I'm at a friend's house at the moment and without my books/dice/map/comfy chair.
Megrim_Lord 05-25-05, 09:54 PM	Tactics have been received for Uhmentarymster and for Trokk. Are you sure you guys don't need to know your start positions??? ;) I'll run the fight if I get home in time, I'm at a friend's house at the moment and without my books/dice/map/comfy chair. doesn't matter to me
Caterane 05-26-05, 06:58 AM	Tactics for Merman sent to Cellardweller by PM. @Pittbull: Jetzt hasst er uns endgültig :D
Huan 05-26-05, 07:52 AM	@Xanadu Tactics recieved for Necavi, thank you. ... I will run the fight tomorrow (no, seriously, I will :) )
Cerebus13 05-26-05, 11:38 AM	@SoulLord - Tactics Received @my other 3 combatants - get crackin on them tactics!
Salzorin 05-26-05, 12:07 PM	@Xanadu: Tactics for Mataichi sent!
xanadu 05-26-05, 12:16 PM	@ pitlords: Necavi has been on a quest. Xanadu pitlorded 2 fights last week; I dont think I did anything costing a credit.
Caterane 05-26-05, 12:25 PM	@ pitlords: Necavi has been on a quest. Xanadu pitlorded 2 fights last week; I dont think I did anything costing a credit. You are Xanadu; why do you speak in the third person? Only Orcy the Green Wonders is allowed to do that LOL Please correct me if I got that wrong: - Necavi has been on a quest. - Xanadu (that's you) pitlorded 2 fights - You didn't do anything that costs credits
Luni 05-26-05, 01:59 PM	@Pitbull: Tactics sent for Talari.
Malither76 05-26-05, 03:15 PM	@Cat, tactics for Gareth PM'ed again email probably would have filtered me out again :)
Megrim_Lord 05-26-05, 04:48 PM	Whoa... Trokk beat Uhmentarymster... serious saratonin rush... DUUUUDE!!!! WTF!!!! THAT WAS AWESOME I WAS SUPPOSED TO BE DEAD MEAT!!! RoL!!! OMFG!!!! ROXXORZ!!!!
Zerone 05-26-05, 09:25 PM	@ Cerebus: The Battle Maiden, Saya's tactics have been sent. Square locations have been sent. No tactics have been received. *•. Z
King Uther 05-26-05, 09:34 PM	Not like you don't kow, but... @Jindl Tactics for Cyalin Orndrill sent via PM
Sindorin 05-26-05, 10:17 PM	Whoa... Trokk beat Uhmentarymster... serious saratonin rush... DUUUUDE!!!! WTF!!!! THAT WAS AWESOME I WAS SUPPOSED TO BE DEAD MEAT!!! RoL!!! OMFG!!!! ROXXORZ!!!! Yes... I was quite surprised at how that fight went. I hope I used the right touch armor classes for a prone character... Like Cat says, the rolls are good for the opponents and then bad for him. I couldn't help it, and I felt kind of bad.
Malither76 05-26-05, 10:30 PM	@sindorin, far as I could tell you were right, being prone gives you a +4 to your AC versus range attacks and U was making range touch so the +4 was right
xanadu 05-27-05, 02:40 AM	You are Xanadu; why do you speak in the third person? Only Orcy the Green Wonders is allowed to do that LOL Please correct me if I got that wrong: - Necavi has been on a quest. - Xanadu (that's you) pitlorded 2 fights - You didn't do anything that costs credits :embarrass 3rd person or not, the list you got there is right.
Caterane 05-27-05, 04:02 AM	Yes... I was quite surprised at how that fight went. I hope I used the right touch armor classes for a prone character... Like Cat says, the rolls are good for the opponents and then bad for him. I couldn't help it, and I felt kind of bad. Sindorin, you ignored important parts of my tactic. - Uhme should fly, not be on the ground. That alone is enough to change the outcome. - Uhme should keep his distance. How has it been possible that Trokk could enter melee after he was prone and laughing on the ground? Trokk stood up with a move action and instantly attacked me? After I had 6 rounds free time I position myself next to him? - Uhme should use all magic missiles first (incl scrolls), then use the other spells. - Eule should be recharged as soon as the shocking grasp has been delivered. You waited until Trokk could move again. - I clearly wrote "Keep distance". Standing next to Trokk is not what I meant by writing that. Please look over it again
Sindorin 05-27-05, 04:10 AM	Holy crap, I'm sorry about that Cat, I totally did not notice your third buff step (casting Fly). I will take a look at that. I truly apologize.
Sindorin 05-27-05, 04:14 AM	Ah, I see why I did what I did: You have in your tactics to cast Hold Person right when you see him, interrupting buffs to do this. You happened to spot him rather quickly, and by the way your tactics are written, this implied to go after him, not wait to finish buffing. Does anyone else think I should have done this differently?
Sunwolf 05-27-05, 06:31 AM	@Jindl Tactics for Telveran sent by PM
Jindl 05-27-05, 08:34 AM	Ah, I see why I did what I did: You have in your tactics to cast Hold Person right when you see him, interrupting buffs to do this. You happened to spot him rather quickly, and by the way your tactics are written, this implied to go after him, not wait to finish buffing. Does anyone else think I should have done this differently? That is what the tactics say. I think I know why Uhme was close to Trokk at the end. Scorching ray is a close range spell. -Jindl
Jindl 05-27-05, 08:36 AM	@Sunwolf/King Uther - All tactics are received. I'll be running the fight Saturday. -Jindl
Caterane 05-27-05, 09:59 AM	discussed by PM
Caterane 05-27-05, 10:18 AM	Tactics: I didn't receive any, but I assume Indri can handle an ECL 2 without them. I did send them on wednesday: Hi Uther! There's no need for a seperate thread because this will be a really boring fight. Indri manifests force screen and defensive precognition (Ac 26), then shoots at the Direbat until I have hit her twice or it is below 10 hp or I can attack it in melee. If any of these 3 conditions are met, switch to Glaive and deal subdual damage once the bat comes into range (10 rounds delay penalty for not attacking applies to bat who avoids combat). Ready vs approach. Just make sure I don't kill the bat. Heal if necessary with wand or spell. also see Fights of the Week thread: Tactics for Indri, Uhmentarymster, and Ixenthor sent. Merman is a more complicated matter though...
Sindorin 05-27-05, 10:34 AM	Discussed by PM, rerunning Trokk vs. Uhmentarymster from Round 4 after Shocking Grasp has been delivered.
Caterane 05-27-05, 10:41 AM	Just to make this clear: I do not thing you cheated. That was just to show the others that I have unnatural misfortune. Rest by PM
cellardweller 05-27-05, 11:44 AM	Tactics for Damon & Jannelle sent Tactics for MerMan received Tactics for Laph recieved Fight ETA 12 hrs
Pittbull 05-27-05, 12:03 PM	@Cellar: Starting to write my tactics now, you'll have them soon. @My Gladiators: All tactics received, everything is OK. Expect the fights to be posted tomorrow. I'm in emergency-duty, sitting in my work! :( Did I mention the beautiful weather we have this weekend? :weep: EDIT: @Cellar and Zyme: Tactics have been sent to you! Thank you!
Sindorin 05-27-05, 02:16 PM	After discussing what was wrong with the original, the rerun of Uhmentarymster the Old vs. Trokk the Eviscerator is up.
Megrim_Lord 05-27-05, 03:00 PM	Sindorin, I have a bone to pick with your rerun, you overshot THL's duration, by round 9 trokk would've stopped laughing and then immediately flew into a rage as per the tactics, and he wouldn't have died giving him a chance to heal, and cat's scorcher still would have failed if he used it based on his earlier rolls
Cerebus13 05-27-05, 03:07 PM	Heindal the Big vs. The Battle Maiden, Saya (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=6288207) is up. An interesting battle that could have swung either way...but when Heindal rolled a 1 on his UMD roll and spoiled his attack scroll for the battle, he was kinda screwed. The two 20's that Saya rolled later on didn't hurt either :P. Check my comments at the bottom please and let me know if there are any problems.
Pitlords 05-27-05, 03:31 PM	@King Uther: A minotaur - as a monstrous humanoid - cannot benefit from a potion of enlarge person. Ego whip deals half charisma damage on a successful save.
SoulLord 05-27-05, 03:39 PM	*sighs* such dissapointing rolls. Also running the numbers it seems it's just not cost effective. ah well maybe next time...... Thanks for running the fight Cerebus. Quick question though where does it say that personal range tatoos cost double? http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/items/psionicTattoos.htm
Caterane 05-27-05, 03:46 PM	Sindorin, I have a bone to pick with your rerun, you overshot THL's duration, by round 9 trokk would've stopped laughing and then immediately flew into a rage as per the tactics, and he wouldn't have died giving him a chance to heal, and cat's scorcher still would have failed if he used it based on his earlier rolls I rolled a 5 (+5 = Ac10) which missed due to you being prone and not in rage. If you stand up and rage (as per your tactic) you would have Ac10 and the scorching ray hits. And Uhme would cast another tasha's laughter on you. Btw, since I shoot magic missiles and I wanted to stay at max range, Uhme is 150ft away. And the last magic missile in round 9 brought you to zero hp.
Megrim_Lord 05-27-05, 05:30 PM	I rolled a 5 (+5 = Ac10) which missed due to you being prone and not in rage. If you stand up and rage (as per your tactic) you would have Ac10 and the scorching ray hits. And Uhme would cast another tasha's laughter on you. Btw, since I shoot magic missiles and I wanted to stay at max range, Uhme is 150ft away. And the last magic missile in round 9 brought you to zero hp. my ac would've been 11, because I'd have my dex back
Sunwolf 05-27-05, 05:38 PM	@Zerone Tactics for Brilf sent by PM
Caterane 05-27-05, 05:53 PM	my ac would've been 11, because I'd have my dex back You never lost your dex. Hideous laughter doesn't make you flatfooted. Just prone. Trokk: AC 16 [+2 Dex, +4 Chain Shirt], Touch 12, Flat 14 -2 rage = AC 10
Megrim_Lord 05-27-05, 07:16 PM	You never lost your dex. Hideous laughter doesn't make you flatfooted. Just prone. Trokk: AC 16 [+2 Dex, +4 Chain Shirt], Touch 12, Flat 14 -2 rage = AC 10 eh, no big deal, this was Trokk's last week anyway, consider him officially retired, I have other plans now :devil:
Caterane 05-28-05, 03:10 AM	Let's play him to level 7 so that he enters the Graveyard and reserves a place of rememberance. He doesn't deserve to be forgotten!
Caterane 05-28-05, 04:56 AM	Damon vs Gareth
Malither76 05-28-05, 05:23 AM	Thanks Cat sorry to make that one take so long, but in Gareths first fight he said he was against using missle weapons, he likes getting his hands dirty :) mabie I should get a few javelin's though.
Sindorin 05-28-05, 06:40 AM	Has anyone heard any word from Spasheridan? I was wanting to get through the second encounter of his quest with him, and this was supposed to happen this week... Oh well, there still might be time if he shows up... Edit: Nevermind, I just forgot that it was still paused... I was under the impression that it was only a 1 week pause...
Pittbull 05-28-05, 06:55 AM	Rerun of Greevus vs Rin (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=6293374&postcount=1583) is posted, sorry same outcome!
Megrim_Lord 05-28-05, 09:57 AM	Let's play him to level 7 so that he enters the Graveyard and reserves a place of rememberance. He doesn't deserve to be forgotten! point taken, I might be able to shake something up with him...
cellardweller 05-28-05, 10:07 AM	Tactics for MerMan received Tactics for Laph recieved Fight ETA 12 hrs Up to round 90 and it could still go either way. I'll finish it in the morning. Can we please initiate a rule that there can be no new pixies in the collesium? It really is an obscene amount of work to run fights with them.
Pittbull 05-28-05, 10:42 AM	Up to round 90 and it could still go either way. I'll finish it in the morning. Can we please initiate a rule that there can be no new pixies in the collesium? It really is an obscene amount of work to run fights with them. Hey, sorry man! I really didn't intend it to be such a long fight. If it's too anoying to run a Laph-fight, I'll retire him after this fight. I don't know what genius-like tactic Cat uses to survive 80 arrows. Sorry again!!
Zerone 05-28-05, 11:35 AM	@ Pittbull: Rin vs. Greevus (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=6293374&postcount=1583) Some amazing rolling... :P How, in the future, are we going to handle non-combat trained animals? I was on one the whole battle; when I was held, wouldn't this cause the animal to withdraw every round, not stand there, since I was no longer able to 'handle' it while there was combat going on? @ Cerebus: Saya fight I'm fine with what happened, but please note these kinds of tactics in the future - 'continue with the Arrows, staying out of movement + sling range and not allowing him to have cover' - which I did not do for several rounds while he pelted Moto with bullets... Thanks ;) *•. Z
Pittbull 05-28-05, 12:56 PM	@ Pittbull: Rin vs. Greevus (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=6293374&postcount=1583) Some amazing rolling... :P How, in the future, are we going to handle non-combat trained animals? I was on one the whole battle; when I was held, wouldn't this cause the animal to withdraw every round, not stand there, since I was no longer able to 'handle' it while there was combat going on? *•. Z But Laurze is a light warhorse and therefore it is trained for combat, that's the way Tagg ruled it in the beginning of the fight. Regarding the rolls, sorry man, it was pretty close, only one hit more and it could go a different way. I hope everbody uses the correct way of posting fights from now on, it took me three hours to fix it. @Luni and Meek Head: Sorry won't be able to post the fight as promised, but it'll be up tomorrow.
Zerone 05-28-05, 01:56 PM	But Laurze is a light warhorse and therefore it is trained for combat, that's the way Tagg ruled it in the beginning of the fight. Regarding the rolls, sorry man, it was pretty close, only one hit more and it could go a different way. True, Laurze is now a Light Warhorse, however, I was on a different Mount, the Mount spell... ;) As for the rolls, that's the breaks vs. a 22 AC :rolleyes: Thanks for fixing the fight! Edit: I just noticed this in Greevus' tactics: Things to always do: - If reduced to 10 or fewer HPs (and not likely to win in the next few rounds) move to cover if it is close, and pull out Wand of CLW and zap up to at least 20 HPs. Stow wand after usage, don't drop it. This would make him do it again and again till at 20, but instead he takes a different action when he is only up to 11 HP that ends the battle (Hold Person). Instead, I should be casting spells and Laurze should be attacking while he is trying to heal. Z
Sindorin 05-28-05, 04:46 PM	Hey, sorry man! I really didn't intend it to be such a long fight. If it's too anoying to run a Laph-fight, I'll retire him after this fight. I don't know what genius-like tactic Cat uses to survive 80 arrows. Sorry again!! It would be a headache for King Uther, but it would solve the problem if Laph joins the campaign that is starting soon... but the campaign would end at some point, so who knows...
Pittbull 05-28-05, 04:57 PM	Edit: I just noticed this in Greevus' tactics: This would make him do it again and again till at 20, but instead he takes a different action when he is only up to 11 HP that ends the battle (Hold Person). Instead, I should be casting spells and Laurze should be attacking while he is trying to heal. Z Sorry, I was told to fix the fight and tried to stick to the original, since Tagg didn't decide to use the wand, I decided to go with his version until round 12, only adding the missing attacks of Laurze. But I must admit, that you're right, following Greevus tactic strictly, leads to your version. As I mentioned above, I only fixed the fight and brought it to a correct posting. If there is a strong wish for a rererun, I'll try to do this but only from the very beginning with new tactics. This fight takes now over three weeks and should have end soon. So, Zerone if you really want a rererun just tell me and, of course, Cerebus needs to give his go too.
Caterane 05-28-05, 06:11 PM	I don't like the idea of this fight going into week 4 because of such a minor interpretation. There have been fights with much bigger mistakes which haven't been rerun. Last week, this fight has been rerun just because 3 attacks from a light warhorse that has little chance to hit were missing. Now because of an interpretation of the winner's tactic that could easily be read the other way (see below). Zerone, Cerebus has already done you a favor when he said he's ok with a rerun just because of the light warhorse. His character had to sit out. Now again. Sorry this is not going to happen. Things to always do: - If reduced to 10 or fewer HPs (and not likely to win in the next few rounds) move to cover if it is close, and pull out Wand of CLW and zap up to at least 20 HPs. Stow wand after usage, don't drop it. Hold person definately qualifies as such.
Zerone 05-28-05, 07:21 PM	because of such a minor interpretation It is stated plainly in his tactics. Heal till above 20, not around, close too, etc. With me at full HP there is no way you would assume that you have a chance to win with 3 HP in the next few rounds, especially with an Acid Arrow damage to come. So he should heal up above 20 HP if he uses his wand even 1 time. That is what his tactics state. I've been screwed in this fashion before, why the change of heart now, Cat? 1. He should either have to Heal above 20 before casting Hold Person. or 2. He should cast Hold Person on the round he Cures from 3 HP to 11 HP, so he is at 3 HP, takes the 5 Acid Arrow damage, and Laurze finishes him off/he bleeds to death. His character had to sit out. And mine didn't? You should put yourself in both person's shoes before you say something. Pittbull, it's ok. You did what was asked of you as a Pitlord. :) Cerebus, this fight was incorrect from the start. What are your feelings on this matter? *•. Z
Megrim_Lord 05-28-05, 07:43 PM	And mine didn't? You should put yourself in both person's shoes before you say something. he has a point
cellardweller 05-29-05, 12:04 AM	If it's too anoying to run a Laph-fight, I'll retire him after this fight. The problem is that many gladiators have no way to attack an invisible ranged opponent and have no choice but to bunker down. This makes the odds of Laph hitting less likely and given that he is only doing d6+1 damage, they can usually heal faster than Laph can inflict. If you could come up with a way for laph to consitently do more damage such as adding sneak attack or elemental damage (rather than the 1 or 2 heavy hitting shots that he currently has) it would make the fights shorter and increase his odds of winning.
Jindl 05-29-05, 12:45 AM	The problem is that many gladiators have no way to attack an invisible ranged opponent and have no choice but to bunker down. This makes the odds of Laph hitting less likely and given that he is only doing d6+1 damage, they can usually heal faster than Laph can inflict. If you could come up with a way for laph to consitently do more damage such as adding sneak attack or elemental damage (rather than the 1 or 2 heavy hitting shots that he currently has) it would make the fights shorter and increase his odds of winning. Given the 10 rounds or so that Laph has available between shots when facing a waiting target like Mer-man, wouldn't it make since for him to regain his psionic focus after each shot, and expel it for each shot? That way, when he does hit he does an extra 2d6 of damage? About the fight, I have a couple of questions? 1. Why did Laph's to hit bonus change from +15 to +14 in Rnd 14 (which caused him to miss by 1)? 2. In Rnds 35-46, Laph's to hit should be the same as Rnds 17-33, which you had at +16. Why do you have it at +15? He should have hit with an 18 or better. He rolled 2x "18", which would have both hit if the +16 was correct. 3. In Rnd 68, you state that Mer-man has been pocketing his unbroken arrows. I just don't see how this could be possible? Wouldn't the actions Mer-man has to spend guiding his mount over to and picking up each arrow prevent him from maintaining his total defense? Or would he only be able to get some of the missed and unbroken arrows without giving up his total defense? Assuming a standard distribution (that 50% of the arrows survive), Mer-man would have to recover 1 arrow every two rounds that he spent in total defense. Of course any rounds that he spends drawing/drinking a healing potion don't count. And this would also assume that each arrow is within a single move of his mount, as the action of picking up the arrow would otherwise occur in the midpoint of the mounts double move. Is this reasoning correct? If so, then I think Mer-man couldn't have pocketed all of the unbroken arrows, more like half of them. 4. Note that Laph can renew his greater invisibility at will as a free action. At that time any equipment he is carrying which is currently visible will become invisible. You made a comment about not being able to pick up the javelins without giving away his position. This is the simple way to do it. Also note that Laph shouldn't need to dust off the flour, as when he renews his greater invisibility, any flour that is stuck to him will become invisible as well. 5. In Rnd 73, Mer-man looses his shield, dropping his AC to 24 (28 with total defense). Since Mer-man readied a disarm in Rnd 74 instead of taking total defense, and Mer-man can't use his mount for cover while attacking, Laph's AoO in Rnd 75 should have hit AC 24. 6. Laph should have taken an AoO (vs AC 24) in Rnd 76 when Mer-man attempts to disarm him again. 7. In Rnd 78, Mer-man does not have his sheild out and he did not take total defense. With cover from his mount, his AC should be 28, which is exactly what Laph hit with his quarterstaff attack. 8. Laph should be getting AoO's against Mer-man's grapple attempts in Rnds 80, 81, 82, 83, and 99. He should also get one when Mer-man draws the bags of flour in Rnds 85, 89, and 95. Note that Mer-man's AC in all of these Rnds should be 28 (or 24 for the grapple AoO's, since he can't use his mount for cover while attacking.) 9. In Rnd 88, I am assuming that Mer-man was readying to shoot Laph, since he saw the pixie withdraw and he had his bow ready. If that is the case, then Laph get's an AoO in Rnd 89 when Mer-man's readied action triggers, causing him to fire his bow while threatened by Laph. Same thing for Mer-man's readied attacks in Rnds 92 and 98. 10. Why doesn't Laph withdraw before attempting to use the powerstone: vigor in Rnd 102? Doing so would have prevented damage until he successfully activated the stone, and would have prevented him from going negative from the effort. Okay, so maybe that was more than just a couple of questions. As long as this fight was, I hope you'll review it tomorrow (after you take a little break :D) -Jindl
cellardweller 05-29-05, 02:05 AM	Given the 10 rounds or so that Laph has available between shots when facing a waiting target like Mer-man, wouldn't it make since for him to regain his psionic focus after each shot, and expel it for each shot? That way, when he does hit he does an extra 2d6 of damage? Laph has buffs up (OPrecog, Compression) that would run out if he stopped to regain focus. 1. Why did Laph's to hit bonus change from +15 to +14 in Rnd 14 (which caused him to miss by 1)? Because I ran the fight with OP having a duration of 10 rounds instead of 30 :mad:. Extra "3"+1 damage. 2. In Rnds 35-46, Laph's to hit should be the same as Rnds 17-33, which you had at +16. Why do you have it at +15? He should have hit with an 18 or better. He rolled 2x "18", which would have both hit if the +16 was correct. As above. Thats an extra "6"+1 and "5"+1 Just in case anyone else is thoroghly confused, these are the attack modifiers as they should be: Laph normal +14 (8dex+2bab+1size+2invisible+1enh) Laph OP +15 (8dex+2bab+1size+2invisible+1enh,+1 insight) - rounds 1-15, 47-90 Laph OP&CP +17(9dex+2bab+2size+2invisible+1enh,+1 insight) rounds 16-46 3. In Rnd 68, you state that Mer-man has been pocketing his unbroken arrows. I just don't see how this could be possible? Wouldn't the actions Mer-man has to spend guiding his mount over to and picking up each arrow prevent him from maintaining his total defense? Or would he only be able to get some of the missed and unbroken arrows without giving up his total defense? Assuming a standard distribution (that 50% of the arrows survive), Mer-man would have to recover 1 arrow every two rounds that he spent in total defense. Of course any rounds that he spends drawing/drinking a healing potion don't count. And this would also assume that each arrow is within a single move of his mount, as the action of picking up the arrow would otherwise occur in the midpoint of the mounts double move. Is this reasoning correct? If so, then I think Mer-man couldn't have pocketed all of the unbroken arrows, more like half of them. Statistically there will be one arrow to collect every 2 rounds. 1)Standard Action for full defence, MEA to pick it up. 2)Standard Action for full defence, MEA to pocket it. 4. Note that Laph can renew his greater invisibility at will as a free action. At that time any equipment he is carrying which is currently visible will become invisible. You made a comment about not being able to pick up the javelins without giving away his position. This is the simple way to do it. Also note that Laph shouldn't need to dust off the flour, as when he renews his greater invisibility, any flour that is stuck to him will become invisible as well. True, I didn't consider that. This negates the arrow on round 87 giving Laph back 11hp. 5. In Rnd 73, Mer-man looses his shield, dropping his AC to 24 (28 with total defense). Since Mer-man readied a disarm in Rnd 74 instead of taking total defense, and Mer-man can't use his mount for cover while attacking, Laph's AoO in Rnd 75 should have hit AC 24. Yep, I neglected to remove the shield AC from the point of melee onward. "6" damage. 6. Laph should have taken an AoO (vs AC 24) in Rnd 76 when Mer-man attempts to disarm him again. 7. In Rnd 78, Mer-man does not have his sheild out and he did not take total defense. With cover from his mount, his AC should be 28, which is exactly what Laph hit with his quarterstaff attack. 8. Laph should be getting AoO's against Mer-man's grapple attempts in Rnds 80, 81, 82, 83, and 99. He should also get one when Mer-man draws the bags of flour in Rnds 85, 89, and 95. Note that Mer-man's AC in all of these Rnds should be 28 (or 24 for the grapple AoO's, since he can't use his mount for cover while attacking.) AoO's from grapple "4","13","11","2" - no extra damage There was implied 5' steps before drawing the bags of flour so no AoO's there. 9. In Rnd 88, I am assuming that Mer-man was readying to shoot Laph, since he saw the pixie withdraw and he had his bow ready. If that is the case, then Laph get's an AoO in Rnd 89 when Mer-man's readied action triggers, causing him to fire his bow while threatened by Laph. Same thing for Mer-man's readied attacks in Rnds 92 and 98. No, he was readying an unarmed grapple, because he new Laph had to come back into melee range. 10. Why doesn't Laph withdraw before attempting to use the powerstone: vigor in Rnd 102? Doing so would have prevented damage until he successfully activated the stone, and would have prevented him from going negative from the effort. This was my way of resolving a "pitlords dilema". Pitbull didn't mention the powerstone of vigor but did say "use anything". The cost of the powerstone was quite high for the chance of blowing through 40 odd hp before it ran out. I couldn't decide what Pitbull would want so I kept Laph where he was and let fate make the decision. Where to now>> Laph has an extra 11hp Merman has -23 hp (enough to drop him into unconsciousness because his rage, frenzy and vigor would all have expired). I will need to go back and edit the rounds affected by flour, as Merman would not waste actions repeating the attack after it was ineffectual the first time. which means that Laph does not necissarily win. Oh boy, this is going to be messy :bigeyes:. In the interests of me not spending 6hrs changing the fight, I am giving Laph free actions to renew his Offensive Precog twice and Merman a free action to activate his tatoo of vigor. Edit: Ps - My afternoon is booked out, so I am unlikely to make this changes till tommorrow.
Pittbull 05-29-05, 03:17 AM	Sorry Cellar, this has been Laph's last arena-fight.
Jindl 05-29-05, 12:17 PM	Sorry Cellar, this has been Laph's last arena-fight. @Pittbull - I think Cellar sum'd it up well when he suggested that Laph shift his tactics from slowly wearing an opponent down to finding a way to deal more damage. If Laph were to take regain focus after every shot, then expend it to use psionic shot (and later, greater psionic shot), then that additional damage would make a huge difference in the fight. Although I don't think you'll face many opponents with huge AC's like Mer-man's, you could bring along a little extra gear and adjust your tactics to deal with them. A couple of tanglefoot bags would have dropped Mer-man's AC 2 pts (and made ride checks for cover not automatic for him). And a few alchemist fires would have let you make touch attacks against his much lower touch AC. And against a mounted foe with a high AC (especially one who doesn't have the mounted combat feat), you should really consider slaying the mount first to get rid of the +4 cover bonus to AC. The pixie fights are only bad when the pixie needs a 19-20 to hit and his opponent can heal almost as fast. If you can either increase the chances that you'll hit or increase the damage on a successful hit, then the duration of the fight will drop considerably. I hope you don't retire Laph, but instead consider these (and other) alternatives. Oh, and don't forget about our 2 on 4 match in 2 weeks ... :D -Jindl
Caterane 05-29-05, 12:28 PM	Given the 10 rounds or so that Laph has available between shots when facing a waiting target like Mer-man, wouldn't it make since for him to regain his psionic focus after each shot, and expel it for each shot? That way, when he does hit he does an extra 2d6 of damage? About the fight, I have a couple of questions? 1. Why did Laph's to hit bonus change from +15 to +14 in Rnd 14 (which caused him to miss by 1)? 2. In Rnds 35-46, Laph's to hit should be the same as Rnds 17-33, which you had at +16. Why do you have it at +15? He should have hit with an 18 or better. He rolled 2x "18", which would have both hit if the +16 was correct. 3. In Rnd 68, you state that Mer-man has been pocketing his unbroken arrows. I just don't see how this could be possible? Wouldn't the actions Mer-man has to spend guiding his mount over to and picking up each arrow prevent him from maintaining his total defense? Or would he only be able to get some of the missed and unbroken arrows without giving up his total defense? Assuming a standard distribution (that 50% of the arrows survive), Mer-man would have to recover 1 arrow every two rounds that he spent in total defense. Of course any rounds that he spends drawing/drinking a healing potion don't count. And this would also assume that each arrow is within a single move of his mount, as the action of picking up the arrow would otherwise occur in the midpoint of the mounts double move. Is this reasoning correct? If so, then I think Mer-man couldn't have pocketed all of the unbroken arrows, more like half of them. 4. Note that Laph can renew his greater invisibility at will as a free action. At that time any equipment he is carrying which is currently visible will become invisible. You made a comment about not being able to pick up the javelins without giving away his position. This is the simple way to do it. Also note that Laph shouldn't need to dust off the flour, as when he renews his greater invisibility, any flour that is stuck to him will become invisible as well. 5. In Rnd 73, Mer-man looses his shield, dropping his AC to 24 (28 with total defense). Since Mer-man readied a disarm in Rnd 74 instead of taking total defense, and Mer-man can't use his mount for cover while attacking, Laph's AoO in Rnd 75 should have hit AC 24. 6. Laph should have taken an AoO (vs AC 24) in Rnd 76 when Mer-man attempts to disarm him again. 7. In Rnd 78, Mer-man does not have his sheild out and he did not take total defense. With cover from his mount, his AC should be 28, which is exactly what Laph hit with his quarterstaff attack. 8. Laph should be getting AoO's against Mer-man's grapple attempts in Rnds 80, 81, 82, 83, and 99. He should also get one when Mer-man draws the bags of flour in Rnds 85, 89, and 95. Note that Mer-man's AC in all of these Rnds should be 28 (or 24 for the grapple AoO's, since he can't use his mount for cover while attacking.) 9. In Rnd 88, I am assuming that Mer-man was readying to shoot Laph, since he saw the pixie withdraw and he had his bow ready. If that is the case, then Laph get's an AoO in Rnd 89 when Mer-man's readied action triggers, causing him to fire his bow while threatened by Laph. Same thing for Mer-man's readied attacks in Rnds 92 and 98. 10. Why doesn't Laph withdraw before attempting to use the powerstone: vigor in Rnd 102? Doing so would have prevented damage until he successfully activated the stone, and would have prevented him from going negative from the effort. Okay, so maybe that was more than just a couple of questions. As long as this fight was, I hope you'll review it tomorrow (after you take a little break :D) -Jindl You went through the whole fight in such detail and didn't spot even ONE of the many mistakes in Merman's favor? No comment :bored: So did I win or do I have to analyze this fight on my own? For example, Merman's AC is 36 not 34, etc
Jindl 05-29-05, 12:55 PM	Laph has buffs up (OPrecog, Compression) that would run out if he stopped to regain focus. Since it wasn't in his tactics, I definately understand. However, I think Pittbull should put it in his tactics in the future :D Statistically there will be one arrow to collect every 2 rounds. 1)Standard Action for full defence, MEA to pick it up. 2)Standard Action for full defence, MEA to pocket it. What about the rounds Mer-man spent drawing/drinking potions. I guess there would be 1 arrow left for every 2 potions that Mer-man drank. Probably not important in the long run, eh? No, he was readying an unarmed grapple, because he new Laph had to come back into melee range. Then Laph would get an AoO against the grapple attempts, right? This was my way of resolving a "pitlords dilema". Pitbull didn't mention the powerstone of vigor but did say "use anything". The cost of the powerstone was quite high for the chance of blowing through 40 odd hp before it ran out. I couldn't decide what Pitbull would want so I kept Laph where he was and let fate make the decision. Considering that you allowed Mer-man to 5 ft step back to avoid an AoO with the flour, then it would seem only fair to let Laph take a 5 ft back (or up) to use the powerstone. But as a pitlord adaptation, that's your call. You went through the whole fight in such detail and didn't spot even ONE of the many mistakes in Merman's favor? No comment So did I win or do I have to analyze this fight on my own? For example, Merman's AC is 36 not 34, etc I haven't noticed any mistakes in Mer-man's favor (other than the AC issue, which I am about to discuss). Regarding Mer-man's AC, he wanted to use the towershield in this fight. Mer-man doesn't have any other shields so I don't understand why there is a +2 shield bonus factored into his AC. Mer-man's base AC should be 24 (27 with towershield). Note that towershields have a max Dex of +2, which is why Mer-man's AC only went up by 3 when using it. Of course, the fact that Mer-man isn't proficient with towershields would put a -10 acp on all of his Str/Dex based skills, such as Ride. Which would then require him to roll an 11 or better on every ride check needed to take cover. So Mer-man's AC should have been 24, 27 with the tower shield, 31 with towershield and total defense, and 35 when using the towershield + total defense + passing his Ride check (about half the time w/ the tower shield). Cellar may need to go back an look at all of Laph's attack rolls. Basically, I would suggest identifying what d20 roll Laph needs to hit AC 35, AC 31, and AC 27. Then if Laph hit 35, he definately hit. If he hit 31, then roll Mer-man's ride check and if he fails then Laph's arrow hits. And if Mer-man didn't take total defense then reduce both of the previous AC's by 4. Once Mer-man looses his towershield, his AC drops to 28 with cover from his mount, 24 vs AoO's (when he can't take cover against while attacking). I think this sounds a lot tougher than it really is (at least I hope its easier than it sounds). Once you identify what d20 rolls Laph needs to hit the above AC's, it should be pretty simple to go down the list of attack rolls and identify which ones hit, then compare the number of hits to the number of damage rolls. BTW: I definately think Cellar should get another credit for this fight. :D -Jindl
Pittbull 05-29-05, 01:40 PM	BTW: I definately think Cellar should get another credit for this fight. :D -Jindl Yes, please Mr. Pitlord, he deserves it!! Edit: As promised, the fight Talari vs. Mugen (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=6301991&postcount=1586) is up!
Malither76 05-29-05, 04:21 PM	Dr. Salvador vs Xyanthraxia is up
Caterane 05-29-05, 05:22 PM	I haven't noticed any mistakes in Mer-man's favor Ok, let us keep this statement in mind... Given the 10 rounds or so that Laph has available between shots when facing a waiting target like Mer-man, wouldn't it make since for him to regain his psionic focus after each shot, and expel it for each shot? That way, when he does hit he does an extra 2d6 of damage? Psionic shot is with no word mentioned in his tactics. It would be a pitlord adaption to use it even once but regaining focus after every round would be way too much. That was what I feared the most, and I blew a sigh of relief when I didn't read it in Pittbull's tactic. Infact, he even wrote he wants a "quick fight". Since we currently go by the very word of the tactic - that's why I was being handicapped in the past weeks - I don't see why it should be differently now. On top of that, Laph's buffs run out. I don't think chosing the best course of action after the fight is up is a good way to discuss fights. Would you have made that suggestion if Laph had hit thrice or more due to his buffs? 2. In Rnds 35-46, Laph's to hit should be the same as Rnds 17-33, which you had at +16. Why do you have it at +15? He should have hit with an 18 or better. He rolled 2x "18", which would have both hit if the +16 was correct. Why do you have it at +16? Base+12 +2 compression = +14. Offensive prescience gives +2 to damage, not attack. What about the rounds Mer-man spent drawing/drinking potions. I guess there would be 1 arrow left for every 2 potions that Mer-man drank. Probably not important in the long run, eh? Tactic: - Heal as soon as I got more than 9 damage. Move Ganimed 80ft away and behind cover so that he cannot attack in that round. Use invisibility if out of cures (see above). 3. In Rnd 68, you state that Mer-man has been pocketing his unbroken arrows. I just don't see how this could be possible? Wouldn't the actions Mer-man has to spend guiding his mount over to and picking up each arrow prevent him from maintaining his total defense? Or would he only be able to get some of the missed and unbroken arrows without giving up his total defense? Assuming a standard distribution (that 50% of the arrows survive), Mer-man would have to recover 1 arrow every two rounds that he spent in total defense. Of course any rounds that he spends drawing/drinking a healing potion don't count. And this would also assume that each arrow is within a single move of his mount, as the action of picking up the arrow would otherwise occur in the midpoint of the mounts double move. Is this reasoning correct? If so, then I think Mer-man couldn't have pocketed all of the unbroken arrows, more like half of them. Tactic: If an arrow doesn't break, use remaining move action to pick it up, and next round remaining move action to store it And as already said, I would ride out of LOS so that he cannot attack me. 4. Note that Laph can renew his greater invisibility at will as a free action. At that time any equipment he is carrying which is currently visible will become invisible. You made a comment about not being able to pick up the javelins without giving away his position. This is the simple way to do it. Also note that Laph shouldn't need to dust off the flour, as when he renews his greater invisibility, any flour that is stuck to him will become invisible as well. Asides from the javelins being stored in my pants (or at least they should be stored), this adaption is - considering the current preference to read tactics; especially mines - is also something Pittbull should come up with, not Jindl after the fight. I wish my characters would be played like that. And also: per prefight discussion with CD, I made clear that the flour is a way to affect Laph. I wouldn't use flour if I'd know that it is useless. Especially not 4 times. 5. In Rnd 73, Mer-man looses his shield, dropping his AC to 24 (28 with total defense). Since Mer-man readied a disarm in Rnd 74 instead of taking total defense, and Mer-man can't use his mount for cover while attacking, Laph's AoO in Rnd 75 should have hit AC 24. Merman made no ride check. This raises his AC to 28. That's another mistake in Merman's favor, Jindl. One of many. He should also get one when Mer-man draws the bags of flour in Rnds 85, 89, and 95. ok, but when it comes to Laph being in the same situation you suddenly reverse your opinion about handling such a situation and say: 10. Why doesn't Laph withdraw before attempting to use the powerstone: vigor in Rnd 102? So you complain that Merman didn't provoke an AoO (because he did not 5ft step) but complain that Laph DID provoke an AoO (because he did not 5ft step)? :/ And now... The long list of mistakes in Merman's favor which Jindl didn't find: :D Laph 28/28 2/3 Inertial Armour(61), Force Screen(12), Offensive Precognition(13)- Laph does not have that power. /*Just noticed that I probably should have renewed offensive precog when it ran out. This turns the 3 19's in the 17-34 block into hits "2"+"3"+"1"+3=9 There is no Offensive precognition to renew. This damage should not happen. +9 hp for Merman. There's also no offensive precognition in the first place. Please look over it again. Round 74: Laph descends to melee range while drawing his longspear and attacks ("14"+7=21 vs AC30) (Listen "9"+10-1=18 vs DC0) Did you include the -20 penalty to move silently because of the attack? Round 11: I am 9 below maximum. I should use a cure potion in that round. See tactic. Round 34: I am 9 below maximum. I should use a cure potion in that round. See tactic. - That also means that I would expand my cure potions much earlier and refer to invisibility+war cry which would cause some of Laph's attacks to miss. Vigor after that. Round 85: Since Merman had his glaive in hand, Laph would incur an AoO even though withdrawing. Since it is in place of the harpoon attacks that doesn't happen, the "18" will be used which deals 1d10+9 damage. - Merman readied to disarm should he be attacked. Since I know from which direction the attack came, I do not have to guess the square, or pinpoint it with listen. This has been done wrong in many rounds. Additionally, Ganimed can clearly pinpoint Laph's position with a move action (which is written in my tactic!) and attack the correct square, so Merman knows the square in any case. I'll list only those rounds where Merman guessed the wrong square or failed to pinpoint: - Round 79: Merman guesses at Laph's position and tries to grapple him ("36" wrong square) - Round 80-92: How can one fail a 50% chance 7 times in a row?? - Round 88: Guessed right square, using up a roll of 98 which would have been the miss chance roll. - Round 98: Wrong square The same thing is true for Ganimed. With its scent, the crab does not have to guess the square. - Round 90: My harpoon attack is +8, not +7 - Round 91: My harpoon attack is +8, not +7 Round 99: Merman draws grapples Laph ("73","86" OK, "5"+10=15 vs "3"-2=5, "10"+10=20 vs AC19, "2"+6=8 damage) but is forced to relequish his grasp as he can't move into his square. Why's that? That little weak pixie should be mine! Strength check? Anything? Same round: Ganimed attacked only twice, not thrice like always before (but as I said, it should be used to pinpoint Laph because it cannot damage him anyway). Same for many other rounds. - MerMan gets +1 attack for being mounted vs a non-mounted combatant. This turns the following misses into hits: Round 87 and Round 90 (together with the harpoon being +8 instead of +7) - Cellar, you had Merman make listen pinpoints and guess squares instead of readying. If Merman has to do that anyway, then there's no point in readying and not attacking with all natural weapons (as touch attacks to start a grapple). - Round 95: A natural 20 on the flour hit. If the flour tactic does not work, this 20 will be used with the grapple (critical grapple?). Btw, with all the favors that were now in Laph's favor, we could for once make an exception on putting me always in the handicap corner, and manifest thicken skin (or force screens, PfG, etc) on me. It is absolutely clear from my tactic that I assumed to be hit only on a natural 20. It is obvious that this was the central and most important requirement in my tactic. If that requirement is not met anymore, the pitlord should use a buff to ensure it is met. I hope we don't adapt for Cat's opponoments like if there's no tomorow while not granting me the same favor. That is what had been done far too often with my fights, and I don't want this to be an Ixenthor vs Laph, Part 2. @David: I know that was a very tough fight, and I'd be willing to leave it as it is now so that you don't have to go over it again. It took me more than an hour to analyze and respond to all what has been said; I don't want to imagine how long it takes to correct it. @Pittbull: ...of course, only if you're ok with that. I haven't noticed any mistakes in Mer-man's favor @Jindl: It is hard to believe that you checked the fights for mistakes on both sides, produced a novel in favor of Laph by analyzing the fight round by round to the point, and didn't found a single mistake in Merman's favor. As you can see there are at least as much mistakes in Merman's favor than in Laphs. Your one-sided analysis is pretty obvious, and just in case you didn't notice: that's not -> :cool: Don't get me wrong; your fight analysises are really awesome and great work and all; I just wish you'd be a bit more neutral sometimes :(
Salzorin 05-29-05, 06:04 PM	Didn't read all of it, but just noticed a small thing Cat: Move Silently doesn't take a -20 penalty from attacking like Hide does.
Caterane 05-29-05, 06:08 PM	Thanks. A battle has a listen Dc of -10, not 0. That turns some pinpoint attempts to successes. Mistakes, mistakes ;)
Jindl 05-29-05, 07:03 PM	Psionic shot is with no word mentioned in his tactics. It would be a pitlord adaption to use it even once but regaining focus after every round would be way too much. That was what I feared the most, and I blew a sigh of relief when I didn't read it in Pittbull's tactic. Infact, he even wrote he wants a "quick fight". Since we currently go by the very word of the tactic - that's why I was being handicapped in the past weeks - I don't see why it should be differently now. If you'll check some of my other posts, you'll see that I stated that it would be a pitlord adaptation to make that change in this fight, and that I recommended to Pittbull to write it into his tactics in future fights. On top of that, Laph's buffs run out. I don't think chosing the best course of action after the fight is up is a good way to discuss fights. Would you have made that suggestion if Laph had hit thrice or more due to his buffs? Yes, because Mer-man is simply healing away Laph's damage. Laph has a limited supply of ammo, so he has to make the hits count. Why do you have it at +16? Base+12 +2 compression = +14. Offensive prescience gives +2 to damage, not attack. I was working from it being offensive precognition (+2). If it was, in fact, offensive precience, then it would indeed be a +14 to hit, with an extra 2 pts of damage throughout. And as already said, I would ride out of LOS so that he cannot attack me. Pittbull's tactics said to fly above you and attack. Considering that you are a large spaced creature and that his fly is only 20 ft slower than your mount, there is no way for you to be out of LOS or for you to even have cover against his attacks (unless you are getting cover from your mount). Asides from the javelins being stored in my pants (or at least they should be stored), this adaption is - considering the current preference to read tactics; especially mines - is also something Pittbull should come up with, not Jindl after the fight. I wish my characters would be played like that. And also: per prefight discussion with CD, I made clear that the flour is a way to affect Laph. I wouldn't use flour if I'd know that it is useless. Especially not 4 times. I know you well enough to know that if your characters primary ability (greater invisibility is Laph's primary ability) was being misused or underused, that you would complain. I'm just pointing out to cellar that Laph, who has been a pixie all of his life, would have known to simply reestablish his invisibility to make the flour, or any picked up object, invisible as well. I wouldn't expect Mer-man to know this automatically, but after using the flour once he would certainly not try it again. [Merman made no ride check. This raises his AC to 28. That's another mistake in Merman's favor, Jindl. One of many. He can't make a ride check to take cover against an AoO from Laph that was provoked by Mer-man attempting a disarm/grapple/or ranged attack. If Mer-man is in the middle of an attack, he can't take cover with his mount. So you complain that Merman didn't provoke an AoO (because he did not 5ft step) but complain that Laph DID provoke an AoO (because he did not 5ft step)? :/ Please explain how Mer-man, who is taking up a 10x10 space, can 5 ft step away from a flying creature that is in melee directly above him? Now rationalize why any caster (and psywarriors are casters) would attempt to cast a healing effect while still being threatened by his opponent? And now... The long list of mistakes in Merman's favor which Jindl didn't find: :D Laph 28/28 2/3 Inertial Armour(61), Force Screen(12), Offensive Precognition(13) - Laph does not have that power. Valid point. I didn't check to confirm if cellar had accurately used Laph's powers. I was focused on the round by round to hits and AC's. This damage should not happen. +9 hp for Merman. There's also no offensive precognition in the first place. Please look over it again. However, there is an extra +2 hps of damage per hit from Laph, which should more than make-up for these 9 hps Mer-man gets back. Did you include the -20 penalty to move silently because of the attack? Irrelevant. You knew where he was anyway. But keep in mind that the -20 applies to charging, not to move + attacking. Round 11: I am 9 below maximum. I should use a cure potion in that round. See tactic. Round 34: I am 9 below maximum. I should use a cure potion in that round. See tactic. - That also means that I would expand my cure potions much earlier and refer to invisibility+war cry which would cause some of Laph's attacks to miss. Vigor after that. This would be something for cellar to consider and possibly change. However, since you are mounted, you really don't have to make warcries for Laph to locate you. Round 85: Since Merman had his glaive in hand, Laph would incur an AoO even though withdrawing. Since it is in place of the harpoon attacks that doesn't happen, the "18" will be used which deals 1d10+9 damage. This assumes that Laph doesn't just re-enact his invisibility. As a pixie, that would definately be the most obvious, natural, and logical choice. If he was invisible, there would be no AoO. Additionally, Ganimed can clearly pinpoint Laph's position with a move action (which is written in my tactic!) and attack the correct square, so Merman knows the square in any case. I'll list only those rounds where Merman guessed the wrong square or failed to pinpoint: - Round 79: Merman guesses at Laph's position and tries to grapple him ("36" wrong square) - Round 80-92: How can one fail a 50% chance 7 times in a row?? - Round 88: Guessed right square, using up a roll of 98 which would have been the miss chance roll. - Round 98: Wrong square The same thing is true for Ganimed. With its scent, the crab does not have to guess the square. I never saw Mer-man make the necessary HA check to push his mount to seek an opponent by scent, and I'm pretty sure your warhorse doesn't know that trick. - Round 90: My harpoon attack is +8, not +7 - Round 91: My harpoon attack is +8, not +7 A valid point. Why's that? That little weak pixie should be mine! Strength check? Anything? Same round: Ganimed attacked only twice, not thrice like always before (but as I said, it should be used to pinpoint Laph because it cannot damage him anyway). Same for many other rounds. Because unless you have improved grab, you have to move into your opponents square to continue a grapple. You can't move straight up into Laph's square, so you can't maintain the hold. - MerMan gets +1 attack for being mounted vs a non-mounted combatant. This turns the following misses into hits: Round 87 and Round 90 (together with the harpoon being +8 instead of +7) First, the +1 mounted only applies to attacking a "creature smaller than your mount that is on foot." Laph is flying, so this +1 doesn't exist. Second, it only applies to melee attacks, not your longbow (or harpoon as you like to call it). - Cellar, you had Merman make listen pinpoints and guess squares instead of readying. If Merman has to do that anyway, then there's no point in readying and not attacking with all natural weapons (as touch attacks to start a grapple). If you know where Laph is, then it is reasonable to make a full attack with all natural weapons. However, I don't think you can substitute "touch attacks to start a grapple" for all of your natural weapon attacks. I think that combat tricks like grappling follow your normal bab routine, not the special natural attack routine. - Round 95: A natural 20 on the flour hit. If the flour tactic does not work, this 20 will be used with the grapple (critical grapple?). Sounds reasonable. If its on the grapple check, then it is a potential crit. If on the touch attack to start the grapple, there is no potential crit. Btw, with all the favors that were now in Laph's favor, we could for once make an exception on putting me always in the handicap corner, and manifest thicken skin (or force screens, PfG, etc) on me. It is absolutely clear from my tactic that I assumed to be hit only on a natural 20. It is obvious that this was the central and most important requirement in my tactic. If that requirement is not met anymore, the pitlord should use a buff to ensure it is met. I hope we don't adapt for Cat's opponoments like if there's no tomorow while not granting me the same favor. That is what had been done far too often with my fights, and I don't want this to be an Ixenthor vs Laph, Part 2. If Mer-man were getting hit often, then he may indeed try to use a buff. Its metagame to assume that your character knows what roll Laph will need to hit him, and whether that roll is an 18+, 19+, or natural 20. Mer-man would have to adjust to this based upon experience, such as whether Laph is hitting him very rarely or extremely rarely. @Jindl: It is hard to believe that you checked the fights for mistakes on both sides, produced a novel in favor of Laph by analyzing the fight round by round to the point, and didn't found a single mistake in Merman's favor. As you can see there are at least as much mistakes in Merman's favor than in Laphs. Your one-sided analysis is pretty obvious, and just in case you didn't notice: that's not -> :cool: Don't get me wrong; your fight analysises are really awesome and great work and all; I just wish you'd be a bit more neutral sometimes :( As I said before, I hadn't noticed any errors in Mer-man's favor. You have pointed out a couple which I agree with (the valid points above). I think the errors that went against Laph were more obvious, which is why my analysis may have appeared one-sided. I didn't intend it to be and I hope you don't take it personally. I was just pointing out the errors that were apparent to me. -Jindl
Zerone 05-29-05, 11:08 PM	Brilf Zephyr vs. Cedric Fischer (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=6305592&postcount=1588) is posted. @ Snommelp There is a mistake with your skills as mentioned on Cedric's character sheet and at the end of the fight thread. @ Cat What is happening with the Rin vs. Greevus fight? *•. Z
Pittbull 05-30-05, 02:41 AM	@Jindl: Thanks a lot for your help! @Cat: I didn't reply because I got so much work with my own fights. @Cat/Cellar: Really, there's no need for a rerun, but I have one more question questions: - Why hasn't Laph used his last 20 arrows? He has 80 in his equipment but used only 60? Free outfit with very thin lead-layer inside with a big cloak to hide the wings(worn, 0 weight) Mithril shirt (worn, 2,5 lbs) * 550gp Darkwood buckler +1 of heartening (left forearm, 1,25 lbs)* 1822,5gp Efficient Quiver (back, 2 lbs) 1800gp - 50 +10 Small Arrows (Efficient Quiver, 4,5 lbs)* 1,5gp - Small Longspear (Efficient Quiver, 4,5 lbs)* 2,5gp - MW Small Longbow (Efficient Quiver, 1,5 lbs)* 187,5 gp - MW Small Longspear (Efficient Quiver, 4,5 lbs)* 152,5gp - MW Small Quarterstaff (Efficient Quiver, 4 lbs)* 150gp - 18 Small Javelins (Efficient Quiver, 18 lbs)* 9gp - 5 Small Elven-Bane arrows +1 835gp [1°] - 5 Small Human-Bane arrows +1 835gp [1°][left at home] Brooch of Shielding 1500gp Quiver of Small Arrows(20) (Quiver, 1,5 lbs)* 3gp Gloves of Dexterity +2 4000 gp Laph used powerstones of inertial armour, force screen and 60 arrows. @Zerone: I don't like the idea of this fight going into week 4 because of such a minor interpretation. I think, we should leave it as it is! @Cellar/Kaigan: I will run your fight today, you both are crazy! @Pitlord: Jannelle Werabrook (Cellardweller) vs Aeluath Dryearraheal (Kaigan): Arstimis Pittbull
Pittbull 05-30-05, 03:42 AM	Hey, I wanted to start, but checking the sheets I recognized that Kaigan hasn't leveled his character, but he wnats to bring in his heavy warhorse, which is only alowed for ECL6 characters. There these variants how I run the fight: (1) Run the fight with Aeluath (ECL5) and his heavy warhorse. Then I've no idea how the XP are calculated!! (2) Run the fight with Aeluath (ECL6) and his heavy warhorse.[Kaigan must level him before!] (3) Give him a light warhorse!! He has none on his sheet! (4) Give him no horse! MUHAHAHAHAHAH!! Edit: Cellar has responded. Aeluath's mount is now a light warhorse for this fight.
Caterane 05-30-05, 06:21 AM	I didn't intend it to be and I hope you don't take it personally. I was just pointing out the errors that were apparent to me. No big deal. Let's forget about it :cool: @ Cat: What is happening with the Rin vs. Greevus fight? It shouldn't have been rerun in the first place just because of some missing attacks of a light warhorse which has little chance to hit anyway - and this has been confirmed in the rerun. Now a similar thing. Zoro look, it's also in your best interest to move on. If this fight goes into week 4 (and week 5...6...?) then you lose another potential 900 XP. You've already lost between 900 and 2700 XP just because Rin didn't fight on. I know losses suck; I'm also annoyed when that happens because of a mistake, and a win would be so much cooler but on the other hand, I never had a rerun for one of my characters. You lose more than you gain in the end, and since we keep thematic rolls, Rin will eventually fail the hold person save and lose. Even if you'd win, you lost more than if you had swallowed the loss from the beginning on. If you are really so set on having a clean record, you can easily restart Rin. Just write me a PM (to the Pitlords Account) and I will reset her. @Pittbull: Use option (3). Consider the heavy warhorse a light one (instant diet :D) re- arrows: that would just cause me to drink the invisibility potion, and make warcries lol Hey Jindl, apropos warcries: Just wanted to make sure that I don't have to read: "Hey yes, it's obvious that you are still on the horse but there is a 0.000001% chance that you are somewhere else so Laph cannot attack you and you delay! Sorry, had you written to make sahuagin warcries in your tactic, the outcome might have been different" :rolleyes:
cellardweller 05-30-05, 08:09 AM	Fight has been modified - same outcome slightly different used items (nothing major). Changing Merman's AC to 36 and switching offensive precog for offensive presence meant that all but the natural 20's missed. Though I probably introduced as many new errors as I fixed. @cat I'll just latch on to some of your comments that were incorrect (the correct ones have been fixed in the fight and the "fuzzy" or inconsequential ones have been left because they is not worth arguing over) - Merman readied to disarm should he be attacked. Since I know from which direction the attack came, I do not have to guess the square, or pinpoint it with listen. This has been done wrong in many rounds. The you only know the location if it is within 5'. It wouldn't work with the longspear attacks (though you should have been aware of the staff attacks). - Round 80-92: How can one fail a 50% chance 7 times in a row?? If you look at Laph's rolls you'll see that Merman definitely got the happy side of the luck stick that fight. I think your bad Juju is contagious :P. Why's that? That little weak pixie should be mine! Strength check? Anything? If you were a player in my RL game I would say absolutely, but know as well as I do how our little band are sticklers for RAW. It clearly states "If you can’t move into your target’s space, you can’t maintain the grapple and must immediately let go of the target" - Cellar, you had Merman make listen pinpoints and guess squares instead of readying. If Merman has to do that anyway, then there's no point in readying and not attacking with all natural weapons (as touch attacks to start a grapple). The ability to do this is called improved grab. It is absolutely clear from my tactic that I assumed to be hit only on a natural 20. Merman has no idea what Laph needs to roll, had Merman been injured significantly after using his clw's I would have had him use the invisiblity potion as specified.
cellardweller 05-30-05, 08:24 AM	Just noticed Jindl's comment about the tower shield proficiency. Statistically this would mean an extra 2.5 hits (because Merman would have drunk his potion of invisibility). Hypothetically this would be an extra "3"+"2"+"2"/2+5=11hp - not enough to down Merman (who still has rage and frenzy in the bag). I don't consider whether or not Merman uses an extra potion worth the effort of making this correction so I am leaving it as is.
Pittbull 05-30-05, 10:33 AM	@Cellar: No problem, stop editing, it's enough. But you forgot to the additional 20 arrows agian. ;) Let's see this fight like:" Laph went fishing, but got eaten by the fish!" :D Thanks to the Nimbus it doesn't matter! Edit: From this point Laph won't fight any normal arena-fights anymore, he'll participate only in mini-quests and campaigns. Next mission: Clean the Jindl-Park!!!
Pittbull 05-30-05, 10:52 AM	Janelle vs. Aeluath (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=6308369&postcount=1589) is up! Cellar told me, that you can use a lance in adjected squares when you're mounted. I didn't kow that and learned something new. He also pointed out that this won't change the outcome of the fight. So it stays as it is. Thanks Cellar, that why I love the CoCo, I'm still learning every week!
Jindl 05-30-05, 12:51 PM	@cellar - Not to cause more issues with Laph vs Mer-man, but ... I think you forgot Laph's DR 10/cold iron when calculating the damage from Mer-man's grapple attempts. -Jindl
Caterane 05-30-05, 12:58 PM	cold iron armor spikes
Jindl 05-30-05, 01:02 PM	Ah okay. Thought maybe you figured out a way to make natural weapons into cold iron weapons (something which druid's would really appreciate).
Megrim_Lord 05-30-05, 05:51 PM	Dr. Salvador vs Xyanthraxia is up Dr. Sal's AC even without dex is 17, X's CdG attempts should have all failed
Salzorin 05-30-05, 06:00 PM	CdG's don't require an attack roll... they're an automatic hit and crit.
bgt 05-30-05, 06:15 PM	In the event that my fight with Hagrid II is extended, I would like to forfeit. My last fight was extended, and the concept of only getting two fights this month is rather boring. I would much rather go after some shocker lizards than spending this week waiting for the fight to finish. This brings up a question, though. If I forfeit a fight, do I get the gold and XP for losing? More importantly, will Hagrid get the XP for winning? I would hate to see this last week be a complete waste for him on my account. I sent a PM to Pittbull letting him know of my intentions, and asking him if he would consider leting this fight be a draw(would that be +600 gp/xp for both of us?).
Megrim_Lord 05-30-05, 06:16 PM	CdG's don't require an attack roll... they're an automatic hit and crit. no, they do require an attack roll, people have failed them many tmes in this arena
Luni 05-30-05, 06:22 PM	Coup de grace don't need attack rolls. I've seen quite a few rolls for Coup de grace and I've always wondered why they were rolling to hit. From the SRD: Coup de Grace: As a full-round action, you can use a melee weapon to deliver a coup de grace to a helpless opponent. You can also use a bow or crossbow, provided you are adjacent to the target. You automatically hit and score a critical hit. If the defender survives the damage, he must make a Fortitude save (DC 10 + damage dealt) or die. A rogue also gets her extra sneak attack damage against a helpless opponent when delivering a coup de grace. Delivering a coup de grace provokes attacks of opportunity from threatening opponents. You can’t deliver a coup de grace against a creature that is immune to critical hits. You can deliver a coup de grace against a creature with total concealment, but doing this requires two consecutive full-round actions (one to “find” the creature once you’ve determined what square it’s in, and one to deliver the coup de grace). Empasis mine.
Salzorin 05-30-05, 06:28 PM	If people were making CdG attack rolls in the past, I find that rather shocking... As Luni posted the text for it, you can see that it is an indeed an automatic hit and crit. I would hope that anybody that's made the mistake in the past of rolling an attack roll for CdG's note this in the future...
Megrim_Lord 05-30-05, 06:31 PM	meh, whatever, so he dies, I'll probably end up cancelling out both my current gladiators if the new one I'm cooking up proves effective anyway...
Cerebus13 05-30-05, 06:54 PM	@ Cerebus: Saya fight I'm fine with what happened, but please note these kinds of tactics in the future - 'continue with the Arrows, staying out of movement + sling range and not allowing him to have cover' - which I did not do for several rounds while he pelted Moto with bullets... Thanks ;) *•. ZDenying him cover would have required double moves or more on Saya's part, because he could just circle around a pillar constantly to protect himself.
Zerone 05-30-05, 07:15 PM	Denying him cover would have required double moves or more on Saya's part, because he could just circle around a pillar constantly to protect himself. Once close enough to the object he is moving around (approx. 6 squares away from it), with a 60 movement (8 diagnol squares), is more than enough to keep him without cover without double moving. Besides, I just stood there and waited as he pummeled me with his sling for seven rounds - so 'staying out of movement + sling range' was ignored, let alone the superior movement. As I said, I'm fine with what happened, but please note these kinds of tactics in the future... :whatsthis *•. Z
Cerebus13 05-30-05, 08:43 PM	Rayos vs Zubair (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=6312907&postcount=1590) is up. Please proofread and send any comments my way. This battle hinged on a few rolls from each player...when Zubair missed his super charged Greater Psionic Shot/Deep Crystal opening shot he was bound to lose against the pure Ranger build with +4 damage vs Elves. People with the patience to play an all out Ranger can do some sick damage against their favored enemies....
Huan 05-30-05, 11:23 PM	Bare-bones of Ixenthor vs Necavi (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=6317371) is up. Short version: Blitzkrieg again... but then there is good news and bad news...
Jindl 05-30-05, 11:43 PM	Bare-bones of Ixenthor vs Necavi (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=6317371) is up. Short version: Blitzkrieg again... but then there is good news and bad news... Don't forget to adjust the rewards for allies... Wait a sec', I'm confused about something. If I understand the new ally rules correctly, the highest CR ally you can bring is your ECL -4. Since Ixenthor is an ECL6 character, that would limit him to CR2. Uralt is a CR3 dienonychus, making him an illegal ally, right? Or do I misunderstand the new ally system? :confused: -Jindl
KerlanRayne 05-31-05, 12:32 AM	Rayos vs Zubair (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=6312907&postcount=1590) is up. Please proofread and send any comments my way.I don't think the wolf would have gotten an AoO on my horse. All he did was move, would have been a double move to withdraw, not really any reason to do otherwise. My attack would have been in the middle of the double move. At worst, he would have gotten an AoO against ME, but not may horse. (At least, I'm pretty sure). Healing by mount would have been a good idea, I have to remember to include that next time. Also, if the wolf is next to me and I double move away for 120' how does the wolf get next to me by double moving 100'. KerlanRayne
Kaigan 05-31-05, 01:31 AM	Va'ria vs. Ripper is up. Please look for errors, thanks.
Pittbull 05-31-05, 02:22 AM	Thank you Cat, Hagrid's tactic has been sent to you via E-Mail.
Jindl 05-31-05, 02:23 AM	Cyalin Orndrill (King Uther) vs Telveran Trueblade (Sunwolf): Jindl is finished. There aren't any errors ... please don't check ... no errors ... -Jindl
xanadu 05-31-05, 02:24 AM	Va'ria vs. Ripper is up. Please look for errors, thanks. The error was me not seeing a scroll of invisibility on Va'ria's sheet nor the spell memorized and believing she could not turn invisible. Silly me to not consider Sindorin using an unneccesarily expensive potion instead :headexplo
Sindorin 05-31-05, 02:28 AM	Hehe, the reason Va'ria has to drink potions of Invis is because Illusion is her prohibited school...
Cerebus13 05-31-05, 07:32 AM	I don't think the wolf would have gotten an AoO on my horse. All he did was move, would have been a double move to withdraw, not really any reason to do otherwise. My attack would have been in the middle of the double move. At worst, he would have gotten an AoO against ME, but not may horse. (At least, I'm pretty sure). Healing by mount would have been a good idea, I have to remember to include that next time. Also, if the wolf is next to me and I double move away for 120' how does the wolf get next to me by double moving 100'. KerlanRayneI had the horse do a single move during that turn because you were setting up for your first shot which included all of your damage buffs. With mounted archery it would have only been a -2...but I figured the roll was going to be close so tried to give you everything possible. The wolf came at you and your horse from the north so in order for you to withdraw without incurring an AoO you had to move southwest and then circle around him to get up to the northern square. The wolf on the otherhand could run straight up to you.
Caterane 05-31-05, 07:50 AM	Thank you Cat, Hagrid's tactic has been sent to you via E-Mail. Ok got them but I still need tactics from bgt
Zerone 05-31-05, 07:57 AM	Don't forget to adjust the rewards for allies... Wait a sec', I'm confused about something. If I understand the new ally rules correctly, the highest CR ally you can bring is your ECL -4. Since Ixenthor is an ECL6 character, that would limit him to CR2. Uralt is a CR3 dienonychus, making him an illegal ally, right? Or do I misunderstand the new ally system? :confused: -Jindl Shouldn't it be ECL -2, like cohorts? *•. Z
Caterane 05-31-05, 08:00 AM	They have no ECL. But Jindl is correct; anyhow I thought they were CR 2. Uralt should be substituted by Sonnenstrahl which has no effect on the fight. @Huan: a diving griffon deals double damage @Zoro: you should read the FAQ: Allies. There are new rules dealing with them.
Huan 05-31-05, 08:20 AM	@Huan: a diving griffon deals double damage They do? I know they got the 2 extra rake attacks, which were included, but I do not see where they got double damage... (I don't see mention of double damage either in the MM) :confused: So, do I calculate the xp loss and gain for both combatants, since both used allies?
Caterane 05-31-05, 08:39 AM	"A creature that flies can make dive attacks. A dive attack works just like a charge, but the diving creature must move a minimum of 30 feet and descend at least 10 feet. It can make only claw or talon attacks, but these deal double damage. A creature can use the run action while flying, provided it flies in a straight line" Movement Modes. Its in the Monster's Manual.
cellardweller 05-31-05, 08:39 AM	All dive attacks deal double damage, it is in the section on types and subtypes. Might I suggest using the ally calculator (http://users.bigpond.net.au/petersd/coco/allycalc/)
Caterane 05-31-05, 08:42 AM	Which page is that?
cellardweller 05-31-05, 08:45 AM	Which page is that? I was referring to the SRD. TypesSubtypesAbilities.rtf has the passage that you quoted.
Huan 05-31-05, 09:01 AM	Ah, I see, thank you (I did not know that until now)... ok ... well, *ahem* it seems then that Necavi was slain in Round 2 then... ouch. Editing now...
Jindl 05-31-05, 09:25 AM	"A creature that flies can make dive attacks. A dive attack works just like a charge, but the diving creature must move a minimum of 30 feet and descend at least 10 feet. It can make only claw or talon attacks, but these deal double damage. A creature can use the run action while flying, provided it flies in a straight line" Movement Modes. Its in the Monster's Manual. When a griffon chooses to dive, it has to give up its bite attack and only attack with its claws, right? What about the rake attacks? From reading the rake definition in the MM glossary, it sounds like rake attacks are claw attacks, so I assume the diving griffon would lose his bite attack but get to make 2 claws and 2 rakes at double damage, all with a base to hit of +8 (before considering charging and higher ground, if applicable). Is this right? -Jindl
Luni 05-31-05, 09:30 AM	When a griffon chooses to dive, it has to give up its bite attack and only attack with its claws, right? What about the rake attacks? From reading the rake definition in the MM glossary, it sounds like rake attacks are claw attacks, so I assume the diving griffon would lose his bite attack but get to make 2 claws and 2 rakes at double damage, all with a base to hit of +8 (before considering charging and higher ground, if applicable). Is this right? -Jindl From the SRD: Pounce (Ex): If a griffon dives upon or charges a foe, it can make a full attack, including two rake attacks. Man, thats a lot of damage for a dive.
Jindl 05-31-05, 09:40 AM	So what you're saying is that the griffon's pounce ability lets it keep its bite attack while diving. But nothing says the bite deals double damage, only the claw/talon attacks. So then the diving griffon would take a normal full attack: a bite, 2 claws, and 2 rakes, with the claws and rakes dealing double damage. Is this right?
Luni 05-31-05, 09:45 AM	It seems right to me.
KerlanRayne 05-31-05, 01:29 PM	I had the horse do a single move during that turn because you were setting up for your first shot which included all of your damage buffs. With mounted archery it would have only been a -2...but I figured the roll was going to be close so tried to give you everything possible. The wolf came at you and your horse from the north so in order for you to withdraw without incurring an AoO you had to move southwest and then circle around him to get up to the northern square. The wolf on the otherhand could run straight up to you.But my main question is, how did my horse provoke an AoO? I'm the one that moved and attacked so I would have provoked the AoO not my horse. KerlanRayne
Cerebus13 05-31-05, 02:16 PM	But my main question is, how did my horse provoke an AoO? I'm the one that moved and attacked so I would have provoked the AoO not my horse. KerlanRayneBecause the horse performed a single move...not a withdraw action. A withdraw is a full action and thus Zubair would have taken a -2 to attack due to firing from a moving mount. I tried to give Zubair the best possible chances to hit Rayos with his first shot. That means no penalty from mount movement, and I was even able to get within 30' for Point Blank Shot. However even this was not enough to hit Rayos, so the extra damage buffs were wasted. Would you rather I have Zubair's horse withdraw from the wolf instead of provoking the AoO? The horse will still die the next round because Rayos will start targetting it with his 3 attacks and then move to you...but Zubair may be able to retreat and heal or something. I'm not sure this will affect the outcome of the match much, but I can alter it if you like.
xanadu 05-31-05, 05:41 PM	From rules of the game part 5: If a flyer makes a diving charge of at least 30 feet (6 squares) and also loses 10 feet of altitude or more, it can attack only with a claw or with a piercing or slashing weapon. These attacks, however, deal double damage.
Caterane 06-01-05, 09:22 AM	Hagrid vs Brogan is up. Very funny fight. Read it! @Bgt: you have a lot of violations. please correct asap
Pittbull 06-01-05, 10:49 AM	Hagrid vs Brogan is up. Very funny fight. Read it! @Bgt: you have a lot of violations. please correct asap OMG! Yes, sir, next time Hagrid wears an armor and he'll learn how to use autohypnosis. Thanks a lot, for helping out and running the fight.
bgt 06-01-05, 03:06 PM	I won my fight! I get +3 HP from my toad familer, resulting in 12 HP. Also, Caterane, regarding my ability scores, are you saying that I have more or less ability points than I should? I'll get to fixing my charachter sheet.
Sindorin 06-01-05, 03:10 PM	He means that you have less points - you get 8 more, which also could have been put into constitution to add more hit points than 12.
Pittbull 06-01-05, 03:12 PM	I won my fight! I get +3 HP from my toad familer, resulting in 12 HP. Also, Caterane, regarding my ability scores, are you saying that I have more or less ability points than I should? I'll get to fixing my charachter sheet. He seems to be right! With the toad he has 12 hps and there fore he has won this one, I'll fix my character-sheet immedeately.
Pitlords 06-01-05, 04:08 PM	I won my fight! I get +3 HP from my toad familer, resulting in 12 HP. Also, Caterane, regarding my ability scores, are you saying that I have more or less ability points than I should? I'll get to fixing my charachter sheet. Right. Forgot about the familiar. Please add a breakdown of the hitpoints behind them. Look at one of my (Caterane) sheet's for guidelines.
Salrantol 06-01-05, 04:25 PM	I'm not so sure Brogan won. The same thing happened a couple of weeks ago against Gareth Irontower...half-giants are not subject to ghoul touch. Surprised? So was I.
Pittbull 06-01-05, 04:39 PM	I'm not so sure Brogan won. The same thing happened a couple of weeks ago against Gareth Irontower...half-giants are not subject to ghoul touch. Surprised? So was I. Whow you're right! Ghoul Touch Necromancy Level: Sor/Wiz 2 Components: V, S, M Casting Time: 1 standard action Range: Touch Target: Living humanoid touched Duration: 1d6+2 rounds Saving Throw: Fortitude negates Spell Resistance: Yes Imbuing you with negative energy, this spell allows you to paralyze a single living humanoid for the duration of the spell with a successful melee touch attack. Additionally, the paralyzed subject exudes a carrion stench that causes all living creatures (except you) in a 10-foot-radius spread to become sickened (Fortitude negates). A neutralize poison spell removes the effect from a sickened creature, and creatures immune to poison are unaffected by the stench. Material Component A small scrap of cloth taken from clothing worn by a ghoul, or a pinch of earth from a ghoul’s lair. Hagrid is no humanoid, he's a giant. Therefore he's immune to ghoultouch. Thanks!
bgt 06-01-05, 04:40 PM	Crud. Well, if the fight gets rerun *sigh* I'll just deliver Ray of Enfeeblements and Chill Touchs with the Spectral Hand, if changing my tactics this late is allowed.
Pitlords 06-01-05, 05:37 PM	Alright, that makes Hagrid the winner again. Sorry bgt, pairings are already up, and it was a mistake from your side. Sorry but that's how we learn the rules. See it positive: you'll never cast ghoul touch on a non-humanoid again :)