Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Megrim_Lord 03-30-05, 02:49 PM	SiNdOrIn HaS bEeN pWnZorEd!!!11!!!1! aside from that, play nice :D
Sindorin 03-30-05, 03:09 PM	Oh no, not another one... and I thought T'Var was a handful :)
Caterane 03-30-05, 03:20 PM	Steve, GET HIM!!! :D 22:00 GMT, beginning my run now...
Sindorin 03-30-05, 04:03 PM	by the way, I did end up fixing my chair (the back had popped off) but recently I pressed on one of the arms too hard and it is now completely broken off... ding! stop editing!
Sindorin 03-30-05, 04:40 PM	wow, it looks like i picked a good time to stop pitlording - there are 34 characters' worth of pitlords, and 24 characters marked ready for this week...
vipergtsmk 03-30-05, 05:03 PM	My fight from last week never ended up getting run by anyone... Does that mean it gets pushed forward to this week or what? I know it's too late to edit, but if not could my charcter (Derth) be paired even though he's not marked ready for this week. There no changes to be made!
Pitlords 03-30-05, 05:18 PM	PAIRINGS DONE Send your tactics early so that your fight can be run early. Pitlords may begin running fights without tactics on saturday. Late Penalties apply on Tuesday 8 AM GMT. Missing Penalty if the fight is not posted at all. If you know that you cannot finish your fight, please post it here so that we can find a substitute pitlord. No one wants to sit out a week! Credit Changes: +2: Caterane, T'Var, Jindl, Sindorin, Spasheridan +1: Arstimis, TaggIIV, Iced, Aramil, Kaigan +0: Huan, Xanadu Credits for Pitlords: +3: Spasheridan +2: T'Var, Kaigan +1: Caterane, Huan, Arstimis, TaggIIV, Iced, Xanadu, Aramil Credits for Questlords: +2: Jindl, Sindorin Neg. Credits for PCs/Quests: -1: Kaigan, Huan, Xanadu, Spasheridan Special Credits: +1: Caterane (admin) This week we see the first Short Quest, run by Huan. They are a mix of the old Monster fights, Arena fights, and a regular Quest with some differences. They do not cost credits for the player, nor do they earn 2° but only 1° for the "Questlord". Infact, since he has to follow only 1 set of tactics these fights are actually way easier than an arena battle but that is offset by the new map that is necessary. They can be run "arena style" or more like a Long Quest, chosen by the pitlord. Since there is only 1 fight, all rules for the Arena apply, but there is no Nimbus that protects you. If you haven't voted on Cellardweller's fey Poison Ivy (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=389894), please do so now. The poll is over soon. @Viper: your fight will be extended into this week. Please do not edit your sheet. If you want you can ready Elishar and perhaps Sunwolf finishes his new character so that I can pair you two. Good luck Cat
Megrim_Lord 03-30-05, 05:27 PM	since Trokk is ready and Gurfy's fight from last week isn't in yet, can Trokk be paired as active with another unpaired gladiator, or would that still cost me a credit?
Pitlords 03-30-05, 05:39 PM	since Trokk is ready and Gurfy's fight from last week isn't in yet, can Trokk be paired as active with another unpaired gladiator, or would that still cost me a credit? Extended fight never cost a credit. Sure, if you find an opponoment, let me know.
Kaigan 03-30-05, 06:07 PM	If you want Trokk can fight Ligaya. Edit: Never mind, Suggang rolled out so it's better if Trokk fights him.
T'Var 03-30-05, 06:27 PM	Jindl of the High Forest (Jindl) vs Aeluath Dryearraheal (Kaigan): T'Var arrrggggg!! ok this has to be some kind of streak. running JotHF now, 5 weeks in a row or is it 6 now?
Huan 03-30-05, 06:42 PM	@Aramil Dunskar Tactics for Nell have been sent via PM.
Aramil Dunskar 03-30-05, 08:09 PM	@Aramil Dunskar Tactics for Nell have been sent via PM. Tatic's have been recieved :D Well seeing as how I had a busy week so far... I forgot to update my guy's, and today was the only chance I had... so what do I miss... Pairing's Yippee! And I coulda used these next fights so I can improve on my now ranged Grakk, and my always ranged Aramil.... I just wish there were more means for Grakk to slice and dice :(
Megrim_Lord 03-30-05, 08:13 PM	If you want Trokk can fight Ligaya. Edit: Never mind, Suggang rolled out so it's better if Trokk fights him. I'd gladly accept, but if Khaz_Gu wants Suggang to fight, that's fine too
Jindl 03-30-05, 08:32 PM	Jindl of the High Forest (Jindl) vs Aeluath Dryearraheal (Kaigan): T'Var arrrggggg!! ok this has to be some kind of streak. running JotHF now, 5 weeks in a row or is it 6 now? 5, I think. And it could be worse. At least my tactics are relatively brief. :D
Aramil Dunskar 03-30-05, 10:59 PM	Ah... just a head's up to Cat, Grakk is level 5 now with his recent win... so you might want to move him up before any confusion next week. Thanks -Aramil
King Uther 03-31-05, 01:54 AM	@Spasheridan Tactics for Cyalin Orndrill have been sent via PM.
Pittbull 03-31-05, 08:02 AM	@Arstimis: Boraxx' tactic has been sent via E-Mail. EDIT: @T'Var: Laph's tactic has been sent via PM. Thanks for running my fights. :)
Kaigan 03-31-05, 10:00 AM	@Cat: sent tactics for Rayos via PM @T'Var: sent tactics for Aeiou via PM @Xanadu: received tactics @Iced: will send tactics either today or tomorrow. @My other gladiators: still waiting, if you get them in soon, one fight should be up today or tomorrow.
T'Var 03-31-05, 10:09 AM	just waiting on tactics from Jindl thanks all
Cerebus13 03-31-05, 11:01 AM	@Xanadu: tactics sent via email whee!
Jindl 03-31-05, 11:19 AM	just waiting on tactics from Jindl thanks all Tactics PM'd for JotHF.
Sindorin 03-31-05, 01:48 PM	Tactics for Ceres and Sokai have been PM'd to Spasheridan and Caterane.
Arstimis 03-31-05, 07:02 PM	Tactics for Borrix recieved Tactics for Arstimis sent Tactics for En'Sidious sent...last week, hehe
Iced 03-31-05, 08:49 PM	If anyone needs to be paired this week, or there is an odd man out, I'd be happy to run an additional fight. Also if there's another person who'll run an additional fight, then I'd love to get some more characters in fighting. If there's no one willing then that's fine, but life's been hectic and I just completely forgot that my characters all said "ready for the 23rd". :doh:
Megrim_Lord 03-31-05, 08:53 PM	Trokk is still looking for an opponent, any comers welcome
spasheridan 03-31-05, 09:54 PM	@ all my gladiators: Your tactics have been recieved! U have em all in and I will start running battles late tonight. Thanks for getting them in so quick! @ T'Var: I sent a revised set of tactics for Legion because detect hostile just isn't going to be a targetting sense vs Laph, even if I tried my sneaky tricks. @ Jindl: Do you need me to resend my tactics for Finael?
Jindl 04-01-05, 10:34 AM	@ Jindl: Do you need me to resend my tactics for Finael? Nope. I still have all of the tactics that were sent last week. -Jindl
TaggIIV 04-01-05, 06:26 PM	Tactics for Nyphanalith PMd to Iced. Tactics recieved for Zubair from KerlanRayne
Kaigan 04-01-05, 07:49 PM	Alrighty Azer vs. Rakkar is up. Please scan it over for mistakes, I don't think there are any but you never know :D. I will be writing a story later, so I'll post when that is up. Have a good one. Kaigan
Cerebus13 04-01-05, 08:56 PM	Kaigan, This question won't affect the outcome of the Azer vs. Rakkar fight, but should Rakkar have been allowed to bring a Heavy Warhorse to the battle? If I have read the Allies/Cohorts rules correctly, you are allowed to take a single basic animal into battle with no XP penalty as long as it doesn't have a higher HD than yours. Heavy Warhorse HD is 4 and Rakkar's is 3...so he can only squeeze a Light Warhorse into fights until he gets to ECL 4. Also, should Azer have recieved a 33% bonus to XP/Gold since he fought alone? I'm just curious about these things for my future fights...shouldn't change the result of this battle at all :D.
Kaigan 04-01-05, 09:40 PM	Nope, I believe you can bring a heavy warhorse. here is a quote from the FAQ You may buy any one of the nine basic animals listed in the "Goods and Services" table. You do not have to go on a Quest to acquire these animals. The animals that can be bought are the following: guard dog, riding dog, donkey, heavy horse, light horse, heavy warhorse, light warhorse, pony, and warpony. Note that these "basic bought animals" do not follow the ECL-5 limit for creatures without LA.
Cerebus13 04-01-05, 09:59 PM	This lower section of the FAQ on cohorts/allies brings up the following exception: Note that there are two exceptions. (1) Firstly, you can always have one of the nine basic animals you can buy (guard dog, riding dog, donkey, heavy horse, light horse, heavy warhorse, light warhorse, pony, and warpony), even though they would breach the CR limit of your ECL-5. Instead there is a special limit for those allies: their HD must not be greater than your ECL. These basic animals still count as an ally so you cannot bring along any other ally unless your ECL is high enough to support more than one (remember: ECL-5 is the limit). Example: A level 3 character (ECL 3) could bring in a bought Light Warhorse even though its CR 1 is more than your ECL-5. He may not bring in a Heavy Warhorse because its HD (4) exceed your ECL (3). A level 6 character (ECL 6) may also bring along a Light Warhorse (CR 1) but no additional ally because his limit is still 1 (6-5=1). He could instead bring in a Heavy Warhorse because his ECL (6) is greater than the Warhorse's HD (4). A level 12 character could bring in 7 Light Warhorses (7*CR1 = CR 7) because his limit is 7 (12-5). This rule seems to override the previous one of ignoring ECL-5 with no CR. Just trying to get clairification, cuz I'm mighty confused.
spasheridan 04-01-05, 10:31 PM	(1) Firstly, you can always have one of the nine basic animals you can buy (guard dog, riding dog, donkey, heavy horse, light horse, heavy warhorse, light warhorse, pony, and warpony) I think the rest of the example (unclearly) attempts to describe when you can take an animal as an ally / additional ally, but the main point is that all of the basic animals are always allowed.
xanadu 04-01-05, 10:47 PM	This lower section of the FAQ on cohorts/allies brings up the following exception: This rule seems to override the previous one of ignoring ECL-5 with no CR. Just trying to get clairification, cuz I'm mighty confused. Hmm...I thought the new rules were coming into effect next week (I know they were not in effect last week). Am I the only one with a heavy warhorse?
Iced 04-01-05, 10:50 PM	Nyphanalith's Tactics recieved
Cerebus13 04-01-05, 10:53 PM	Oh okay, I think I understand it better now :). Gonna be a while before I'll be able to take more than one ally into battle :P.
Arstimis 04-01-05, 11:19 PM	I think the new rules came into effect his week one of those new rules being a heavy warhorse would not be allowed in an ECL 3 fight because of its 4 HD being more than the 3 ECL of the gladiator The reason for it is that most problems with horses came from Heavy Warhorses winning the ECL 3 battles Edit: Eniolissaryn the Elder (Jindl) I still havent recieved your tactics
Cerebus13 04-02-05, 12:22 AM	So uh...I've seen interpretations on both sides of this rule. Which one is correct? :P
Jindl 04-02-05, 12:25 AM	Edit: Eniolissaryn the Elder (Jindl) I still havent recieved your tactics Writing them now :(
spasheridan 04-02-05, 12:49 AM	Jerren vs Cyalin is up
spasheridan 04-02-05, 03:27 AM	Arstimis vs Gabriel is up
Megrim_Lord 04-02-05, 08:04 AM	Spash, studded Leather isn't metal armor, it's leather with some studs, which btw could easily be made out of bone, but that doesn't matter because Studded Leather still isn't metal armor, metal studs or not :D
Megrim_Lord 04-02-05, 08:13 AM	although it doesn't really matter at this point Spash, I will point out for your future reference that in my tactics I believe it said (not in so many words) the Hippogriff should have come in flying, thus not be subjected to Entangle, but I could be wrong :D
Jindl 04-02-05, 09:03 AM	Spash, studded Leather isn't metal armor, it's leather with some studs, which btw could easily be made out of bone, but that doesn't matter because Studded Leather still isn't metal armor, metal studs or not :D Studded leather is considered metal armor, which is why druids are prohibited from wearing it. "Druids are proficient with light and medium armor but are prohibited from wearing metal armor; thus they may wear only padded, leather, or hide armor. (PHB, pg 34)" No studded leather. -Jindl
Arstimis 04-02-05, 09:47 AM	Arstimis vs Gabriel is upFirst, when you post the fight, the gladiators tactics are supposed to be right below thier character sheets. Not that it would make any difference in the fight. But you did decide to ignore some parts of my tactics. Like: "If he attacks me. The horse will run to attack Gabriel" and "If Entangled try to move away somewhere and stay behind cover." Since him trying to entangle me was an attack, then horse should have ran after him. Since he was entangling me, I should have moved then, not sat around in it having to make saves the whole time. Afterthoughts:Arstimis, you're tactics were a bit clumsy. You don't have handle animal ranks so dragging your horse with you would have been... difficult at best. Hiding behind your mount is a bit silly, it would have been better to just hide behind pillars. how can you say my tactics were clumsy. My horse was there for a reason (which you ignored) and the skill Handle Animal has no part and is not needed at all. Also i did not orignally intend my horse to give me cover, but since he was there he might as well. till my enemy attacks me, in which he will run. then i will stay behind the cover that I was at.(I didnt specify pillar, because there are pillars and rocks, so i just said cover) Dont take any of this offensively. Im just trying to help you for future reference in later fights
Jindl 04-02-05, 10:12 AM	@Arti - You should have tactics for the Elder in your PM box now. :D -Jindl
Arstimis 04-02-05, 11:08 AM	@Arti - You should have tactics for the Elder in your PM box now. :D -JindlI do, but they were late and I wont accept them. hehe, jk, late april fools :D
Kaigan 04-02-05, 11:33 AM	@All: fixed the Azer Rakkar fight. Azer loses but gains still 300 xp/gp becuase of the gold cap, and Rakkar wins but gains 675 xp/gp because of -25% of having the heavy horse ally. Story should be up later today, my other fight will be up tomorrow.
Jindl 04-02-05, 11:49 AM	@All: fixed the Azer Rakkar fight. Azer loses but gains still 300 xp/gp becuase of the gold cap, and Rakkar wins but gains 675 xp/gp because of -25% of having the heavy horse ally. Story should be up later today, my other fight will be up tomorrow. Because of a rules loophole, I think Cat postponed implementing the basic animal reward modifications until next week. So Rakkar should gain the normal 900 xp/900 gp. -Jindl
spasheridan 04-02-05, 01:32 PM	the Hippogriff should have come in flying, thus not be subjected to Entangle, but I could be wrong :D Yes, but since they only have average manuver they can't hover. If they can't hover they can't fly and do a full attack. I figured maximal attacks (for rolling those 20's) was what you wanted... First, when you post the fight, the gladiators tactics are supposed to be right below thier character sheets. Your tactics are inculded in the quote of your character sheet. Not that it would make any difference in the fight. But you did decide to ignore some parts of my tactics. Like: "If he attacks me. The horse will run to attack Gabriel" and "If Entangled try to move away somewhere and stay behind cover." Since him trying to entangle me was an attack, then horse should have ran after him. Since he was entangling me, I should have moved then, not sat around in it having to make saves the whole time.Well, the "if he attacks me" part probably refers to the horse performing the defend trick. I would be very... doubtful.. of allowing an Int 2 horse to infer that Gabriel was the source of the entangle spell. A scorching ray, magic missile, an arrow.. yeah, that would trigger the defend trick. Not an entangle spell. Nor a summon ally spell. The horse is just to dumb to understand the linkage there. The "if entangled" part was strange to me.. Why would you wait to be entangled to move away instead of moving away when he cast the spell? SO.. you sat there until you finally failed a save to become entangled, broke free, and then moved out. WHich is the letter of your tactcs. I can see now that you meant "If he casts entangle, move out of the area" I did wait an extra round or 2 on some of your vigor manifestations though, but I caught it before it went to far. how can you say my tactics were clumsy. My horse was there for a reason (which you ignored) and the skill Handle Animal has no part and is not needed at all. Also i did not orignally intend my horse to give me cover, but since he was there he might as well. till my enemy attacks me, in which he will run. then i will stay behind the cover that I was at.(I didnt specify pillar, because there are pillars and rocks, so i just said cover) Dont take any of this offensively. Im just trying to help you for future reference in later fights I see now. It seemed to me that you're use of the horse was a moving shield / last line of defense. If you planned on moving and bringing the horse with you you need handle animal for it to perform a follow trick. That's where the "what a strange idea" thought came into my head, and why I found your tactics clumsy. I see now (that I've had some sleep) that you meant the defend trick to be a trigger for the horse's attacks.
spasheridan 04-02-05, 02:42 PM	@Xanadu- Double check the entangle spell. Anyone inside the area is slowed to half move, and if you're inside overlapping spells you need to make multiple saves. You only rolled saves when the spell was cast. I think there are at least 4 more saves to made vs the DC 11 entangle (every turn on the casters turn the entangle tries to get anyone in the area). Also, double check the produce flame spell. It has a duration of 6 minutes, each flame thrown reduced the duration by 1 minute. If the spell was on for 10 rounds then the 5th throw evaporated the spell, so there would have been no 6th throw.
xanadu 04-02-05, 03:23 PM	Spasheridan, Hmm, your right about the entangling on their turn but nowhere in the description does it say they overlap. Cat does not believe they do and since D & D frowns upon similar sources stacking I am inclined to agree with him. I will roll more saves on his turn though yet I doubt it will make a difference because Solmund can easily make a DC 11 save. As a personal note, I really think it is dumb beyond all belief that one needs to virtually save twice against web, entangle, and the like. The second save should occur on the caster's intiative.
Arstimis 04-02-05, 03:28 PM	Well, the "if he attacks me" part probably refers to the horse performing the defend trick. I would be very... doubtful.. of allowing an Int 2 horse to infer that Gabriel was the source of the entangle spell. A scorching ray, magic missile, an arrow.. yeah, that would trigger the defend trick. Not an entangle spell. Nor a summon ally spell. The horse is just to dumb to understand the linkage there.first. Is there any other source? What in the world else could it be. and with that logic why would the horse think the scorching ray of magic missle is coming from the mage? there is no one else for it to come from, other than my enemy. it seems to me if a creature knows who its enemy is then it would know when something bad happened it came from the enemy. Als The "if entangled" part was strange to me.. Why would you wait to be entangled to move away instead of moving away when he cast the spell? SO.. you sat there until you finally failed a save to become entangled, broke free, and then moved out. WHich is the letter of your tactcs. I can see now that you meant "If he casts entangle, move out of the area" heh, yes i could see how it coule be confusing, but its better to play the characters in the arena a little smarter than a little dumber. especially when you know thats what was meant. I did wait an extra round or 2 on some of your vigor manifestations though, but I caught it before it went to far. Hehe, ya, i did see that. I was worried I was about to die, hah. [ I see now. It seemed to me that you're use of the horse was a moving shield / last line of defense. If you planned on moving and bringing the horse with you you need handle animal for it to perform a follow trick. That's where the "what a strange idea" thought came into my head, and why I found your tactics clumsy. I see now (that I've had some sleep) that you meant the defend trick to be a trigger for the horse's attacks. I would have never needed the horse to follow and have me use it as cover. Because the only reason I would move is because I was getting out of entangle (an attack) at which point my horse would be running to attack the enemy. Well, thanks for arguing (heh) and clearing some things up between us
Cerebus13 04-02-05, 04:21 PM	Xanadu, I never expected the Entangles to cause double saves when they overlapped, so I had adjusted my tactics to simply try centering the spell over him every time he broke out of the plants. It seems I have misinterpreted the rules for scrolls however...as I thought they worked exactly like casting a spell prepared from memory, thus adding my Wisdom bonus to the saving throw. This page from an online SRD here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/scrolls.htm) is about scrolls, and the passage I am referring to is this: Determine Effect A spell successfully activated from a scroll works exactly like a spell prepared and cast the normal way. Assume the scroll spell’s caster level is always the minimum level required to cast the spell for the character who scribed the scroll (usually twice the spell’s level, minus 1), unless the caster specifically desires otherwise. The writing for an activated spell disappears from the scroll. The bolded section led me to believe this. It won't change the outcome of this fight obviously, but I am curious as to whether we add our stat adjustments to spell DCs when cast from scrolls...for future fights. Thank you for the quick fight resolution as well :).
Snommelp 04-02-05, 04:29 PM	It won't change the outcome of this fight obviously, but I am curious as to whether we add our stat adjustments to spell DCs when cast from scrolls...for future fights. Forgive me if I am mistaken, but I believe it also states in the SRD that store-bought scrolls are assumed to have been scribed by a mage with the minimum score required in the necessary stat, and it is the scriber's stats which determine the power, not the caster's.
xanadu 04-02-05, 04:55 PM	Cerebus - staves are the only magic items which convey your ability modifiers. Scrolls, wands, etc., are all assumed to have the lowest DC and caster level possible unless you purchase or make one specifically. You have to read what's after the bold as well ;)
Cerebus13 04-02-05, 05:01 PM	Yeah I'm a bit too hasty and should have investigated the rules better, found a clear explanation here: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20041123a Gonna have to adjust my tactics a bit :P.
TaggIIV 04-02-05, 05:36 PM	first. Is there any other source? What in the world else could it be. and with that logic why would the horse think the scorching ray of magic missle is coming from the mage? there is no one else for it to come from, other than my enemy. it seems to me if a creature knows who its enemy is then it would know when something bad happened it came from the enemy. Als The source would be the plants themselves, for all it knows. Unless it can see the person physically launching or shooting a projectile or ray/spell at you, it does not necessarily know that person is the one attacking you. That's my interpretation, anyway. Like my dog, if you poke at it with your foot it will start biting your toes, but if you move your leg away it gets confused and just sits there.
Jindl 04-02-05, 07:31 PM	In the CoCo, we have ruled that the definition of the word "attack" is the one used by the invisibility spell. Therefore, an entangle spell is an attack. The defend trick works against any attacker (ie. person who makes an attack). Therefore the horse would defend you against a druid who cast entangle at you. It's not an issue of identifying the source of the attack. The source is simple and clear. The druid casts the spell, the attack occurs, the horse reacts. -Jindl
Kaigan 04-03-05, 04:07 AM	Hey guys, well I posted the story for Azer vs. Rakkar, hope you like it. Here it is.
spasheridan 04-03-05, 05:20 AM	Indri'ynar Per-El'ereth vs Ceres Solus is up. I had a problem towards the end with trying to stick with Indri's tactics to ready / sunder. I think I have the exact timing of the events a bit mistaken, but I need a nap. I'll be back to fix it up tomorrow, but here it is for comments and suggestions. In the CoCo, we have ruled that the definition of the word "attack" is the one used by the invisibility spell. Therefore, an entangle spell is an attack. The defend trick works against any attacker (ie. person who makes an attack). Therefore the horse would defend you against a druid who cast entangle at you. It's not an issue of identifying the source of the attack. The source is simple and clear. The druid casts the spell, the attack occurs, the horse reacts.Wow. I wasn't aware of this. IMO it's a bit of a stretch that an entangle spell would be construed by a horse as an attack. Same as mental effects like a charm person spell or a phantasmal killer spell... I just can't see how a horse would know that the caster was doing anything to warrant protection. A horse, really, is smart enough to understand physical threats and that's about it. That said, it sure is a nice and easy line to draw, so moving forward that's what I will do. The less thinking a pitlord needs to do the better!
Caterane 04-03-05, 07:23 AM	@Spasheridan: There is a mistake in the fight. Ceres has his action still, so he sticks Indri with his lance (15+9 = AC 24, ride check 13+11, hit) for (8+10) another 18 points of damage! Indri falls dead. Indri's AC is 28 [10,+4dex,+4armor,+4force,+2PfG,+4cover(r ide)] so the last attack doesn't hit. That means Indri can now savely ride away (AoO already used up) and shoot him down. He cannot get me without bow or horse. As for the AoO, it wasn't the best maneuver to ride in while he wields the lance. Here's the excerpt from my tactic: ready action to ride next to him [...] and I sunder his bow (no AoO because he has a bow in hand). It would have been better to shoot him until he switches the lance with a bow because as long as he has a lance in hand he is no threat at all (unless I go into melee of course which would be kind of silly). Please correct this as I think that might have an impact on the outcome. ;)
Kaigan 04-03-05, 11:29 AM	I'm just curious: How do you actually find the price for a powerstone, with a different ML than the lowest spell. For example: A powerstone of vigor with an ML of 6 or a powerstone of ego whip that is enlarged and is ML of 7? Edit: And Cat: Shouldn't we get more xp now that we are level five? The value you gave us is for level four.
Aramil Dunskar 04-03-05, 12:17 PM	I need a good dice roller program that I can use for fights. So if anyone has a good one please give me the link so I can do the fight asap. Thanks -Aramil
vipergtsmk 04-03-05, 12:53 PM	Invisible Castle Die Roller (http://www.invisiblecastle.com/) Does that help?
Aramil Dunskar 04-03-05, 01:07 PM	Invisible Castle Die Roller (http://www.invisiblecastle.com/) Does that help? Yes that helps greatly, thanks. *Goes off to work on new character and match. :D * -Aramil
spasheridan 04-03-05, 01:25 PM	Indri's AC is 28 (10,+4dex,+4armor,+4force,+2PfG,+4cover( ride)] so the last attack doesn't hit. That means Indri can now savely ride away (AoO already used up) and shoot him down. He cannot get me without bow or horse. Yeah, I figured there were some mistakes in the fight, it was late and my eyes were wandering. Your AC is 26 there, but I was rolling the ride check like mounted combat (ride check = AC, not ride check = cover). THanks! That'll be a big change. As for the AoO, it wasn't the best maneuver to ride in while he wields the lance. Here's the excerpt from my tactic: It would have been better to shoot him until he switches the lance with a bow because as long as he has a lance in hand he is no threat at all (unless I go into melee of course which would be kind of silly). Please correct this as I think that might have an impact on the outcome. ;) Hrm... lemme think about that one. I'm not so sure that your tactics specify only sundering the bow when he has it in his hands. Your tactics are fairly clear, once his horse is dead you drop back, buff, and then ready to sunder the bow. You assume he has the bow out because you should be out of melee range for a few rounds buffing, but with your rage up you can't buff so I have you charge in right away. The main reason for this is that you only have 5 rounds of rage, and once it's over you become fatigued and that's not very nice for you. Also, even if he just has his bow out he can still attack with his bite or do a "drop's bow from 1 hand as a free action at the end of every turn" so he has a claw free for AoO's. I have a PnP D&D game to go to today, I'll be back later. Show me again why you would fall back and let you're rage end instead of rushing in now to break his bow and start you're pincushion tactic.
spasheridan 04-03-05, 01:47 PM	I'm just curious: How do you actually find the price for a powerstone, with a different ML than the lowest spell. For example: A powerstone of vigor with an ML of 6 or a powerstone of ego whip that is enlarged and is ML of 7? Price = Power Level * Manifester Level. Manifester Level = # of PP spent on power. SO, Stone of Vigor (ML 6) = 1*6*25=150gp Stone of Enlarged Ego Whip (ML 7) = 2*7*25=350gp Make sense? It's just like buying a scroll.
Aramil Dunskar 04-03-05, 03:22 PM	Nell vs Dearth (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=5849374#post5849374) is up! Let me know if I need to change anything. -Aramil
xanadu 04-03-05, 07:16 PM	Hey guys, well I posted the story for Azer vs. Rakkar, hope you like it. Here it is. :pint: I'll toast to that quite good story.
Caterane 04-03-05, 07:51 PM	Yeah, I figured there were some mistakes in the fight, it was late and my eyes were wandering. Your AC is 26 there. AC is 28 [10 +4dex +4armor +4force +2PfG +4cover (ride)] Hrm... lemme think about that one. I'm not so sure that your tactics specify only sundering the bow when he has it in his hands. Your tactics are fairly clear, once his horse is dead you drop back, buff, and then ready to sunder the bow. You assume he has the bow out because you should be out of melee range for a few rounds buffing, but with your rage up you can't buff so I have you charge in right away. That seems to be a common misinterpretion of Rage. I can buff with potions and tattoos because they do not require any concentration. I also do not have to charge in right away just because I am in rage. The main reason for this is that you only have 5 rounds of rage, and once it's over you become fatigued and that's not very nice for you. Well, I had 4 rounds left when I readied and Ceres just moved to the Central Pillar from which he was just 15 ft away. According to his tactics he wanted to use his bow while staying at the central pillar. So what happens is that: Ceres moves to the central pillar AND draws his bow while he moves (because he can do that while moving; he would waste an action if he doesn't do that). There he drops his lance and shoots. Here comes my ready action in: while he draws his bow he has both hands occupied and cannot use his lance. An alternative that would also be better: instead of just charging onto the tip of the lance, I could wait until Ceres moved to (-1/-3) which is 15ft away, then trigger the ready action and approach from the NW so that I have cover while moving through his threatening area thus suffering no AoO. I am just writing this because that is how I would have done it if I could play Indri on my own. But even if you decide that Ceres doesn't use his free opportunity to draw the bow and miss an opportunity to shoot in the same round, and if you also decide that I don't approach using cover, then it doesn't hurt to wait one single round (and heal) while Ceres draws his bow. Also, even if he just has his bow out he can still attack with his bite or do a "drop's bow from 1 hand as a free action at the end of every turn" so he has a claw free for AoO's. A claw does much less damage than a lance and doesn't give him an AoO when I approach. I have a PnP D&D game to go to today, I'll be back later. Show me again why you would fall back and let you're rage end instead of rushing in now to break his bow and start you're pincushion tactic. I didn't say let rage run out but I meant to wait until he has his bow out which occurs within my rage duration and is a logical assumption given the fact that he has no other way of harming me, nor does he have any buffs left in his equipment. He just doesn't have anything "better" to do than shoot me with arrows, and that is exactly what he wrote in his tactic.
Huan 04-03-05, 09:19 PM	Nell vs Dearth (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=5849374#post5849374) is up! Let me know if I need to change anything. -Aramil In round 8 where I manifest Entagling Ectoplasm on Derth, I actually would have hit him. Remember, EE calls for a ranged touch attack, in which case Derth has a touch AC of 13. Also, my ranged attack would have been +5 (2 base + 2 Dex + 1 Offensive Precognition) that round, not +3. Not a big fight-altering detail, so no biggie. Otherwise, thanks for pitlording.
Aramil Dunskar 04-03-05, 10:02 PM	In round 8 where I manifest Entagling Ectoplasm on Derth, I actually would have hit him. Remember, EE calls for a ranged touch attack, in which case Derth has a touch AC of 13. Also, my ranged attack would have been +5 (2 base + 2 Dex + 1 Offensive Precognition) that round, not +3. Not a big fight-altering detail, so no biggie. Otherwise, thanks for pitlording. Drat, I thought that was a little awkward. I forgot that it was a ranged touch attack. Plus when I was doing bonus' I forgot to include bab :embarrass Sorry, if you'd like I'll edit the match, if not then I'll leave it as it is. -Aramil
Huan 04-03-05, 10:15 PM	Drat, I thought that was a little awkward. I forgot that it was a ranged touch attack. Plus when I was doing bonus' I forgot to include bab :embarrass Sorry, if you'd like I'll edit the match, if not then I'll leave it as it is. -Aramil Nah, don't worry about it, it's no big deal. Just something to remember for next time. :)
Jindl 04-04-05, 12:33 AM	En'Sidious Nyte (Arstimis) vs Gurfnerfurker (Megrim Lord) is finally up! My apologies again to both players who had to wait an extra week for the fight. Please check the pitlord comments in the fight, which are written in red. @Arti - Please fix the links for Nyte's previous fights, as they are currently not working. -Jindl
Arstimis 04-04-05, 12:46 AM	[post=5853872]@Arti - Please fix the links for Nyte's previous fights, as they are currently not working. -Jindl Hehe, i guess they are..sorry didnt notice
spasheridan 04-04-05, 01:00 AM	AC is 28 [10 +4dex +4armor +4force +2PfG +4cover (ride)]and -2 for rage makes it 26. That seems to be a common misinterpretion of Rage. I can buff with potions and tattoos because they do not require any concentration. I also do not have to charge in right away just because I am in rage. This is true, you could use a tatoo of biofeedback or vigor or an oil of magic weapon. I was thinking mostly of using your own powers, which you are unable to do while raging. Well, I had 4 rounds left when I readied and Ceres just moved to the Central Pillar from which he was just 15 ft away. According to his tactics he wanted to use his bow while staying at the central pillar. So what happens is that: Ceres moves to the central pillar AND draws his bow while he moves (because he can do that while moving; he would waste an action if he doesn't do that). There he drops his lance and shoots. Here comes my ready action in: while he draws his bow he has both hands occupied and cannot use his lance. I'm not sure it would work out the way you think it will. He wants to get into the center to avoid melee from you, so he'll move to a place where you will have trouble charging him with your large horseAn alternative that would also be better: instead of just charging onto the tip of the lance, I could wait until Ceres moved to (-1/-3) which is 15ft away, then trigger the ready action and approach from the NW so that I have cover while moving through his threatening area thus suffering no AoO. I am just writing this because that is how I would have done it if I could play Indri on my own. Yeah.. this is the probelm with readied actions. You don't know what he will do when you choose you're trigger, but I as the pitlord do.. and I have to pick the trigger. So I get to pick the "best" trigger, and it's best for one of you.. so I'm playing favorites. You would never pick a trigger of "he move's to X spot", you would pick a trigger like "he moves X feet" or "he gets more than X feet away". I thought about making your trigger "he moves more than 30 feet" so it would comply with your tactics of having the readied action start AFTER he had made his action, but I realized that a 30 ft move would put him out of your range (he could have moved into a spot you couldn't have followed). So then it's who wins... and this brings up why I hate readied actions as a pit lord. But even if you decide that Ceres doesn't use his free opportunity to draw the bow and miss an opportunity to shoot in the same round, and if you also decide that I don't approach using cover, then it doesn't hurt to wait one single round (and heal) while Ceres draws his bow. This does make much more sense with your tactics, I'll take this into consideration when I fix it up. I didn't say let rage run out but I meant to wait until he has his bow out which occurs within my rage duration and is a logical assumption given the fact that he has no other way of harming me, nor does he have any buffs left in his equipment. He just doesn't have anything "better" to do than shoot me with arrows, and that is exactly what he wrote in his tactic. Hrmm... I think this is a bit of a stretch on what the tactics imply. It's close, but shaded a bit off. I'll let you see take 2 of this in a bit. I'm sure you're breathless with anticipation! Thanks for the feedback though, I knew as I was running that section that things were a bit off. Like I said, it was late.
spasheridan 04-04-05, 02:31 AM	I'm not sure it would work out the way you think it will. He wants to get into the center to avoid melee from you, so he'll move to a place where you will have trouble charging him with your large horse Well, the edits to the fight are in. And low and behold, Indri is fast enough to run around the central pillar and get his tactic in. Ceres had some VERY lucky rolls at the end, but check it out.
Caterane 04-04-05, 05:34 AM	@Spasheridan: Sorry, but there are still some things I am not satisfied with. We keep thematic rolls in the rerun. Since Indri succeeded in sundering the bow the first run, he does so in the rerun. The others will confirm that if you don't believe me. Even on your version I succeeded because in case of a tie, the higher sunder modifier wins, and I have the higher sunder modifier by far; but as I pointed out earlier, that doesn't matter since we keep thematic rolls in reruns. Then, after the sunder succeeded, I wanted to get away from him asap ("sunder his bow [...] then ride the hell away"). That means a fullattack from my horse is only necessary when I missed the sunder, which I didn't. He gets his AoO which I survive (infact it even misses, see below). Some additional mistakes: In round 7 I didn't use a ride check. Why? As we have found out some weeks ago (Tavern, p47), I can use the ride check anytime and still attack in the same round. Then why does his claw have +9 on the attack? Even as a primary weapon it only has +8. This AoO misses. The bow on round 6 dealt (8+10) damage which is also wrong (fortunately it didn't hit). The claw deals 1d4+7 not +8. In a full attack it deals only half str damage (+3) because it is a secondary attack. He also suffers -5 on his claw attacks. The bite deals 1d6+7 damage at no attack penalty being the primary weapon. In round 8, he dealt with 2 claws (2d6+16-4, 4+3+16-4=19) damage. He gets a +35 damage bonus altogether. How is that possible? EDIT: ok, I got that. Still, +3 damage only, not +8. Even as primary weapon it deals +7 not +8. My rage doesn't end before the end of round 8. When I activated it in round 4, Ceres was first and Indri was last in that round; the initiative resetted when I readied but the rage should last till last in that round.
Sindorin 04-04-05, 08:43 AM	Ceres didn't get a ride check to negate the hit(s) to his mount through mounted combat.
Caterane 04-04-05, 09:06 AM	Ceres didn't get a ride check to negate the hit(s) to his mount through mounted combat. Indri drops his bow, draws his greatsword. He commands storm to attack Mekrdhek (11+6=17 vs ride 4+10, 20! 18+6 confirms, 14+1) and Storm smashes Mek for (3d6+12+d4+2=5+5+4+4+14=32) 32 and kills Mekrdhek.
Sindorin 04-04-05, 09:31 AM	oh, :) didn't see it.
spasheridan 04-04-05, 11:24 AM	We keep thematic rolls in the rerun. Since Indri succeeded in sundering the bow the first run, he does so in the rerun. The others will confirm that if you don't believe me. You rolled an 8 to hit the unattended bow in the original one, so now you used the same roll (8) to hit his bow while it was attended, but he get's to roll now instead of you just hitting it's AC. Even on your version I succeeded because in case of a tie, the higher sunder modifier wins, and I have the higher sunder modifier by far; but as I pointed out earlier, that doesn't matter since we keep thematic rolls in reruns. Step 3: Consequences. If you beat the defender, roll damage and deal it to the weapon or shield. See Table: Common Armor, Weapon, and Shield Hardness and Hit Points to determine how much damage you must deal to destroy the weapon or shield. No, you miss. Then, after the sunder succeeded, I wanted to get away from him asap ("sunder his bow [...] then ride the hell away"). That means a fullattack from my horse is only necessary when I missed the sunder, which I didn't. He gets his AoO which I survive (infact it even misses, see below). You had to 5 foot adjust to get into base to base with him, therefore you sit there and take the full attack. Some additional mistakes: In round 7 I didn't use a ride check. Why? As we have found out some weeks ago (Tavern, p47), I can use the ride check anytime and still attack in the same round. Then why does his claw have +9 on the attack? Even as a primary weapon it only has +8. This AoO misses. This was a "thematicly maintained" roll, the lance was +9. OK, he rolls a 23 instead of a 24, your AC is still 22 so it's a hit. You can't do a ride check for cover VS an AoO of an attack. This is the only case where you can't do it I believe, if you're attack incurs the AoO then you can't do a ride check for cover during it. The bow on round 6 dealt (8+10) damage which is also wrong (fortunately it didn't hit). Again, thematicly maintained from earlier incarnation... it would have been 8+7 if it hit, sorry. The claw deals 1d4+7 not +8. In a full attack it deals only half str damage (+3) because it is a secondary attack. He also suffers -5 on his claw attacks. The bite deals 1d6+7 damage at no attack penalty being the primary weapon. Full Attack: A half-dragon fighting without weapons uses both claws and its bite when making a full attack. If armed with a weapon, it usually uses the weapon as its primary attack and its bite as a natural secondary attack. If it has a hand free, it uses a claw as an additional natural secondary attack. Sorry, but you're wrong, the bite is the secondary attack. BUT, this does leave Stormrage with 2 HP instead of 0. I'll take a peak at it from there. In round 8, he dealt with 2 claws (2d6+16-4, 4+3+16-4=19) damage. He gets a +35 damage bonus altogether. How is that possible? EDIT: ok, I got that. Still, +3 damage only, not +8. Even as primary weapon it deals +7 not +8. My rage doesn't end before the end of round 8. When I activated it in round 4, Ceres was first and Indri was last in that round; the initiative resetted when I readied but the rage should last till last in that round.No, I think you're rage ends on your turn. And it's better for you, the -2 to AC for rage (which you seem to forget often) is replaced with a -1 to AC for Fatigued. I'll double check it from when Stormrage get's hit.
T'Var 04-04-05, 11:32 AM	hey all, im really sorry but i just cant finish find the time to run my fights this week. every time i get down to do it something comes up and throws it out of wack. Very sorry to everyone involved Cat also if you can put me to zero fights I'll be gone for the next several weeks Ill pm everyones tactics to the pitlord account to be reassigned
spasheridan 04-04-05, 12:53 PM	@T'Var- Is this because of my super-evil tactics for Legion? Feel free to have him self-immolate if you feel it's the best way!
Kaigan 04-04-05, 01:13 PM	Cat: Just wondeirng if you fixed the exp for Rayos vs. Sokai fight?
Megrim_Lord 04-04-05, 03:09 PM	Jindl, sorry, but I have a few issues with the fight :D Round 7, Gurfy shouldnt have moved towards nyte; he broke the whip's grapple, plus he was injured so, as per my default tactics gurfy should have run away and manifested vigor stones and the listed powerstones before continuing to fight. this should have had a considerable impact on the fight, because Gurfy's AC would've been 4 higher, he would have had DR and temp HP as well.
Jindl 04-04-05, 03:25 PM	If grapple is broken and not reestablished, manifest burst, RUN away, use powerstones of Force Screen & Biofeedback. @Megrim - From this, I thought you wanted to make at least one attempt at reestablishing the grapple before running away. That is why you attempted to move to keep Nyte within range of the whip. Had you survived another round, you would have moved into range for the whip to attack Nyte again, and you would have directed your psionic shot at him. FYI: Running would draw an AoO, and based upon the attack roll, the horse would have hit you, and since you must run in a straight line, your running distance would have been limited to within range for the horse to persue you and for Nyte to rehide and snipe. I think I followed what was written in your tactics, but even if you did run, I doubt it would change the outcome, becuase the horse would be attacking you while you tried to draw/use the powerstones, and Nyte would have added sneak attack damage to the psionic shot he would later have fired at you while sniping. Sorry, bud. I think Gerf's best option in the fight would have been to use psionic shot on Nyte first, before targetting the horse. Better luck next time :D -Jindl
Megrim_Lord 04-04-05, 03:38 PM	@Megrim - From this, I thought you wanted to make at least one attempt at reestablishing the grapple before running away. That is why you attempted to move to keep Nyte within range of the whip. Had you survived another round, you would have moved into range for the whip to attack Nyte again, and you would have directed your psionic shot at him. FYI: Running would draw an AoO, and based upon the attack roll, the horse would have hit you, and since you must run in a straight line, your running distance would have been limited to within range for the horse to persue you and for Nyte to rehide and snipe. I think I followed what was written in your tactics, but even if you did run, I doubt it would change the outcome, becuase the horse would be attacking you while you tried to draw/use the powerstones, and Nyte would have added sneak attack damage to the psionic shot he would later have fired at you while sniping. Sorry, bud. I think Gerf's best option in the fight would have been to use psionic shot on Nyte first, before targetting the horse. Better luck next time :D -Jindl I know running draws an AoO, but with an AC of 21 i assumed it was worth the risk when writing my tactics, plus with skate manifested I could have gotten 180ft away, and you cant base results on a previous attack roll, because that's just what it was, the previous attack roll. the horse could have followed but not Nyte if he wanted to keep cover. speaking of cover, can you show me where on the map Nyte was getting his alleged cover?
Jindl 04-04-05, 03:48 PM	speaking of cover, can you show me where on the map Nyte was getting his alleged cover? The rock at (-14, -3).
Huan 04-04-05, 04:41 PM	hey all, im really sorry but i just cant finish find the time to run my fights this week. every time i get down to do it something comes up and throws it out of wack. Very sorry to everyone involved Cat also if you can put me to zero fights I'll be gone for the next several weeks Ill pm everyones tactics to the pitlord account to be reassigned Hmm, I think I will do my part to help out and take either one or both of your fights (if no one else objects)... it would be a shame to have fights carried onto next week.
spasheridan 04-04-05, 04:58 PM	Hey T'Var- I can take the Kaigan / Jindl match.
Arstimis 04-04-05, 06:05 PM	I fear I am in the same situation as T'Var... I am lucky enough to get this time to write this. I am very sorry. Huan, since spash can do one of T'Var's fights, do you think you could do mine? Cat: take away the Credit from me and set me to no fights..till i say i can do it again Again I am very sorry for this
Caterane 04-04-05, 06:25 PM	Even on your version I succeeded because in case of a tie, the higher sunder modifier wins, and I have the higher sunder modifier by far No, you miss. It is an opposed roll, and as with ALL opposed rolls, a tie is decided by the higher modifier. Since I have the higher modifier, I BEAT the defender. Please correct this. Or ask anyone else if you don't believe me. That is a basic rule and decides the fight. @all: can someone please confirm this? Thanks. About the bite/claw, I could tell you now that the bite is the primary weapon because it does more damage, and even in your example it mentions the bite first, but I don't care anymore. Please correct the sunder attempt which succeeds, then ride away suffering an AoO from the claw or whatever primary weapon he has, and shoot with the bow. Thanks.
Snommelp 04-04-05, 06:27 PM	I know running draws an AoO, but with an AC of 21 i assumed it was worth the risk when writing my tactics, plus with skate manifested I could have gotten 180ft away, and you cant base results on a previous attack roll, because that's just what it was, the previous attack roll. the horse could have followed but not Nyte if he wanted to keep cover.Any changes recycle old rolls according to type. If the horse attacked and hit in the old fight, the attack will hit again in the rerun unless your AC or its attack bonus change. I did not actually read the fight, though, so this may be irrelevant.
Kaigan 04-04-05, 06:29 PM	I fear I am in the same situation as T'Var... I am lucky enough to get this time to write this. I am very sorry. Huan, since spash can do one of T'Var's fights, do you think you could do mine? Cat: take away the Credit from me and set me to no fights..till i say i can do it again Again I am very sorry for this Give me the fight, i'll do it tonight. Just PM me the tactics
Snommelp 04-04-05, 06:32 PM	It is an opposed roll, and as with ALL opposed rolls, a tie is decided by the higher modifier. Since I have the higher modifier, I BEAT the defender. Please correct this. Or ask anyone else if you don't believe me. That is a basic rule and decides the fight. @all: can someone please confirm this? Thanks. Sorry, Cat, but all I can find is opposed checks. I'll keep looking, but I don't know that I'll find anything to help you.
Arstimis 04-04-05, 06:48 PM	Give me the fight, i'll do it tonight. Just PM me the tacticsThank you. Tactics are being PMed now
Pitlords 04-04-05, 06:52 PM	New Pitlords: Eniolissaryn the Elder (Jindl) vs Boraxx (Pittbull): Arstimis Kaigan Jindl of the High Forest (Jindl) vs Aeluath Dryearraheal (Kaigan): T'Var Spasheridan Laph Jeirehneen (Pittbull) vs Legion (Spasheridan): T'Var Huan T'Var-2, Arty-1, Huan+1, Kaigan+1, Spash+1 credits. Tactics for Jindl, Laph, Aeiou, and Legion forwarded to the respective pitlord. T'Var and Arty set to <zero>. We have pitlords for only 14 fights now. If anyone wants to earn credits he is most welcome!!
spasheridan 04-04-05, 07:04 PM	It is an opposed roll, and as with ALL opposed rolls, a tie is decided by the higher modifier. Since I have the higher modifier, I BEAT the defender. Please correct this. Or ask anyone else if you don't believe me. That is a basic rule and decides the fight. @all: can someone please confirm this? Thanks. I believe that the wording in the SRD is clear Cat. You must beat his roll. There are some instances where ties are declared by the higher modifier, like initiative or grapple. In these cases it is clearly states what to do in cases of ties. For sunder the rule is that the attacker must beat the defender, which means that a tie is an unsucsesful sunder attempt.. or, you missed. If you disagree please point out the page in the SRD or the PHB that describes how the modifer for sunder is the determining factor in a tie. About the bite/claw, I could tell you now that the bite is the primary weapon because it does more damage, and even in your example it mentions the bite first, but I don't care anymore. Please correct the sunder attempt which succeeds, then ride away suffering an AoO from the claw or whatever primary weapon he has, and shoot with the bow. Thanks. Cat, again, the SRD is quite clear on what is a primary and what is a secondary attack, and it has nothing to do with the damage die. You can't ride away because you had to 5 foot adjust BEFORE the sunder, so you need to sit there a round. Stormrage has 2 HP at the beggining of rnd 8 instead of being goosegged, so you have some options open. I believe your tactics say that :Repeat (3) if it failed. Use an obscurring mist to mask my maneuver the second time.So you will ride away This incurs an AoO on you (you can't withdraw, you make a ride check) or maybe on Stormrage. I'm not sure, I'll look at it later ... and I'll run the fight changes later as well, but in about 4 hours when I get home from work and have finished dinner. I'm not an expert on Sunder, I rarely use it, so if you can find me some reference on this tie being determined by modifer rule I'll check it out, you may be right.
Huan 04-04-05, 07:09 PM	Bare-bones of Ixenthor's Short Quest (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5860717) is up (only a rough draft...expansion later, time permitting). Tactics for Laph and Legion recieved, thank you. Other writing project status: Coming along.
Jindl 04-04-05, 07:17 PM	I'm not an expert on Sunder, I rarely use it, so if you can find me some reference on this tie being determined by modifer rule I'll check it out, you may be right. Here's a discussion between Micheal Noah and I from the FoTW - March 16, 2005 thread. We were talking about resolving a Disarm tie, but I think it would apply equally to Sunder attempts, as they are both considered attack rolls: I bring this up because I was the one that noticed the grapple check for whip vs. horse last week. In a tied grapple check, the grappler with the higher mod wins. When I saw the disarm attempt this week, I initially thought the same thing was true (as did some of you). However, there is no entry about ties in the Disarm action wording. In fact, it says, "Step Three: Consequences. If you beat the defender, the defender is disarmed." This would imply to me that it is only if your check is greater than the defender's is he disarmed. Now, the definition for opposed checks says that the higher mod wins in a tie, which would initially seem to apply to disarms. But, "opposed checks" are defined as "A method of determining the result when a character attempts an action (other than an attack or a saving throw) that has a chance of failure. " (wizards online glosary) And, Disarm is an "opposed attack roll", so it doesn't seem to qualify. While I think you make a pretty good point, I would counter it with this answer. When making an attack roll, you pass or fail depending on whether you equal or exceed the target number (the defender's AC). Since a disarm check is an attack roll, you succeed or fail based upon whether you meet or exceed the target number (the result of the defender's check). Effectively, the defender is setting the DC of the check by his roll, and the attacker is rolling to see if he meets the DC or not. Whether you use this interpretation or the standard one for opposed rolls is irrelevent to the outcome. Both yeild the same result in this case (the defender is disarmed). In the Core rules, there is only one example of a roll contest being "rerolled" if the result is a tie, and that is spelled out specifically in the grapple section. I don't believe it also would apply to disarm checks, or that deviation from the standard method of attack rolls or opposed checks would have been noted in the disarm section. -Jindl I think that's a reasonable conclusion.
Zyme86 04-04-05, 07:27 PM	I have two complaints regarding kaigen and his adjudicating of the fight. First, A monk can use the stunning fis abilities once per day, for ever monk level you have (this case 2) You completly over looked the damage delt by my great axe Due to the unique sizing (the ballance of a small great axe, but sized for a larger fighter) deals 2d8, not 1d12 Extra HP during rage was not accounted for Str damage was not added to attack on round 3 He would have been taken down then The outcome wouldn't have changed, but the extra two rounds were erouious.
Kaigan 04-04-05, 07:41 PM	I have two complaints regarding kaigen and his adjudicating of the fight. First, A monk can use the stunning fis abilities once per day, for ever monk level you have (this case 2) First of all, yes, he can do it twice a day, but due to the 1/3 rule, he can only use it once You completly over looked the damage delt by my great axe Due to the unique sizing (the ballance of a small great axe, but sized for a larger fighter) deals 2d8, not 1d12 Granted. Yes, you are correct, i did not factor that in. I apologize, but you still win, you didn't use anything, so I will not change. Extra HP during rage was not accounted for Again you are correct, I was a bit hasty. I apologize again. But yes, you didn't even get hit, so.... yeah. I won't change that either. Str damage was not added to attack on round 3 He would have been taken down then Strength was taken into account. You got a "1" on your damage roll, so +3str, and +4 PA is 8. Granted you would have had a 2d8 damage die, but it still does not change the outcome The outcome wouldn't have changed, but the extra two rounds were erouious. Yes, but "erouious". Not sure if that's a word or not, or if you meant erroneous. But yeah, doesn't change the outcome at all. So all this really served was to tell me of little mistakes. Thank you for your time.
Jindl 04-04-05, 07:44 PM	You completly over looked the damage delt by my great axe Due to the unique sizing (the ballance of a small great axe, but sized for a larger fighter) deals 2d8, not 1d12 No, he is not correct. A small sized greataxe is not a different weapon. It is a still a great axe. And by definition, a greataxe that is sized for a medium creature does 1d12 damage, not 2d8 damage. -Jindl
Zyme86 04-04-05, 07:57 PM	an axe sized for a small person, in real life, has a different comparative balance point. What daka carries is an axe that is sized for a medium person, but still carries the ballance point of a small great axe. the damage for a small g. axe is 1d10, so when a midium version is made, it's damage scales to 2d8 I apologize of the over zeleous zeal I put into you GMing of Daka, I was simply over enthustic and got impatien, so when it finally posted, I reacted overly harsh By the by, what is this one/third rule in regard the monk Stunning fist.
Jindl 04-04-05, 08:01 PM	an axe sized for a small person, in real life, has a different comparative balance point. What daka carries is an axe that is sized for a medium person, but still carries the ballance point of a small great axe. the damage for a small g. axe is 1d10, so when a midium version is made, it's damage scales to 2d8 Regardless of its size, a greataxe remains a greataxe. Per the rules, a medium size greataxe does a base of 1d12 damage. Would any other Elders care to comment on this as well? -Jindl
Aramil Dunskar 04-04-05, 08:10 PM	Regardless of its size, a greataxe remains a greataxe. Per the rules, a medium size greataxe does a base of 1d12 damage. Would any other Elders care to comment on this as well? -Jindl Well I'm not an Elder, but I would like to make a comment anyway. According to the book, yes you are right Jindl. However, what Zyme is trying to get at is really a whole new perspective of looking at weapons with DnD. I think he is trying something pretty cool actually, by taking the standard weapon, but changing it so when you swing the weapon you could either deal more damage, or soften the blow, just by changing the point at which you apply the pressure. Whether or not we choose to incorporate this, is up to the Elders, but I think I might have cleared this up for anyone confused. -Aramil
spasheridan 04-04-05, 08:18 PM	an axe sized for a small person, in real life, has a different comparative balance point. What daka carries is an axe that is sized for a medium person, but still carries the ballance point of a small great axe. the damage for a small g. axe is 1d10, so when a midium version is made, it's damage scales to 2d8 1) This isn't real life, it's a game. 2) Balance points don't mean anything, use game rule terms. 3) Size rules are clear. If you are wielding a weapon designed for a medium wielder, then use the weapon listed on the chart. Greataxe (med) does d12 damage per the chart, so any Greataxe (med) does d12 damage. To be specific, all of the weapons in the game have their damage listed when they are medium and small sized. Therefore, any weapn you use that is size medium or size small will have it's damage listed on the charts and you don't use a damage adjust chart to determine the damage. 4) There is no Small -> Medium damage chart. On the weapon charts, small greataxes for d10 damage and medium greatzes do d12 damage. THerefore, any small weapon that does d10 damage would do d12 damage as a medium weapon (or 2d6 damage if it were a greatsword). The chart you are looking at is a Medium -> Large chart, and it is obviously not used for doing damage from small to medium. If it was, Small greatswords would do d8 damage and not d10. 5) What you want is a Large Waraxe. That is a d10 weapon for medium creatures. As a Large Weapon it does 2d8 damage, and if you take the correct feats you will only be -2 to attack with it. Sorry if I sound harsh!
Caterane 04-04-05, 08:18 PM	@Huan: What can I say. I think I'm running out of compliments faster than you produce these awesome stories. I am not sure if a simple thank you is enough; perhaps I'll open a Huan Fanclub here in Germany :D @Spash: I hope Jindl's reference helps in convincing you. @Zyme/Jindl: I concur with Jindl else there is no reason to use a regular greataxe over an "enlarged small" (!?) greataxe. Would be a nice loophole. Perhaps I can provide an elegant solution that confirms this. DMG,p27: Weapon Equivalencies. A small greataxe (1d10) is the equivalent of a medium battleaxe (1d8) and a medium battleaxe scales to 2d6, or 1d12 ...like a greataxe. Elegant or not, in any case, there is no such thing as a "large small greataxe". It is a medium greataxe and table 7-5 (PHB p117: equipment) overrides the table 2-2 (DMG p28: weapon sizes).
Cerebus13 04-04-05, 08:51 PM	@Pitlords I would be willing to try Pitlording a lower level battle (ECL 3? :P) and see how it works out for me. Throw me on the list for one battle in the upcoming week if that is alright with you and the elders.
Zyme86 04-04-05, 08:59 PM	If you need any extra hands with the low level fights, I would be willing to assist as a pitlord
spasheridan 04-04-05, 09:46 PM	@Spash: I hope Jindl's reference helps in convincing you.Nope, it doesn't convince me. If that was all you had to go on I would have said that the attacker didn't beat the defenders roll. I did some more digging though and...Opposed Checks An opposed check is a check whose success or failure is determined by comparing the check result to another character’s check result. In an opposed check, the higher result succeeds, while the lower result fails. In case of a tie, the higher skill modifier wins. If these scores are the same, roll again to break the tie.It says skill modifier, but I'm not going to quibble that. That convinced me. I like logic, but I really like rules. OK, so.. fixing the fight in a bit. Stormrage will have 2 HP left, Indri will have 14 HP left, and the bow is destroyed. It's the beggining of rnd 8 and Indri is going to ride away.
spasheridan 04-04-05, 09:53 PM	SO, can a horse withdraw? Can a rider on a horse withdraw?
Snommelp 04-04-05, 09:59 PM	SO, can a horse withdraw? Can a rider on a horse withdraw? The withdraw action is nothing more than moving away from your opponent without taking your attention away from him. A common example is backing away with your sword and shield in defensive positions. Both a horse and a mounted character are capable, logically and mechanically, of withdrawing, provided neither does anything that round besides move.
Kaigan 04-04-05, 10:03 PM	That is incorrect I believe. In past fights, my characters have had their mounts withdraw, but the character still suffers an AoO.
Snommelp 04-04-05, 10:05 PM	That is incorrect I believe. In past fights, my characters have had their mounts withdraw, but the character still suffers an AoO. Odds are that while the horse was withdrawing, the character was doing something else. Dividing your attention in such a manner opens up the chance for an Attack of Opportunity. If your character did nothing but sit on the horse while the horse withdrew, then the character should not have drawn an AoO.
Huan 04-04-05, 10:07 PM	@Huan: What can I say. I think I'm running out of compliments faster than you produce these awesome stories. I am not sure if a simple thank you is enough; perhaps I'll open a Huan Fanclub here in Germany :D Thank you very much, you flatter me.... but I'm not done yet ... I still have a few more stories from last week to churn out (and that mini-quest is only bare-bones so far ;) ), so hopefully I'll explode with tales this coming week. :D
Iced 04-04-05, 11:44 PM	I can take as many fights as needed up to a reasonable amount(don't decide that i'm running all the ELC-3 fights or something similar...;))
spasheridan 04-05-05, 12:01 AM	OK, the 3rd run of Ceres v Indri is up. This time the bow was destroyed, and then I thought Indri had the fight in the bag ... but the dice are a higher power.
Iced 04-05-05, 12:03 AM	:confused: Kaigan talks about a horse in his tactics for Coralias, and has a masterwork bit and bridle, but there is no horse mentioned on his character sheet. :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:
Kaigan 04-05-05, 12:41 AM	Yeah, that is bizarre, I forgot to buy a horse. And to make matters worse, I spent two feats on mounted horse stuff, and I still don't have enough money for it. Oh well, just run the fight without a horse, follow all my tactics the same, i'll just have to deal with a lesser movement speed.
Jindl 04-05-05, 01:12 AM	Crask Mindwhip (Iced) vs Finael Owlguide (Spasheridan) is posted. My apologies to both Iced and Spasheridan for taking an extra week on the fight. :( -Jindl
spasheridan 04-05-05, 01:47 AM	Aelou vs JotHF is up. It looks amazingly like Finaels fight with Crask though. @ Iced- When I was reading that fight I saw you buffing and I was going "NUTS! Why would I let him buff for so long!" Sometimes no matter what we plan the dice have their own say in the match!
Pittbull 04-05-05, 02:55 AM	New Pitlords: Eniolissaryn the Elder (Jindl) vs Boraxx (Pittbull): Arstimis Kaigan Laph Jeirehneen (Pittbull) vs Legion (Spasheridan): T'Var Huan Thanks, to both of you! T'Var and Arty set to <zero>. We have pitlords for only 14 fights now. If anyone wants to earn credits he is most welcome!! I'm quite busy at the moment, but just gimme <one> fight for this week.
Caterane 04-05-05, 04:05 AM	SO, can a horse withdraw? Can a rider on a horse withdraw? Yes, both have to do the withdraw action. It is definately possible. That means Indri and Stormrage do not suffer an AoO while riding away. This is a basic D&D rule and has been handled like that all along. Infact, we even corrected past fights on that. Indri would escape, tap force screen on Stormrage, heal himself and it, then shoot Ceres with arrows and probably win the fight. But, Spash, I don't care anymore. That is just too taxing for me. I don't have the time and I lose interest in this discussion for everytime I succeed in convincing you with the help of others, something new pops up. So Sindorin, congratulations on your win. Ceres is a cool character (and a lucky one for sure ;) ).
Pitlords 04-05-05, 06:18 AM	Zyme86 and Cerebus13 have been added to the Pitlord List. Also thanks to those who increased their number of fights. @Cerebus: I used your email: evilsticky (at) gmail.com. Please confirm this. @Zyme86: I set PM as default for your account but if you could send me your email address (optional) I can add it to the list. Emails are prefered but not mandatory. Thanks.
Cerebus13 04-05-05, 08:08 AM	@Pitlords That email will work fine, thanks :).
Sindorin 04-05-05, 08:08 AM	So Sindorin, congratulations on your win. Ceres is a cool character (and a lucky one for sure ;) ). I honestly do not know how he has managed to do so well, especially since he has invested 3000 of his allocation to that pegasus... pure luck, I tell you...
Captain Mutilate 04-05-05, 09:37 AM	Kaigan: I don't want a redo, but note the bolded part. STUNNING FIST [GENERAL] Prerequisites: Dex 13, Wis 13, Improved Unarmed Strike, base attack bonus +8. Benefit: You must declare that you are using this feat before you make your attack roll (thus, a failed attack roll ruins the attempt). Stunning Fist forces a foe damaged by your unarmed attack to make a Fortitude saving throw (DC 10 + 1/2 your character level + your Wis modifier), in addition to dealing damage normally. A defender who fails this saving throw is stunned for 1 round (until just before your next action). A stunned character can’t act, loses any Dexterity bonus to AC, and takes a –2 penalty to AC. You may attempt a stunning attack once per day for every four levels you have attained (but see Special), and no more than once per round. Constructs, oozes, plants, undead, incorporeal creatures, and creatures immune to critical hits cannot be stunned. Special: A monk may select Stunning Fist as a bonus feat at 1st level, even if she does not meet the prerequisites. A monk who selects this feat may attempt a stunning attack a number of times per day equal to her monk level, plus one more time per day for every four levels she has in classes other than monk. A fighter may select Stunning Fist as one of his fighter bonus feats.
Cerebus13 04-05-05, 09:45 AM	@Cap'n Unfortunately the CoCo limits usable abilities and spells to 1/3rd (rounded up!) of their normal amount of uses per day. Annoying sometimes for abilities that are based on class level instead of ability scores or something else that is buffable. Edit: Gotta remember the rounding up part when doing hitpoints from now on :P
Snommelp 04-05-05, 10:28 AM	@Cap'n Unfortunately the CoCo limits usable abilities and spells to 1/3rd (rounded down) of their normal amount of uses per day. Annoying sometimes for abilities that are based on class level instead of ability scores or something else that is buffable. Almost entirely correct. CoCo rounds up, always.
spasheridan 04-05-05, 10:49 AM	Yes, both have to do the withdraw action. It is definately possible. That means Indri and Stormrage do not suffer an AoO while riding away. This is a basic D&D rule and has been handled like that all along. Infact, we even corrected past fights on that. Indri would escape, tap force screen on Stormrage, heal himself and it, then shoot Ceres with arrows and probably win the fight. But, Spash, I don't care anymore. That is just too taxing for me. I don't have the time and I lose interest in this discussion for everytime I succeed in convincing you with the help of others, something new pops up. So Sindorin, congratulations on your win. Ceres is a cool character (and a lucky one for sure ;) ). Look at the map. Look at the positions. Tell me how the AoO happened. O O @ O O O O S S O @ O S S O O O C O O O O @ O O C is Ceres S is stormrage Tell me, where can Stormrage move that isn't into a threatened square? Diagonals: When measuring distance, the first diagonal counts as 1 square, the second counts as 2 squares, the third counts as 1, the fourth as 2, and so on. You can’t move diagonally past a corner (even by taking a 5-foot step). You can move diagonally past a creature, even an opponent. You can also move diagonally past other impassable obstacles, such as pits. CAT, if you go back and check your posts, they are filled with errors. You happily accuse me of being wrong on many occasions. Every time you are correct I agreed with you and fixed the issues. Every time you were dead wrong you didn't say "Sorry, I got that mixed up". You just found something else to pick at. I think you forgot the -2 to AC for rage 3 times. You continued to say that the bite was the primary attack after I showed you the quote from the SRD saying which attack was primary and which was secondary. I had to tell you twice that Stormrage had to 5 foot adjust into Ceres for you to do the Sunder so you couldn't move away that turn. Like I said in my original post, I started the fight late at night, I was tired, and I knew I had made some mistakes. BUT I put it up with the intent to fix it AND to offer the curtesy of allowing the combatants to check where it was so far. I freely admit that I made mistakes in the fights, but I believe that they are now ALL fixed. Can you do the same and admit that you made mistakes as well? Can you take a moment before asking for a 4th re-run and double check that the error you believe is there is actually NOT there?
Captain Mutilate 04-05-05, 11:29 AM	Almost entirely correct. CoCo rounds up, always. >.<
Caterane 04-05-05, 11:35 AM	Every time I lose it is a rules error? Let's see... First run of the fight: you handled the ride check wrong so that Indri didn't get +4 cover AC which negated a hit and made the outcome uncertain again. Second run of the fight: I lost an opposed roll despite my modifier being higher. That means the fullattack of Ceres that killed me doesn't happen. Fight open again. Third run of the fight: I suffer an AoO (that decided the fight) even though I and my horse use the withdraw action (and I can withdraw, see below). And I am not prone despite failing the ride check when my horse dies... so I don't think that's an appropriate statement. These are definate mistakes. If I make a mistake with your character in a fight (let's say I calculate your AC wrong and you die because of that), I'd always correct it. That's why this thread is for. That said, I am wondering how I got into that position in the first place. Here are 2 maps: Below we see Round 6. Ceres has just moved to the red dot, and Indri is about to trigger his ready action and base Ceres. Note that my mount has a movement of 80 ft. And note that Ceres has no actions left. http://home.arcor.de/caterane/Indri-Ceres-6.jpg Indri however, didn't base Ceres but moved to 10ft away instead of taking the most direct path. http://home.arcor.de/caterane/Indri-Ceres-7.jpg PHB, p148 speaks about squeezing or obstacles, and that it costs double movement. So it would be easy to move directly to Ceres and base him. The same is true for the withdraw. Squeezing through the diagonal would cost me double movement for this one square but since my horse has 160ft on a double move I don't see a problem in escaping. Or do you want to tell me no horse can ever enter the Central Obstacle? Another note Spash: it seems our discussion is going to boil a bit but I don't want that to happen. I like the way you run your fights and you are an important member of the CoCo; I am just trying to show you my point of view. So let us calm down a bit. :cool:
Kaigan 04-05-05, 12:44 PM	Elder vs. Boraxx is up. Hope everything looks in order.
Jindl 04-05-05, 12:53 PM	Elder vs. Boraxx is up. Hope everything looks in order. I only saw 1 error: Protection from arrows gives DR 10/magic. So the spell can only absorb 10 damage on any single hit. That means that the Elder has to pass a concentration check in Rnd 2 when he is interrupted, because 1 pt of damage gets through. It's a DC 10 +1 power level +1 damage = 12 check, so the Elder passes it on a 4 or greater. Later in the fight, the spell would only absorb the first 10 pts of the critical hit, however, that would just cause the spell to last longer, resulting in the same final hp totals. That's all I noticed. Let's see if Pittbull finds anything else ;) Thanks for running the fight for us!! -Jindl
Pittbull 04-05-05, 01:12 PM	@Kaigan: Thanks for running the fight. I did this stupid mistake to ready a charge after a single-move, which is impossible. After losing initiative, Boraxx' chances to win were pretty low, but nicely run fight. Cool! :) There weeks losing-streaks against Jindl aren't nice! :(
Sindorin 04-05-05, 01:14 PM	That's what we get for having two characters each at fifth level...
spasheridan 04-05-05, 01:48 PM	PHB, p148 speaks about squeezing or obstacles, and that it costs double movement. So it would be easy to move directly to Ceres and base him. The same is true for the withdraw. Squeezing through the diagonal would cost me double movement for this one square but since my horse has 160ft on a double move I don't see a problem in escaping. Or do you want to tell me no horse can ever enter the Central Obstacle? NOW.. that's a differant story. Yes, you could have squeezed through the central obstacle to attack. Of course, squeezing gives you a -4 attack/ AC so I generally don't have people do it. I would require something in your tactics to have you do this (IE say "squeeze through the central obstacle" or "take the most direct route, even if I have to squeeze") because of this penalty. To pull off your manuver you suffered 2 AoO & 1 full attack. In a perfect world you would have suffered 1 AoO. Seriously.. look at the dice! Ceres rolled 19's and 17's the whole time. Without crazy dice like that you would have been in and out of there and pluggin him full of arrows, so I thought that you wouldn't mind the attacks. I'm blaming the dice!!!Another note Spash: it seems our discussion is going to boil a bit but I don't want that to happen. I like the way you run your fights and you are an important member of the CoCo; I am just trying to show you my point of view. So let us calm down a bit. :cool: Yeah.. I edited my post after I wrote it.. I shouldnt post before I have my coffee. Sorry for the harsh words! I had hoped I had edited it before anyone read it.
Jindl 04-05-05, 01:51 PM	That's what we get for having two characters each at fifth level... Unfortunately, JotHF is 22 xp short of being 6th level. So I guess he'll get another 5th level fight this week.
Caterane 04-05-05, 03:04 PM	NOW.. that's a differant story. Yes, you could have squeezed through the central obstacle to attack. Of course, squeezing gives you a -4 attack/ AC so I generally don't have people do it. I would require something in your tactics to have you do this (IE say "squeeze through the central obstacle" or "take the most direct route, even if I have to squeeze") because of this penalty. I could have attacked without penalty because the "attack" space is broad enough to attack without penalties. And I could have retreated without AC penalty. The penalty applies only as long as I am actually squeezing and this is out of Ceres reach. http://home.arcor.de/caterane/Indri-Ceres-6.1.jpg To pull off your manuver you suffered 2 AoO & 1 full attack. In a perfect world you would have suffered 1 AoO. And that made a huge difference in this fight...
spasheridan 04-05-05, 04:14 PM	Yeah, I see now that it's "possible" to squeeze into that corner. I'll take that into consideration in future fights. I wonder what the effects of squeezing on the mount are? Is it a standard ride check? Is it pushing the mount to make it squeeze? Would Ceres have moved to where he did or would he have backed up to (4,3) instead if I knew about squeezing through the cracks? There are a few grey area's in here, but most of them could be cleaned up.
Caterane 04-05-05, 04:35 PM	Yeah, I see now that it's "possible" to squeeze into that corner. I'll take that into consideration in future fights. I wonder what the effects of squeezing on the mount are? Is it a standard ride check? Is it pushing the mount to make it squeeze? Would Ceres have moved to where he did or would he have backed up to (4,3) instead if I knew about squeezing through the cracks? There are a few grey area's in here, but most of them could be cleaned up. Hi Spash, no there's no ride check or anything. To conclude the fight and answer your questions about the grey areas... whatever Ceres would have done or whereever he would have moved to, the whole point in readying a move was that I can move in to base him, ini resets: sunder+move away. 1 AoO from a claw and thats it. Fight won. Stopping 10ft away spoils the purpose of the ready action and makes it completely useless. That's what I was trying to tell you. Well, the mistake stands and I lost because of it, but as I said, Sindorin can keep his win.
spasheridan 04-05-05, 04:55 PM	Hi Spash, no there's no ride check or anything. To conclude the fight and answer your questions about the grey areas... whatever Ceres would have done or whereever he would have moved to, the whole point in readying a move was that I can move in to base him, ini resets: sunder+move away. 1 AoO from a claw and thats it. Fight won. If he stood there like a log an took it, yes, fight won. There are actions he could / would / DID take to stop that from happening. Stopping 10ft away spoils the purpose of the ready action and makes it completely useless. That's what I was trying to tell you. Well, the mistake stands and I lost because of it, but as I said, Sindorin can keep his win. No, stopping 10 ft away doesn't spoil the purpose of the readied action. It spoils the perfect outcome of your tactic, but not the general purpose of them. It's what you had to do because of the tactics and positions. IF you had written "I will only close within X feet IF AND ONLY IF I can sunder and run away without Ceres attacking" then stopping 10 feet away would have defeated the point of the tactics. If you had written that in I would have had you reposition at something like (0,4), where you would be able to ride around the column to any square within a move of Ceres. BUT, if you had denied this chance then your rage would have worn off by the time you got another chance.. and then the sunder WOULD have failed... see how it goes? It's never as cut and dried as it looks, and no matter how pretty or well thought out your tactics are, the dice and the battlefield hae a lot to say about who wins. SO don't say that you're "giving" the fight to Sindorin.. he won, you lost.
Caterane 04-05-05, 05:01 PM	With the squeezing above I would have been able to do just that. Ready, base, sunder, retreat.
spasheridan 04-05-05, 05:16 PM	If I as the pitlord knew you could squeeze then Ceres would have known. He would have moved to.. well, read my post and you'll see. If you count your move and remember no doing diagonal movement around corners, you'll see that 80 feet of movement would get you to (2,1 TL) from your current postion. That's 10 feet away from Ceres.
Sindorin 04-05-05, 06:20 PM	Unfortunately, JotHF is 22 xp short of being 6th level. So I guess he'll get another 5th level fight this week. Eek, and I still haven't found an economical way to counter entangle :rolleyes: ;)
Jindl 04-05-05, 06:33 PM	Eek, and I still haven't found an economical way to counter entangle :rolleyes: ;) Read my pitlord comments to Fineal from this week's fight.
Snommelp 04-05-05, 06:45 PM	Edit: Gotta remember the rounding up part when doing hitpoints from now on :P Forgive me; when I said "always" I meant "always, under the 1/3 rule." HP rounds down, always. Actually, I think HP is the only thing that rounds down, and everything else rounds up.
Sindorin 04-05-05, 06:46 PM	Read my pitlord comments to Fineal from this week's fight. Ah, yes... Potion of Fly: 750 gp. Power Stone of Levitate, psionic: 150 gp. Avoiding Entangle: Priceless. There are some things money can't buy. For everything else, there is the Expanded Psionics Handbook...
Iced 04-06-05, 01:18 AM	Coralias vs Nypholiph(i think that's his name...) is up sorry for delay, comp has virus. (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5856835&postcount=1433)
Caterane 04-06-05, 10:43 AM	If I as the pitlord knew you could squeeze then Ceres would have known. He would have moved to.. well, read my post and you'll see. If you count your move and remember no doing diagonal movement around corners, you'll see that 80 feet of movement would get you to (2,1 TL) from your current postion. That's 10 feet away from Ceres. Ok, let's say Ceres is a mathematical genius and can judge on the spot how much 80ft are around the obstacle and positions himself so that I stop exactly 10ft away ...which he did, btw. The fight continues as you ran it, until I have to withdraw, and that's where I could have squeezed diagonally NE so that I don't incur an AoO, and the -4 AC/attack doesn't matter because I do not get an AoO. No matter where Ceres moves in round 6 - before my ready action - I can base him and sunder on round 7 - which I did - and withdraw on round 8 by squeezing. That is what Indri could and would have done, something that would shift the balance tremendously in my favor because Ceres has neither a bow nor a horse. So it is not as easy as you say "Ceres won, Indri lost, and the fight is okay as it is now".
Huan 04-06-05, 11:00 AM	When dispelling magic, can you choose not to dispel an effect you've cast yourself. Or rather, choose to fail the check? (I think this was answered before, but I cannto find it)
spasheridan 04-06-05, 11:03 AM	Diagonals: When measuring distance, the first diagonal counts as 1 square, the second counts as 2 squares, the third counts as 1, the fourth as 2, and so on. You can’t move diagonally past a corner (even by taking a 5-foot step). You can move diagonally past a creature, even an opponent. You can also move diagonally past other impassable obstacles, such as pits. CAT, this is the 3rd time I've put this quote up, do you read my posts? NO, you cannot avoid the AoO by squeezing around a corner because you cannon move diagonally past a corner.
Jindl 04-06-05, 11:07 AM	When dispelling magic, can you choose not to dispel an effect you've cast yourself. Or rather, choose to fail the check? (I think this was answered before, but I cannto find it) In a targetted dispel, all effects cast by you are automatically dispelled. In an area dispel, you can choose to fail the check on an effect cast by you. Since an area dispel ends at 1 dispelled effect per creature, if you failed the check on your effect, no other effects would be dispelled on that creature. -Jindl
Jindl 04-06-05, 11:13 AM	@Cat + Spa - Don't make me smack you both with the "Be Nice" stick!! :D @Spa - I think what Cat is saying is that he could squeeze through the 5 ft gap inside the central obstacle while withdrawing. That way he doesn't move diagonally past the corner. And since he used the withdraw action, there is no AoO for leaving the first threatened space, and he didn't move out of any other threatened spaces. @Cat - The fight is decided, the discussion should be over. Let's stop beating a dead horse (or phrenic wild elf), okay? As far as how the fight should have ended, if Indri withdrew, all Ceres would have to do is hustle over to (-9, -17) where Indri dropped his bow and wait. Either Indri returns to try and recover his only ranged weapon, or he rides in for melee. Either way Ceres will get a readied attack (and maybe an AoO). Either way Stormrage gets killed, Indri falls prone, and Ceres kills him when initiative resets. So again, can we please end this long running discussion? -Jindl
Huan 04-06-05, 12:52 PM	Bare-Bones of Laph vs Legion (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5877524) is up. Short version: Not pretty at all. :nonono: Why was this last fight so late?... allow me to explain: Last afternoon I was driving as per normal down the highway when all of a sudden my steering randomly failed. I miraculosuly keep the car in my lane but end up ramming the cement median. Spinning and skidding in place after a while, my car was crushed (Airbags deployed ...the whole thing). I managed to bail out of there and get ot safety but there went my day. After the emergency services came they looked at my accident (it was only me, no one else was involved), they said I am seriuosly lucky becuase I should have died in the accident ( :eek: that's .. nice to hear). Anyway I'm fine now, and though I am still a little shaken from the impact, am not disheartened enough to cease my normal activities. (but nothing like near-death to put your life in perspective, eh?)
Jindl 04-06-05, 01:16 PM	@Huan - Glad you are okay, buddy. :eek: A few errors in the fight: [Laph target dispels Legion (knows where Legion is since he never moved. Dispels Vigor (Succeed), Invisibility (Succeed), and Entangle (auto-succeed)). Plants re-entangle Legion, Legion saves 6 vs DC 13, (failed, entangled)] [Legion drops (free action and takes the full defensive)] Laph: HP: 11/11; (-1,5, 10 ft up); Legion: 23/27; (20,0); Stuck/entangled A targetted dispel magic requires that you can see your target. Since Legion is invisible and Laph cannot see invisible, he cannot target Legion with a targetted dispel magic. He could use an area dispel magic, but then he could only potentially dispel the vigor or the invisibility, not both. Plus, the entangle spell would count as a different creature and if it was dispelled (by passing the check), the entire entangle spell area would be dispelled. [Laph rapid fires at Legion, 16, 16 vs AC 24 (miss)] [Legion manifests Dispels Psionics of area of entangle on him (concentration failed)] Laph: HP: 11/11; (-1,5, 10 ft up); Legion: 23/27; (20,0); Stuck/entangled; 9 pp left Given the situation, I think it would be appropriate for Legion to expend his psionic focus to automatically succeed at the concentration check, since escaping the entangle is critically important to his tactics. [Laph rapid fires at Legion, [natural 20, no crit],[fumble] vs AC 20 (hit: 3 dmg)] Laph: HP: 11/11; (-1,5, 10 ft up); Legion: 20/27; (20,0); Stuck/entangled; Synesthete ends in a long time. I guess Legion tapped a tattoo: synesthate, although it wasn't actually stated what he did this round. [Laph rapid fires at Legion, 10,20 vs AC 20 (hit: 2 dmg)] [Legion taps Tattoo of Synesthete, listens for Laph, Lsiten 14 vs DC 11 (distance) (hears vaguely)] Laph: HP: 11/11; (-1,5, 10 ft up); Legion: 18/27; (20,0); Stuck/entangled; 4 pp left Maybe he didn't activate the tattoo: synesthate in Rnd 5. In which case I have no idea what his action was that round? I think the main issues are the improper targetted dispel, which could have saved Legion's invisibility defense, and the failure to expend focus to pass an important concentration check. Correcting these mistakes might not change the outcome, but I thought they were important to note. :D -Jindl
Pittbull 04-06-05, 01:22 PM	Gladfully you are OK! Hey, thanks a lot, that you did the fight. Jindl allready checked the fight and said that the mistakes won't change the outcome. I'm quite busy and of course I believe him. :) Thanks again, now I'm able to set Laph ready for this week.Yipee! Best wishes to you, Huan!! Thanks for your efford!!! :)
Jindl 04-06-05, 01:29 PM	The only reason I don't think correcting the mistakes will change the outcome is because Legion has virtually no method of attacking Laph. Even if he remained invisible and kept vigor, even if he broke free of the entangle, Laph could fire arrows at him all day. And once Laph was running out of arrows, he just invisibly flies down and collects the 50% of arrows that missed and didn't break. Then he continues firing. Eventually, Laph will win the encounter. @Spasheridan - Spending 1 credit for a potion: see invisibility doesn't seem too expensive now, does it? :D
Caterane 04-06-05, 02:12 PM	See invisibility is personal thus no viable option for a potion. At least that's what we agreed upon. @Huan: OMG! Don't do such things!!
spasheridan 04-06-05, 02:32 PM	@Huan & Jindl- Yeah.. that's a wacky fight. But my alternate tactic was to levitate to the ceiling and manifest matter agitation on myself and then stop maintaining levitate. I honeslty had.. oh, a zero % chance of winning. I considered how to deal with invisible folks and decided I didn't need to worry about for his 1st fight... OOPS! Huan, don't worry about making any changes. @HUan: DUDE! Glad yer OK! Be safe!
Megrim_Lord 04-07-05, 03:00 PM	@ Huan: and you survived only to have Nell's head ripped off, how sad. Anyway, good to see you're ok