Post/Author/DateTime	Post
TheMagister 08-16-06, 01:45 PM	Fights of the Week: August 16th (Shamelessly copy/pasted from TelinArtho's Waywreth's DRACAZAR'S template!) Sheets Deadline for editing characters sheets is 21:00 CET. Central European Time (http://wwp.centraleuropeantime.eu/) shows the time. Please don't edit the sheet after the deadline or you will lose the match. Currently, you have about 1 hour. Rules of Gladius All that you need to know is written in the Rules of Gladius. It could be useful also to give a look to the Court Decisions. Please do not make fake accounts or insult the Elders. Pairings GM Caterane will pair the active Characters of Gladius after the deadline. Make sure that your character is not in Prison (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=571107&goto=lastpost). Pitlording You should use the CoCo Dice Roller (http://www.hwx.it/wizards.com) for the fight. If you need, there is a nice Template ready to use that will help. You could find very useful the Battle Map Tag Generator (http://www.hwx.it/coco) for dynamic Maps, You must post a link to your fight in this thread when it is complete. Other useful links are Skills and Feats, Quick Access tables for XP and Gold. Recent News and Developments There have been several additions and modifications to the new Guild rules. Check the Council of Gladius thread for more information! Also being debated are the rules and allowances for diplomacy and Leadership allies, with strong points on both sides of the discussion. Comments & Concerns Post any comments or concerns for this weeks fights in this thread. Be kind and courteous to your fellow posters, don't attack pitlords. Please remember that they do hard work and consume a lot of time to let you play and above all, have FUN! If you have questions or comments on any of the changes, please make your posts be heard in the Council of Gladius!
TelinArtho 08-16-06, 01:48 PM	*ahem* not my template... I stole it without credit from Waywreth... I think.
TheMagister 08-16-06, 01:50 PM	*ahem* not my template... I stole it without credit from Waywreth... I think. Oh. Off to edit!
Zevox 08-16-06, 01:52 PM	Actually, I'm pretty sure Dracazar was the original architect of that template. Could be wrong, but I seem to remember him accidentally posting the first FotW thread with it one day early. Zevox
waywreth 08-16-06, 02:00 PM	Oh. Off to edit! Well I stole it from someone else as well... Dracazar, who was the original creator on April 19th. I just edited the time/clock links. edit - Dangit Zevox! I was busy tracking down when it was created.
Usurpator 08-16-06, 02:07 PM	Hey people, Trying to get Kitaya converted to the 3FC format, which incidentally is a lot of work. Question about the expendables (which Kitaya's build relies heavily upon): Kitaya is currently at 9575/10000 XP, almost 5th lvl. She can have 800 gp. worth of expendables when she starts the cycle. However her next fight goes, she will level and thus spend her last two fights in the 5th lvl league. Can I already buy stuff that I move from 'at home' to the active portion of my equipment after the first fight? Can I do anything to prevent her from 'just balancing on next level'? Because I don't like to fight two out of every three fights without the full allowance of equipment for her level. A scroll of Fly is very useful in the 5th lvl league, and she is allowed to have it in the 5th lvl league, but she is currently not allowed to buy it (the scroll's CL would be to high in the ECL 4 league, and she doesn't have the money allowance for expendables to spend on it).
Zevox 08-16-06, 02:16 PM	Hey people, Trying to get Kitaya converted to the 3FC format, which incidentally is a lot of work. Question about the expendables (which Kitaya's build relies heavily upon): Kitaya is currently at 9575/10000 XP, almost 5th lvl. She can have 800 gp. worth of expendables when she starts the cycle. However her next fight goes, she will level and thus spend her last two fights in the 5th lvl league. Can I already buy stuff that I move from 'at home' to the active portion of my equipment after the first fight? Can I do anything to prevent her from 'just balancing on next level'? Because I don't like to fight two out of every three fights without the full allowance of equipment for her level. Nope. If you level in mid-cycle, you're stuck with whatever items you started with until the cycle ends. Thats the downside to mid-cycle leveling, with the upside having to do with sudden increases in spells/pp/ability uses per day/etc. That was the result of a fairly long discussion way back when the 3FC started, when the original intent was to not allow mid-cycle leveling (aside from the obvious potential xp/gp imbalance that could create for having more fights than necessary at a lower ECL, it became a pain for Cat to keep track of who was on what fight and who should be leveling up, etc, so that got dumped). Zevox
Usurpator 08-16-06, 02:16 PM	Another question: How does the 1/3rd rule work when you level after the first fight? For example: Kitaya: First fight: ECL 4, 9 spell levels total, allowed to use 3 in first fight. Second fight: ECL 5, 15 spell levels total, used 3 in previous fight. How many spell levels is she allowed to use? Half of what she has left (6 in the second fight, 6 in the last fight)? Or one third of the new total (5 second fight, 7 last fight)? Or just the pre-calculated 3 (3 next fight, 9 last fight)?
DSugui 08-16-06, 02:17 PM	Alternatively, you can go on a MQ ouside the cycle just to level up - not the best solution, but in your case I think it's a necessary one.
Usurpator 08-16-06, 02:22 PM	Nope. If you level in mid-cycle, you're stuck with whatever items you started with until the cycle ends. Thats the downside to mid-cycle leveling, with the upside having to do with sudden increases in spells/pp/ability uses per day/etc. That was the result of a fairly long discussion way back when the 3FC started, when the original intent was to not allow mid-cycle leveling (aside from the obvious potential xp/gp imbalance that could create for having more fights than necessary at a lower ECL, it became a pain for Cat to keep track of who was on what fight and who should be leveling up, etc, so that got dumped). Zevox Thanks. But since you are at an obvious disadvantage if you start the 3FC just as you are about to level, what can be done to avoid this? The increases are not an upside to me, they are the default: if you level you get the advantages, right? Or would you have people fight in a higher league because they are virtually of a higher level without having the benefits of a higher level? Currently you are allowed the advantages of you class, but not the advantages of the equipment that you should be able to use at that level. That seems wrong, but I also do not see an easy solution to this problem. Buying new stuff mid-cycle is not a real option. I know what the original intent was, and I was against not allowing mid-cycle levelling, amongst others for the reasons mentioned. I was happy to see that it was changed.
Zevox 08-16-06, 02:22 PM	Another question: How does the 1/3rd rule work when you level after the first fight? For example: Kitaya: First fight: ECL 4, 9 spell levels total, allowed to use 3 in first fight. Second fight: ECL 5, 15 spell levels total, used 3 in previous fight. How many spell levels is she allowed to use? Half of what she has left (6 in the second fight, 6 in the last fight)? Or one third of the new total (5 second fight, 7 last fight)? Or just the pre-calculated 3 (3 next fight, 9 last fight)? One-third of your new total plus whatever was unused in the previous fight if you're on fight 2 (in your example, this is 5 (1/3 of your new total), plus nothing since you used all 3 last fight). In the third fight you can always use all spells/abilities/pp/etc you have left. Zevox
Usurpator 08-16-06, 02:25 PM	Alternatively, you can go on a MQ ouside the cycle just to level up - not the best solution, but in your case I think it's a necessary one. Is that possible? I thought MQ's were included in the cycle? Was that changed? Are you not allowed to Miniquest anymore during a cycle now? Or simply allowed to MQ but not allowed to buy equipment when you are still busy in a cycle? Kitaya wants to become a member of WAR, so she has a reason to go on a MQ apart from just the technical reason.....
Zevox 08-16-06, 02:32 PM	Thanks. But since you are at an obvious disadvantage if you start the 3FC just as you are about to level, what can be done to avoid this? The increases are not an upside to me, they are the default: if you level you get the advantages, right? Or would you have people fight in a higher league because they are virtually of a higher level without having the benefits of a higher level? Currently you are allowed the advantages of you class, but not the advantages of the equipment that you should be able to use at that level. That seems wrong, but I also do not see an easy solution to this problem. Buying new stuff mid-cycle is not a real option. I know what the original intent was, and I was against not allowing mid-cycle levelling, amongst others for the reasons mentioned. I was happy to see that it was changed. Theres no way to avoid it, unfortunately (I've been through this with two of my characters already, and another is going through it now since she leveled up in her first fight - its just something everybody potentially has to deal with). As you said, permitting purchasing items in mid-cycle isn't going to happen. Permitting swapping them with at-home items wouldn't help even if it were possible - after all, the cap isn't just on what you have with you, its on what you own, even if you leave it at home. The advantage to spells primarily comes from the ability to select them in mid-cycle (for instance, my Fighter/Cleric Ceilia went from level 3 to 4 in her second fight, getting a new 1st level Cleric spell. Normally I'd fill that slot with a second Divine Favor, but since I still hadn't cast that I filled it with Entropic Shield instead, and just switched it after her next fight) and the sometimes significant increase in spells/pp you'll have available in your third fight as a result of the level up. Naturally this means nothing to non-casters/manifesters, but theres no real way to change that (I suppose Barbarians hitting ECL 5 in mid-cycle and getting a second rage may see some benefit from it, or Monks with stunning fist leveling up in mid-cycle, but beyond that no non-casters get much from it). Zevox
TelinArtho 08-16-06, 02:33 PM	One-third of your new total plus whatever was unused in the previous fight if you're on fight 2 (in your example, this is 5 (1/3 of your new total), plus nothing since you used all 3 last fight). In the third fight you can always use all spells/abilities/pp/etc you have left. Zevox Hmmm. I don't think that has come up exactly, but I think this is wrong. It might not be clearly explained though in the rules - so I'd have to check. Ana, for instance, just leveled and went from 13 total to 22 total. In her first two fights, she had used 5/5 in the first fight and 1/5 in the 2nd. Using your calculation, in the last fight she'd be able to use 8 (her new total) + 4 (total left from previous) = 12. However, this is the last fight of her cycle, so in theory, she should be able to use the remainder of her spells - meaning that the formula would be recalculated according to the new total. This would give her 8 + (3+7) = 18.
Zevox 08-16-06, 02:34 PM	Is that possible? I thought MQ's were included in the cycle? Was that changed? Are you not allowed to Miniquest anymore during a cycle now? Or simply allowed to MQ but not allowed to buy equipment when you are still busy in a cycle? Kitaya wants to become a member of WAR, so she has a reason to go on a MQ apart from just the technical reason..... Yup. For some reason that little hole got left. In point of fact, if you go on a MQ of an EL lower than your ECL, it can never count as part of a cycle. That of course doesn't apply to Guild-membership MQs, since they have to be at least EL = your ECL, but you can still do those out-of-cycle with the way the rules are written now. Zevox
Zevox 08-16-06, 02:35 PM	Hmmm. I don't think that has come up exactly, but I think this is wrong. It might not be clearly explained though in the rules - so I'd have to check. Ana, for instance, just leveled and went from 13 total to 22 total. In her first two fights, she had used 5/5 in the first fight and 1/5 in the 2nd. Using your calculation, in the last fight she'd be able to use 8 (her new total) + 4 (total left from previous) = 12. However, this is the last fight of her cycle, so in theory, she should be able to use the remainder of her spells - meaning that the formula would be recalculated according to the new total. This would give her 8 + (3+7) = 18. Thats why I mentioned that the formula only applies to the second fight. In the third you can always use all of your remaining abilities. I suppose I may have made an error though - I'll double-check. Edit: Rules don't say anything specific, just that you get your abilities even though you technically haven't rested. A bit of a conundrum then... Zevox
King Uther 08-16-06, 04:18 PM	Round 3 continued: Ephraim jumps on the ground, engaging the guard in the alley. With one swipe of his greatsword he beheads the elf. [Damage: 11] Silis fires a shot at the fleeing warrior, missing. He drops his rapier on the ground for the Prince to defend himself should the time arise. Solan, seeing one of the guards running away, follows him with a charge, hitting him in the back with the lance quite hard. [Damage: 16] Round 4 summary: Featylec fires at the warrior Solan hit and ran by, plugging him in the back. He topples to the ground, scraping his teeth upon the concrete. [Damage: 6] With that, the combined attacks of Featylec and shots from Ephraim and Silis leave the heavy warrior standinf next to Featylec dead, falling of of the roof. Solan chased down the Northbound middle guard, crushing his skull from the inside via lance. Dudael, and an aggressive Prince finished off the female archer on the ground floor. All of the guards were unconscious, some dead, and Prince stands in the center of the street. He looks up and around at everyone. "What now?!?"
TelinArtho 08-16-06, 04:30 PM	Methinks King Uther has forgotten where he is...
DSugui 08-16-06, 04:36 PM	It's the pressure to keep everything on schedule ;)
Pitlords 08-16-06, 05:59 PM	PAIRINGS DONE Credit Changes: +9: Caterane +7: Uther +3: DSugui, Erithmu, Iced, Zevox, Stormwind, Vath +2: ayyiniwindrider, bgt +1: Abyssal, hogarth, MWB, Myrridin, Zelck, NiQil -1: Telin
NiQil 08-16-06, 06:15 PM	So I don't activate any of my Horsemen this week, thinking I should give some time for more PCs to get to ECL 6 so there won't be as many team/hunter/ffa battles there.....and instead I ready the Scalari Brothers. So what happens? One gets a Hunter fight, the other a FFA. This must be Cat getting even with me for the whole staff thing.... :P
TelinArtho 08-16-06, 06:24 PM	All of my characters in arena fights this week are in FFAs too... of course I only have 1 arena fighting character this week... of course, I do have 6 characters active... (3 crafting, 2 on MQs and 1 in the arena fight...). Still the FFA should be a lot of fun: Fighter vs Fighter vs Cleric/Psion...
Caterane 08-16-06, 06:29 PM	@NiQil: Seems like the Pairingsmaker has a bone to pick with you too. Why must you be so mean to everyone :P @Telin: First time such a fight is set up but the ELs are matched. I'm looking forward to it. :cool: I'd like to have tactics as early as possible please. This will be a hell of a fight.
NiQil 08-16-06, 06:33 PM	@ Telin: I think we are going to need a ruling on how you will handle the violtion I just posted on Ghashara (orsono) regarding the studded leather armor. A druid who wears prohibited armor or carries a prohibited shield is unable to cast druid spells or use any of her supernatural or spell-like class abilities while doing so and for 24 hours thereafter. So either the character stays as is and cannot use the above-mentioned stuff, or there is an alteration to the armor worn by the PC. I would like to know ASAP, as this will have a direct bearing on my tactics (and probably the third party in the Hunter fight too).
Traevanon 08-16-06, 07:55 PM	Either the pairingsmaker missed me (new active rebuild of Khabil) or I was supposed to send a PM to Pitlords... not sure which. Either way let me know and we'll work it out.
Traevanon 08-16-06, 08:00 PM	Nevermind, I'm in a team match vs an ECL 5, the name is just spelled wrong. heh Okay, on to tactics.
Pittbull 08-16-06, 08:01 PM	@Rith: Wasn't able to sleep, thus the tactics are quite early. Thanks for running the fight.
NiQil 08-16-06, 08:01 PM	@ TelinArtho: Tactics for Igg in clusterpuck number 1 sent via PM @ Zevox: Tactics for Ook in clusterpuck number 2 sent via PM @ no one in particular: I have the rather strong urge to take the pairingsmaker out and treat it like the fax machine in the movie Office Space.....
TelinArtho 08-16-06, 08:20 PM	Because the player is new and probably didn't notice the violation before pairings (the one I had made), I'm going to treat the armor as leather armor. In other words - treat his AC as one lower.
Erithmu 08-16-06, 08:22 PM	@pittbull: got em, just waiting on Cat. @Niqil: Wouldn't you need more of a Matrix type of thing, or maybe a Tron type of thing. The pairingsmaker is software not hardware.
MindWandererB 08-16-06, 08:56 PM	@Niqil: Wouldn't you need more of a Matrix type of thing, or maybe a Tron type of thing. The pairingsmaker is software not hardware.We're a bunch of people taking the identities of fictitious avatars playing fantasy characters who beat the crap out of each other in a virtual medium. Why is taking a sledgehammer to a piece of software any harder to believe?
Erithmu 08-16-06, 09:06 PM	We're a bunch of people taking the identities of fictitious avatars playing fantasy characters who beat the crap out of each other in a virtual medium. Why is taking a sledgehammer to a piece of software any harder to believe? So I like getting my metaphors correct figuratively. I'm sure the code is stored somewhere in a computer, but there are multiple computers and the code is an indiscriminant program that will live where ever it is wanted. It is not an unloved child, it is cared for.
orsono 08-16-06, 09:13 PM	this is my upcoming fight. and I need a little help :-) Sali Kan (ayyiniwindryder) => Igg (NiQil) => Ghashara (orsono) : TelinArtho [Temple] [Hunter] from what I read. Sali has to defeartIgg IGG has to Defeat Ghashara and Gashara has to defeat Igg? or is it Sali?
Book5 08-16-06, 09:14 PM	@hogarth - tactics sent @pairingmaker.... WHY WHY WHY? What did I do wrong this time? (not even going to presume I didn't do something wrong - but Tans not on the prison roster??? ) .... HA!! I put the 26th.. drat (I was right!) nevermind.. @PitLords - can I get Tan added? I guess there is only the one 5th level fight though...
Book5 08-16-06, 09:56 PM	It is not an unloved child, it is cared for. bratty, uncarring, picky little kid :rolleyes:
Erithmu 08-16-06, 10:01 PM	@Book5: You ok man ... you have made like 15 posts in the span of an hour ... you might wanna switch to decaf, about two cups ago.
Book5 08-16-06, 10:01 PM	this is my upcoming fight. and I need a little help :-) Sali Kan (ayyiniwindryder) => Igg (NiQil) => Ghashara (orsono) : TelinArtho [Temple] [Hunter] from what I read. Sali has to defeartIgg IGG has to Defeat Ghashara and Gashara has to defeat Igg? or is it Sali? Sali
Book5 08-16-06, 10:04 PM	@Book5: You ok man ... you have made like 15 posts in the span of an hour ... you might wanna switch to decaf, about two cups ago. I have nothing else I am paying attention too right now... (normally at I'm at work) and I have been kinda gone.. :embarrass I'll go write some fluff on a guild or something to let eveyone catch back up :D
Zevox 08-16-06, 10:35 PM	Wow - wierd pairings for me this week. My monk gets matched with an archer she beat by the skin of her teeth last level, and its on the same map as last time too. My evil Druid gets paired with a member of TLT (the one Guild she'd like to raze to the ground more than any other) to fight a member of the CEF (the 2nd Guild on that list). And Asran gets to be a pancake between a Great Reknown Kineticist and two Half-Giants who hate each other. And of course this is the 5th week in a row that I've been set to run one of my brother's character's fights, and hes only been here 5 weeks. That pairingsmaker must have a real sense of irony. Anyway, I'll see about getting Annalina's and Indrithia's tactics away tonight. Asran's and Destra's will have to wait until tomorrow - have to converse with lonewolf on one, and be very thorough on the other if I hope to come in anything but last. @ Waywreth, MWB, DSugui, & Cat - Just to note, Asran's sheet was edited about 20 minutes after the deadline this week due to how late his fight got posted. Hope thats not a problem (hes only on his second fight, so he couldn't have had anything changed around anyway, so I imagine it shouldn't be). Zevox
bgt 08-16-06, 11:44 PM	Unfortunatley, do to schedule conflicts, I probably won't be able to run my fights this week. If anyone can take them, I would be very thankful. ECL 3 Reinard Blueriver (DirewolfX) vs. Kervan Sheharath (MindwandererB) ECL 4 Mattes (mattes) vs. Izumi (Macbrea)
MindWandererB 08-16-06, 11:56 PM	Unfortunatley, do to schedule conflicts, I probably won't be able to run my fights this week. If anyone can take them, I would be very thankful. ECL 3 Reinard Blueriver (DirewolfX) vs. Kervan Sheharath (MindwandererB) ECL 4 Mattes (mattes) vs. Izumi (Macbrea)Hm. I was just about to say that I had sent tactics for that one. Well, whoever picks Reinard vs. Kervan up, I'll be able to send you my tactics right away. I can probably take Mattes vs. Izumi. They're both pretty simple characters, and my other fight (Va'ria intercepts Sdentch) is with two characters that are also pretty simple and that I'm familiar with, even though they are ECL 10. On the other hand, I'm a little short in time this week... if no one bites on that one by the time I'm done with Va'ria/Sdentch, I'll nab it. @Zevox and everyone associated with Asran: The only problem is that you missed what Asran used up in the last fight. That appears to be a use of Darkness SLA and a Prot. Good potion.
Zevox 08-16-06, 11:57 PM	@ Zelck - Tactics for Indrithia Celeth (vs Monsieur Hood) have been PMed. Talk about a repeat match - hopefully the result will be a repeat as well ;) . @ Abyssal & bgt - Theres a problem that'll need to be resolved before I can write Annalina's tactics. Luxt'l mispriced his tatoos and is over his expendable cap (that, among other problems, has been posted in the prison). Since its up to each individual pitlord to decide how to deal with that, I'll need to hear what Abyssal is going to do before I can write my tactics. Zevox
McJarvis 08-17-06, 12:45 AM	@Zevox- tactics sent. Enjoy :) I dunno why I put burglary as what I was doing this week. My check is only +7.(lack of tools and money to buy them made me have to do with a lower score...oops)
Zevox 08-17-06, 01:46 AM	@ Abyssal Stalker - Tactics for Annalina Vale (vs Luxt'l) sent. It seems somehow ironic that my Bard is matched up with a rogue/sorcerer... @ NiQil - Tactics recieved, thank you. @ McJarvis - Tactics recieved, thank you. Zevox
Sindorin 08-17-06, 01:56 AM	Tactics for Va'ria sent to MindWandererB!
ayyiniwindryder 08-17-06, 02:04 AM	@Zevox - tactics for Ivan sent @TelinArtho - tactics for Sali sent
King Uther 08-17-06, 02:05 AM	@Gladiators Tactics due by Friday evening, as always. @Sindorin Win by evil.
Abyssal Stalker 08-17-06, 02:38 AM	+1: Abyssal, hogarth, MWB, Myrridin, Zelck, NiQil Shouldn't I get +2? I'm running a fight and a MQ with only 1 active character!
Caterane 08-17-06, 03:33 AM	@Abyssal: Right. Added. @Book5: Sorry, I have no pitlords left. @Zevox: Don't worry about the late edit. But there is the issue with your missing Darkness SLA and Prot.f.Good potion. If you allow me to edit your sheet, I can mark them off. Else send it in the tactic. @Rith: Tactics sent.
DSugui 08-17-06, 08:57 AM	@Myrridin,lonewolf,Cat: Daisy will be taking Bobo the Brute as her free merc.
Erithmu 08-17-06, 09:08 AM	@Pittbull and Cat: Tactics recieved: Questions sent to both, mostly on the basis that I want to take a major pitlord judgment call out of this fight. @my Pitlords: tactics comming today sometime.
Myrridin 08-17-06, 09:48 AM	So this "Intercepts" thing....What's up with this? :)
Stormwind 08-17-06, 09:49 AM	@Gladiators Tactics due by Friday evening, as always. @Sindorin Win by evil. @King Uther: Tactics for Varjo in Hunter fight sent by PM. Evil plans abound ...
Stormwind 08-17-06, 10:10 AM	@Vathelokai: Miniquest for Hassan is up here ... preamble will be added soon is up.
Zevox 08-17-06, 10:26 AM	@Zevox: Don't worry about the late edit. But there is the issue with your missing Darkness SLA and Prot.f.Good potion. If you allow me to edit your sheet, I can mark them off. Else send it in the tactic. I already marked those off when I edited the sheet, though. Right next to his Darkness SLA it says he has 2/3 remaining, and his potions are down from the 4 he had last week to 3 this week. Wheres the problem? Zevox
waywreth 08-17-06, 10:39 AM	@Cat - tactics sent for Gaston: Gaston (waywreth) vs. Asran (Zevox) vs. Sunstroke (MindWandererB) & Dronnar (DSugui) : Caterane [Temple] [All vs All] [Inter-League]
Erithmu 08-17-06, 11:04 AM	@Telin: Tactics away for Shadowsong @KU: Same for Ignatius
TheMagister 08-17-06, 12:04 PM	@ Zelck - Tactics for Indrithia Celeth (vs Monsieur Hood) have been PMed. Talk about a repeat match - hopefully the result will be a repeat as well ;) . Zevox Yeah...fate is fickle. That pairings-spider has a cruel sense of humor. Look for tactics sometime today. I have to think about this one (again). TM
TheMagister 08-17-06, 12:08 PM	Tactics for Va'ria sent to MindWandererB! {grumble} Look for 'em later today. Tonight. ... Next week? Please don't hurt me no more nice lady? ;) TM
Zevox 08-17-06, 12:10 PM	@ Cat - Tactics for Archdevil Asran (vs Gaston vs Sunstroke & Dronnar) have been PMed. Zevox
Sindorin 08-17-06, 12:17 PM	"Tee hee... have fun raiding the CEF!"
TelinArtho 08-17-06, 12:42 PM	Tactics have been received for Sali Kan, Igg and Shadowsong. Still waiting on 1 from each of those two fights and the 2 others from my 3rd fight.
DSugui 08-17-06, 12:48 PM	@Zevox: Tactics for Valek sent by PM @Myrridin: Tactics for Daisy sent by PM So this "Intercepts" thing....What's up with this? :)It's guild stuff. You just run the fight normally, but since Daisy is 2 ECL lower than Karen, she gets a free merc, 2 buffing rounds before the fight and a surprise round in the beggining of the fight. (Although I think this will not be enough... Not in this map anyways.)
hogarth 08-17-06, 12:58 PM	@Book5: tactics received @AbyssalStalker: if you send your tactics by this evening, I can probably try running the fight tonight. If not, it will probably have to wait until Sunday night.
Zevox 08-17-06, 01:07 PM	@ DSugui - Valek's tactics recieved, thank you. @ Telin - Farig's tactics recieved, thank you. @ ayyiniwindryder - Ivan's tactics recieved, thank you. Zevox
MindWandererB 08-17-06, 01:36 PM	I already marked those off when I edited the sheet, though. Right next to his Darkness SLA it says he has 2/3 remaining, and his potions are down from the 4 he had last week to 3 this week. Wheres the problem?Ah, I missed that. The problem was that the 3FC section in your sheet is blank. I didn't think to check the relevant sections within the sheet. @Sindorin: Received. @Cat: DSugui and I are still hammering out some details. We're on the verge of a consensus, though. BTW, I encourage you to work out the RP explanation for this one. It boggles me.
Zevox 08-17-06, 01:49 PM	Ah, I missed that. The problem was that the 3FC section in your sheet is blank. I didn't think to check the relevant sections within the sheet. Yeah, I missed that when I updated his sheet. I had forgotten to add it to his sheet when his quest ended, since that too was a little close to the line, and since Telin didn't use the standard wrap-up for me to just copy & paste I forgot about it in my haste to get Asran ready before Cat started the pairings. I'll be sure to get it in after this fight. @Cat: .... BTW, I encourage you to work out the RP explanation for this one. It boggles me. Agreed. Memembers of the EHTC and PSI, the only two Guilds with technically friendly attitudes, fighting against both each other and a team of another member of PSI alongside the single person he'd most like to gut. I can't decide if that makes more sense or less sense than my other inter-league fight, where Destra is fighting alongside Kitty even though she'd rather commit suicide than fight alongside a member of the TLT (and would rather kill said member than do either of those things). Zevox
MindWandererB 08-17-06, 02:03 PM	Agreed. Memembers of the EHTC and PSI, the only two Guilds with technically friendly attitudes, fighting against both each other and a team of another member of PSI alongside the single person he'd most like to gut. I can't decide if that makes more sense or less sense than my other inter-league fight, where Destra is fighting alongside Kitty even though she'd rather commit suicide than fight alongside a member of the TLT (and would rather kill said member than do either of those things).At least the Kitty/Destra one is only objectionable to one person, and only about one other person (only one attitude out of six). The PSI mess involves three people who would rather be allies but are fighting each other, two people who would rather be enemies but are allied, and a situation that by all rights ought to be just a giant mosh pit with an ECL 7 in the middle and 25 ECLs of opponents beating on him (8 wrong attitudes out of 12).
Macbrea 08-17-06, 02:07 PM	I will have my tactics for Izumi out in a minute MindwanderB. I have a feeling this will come down to wether a scroll kills her or not.
Zevox 08-17-06, 02:12 PM	At least the Kitty/Destra one is only objectionable to one person, and only about one other person (only one attitude out of six). The PSI mess involves three people who would rather be allies but are fighting each other, two people who would rather be enemies but are allied, and a situation that by all rights ought to be just a giant mosh pit with an ECL 7 in the middle and 25 ECLs of opponents beating on him (8 wrong attitudes out of 12). Good point. ...and now you've got me thinking of what it would be like to have Sunstroke caught between those three. Thats a fight I'd like to see :devil: . Zevox
hogarth 08-17-06, 02:17 PM	@Cat: DSugui and I are still hammering out some details. We're on the verge of a consensus, though. BTW, I encourage you to work out the RP explanation for this one. It boggles me. Let's be realistic -- you (the player) signed up your character to fight in a gladiatorial arena, knowing that he/she might have to fight a "friend" or team up with an "enemy" (although in the end no one really dies, so it's fairly abstract). If one of those situations really bothers you (the player), you have several choices: (a) drop that character out of arena fighting to avoid such dilemmas (b) surrender if you have to fight a "friend" (I'm sure the "friend" wouldn't mind, but it goes against the spirit of the arena) (c) attack a member of your own team if you don't like him (which probably violates the arena rules, I imagine) I mean really...if you want to just run a character for roleplaying purposes, you can always restrict him/her to guild missions, (mini-)quests, etc.
Abyssal Stalker 08-17-06, 02:25 PM	@Book5: tactics received @AbyssalStalker: if you send your tactics by this evening, I can probably try running the fight tonight. If not, it will probably have to wait until Sunday night. Sent...
MindWandererB 08-17-06, 03:13 PM	Let's be realistic -- you (the player) signed up your character to fight in a gladiatorial arena, knowing that he/she might have to fight a "friend" or team up with an "enemy" (although in the end no one really dies, so it's fairly abstract). If one of those situations really bothers you (the player), you have several choices: (a) drop that character out of arena fighting to avoid such dilemmas (b) surrender if you have to fight a "friend" (I'm sure the "friend" wouldn't mind, but it goes against the spirit of the arena) (c) attack a member of your own team if you don't like him (which probably violates the arena rules, I imagine) I mean really...if you want to just run a character for roleplaying purposes, you can always restrict him/her to guild missions, (mini-)quests, etc.No reason to be snippy about it. The "arena combat" idea is an artifact of the system; the intention with the CoCo was that these fights are taking place somewhere in the Gladius area. I'm not complaining, but Cat in particular likes to have some verisimilitude; if he can come up with some RP of what's going on, I'd love to see it. @Cat, Sindorin, TheMagister: The Prebuff section on Sdentch's sheet says that Grauerholz, the mercenary, has been hired. However, this is not in the title line, and he's not marked in the mercenary roster as being hired. Magister, if you were under the impression that he was in fact hired, you'll need to get verification from Cat/Pitlords (remember that Cat isn't checking the Pitlords mailbox much anymore). If not, please state so here, so that Sindorin can take that into consideration with his tactics.
Usurpator 08-17-06, 04:47 PM	Lord T, that idea of yours to rig the pairings is pure brilliance! I heard several gladiators are already coming to blows about the match ups. Some are threatening to leave the arena, while others might even turn on their assigned allies. Ticket sales are up, the guilds are off balance, it worked better than I ever imagined. You think they would have learned their lessons last time, when we helped to introduce the new laws that stripped them of much of their power and belongings. A dark figure reclining on stone throne replied with a deep grating voice: The guilds are fools if they think they can take control of Gladius without anyone opposing them. Grand fools.
TheMagister 08-17-06, 06:31 PM	No reason to be snippy about it. The "arena combat" idea is an artifact of the system; the intention with the CoCo was that these fights are taking place somewhere in the Gladius area. I'm not complaining, but Cat in particular likes to have some verisimilitude; if he can come up with some RP of what's going on, I'd love to see it. @Cat, Sindorin, TheMagister: The Prebuff section on Sdentch's sheet says that Grauerholz, the mercenary, has been hired. However, this is not in the title line, and he's not marked in the mercenary roster as being hired. Magister, if you were under the impression that he was in fact hired, you'll need to get verification from Cat/Pitlords (remember that Cat isn't checking the Pitlords mailbox much anymore). If not, please state so here, so that Sindorin can take that into consideration with his tactics. I foolishly neglected to specify which gladiator I wanted to take with Sdentch when she left to vandalize the vandals. I sent him a PM questioning whether or not I could take a gladiator but didn't say which one. I think I was deciding between Grauer and Hauber and had decided to decide later. =) I'll PM Cat and see if an exception can be made that'll allow me to have Grauer. I'll also copy Sindorin so that he can follow the conversation. Thanks for catching that. TM
hogarth 08-17-06, 11:34 PM	Ba'al (Book5) vs. the Undertaker (AbyssalStalker) is up HERE (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=9866833&postcount=858). Let me know if you have any questions or concerns; it's my first time pitlording, so no doubt I've made some mistakes. Constructive criticism is appreciated.
DSugui 08-17-06, 11:57 PM	Ba'al (Book5) vs. the Undertaker (AbyssalStalker) is up HERE (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=9866833&postcount=858). Let me know if you have any questions or concerns; it's my first time pitlording, so no doubt I've made some mistakes. Constructive criticism is appreciated. Since it's your first fight as pitlord, let me give you some tips about this (sometimes hard) job: 1) Use the "Quote" button to copy the character sheets. This will keep the orginial format, which is easier to read. Just remember to remove the [ quote] and [/ quote] tags. 2) Use colors! Identifying the characters actions with their colors makes the fight easier to follow. 3) Put the maps on sblocks. Just to clean up the post in case you have vertically long maps. As for the fight itself, it seems pretty good. Let the players involved comment about that, though. Good job.
Abyssal Stalker 08-18-06, 01:07 AM	Ba'al (Book5) vs. the Undertaker (AbyssalStalker) is up HERE (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=9866833&postcount=858). Let me know if you have any questions or concerns; it's my first time pitlording, so no doubt I've made some mistakes. Constructive criticism is appreciated. It looks pretty good on the whole, but there's a slight error in the end of the fight. Undertaker can't fire the magic missile before Nail has delivered the touch spell, otherwise the shocking grasp gets wasted. Undertaker should first let Nail do the delivering and then act on the base of the outcome. This has no effect on the outcome of the fight, it just changes the order of those two spells. Thanks for running the fight!
hogarth 08-18-06, 07:13 AM	It looks pretty good on the whole, but there's a slight error in the end of the fight. Undertaker can't fire the magic missile before Nail has delivered the touch spell, otherwise the shocking grasp gets wasted. Undertaker should first let Nail do the delivering and then act on the base of the outcome. This has no effect on the outcome of the fight, it just changes the order of those two spells. Thanks for running the fight! I reversed the order of the two spells and I cleaned up the formatting. Let me know if you find any more problems.
Abyssal Stalker 08-18-06, 10:18 AM	Annalina vs Luxt'l is running in round 7. Please check for mistakes (I already know one, Annalina shouldn't spot Luxt'l but on the other hand Larcalmė would've moved there anyway. It's the fault of the incorrect modifier in Luxt'l's sheet.) Please check my ruling on the Obscuring Mist!
Zevox 08-18-06, 11:03 AM	Annalina vs Luxt'l is running in round 7. Please check for mistakes (I already know one, Annalina shouldn't spot Luxt'l but on the other hand Larcalmė would've moved there anyway. It's the fault of the incorrect modifier in Luxt'l's sheet.) Please check my ruling on the Obscuring Mist! Well, looks okay overall, though I can't see the maps (they won't load up for some reason when I click thier links). As for Obscuring Mist, I fear you have that wrong in a way, though you get pretty much the same effect from the correct rule as from yours. Creatures 5' away from each other (which is being adjacent) have concealment, which is sufficient to hide in. However, since he doesn't have hide in plain sight and Annalina has spotted him, he has to break LoS before he can hide anyway, which in this case means getting further into the mist so he has total concealment. However, since the mist is only 20' in radius anyway, Larcalmė will be able to scent him no matter where in it he goes, so a simple "attack" command solves that - Annalina need only follow him and attack where he attacks. Not to mention that the mist only lasts 10 rounds since the scroll is CL 1. With the scorching ray, unless Annalina has cover, it would actually hit (flat-footed touch AC for Annalina is 10), but you'll need to check to see if it hits her or an image. Oh, and it looks like you missed one of Luxt'l's violations (which was addmitably added later than the others when Telin pointed it out to me): his hp is only 19, not 23. Zevox
orsono 08-18-06, 11:19 AM	tactics for Ghashara sent to TelinArtho.
Abyssal Stalker 08-18-06, 11:45 AM	Well, looks okay overall, though I can't see the maps (they won't load up for some reason when I click thier links). As for Obscuring Mist, I fear you have that wrong in a way, though you get pretty much the same effect from the correct rule as from yours. Creatures 5' away from each other (which is being adjacent) have concealment, which is sufficient to hide in. However, since he doesn't have hide in plain sight and Annalina has spotted him, he has to break LoS before he can hide anyway, which in this case means getting further into the mist so he has total concealment. However, since the mist is only 20' in radius anyway, Larcalmė will be able to scent him no matter where in it he goes, so a simple "attack" command solves that - Annalina need only follow him and attack where he attacks. Not to mention that the mist only lasts 10 rounds since the scroll is CL 1. With the scorching ray, unless Annalina has cover, it would actually hit (flat-footed touch AC for Annalina is 10), but you'll need to check to see if it hits her or an image. Oh, and it looks like you missed one of Luxt'l's violations (which was addmitably added later than the others when Telin pointed it out to me): his hp is only 19, not 23. Zevox OK, the fight is done. Fixed those mistakes. Apparently the image-code can't contain a &-sign.
Caterane 08-18-06, 12:18 PM	Asran vs Gaston vs Team Sunstroke/Dronnar is done.
Stormwind 08-18-06, 12:28 PM	@Iced: Tactics for Cyra in Cyra vs Uilo & Loddick sent via PM
Zevox 08-18-06, 12:37 PM	Asran vs Gaston vs Team Sunstroke/Dronnar is done. :OMG! Well, that was... unexpected. I figured that SR would save me one of these days, but I never imagined it would win me an FFA like that! I'll wait and see what the others have to say, but an initial look over seems okay by me. @Zevox: Your 3FC info is missing. I could have let you auto-lose for that. I know, and I apologize. Like I mentioned here before, I had to update in some haste for the past two weeks, so its gotten overlooked in the rush. I'll make sure to add it now. Half-fiend :P Asran Biologically, for now. I'd suggest not saying that to his face unless you want to be the target of some cruel revenge when he makes himself Lord of Hell. :P ;) @ Abyssal - That one looks good to me too. Zevox
Milov 08-18-06, 12:43 PM	Tactics for Ihdald and Genia send to thier respective pitlords.
DSugui 08-18-06, 12:45 PM	Asran vs Gaston vs Team Sunstroke/Dronnar is done. Somehow I have the feeling this is not what MWB and I have planned. The main idea we had is that we shouldn't be close to each other so not to be caught in one Energy whatever. If Sunstroke was going to catch Gaston, Dronnar should have changed to Asran. Other than that, Dronnar has a [Failure] tag, so he would be charged only 400gp for Simaro.
waywreth 08-18-06, 12:47 PM	Asran vs Gaston vs Team Sunstroke/Dronnar is done. No complaints here. That was about what I expected to happen. Gaston managed to kill 2 of his opponents and every ally on the map. Bonus points for not surrendering!
Milov 08-18-06, 01:06 PM	Fixed tactics for Genia sent, since there was a mistake pointed out to me in the first set.
Zevox 08-18-06, 01:19 PM	@ Traevanon - Tactics for Khabil recieved. Still waiting on Geoffrey for that match. @ Milov - Tactics (original and revised) recieved. Zevox
Erithmu 08-18-06, 01:41 PM	@ Iced: Tactics for Loddick sent: If you don't get any from Drac let me know and I'll come up with some.
DirewolfX 08-18-06, 01:44 PM	@bgt: Tactics for Reinard sent via PM. Thanks for running the fight. :)
MindWandererB 08-18-06, 02:14 PM	Somehow I have the feeling this is not what MWB and I have planned. The main idea we had is that we shouldn't be close to each other so not to be caught in one Energy whatever. If Sunstroke was going to catch Gaston, Dronnar should have changed to Asran.This is exactly correct. In Round 4, Sunstroke had the option of going for either of his opponents, and he went for the one with lower designated priority. That should not have happened. Let's see what should have happened: The Round 5 energy missile would have targeted Sunstroke and Asran instead of Sunstroke and Dronnar, which would have left Dronnar alive for the time being. Round 6, he would then have the option of hitting Sunstroke and Asran, or Dronnar and Simaro (probably the latter, since they're threatening him directly). Round 7, he would direct his stone against Asran and Sunstroke, which would kill Sunstroke if he weren't dead already. The upshot of all this is that Asran might have taken a little bit more damage from a grapple, plus possibly some damage from one additional Energy Missile, and Gaston would have taken less damage from the grapple but possibly more damage from Dronnar. Probably not enough to matter, considering Asran's resistances (energy, damage, and spell!). Either way, Dronnar and Sunstroke still lose first, so no need to correct for my part. ------ @TheMagister: I have no tactics for Sdentch. Her M.O. is pretty simple, but it would be really nice if you gave me something to work with. This is one of the first guild battles, so I really don't want there to be any confusion or hard feelings. If I have to improvise Sdentch's tactics, I either give her an advantage (since using her defaults would be technically called for) or a disadvantage (if those tactics aren't very good).
MindWandererB 08-18-06, 02:20 PM	@bgt: Tactics for Reinard sent via PM. Thanks for running the fight. :)bgt said back on page 1 that he won't be able to run the fight. So just hold on to those tactics until someone offers to pick it up.
TelinArtho 08-18-06, 02:24 PM	I believe those fights have been reassigned on the characters thread - since I think I picked one of them up. I'll check to make sure.
Zevox 08-18-06, 02:27 PM	The upshot of all this is that Asran might have taken a little bit more damage from a grapple, plus possibly some damage from one additional Energy Missile, and Gaston would have taken less damage from the grapple but possibly more damage from Dronnar. Probably not enough to matter, considering Asran's resistances (energy, damage, and spell!). Either way, Dronnar and Sunstroke still lose first, so no need to correct for my part. Well, I would like to point out that Sunstroke would have one hell of a time trying grapple Asran when hes flying at 20' altitude and has orders to evade getting grappled by Sunstroke. But yeah, odds are the match wouldn't change even if Sunstroke tried chasing Asran. ... which actually is a mixed good and bad thing for me. On the one side, the win means Asran is definitely out of danger of getting the Failure tag, and it gets him a lot of gold. On the other, it means theres the distinct possibility that he'll level before he gets the chance to do his quest for a leadership cohort, which means he'd have to do a frozen quest for it, which means no gold reward to spend on the cohort. And that Cohort has about 6,000 gp worth of expenditures I've got to cover. And just to get her at the proper level I need to upgrade Asran's cloak of charisma to +3, which is 5,000 gp. Ow. Never thought winning a big FFA could be a bad thing... the irony is thick indeed. Zevox
Erithmu 08-18-06, 02:37 PM	Well, I would like to point out that Sunstroke would have one hell of a time trying grapple Asran when hes flying at 20' altitude and has orders to evade getting grappled by Sunstroke. But yeah, odds are the match wouldn't change even if Sunstroke tried chasing Asran. Zevox I'll poke a hole in this ... The roof is at 20 ft which means Asran is at 15 ft and Sunstroke has 10 ft reach, so he doesn't even have to jump
MindWandererB 08-18-06, 02:37 PM	Well, I would like to point out that Sunstroke would have one hell of a time trying grapple Asran when hes flying at 20' altitude and has orders to evade getting grappled by Sunstroke. But yeah, odds are the match wouldn't change even if Sunstroke tried chasing Asran.Not so hard. 10' cube for space and 10' reach means he could have caught Asran without any more difficulty than if he weren't flying (he threatens a 4x4 6x6 area at that altitude [Edit: Rith's right, Asran is at 15']), except for the option to evade by going over obstacles. But as I said, even if he went straight there and succeeded at the grapple, it would have taken some highly unusual rolls to even have Asran lose to Gaston.
waywreth 08-18-06, 02:44 PM	... which actually is a mixed good and bad thing for me. Ow. Never thought winning a big FFA could be a bad thing... the irony is thick indeed. Zevox Alas - You should've had in your tactics to surrender if you were the 2nd to die. Ah well. It's a fitting and enjoyable final fight for Gaston, who goes into the ranks of the Frozen Gladiators. In other unrelated news... here we go again. On Monday, August 21st, at 7:30 a.m., Wizards will make a database snapshot of the forums and begin applying software and hardware upgrades to this data. We expect to have the upgraded forums ready for your use the morning of Thursday, August 24th.
waywreth 08-18-06, 02:46 PM	... which actually is a mixed good and bad thing for me. Ow. Never thought winning a big FFA could be a bad thing... the irony is thick indeed. Zevox Alas - You should've had in your tactics to surrender if you were the 2nd to die. Ah well. It's a fitting and enjoyable final fight for Gaston, who goes into the ranks of the Frozen Gladiators. No matter, the Iron Man awaits! In other unrelated news... here we go again. On Monday, August 21st, at 7:30 a.m., Wizards will make a database snapshot of the forums and begin applying software and hardware upgrades to this data. We expect to have the upgraded forums ready for your use the morning of Thursday, August 24th.
Zevox 08-18-06, 02:56 PM	Alas - You should've had in your tactics to surrender if you were the 2nd to die. Ah well. It's a fitting and enjoyable final fight for Gaston, who goes into the ranks of the Frozen Gladiators. No, like I said, the win removes Asran from any chance of getting the Failure tag anytime soon, and he has to avoid that if he wants his Leadership Cohort at her max level (little problem with LA not counting towards your leadership score and all). Oh well, I suppose I could always cut down on the cohort's expenses... that'll just make her less effective. Ah, I'll figure something out. In other unrelated news... here we go again. Yup, try #4. So, do we still do pairings that week, since the transfer takes place on a thursday? Zevpx
TelinArtho 08-18-06, 03:02 PM	Ghashara hunts Sali Kan hunts Igg Scalari is up. VERY close match with some big (and small) dice at the end to screw up everything...
ayyiniwindryder 08-18-06, 03:29 PM	@TelinArtho - hunter match looks good to me. I am wondering why Sali didn't cast defensively in round 7 (and I took an AoO because of it), but I'm not sure that it would have made a difference in the long run. Kinda disappointed about those saves too, but not much I can do about that, heh. I hate druids with all of their animals. @Blazinghand & Setzertrancer - still waiting on tactics. You have like 40 mins before the 9pm GMT deadline. Without them, I resort to default tactics. If you don't have any, you auto-forfeit.
MindWandererB 08-18-06, 03:32 PM	@Cat: One more thing on that fight, the rewards seem to be off. Asran has allies, which should increase the rewards for everyone else--they were deducted from his reward, but not added to everyone else's. Gaston, Sunstroke, and Dronnar should get an extra 7.1% rewards. It also looks like the penalty for the mercenary was also incorrectly applied. Dronnar should indeed lose the full 25%, but for Asran and Gaston, It should be applied to one half of one of two opposing teams, so they should get 1/4 of 25% (6.25%), not 1/3 of 25%, as a bonus. And actually, the variable ECLs were not considered, either. Let's see: the reward for an ECL 7 beating an ECL 9 should be 4,200, so the loser reward is 1400, divided by two for two PCs is 700, so that should be the base award for us, not 900. For the other two, there's no issue, since two ECL 7's grant the same amount of XP as one ECL 9.
TelinArtho 08-18-06, 03:38 PM	bgt said back on page 1 that he won't be able to run the fight. So just hold on to those tactics until someone offers to pick it up. Just checked - they apparently haven't been reassigned. I'll take the Kervan fight (since MWB definitely can't take it) - so you and your opponent can send tactics onward. Also - I have received Dracazar's tactics - so I'll be running that fight eventually - probably later tonight or over the weekend. I have NOT received tactics for this fight from either side: Quesis II (Dracazar) vs. Tivik Valcs (mattes) : TelinArtho [Forest]
TelinArtho 08-18-06, 03:44 PM	@TelinArtho - hunter match looks good to me. I am wondering why Sali didn't cast defensively in round 7 (and I took an AoO because of it), but I'm not sure that it would have made a difference in the long run. Kinda disappointed about those saves too, but not much I can do about that, heh. I hate druids with all of their animals. Mostly because casting defensively doesn't guarantee you'll get the spell off, and the chances of the wolf both a) hitting you and b) doing enough damage to make it a worse DC are smaller than you making the check to begin with. The wolf had to hit AC21 with a +5 attack and deal at least 7 damage on a 1d6+4 attack. Yes, you got unlucky in that it hit and did more damage, but that was a small chance to happen (25% on the hit, 50% on the damge = 12.5% of the time - roughly) vs the straight concentration check - which would have been DC17 vs a +9 = 65% chance to make the roll straight away. Just so you know, if you want to guarantee one way or the other - specify it in your tactics. Unless your concentration check is decently high (say +12 or more) or unless you are in a situation where casting defensively makes much more sense (high attack/high damage opponent, multiple opponents, etc), I'll generally pick the one that would make more sense to me. However, this is only when it isn't specified in tactics.
MindWandererB 08-18-06, 03:50 PM	Just checked - they apparently haven't been reassigned. I'll take the Kervan fight (since MWB definitely can't take it) - so you and your opponent can send tactics onward.Done for my part. TheMagister, who is not currently online, has about 15 minutes to get me tactics. A bad start for the guild wars. Fortunately, he has defaults, but against Va'ria, that's unlikely to be enough (this is by no means an evaluation of Va'ria's tactics, which I've barely skimmed). I have also received no confirmation that Grauerholz is in fact hired, so he won't be. <sigh> No, I don't think I can do it. There's too much riding on the fight for me to run it without tactics. I may not be able to get the fight done on time, but I'll eat the credit loss to save my conscience. However, this is a bad precedent, and I'm very upset about it. When the welfare of a guild falls into the hands of one person, that person needs to be responsible enough to be ready. I will wait no later than tonight to start running this fight, if I have time to do so (which is by no means certain). Stormwind, it's your responsibility to write tactics for Sdentch if Magister doesn't. I'll PM Cat directly about the merc. This also means that I won't be able to take over bgt's other fight (Mattes vs. Izumi). If someone else can do this, please speak up. I have tactics for Izumi and can forward them to whoever wants it, but I don't have them for Mattes.
Dracazar 08-18-06, 04:05 PM	Fights of the Week: August 16th (Shamelessly copy/pasted from TelinArtho's Waywreth's DRACAZAR'S template!) Thanks you all for credits :D LEVEL 4 FIGHTS * Quesis II (Dracazar) vs. Tivik Valcs (mattes) : TelinArtho [Forest] Quesis is ECL5, is this an interleague fight? @TelinArtho: Dracazar's and Quesis' tactics sent @Iced: Uilo's tactic sent to Erithmu for preview, I'll send to you as soon as I get his reply
Stormwind 08-18-06, 04:20 PM	Done for my part. TheMagister, who is not currently online, has about 15 minutes to get me tactics. A bad start for the guild wars. Fortunately, he has defaults, but against Va'ria, that's unlikely to be enough (this is by no means an evaluation of Va'ria's tactics, which I've barely skimmed). I have also received no confirmation that Grauerholz is in fact hired, so he won't be. <sigh> No, I don't think I can do it. There's too much riding on the fight for me to run it without tactics. I may not be able to get the fight done on time, but I'll eat the credit loss to save my conscience. However, this is a bad precedent, and I'm very upset about it. When the welfare of a guild falls into the hands of one person, that person needs to be responsible enough to be ready. I will wait no later than tonight to start running this fight, if I have time to do so (which is by no means certain). Stormwind, it's your responsibility to write tactics for Sdentch if Magister doesn't. I'll PM Cat directly about the merc. This also means that I won't be able to take over bgt's other fight (Mattes vs. Izumi). If someone else can do this, please speak up. I have tactics for Izumi and can forward them to whoever wants it, but I don't have them for Mattes. @Mindwanderer: I'm afraid that by my understanding of the rules, if a character has default tactics, the the pitlord has to run with them for the operation. See bolded part of quote. Inactive Characters: Guildmasters need a player's permission to use their character in a CAP. Sometimes, however, it might happen that a character is involuntarily involved in an action (eg target of a Kidnap Character operation) but his player has no time to fight a Battle of Gladius. In this case, the guildmaster or (with the guildmaster's permission) another member of that guild may write tactics for this encounter. The guild system just cannot take such things into consideration; if allowed, it might even become a popular tactic to make your PC immune to operations. Default tactics are a way to make sure your character is always in your hands. I would happily write tactics for Sdentch, but without explicit permission from TheMagister and with existing default tactics, I don't believe that that is an option ... :( Storm
MindWandererB 08-18-06, 04:25 PM	@Mindwanderer: I'm afraid that by my understanding of the rules, if a character has default tactics, the the pitlord has to run with them for the operation. See bolded part of quote. I would happily write tactics for Sdentch, but without explicit permission from TheMagister and with existing default tactics, I don't believe that that is an option ... :(Although you are correct, you will find that Sdentch's default tactics are a bit meager. I think it would be perfectly appropriate for you to put whatever "spin" on them you would like, as long as the general spirit remains the same. However, since Magister is usually pretty responsible, I'm sure I'll get something from him soon, so hopefully it won't be an issue.
lonewolf 08-18-06, 05:00 PM	@Myrridin: Tactics for Karen are away. sorry for the delay.
Myrridin 08-18-06, 05:06 PM	@lonewolf: I was going to say, right up against that 9pm GMT timeline, weren't we? :P I'll more than likely run the fight on Monday, as this weekend is my wife's birthday.
TheMagister 08-18-06, 05:57 PM	Although you are correct, you will find that Sdentch's default tactics are a bit meager. I think it would be perfectly appropriate for you to put whatever "spin" on them you would like, as long as the general spirit remains the same. However, since Magister is usually pretty responsible, I'm sure I'll get something from him soon, so hopefully it won't be an issue. Well, I'm glad you see me as responsible, anyway. =) Tactics sent. Sorry for the lateness (it's 4:00 pm Pacific time for you, right? Or is it 3?). I was waiting to the last minute in hopes of hearing from Sindorin on his decision to allow Grauerholz to accompany Sdentch. TM
MindWandererB 08-18-06, 06:10 PM	It's 3 here. Sindorin's tactics already include Grauerholz, so it should be okay. Starting the battle now.
ayyiniwindryder 08-18-06, 09:26 PM	Der Eisenwolf vs Kultak the Nemesis is up. @UserNamer & Blazinghand - expect Monch vs Nathas sometime Sunday.
NiQil 08-18-06, 09:28 PM	Ghashara hunts Sali Kan hunts Igg Scalari is up. VERY close match with some big (and small) dice at the end to screw up everything... @ Telin...clean fight as far as I can tell...however, you have a mistake in the results. As of round 9, Igg won this fight. Hunter Fights: These work similar to All vs All Fights with the difference that every character has a target assigned. The number of gladiators is either 3 or 4. Rules: In a Hunter Fight, everyone has a target which is determined by the order characters are listed in the Pairings Post: A -> B -> C -> D -> A. You may attack any Character but you will only get rewards for defeatedx targets. Once you have defeated your target, you will immedeately and automatically get your target's target. Rewards are based on Last Man Standing and the number of defeated targets: Last Man Standing gains Winner rewards, plus 1 loser rewards for every target defeated. All others gain Loser rewards, plus 1 loser rewards for every target defeated. Power-Rating Calculation: Base PR of Defeated Target/Character*100 (each individually) minus (if killed) Character/Hunter*100. xDefinition 'defeated': target is dead, unconscious, or helpless with no chance to rejoin on its own. To receive rewards this state must still apply at the end of the fight. If your target gets anyhow revived again during the fight, you get your original target reassigned and no target rewards until it is defeated (again). As per the bolded definition of defeated above, Ghashara was defeated at the end of round 9, and Igg is the winner. The rounds after that are not valid. Edit: Also, you may want to get in the habit of using the post fight results template in the Rules thread also...Cat has previously stated that it is mandatory, though he has not enforced that as of yet...
Traevanon 08-18-06, 10:29 PM	@Username: :bored: Horses can grapple....... I had not even contemplated this level cheese. Well done. Okay so I went and looked at Der Eisenwolf (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=9577944) and his ally seems to be out of order. I'm not very familiar with the ally rules, and he is a new player so I am loathe to report him to Prisonlords however I see these right off the bat: 1) Magnifico is listed as a Heavy Warhorse under equipment, as a Horse under ally, and using most of the stats of the Light Warhorse. Also paid for as a Light Warhorse (150gp +feats). 2) A Light Warhorse has 6 skill points (1 per HD +3 to start), this one seems to have more. 3) It has an initiative of +3 which is inconsistent with its Dex. 4) Its Flat-Footed armorclass is too low (should be 17). 5) He is over the expendables cap by 200gp. Also, some items listed as expendables technically arent. Please fix it when you get the chance.
Zevox 08-18-06, 10:49 PM	It also looks like the penalty for the mercenary was also incorrectly applied. Dronnar should indeed lose the full 25%, but for Asran and Gaston, It should be applied to one half of one of two opposing teams, so they should get 1/4 of 25% (6.25%), not 1/3 of 25%, as a bonus. Eh, why would it only be half of the bonus they'd normally get? Presumably Dronnar having his merc has no effect on Sunstroke, being his teammate, so he has two opponents to split the 25% bonus among - ergo, +12.5% each. Zevpx
Zevox 08-18-06, 10:54 PM	Der Eisenwolf vs Kultak the Nemesis is up. Okay, I know I'm not involved in the fight, but why is the horse getting multiple grapple attempts per round? It has neither a high enough bab for that nor the Monk ability Flurry of Blows, so it gets only 1 attempt per round. Zevox
MindWandererB 08-18-06, 11:08 PM	Eh, why would it only be half of the bonus they'd normally get? Presumably Dronnar having his merc has no effect on Sunstroke, being his teammate, so he has two opponents to split the 25% bonus among - ergo, +12.5% each.Well, the rules say that the % change should be applied to each character individualy. The reward for beating Dronnar goes up by 25%, but Dronnar is only one half of one team, and that team is one half of the total opposition; therefore, the modifier should be 1/4 of 25%.
ayyiniwindryder 08-18-06, 11:27 PM	@Traevanon - I hadn't noticed the discrepancies with the horse, but none of them came into play in the fight. @Zevox - While grappling, you can deal damage to your opponent equivalent to an unarmed strike. Make an opposed grapple check in place of an attack. If you win, you deal nonlethal damage as normal for your unarmed strike (1d3 points for Medium attackers or 1d2 points for Small attackers, plus Strength modifiers). If you want to deal lethal damage, you take a -4 penalty on your grapple check. Exception: Monks deal more damage on an unarmed strike than other characters, and the damage is lethal. However, they can choose to deal their damage as nonlethal damage when grappling without taking the usual -4 penalty for changing lethal damage to nonlethal damage. When initiating a grapple, you use up one of you attacks (like a trip attempt). As I understand, you can make a grapple for each attack you have. The horse's full attack is hoof, hoof, bite - so he gets three grapples. I was assuming that he used the 1d4+3/1d4+3/1d3+1 damage for his attacks as per "unarmed" (natural in this case). I can see your case, and now that you've pointed it out I'm not sure which is correct. It's a case of unarmed vs natural attacks. All of those big "traditional" grapplers (bears, snakes, etc) don't have unarmed damage, and they grapple just fine - so I used natural damage instead. In any case, Kultak never beat the horse to escape (though he may have if the fight were longer). I don't feel that it changes the fight either way, but if it's mechanically incorrect I will fix it.
NiQil 08-18-06, 11:32 PM	@Traevanon - I hadn't noticed the discrepancies with the horse, but none of them came into play in the fight. @Zevox - When initiating a grapple, you use up one of you attacks (like a trip attempt). As I understand, you can make a grapple for each attack you have. The horse's full attack is hoof, hoof, bite - so he gets three grapples. I was assuming that he used the 1d4+3/1d4+3/1d3+1 damage for his attacks as per "unarmed" (natural in this case). I can see your case, and now that you've pointed it out I'm not sure which is correct. It's a case of unarmed vs natural attacks. All of those big "traditional" grapplers (bears, snakes, etc) don't have unarmed damage, and they grapple just fine - so I used natural damage instead. In any case, Kultak never beat the horse to escape (though he may have if the fight were longer). I don't feel that it changes the fight either way, but if it's mechanically incorrect I will fix it. This grapple information is incorrect. Here is the relevant clarification from the Court Decisions: Q: How do natural weapons work in a grapple? A: As per the 3.5 FAQ, under normal circumstances, a creature can attack with only one of its natural weapons while grappling (and it takes a –4 penalty on such attacks; PH 156). A creature that chooses to make grapple checks in place of attacks (that is, to damage its opponent, escape from the grapple, move, pin its opponent, or use its opponent’s weapon) is allowed one grapple check for every attack that its base attack bonus would allow (even if it doesn’t normally make multiple attacks in this manner). A creature with BAB +0 to +5 may make one grapple check in place of an attack, BAB +6 to +10 two, BAB +11 to +15 three, and BAB +16 to +20 four. In short, the only thing that determines the number of grapple checks a combatant can have in a round is their BAB, unless you have the flurry of blows class feature (as a monk), as this is a specifically listed exception to the BAB rule. See the FAQ for further details.
ayyiniwindryder 08-18-06, 11:39 PM	Yar, my fault then. @UserNamer & Setzertrancer - Will fix the problem. Expect a redux from round 6 onward sometime Saturday night.
NiQil 08-18-06, 11:49 PM	Yar, my fault then. @UserNamer & Setzertrancer - Will fix the problem. Expect a redux from round 6 onward sometime Saturday night. No worries...it took us the better part of 6 months to hammer out grapple rules, only to have the FAQ come out and change them all......and then later change them back to the way we had them the first time. They aren't the best laid-out portion of the game....
Traevanon 08-19-06, 12:14 AM	Also, I dont think that an animal using the Pin command would grapple for damage, but then again I'm not very familiar with the Handle Animal rules.
Zevox 08-19-06, 12:37 AM	Also, I dont think that an animal using the Pin command would grapple for damage, but then again I'm not very familiar with the Handle Animal rules. Considering that the "pin" command isn't in the SRD or PHB, thats not surprising (according to our skill rules page, it was taken from a WotC article on the main website homepage). You do appear to be right, however. The pin entry in our skills rules says: Pin (DC 15): The animal attempts to grapple and pin a designated creature. Not a thing in there about grappling for damage. Of course, one could easily argue that using this command to get them to grapple then giving the "attack" command would get them to grapple for damage, but then again it could be argued that this would lead to them attacking with a natural weapon in the grapple or breaking the grapple to do normal attacks. Quite the connundrum. Zevox
King Uther 08-19-06, 01:39 AM	@Gladiators Well, for the one that is actually a fight, I intend to hammer it out tomorrow night, possibly Sunday if need be. For the other, I guess I could post it at any time.
TelinArtho 08-19-06, 09:54 AM	Monster Fight setups have been posted for Quesis II (Dracazar) and Tivic Valcs (mattes) have been posted - good luck to both of you.
TelinArtho 08-19-06, 12:27 PM	Shadowsong vs Dracazar is up.
Dracazar 08-19-06, 01:24 PM	Shadowsong vs Dracazar is up. I'm absolutely disappointed for that fight. In PM I asked to don't waste MM because I was sure he would have shielded! Also I asked very clearly to use shocking grasp (there are 3 of them) and you used zero I ask you to follow the tactic please
Zevox 08-19-06, 03:51 PM	Ook vs Farig vs Genia is up. Two trippers go at it, with the one with the better modifiers winning. Oh, and there was some cleric in there who was totally superfluous :P . Zevox
NiQil 08-19-06, 04:04 PM	Ook vs Farig vs Genia is up. Two trippers go at it, with the one with the better modifiers winning. Oh, and there was some cleric in there who was totally superfluous :P . Zevox I think your rewards are off...shouldn't both Genia and Ook be getting a bonus and Farig a penalty for the mount ally? Not a class ally, afterall....
Zevox 08-19-06, 04:05 PM	I think your rewards are off...shouldn't both Genia and Ook be getting a bonus and Farig a penalty for the mount ally? Not a class ally, afterall.... Farig's forgery free activity negated that. Zevox
NiQil 08-19-06, 04:07 PM	Farig's forgery free activity negated that. Zevox I see that he used Forgery to negate the penalty.....however I don't recall forgery negating the bonus to the other fighters....I'll have to go check that again.
Zevox 08-19-06, 04:11 PM	I see that he used Forgery to negate the penalty.....however I don't recall forgery negating the bonus to the other fighters....I'll have to go check that again. It does both because it reduces the effective CR/ECL of the ally for all purposes. The horse becomes effectively a CR 0 ally, so no adjustments for anyone. Zevox
NiQil 08-19-06, 04:19 PM	It does both because it reduces the effective CR/ECL of the ally for all purposes. The horse becomes effectively a CR 0 ally, so no adjustments for anyone. Zevox Actually, that's not entirely true... The violent past has made it necessary for the Gladius Government to make a law that requires every powerful group to be registered. Since many characters are one-man-armies they are only allowed a certain number of allies (see Rules of Gladius: Allies I). With the Forgery skill, a character can forge the documents and make his allies appear weaker than they actually are. The effect is that he can have more allies than normally. As a Free Activity, a character can treat one of his allies as if that ally would be lower in ECL (or CR if no ECL available). The ECL (or CR) decreases by 'Forgery value divided by 5'. Note that the ally does not really lose a level; he'll just be treated that way. The character can now either bring additional allies in, or suffer less penalties to his rewards. In no way can the character bring in a more powerful ally than his maxCA allows!! Nowhere there does it say that it takes away the bonus the other gladiators receive for that ally being there. It just says that the PC using Forgery takes less penalties for the ally, or allows them to bring more allies. I can certainly see how the impression might be given that it takes away the bonuses as well, but as you can see, nowhere does it say that at all.
Zevox 08-19-06, 04:27 PM	Actually, that's not entirely true... Nowhere there does it say that it takes away the bonus the other gladiators receive for that ally being there. It just says that the PC using Forgery takes less penalties for the ally, or allows them to bring more allies. I can certainly see how the impression might be given that it takes away the bonuses as well, but as you can see, nowhere does it say that at all. Nowhere does it say that it leaves the bonus to the character's enemies either. To me, this is the key passage: As a Free Activity, a character can treat one of his allies as if that ally would be lower in ECL (or CR if no ECL available). The ECL (or CR) decreases by 'Forgery value divided by 5'. Note that the ally does not really lose a level; he'll just be treated that way. That says what the activity does - treats the ally as being of a lower CR/ECL. The rest is just a reiteration of what benefits you gain from that effect for those who don't already know. Unless I hear otherwise from Cat, I'm not going to presume the activity only affects the rewards penalties when the activity description doesn't state such. Zevox
NiQil 08-19-06, 04:45 PM	Nowhere does it say that it leaves the bonus to the character's enemies either. To me, this is the key passage: That says what the activity does - treats the ally as being of a lower CR/ECL. The rest is just a reiteration of what benefits you gain from that effect for those who don't already know. Unless I hear otherwise from Cat, I'm not going to presume the activity only affects the rewards penalties when the activity description doesn't state such. Zevox I'll see if I can get Cat to clear the wording up there, since it is poor....but I would like to point out that the key passage you quoted states that the character treats one of his allies as if it has a lower ECL/CR....doesn't say anything about his opponents treating that ally as if it had a lower ECL/CR. Hence the reason for my question. It is being assumed that the opponents don't receive the bonus because the character doesn't receive the penalty, but your own key passage only talks about the character treating his ally at a lower ECL/CR...never talks about everyone else treating it that way.
Usurpator 08-19-06, 04:50 PM	NiQil, to me it makes sense that ally bonuses and penalties are linked together. Either you have both, or have neither. The line that says penalty is an 'example line'; it described examples of the effect reducing the effective CR of an ally can have. The examples are written from the perspective of ' the character with forgery', obviously talking about rewards of others on this line would be weird. In law, we call this a cumulative summary (some possibe examples), you are interpreting it as a limitative summary (all possible examples).
Sindorin 08-19-06, 05:12 PM	My apologies for not responding quickly to the mercenary dilemma. I am currently out of town away from home, pirating internet off of this town's library. I did reply to Cat's PM to me, but if MWB has already begun the fight as it appears, then I will accept whether or not his pitlording includes the mercenary in Violation. My tactics do indeed account for Grauerholz, but that does not make the manner in which he was 'hired' okay. At first I had no idea there was a problem until I read the rules just now, having never hired a merc before in this game. Oh well, gl to TM.
TheMagister 08-19-06, 05:29 PM	My apologies for not responding quickly to the mercenary dilemma. I am currently out of town away from home, pirating internet off of this town's library. I did reply to Cat's PM to me, but if MWB has already begun the fight as it appears, then I will accept whether or not his pitlording includes the mercenary in Violation. My tactics do indeed account for Grauerholz, but that does not make the manner in which he was 'hired' okay. At first I had no idea there was a problem until I read the rules just now, having never hired a merc before in this game. Oh well, gl to TM. There's no problem. Sdentch's tactics were written with the assumption that Grauer was not present. If he is, then MWB is freelancing him (which is fine by me). If he's not, then that's fine, too. An thanks for the "gl". Sdentch would need AMAZING luck to be effective vs. a caster such as Va'ria who is built around attacking Will saves. TM
Erithmu 08-19-06, 08:22 PM	Shadowsong vs Dracazar is up. @Telin: no major problems here. Minor issue: I make 76gp rather than 96. @Drac: the reason he didn't use any Shocking grasps is that you were never in range to use them. Your Hawk was put into negative hps on the first attack when it failed it's tumble. At that point you could not catch up to me due to my mount's speed. I don't know about the PM regarding MM, so I have no comment there. If you did, you would probably only surrender sooner. But I'll leave that for you and Telin to decide.
Erithmu 08-20-06, 02:13 AM	Harvester vs Morathor is up Rewards in the morning ... time for sleepy.
Pittbull 08-20-06, 10:22 AM	First of all, I don't call for rerun, but I just want to know why you made such adjustments. In round 8: Morathor has been fooled by the image, which he disbelieved, then he sees the real Harvester and his army. Then in round 9: Harvey is first and hits him with his magic missles. But the you decided to shoot back and not to follow my tactic. Following my tactic, Morathor needs to be in clever position. He should have moved back to his initial position and wait for the Harvester to come. A movement like this? http://www.hwx.it/coco/coco.php;v=1;map=sewer;b=Harv,L,11,31;c= Knel,L,11,27;d=Wrai,L,6,31;e=Res,S,14,29 ;f=Mor,L,13,20,21,20;style=s Then later you forced him to move around and the Harvester needed to do nothing but waiting to release his readied MMs? If the Harvester needed to come closer to central chamber, it would have been possible to overrun Knellstriker and Wraith and then get him into a grapple, which was my primary tactic. Next action should have been to get him into the sludge (maybe total-cover, while pinning to the ground + 2d6 acid damage to both, Morathor has 10res). If he doesn't come closer Morathor has to fight his allies first, also with the sludge-grapple tactic. This would have been the way I wanted you to run Morathor. Shooting with the bow, was like commiting suicide. Why do follow Cat's completely and mine not? Again, this is not a request for a rerun, I only want to know, why you didn't follow the tactics. I just want to learn and write better ones next time. Edit: If you command an animal to guard you need to do handle animalchecks vs DC10 (I can't find tools for handle animal on his sheet, without riding+5).
Sindorin 08-20-06, 11:38 AM	The thought just occurred to me as I just got home and am getting ready for work... Do the frozen characters follow the 3FC? I actually hadn't put 3FC info up for Va'ria or Ceres because neither of them have been active, and Va'ria only recently for the guild wars. If she needs it, this week was her first active week for the 3FC and I can just add it in once the fight is posted.
Zevox 08-20-06, 03:23 PM	The thought just occurred to me as I just got home and am getting ready for work... Do the frozen characters follow the 3FC? I actually hadn't put 3FC info up for Va'ria or Ceres because neither of them have been active, and Va'ria only recently for the guild wars. If she needs it, this week was her first active week for the 3FC and I can just add it in once the fight is posted. Cat hasn't said, but considering they can't participate in the arena normally, I doubt they will. Zevox
MindWandererB 08-20-06, 05:42 PM	My apologies for not responding quickly to the mercenary dilemma. I am currently out of town away from home, pirating internet off of this town's library. I did reply to Cat's PM to me, but if MWB has already begun the fight as it appears, then I will accept whether or not his pitlording includes the mercenary in Violation. My tactics do indeed account for Grauerholz, but that does not make the manner in which he was 'hired' okay. At first I had no idea there was a problem until I read the rules just now, having never hired a merc before in this game. There's no problem. Sdentch's tactics were written with the assumption that Grauer was not present. If he is, then MWB is freelancing him (which is fine by me). If he's not, then that's fine, too. An thanks for the "gl". Sdentch would need AMAZING luck to be effective vs. a caster such as Va'ria who is built around attacking Will saves.As luck would have it, I only got to spend a few minutes on the fight on Friday. So when I do get to it (may be today, may be tomorrow), it will be without Gauerholz.
Erithmu 08-20-06, 08:28 PM	@Pittbull: I took the free shot as it seemed like a good idea at the time. Rushing in would have been bad, and with an enlarged harvester (who only has a speed of 10 when he is enlarged, due to the water slowing him down.) I figured that you could take a shot, step away, and then get to a better position by the time he even started to move. In fariness there was no mention of overrun in your tactics (and about the only time I have seen it used was when TM did it in one of the TAO's Multi-quest to get back the school) so it was not even on my radar. I cannot in fairness go back and execute a manuver that is suggested in the FotW thread. If I had gone and grappled Knellstriker and dragged him to the acid I think Harvy would have shot you down before you got out of the hallway. After that I'm not sure you could have gotten through wraith in time to grapple/pin harvy.
Zelck 08-21-06, 12:32 AM	Indrithia vs. Mssr. Hood (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=9889499&postcount=873) is finished. It's better to be lucky than good... Now just lemme hunt down those messed up sblocks tags...
Guildmaster (EHTC) 08-21-06, 01:10 AM	Indrithia vs. Mssr. Hood (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=9889499&postcount=873) is finished. It's better to be lucky than good... Now just lemme hunt down those messed up sblocks tags... Little note: hiding after shooting is a move action, so Hood could never rapid-shoot while hiding (he'd be auto-spotted afterwards if he tried) - it doesn't matter since Indrithia won anyway, but that would negate the psionic shot hit in round 8, unless Hood decided not to hide (which I suspect was his intention looking at his tactics). Also, you forgot to have Indrithia drink a healing potion after that hit (just barely falls into her healing contingency of 12 or less hp, but it would). Doesn't matter both since she won and because the hit should never have happened if Hood wanted to snipe, but its there and worth noting. Otherwise, looks like a clean run. Zevox Edit: Blech, I really need to pay more attention to what account I'm on...
King Uther 08-21-06, 01:13 AM	@Gladiators Both fights will be up tomorrow. A persistent wife keeps making me push back my fights. Grrrrr...
Zelck 08-21-06, 01:22 AM	DSugui: please check your PM about the fight. I think there was something in my tactics that was misunderstood and/or not sufficiently clarified. EDIT: Note, the PM's timestamp should be right after my first Mind Thrust's timestamp.
Zevox 08-21-06, 01:44 AM	Little note: hiding after shooting is a move action, so Hood could never rapid-shoot while hiding (he'd be auto-spotted afterwards if he tried) - it doesn't matter since Indrithia won anyway, but that would negate the psionic shot hit in round 8, unless Hood decided not to hide (which I suspect was his intention looking at his tactics). Actually, upon further review, this was impossible for another reason. Indrithia and Hood started round 1 with line-of-sight. Without Hide in Plain Sight, Hood could not hide without breaking LoS first, which nothing in the plains map does. So he flat out never could've hidden even if he wanted to. Doesn't matter for the fight, but worth noting. Zevox
DSugui 08-21-06, 02:05 AM	@Zelck: Oh, man, now you tell me this? When I start running a fight I do nothing else until I finish... Your tactics are not really clear, tough. If I have 6 HP or less, or run out of xbow bolts, burn everything on 3PP Mind Thrusts and hope he fails the saves. That's why I thought the Mind Thrust should be 1 pp each. Well, I will run the extra damage and see what happens. Just wait a little longer. EDIT: Done. Ihdald Seaslash (Milov) vs. Andurwin Calathos (Zelck) is up HERE and HERE. @Zelck: Next time, be clearer on your tactics. You cost me 2 hours :embarrass . I could be sleeping at this time...
ayyiniwindryder 08-21-06, 02:16 AM	Eisenwolf vs Kultak REDUX is up. Note the change of location - accidentally posted a new message instead of editing. Monch vs Nathas is up. Lots of luck - both good and bad. Kepts me on the edge of my seat.
Zelck 08-21-06, 02:27 AM	@Zelck: Oh, man, now you tell me this? When I start running a fight I do nothing else until I finish... Your tactics are not really clear, tough. That's why I thought the Mind Thrust should be 1 pp each. Well, I will run the extra damage and see what happens. Just wait a little longer. EDIT: Done. Ihdald Seaslash (Milov) vs. Andurwin Calathos (Zelck) is up HERE and HERE. @Zelck: Next time, be clearer on your tactics. You cost me 2 hours :embarrass . I could be sleeping at this time... Sorry dude :(. I seem to have a hard time writing the tactics I come up with down in a PM :(. My thoughts were that I had to outrace the CLW wand, and I put 3PP for the first Mind Blast, so it never occured to me until I saw you roll the Mind Blast roll that they could be anything other than 3PP. I tried to send you a PM, but I guess you didn't see it. Thanks again for running the fight, and I'm very very sorry about the trouble I caused. I have this sinking feeling that this is going to happen again (especially given my blunder last week). I'd be very thankful if my future PLs can check over my tactics and PM me about things that should be clarified.
Zevox 08-21-06, 02:33 AM	Monch vs Nathas is up. Lots of luck - both good and bad. Kepts me on the edge of my seat. Eh, I know I'm not in this fight, but I think you missed something about CDGs. They're auto-crits. So the scythe CDG is 8d4 damage, not 2d4. That means Monch failed his save, since the extra damage will bump the DC to at least 24. Zevox
TheMagister 08-21-06, 03:51 AM	Indrithia vs. Mssr. Hood (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=9889499&postcount=873) is finished. It's better to be lucky than good... Now just lemme hunt down those messed up sblocks tags... The only thing I would take issue with (besides the dice screwing me with all those nat 20s in a row) is the final round. Robbed of his extra hp and having lasted through Indri's force screen (which was the whole point of the total defense strategy in the first place), Hood should step back and rapid shoot (which would trigger Indri's disarm tactic on Indri's next turn). When Indri tries to disarm, she'll succeed (with that damnable natural 20) but Hood'll get a chance to punch her with the acidic gauntlet on the AoO. After that, Hood will 5ft step back and draw the next bow as part of the movement (for free with the +1 BAB) and rapid shoot, starting the disarm tactic loop all over again. Hood should still have a few shots at winning this one. Here's hopin' the gauntlet hits! TM
Pittbull 08-21-06, 04:40 AM	@Pittbull: I took the free shot as it seemed like a good idea at the time. Rushing in would have been bad, and with an enlarged harvester (who only has a speed of 10 when he is enlarged, due to the water slowing him down.) I figured that you could take a shot, step away, and then get to a better position by the time he even started to move. In fariness there was no mention of overrun in your tactics (and about the only time I have seen it used was when TM did it in one of the TAO's Multi-quest to get back the school) so it was not even on my radar. I cannot in fairness go back and execute a manuver that is suggested in the FotW thread. If I had gone and grappled Knellstriker and dragged him to the acid I think Harvy would have shot you down before you got out of the hallway. After that I'm not sure you could have gotten through wraith in time to grapple/pin harvy. BTW, I don't see overrun a special tactic which needs to be mentioned. Having such a high AC, it isn't even very dangerous. But that is not important. Most important is, why did you allow the Harvester to stay there and keep his formation? Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining that I lost, this was obvious right from the beginning. I just wanted to figure out why you shreddered my tactic and did completely follow Cat's. Your adjustment was shooting with 1d20+4 vs AC23, against a character who deals automatic damage of 5d5+5 per round, which is a foolish act of suicide. Please tell me, why is the Cat's character allowed to do this and mine not? Again, this is no request for a rerun, but just a question why you made this decision. P.S.: If anything in this post is inpolite, I apologize, since it isn't intented, it's only my bad english. I'm bearing no grudge, I just don't understand your decision. EDIT: I talked to Cat and everything is clear, sorry for making so much trouble.
NiQil 08-21-06, 07:57 AM	@ Zevox, Usurpator & anyone else that responded to my question on this issue: Here is the PM exchange with Cat on the subject: I have a question about the Forgery rules that came up due to one of my character's fights this week. The violent past has made it necessary for the Gladius Government to make a law that requires every powerful group to be registered. Since many characters are one-man-armies they are only allowed a certain number of allies (see Rules of Gladius: Allies I). With the Forgery skill, a character can forge the documents and make his allies appear weaker than they actually are. The effect is that he can have more allies than normally. As a Free Activity, a character can treat one of his allies as if that ally would be lower in ECL (or CR if no ECL available). The ECL (or CR) decreases by 'Forgery value divided by 5'. Note that the ally does not really lose a level; he'll just be treated that way. The character can now either bring additional allies in, or suffer less penalties to his rewards. In no way can the character bring in a more powerful ally than his maxCA allows!! Most everyone has read the above rules and assumed that because the character with the ally is reducing his penalty, then the character's opponents should not be receiving a bonus for the ally being there. However, by a strict reading of what is written there, it doesn't say anything about the ECL/CR being treated as lower for opponents to not receive the bonus...it just says that it reduced the penalty for the character who is bringing the ally. I would like to get clarification on exactly what is intended here. Are we saying that with the Forgery skill, we can eliminate both the ally penalty to the PC and the ally bonus to the opponents who have had to contend with this ally in the fight (and in my case, lost because it was there)? Or are we saying that we are allowing the PC to negate his penalties, but still providing a bonus to the opponents for having to contend with the ally? It seems unfair to the opponents who have to fight through this ally that they would not get a bonus to their rewards for that ally being there, regardless of whether the PC takes a penalty or not. I would like to see if we can make this a little clearer one way or the other. Doesn't affect the opponent. Just the owner of the ally. In short, only the owner of the ally gets his penalty reduced....the bonus his opponents receive for the ally is still received as normal.
hogarth 08-21-06, 08:31 AM	@ Zevox, Usurpator & anyone else that responded to my question on this issue: Here is the PM exchange with Cat on the subject: In short, only the owner of the ally gets his penalty reduced....the bonus his opponents receive for the ally is still received as normal. Does that mean that everyone who's ever fought against an opponent with forged allies gets a retroactive bonus in gold and xp? (I hope the answer is yes!)
Zevox 08-24-06, 04:11 PM	Valek vs Khabil & Geoffrey is done. Two good sets of tactics, yet the dice were the ones that decided it. Also, I've transfered Mort vs Ivan here and updated the rewards for Ook vs Farig vs Genia. Zevox
DSugui 08-24-06, 05:00 PM	Valek vs Khabil & Geoffrey is done. Two good sets of tactics, yet the dice were the ones that decided it. Oh, well, the gods really hate Valek... Not only my opponents get to start in the same square, but he fails that saves... Thanks for the run, Zevox.
MindWandererB 08-24-06, 05:30 PM	These are the fights that are still outstanding as of this moment. I believe that a couple of them were finished, but need to be transferred to the new boards. LEVEL 3 FIGHTS Reinard Blueriver (DirewolfX) vs. Kervan Sheharath (MindwandererB) : bgt=>TelinArtho [Temple] LEVEL 4 FIGHTS Mattes (mattes) vs. Izumi (Macbrea) : bgt=>Someone [Forest] Quesis II (Dracazar) vs. Unknown Monster : TelinArtho [Forest] [Fight] Tivik Valcs (mattes) vs. Unknown Monster : TelinArtho [Forest] [Fight] LEVEL 6 FIGHTS Varjo (Stormwind) => Neidr Bresent (bgt) => Kimahri Ronso (Dr.Funk) : King Uther [City] [Hunter] LEVEL 8 FIGHTS Ignatius (Erithmu) vs. Kitty (lonewolf) & Destra (Zevox) : King Uther [Cavern] [Inter-League] LEVEL 9 FIGHTS Karen Douglas (Lonewolf) intercepts Little Daisy[7] (DSugui) : Myrridin [Sewer] [Guild] Uilo[7] (Dracazar) & Loddick[6] (Erithmu) intercept Cyra Val (Stormwind) : Iced [Cavern] [Guild]
Zevox 08-24-06, 07:04 PM	King Uther's fights were both finished and posted on the old boards - both were surrenders (Destra & Kitty surrender to Ignatius, Kimahri and Neidr surrender to Varjo). Iced had posted the setup and started on Cyra vs Uilo & Loddick, but it wasn't finished. Myrridin said that with the pairings delay he could have Karen vs Daisy done, so that shouldn't be a problem. The others though, no clue. Zevox
Macbrea 08-24-06, 07:36 PM	Izumi is cursed! She must take two weeks per fight to fight them!
Zevox 08-24-06, 07:59 PM	Izumi is cursed! She must take two weeks per fight to fight them! Meh, what the hell, I've got time this weekend. Send me the tactics and I'll run it. Zevox
NiQil 08-24-06, 08:59 PM	Does that mean that everyone who's ever fought against an opponent with forged allies gets a retroactive bonus in gold and xp? (I hope the answer is yes!) I don't see why not...since this is not a change, but rather a clarification of already existing rules...if you know of a fight that has been affected, I would suggest sending a PM to your pitlord and the other members involved and working it out amongst yourselves.
hogarth 08-24-06, 09:03 PM	I don't see why not...since this is not a change, but rather a clarification of already existing rules...if you know of a fight that has been affected, I would suggest sending a PM to your pitlord and the other members involved and working it out amongst yourselves. In Ceilia vs. Kilpquabjeg both sides were using forgery. So definitely Zevox's character should get an extra 25%. But am I correct in saying that the loser of an ECL3 arena fight can never get more than 300xp (even if the enemy has allies)?
NiQil 08-24-06, 09:06 PM	In Ceilia vs. Kilpquabjeg both sides were using forgery. So definitely Zevox's character should get an extra 25%. But am I correct in saying that the loser of an ECL3 arena fight can never get more than 300xp (even if the enemy has allies)? No...ally bonuses can go beyond the loser limit...the loser limit is there to prevent someone of a lower ECL fighting someone of a higher ECL all the time and gaining skewed rewards.
NiQil 08-24-06, 09:09 PM	@ TelinArtho: Wanted to check and see what the status was on the result change in the Igg/Ghashara/Sali Hunter fight...any word?
TelinArtho 08-24-06, 09:14 PM	I'll be getting everything done. I have been absent because my family was involved in a car accident on Sunday night and since I knew things would be put off until the 30th - it was easy to put this stuff on the back burner until Monday or Tuesday. They will get done - I promise I will review everything when I get the chance and finish the 3 fights I have outstanding. One note - for the 2 monster fights - those players should probably resend their tactics, just to be safe. I know I can access the old boards, but just to be safe... Anyway - just to clear the air - my wife was hurt pretty badly in the accident but my 2 kids and myself are pretty much just emotionally scarred. See you all on Monday if not sooner.
NiQil 08-24-06, 09:19 PM	Take all the time you need....family comes first. My best to those that need it on a speedy recover.
Macbrea 08-24-06, 10:42 PM	Well, I am not sure if matte ever sent tactics to mindwanderb or not. btg said he didn't have time to run any fights this week. Her tactics could be written by my enemy they are so easy: Ok, Izumi's tactics in this one are pretty simple. Start on square by left pathway with Kusari-gama in hand. Manifest Skate(2 minutes) and move along path looking for Matte. Once, Izumi spots/hears Mattes move toward him to get to melee range. Beat well with Kusari-gama until wizard stops moving. Then beat up some more. If wounded get closer. If grappled wrestle with him.
Zevox 08-24-06, 10:45 PM	Very well then, I'll PM Mattes (both here and on the old boards), and if he sends some tactics I'll run it. If not, I guess you get an auto-win. Zevox
Macbrea 08-24-06, 10:53 PM	I have no problem waiting til it gets reset. I was just laughing about the fact she keeps getting paired in such a fashion she takes two weeks.
MindWandererB 08-25-06, 12:09 AM	@Telin: Best of luck to your wife and your family. Car accidents are horrible things. I hope she recovers quickly and fully.
Zevox 08-25-06, 01:59 AM	@ Macbrea - Well, Mattes got me his tactics, so I'll get that run over the weekend. Zevox
Macbrea 08-25-06, 08:28 AM	@Zevox: Thanks. Now, hopefully I can get her to a week of crafting.
Pittbull 08-25-06, 10:32 AM	Anyway - just to clear the air - my wife was hurt pretty badly in the accident but my 2 kids and myself are pretty much just emotionally scarred. See you all on Monday if not sooner. Best wishes to your wife! I hope, she'll get well soon.
Sunwolf 08-25-06, 10:37 AM	Anyway - just to clear the air - my wife was hurt pretty badly in the accident but my 2 kids and myself are pretty much just emotionally scarred. See you all on Monday if not sooner. Take what time you need, Telin. Best wishes for a quick and full recovery for your wife.
lonewolf 08-28-06, 07:19 AM	any information about the Karen Douglas (Lonewolf) intercepts Little Daisy[7] (DSugui) : Myrridin [Sewer] [Guild] fight? Myrridin said sometime last week that he wont make it, but everyone thought that he will have the time until this weeks pairings. Im posting my tactics here just in case someone wants to take it over. Maybe DSgui will do the same. Karen starts in the back corner of her box with her spiked chain of supression and the pearl of Brain lock in her hands. Thranduil will start beside me. Round1: manifest a 3pp Expansion from memory. Round2: manifest specified energy adaption(fire) from memory. Round3: manifest Force Screen from memory and move out. If Bobo comes into sight use the Pearl of Brain Lock and kill Bobo ASAP. Use both Warmind chains as soon as engaging and invest 2pp into the spiked chain. Use Full attacks while he is dazed and Spring attacks if he is not. End the spring attack always 20ft away from Bobo. All attacks against Bobo should be normal attacks. bringing him down is a priority. While fighting Bobo try to gain cover/full cover from Daisy. This has priority over the 20ft distance to Bobo. Thranduils job is to avoid Bobo and grapple Little Daisy. If he is at any time below half hp he will withdraw from the battle. He will always stay far enough away from Karen to avoid beeing hit by a flamestrike aimed at Karen.(unless both of them are grappling Daisy :D) Once Bobo is down engage Daisy. If she is avoiding me use the corners and my reach to force her to get to me. If this doesnt work drink potion of invisibility and grapple her to death. If Expansion gets dispelled refresh it with a stone. Ignore it if other buffs are dispelled. AoO against summons will always be touch attacks to trip. Note that every hit (touch attack or not) forces a dispel check with 1d20+11 against all effects on the creature/ may dispel the summoned creature. If Bobo is down, I know that Daisy has used her dispel and Karen is below half hitpoints: draw and use Stone of Vigor[ML4]. Also refresh Specified energy adaption(fire) from stone if it has been dispelled in this case. That should be all. greets lonewolf
Zevox 08-28-06, 12:32 PM	any information about the Karen Douglas (Lonewolf) intercepts Little Daisy[7] (DSugui) : Myrridin [Sewer] [Guild] fight? Myrridin said he'd have time to run it after he found out pairings had been delayed for a week, but we haven't heard from him since. Zevox
TelinArtho 08-28-06, 12:47 PM	@ Telin...clean fight as far as I can tell...however, you have a mistake in the results. As of round 9, Igg won this fight. As per the bolded definition of defeated above, Ghashara was defeated at the end of round 9, and Igg is the winner. The rounds after that are not valid. Edit: Also, you may want to get in the habit of using the post fight results template in the Rules thread also...Cat has previously stated that it is mandatory, though he has not enforced that as of yet... I've altered the fight results to reflect the above and have sent a pm to all affected parties (not ayyin... because his name is annoying ( :) )and his rewards don't change...) and to pitlords.
TelinArtho 08-28-06, 12:48 PM	Okay - I'll be working on my remaining fights as I get the chance. The Kervan vs Reinard fight will probably first since I did receive their tactics first.
TelinArtho 08-28-06, 01:52 PM	Kervan Sheherath vs Reinard Blueriver is up. Short and effective. Not all positions and status lines are listed, but if there's problems, I can edit them in once I am done with my other two remaining fights.
Zevox 08-28-06, 02:07 PM	Izumi vs Mattes Gearos is done. Good luck on one side and bad luck on the other decided it. Zevox
Macbrea 08-28-06, 02:35 PM	By the way. The answer to your question was she is suffering from the three week cycle determines what she may own. She has finished with enough materials to make her weapon now.
TelinArtho 08-28-06, 05:06 PM	Quesis vs 4 Derro Marauders is up. Nasty fight. There is a big error I'll need to fix, but I want to get going on the other monster fight first, since it is unlikely to change the outcome - just prolong it...
Dracazar 08-28-06, 05:29 PM	Quesis vs 4 Derro Marauders is up. Nasty fight. There is a big error I'll need to fix, but I want to get going on the other monster fight first, since it is unlikely to change the outcome - just prolong it... There is one BIG issue I asked very clearly to use ranged attacks from canopy, I have all the time to climb up on the tree even if there is LoS with the Derro. I would appreciate very much if you could change the fight following the tactic from the canopy. Please also I hope you can roll the concealment. Also use Rage if you need some HP.
TheMagister 08-28-06, 05:50 PM	@anybody with psionic items experience: cc: Zelck, possibly I don't have my books on me ATM (I'm at work), the SRD is blocked by my company's firewall, and I would like clarification on a subject. On a failed manifester level check (activating a powerstone with a higher manifester level than you currently have), is the power wasted or was is just never manifested from the stone? Is there a rule that specifically deals with natural 1s on this roll and whether or not the power is wasted? Thanks, TM
Dracazar 08-28-06, 06:03 PM	There is one BIG issue I asked very clearly to use ranged attacks from canopy, I have all the time to climb up on the tree even if there is LoS with the Derro. I would appreciate very much if you could change the fight following the tactic from the canopy. Please also I hope you can roll the concealment. Also use Rage if you need some HP. From canopy Derros could not sneak attack due to the distance and also Quesis will have always cover
TelinArtho 08-28-06, 06:04 PM	@TM - like scrolls, you have a potential of a mishap (Wisdom check DC5 on a failed ML check). If a mishap occurs (which I don't know if that has ever happened...), then just look at what is on the scrolls section if you can.
Zelck 08-28-06, 06:09 PM	@anybody with psionic items experience: cc: Zelck, possibly I don't have my books on me ATM (I'm at work), the SRD is blocked by my company's firewall, and I would like clarification on a subject. On a failed manifester level check (activating a powerstone with a higher manifester level than you currently have), is the power wasted or was is just never manifested from the stone? Is there a rule that specifically deals with natural 1s on this roll and whether or not the power is wasted? Thanks, TM Hmm... nope, it's not used up. Hum. Edits, here we come... @Zevox: I'll also edit in the healing contingency. Note that you still get hit because you've already spotted Hood at that time and both arrows would have hit. You deflected the first, but couldn't do anything about the second.
Zelck 08-28-06, 07:13 PM	The edit (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=9889499&postcount=873) is complete. Both players should take a look at it as stuff has changed.
MindWandererB 08-28-06, 08:42 PM	@TM - like scrolls, you have a potential of a mishap (Wisdom check DC5 on a failed ML check). If a mishap occurs (which I don't know if that has ever happened...), then just look at what is on the scrolls section if you can. Actually, power stone mishaps (brainburn) are different from scroll mishaps.
Erithmu 08-28-06, 11:05 PM	Anyone able to pick up Cyra vs Loddick + Uilo ... It is a guild fight and will mess things up if it gets held over. I haven't seen Iced repost the old tactics but they are here (http://boardsold.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=9904568&postcount=881) if someone could maybe pick it up ...
TelinArtho 08-29-06, 12:01 PM	Tivik Valcs vs the Darkmantle Squad of Death is up. Surprising ending due to some horribly lopsided rolls.
TelinArtho 08-29-06, 12:12 PM	There is one BIG issue I asked very clearly to use ranged attacks from canopy, I have all the time to climb up on the tree even if there is LoS with the Derro. I would appreciate very much if you could change the fight following the tactic from the canopy. Please also I hope you can roll the concealment. Also use Rage if you need some HP. Well, like I said - you would have had concealment from your current position as well. However, I am loathe to edit it in - and here's why. Your tactics state to stay in the trees while you eliminate your opponent's mount (which they have none). They also say to come down if you fear the 10-round penalty - which you did. Before getting to the 2nd tree, you were confronted by your opponent. By having you climb now is not in your tactics. While I agree you would have help by being up there - you specify nothing about returning to the trees at all cost if you are attacked from the ground. I will add in the rage when you reach 10hp as you have specified that and I missed it. Your other comment about them not being able to sneak attack would be incorrect (though only because of your reasoning - please read). Standing directly beneath you or within one 5ft step of that would be within 30ft and cover does not negate sneak attacks. Concealment, which you have on the ground I might add, does negate sneak attacks (which is something I did miss). When I go back to edit things, I will remove the sneak attack damage.
Zevox 08-29-06, 12:44 PM	@ Telin - Since the canopy grants both cover and concealment against those outside of it, being in it would negate sneak attacks from those outside of it. Zevox
TelinArtho 08-29-06, 01:07 PM	Edit for the Quesis fight is done. @Zevox - while I agree, I was merely pointing out that he did not need to be in the canopy to remove the sneak attack damage - merely being in the underbrush grants that. Since returning to the canopy after being attacked was not in his tactics, making that change is a big improvisation (especially when you consider that while climbing he does not benefit from concealment nor his dex bonus). I was very kind to Quesis in this alteration. Instead of continuing with the hide and snipe tactics they were already using, they just straight out attacked. If I had continued, not only would the attack on Derro 1 have missed (because of cover), Quesis still would have expired due to lack of HP when rage ran out. Add to that that some of the misses on the part of shooting at an aware opponent would have hit his AC minus dex - and that would've been a lot quicker.
TelinArtho 08-29-06, 04:26 PM	Anyone able to pick up Cyra vs Loddick + Uilo ... It is a guild fight and will mess things up if it gets held over. I haven't seen Iced repost the old tactics but they are here (http://boardsold.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=9904568&postcount=881) if someone could maybe pick it up ... I'll try to pick it up, but I likely won't start on it until tomorrow morning - so it will be near to the deadline if I get to it. If someone has the time between now and the time you notice a relevant roll log in the CoCo roller, please post and take it.
Stormwind 08-29-06, 04:33 PM	Thanks Telin ... if you have the time to get it done, it will be appreciated.
TelinArtho 08-29-06, 04:38 PM	I'm actually going to start on it now. Since it is in the cavern - it won't likely be a 100 round search followed by a 70 round melee... not that I don't think it will end up that way... :)
Dracazar 08-29-06, 06:18 PM	Edit for the Quesis fight is done. @Zevox - while I agree, I was merely pointing out that he did not need to be in the canopy to remove the sneak attack damage - merely being in the underbrush grants that. Since returning to the canopy after being attacked was not in his tactics, making that change is a big improvisation (especially when you consider that while climbing he does not benefit from concealment nor his dex bonus). I was very kind to Quesis in this alteration. Instead of continuing with the hide and snipe tactics they were already using, they just straight out attacked. If I had continued, not only would the attack on Derro 1 have missed (because of cover), Quesis still would have expired due to lack of HP when rage ran out. Add to that that some of the misses on the part of shooting at an aware opponent would have hit his AC minus dex - and that would've been a lot quicker. Climb up to the canopy and use bow (force screen up on LoS) ...range attacks from canopy... Climb that tree (it should take about 3 rounds), the tree is 30' high and the canopy is at 30' height If I'm too passive (10 rounds limit) then climb down, move on another tree near pathway Climb up this new tree and try to ambush from here, change again if needed Before getting to the 2nd tree, you were confronted by your opponent. By having you climb now is not in your tactics. While I agree you would have help by being up there - you specify nothing about returning to the trees at all cost if you are attacked from the ground As you can read by the tactic's quote it is VERY clear I want to stay upon the canopy It is a very marginal your remark that I didn't specified the IF condition about ground attacks Nobody could specify every contingency in the tactic, I think mine was clear However I accept your improvisation, thank you. Reading the Derro sheet I noticed that his speed is 20' Quesis speed is 40' with also Run and Fleet or Foot feat and 20' reach Are you sure that they could easily evade melee? (I'm only asking) I think that even with Hide they would be hit on first unsuccessfull hide check If the Force Screen fades, I buff with another one, do it only if I'm not in melee Please may you add another force screen as soon as the first fades out? At round 25, derro 2 attack will not hit for 2 hp At round 28, derro 2 attack will not hit for 6 hp At round 29, derro 2 attack will not hit for 4 hp On round 30 Quesis will not rage At round 32, derro 4 crit will not be confirmed At round 35, derro 4 attack will not hit for 1 hp At round 36, derro 4 attack will not hit for 5 hp At round 33 quesis could attack a closer derro (without -4 penalty) and it would be an hit Please, that of the Force Screen is major issue that would change the fight, thank you.
Dracazar 08-29-06, 06:26 PM	About this section of FotW 1st post template: Rules of Gladius All that you need to know is written in the Rules of Gladius. It could be useful also to give a look to the Court Decisions. Please do not make fake accounts or insult the Elders. I noticed that it should be changed to: Rules of Gladius All that you need to know is written in the Rules of Gladius. It could be useful also to give a look to the Court Decisions part 1 and part 2. Please do not make fake accounts or insult the Elders.
TelinArtho 08-29-06, 06:27 PM	I completely missed the rebuffing Force Screen - and the sad thing is I specifically checked for it :( Sorry about that - it will definitely be added back in. As to them being able to avoid melee - you only have the 20' reach when enlarged. On this map - there are few locations for a large creature to move without being in a hampered terrain at a minimum - which means you would be forced to move at 20, and would not be able to charge or run. They can only move 20 - but their ability to hide from you anytime they break LOS makes it easy for them to evade (since you would chase one - he would hide and while you search you get plugged by the other three. On the forest map - large creatures would really suffer. If you tried to engage in melee without enlarging - you'd have a better chance - but that is again - specifically not part of your tactics (you specify you want to expand before getting into melee). As to returning up the tree - bear in mind that while you wanted to ambush from the tree - it was specifically to take out the mount of your opponent - otherwise you were content to engage in melee. I will modify the fight when I get done with the guild fight to add in the 2nd force screen.
Dracazar 08-29-06, 06:52 PM	TelinArtho Thanks. Mates, I would like to suggest you all this: With new board I have screen used at 50%, go here: My Account -> Edit My Profile Information -> Edit Options -> Use a variable width screen It a lot better!
Iced 08-29-06, 10:31 PM	if anyone wants to run the guild fight it's set up and if i get to it tonight it'll be late... School starts tomorrow and AP english HW is killing me. First day off from work in 4.5 weeks and i'm stuck writing essays for school...:P ~Iced
Erithmu 08-29-06, 11:27 PM	@Telin: Killing me ... you get all the way to where the fight could be decided by the next roll, and you leave it. Its like a movie ending only to find out that you have to wait to find out the conclusion. Ugga .... Oh well I did my job ... Rush ....
TelinArtho 08-30-06, 10:40 AM	Yeah - well I had already pushed myself to be a half-hour late... anyway - I'll be finishing it up this morning. Give me an hour or two.
Erithmu 08-30-06, 11:02 AM	It's fine, was in a joking manner anyways ... I just know I have to update Loddick pretty quick for his 2nd intercept in a row.
Stormwind 08-30-06, 12:06 PM	It's fine, was in a joking manner anyways ... I just know I have to update Loddick pretty quick for his 2nd intercept in a row. @Erithmu: Just a note, If a character fails an intercept, then the original operator can choose to abort the operation and instead imprison the interceptor. (It won't happen in this case because Cyra will continue with the operation if she wins). However it could easily happen, for example if one guild decides to do operations several weeks in a row, then imprisoning members of the other guild could be a good thing, and putting the same character down for interceptions two weeks in a row could be quite risky.
DSugui 08-30-06, 12:09 PM	What about Daisy? With no sign of her fight with Karen being finished before deadline, will she be able to intercept Asran this week?
Caterane 08-30-06, 12:11 PM	It's very unfortunate that the two most important fights are missing, especially since there was 2 weeks time to run them. We do it that way. The fight is extended but the participants can intercept normally (which actually happened in this week's CAP Reactions). You take teh sheet as it is now and you have full access as if it would be a fight from last week. When both fights are done (the late one and the one this week) we count spell levels and expendables and remove them normally. If a spell has been used in both fights, the player picks another one of equal level (or a SL combination if not available). Expendables used in both fights will be only removed once and the second one will be deducted from the rewards. It's a bit awkward but the only way to get the CAP Reaction in this week. I hope it's clear that guild battles are of top priority for pitlords. I put two [G] behind those affected.
Erithmu 08-30-06, 12:15 PM	PSI/TLT guild fight should be up before the deadline. Telin is working out the end game right now. Loddick has already fallen so it is a little easier.
TelinArtho 08-30-06, 12:19 PM	Actually, it might already be done because of a bit of a question I've been unable to find the answer to. Can an animal be handled or pushed to attack an opponent it cannot detect by any means? (As in - the target has Hide from Animals but the master knows the location of the target). If yes, then Cyra would very likely have already fallen. If no - then I'm just going as it is...
Erithmu 08-30-06, 12:23 PM	I would probably just give it the normal invisible miss chance, but that's sort of a ... rule 0 thing. If Uilo Got Faerie fire off, then I would say definately give the miss chance. the line is slightly fuzzy however
Caterane 08-30-06, 12:32 PM	Awesome! All hail Telin!
Dracazar 08-30-06, 12:32 PM	@TelinArtho I don't know the exact fight but reading the dice sessions I would tell this (just to prevent further issues): As for tactic: Uilo would use Scent (from two animals) and Tremorsense (from Xorn) to detect Cyra, you can read also this: If the creature is a Rhinoceros (without scent), toss another one and also If the creature from the Bag of Tricks dies, then Uilo tosses another one as soon as possible EDIT: About Quesis, it is obvious to give priority to guild fight, but if Quesis fight could not be edited before deadline I would like to keep it also for next week so TelinArtho could edit it with cam
Erithmu 08-30-06, 12:35 PM	Drac: please leave the rhino out .... pretty please ... (Cyra has Hide from animals up anyway, pretty sure about it)
TelinArtho 08-30-06, 12:41 PM	Okay - the fight is up without rewards - I'm working on them now. @all involved: I had to make some game time decisions here since Cyra didn't expect to be so "Obvious" and Uilo didn't expect Cyra to be so "Obvious." Keeping the rhino seemed a reasonable adjustment since Faerie fire was there. As to the part about hide from animals, given time constraints I could alter it - but it would definitely go past the deadline. In other words - give me a darn good reason :) I'm hoping to write up a story with it, but if someone else would like a crack at it, please let me know (as I am quite busy - but I feel this kind of fight should have a story).
MindWandererB 08-30-06, 12:50 PM	Okay - the fight is up without rewards - I'm working on them now.I personally am not of the opinion that Hide from Animals defeats Faerie Fire--isn't that kind of the point? That would have shortened the fight tremendously, and saved several expendables and whatnot.
Dracazar 08-30-06, 12:52 PM	Just to clarify, I agree with you, with Faerie Fire there is no need to change the creature TelinArtho I know I'm asking a lot but please may you tell me if Quesis changes will go after the deadline? If so I'll ask Cat to keep the fight for another week, if you will able to edit it before deadline (thanks very much) I'll give a try to edit the sheet for next 3 weeks cycles
DSugui 08-30-06, 12:58 PM	You take teh sheet as it is now and you have full access as if it would be a fight from last week. When both fights are done (the late one and the one this week) we count spell levels and expendables and remove them normally.Does this mean I can't change my spell list, even if last week it was my third fight and this week would be the first? My spell selection can be a very important factor for this fight.
Stormwind 08-30-06, 01:01 PM	@Telin: The fight looks fine to me. Thanks very much for taking it at the last minute. Actually, it might already be done because of a bit of a question I've been unable to find the answer to. Can an animal be handled or pushed to attack an opponent it cannot detect by any means? (As in - the target has Hide from Animals but the master knows the location of the target). If yes, then Cyra would very likely have already fallen. If no - then I'm just going as it is... I would rule that the animal can only attack "something in that square" if it has the attack trick and is then pushed to attack. I would base this on the fact that you need to teach an animal individual attack tricks to enable it to attack aberrations and other 'strange' things. I would classify a creature it cannot detect and outlined in faerie fire as a 'strange' thing. Then if it is successfully pushed, then it makes an attack as if it's opponent were invisible (can only see outline, not actual creature) Just my opinion. Storm Edit: @Telin: Could you include Cyra's free activity? It is on the top of her character sheet, but there simply wasn't space to add it to her title line...
TelinArtho 08-30-06, 01:02 PM	Just to clarify, I agree with you, with Faerie Fire there is no need to change the creature TelinArtho I know I'm asking a lot but please may you tell me if Quesis changes will go after the deadline? If so I'll ask Cat to keep the fight for another week, if you will able to edit it before deadline (thanks very much) I'll give a try to edit the sheet for next 3 weeks cycles I'm working on it now - no need to keep it extended for next week, but it might mean you aren't paired unless you are quick to edit your sheet. Working...
Erithmu 08-30-06, 01:06 PM	@Telin: Thanks very much for the last minute run, I think Storm, Drac and I all owe you one. And I never noticed that energy stun was short range for some reason ... go figure.
MindWandererB 08-30-06, 01:25 PM	@Telin: Thanks very much for the last minute run, I think Storm, Drac and I all owe you one. And I never noticed that energy stun was short range for some reason ... go figure. And I owe you one, as well. If this had gotten delayed, and Cyra won, then the combination of her thievery and Asran's assault all in the same week could have bankrupted TLT and caused major problems in maintaining upkeep. @Cat: I agree that your solution works only on fights 1 and 2 of a sequence. On Fight 3, we need a different plan. I think the player should be allowed to PM their "reset" information (new purchases, spells prepared, etc.) to all involved parties, and run the fight using that information.
TelinArtho 08-30-06, 01:58 PM	Edit of the Quesis fight is up and done with. Most of the rolls have just been reassigned without changing them in the roller itself. Not the best form - but I was aiming for speed. If I get the time (which isn't likely), I'll try to reassign the rolls to the new owners (in terms of rounds and characters). The fight result did not change.
TelinArtho 08-30-06, 02:01 PM	@Stormwind - best to include that tidbit in your tactics next time - but yes, I'll edit the profession income in. Well, since Husk had the improved attack trick and the rhino can be controlled as if it had any trick in the handle animal description - I guess that means the fight would've been done MUCH faster. Unless you guys want a holdover for me to adjust the expendables though, I don't think I'll have the time to edit it. Hmmm... 2pm - time to go get lunch...
Stormwind 08-30-06, 02:05 PM	@Stormwind - best to include that tidbit in your tactics next time - but yes, I'll edit the profession income in. Well, since Husk had the improved attack trick and the rhino can be controlled as if it had any trick in the handle animal description - I guess that means the fight would've been done MUCH faster. Unless you guys want a holdover for me to adjust the expendables though, I don't think I'll have the time to edit it. Hmmm... 2pm - time to go get lunch... Nah ... don't worry about it ... I'm fine with the fight as is ... besides, it makes for a better story this way ;)
Dracazar 08-30-06, 03:41 PM	Edit of the Quesis fight is up and done with. Most of the rolls have just been reassigned without changing them in the roller itself. Not the best form - but I was aiming for speed. If I get the time (which isn't likely), I'll try to reassign the rolls to the new owners (in terms of rounds and characters). The fight result did not change. at round 31 Quesis has 16 hp at round 32 she has 11 hp but the damage was only 1+2=3, quesis should have 3 hp more and rage some round after at round 36 Derro 2 has no +4 bonus to AC (he is not the Derro prone, it was Derro 1) the hit should do damage at round 40 again Derro 2 has no +4 bonus to AC, the hit should do damage Quesis should rage (with some Int) about 7-8 HP because Derro average damage is 3.5*2=7 Please may you confirm this? Thank you a lot for this and for guild fight!
TelinArtho 08-30-06, 03:55 PM	at round 31 Quesis has 16 hp at round 32 she has 11 hp but the damage was only 1+2=3, quesis should have 3 hp more and rage some round after at round 36 Derro 2 has no +4 bonus to AC (he is not the Derro prone, it was Derro 1) the hit should do damage at round 40 again Derro 2 has no +4 bonus to AC, the hit should do damage Quesis should rage (with some Int) about 7-8 HP because Derro average damage is 3.5*2=7 Please may you confirm this? Thank you a lot for this and for guild fight! I'll have to look at round 32. For Derros 2 and 4, they both set themselves up with cover versus you - so that's where the +4 to AC comes in. As to when to rage, you didn't give me a threshhold. I think I used 10hp as the threshhold because it was the only hp value in your tactics (granted, I misread it as "Rage when I am at 10hp" not "Also use Rage if low on HP, it will give 10 HP" - but if you wanted to rage at a specific point, you need to be specific about it. If you are not specific about it - that's pitlords' discretion. EDIT - you are correct about the HP change in round 32. I haven't altered the fight yet, but if you look at the rolls on the roller, you still didn't have enough. After rage ends, you have a net -9 str and -2 dex. I haven't updated the used expendables, but its only a matter of 5-6 arrows I think.
Dracazar 08-30-06, 04:11 PM	I'll have to look at round 32. For Derros 2 and 4, they both set themselves up with cover versus you - so that's where the +4 to AC comes in. As to when to rage, you didn't give me a threshhold. I think I used 10hp as the threshhold because it was the only hp value in your tactics (granted, I misread it as "Rage when I am at 10hp" not "Also use Rage if low on HP, it will give 10 HP" - but if you wanted to rage at a specific point, you need to be specific about it. If you are not specific about it - that's pitlords' discretion. EDIT - you are correct about the HP change in round 32. I haven't altered the fight yet, but if you look at the rolls on the roller, you still didn't have enough. After rage ends, you have a net -9 str and -2 dex. I haven't updated the used expendables, but its only a matter of 5-6 arrows I think. I thought you misreaded, I can't set a specific point for Rage ability in monster fights because I doens't know the foe, but after taking several arrows from Derros it is reasoneable that I know their damage potential. So, because there are only two of them with some INT she should not rage before 6-7 HP (about) also because this is last resort. Actually she rage at 13 HP (with fix from round 32) so it is really to soon. About cover, I think that it is a extra advantage for Derro's that Quesis should have easily removed because they are sniping. To snipe they need 30' but Quesis could move easily and should lose the cover (this was also the reason I asked for the canopy, as for tactic) so it should be hard for them to get cover and stay just below the canopy. I can't understand the exact map positions of Derros and Quesis but I think that it would be really hard for them to get concealment, snipe and also cover and Quesis that is quite smart is unable to negate this. EDIT: Please, may I know what stands for the -2 to Quesis bow attacks?
TelinArtho 08-30-06, 04:24 PM	Different players have different threshholds for rage and healing. Look at NiQil's 4 horsemen - 25hp or below - heal up please. For me - I rarely use healing so I tend to be a little closer - probably the 10hp line for most opponents. I don't think I've ever looked at the average damage from a particular attack and said "Hey - I won't heal or rage until I reach this point here." If you want something like that - I think you would need much more than just the average damage and a decent intelligence - probably a heal check would be appropriate (if you are dealing with an unknown opponent). At the very least, I would still require a statement in your tactics to the effect of "Depending on their damage range - please use rage when I am at HP= 1+ avg damage of all regular attacks in a given round." For what it is worth - you are grasping at straws here. You left it up to pitlord discretion and I picked "around 10hp" for you - because that's what I would've done with one of my characters and you didn't specify in your tactics. Okay cover: To snipe - they don't need to be within 30ft - that's for sneak attacks - so just throw that out now. As to "ideal" conditions, I want to stress again that I disagree that you wanted to return to the canopy once you were engaged. You wanted to ambush to take out a mount from the trees but otherwise wanted to engage in melee. That being said, even if I did want to go through the effort of changing 40+ rounds of the fight, the net would be a -2 to their attacks and nothing more. Why? Because during the fight, they stayed at a convenient 100-105ft range - a -2 penalty for them and a +0 penalty for you. If you forced them to fight you while you were in the cover of the canopy, they would move to a more convenient range and still keep the cover they had - heck they could go prone as well and get another +4 against you. Since this would prolong the fight, you are looking at your force screen going away as well - which just makes things easier for them. In other words, as I have said before, while I did not make the situation the absolute best for you, given your tactics, I gave you what you asked for. After three full edits, I am done with the fight because I am confident that the result would not change.
MindWandererB 08-30-06, 04:33 PM	I don't think I've ever looked at the average damage from a particular attack and said "Hey - I won't heal or rage until I reach this point here."For the record, I do this all the time. But against an unknown opponent, I won't assume my character can do the estimate on the fly, and will heal more conservatively (or not at all, depending on what info I have).
Dracazar 08-30-06, 04:33 PM	That I don't undestand is why you add +4 cover bonus to Derros and you never added the +4 cover bonus (from round 32+) to Quesis even if she is attacked from 3 directions. She is not so stupid (INT 13) to play as a pincussion. I thought we were all without cover (for a faster fight) and it was ok for me even if I asked for cover bonus in the tactic. Now I see that my foes has that bonus and Quesis hasn't, not fair.
TelinArtho 08-30-06, 04:40 PM	Well, fair or not - the derro would have just as easily played a game of cat and mouse that could have extended the fight exponentially in order to give them the best advantage all around. In all fairness - I played them extremely stupidly - so while it would seem you sat there as a pincushion, just bear in mind that they could get you without your dex bonus easily and frequently. If I had more time this past week and if my last week wasn't so dreadful, maybe I'd be willing to put more into this fight than the time I have so far. However, given those things - and the fact that I have already rewritten the fight 3 times, I am loathe to do it. If you want a complete rerun of the fight from stage one - go ahead - but you are going to have to get the approval from Cat on that - and don't expect me to pitlord it.
Dracazar 08-30-06, 04:57 PM	I want to be bright, by your words it seems I'm paranoiac: A) Round 17,18,20,22,23 : Quesis has cover vs Derro3 B) Round 25,26,27,28: Quesis has no cover vs four Derros and they have no cover vs Quesis C) Round 29,30,31,32,33: Quesis has no cover vs three Derros and they have no cover vs Quesis D) Round 34,35,36,37,38,39,40,41,42 : Quesis has no cover vs two Derros and they HAVE cover vs Quesis A) Ok B) and C) is not ok because I asked for cover in tactic (canopy or not) but I could accept it D) Unfair
TelinArtho 08-30-06, 05:20 PM	I want to be bright, by your words it seems I'm paranoiac: A) Round 17,18,20,22,23 : Quesis has cover vs Derro3 B) Round 25,26,27,28: Quesis has no cover vs four Derros and they have no cover vs Quesis C) Round 29,30,31,32,33: Quesis has no cover vs three Derros and they have no cover vs Quesis D) Round 34,35,36,37,38,39,40,41,42 : Quesis has no cover vs two Derros and they HAVE cover vs Quesis A) Ok B) and C) is not ok because I asked for cover in tactic (canopy or not) but I could accept it D) Unfair Actually, in B you do have cover - I just only modified the rolls that would have missed due to your new force screen. Remember this isn't the original run of the fight. You have cover against Derro 3 in these rounds. For the rest, I agree that you might have desired cover (the only mention of cover in your tactic is to provide benefit while attacking a mount remember...), but at the same time, this doesn't help you. Like I said, had the derro been played to their style, they would have been denying your dex bonus while staying under their own cover as much as possible. Yes - I didn't give you cover for a few rounds - but I also didn't deny your dex bonus and negate your cover at the same time. Like I said - I played the derro stupidly in retrospect - probably because of time constraints. Anyway - I let it rest. If you want to get a rerun - PM Cat and get it approved. Just make sure I'm not the pitlord.