Post/Author/DateTime	Post
waywreth 10-25-06, 03:05 PM	Fights of the Week: October 25th Sheets Deadline for editing characters sheets is 21:00 CET. Central European Time (http://wwp.centraleuropeantime.eu/) shows the time. Please don't edit the sheet after the deadline or you will lose the match. Rules of Gladius All that you need to know is written in the Rules of Gladius. It could be useful also to give a look to the Court Decisions part 1 and part 2. Please do not make fake accounts or insult the Elders. Pairings GM Caterane will pair the active Characters of Gladius after the deadline. Make sure that your character is not in Prison (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=571107&goto=lastpost). Pitlording You should use the CoCo Dice Roller (http://www.hwx.it/wizards.com) for the fight. If you need, there is a nice Template ready to use that will help. You could find very useful the Battle Map Tag Generator (http://www.hwx.it/coco) for dynamic Maps, You must post a link to your fight in this thread when it is complete. Other useful links are Skills and Feats, Quick Access tables for XP and Gold. If a fight needs to be rerun, the Pitlord has to inform the Pitlords account. He cannot react to requests from Players because the other player and the pitlord might disagree. He has no time to read the fight and the discussion. Please keep that in mind. PMs from players with rerun requests won't have an impact. Recent News and Developments TBA Comments & Concerns Post any comments or concerns for this weeks fights in this thread. Be kind and courteous to your fellow posters, don't attack pitlords. Please remember that they do hard work and consume a lot of time to let you play and above all, have FUN! If you have questions or comments on any of the changes, please make your posts be heard in the Council of Gladius!
Pitlords 10-25-06, 04:54 PM	I'd like to mention a CoCo rule that should probably be mentioned in the post above. If a fight needs to be rerun, the Pitlord has to inform me. I cannot react to requests from Players because the other player and the pitlord might disagree. I have no time to read myself into the fight and the discussion. Please keep that in mind. PMs from players with rerun requests won't have an impact.
Pitlords 10-25-06, 06:50 PM	PAIRINGS DONE and we have a State of Emergency. If the Pitlords number doesn't increase significantly during the next week we'll continue with the SoE for some weeks. There are still these fights left: Gundmir (False_Keraptis) vs. Unknown Monster : XXXXX [City] Zodiac (Vathelokai) vs. Wisp (c00lz3) : XXXXX [Cavern] Perius (Ravashack) vs. Unknown Monster : XXXXX [Arena]
MindWandererB 10-25-06, 06:53 PM	Well, I can free one PL up: Ixenthor (Caterane) & Leif (Sunwolf) assault the Rioters in Gorthyum : Erithmu [Miniquest] [Guild] That's on today's CAPs, so it doesn't start until next week. (Hey, it could be intercepted.)
Erithmu 10-25-06, 06:53 PM	I'll take the Perius fight. Monster will be up after the Fight listing has been posted. @Cat: Take a look at the guildhall regarding your intended MQ. (what MWB said)
Pitlords 10-25-06, 07:02 PM	@MWB: Erithmu is on vacation the next 2 weeks and can't run the MQ thereafter. I doubt that anyone would intercept Ixenthor and Leif; the CEF is currently at war with no one and it needs an exceptional force to intercept them anyway. If someone does, we'll do the intercept but till then I see no reason not to play the MQ now. Technically, it starts on Nov 1, of course.
Erithmu 10-25-06, 07:07 PM	Also technically speaking, there isn't anyone who can intercept due to lack of CAPs or appropriate level characters.
Hirumajoe 10-25-06, 07:07 PM	I would like to point out that the Osiris vs Valen fight is actually trivial. Valen surrendered last week. All that really needs to be done for it is copy and paste the character sheets and rewards, which should free up one fight.
MindWandererB 10-25-06, 07:08 PM	Fair enough. By the books, it's Nov. 1, but you can of course get a head start on the paperwork. It should "officially" be on next week's pairings, but there's nothing to say that it can't be effectively done before then. And yes, it could be intercepted, just with a handicap. WAR could send Sdentch and Kracknol, for instance. Not that I think it'll happen, of course.
False_Keraptis 10-25-06, 07:12 PM	It probably doesn't matter, but Fnorri is level 4 now, and his miniquest is listed under level 3 fights.
Erithmu 10-25-06, 07:14 PM	@MWB: Krack is on campaign ...
Pitlords 10-25-06, 07:21 PM	I would like to point out that the Osiris vs Valen fight is actually trivial. Valen surrendered last week. All that really needs to be done for it is copy and paste the character sheets and rewards, which should free up one fight. Ok, I assigned Zelck a real fight. He's also responsible for posting the old "fight". One ECL 3 Monster Fight left to take!
Erithmu 10-25-06, 07:32 PM	Cat and Sunwolf: Here for your mission. @Zelck: send me peliminaries and I'll get back to you, I have school to take care of before the end of the night.
TheMagister 10-25-06, 07:35 PM	Odd. Tessero vs. Atalan [week 2] Disappeared. Hmm. TM
Sjiggie 10-25-06, 08:17 PM	I was supposed to do a MQ last week to join the EHTC with Maglu (my only character) but I haven't heard anything from my QL Jerrick_Quekiri. Is the MQ beig held this week as a holdover or should I do new one?
NiQil 10-25-06, 08:34 PM	Odd. Tessero vs. Atalan [week 2] Disappeared. Hmm. TM I sent a PM to Pitlords to get the fight re-added and assigned a pitlord...he appears to have deleted it by mistake. So don't edit and hang on to your tactics until he gets back to me.
False_Keraptis 10-25-06, 09:36 PM	So, can anybody take Gundmir's monster fight (ECL 4)?
McJarvis 10-25-06, 09:40 PM	I think there was a mis-pairing: Mort Noir Reborn (McJarvis) vs. Toron Brightstar (Iced) : Highfire [Arena] wasn't done last week after Highfire couldn't do it. Mort Noir Reborn (McJarvis) vs. Matthis Dar'ath (waywreth) : Abyssal Stalker [Arena] [Week 2] <--listed for this week.... waywreth's character could easily slide into: Kagun Flinthand (cgriffis) vs. Unknown Monster : McJarvis [Arena] though. No need for more pitlords :) Though don't get me wrong- Mort doesn't care who he fights. I just imagine Iced might care if his character gets left out...
NiQil 10-25-06, 10:08 PM	@ all: As mentioned above, the Atalan vs Tessero Valis fight was accidently deleted from the pairings, and should have been listed as a held over fight since it was never run. As such, it will also need a pitlord. So if anyone can step up and cover that (especially since it is already in week 2), it would be appreciated.
Milov 10-25-06, 10:42 PM	Bit of a problem.... In the level 4 fights, my monk, Ventr the Dreamer was not included, even though he was readied on time.
TheMagister 10-25-06, 10:46 PM	Bit of a problem.... In the level 4 fights, my monk, Ventr the Dreamer was not included, even though he was readied on time. Ventr was probably excluded on purpose because of the pitlord shortage. Ihdald got paired, though. Check out the Rules of Gladius thread for State of Emergency guidelines. TM
Krytos 10-25-06, 10:56 PM	Tactics sent to my Pitlord. Let me know if there's any problems.
Ravashack 10-25-06, 11:29 PM	Tactics submitted to Erithmu via PM. Thanks for picking it up!
Erithmu 10-25-06, 11:41 PM	Tactics submitted to Erithmu via PM. Thanks for picking it up! Received and posted along with the monster.
Zelck 10-25-06, 11:50 PM	Hmm... I noticed Walden's listed as doing a full activity in the roster, but he's not on the full activity list. I'm pitlording fights, so I should be able to activate two characters.
waywreth 10-26-06, 12:09 AM	I think there was a mis-pairing: Mort Noir Reborn (McJarvis) vs. Toron Brightstar (Iced) : Highfire [Arena] wasn't done last week after Highfire couldn't do it. Mort Noir Reborn (McJarvis) vs. Matthis Dar'ath (waywreth) : Abyssal Stalker [Arena] [Week 2] <--listed for this week.... waywreth's character could easily slide into: Kagun Flinthand (cgriffis) vs. Unknown Monster : McJarvis [Arena] though. No need for more pitlords :) I'm fine with this if cgriffis is. Drop him a PM McJarvis? I'll send tactics for Matthis tomorrow (err later today technically).
McJarvis 10-26-06, 12:11 AM	I'm fine with this if cgriffis is. Drop him a PM McJarvis? I'll send tactics for Matthis tomorrow (err later today technically). I PM'd pitlords about the issue. I'll send a heads-up Matthis's way regarding it...I'm pretty sure that's how it will be resolved.
Erithmu 10-26-06, 12:35 AM	@Abyssal: Tactics for Torel are your way. @Zelck: Initial brainstorm your way for the team fight.
TARDIS 10-26-06, 12:44 AM	Tactics sent to McJarvis. @Kytos: Welcome to the Coliseum! After this we'll have a grand total of 3 fights under out belts between the two of us. Nice build and good luck to you, sir. See you in the pit!
Etiquette_Gnome 10-26-06, 03:00 AM	I'm curious as to whether it's an oversight for my other character, Shreckentaum (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10391070&postcount=972) to not get paired, despite him being stated as ready.
Pitlords 10-26-06, 03:43 AM	Made the following corrections: Kagun Flinthand (cgriffis) vs. Matthis Dar'ath (waywreth) : Abyssal Stalker [Arena] [Week 2] Tessero Valis (TheMagister) vs. Atalan (NiQil) : McJarvis [Arena] [Week 2] Mort Noir Reborn (McJarvis) vs. Toron Brightstar (Iced) : Papapeperoni [Arena] [Week 2] Maglu Hrugg (Sjiggie) miniquests to join EHTC : XXXXX [Miniquest] [Guild] [Week 2] @Sjiggie: Sorry that you have to wait. If you like we can cancel your miniquest. It's a bad week for us. Who runs: ML XXXXX: Cyra Val (Stormwind) befriends Gauterix for PSI
Vathelokai 10-26-06, 04:53 AM	For those who are not familiar... Meta Rules - State of Emergency The CoCo State of Emergency is a safeguard that will be initiated when there is a lack of pitlords. This state normally lasts for several weeks until the Game Master is sure that it is safe to go back normally. This might also cause some adjustments in the rules to prevent future state of emergencies. If this state persists for a long period of time, it will become standard coco rule. Normally, a character can have two active characters for free, and pays one credit per additional character. In the State of Emergency, every player can have only one character active, plus one per fight he pitlords. Running Quests and Campaigns, doing board work, or similar things that earn credits but do not help to solve the situation, do not count. Only the Game Master can declare or end a state of emergency. So basicly, everyone is allowed one active character unless you are pitlording fights. And I see I have extra fights this week... :confused: No worries, I'll just have to make everything quick! @Pitlords: Zodiac and Wisp [ecl4] are rematching this week, as they did last week. I'm okay with it, but it does seem a bit unfair to Wisp (Coolz3). If possible we can change, or Wisp and Zodiac can team fight a monster (same pitlord/player ratio). If Coolz3 has an opinion I'd like to hear it. @MWB: Tactics for Besthirah recieved. Waiting for Anixx. I'll go look up that week 2 Valkin vs. Sunstroke after I get my MQ for the week up.
Maraxus 10-26-06, 05:12 AM	State of emergency? Looks like good luck I did not get Noko ready yesturday. :) Tactics for Durin send to False_Keraptis.
c00lz3 10-26-06, 05:15 AM	@Pitlords: Zodiac and Wisp [ecl4] are rematching this week, as they did last week. I'm okay with it, but it does seem a bit unfair to Wisp (Coolz3). If possible we can change, or Wisp and Zodiac can team fight a monster (same pitlord/player ratio). If Coolz3 has an opinion I'd like to hear it. A team fight sounds fun, I was almost going to go on a quest this week anyway. I didnt mind much myself but I like the your idea, I think we would be a potent team.
Abyssal Stalker 10-26-06, 05:16 AM	@My players: Please send me your tactics ASAP. I have two fights to run, and I won't probably be able to do them on weekend. I could do one tonight, if I only had the tactics. I allready have Erithmu's tactics, but all the others are missing.
Vathelokai 10-26-06, 05:30 AM	A team fight sounds fun, I was almost going to go on a quest this week anyway. I didnt mind much myself but I like the your idea, I think we would be a potent team. I'll PM pitlords; it isn't a sure thing, but I'll hold off on writing tactics for an hour or so until Cat gets on. *EDIT* Sent.
False_Keraptis 10-26-06, 05:36 AM	@ Maraxus: Tactics received. Does no one want to run Gundmir v. CR 4 monster? Will my entreaties go unheard?
Vathelokai 10-26-06, 05:45 AM	@ Maraxus: Tactics received. Does no one want to run Gundmir v. CR 4 monster? Will my entreaties go unheard? If it still hasn't been picked up by the time I finish my other two fights, I'll pick it up; but there are still some people who havn't logged in since before pairings, so I'd be patient.
Abyssal Stalker 10-26-06, 05:53 AM	@Sjiggie: Sorry that you have to wait. If you like we can cancel your miniquest. It's a bad week for us. Oh, what the heck. I'll take Sjiggie's MQ. Don't expect anything too fancy.
Caterane 10-26-06, 07:06 AM	I'm curious as to whether it's an oversight for my other character, Shreckentaum (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10391070&postcount=972) to not get paired, despite him being stated as ready. I haven't received a PM with a request to add him to the roster. Done now but keep in mind that you have to inform me about new characters.
TheMagister 10-26-06, 07:26 AM	@McJarvis: tactics for Tessero Valis vs. Atalan forwarded by PM. @hogarth: Hood tactics will be "in the mail" later today. TM
NiQil 10-26-06, 08:21 AM	@ McJarvis: Forwarded tactics for Atalan via PM. @ False_Keraptis: I will have you tactics for Keltsat tonight when I get home from work.
Abyssal Stalker 10-26-06, 08:29 AM	@Cat: remember to give me the credit for running the MQ. I'm going to need them when I activate Jonathon! :)
waywreth 10-26-06, 08:37 AM	Tactics for Matthis sent via PM for Kagun Flinthand (cgriffis) vs. Matthis Dar'ath (waywreth) : Abyssal Stalker [Arena]
cgriffis 10-26-06, 08:49 AM	Greetings, Matthis, we meet again! Tactics sent for Kagun via PM. Craig Tactics for Matthis sent via PM for Kagun Flinthand (cgriffis) vs. Matthis Dar'ath (waywreth) : Abyssal Stalker [Arena]
Abyssal Stalker 10-26-06, 09:00 AM	Got tactics from waywreth and cgriffis, will try to run the fight when I get home.
Vathelokai 10-26-06, 10:49 AM	A team fight sounds fun, I was almost going to go on a quest this week anyway. I didnt mind much myself but I like the your idea, I think we would be a potent team. Unfortunately, Cat says no. So it's a rematch in a much smaller arena!
Hirumajoe 10-26-06, 10:55 AM	@Abyssal Stalker: Tactics for Valen Sky Sent.
hogarth 10-26-06, 11:30 AM	@Hirumajoe: tactics sent for Reginald Molehusband.
Hirumajoe 10-26-06, 11:37 AM	@Hogarth: Tactics Received.
Abyssal Stalker 10-26-06, 01:10 PM	Kagun vs Matthis (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10468376&postcount=169) is done!
hogarth 10-26-06, 01:30 PM	Kagun vs Matthis (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10468376&postcount=169) is done! Note that the spell Sleep takes a full round to cast, so it doesn't take effect until the beginning of the caster's next turn. I'm not sure if you took that into account or not, but it doesn't look like it would affect the fight.
Abyssal Stalker 10-26-06, 01:38 PM	Damn. I didn't. :) Not that it would change the fight. It spares some expendables from Matthis, this makes him use only 4 scrolls. I'll edit it in. Edit: There.
Abyssal Stalker 10-26-06, 01:42 PM	Tactics for Manzarf sent. I'll have to think more carefully tactics for The Undertaker. I'll write them tomorrow!
TheMagister 10-26-06, 02:34 PM	I'll have to think more carefully tactics for The Undertaker. I'll write them tomorrow! It took me 6 hours of on/off typing while I'm at work to write Hood's tactics for that fight. It won't be pretty, however it goes. @Hogarth - tactics for Hood vs. Brother Death and the Waterboy sent via PM. Thanks for running that one! TM
waywreth 10-26-06, 02:40 PM	I'm pretty sure that you did this right Abyssmal but I can't find where it says so... Does anyone recall where it says you don't use the creators attribute as part of the DC on a scribed scroll?
Abyssal Stalker 10-26-06, 02:44 PM	I don't remember either, but I recall that scrolls use always the minimum DC. EDIT: Here's something. Saving Throws Against Magic Item Powers Magic items produce spells or spell-like effects. For a saving throw against a spell or spell-like effect from a magic item, the DC is 10 + the level of the spell or effect + the ability modifier of the minimum ability score needed to cast that level of spell.
McJarvis 10-26-06, 02:44 PM	I'm pretty sure that you did this right Abyssmal but I can't find where it says so... Does anyone recall where it says you don't use the creators attribute as part of the DC on a scribed scroll? I forget where it says it, but the rule is you use the minimum required attribute to cast the spell in question. :-)
hogarth 10-26-06, 02:46 PM	I'm pretty sure that you did this right Abyssmal but I can't find where it says so... Does anyone recall where it says you don't use the creators attribute as part of the DC on a scribed scroll? It's under "Saving Throws Against Magic Item Powers" in the "Basics & Creation" part of the SRD. I.e., here: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/magicItemBasics.htm#savingThrowsAgainstM agicItemPowers
TheMagister 10-26-06, 03:09 PM	@hogarth - clarification PM sent in response to enlightening question. Thanks!
Zevox 10-26-06, 03:29 PM	@ Zelck - Tactics for Destra Stormwind (vs Manzarf the Loathsome) have been PMed. That should be a nice winnable battle. @ Macbrea - Working on the assassin sisters' tactics now. That one, unfortunately, will need divine intervention to be won as near as I can tell... Zevox
McJarvis 10-26-06, 03:43 PM	Roy Kadeer (Krytos) vs. Flaeli Stormbringer (TARDIS) can be found here (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10468198&postcount=168).
Etiquette_Gnome 10-26-06, 03:54 PM	@McJarvis: Tactics for Ynotar sent Here's to hoping Dragonlily surrenders; he's been wanting an excuse to eat at that restaurant for a long time. :P
Zevox 10-26-06, 04:05 PM	@ Macbrea - Tactics for Annalina & Indrithia PMed. Yeah, definitely going to need divine intervention to win that one... Oh, and Izumi's tactics recieved, thanks. I hope to run that one tomorrow (*hint hint nudge nudge @ other fighters*). Zevox
Gonbow 10-26-06, 05:51 PM	@ Macbrea - Tactics for Annalina & Indrithia PMed. Yeah, definitely going to need divine intervention to win that one... Oh, and Izumi's tactics recieved, thanks. I hope to run that one tomorrow (*hint hint nudge nudge @ other fighters*). Zevox Yes yes, tactics will be forthcoming for Tatyana later tonight. It's a complicated battle see, two kineticists with a meat-shield each for backup...
Zevox 10-26-06, 06:03 PM	Yes yes, tactics will be forthcoming for Tatyana later tonight. It's a complicated battle see, two kineticists with a meat-shield each for backup... Bah, its not like tactics for a Kineticist are ever complicated. "Super-vigor hp, seek foe, fire energy missilies until golden brown." :P I kid, I kid! Take your time. :) Zevox
Milov 10-26-06, 07:49 PM	Yeah... sorry bout the dumb question earlier guys. I didn't notice the "State of Emergency" tag and it was almsot immediatly explained by my brother... So... yeah. Oh well, suppose one's better than none.
Milov 10-26-06, 08:04 PM	Oh, and Hogarth, Tactics for Ihdald sent out.
TARDIS 10-26-06, 08:44 PM	This doesn't really impact my fight immensely, but can you have a dragonhide chain shirt? Where do the links come from? Dragonhide Armorsmiths can work with the hides of dragons to produce armor or shields of masterwork quality. One dragon produces enough hide for a single suit of masterwork hide armor for a creature one size category smaller than the dragon. By selecting only choice scales and bits of hide, an armorsmith can produce one suit of masterwork banded mail for a creature two sizes smaller, one suit of masterwork half-plate for a creature three sizes smaller, or one masterwork breastplate or suit of full plate for a creature four sizes smaller. In each case, enough hide is available to produce a small or large masterwork shield in addition to the armor, provided that the dragon is Large or larger. This seems rather odd to me--- a chain shirt? Does that mean I can make a darkwood greataxe or an iron golem made from darkwood?
NiQil 10-26-06, 08:58 PM	This doesn't really impact my fight immensely, but can you have a dragonhide chain shirt? Where do the links come from? This seems rather odd to me--- a chain shirt? Does that mean I can make a darkwood greataxe or an iron golem made from darkwood? The ruling is located in the Court Decisions: Q: What armors can be made out of dragonhide? A: All armors normally found in the core rules are eligible to be made from dragonhide. The reasoning behind the ruling is that the armors given in your quote are examples of what can be made from what quantities of dragonhide, not a limitation on what types of armors can be made. Edit: @ False_Keraptis: Tactics for Keltsat sent via PM.
Traevanon 10-27-06, 12:08 AM	@Niqil: Which is the same reasoning why I feel that Wands are not the only weapon-like items eligible to be Quickdrawn. I can be tiresome cant I? ;)
Erithmu 10-27-06, 09:50 AM	@Zevox: Tactics for Shadowsong and Andurwin are sent.
hogarth 10-27-06, 09:56 AM	@Milov: sent a PM concerning tactics (Confuzzled is not available for this fight since it's dead) @Abyssal Stalker: if you could get in your tactics for the Undertaker by tonight, I could start running the fight. I'll need the tactics by Saturday morning (EST) at the latest.
Zevox 10-27-06, 11:22 AM	Well, I now have all the tactics for my fight (thanks for getting them in so quick guys!). I should be able to run it this afternoon. Zevox
MindWandererB 10-27-06, 12:12 PM	The reasoning behind the ruling is that the armors given in your quote are examples of what can be made from what quantities of dragonhide, not a limitation on what types of armors can be made.So it was argued. It ended up being a close vote--one that would well swing the other way now that I get one, because I feel strongly that the list in question was meant to be exhaustive. Sauro, what was your opinion? Since NiQil and I disagree on this one, and Pittbull doesn't get involved much, I think you would be the deciding vote.
McJarvis 10-27-06, 12:13 PM	So it was argued. It ended up being a close vote--one that would well swing the other way now that I get one, because I feel strongly that the list in question was meant to be exhaustive. Sauro, what was your opinion? Since NiQil and I disagree on this one, and Pittbull doesn't get involved much, I think you would be the deciding vote. Heh. We should form CoCo poltical parties that have platforms for rules we are for/against,and then try to get our representatives on the elder council just to vote out old rules we don't like anymore...
MindWandererB 10-27-06, 12:44 PM	Heh. We should form CoCo poltical parties that have platforms for rules we are for/against,and then try to get our representatives on the elder council just to vote out old rules we don't like anymore... That would work nicely if elders were elected officials. Since we're not, we don't need to be a representative democracy. We're more of a meritocratic oligarchy.
McJarvis 10-27-06, 12:46 PM	That would work nicely if elders were elected officials. Since we're not, we don't need to be a representative democracy. We're more of a meritocratic oligarchy. Who said anything about voting for elders? My idea was the parties could get their candidates into office by bribing Caterane with DnD books.
SauroGrenom 10-27-06, 01:03 PM	So it was argued. It ended up being a close vote--one that would well swing the other way now that I get one, because I feel strongly that the list in question was meant to be exhaustive. Sauro, what was your opinion? Since NiQil and I disagree on this one, and Pittbull doesn't get involved much, I think you would be the deciding vote. Don't we have 5 elders? What happened to Uther or Huan? MWB Replaced on of them. I forget which one... Well anyway about dragonhide armors of various kinds. We had a discussion about this. The special material section lists Hide, Breast-Plate, Banded, Half-plate and Full-plate armors. Clearly this cannot by any standard founded in reason be an exhaustive list. Why include blanded mail and not splint mail? They are almost identical in construction. Check google images and find some examples to look at. Why not include scale mail when it is the most obvious one to make with dragon scales? Why allow hide armor and not leather or studded leather? Seriously hide and leather are made of the same stuff... animal hides. Leather is just a bit more processed and supple than a crude hide. The description of dragon hide armor doesn't say that the list is a complete list. Rather the language is very general and gives a sort of benchmark about the size of dragons required for various types of armor. I say allow the dragon hide chain shirts because it not unbalanced to allow dragon hide chain shirts. It's not hard for me to imagine a shirt crafted of a thin supple dragon hide leather with scales intact, and have that be equivalent to a chain shirt.
SauroGrenom 10-27-06, 01:06 PM	Who said anything about voting for elders? My idea was the parties could get their candidates into office by bribing Caterane with DnD books. :rofl: Ahh, I wish there was a smily that was slapping it's knee. I think Cat is above bribery. Sorry to burst your bubble. Besides in some cases what the people want isn't in their best interest.
Zevox 10-27-06, 01:11 PM	Don't we have 5 elders? What happened to Uther or Huan? MWB Replaced on of them. I forget which one... KU is still an Elder (though considering hes in psuedo-retirement I'm guessing he'll be replaced soon too). MWB replaced Huan. Beyond that its you, NiQil, and Pittbull. And anyway, just in case anyone forgot (and because it bears repeating), I'm with MWB. The list given of Dragonhide armors seems to be intended to be exhaustive to me. Plus if armors other than those listed were allowed in a normal TT game there'd be the question of how much hide you need to make them, since only those particular types are mentioned in the description, which further leads me to believe its exhaustive (if it wasn't, why not just toss in the few types of armor not listed with the amount of hide they need?). Zevox
MindWandererB 10-27-06, 01:16 PM	Well, unless KU and Pittbull decide to cast votes on this one (unlikely), then the ruling stands. Although I really wish someone would explain how you make chain links out of dragonhide.... I would think a "thin supple dragon hide leather with scales intact" would be closer to studded leather than a chain shirt.
hogarth 10-27-06, 01:16 PM	It's not hard for me to imagine a shirt crafted of a thin supple dragon hide leather with scales intact, and have that be equivalent to a chain shirt. It's not hard for me to imagine that throwing dragon droppings in a character's face would cause them to make a Fort save or be nauseated, but I couldn't find that listed in the rules either. :D
TheMagister 10-27-06, 01:32 PM	Well, unless KU and Pittbull decide to cast votes on this one (unlikely), then the ruling stands. Although I really wish someone would explain how you make chain links out of dragonhide.... JUST for the sake of argument, I'm going to play devil's advocate on the part of the dragonhide chain shirt. Suppose a leatherworker/tanner could process the hide in such a manner as to dissolve the skin and leave the scales. Suppose the armorsmith took said scales and seperated out those that were too thin or too small, leaving him with thick, appropriately sized scales. Suppose this armorsmith then, by various means, punched or drilled holes in the scales. Then, the armorsmith slit the holey scales so that he might join them together and fashion a link-chain of scales. The armorsmith then used the cast-off scales (those that were too small or thin) as patching material to strengthen the cut holey scales and make them as strong as normal. Repeated thousands of times, this could conceivably produce a chain shirt constructed of dragonscales. ... Of course, this would take YEARS, but I suppose it could be done by a master armorsmith. TM
Milov 10-27-06, 06:57 PM	Hogarth - Sorry bout' that. Sent muh Addendum, as it were.
False_Keraptis 10-27-06, 07:41 PM	@ Niqil: tactics received. So, no takers for Gundmir's monster fight, eh? Shoot.
Zevox 10-27-06, 08:35 PM	Shadowsong & Andurwin vs Izumi & Tatyana is up. A firefight between two kineticists. Oh, and theres a couple of warriors in there too, but they don't really do anything :P . Zevox
Macbrea 10-27-06, 08:53 PM	To answer your question, Izumi did pretty much as expected in the fight. Targetting the bow had exactly the same effect had I targetted my opponent. I hit the bow but would have missed my opponent each time. It resulted in most of the pp being spent to take out Izumi. This gave my partner the maximum amount of time to deal damage. Yes, I could have gone straight for my opponent and was hoping to break the bow on the first swing. But seem to miss it. My error for not stating to take ignore the bow after the first swing.
Zelck 10-28-06, 11:54 AM	I am facing the stark reality that I probably won't have time to run Manzarf vs. Destra. Can someone bail me out and take that one?
Zelck 10-28-06, 12:54 PM	Zodiac vs. Wisp is up (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10488441&postcount=174). One spell made all the difference. @Hirumajoe: By the way, I also posted Osiris vs. Valen. I noticed you got the rewards for that fight wrong (you forgot the xp bonus from Osiris's ally).
hogarth 10-28-06, 01:24 PM	@Abyssal Stalker: if you could get in your tactics for the Undertaker by tonight, I could start running the fight. I'll need the tactics by Saturday morning (EST) at the latest. Unfortunately, I need to start running the fight now and I don't see any default tactics for the Undertaker. It looks like he's going to forfeit. :weep:
Vathelokai 10-28-06, 02:14 PM	Although I really wish someone would explain how you make chain links out of dragonhide.... The Fabricate spell. Though TheMagister's description was the first thing I thought of.
Vathelokai 10-28-06, 02:17 PM	*EDITED - Reread* Zodiac vs. Wisp is up (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10488441&postcount=174). One spell made all the difference. I didn't know that Web blocked LOELine of Effect: A line of effect is a straight, unblocked path that indicates what a spell can affect. A line of effect is canceled by a solid barrier. It’s like line of sight for ranged weapons, except that it’s not blocked by fog, darkness, and other factors that limit normal sight. ... An otherwise solid barrier with a hole of at least 1 square foot through it does not block a spell’s line of effect. Such an opening means that the 5-foot length of wall containing the hole is no longer considered a barrier for purposes of a spell’s line of effect. It definitely blocks LOS, as it says in the spell description. Additionally, Web is a 20 ft burst, and sleep is a 10 ft burst, and web only gives total cover if there are 20 ft or more webs.If you have at least 5 feet of web between you and an opponent, it provides cover. If you have at least 20 feet of web between you, it provides total cover. The strands of a web spell are flammable. A magic flaming sword can slash them away as easily as a hand brushes away cobwebs. Any fire can set the webs alight and burn away 5 square feet in 1 round. All creatures within flaming webs take 2d4 points of fire damage from the flames.So the tindertwig only burns 5 ft per round, and with Nadir I can target sleep close enough to get him with the burst, despite not having LOS.... I think; let me go get a map. http://www.hwx.it/coco/coco.php;v=1;map=cavern;a=Z,M,16,9,Zodia c;b=N,D,13,18,Nadir;c=W,M,8,23,Wisp,Psi; n=Web,10,21,4;o=Sleep,9,21,2;style=s;opa city=75 Wisp is in the range of Nadir's blindsense, and the center of the sleep spell (grey) is exactly 20 ft from the edge of the web (green) (within LOS), so I think it possible. I can accept the ruling, no problem (barring some rule that neither of us have seen) to avoid a hold over. Anyone have an opinion/official rule on the LOS vs. LOE? @Coolz3: Nice move with the tindertwig; all my characters will be carrying one from now on.
hogarth 10-28-06, 03:31 PM	Monsieur Hood vs. Ihdald Seaslash vs. The Undertaker (MIA) (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10489337&postcount=176) is up now. If anyone has any comments or criticisms, please let me know.
Milov 10-28-06, 07:01 PM	Monsieur Hood vs. Ihdald Seaslash vs. The Undertaker (MIA) (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10489337&postcount=176) is up now. If anyone has any comments or criticisms, please let me know. Now, I'm just bringing this up as a point, it would not change the outcome at all. But There was no need to drop Ihdald's Shield when the wand was drawn, because if I remember correctly, he can have the wand drawn into the same hand as the shield while it's out. With Mssr. Hood's rolls though, it makes no difference. Thanks for running the fight Hogarth!
hogarth 10-28-06, 07:19 PM	Now, I'm just bringing this up as a point, it would not change the outcome at all. But There was no need to drop Ihdald's Shield when the wand was drawn, because if I remember correctly, he can have the wand drawn into the same hand as the shield while it's out. With Mssr. Hood's rolls though, it makes no difference. Thanks for running the fight Hogarth! I put the shield away so you could use your bow as well. I would suggest changing your light shield for a buckler so you don't have to take it off to use your bow. By the way, TheMagister pointed out that your hit points are 4 pts. too high.
Zelck 10-28-06, 07:33 PM	*EDITED - Reread* I didn't know that Web blocked LOE It definitely blocks LOS, as it says in the spell description. Additionally, Web is a 20 ft burst, and sleep is a 10 ft burst, and web only gives total cover if there are 20 ft or more webs.So the tindertwig only burns 5 ft per round, and with Nadir I can target sleep close enough to get him with the burst, despite not having LOS.... I think; let me go get a map. http://www.hwx.it/coco/coco.php;v=1;map=cavern;a=Z,M,16,9,Zodia c;b=N,D,13,18,Nadir;c=W,M,8,23,Wisp,Psi; n=Web,10,21,4;o=Sleep,9,21,2;style=s;opa city=75 Wisp is in the range of Nadir's blindsense, and the center of the sleep spell (grey) is exactly 20 ft from the edge of the web (green) (within LOS), so I think it possible. I can accept the ruling, no problem (barring some rule that neither of us have seen) to avoid a hold over. Anyone have an opinion/official rule on the LOS vs. LOE? @Coolz3: Nice move with the tindertwig; all my characters will be carrying one from now on. Well, total cover would block your spell. I did miss the one 5' square per round thing. I doubt this will change the fight however. What I think will end up happening is you use X sleep spells, Wisp falls asleep, you dismiss the web (or it's already gone) and CDG, only to have the psicrystal touch you for lethal damage. Good catch on the 5'/round thing though. Tell me if you still want a rerun, although I'm very busy this week.
Vathelokai 10-28-06, 11:17 PM	Well, total cover would block your spell. I did miss the one 5' square per round thing. I doubt this will change the fight however. What I think will end up happening is you use X sleep spells, Wisp falls asleep, you dismiss the web (or it's already gone) and CDG, only to have the psicrystal touch you for lethal damage. Good catch on the 5'/round thing though. Tell me if you still want a rerun, although I'm very busy this week. Ah; forgot my tactics say to dismiss the web. No rerun nessicary. I accept the loss. But I still disagree on the LOS/LOE thing. I'll post it in the elders thread.
TheMagister 10-29-06, 12:41 AM	With Mssr. Hood's rolls though, it makes no difference. Thanks for running the fight Hogarth! Yes, thanks for the run, Hogarth! Still, Mssr. Hood had his share of bad rolls. How many 5s and 4s in there? Like, TEN?!
Abyssal Stalker 10-29-06, 08:17 AM	I put the shield away so you could use your bow as well. I would suggest changing your light shield for a buckler so you don't have to take it off to use your bow. By the way, TheMagister pointed out that your hit points are 4 pts. too high. Sorry man. I had no time to get the tactics to you. I thought that I would've had time on friday, but things turned out so that this is the first time I got a chance to log in. Oh, well. It would've been an interesting fight!
Papapeperoni 10-29-06, 09:20 AM	Mort vs. Toron is up. Iced didn't send tactics unfortunately. How to change the xp/gp with allies? Greetings, --Papapeperoni
Zelck 10-29-06, 09:23 AM	Can someone take the Destra vs. Manzarf fight? I'm really busy and probably won't have time to do it. I will forward the tactics to you.
McJarvis 10-29-06, 10:32 AM	Mort vs. Toron is up. Iced didn't send tactics unfortunately. How to change the xp/gp with allies? Greetings, --Papapeperoni All of mine are class-allies, so no changes.
Zevox 10-29-06, 11:00 AM	Mort vs. Toron is up. Iced didn't send tactics unfortunately. How to change the xp/gp with allies? Greetings, --Papapeperoni You'll need to post the sheets with the fight too, just to note. For allies, Toron doesn't have any, and Mort's are a class ally and a psicrystal, so they don't affect rewards. No changes. Zevox
McJarvis 10-29-06, 11:04 AM	You'll need to post the sheets with the fight too, just to note. For allies, Toron doesn't have any, and Mort's are a class ally and a psicrystal, so they don't affect rewards. No changes. Zevox I just edited my sheet after he posted the win, but all I've done is added xp/gp rewards and noted that my deeper darkness is expired.
McJarvis 10-29-06, 01:09 PM	@my remaining fighters: I'll try to do all three of my remaining fights tomorrow(somehow I just caught that- I signed up for three fights and got four). No worries on me getting assigned extra fights...I'll get to 'im :-)
Vathelokai 10-29-06, 04:51 PM	Well, I'm up to round 40 of Valkin vs Sunstroke. The ranged portion of the triathalon is done, and now the opponents are advancing to melee. Linky. I'm trying to fit the fight in while my baby takes naps, thus the slowness. It'll be done tonight/in the morning definitely. Hopefully I will get my other fight done tonight too. I havn't even had time to look over everything for that yet.
Erithmu 10-29-06, 05:28 PM	Perius vs Fiendish Umber Hulk is up
TheMagister 10-29-06, 07:00 PM	Can someone take the Destra vs. Manzarf fight? I'm really busy and probably won't have time to do it. I will forward the tactics to you. I've come upon some unexpected work time (yay, overtime!), so I can take it. Forward tactics, please! Will send a PM. TM
TelinArtho 10-29-06, 08:38 PM	Well, I'm up to round 40 of Valkin vs Sunstroke. The ranged portion of the triathalon is done, and now the opponents are advancing to melee. Linky. I'm trying to fit the fight in while my baby takes naps, thus the slowness. It'll be done tonight/in the morning definitely. Hopefully I will get my other fight done tonight too. I havn't even had time to look over everything for that yet. I kind of figured that this was going to happen - but there's not much I could've done about it without seriously giving myself the short end of the stick... One thing I do note is that you aren't taking into account Sunstroke's deflect arrows and seem to be having Sir Valkin ready to fire rather than to make full attack actions to fire two arrows. Since the damage was all absorbed by Vigor and he renews it - I don't think it is an issue - I just wanted to bring it up now in case you feel you need to change it (I certainly don't think you do). In any case, thanks for taking your time with it. /d
Gonbow 10-29-06, 10:23 PM	Shadowsong & Andurwin vs Izumi & Tatyana is up. A firefight between two kineticists. Oh, and theres a couple of warriors in there too, but they don't really do anything :P . Zevox Finally back from the weekend, fight looks solid. Tatyana is a study in damage output, yes indeed. I left the sling & stones behind because my weight situation was untenable to take it with and the bolts, which were, imho, more important since each one can do 5d6 if it's psi-shot charged. Andur's just lucky an un-charged one hit him ^_^ Random query: I can move items from 'home' to 'carried' inbetween fights in a 3FC, yes?
NiQil 10-29-06, 10:44 PM	Finally back from the weekend, fight looks solid. Tatyana is a study in damage output, yes indeed. I left the sling & stones behind because my weight situation was untenable to take it with and the bolts, which were, imho, more important since each one can do 5d6 if it's psi-shot charged. Andur's just lucky an un-charged one hit him ^_^ Random query: I can move items from 'home' to 'carried' inbetween fights in a 3FC, yes? No. Items listed at home are not available for use until the end of your current cycle. If you want an item available, you have to list it in your carried section.
Gonbow 10-29-06, 10:49 PM	No. Items listed at home are not available for use until the end of your current cycle. If you want an item available, you have to list it in your carried section. Interesting... that doesn't make much sense, given the only exploit I can see is expendables; which have to be in their own section anyways and always carried already. But it works. After reviewing my sheet and the fight, there was actually a small discrepency that was my fault; my Cognizance stone was left at home for that fight, because of the weight! (Ironic, being it was the item I wanted to leave behind now that I cant get anything out of it anymore) So I would have been 5 hp in the hole and I suppose, one turn quicker in getting out of the gate. But I'd rather not have a rerun at this point. Win or lose, Tatyana moves into the next ECL bracket, so I'm happy.
MindWandererB 10-29-06, 10:56 PM	No. Items listed at home are not available for use until the end of your current cycle. If you want an item available, you have to list it in your carried section.This has not been the ruling thus far. (Which is why your at-home expendables count toward the cap.) We need an official clarification, because people have been given the opposite answer multiple times in the past. Re: Sunstroke/Valkin: Adding Deflect Arrows would save me some money. Add it if you can, please.
NiQil 10-29-06, 11:11 PM	This has not been the ruling thus far. (Which is why your at-home expendables count toward the cap.) We need an official clarification, because people have been given the opposite answer multiple times in the past. Re: Sunstroke/Valkin: Adding Deflect Arrows would save me some money. Add it if you can, please. To my knowledge, this rule has been in effect since the 3FC started, though I have not looked through the Rules thread to see if it is mentioned. The problem with allowing shifting from home to active during a cycle is a)expendables, as Gonbow mentioned, b) crafting items as a free activity and then listing them in your at-home section only to move them to active a week later is already something not allowed, and c) encumbrance avoidance. I will PM Cat and see if he can give us a clarification.
Hirumajoe 10-29-06, 11:14 PM	I've certainly been transfering arrows to bring Valen back up to 40 or 60 each fight, as I had been informed at some point that this was ok. I guess what it just forces me to do is buy a sack, put everything at home in the sack, and drop it as a free action on the first turn in every fight. Its not a big deal either way. Its just convient and more elegant to just transfer stuff between carried and home betwen fights. And I suppose it makes a slight difference to those with Uncanny Dodge (i.e. encumbrance reducing max dex if somehow the enemy arrived before they've had their first action.)
Zevox 10-29-06, 11:47 PM	To my knowledge, this rule has been in effect since the 3FC started, though I have not looked through the Rules thread to see if it is mentioned. The problem with allowing shifting from home to active during a cycle is a)expendables, as Gonbow mentioned, b) crafting items as a free activity and then listing them in your at-home section only to move them to active a week later is already something not allowed, and c) encumbrance avoidance. As MWB said, the rule as its thus far been run is that they could be transfered. Two of those weren't an issue about it - A was avoided because the expendable cap is on what you can own, not just what you can bring with you (if you read that rule thats the way its written), and B was avoided because you can't use anything you craft in mid-cycle anyway even if you try to bring it with you. C I don't think really qualifies as a problem, since you can't swap items after pairings are rolled - best it does is let archers or weaker characters with bows/crossbows/slings as backup weapons keep some spare arrows/bolts/sling stones at home so they don't run out too easily in mid-cycle. Hardly an unfair manuever. Zevox
TheMagister 10-30-06, 01:20 AM	@Zelck, Zevox, and Abyssal Stalker - tactics for Manzarf the Loathsome vs. Destra Stormwind received. Fight will be posted tomorrow in the p.m. TM
Krytos 10-30-06, 01:41 AM	This came up only briefly in my fight this week, but I would like to hear an actual ruling on this. Can one drink a potion (or make other standard actions) while a mount takes double moves? I can't find anything in the mounted combat section that would deny you actions while mounted, but I just want to make sure.
MindWandererB 10-30-06, 01:44 AM	This came up only briefly in my fight this week, but I would like to hear an actual ruling on this. Can one drink a potion (or make other standard actions) while a mount takes double moves? I can't find anything in the mounted combat section that would deny you actions while mounted, but I just want to make sure. Yes. You can take any standard action that doesn't require you to be in a particular place (such as a melee attack). Concentration checks are required for spells and scrolls (and powers and stones). If it matters, the action takes place at the middle of your move.
Zelck 10-30-06, 01:54 AM	@Zelck, Zevox, and Abyssal Stalker - tactics for Manzarf the Loathsome vs. Destra Stormwind received. Fight will be posted tomorrow in the p.m. TM Thank you so much! :)
TheMagister 10-30-06, 02:03 AM	Thank you so much! :) Glad I could be available to help. You're welcome! ;)
Vathelokai 10-30-06, 02:16 AM	One thing I do note is that you aren't taking into account Sunstroke's deflect arrows and seem to be having Sir Valkin ready to fire rather than to make full attack actions to fire two arrows. Since the damage was all absorbed by Vigor and he renews it - I don't think it is an issue - I just wanted to bring it up now in case you feel you need to change it (I certainly don't think you do). Re: Sunstroke/Valkin: Adding Deflect Arrows would save me some money. Add it if you can, please.Both additions made; deflect added and full attacks added. Result is that Sunstroke wasn't hit at all and saved 2 charges of vigor. Valkin used twice as many arrows.
TheMagister 10-30-06, 02:24 AM	Setup for Manzarf vs. Destra posted. Fight will be run tonight and tomorrow night, and posted tomorrow night as well (I'd guess around 10pm or midnight, US Central).
Abyssal Stalker 10-30-06, 03:53 AM	Setup for Manzarf vs. Destra posted. Fight will be run tonight and tomorrow night, and posted tomorrow night as well (I'd guess around 10pm or midnight, US Central). I should probably point out at this point that the height of the temple is only 20ft. That means that Manzarf has no problem reaching Destra when enlargened, unless you think it would be too much of an improvisation. It is true that I don't have anything in my tactics about Destra using spider climb, and the truth is that I didn't even think about that situation.
TheMagister 10-30-06, 04:27 AM	When I first saw the tactics I thought, "Oh, man...Manzarf is screwed." But the reach certainly fixes that problem, something I only realized after I re-read the map properties. It's all up to the dice, now. Dunno whether it's good or bad, but you're certainly getting all your bad rolls out of the way early, Abyssal. I might get a little more done tonight, but I doubt it. I'll post what I have. TM
Vathelokai 10-30-06, 04:28 AM	Valkin vs Sunstroke I think this one is over, but I'd like it looked over. Some of the rolls on the roller are off by a point or two (forgot flurry, etc.), but I didn't see any fight effecting. I'm passing out. I'll get Anixx vs. Besthira tommorrow night.
Caterane 10-30-06, 04:43 AM	It is my understanding that while a character is inside of a 3FC, they may not transfer equipment from the at home section of their sheet to their active section. However, in the FotW thread, MWB and others have contended that this is allowed. I would like some clarification on this, as well as a mention of this in the 3FC section of the Rules thread. I do not think it should be allowed, because it allows a)the at home section to be used to allow characters to avoid encumbrance issues, which should not be allowed, b)the use of items crafted as a free activity during that same 3FC, since they would be placed in the at home section once completed, and c)the replenishment of things like scrolls and potions and ammunition, when part of the idea behind the 3FC was to force characters to either plan ahead, or fight under less than ideal conditions. If you could shed some light on this issue, it would be appreciated. Encumbrance could be an issue in rare cases, crafted items during the 3FC are explicitely mentioned to not be available until the cycle is complete, no matter where you place them, and finally there's no reason to put scrolls and potions into your at home section. So it's possible just like you can exchange your allies during the cycle (if you have several ones). If you give me better reasons on why we should seperate the At Home section, we could consider a rules change but that would not affect the fight.
NiQil 10-30-06, 07:22 AM	Encumbrance could be an issue in rare cases, crafted items during the 3FC are explicitely mentioned to not be available until the cycle is complete, no matter where you place them, and finally there's no reason to put scrolls and potions into your at home section. So it's possible just like you can exchange your allies during the cycle (if you have several ones). If you give me better reasons on why we should seperate the At Home section, we could consider a rules change but that would not affect the fight. Alright...if you don't think those are good enough reasons, then how about you give me a reason we have the at home section at all? What's the point? It's little things like this that drive me up the wall sometimes about this place. In my mind, the at home section is clearly being used to get around the intention behind other rules, namely encumbrance. While you think that expendables should be listed in a seperate place altogether, I see many characters listing them in the at home section for this very reason. I see ammunition listed in the at home section for this very reason. This is all solved by a simple rule that states "if you want it available in the cycle, bring it with you." Allies are not a good comparison, because you can choose to leave them out of the arena before the fight ever begins...not so with equipment. But have it your way.
Abyssal Stalker 10-30-06, 07:39 AM	I'm with NiQil. The same thing has come up at least a couple of times during the time I've been here. First issue was the armor debate - if armor could be taken off before the fight and left home. The rules are unclear about these small things at the moment. The "at home"-section seems quite useless, if people can randomly decide what they carry and when it suits them best. If the 3FC was meant to make CoCo represent more a normal D&D game, then this thing should also be taken care of. In a normal D&D game you need to carry everything you need in order to have them available. You might put them in the saddle bags or somewhere else, but then they are in the saddle bag when you need them. People shouldn't be able to just decide that they have things when they need and that they don't create any extra weight when not needed. Encumbrance is the key word, and might or might not make a difference.
Hirumajoe 10-30-06, 07:41 AM	Alright...if you don't think those are good enough reasons, then how about you give me a reason we have the at home section at all? What's the point? It's little things like this that drive me up the wall sometimes about this place. In my mind, the at home section is clearly being used to get around the intention behind other rules, namely encumbrance. While you think that expendables should be listed in a seperate place altogether, I see many characters listing them in the at home section for this very reason. I see ammunition listed in the at home section for this very reason. This is all solved by a simple rule that states "if you want it available in the cycle, bring it with you." Allies are not a good comparison, because you can choose to leave them out of the arena before the fight ever begins...not so with equipment. But have it your way. NiQil, if it makes you feel any better, consider that every character could spend 8g to buy a donkey, 15g for a pack saddle, and 1g for 10 sacks. And now imagine calling that donkey "The Home Section". Hence the effect can easily be duplicated in a table top game or in the CoCo. I see where you're getting at in regards to encumbrance, but its pretty much a non-issue. There are many ways around it which are logical and within the rest of the rules set. If the rules were changed to only use what you bring in a 3FC, it wouldn't fundamentally change any fight. It'd just make people spend a silver on either a sack to drop as a free action at the start, or spend trivial amount of gold on a porter. Anyways, just my two cents. Edit: In regards to armor being left at home, I have been told and had it ruled such that you have to decide to wear it or not before the pairing are made. You can't even decide to be carrying your armor or wearing your armor after the pairing are made, its whatever the state was when you posted. Which makes perfect sense. As long as all decisions to make transfers between character and home are done before pairings and before you know who your opponent is, I think its fine. Since a character can make a judgement call immediately after that last fight and say "Hey, I used up all of X, I should go refill at my trusty donkey/porter/magic floating chest that follows me around". The archer realizes he used all his arrows and refills. If people try to get this changed in the council of Gladius or something, I'll support it. And invest in a donkey. :-)
Zevox 10-30-06, 07:54 AM	I should probably point out at this point that the height of the temple is only 20ft. That means that Manzarf has no problem reaching Destra when enlargened, unless you think it would be too much of an improvisation. It is true that I don't have anything in my tactics about Destra using spider climb, and the truth is that I didn't even think about that situation. Note though that my tactics account for that very thing :) . - If Manzarf is enlarged (via his potion), get to the ceiling over the center statue. If he wants to strike me with his guisarme there he’ll have to jump for it, and with his armor penalty he may just fall in the lava. If he makes it, just withdraw from the area, forcing an even harder jump on him. Rinse and repeat unless delay penalty threatens, in which case use tactical maneuver between the inner section and outer ledges to prevent melee while spell bombing. In any event, it'll be interesting to see how it turns out. Its all up to the dice indeed :) . *crosses fingers for Manzarf's bow and Guisarme to be warped* Zevox
Caterane 10-30-06, 08:08 AM	We've lost another two pitlords for the coming week and have two Uncon fights. There'll definately be a State of Emergency so please activate only 1 character if possible. I am not sure if that is sufficient even with SoE. :(
TelinArtho 10-30-06, 08:11 AM	Valkin vs Sunstroke I think this one is over, but I'd like it looked over. Some of the rolls on the roller are off by a point or two (forgot flurry, etc.), but I didn't see any fight effecting. I'm passing out. I'll get Anixx vs. Besthira tommorrow night. Looks great Vath (though I haven't checked everything quite yet). The only thing I saw right off the bat is that Sunstroke starts round 52 with 13 hp left (and 1 subdual) and takes 13 damage from Overseer and Foreman. Sir Valkin also starts with 36 hp and takes 10 damage form Sunstroke. All of this damage is not marked in the round end summary and just means that Sunstroke was down 1 round earlier. I'll check the fight further when I get a chance - but nice run overall.
Hirumajoe 10-30-06, 08:52 AM	We've lost another two pitlords for the coming week and have two Uncon fights. There'll definately be a State of Emergency so please activate only 1 character if possible. I am not sure if that is sufficient even with SoE. :( Well, Maratai will be retiring in anticipation of a future grouped character (who is still being debated around the house... Although the a Fighter/Bard, Fighter/Paladin pair seems to be in the lead..). If its helpful I can have my one other character, Valen, either take a week's break, or offer to surrender if he gets paired without a pitlord to run it.
TelinArtho 10-30-06, 12:04 PM	@Vath - I went through the fight for you and marked up the used items: Sir Valkin 14 arrows, all misses - 7 recovered; 3 charges from Wand of CLW Sunstroke 13 arrows (19 misses, 3 hits; 9 recovered); Powerstone of Inertial Armor, Powerstone of Chameleon, 3 charges from a Dorje of Vigor, Powerstone of Wall Walker, 2x Defensive Precognition from memory, Expansion from memory (aug 3pp), Scroll of Mirror Image, Scroll of Shield, Potion of Protection from Good Sir Valkin gains 2400xp -4.1666% = 2300xp/3243gp. Sunstroke gains 800xp +4.1666% = 833xp/1174gp. Feel free to double check if you like.
Vathelokai 10-30-06, 01:54 PM	@Vath - I went through the fight for you and marked up the used items: Sir Valkin 14 arrows, all misses - 7 recovered; 3 charges from Wand of CLW Sunstroke 13 arrows (19 misses, 3 hits; 9 recovered); Powerstone of Inertial Armor, Powerstone of Chameleon, 3 charges from a Dorje of Vigor, Powerstone of Wall Walker, 2x Defensive Precognition from memory, Expansion from memory (aug 3pp), Scroll of Mirror Image, Scroll of Shield, Potion of Protection from Good Sir Valkin gains 2400xp -4.1666% = 2300xp/3243gp. Sunstroke gains 800xp +4.1666% = 833xp/1174gp. Feel free to double check if you like. Thanks! Just want to wait for MWB's opinion before wrapping it up.
Vathelokai 10-30-06, 01:55 PM	We've lost another two pitlords for the coming week and have two Uncon fights. There'll definately be a State of Emergency so please activate only 1 character if possible. I am not sure if that is sufficient even with SoE. :( I'll one up you and have 0 active! So there! And since I got bumped to 2 fights anyway, you can set me up for 2 next week.
MindWandererB 10-30-06, 02:19 PM	Valkin vs Sunstroke I think this one is over, but I'd like it looked over. Some of the rolls on the roller are off by a point or two (forgot flurry, etc.), but I didn't see any fight effecting. I'm passing out. I'll get Anixx vs. Besthira tommorrow night. There is one issue: In round 41, Prot. Good mysteriously ends. Since it would ward off Overseer for many rounds, it would matter quite a bit, and could very possibly tip this the other way.
TelinArtho 10-30-06, 02:19 PM	We've lost another two pitlords for the coming week and have two Uncon fights. There'll definately be a State of Emergency so please activate only 1 character if possible. I am not sure if that is sufficient even with SoE. :( Well, with that I'll announce that I'm taking one fight this upcoming week to hopefully alleviate some of the stresses...
Vathelokai 10-30-06, 02:49 PM	There is one issue: In round 41, Prot. Good mysteriously ends. Since it would ward off Overseer for many rounds, it would matter quite a bit, and could very possibly tip this the other way. Cut and paste error. I'll go through the rolls when I get off work; but those horses got lucky - half the hits were unconfirmed crits. Also, does the summoned Overseer have to roll SR check to get close to good protected sunstroke? Since Sunstroke started a grapple with the mounted Valkin, Sunstroke did get very close to him, but Overseer might be blocked. The paladin mount summon is a calling effect, and I don't remember off the top of my head if that is blocked, since the mount isn't technicly extraplanar (or is it?).
TelinArtho 10-30-06, 02:59 PM	The only other question there is whether Overseer is even Good-aligned - since the base is a Neutral animal and they make no mention of an alignment change in the description of the paladin's special mount. Also - since it is called, not summoned - I don't believe the spell would apply regardless.
MindWandererB 10-30-06, 03:53 PM	The only other question there is whether Overseer is even Good-aligned - since the base is a Neutral animal and they make no mention of an alignment change in the description of the paladin's special mount. Also - since it is called, not summoned - I don't believe the spell would apply regardless. Good point--I forgot it was a Calling effect. Unless the +2 AC makes any difference, I'll accept the loss. I didn't really expect to win that one anyway.
McJarvis 10-30-06, 04:09 PM	Marcus Rederta (Papapeperoni) vs. Marataie (Hirumajoe) : [Arena] (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10508760&postcount=185) is up.
Hirumajoe 10-30-06, 04:17 PM	Marcus Rederta (Papapeperoni) vs. Marataie (Hirumajoe) : [Arena] (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10508760&postcount=185) is up. Other than th fact that Maratai is a she, not a he, and that for some reason, everyone keeps adding an e on the end, it looks reasonable from this end.
McJarvis 10-30-06, 04:18 PM	Other than th fact that Maratai is a she, not a he, and that for some reason, everyone keeps adding an e on the end, it looks reasonable from this end. Everyone looks like a dude from the crowd, don't ya know... What we need are more "well endowed" women. Or more well endowed men...
McJarvis 10-30-06, 04:18 PM	Ynotar (Etiquette_Gnome) vs. Dragonlily (Selena Ombrenoire) : [Arena] (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10507610&postcount=182) is up.
Hirumajoe 10-30-06, 04:23 PM	If a diminutive psicrystal is hiding in the brush adjacent to a medium character standing in the path on the forest map, does the character get an attack of opportunity when it moves it his space? I figure the character auto-spots once the psicrystal is in the path, since they're no cover, the question is it too late for the character to take their attack of opportunity? Or would they need to spot the crystal before it moves into the square? Also, does a psicrystal appy its strength or dexterity to touch attacks?
hogarth 10-30-06, 04:26 PM	If a diminutive psicrystal is hiding in the brush adjacent to a medium character standing in the path on the forest map, does the character get an attack of opportunity when it moves it his space? I figure the character auto-spots once the psicrystal is in the path, since they're no cover, the question is it too late for the character to take their attack of opportunity? Or would they need to spot the crystal before it moves into the square? I think Grakkar should get his attack of opportunity since the psicrystal is moving into the open. I pondered this question earlier when formulating my tactics.
TheMagister 10-30-06, 04:33 PM	I think Grakkar should get his attack of opportunity since the psicrystal is moving into the open. I pondered this question earlier when formulating my tactics. Well, the psicrystal is hidden at the beginning (with a pretty decent hide check, being diminuative and all). If the psicrystal moves out onto the path, no AoO (entering a threatened area doesn't provoke) is granted but it is auto-spotted. If the psicrystal moves into Grakkar's space to touch him, then an AoO is granted (for moving out of a threatened area). However, the whole thing could be avoided by the psicrystal taking a 5' step into Grakkar's space, couldn't it (I freely admit I'm not looking at the fight...this may be a stupid suggestion). TM
Hirumajoe 10-30-06, 04:44 PM	You know, you're right. The obvious kinda staring at me in the face. However, I don't it matters since this is the 3rd fight of the cycle and Reginald won anyways. If necessary I'll edit it in. Btw, Default Grakkar Stonefist (Papapeperoni) vs. Reginald Molehusband (hogarth):Forest is up here.
hogarth 10-30-06, 04:46 PM	If the psicrystal moves into Grakkar's space to touch him, then an AoO is granted (for moving out of a threatened area). It was a touch attack (Dissipating Touch). Unfortunately, the psicrystal was the one who got dissipated. Crunch!
hogarth 10-30-06, 06:26 PM	Btw, Default Grakkar Stonefist (Papapeperoni) vs. Reginald Molehusband (hogarth):Forest is up here. A couple of minor points: -Being stunned doesn't have any effect on one's Reflex save. -Listen checks on the Forest map suffer a -4 penalty per 10', not -2 per 10'; I think you were using -2 per 10', but I could be wrong. -Shouldn't Reginald's rewards be 1200*(1-12.5%+29%)=1398 gp/xp?
Hirumajoe 10-30-06, 07:01 PM	A couple of minor points: -Being stunned doesn't have any effect on one's Reflex save. You're right. For some reason I was thinking Denied Dex to AC = Denied Dex to reflex saves... -Listen checks on the Forest map suffer a -4 penalty per 10', not -2 per 10'; I think you were using -2 per 10', but I could be wrong. I was using -2 per 10'. I thought the forest map said the penalty was doubled? Checking... From the forest map: Forest Noise: The background noise of the forest makes listen checks more difficult. The distance penalty is 2 per square, not 1. Huh. I guess I read that too quickly. But why does it say the distance penalty is 2 per square, not 1? Isn't it usually -1 per 10'? -Shouldn't Reginald's rewards be 1200*(1-12.5%+29%)=1398 gp/xp? Yeah, it should. I went too fast on the calculater and did 1200*(0.875*1.29). Will correct the rewards. Thanks for looking it over and finding mistakes.
McJarvis 10-30-06, 07:03 PM	@Niqil and TM: Started your fight & the "results so far" are posted. I'm going out for a few hours, but if either of you want to concede and make my life easier that'd be great! hahaI'm back now...it's gonna be one of those 30 round fights methinks... ~McJ~
Gonbow 10-30-06, 08:01 PM	@Hirumajoe A 'square' is a '5-ft square'. Thus -2 per 5 ft equates to -4 per 10 ft. All CoCo maps that I know of use 5-ft squares, as that is the facing of an average gladiator (medium).
Hirumajoe 10-30-06, 08:21 PM	@Hirumajoe A 'square' is a '5-ft square'. Thus -2 per 5 ft equates to -4 per 10 ft. All CoCo maps that I know of use 5-ft squares, as that is the facing of an average gladiator (medium). Oh, the confusion on my part wasn't on the size of the basic square. The way its expressed had me thinking it twice the normal penalty. And I agree on re-reading it explicitly states -2 per square and hence -4 per 10'. My question was regarding include the statement "The distance penalty is 2 per square, not 1." Why include the ",not 1" part? As far as I know, there is no standard case where the listen check is -1 per square. In the srd, the distance penalty is listed as -1 per 10'. Coming from this table: Listen DC Modifier Condition +5 Through a door +15 Through a stone wall +1 Per 10 feet of distance +5 Listener distracted So why not write ", not 1 per 10' "? The way its written it seems to imply the normal case (which doesn't apply on the forest anyways) is -1 per 5', and that the forest is double that. Anyways, its been cleared up and I'll remember it for next time. :-)
TheMagister 10-30-06, 08:29 PM	Posted a few more rounds of Manzarf vs. Destra. Had to make what might be a controversial Pitlord call concerning Spider Climb and its relationship to shields and spells with somatic components. Please check it and tell me what you think about the call (esp. Zevox). Otherwise proceeding as both combatants had anticipated (with a few exceptions). Edit: Okay. No replies, so I'm proceeding with the fight.
Zevox 10-30-06, 10:32 PM	Posted a few more rounds of Manzarf vs. Destra. Had to make what might be a controversial Pitlord call concerning Spider Climb and its relationship to shields and spells with somatic components. Please check it and tell me what you think about the call (esp. Zevox). Otherwise proceeding as both combatants had anticipated (with a few exceptions). Edit: Okay. No replies, so I'm proceeding with the fight. Just got back from work (else I would've replied sooner), and while I think you're justified in making the call, I do disagree about it. If you can still use the hand holding a light shield to hold other objects (potions, wands, even weapons are fair game, albeit that you can't use weapons), I don't think Destra should be taking a climb speed penalty for using her shield - given that you can hold all those things and still use the shield effectively, shouldn't she be able to apply her hand to the ceiling for the spell's effect with it on without trouble? Zevox
McJarvis 10-30-06, 10:43 PM	....I'll get this right, just you wait..
NiQil 10-30-06, 10:52 PM	@ McJarvis: If you are going to include the spurring for the non -4 attacks, then I would ask that the rolls for the ride checks to be made. Since we know that he needs 4 rounds of spurring to get a non -4 attack, each of the hits that is not a rolled 20 should require 4 consecutive DC 15 ride checks to be made. I won't make you plot the movement, but I would appreciate if those checks can be made. If there is not 4 consecutive ride checks successfully made, then the attacks that are not 20's should not hit. I have no problem with you shortcutting the movement, but I don't think asking for the rolls is too much.
McJarvis 10-30-06, 10:55 PM	@ McJarvis: If you are going to include the spurring for the non -4 attacks, then I would ask that the rolls for the ride checks to be made. Since we know that he needs 4 rounds of spurring to get a non -4 attack, each of the hits that is not a rolled 20 should require 4 consecutive DC 15 ride checks to be made. I won't make you plot the movement, but I would appreciate if those checks can be made. If there is not 4 consecutive ride checks successfully made, then the attacks that are not 20's should not hit. I have no problem with you shortcutting the movement, but I don't think asking for the rolls is too much. Please check what I just posted. I think it is acceptable. ((essentially I made him not attack UNTIL he got 4 spurs off. I know there are delays- but this is the cleanest way I could think of that wouldn't require me going in and majorly editing results. He also missed all four attacks that were made without the -4...))
NiQil 10-30-06, 11:00 PM	I knew going in this battle was a long shot, and for your sanity, I can live with that. From there, I am guessing it is going back to tactics as best you can LOL. I guess I will be attacking the horse, while Tessero closes, and then it's my turn to stay at range, if I can kill the horse.
TheMagister 10-30-06, 11:27 PM	The way I understand it: There are already 100 ft. between Atalan and Tessero. Tessero spurs Equalizer, changing his speed to 50'. Tessero moves 100 ft. and fires at a -4 penalty. (200' between them) Atalan moves 80 ft.(120' between them) Tessero fires (no penalty) and moves 40' (160' between them). Atalan moves 80'(80' between them). Tessero spurs Equalizer, changing his speed to 50'. Tessero moves 100 ft. and fires at a -4 penalty (180' between them). Atalan moves 80' (100 ft. between them). Tessero fires (no penalty) and moves 40' (140' between them). Atalan moves 80' (60' between them). Tessero spurs Equalizer, changing his speed to 50'. Tessero moves Equalizer 100', and fires at a -4 (160' between them). Atalan moves 80' (80' between them). Tessero fires (no penalty) and spurs Equalizer, changing his speed to 50'. Tessero moves away 50' (130' between them). Atalan moves 80' (50' between them). Tessero spurs Equalizer, changing his speed to 50'. Tessero double moves 100', firing at a -4 penalty (150' between them). Atalan moves 80' (70' between them). Tessero fires (no penalty) and moves 40' (110' between them). Atalan moves 80' (30' between them). In all that: 4 no penalty shots 4 penalty shots (-4) 5 damage to Equalizer So it doesn't have to be an every round thing. There are also the instances where Tessero could spur Equalizer and run him across the arena, and fire at Atalan as he approaches. That could save some Equalizer HP as well. TM
McJarvis 10-30-06, 11:58 PM	The way I understand it: Spurring will increase your mount's speed to 70ft, which is then reduced to 2/3 that amount.(encumbrance)(70*2/3=46.666666, rounded down to nearest 5: 45 ft) Boni to speed are always added to normal speed, then reduced due to encumbrance. So spurring actually only increases your speed by 5 ft. Also note that Atalan goes first, not you. So: There are already 100 ft. between Atalan and Tessero. Atalan moves to 80 ft( 20' between the two) Tessero spurs(45 ft movement) and double moves/fires (-4 penalty) 110' between the two. Atalan moves 80 ft.(30ft between the two) Tessero double moves/fires(-4 penalty) 110' between the two Atalan moves 80 ft.(30 ft between the two Tessero spurs & doulbe moves (-4 penalty) 120' between them ... And so and and so forth. Thus you gain 10 ft every 2 rounds: You need 40 ft to fire a shot without penalty, so every 8 rounds(& 4 damage to your horse) you fire a shot without penalty. This is within "delay" times, so it's safe to assume you'll just opt to do this for the first five shots. First five shots were all below 17: thus the spurring didn't really earn you anything. :(
Macbrea 10-31-06, 12:01 AM	Have a silly question in the Kimahri [ECL 7] vs Annalina [ECL 5] & Indrithia [ECL 5] fight. Set-up and Fight can be found here. That was a close fight. Kimahri won but If I understand this correctly is the rewards: Kimahri 2,100xp, 2593 gp Loosers 3000xp/3 = 1000 xp, 1060 gp Is that amount then divided by two because there was two combatants to give them 500xp, 530gp each. Or do they get the full amounts.
Zevox 10-31-06, 12:10 AM	Have a silly question in the Kimahri [ECL 7] vs Annalina [ECL 5] & Indrithia [ECL 5] fight. Kimahri won but If I understand this correctly is the rewards: Kimahri 2,100xp, 2593 gp Loosers 3000xp/3 = 1000 xp, 1060 gp Is that amount then divided by two because there was two combatants to give them 500xp, 530gp each. Or do they get the full amounts. Its divided between the two of them, just the way it is in a team fight. Zevox
McJarvis 10-31-06, 12:33 AM	Fight is finished now. Back to reading up on guild rules!
NiQil 10-31-06, 12:49 AM	Fight is finished now. Back to reading up on guild rules! By my count, 4 charges of the dorje were used. Also, for the record, the last attack totalling 11 actually hits Tessero's touch AC, but doesn't change anything. We'll just put this fight out if it's misery. I knew it was a long shot going in. I still managed to make a go of it. Thanks for the run.
McJarvis 10-31-06, 12:54 AM	By my count, 4 charges of the dorje were used. Also, for the record, the last attack totalling 11 actually hits Tessero's touch AC, but doesn't change anything. We'll just put this fight out if it's misery. I knew it was a long shot going in. I still managed to make a go of it. Thanks for the run. fixed. Thanks for the patience, and sorry for the last-minute nature of it all.
MindWandererB 10-31-06, 01:04 AM	@McJarvis and TheMagister: Don't hesitate to ask if you have any questions about the guilds. Even I haven't mastered all the rules, but if I can help clarifying, let me know.
NiQil 10-31-06, 01:13 AM	Now...anyone seen False_Keraptis? Still have that fight outstanding too....
McJarvis 10-31-06, 01:13 AM	@McJarvis and TheMagister: Don't hesitate to ask if you have any questions about the guilds. Even I haven't mastered all the rules, but if I can help clarifying, let me know. The only problems I'm hitting is that there are alot of typos in the current rules due to the changes Cat just introduced. I think I can decipher them all, though.
TheMagister 10-31-06, 02:21 AM	Manzarf vs. Destra is completed and up. An interesting fight all around. It did take longer than I expected, mostly because there were over 180 hps involved in the fight. ;) TM
MindWandererB 10-31-06, 02:29 AM	The only problems I'm hitting is that there are alot of typos in the current rules due to the changes Cat just introduced. I think I can decipher them all, though. If you point typos out to me, I can fix them. Typos bug me, too.
TheMagister 10-31-06, 02:44 AM	@Niqil - I take your comment "TM has a very solid build here." as the highest praise. Thanks! TM
TheMagister 10-31-06, 02:55 AM	In other news: TM: you can't block crystal shard with your tower shield. This would effectively allowing a spell to sunder the shield, and spells can't sunder equipment that is attended to. Also, towershields can't be used to block spell effects in general. Hmm. I looked this relationship over before I wrote it and came up with a different conclusion. Here it is: <snip> The shield does not, however, provide cover against targeted spells; a caster can cast a spell on you by targeting the shield you are holding.<snip> Target or Targets: Some spells, such as charm person, have a target or targets. You cast these spells on creatures or objects, as defined by the spell itself. You must be able to see or touch the target, and you must specifically choose that target.<snip> Effect:<snip> Ray: Some effects are rays (for example, ray of enfeeblement). You aim a ray is if ysing a ranged weapon, though typically you make a rnged touch attack rather than a normal ranged attack. As with a ranged weapon, you can fire into the dark or at an invisible creature and hope you hit something. You don't have to see the creature you're trying to hit, as you do with a targeted spell. Intervening creatures an obstacles, however, can block your line of sight or provide cover for the creature you're aiming at. It seems clear that there is a marked difference between Targeted spells and Ray spells. A Tower Shield can be used as an "intervening obstacle" to provide total cover from the caster of a ray spell. A Tower Shield can NOT be used as total cover against a psionic charm, since the caster can simply choose you by targeting your shield (i.e. - "I charm the holder of that shield."). Stop me if I'm wrong, here...
Vathelokai 10-31-06, 05:33 AM	Good point--I forgot it was a Calling effect. Unless the +2 AC makes any difference, I'll accept the loss. I didn't really expect to win that one anyway. The +2 caused two misses for 15 damage (this time I'm going to assume that the paladin mount is good aligned; this should not be construed as binding and should probably be looked into). Then there was an addition error that lost some hp later. Result - fight went 1 more round, and Sunstroke went to 0 instead of 1 hp. Results posted. Linky
hogarth 10-31-06, 07:04 AM	It seems clear that there is a marked difference between Targeted spells and Ray spells. A Tower Shield can be used as an "intervening obstacle" to provide total cover from the caster of a ray spell. A Tower Shield can NOT be used as total cover against a psionic charm, since the caster can simply choose you by targeting your shield (i.e. - "I charm the holder of that shield."). Stop me if I'm wrong, here... For the record, I agree with TheMagister. My understanding is that Energy Missile (for example) can't target an attended object since it's a targeted spell. But Energy Ray could -- it would just be an ordinary (ranged) sunder attempt.
Abyssal Stalker 10-31-06, 08:27 AM	@Rith & Hirumajoe: I've posted the first few rounds of the fight, I hope you have checked they are OK? There are some minor issues like missing modifiers in the rolls, but they are minor and I've taken them into account when checking the results. I'll finish the fight when I get home from work, which should be something like 3-4 hours later from now.
Erithmu 10-31-06, 08:39 AM	@Rith & Hirumajoe: I've posted the first few rounds of the fight, I hope you have checked they are OK? There are some minor issues like missing modifiers in the rolls, but they are minor and I've taken them into account when checking the results. I'll finish the fight when I get home from work, which should be something like 3-4 hours later from now. Looking good so far.
Zevox 10-31-06, 08:41 AM	My understanding is that Energy Missile (for example) can't target an attended object since it's a targeted spell. But Energy Ray could -- it would just be an ordinary (ranged) sunder attempt. Actually, our ruling is that neither could. Theres no such thing as a ranged sunder attempt (without a non-core feat, anyway), so energy ray can't be used for such. Edit: Note that I'm not saying I agree with this, just relaying it. @ TM - Looks pretty good to me. Still disagree with the half speed ruling, but it didn't wind up affecting the fight, so I'll not press the point. Thanks for running it! Zevox
Hirumajoe 10-31-06, 10:16 AM	@Rith & Hirumajoe: I've posted the first few rounds of the fight, I hope you have checked they are OK? There are some minor issues like missing modifiers in the rolls, but they are minor and I've taken them into account when checking the results. I'll finish the fight when I get home from work, which should be something like 3-4 hours later from now. Looks good so far. Minor detail that doesn't affect anything in round 4: The AoO isn't for the fast dismount (since mounting/dismounting doesn't cause AoO) but rather Torel's movement out of Sinwa's squares to flank does, since she leaves threatened squares. Also don't forget to finish round 4 with Valen's action, since he hasn't taken one yet. However, if I had to bet on the outcome, I'd be betting on team Torel and Sinwa at this point. :-)
Abyssal Stalker 10-31-06, 12:31 PM	OK, the fight is done (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10508079&postcount=183). It was an even fight, decided by a critical hit. Check for mistakes, because they might change the fight in one way or another. I had the "most interesting" way back from work. I had to drive 100km in a damn blizzard on the highway, took me almost 2 hours. There were at least 10 cars that had slipped from the road to the side. It's been snowing here since midday, the lovely weather of Finland. :gel:
Hirumajoe 10-31-06, 12:41 PM	OK, the fight is done (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10508079&postcount=183). It was an even fight, decided by a critical hit. Check for mistakes, because they might change the fight in one way or another. As you mentioned, some of the bonuses look slightly off in the CoCo roller (like Torel should have a +5 touch attack, not +4), but since they don't affect any successes or failures, I don't think anything needs changing. I'm happy with it if Erithmu is. Thanks for running the fight. I had the "most interesting" way back from work. I had to drive 100km in a damn blizzard on the highway, took me almost 2 hours. There were at least 10 cars that had slipped from the road to the side. It's been snowing here since midday, the lovely weather of Finland. :gel: And I thought it got bad in the North East United States during the winter. Fortunately I'm currently living in the city of Boston and just take the subway. No driving necessary. :)
Abyssal Stalker 10-31-06, 12:51 PM	@TheMagister and Zevox: I'm currently checking the Manzarf vs Destra fight. I noticed some errors, that might have an effect or not. So please hold a little bit before editing. They won't change the fact that taking down Carcaruva took surprisingly long and that Zevox had great tactics (as always). EDIT: You have quite a big mistake in the fight. Manzarf's AC should be 3 points higher. You are missing the shield bonus. The shield is animated so he gets the bonus even though he uses a two-handed weapon! This changes at least things in rounds 3, 4, and 5. I'm not sure if the spider climb is handled correctly, but I'm not going to argue about it. I have always figured that the "hands free" -condition should be met all the time in order to stay on the surface. The description doesn't say anything about stopping and doing something with hands - I think it's not mentioned because it is obvious. But like I said, I'm not going to argue. I'm not too good with the rules so I might as well be wrong and my DM sense might differ from the others.
Erithmu 10-31-06, 03:43 PM	OK, the fight is done (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=10508079&postcount=183). It was an even fight, decided by a critical hit. Check for mistakes, because they might change the fight in one way or another. Yea ... saw 'decided by a crit hit.' and figured that for a bad thing. I'll give this one to the dice on Valen's side.
False_Keraptis 10-31-06, 04:03 PM	Keltsat v. Durin in the Arena is up! Sorry to get it in so late, and I suspect someone will have a problem with it, but I don't know what I should have done differently. I think I'm just not particularly skilled in one of the character's styles.
TheMagister 10-31-06, 04:28 PM	@TheMagister and Zevox: I'm currently checking the Manzarf vs Destra fight. I noticed some errors, that might have an effect or not. So please hold a little bit before editing. They won't change the fact that taking down Carcaruva took surprisingly long and that Zevox had great tactics (as always). EDIT: You have quite a big mistake in the fight. Manzarf's AC should be 3 points higher. You are missing the shield bonus. The shield is animated so he gets the bonus even though he uses a two-handed weapon! This changes at least things in rounds 3, 4, and 5. I'm not sure if the spider climb is handled correctly, but I'm not going to argue about it. I have always figured that the "hands free" -condition should be met all the time in order to stay on the surface. The description doesn't say anything about stopping and doing something with hands - I think it's not mentioned because it is obvious. But like I said, I'm not going to argue. I'm not too good with the rules so I might as well be wrong and my DM sense might differ from the others. ACK! You know something stupid? I ran the fight with his 23 AC up till round 11, then dropped the fight for the night and picked it up the next night. When I came back in, I said to myself "Self, you have Manzarf's AC too high! He's wielding a two-handed weapon, so he can't be wielding that heavy shield!" So I went back and editted the ENTIRE fight up to that point. :doh: Well, I did the right thing and didn't delete the original rolls from the document, but I'm afraid that I DID delete them from the CoCo roller. Manzarf actually has another chance in this fight, because has more hp, and rages later. @Zevox - If you have a problem with the Spider Climb ruling, bring it up in the Ask an Elder thread NOW. I'm going to send a PM to Pitlords telling him that I need to hold the fight over to get it right. Sorry fellas. When I took this fight, I didn't forecast it taking so long. The soonest I'll be able to get back on it is Friday night (US Central Time). TM
Zevox 10-31-06, 06:03 PM	I'm going to send a PM to Pitlords telling him that I need to hold the fight over to get it right. No no, please don't do that! I'd rather have Destra just surrender than have the fight held over! Its not worth it to have it held over, particularly in a state of emergency, when I want to deactivate her next week. Please, just have her surrender the fight instead. Zevox
MindWandererB 10-31-06, 06:05 PM	If it helps, TM, the deleted rolls are still available, and you can undelete them.
Zevox 10-31-06, 06:12 PM	@ Macbrea - Went over Annalina/Indrithia vs Kimahri in more detail, and theres a couple of minor errors that, while not fight-affecting, are important for bookkeeping. You have Indrithia use 5 stunning fists in the match, but she can only use four max since shes in fight 2, and I only asked for her to use three (one on alpha strike, two more in flurries). In the wrap-up, Annalina used a powerstone of force screen [ML 2], not a tattoo. Please edit those in so the bookkeeping here is accurate! Zevox
NiQil 10-31-06, 09:31 PM	Keltsat v. Durin in the Arena is up! Sorry to get it in so late, and I suspect someone will have a problem with it, but I don't know what I should have done differently. I think I'm just not particularly skilled in one of the character's styles. There is a large tactical error here that I would like to see corrected. In round 3, Keltsat is attacked in melee. In the following round, you have him attempting to move around the obstacles and rehide. However, my tactics for melee state as follows: If I am ever caught in melee, immediately withdraw. Avoid melee at all costs. I can outrun the horse (which is very comical to me LOL), so do what you have to, but keep me out of melee. In melee, he trips me once and I die. So in round 4, rather than doing what you did, there should have been an immediate withdrawal with 100 ft of movement away with an obstacle between us so that he could not charge at me, also as per my tactics. That could change things rather dramatically, so I would appreciate if this could be altered.
TheMagister 10-31-06, 09:33 PM	No no, please don't do that! I'd rather have Destra just surrender than have the fight held over! Its not worth it to have it held over, particularly in a state of emergency, when I want to deactivate her next week. Please, just have her surrender the fight instead. Zevox All right, but I still think you'd have won it in the end. From your mouth to Pitlord's ears. I'll quote this post in my PM to retract the Extended-ness of the fight. Manzarf wins!
TheMagister 10-31-06, 09:37 PM	Sent to Pitlords: Sorry for the mix up! Zevox retracts his wish to have the fight corrected. Sorry again, and I hope this hasn't caused any more work for you! I'll bump my requested fight total back up to 3 fights for next week. TM I'm sorry you feel this way, Z! I think Destra had a good chance of pulling this one out, mostly by outlasting Manzarf's rage. I'll go in and adjust the rewards according to your surrender. TM
Zevox 10-31-06, 09:37 PM	All right, but I still think you'd have won it in the end. I suspect that too. However, as I've said many times before, nothing is worth having a fight held over to me. In most circumstances I'd rather just get my character into a new fight the following week, and in this case I want to deactivate Destra so Istima can get back into the arena and level up (with the SoE I'm trying to cut down on my activated characters until thats resolved). I don't care a lick about my characters' win/loss record (hell, Destra's is already screwy, since Pitlords marked one of her wins somewhere as a loss on her record), and its always much more fun to fight a new battle each week than to wait multiple weeks for any one to be resolved in my opinion. Thats why I feel this way. Zevox
TheMagister 10-31-06, 09:43 PM	I understand. To me, it's all about bragging rights. I enjoyed the heck out of Sdentch, and she had a good record (about 50/50, which is GREAT for a straight melee build with a crappy Will save), but it's just no fun looking at that "loss" side... Anyhow, the "Results" portion of the post has been edited to include Destra's surrender. Sorry this turned out the way it did. ... I think I'm projecting my anxiety over the WAR guildmaster position into this battle. I feel like I let you down! TM
McJarvis 10-31-06, 10:05 PM	I think I'm projecting my anxiety over the WAR guildmaster position into this battle. I feel like I let you down! I feel you on that.
Macbrea 10-31-06, 10:17 PM	Sorry, about the extra flurries. From reading over the character sheet I thought you had 5 of 5 availble and miss understood that you wanted to use 2 more. Fixed now as last two didn't have any effect anyways. Tattoo changed to stone.
False_Keraptis 10-31-06, 10:42 PM	So in round 4, rather than doing what you did, there should have been an immediate withdrawal with 100 ft of movement away with an obstacle between us so that he could not charge at me, also as per my tactics. In round 4, Keltsat couldn't move 100 feet because he had been tripped and had to spend a move action standing up; as he only had 50 feet of movement to use, I thought it would be best to disappear behind an obstacle in such a way that even if Durin followed, he likely wouldn't get a clear LOS for an autospot. I still don't think it was a terrible move; the dice just didn't cooperate. Sorry, I stand by my call on that one.
False_Keraptis 10-31-06, 10:48 PM	@ NiQil and Maraxus: Looking over the fight again, in round 5 I probably should have ended Keltsat's move in the square immediately southwest of where I did, so that if Durin followed, as he obviously would, he wouldn't get an autospot. I don't have time to correct this tonight, but if you don't mind the fight being held over, I'd be happy to roll a spot v. hide and take it from there. If you want it held over, please reply soon, as I'm just on my way out the door.
NiQil 10-31-06, 10:51 PM	@ NiQil and Maraxus: Looking over the fight again, in round 5 I probably should have ended Keltsat's move in the square immediately southwest of where I did, so that if Durin followed, as he obviously would, he wouldn't get an autospot. I don't have time to correct this tonight, but if you don't mind the fight being held over, I'd be happy to roll a spot v. hide and take it from there. If you want it held over, please reply soon, as I'm just on my way out the door. If you can adjust the fight before pairings, it would be appreciated, but with the SoE, it is not worth holding it over.
False_Keraptis 10-31-06, 10:58 PM	If you can adjust the fight before pairings, it would be appreciated, but with the SoE, it is not worth holding it over. There's a very small chance I'll have an opportunity to adjust it tomorrow morning before pairings; I'll do it if I can. Sorry about this; I definitely should have run this fight earlier.
Abyssal Stalker 11-01-06, 01:41 AM	@TM & Z: Sorry guys! Didn't mean to cause such a mess, I just thought that it would be nice to see Manzarf's overwhelmnigly expensive shield in use for once... It is true that he probably would've needed some luck to win the fight, but I think he still had some kind of chance. I have to say that I don't feel good at all about this "win". If you still wish to change the fight so that Destra is the winner, I'm cool with that. Boy, are we competitive people! Nobody wants to win the fight :)
Maraxus 11-01-06, 09:25 AM	There's a very small chance I'll have an opportunity to adjust it tomorrow morning before pairings; I'll do it if I can. Sorry about this; I definitely should have run this fight earlier. Next week, I have set Noko to ready and since there will be either a state of emergency or very close to it, this is probably, no problem here.
Vathelokai 11-01-06, 10:37 AM	The amazingly late Anixx vs. Besthira guild interception is up. Partly decided by AC, mostly decided by the Dice Gods.
MindWandererB 11-01-06, 01:51 PM	The amazingly late Anixx vs. Besthira guild interception is up. Partly decided by AC, mostly decided by the Dice Gods. Looks good, although I don't feel my tactics were followed the way I intended, I won't argue it (and Iced never does). Just a rule comment, though: a monk with a bite attack has an attack routine that looks like this: unarmed strike/unarmed strike/bite. You can't flurry with the bite, per se. And all attacks take the -2 penalty unless the character has at least 5 levels.
Caterane 11-01-06, 02:07 PM	Thanks for no late fights. That helps us a lot. Please make sure to activate only 1 character and no miniquest.
Zevox 11-01-06, 02:49 PM	Please make sure to activate only 1 character and no miniquest. A pity Asran is on a Guild op that forces him to do a miniquest... :raincloud Zevox