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| TelinArtho09-05-07, 11:54 AM | Fights of the Week: September 5th Please don't edit the sheet after the deadline or you will lose the match. Rules of Gladius All that you need to know is written in the Rules of Gladius. It could be useful also to give a look to the Court Decisions Part 1 and Part 2. Please do not make fake accounts or insult the Elders. Pairings GM MindwandererB will pair the active Characters of Gladius after the deadline. Link to pairings. Make sure that your character is not in prison. Pitlording You should use the CoCo Dice Roller (http://www.hwx.it/wizards.com) for the fight. If you need it, there is a nice template ready to use that will help. You could find the Battle Map Tag Generator (http://www.hwx.it/coco) for dynamic Maps very useful. You must post a link to your fight in this thread when it is complete. If you need a quick and dirty tool to calculate distances between two points (in 2-D or 3-D), this tool used to suffice until it got taken down without giving us proper notification... the Nerve Another useful link is the Quick Access tables for XP and Gold. If a fight needs to be rerun, the Pitlord has to inform the Pitlords account. He cannot react to requests from Players because the other player and the pitlord might disagree. He has no time to read the fight and the discussion. Please keep that in mind. PMs from players with rerun requests won't have an impact. Recent News and Developments Currently being discussed in the Council: Reworking credits/rewards/costs. Comments & Concerns Post any comments or concerns for this weeks fights in this thread. Be kind and courteous to your fellow posters, and don't feed the pitlords. Please remember that they do hard work and consume a lot of time to let you play. Above all, have FUN! If you have questions or comments on any of the changes, please make your posts be heard in the Council of Gladius! |
| templer1009-05-07, 12:02 PM | men i really hope this week Ill get to fight something OTHER then monsters for a change - 2 weeks in a row of that is quite enough... |
| Erithmu09-05-07, 12:03 PM | men i really hope this week Ill get to fight something OTHER then monsters for a change - 2 weeks in a row of that is quite enough...You might tell Longshot that it is September and not August ... |
| templer1009-05-07, 12:05 PM | You might tell Longshot that it is September and not August ... err oops. corrected - ECL 10 might see Elrick vs kervan - Codzila vs druidzila. althrough with Longshot's new cohort - i can identify pretty much anything including who is it's mother and what it had for lunch 5 years ago... |
| TelinArtho09-05-07, 12:12 PM | Well, for my part - I'm only activating one or two characters per week right now. Life is too busy with the campaign, the Denth invasion and real life... (oh yeah - I have 3 kids... and school's starting...). I might get around to activating Kraegin and Sir Valkin again soon, but we'll see. I can't say I really enjoy activating Kraegin to find him auto-dispelled by a dispel psionics... |
| hogarth09-05-07, 12:16 PM | men i really hope this week Ill get to fight something OTHER then monsters for a change - 2 weeks in a row of that is quite enough... You might consider making a few new level 3 characters while you wait for the higher ECL leagues to fill out. There's usually a good number of opponents in the lower levels. |
| templer1009-05-07, 12:18 PM | Well, for my part - I'm only activating one or two characters per week right now. Life is too busy with the campaign, the Denth invasion and real life... (oh yeah - I have 3 kids... and school's starting...). I might get around to activating Kraegin and Sir Valkin again soon, but we'll see. I can't say I really enjoy activating Kraegin to find him auto-dispelled by a dispel psionics... WEll blame the Psionics Rules lol- even i ackgnoladge that Dispel psionics is Wierd and the only somewhat decent defense against it (dispelling buffer) is also a psion power (and 6th level to boot). |
| templer1009-05-07, 12:22 PM | You might consider making a few new level 3 characters while you wait for the higher ECL leagues to fill out. There's usually a good number of opponents in the lower levels. i dont really LIKE the lower ECL's - and i need a new Concept I got a promising Sorcerer but hell need ECL 6 to start being effective. I have some plans for new ECL 3-4's But i dont have the credits for the UA material i need from there. |
| whitebaron09-05-07, 12:28 PM | i dont really LIKE the lower ECL's - and i need a new Concept I got a promising Sorcerer but hell need ECL 6 to start being effective. I have some plans for new ECL 3-4's But i dont have the credits for the UA material i need from there. well, as for me, i find it interesting to actually level a character, not just play him when he's at his best. it's true that some combinations won't work at all at lower ecls, since some combos only kick in at about lvl 5-6 or even higher. but the really exciting thing is, to actually get such a char to lvl 5 or 6 without being a sitting duck - in a real environment, this char might end up dead quite soon/often, and that's why i don't like my campaigns to start at too high level either - people just take feats that are good for now - and don't bother about the problems they'd gotten at ecl 3 with feats still unusable. |
| templer1009-05-07, 12:39 PM | well, as for me, i find it interesting to actually level a character, not just play him when he's at his best. it's true that some combinations won't work at all at lower ecls, since some combos only kick in at about lvl 5-6 or even higher. but the really exciting thing is, to actually get such a char to lvl 5 or 6 without being a sitting duck - in a real environment, this char might end up dead quite soon/often, and that's why i don't like my campaigns to start at too high level either - people just take feats that are good for now - and don't bother about the problems they'd gotten at ecl 3 with feats still unusable. I did Level Most of My chars from ECL 3-4 (all expet longshot who's from 6) And Lorian is actually the first char i Made for CoCo (or the second by a week i dont remmber) The main problem really is i dont have A Firm concept - iam thinking about reworking an Old char Concept (triper/grappler) But he plays A LOT better as part of a team. |
| whitebaron09-05-07, 12:43 PM | well, do you think my 3 ecl3 characters have that firm a concept? :D they just run and grapple, or run and gun, or cast entangle. ;) maybe you'd like to give one character a break, make a fun character, and just level a bit slower? preserves your credits, and gives you a decent chance for at least 1 opponent fight as long as the many denthian attacks continue. ;) |
| TelinArtho09-05-07, 12:47 PM | In case anyone is concerned about the Denthian attacks - they will be slowing down as the groups succeed. I'm not giving specifics yet - but they will start to come down. |
| TheMagister09-05-07, 02:56 PM | They'll slow down for the city and pick up for the groups as the reinforcements are re-routed to intercept the interlopers. {sigh} But then again, that's why they pay us the big bucks, right? |
| lonewolf09-05-07, 03:05 PM | But then again, that's why they pay us the big bucks, right? They do? :confused: :rolleyes: |
| TheMagister09-05-07, 03:57 PM | They do? :confused: :rolleyes: They do me! I got 7500 gp for winning an equal ECL fight with Sdentch! That multiplier really ups the gold you get. :cool: |
| TelinArtho09-05-07, 04:16 PM | Did I miss an announcement? Seems like MWB's running a little late on pairings this week... (not that I need him to rush - what with only one character active and that one is just a holdover from last week...) |
| MindWandererB09-05-07, 04:23 PM | Just a little. My wife's been home for lunch the last few weeks, and family comes first, so I wait for her to go back to work before I do pairings. I'm starting now. BTW... we have 18 fights covered, even with volunteers, and seven holdovers. I think a state of emergency may be unavoidable. |
| TelinArtho09-05-07, 04:27 PM | Just a little. My wife's been home for lunch the last few weeks, and family comes first, so I wait for her to go back to work before I do pairings. I'm starting now. BTW... we have 18 fights covered, even with volunteers, and seven holdovers. I think a state of emergency may be unavoidable. Well I can't argue with that... any day that I'm at home with the family pretty much guarantees I won't be online... (hence the disappearance on most weekends...). The state of emergency is not a surprise to me... we've certainly been flirting with it for a few weeks. |
| Erithmu09-05-07, 04:34 PM | For those of you who are newer to the CoCo, State of Emergency rules are here. Just scroll down a bit. |
| hogarth09-05-07, 04:36 PM | I'll take a fight (level 3 or 4 only, no miniquests). |
| Callix09-05-07, 04:46 PM | I could handle one fight this week. I'd rather it wasn't a miniquest though. |
| TelinArtho09-05-07, 05:41 PM | @Zevox - do you need me to roll up the denth encounters this week? NVM - I don't know who is defending... |
| lonewolf09-05-07, 05:41 PM | * Therador Goldscale (lonewolf) miniquests to join CEF : lonewolf [Miniquest] I believe this needs to be corrected... :rolleyes: |
| MindWandererB09-05-07, 05:42 PM | Pairings are done, and a State of Emergency was avoided, barely. A couple of you got assigned a little more than you wanted but no more than you signed up for; if you can't handle something, be sure to try to pass it off as soon as you realize you can't. Just as I was finishing, I realized that since I didn't have the guild stuff, I ran out of pitlords before getting to the Denth fights this week. Since we made a decision a long time ago that we wouldn't let the guild game interfere with our normal functioning, those fights will have to remain unassigned. If anyone wants to pick them up (after completing any fights you're already down for), post that here and we'll (well, Zevox/Telin) will take care of you. If those fights still have no pitlords by the end of the week, we'll probably have to hold them over in lieu of any new attacks next week. Credits Eamane F2 A-1 Erithmu F2 C3 lonewolf F1 A-2 Macbrea F1 Sjiggie F2 Taureus_Drakken F1 TelinArtho F3 C3 G1 Q-1 templer10 F5 A-1 whitebaron F2 A-1 Callix F1 hogarth F1 MindWandererB A1 G1 NiQil A1 SauroGrenom A1 G1 TheMagister G1 Vathelokai G1 Zevox G1 Key: F=Fight, Q=Quest, C=Campaign, G=Guildmaster, A=Admin or Active Characters |
| MindWandererB09-05-07, 05:45 PM | * Therador Goldscale (lonewolf) miniquests to join CEF : lonewolf [Miniquest] I believe this needs to be corrected... :rolleyes: Right... swapped with Macbrea for Longshot's monster fight. |
| TelinArtho09-05-07, 05:47 PM | Hmm - I guess Spectres in the Bright Sunlight would be considered an Auto-win eh? (Powerless in the sunlight...). Rerolling Elrick's encounter... |
| TelinArtho09-05-07, 05:53 PM | Okay - monster info for both fights are up. Good luck. |
| templer1009-05-07, 05:57 PM | Hmm - I guess Spectres in the Bright Sunlight would be considered an Auto-win eh? (Powerless in the sunlight...). Rerolling Elrick's encounter... Note that Elcik's fight is in the Cavern not the sewer. |
| lonewolf09-05-07, 06:02 PM | @templer: Monster Info is up. |
| templer1009-05-07, 06:05 PM | @templer: Monster Info is up. All i got to say is - good thing my cohort has ego whip otherwise going through 250+ HP would have been a *****. |
| Rauul09-05-07, 06:11 PM | # Brother Ryu (hogarth) vs Random Denthian Monster : Erithmu [Arena] [Week 2] # Gradak Tumblebelly (Sjiggie) vs. Petyr Darry (Callix) : Eamane [Arena] [Week 2] i forwarded the tactics that i had sent to me.. to the proper pitlords i apologize again for being a klutz |
| whitebaron09-05-07, 06:42 PM | monster info for dajeus/eamane posted: 1 large quadruped |
| Salrantol09-05-07, 07:09 PM | @Erithmu: Tactics for Esme Baraksdottir sent via PM. |
| Eluria09-05-07, 08:19 PM | @Sjiggie: Tactics sent for Wroth v. Raelin. Thanks for pitlording |
| waywreth09-05-07, 09:31 PM | Doh! I put ready for August 5th instead of September 5th for Inzin. Would it be possible to make Wisp (c00lz3) vs. Unknown Monster : TelinArtho [Plains] vs. Inzin instead or is it too late? No biggie, I'm going to be sitting out a few weeks after this though with RL stuff and I was hoping to finish the fight cycle. |
| NiQil09-05-07, 10:11 PM | @ hogarth: Tactics for Ryer Ord Star sent via PM. |
| TelinArtho09-05-07, 11:11 PM | Doh! I put ready for August 5th instead of September 5th for Inzin. Would it be possible to make Wisp (c00lz3) vs. Unknown Monster : TelinArtho [Plains] vs. Inzin instead or is it too late? No biggie, I'm going to be sitting out a few weeks after this though with RL stuff and I was hoping to finish the fight cycle. I certainly have no problem with it. PM Pitlords and c00lz3 to make sure it gets done (and that c00lz3 doesn't have an issue). |
| MindWandererB09-06-07, 03:38 AM | Not many people want monster fights... I've gone ahead and made the change. |
| Macbrea09-06-07, 08:15 AM | Relanex Thines (Macbrea) vs. Unknown Monster : templer10 [Plains] I am gonna need more information about the monster then none. :P |
| Callix09-06-07, 08:25 AM | @Sjiggie: Tactics for Ralein vs Wroth sent... Wroth has so many options, and no history to look up. Still, I finally get a fight with a straight numerical advantage. Oh, well. @Eamane: I have lonewolf's tactics, but won't be able to run the fight until Monday morning GMT (Monday arvo my time) if I don't have them by about 8 PM GMT tonight. |
| templer1009-06-07, 08:29 AM | Relanex Thines (Macbrea) vs. Unknown Monster : templer10 [Plains] I am gonna need more information about the monster then none. :P Blah- my food will come soon - ill roll then. |
| Macbrea09-06-07, 08:35 AM | heh.. bet he has to reroll about 3 times! Relanex on the plains is a tough opponent. |
| templer1009-06-07, 09:00 AM | heh.. bet he has to reroll about 3 times! Relanex on the plains is a tough opponent. Monster is rolled - 1 GARGANTUAN Flying Monster - no applicable knowladge - Ill try not to Spread your parts all OVER the plains... |
| Macbrea09-06-07, 09:08 AM | wow.. that limits it down alittle.. heh.. So.. Nature or Psionic.. chuckle. |
| templer1009-06-07, 09:11 AM | wow.. that limits it down alittle.. heh.. So.. Nature or Psionic.. chuckle. ither arent that many Gargantuan creatures in the CR9 list- in fact - i think there is only 1... |
| Macbrea09-06-07, 09:25 AM | Nod... tactics sent. That should be horridly quick in it's favor. 207hp is alot to go through. |
| Nurlithion09-06-07, 11:39 AM | Hey all, I just checked the pairings for this week(I know I'm one day late, I totally forgot, sorry), and my character Nemion didn't get paired for some reason. He is not in jail, so I thought I'd ask here. Thanks in advance for the help! |
| Zevox09-06-07, 11:46 AM | Hey all, I just checked the pairings for this week(I know I'm one day late, I totally forgot, sorry), and my character Nemion didn't get paired for some reason. He is not in jail, so I thought I'd ask here. Thanks in advance for the help! That would be because hes not on the roster. I take it you forgot to PM pitlords and get him put on there? Zevox |
| lonewolf09-06-07, 11:47 AM | Hey all, I just checked the pairings for this week(I know I'm one day late, I totally forgot, sorry), and my character Nemion didn't get paired for some reason. He is not in jail, so I thought I'd ask here. Thanks in advance for the help! I assume you didnt send a PM to pitlords saying that you wanted your character added to the roster, because he isnt. |
| Nurlithion09-06-07, 11:48 AM | Oh damn. Is it too late for this week? |
| templer1009-06-07, 11:53 AM | Nod... tactics sent. That should be horridly quick in it's favor. 207hp is alot to go through. Indeed - BTw - Monster with None in teh treasure entrey still get nothing right? |
| TelinArtho09-06-07, 11:57 AM | Correct t10. |
| whitebaron09-06-07, 12:10 PM | @hogarth: tactics for verren sent. @taureus: tactics for wooly sent. @erithmu: tactics for gwerdan sent. |
| templer1009-06-07, 12:18 PM | Correct t10. ah good- easy fight to run - then. |
| templer1009-06-07, 03:00 PM | Lonewolf - Tactics for longshot are out- iam so ashamed - had to pull out the Eho whip card sigh - going through 200+ HP with that triceratops ridiculesly high Dmg attacks would have been pure suicide. |
| templer1009-06-07, 03:46 PM | Telin- tactics for Elrick vs i think 4 half celstial phase spiders. |
| templer1009-06-07, 05:21 PM | Relanex Becomes Roc food here (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=13691006&postcount=1291) |
| Erithmu09-06-07, 05:28 PM | @salrantol: Clarification for Esme sent |
| Callix09-06-07, 06:42 PM | Alacrity vs Darian Thorne is up. Any comments or corrections sincerely appreciated. |
| Eamane09-06-07, 07:25 PM | Alacrity vs Darian Thorne is up. Any comments or corrections sincerely appreciated. Looks good to me, went about the way I expected it to. @My fighters I've received all tactics, I'll be running the fight that was held over first, which should be up either late tonight or tomorrow afternoon. |
| lonewolf09-07-07, 01:36 AM | Alacrity vs Darian Thorne is up. Any comments or corrections sincerely appreciated. Yes looks good to me. Thanks for running. |
| mucki09-07-07, 04:19 AM | @eamane, in case you haven't startet yet: I sent a small clarification to my tictacs. |
| MindWandererB09-07-07, 06:00 AM | @templer10: Team tactics will be to you a smidge late. It's absurdly late for me right now; I'll finish them up and get them to you as soon as I can, probably within a couple hours after the deadline. We have a strategy, I just have to write it up. |
| templer1009-07-07, 06:27 AM | @templer10: Team tactics will be to you a smidge late. It's absurdly late for me right now; I'll finish them up and get them to you as soon as I can, probably within a couple hours after the deadline. We have a strategy, I just have to write it up. It's okay - i can do the lay overs in the meantime |
| templer1009-07-07, 10:01 AM | Truls vs Yakov is done (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=13698236&postcount=1293) - rather suprising ending. |
| whitebaron09-07-07, 10:31 AM | @tdd: i'll need your tactics before tomorrow, or i'll run snaga with default tactics... tactics for all other chars received... @eamane: you'll probably need some luck for your fight... we'll see how dr5/magic works against your animals... |
| TelinArtho09-07-07, 10:54 AM | Wisp (c00lz3) vs Inzin Dar'ath (waywreth) is up. For once the dice don't kill one of waywreth's characters... |
| waywreth09-07-07, 11:17 AM | Wisp (c00lz3) vs Inzin Dar'ath (waywreth) is up. For once the dice don't kill one of waywreth's characters... The correct quote should have been "For once MY dice don't kill one of waywreth's characters..." Thanks for the run! :P |
| TelinArtho09-07-07, 11:58 AM | Elrick Flamebrother (templer10) vs 4 Half-Celestial Phase Spiders (Unknown Monster) is up. @Waywreth - I don't think I've killed you many times... but maybe that's just because I kill everyone equally... |
| TelinArtho09-07-07, 12:01 PM | @templer10 - I have not received tactics for Lorian yet. I'm just surprised since you seem to have already started on your fights for the week. |
| templer1009-07-07, 12:31 PM | @templer10 - I have not received tactics for Lorian yet. I'm just surprised since you seem to have already started on your fights for the week. errr- knew i forgotten something lol... doing as we speak. |
| hogarth09-07-07, 12:32 PM | --never mind-- |
| Taureus_Drakken09-07-07, 12:36 PM | @Eamane: Just waiting for Shugo-zact tactics, and then I can start it after I get back from work later tonight. 10pm EST. ¬Taureus¬ |
| templer1009-07-07, 01:19 PM | TElin - tactics for lorian are out. |
| Macbrea09-07-07, 01:33 PM | Oh, hey, templer10. Use the pathing I gave you. I wrote my original tactics based off the map in the character thread. Temple map was read incorrectly. |
| whitebaron09-07-07, 02:07 PM | Dajeus vs Celestial Bison is up. see why DR5 is really bad at ECL 3 ah, and yes: tactics for snaga received. since this is gonna be a long night(pick up parents from airport at 1.30 am), the fight may be up in a few hours already. (but now, i'll take a break first.) |
| TheMagister09-07-07, 02:23 PM | Elrick Flamebrother (templer10) vs 4 Half-Celestial Phase Spiders (Unknown Monster) is up. @Waywreth - I don't think I've killed you many times... but maybe that's just because I kill everyone equally... Hey, I know it's not my fight or anything but: Why didn't the phase spiders ever catch Elrick flat-footed? How can Elrick ride for cover if he's flat-footed (he can't). What's preventing the Phase Spiders from doing their normal blinking thing (approach ethereal, shift to material as a move FREE, attack, shift back to ethereal as a free MOVE)? What could Elrick possibly do about it? He can ready, but that limits him to one touch a round. When I saw that monster draw, I thought it'd be an auto-loss for sure for the druid... TM |
| TelinArtho09-07-07, 02:27 PM | Mostly because there's not much I can do with the ethereal and the number of rounds they are allowed outside of the arena (cumulative 10 rounds maximum). Also - I don't think that shifting back would catch him flat-footed (or without dex). I could be wrong - but I don't see anything that would indicate that it allows them to attack as if they were blinking (their ethereal jaunt is very different from blinking). |
| TheMagister09-07-07, 02:31 PM | Um...read the monster description? Unless Elrick can see invisible, he's caught flat-footed each time they shift back to the material. It's the phase spider's speciality. |
| whitebaron09-07-07, 02:32 PM | What's preventing the Phase Spiders from doing their normal blinking thing (approach ethereal, shift to material as a move, attack, shift to ethereal as a free)? this is certainly possible, but: he won't be flatfooted, since he's already aware that there is an enemy. since they turn material before attacking, they get no bonus. Mostly because there's not much I can do with the ethereal and the number of rounds they are allowed outside of the arena (cumulative 10 rounds maximum). well, i guess thats the main problem. the outside-arena stacks for all spiders? then you should this only on the injured ones. ;) |
| Eamane09-07-07, 02:34 PM | Dajeus vs Celestial Bison is up. see why DR5 is really bad at ECL 3 ah, and yes: tactics for snaga received. since this is gonna be a long night(pick up parents from airport at 1.30 am), the fight may be up in a few hours already. (but now, i'll take a break first.) Though it really won't make a difference in this case, in r2 and r4 (Where I have LOS to my opponent and my animal is still alive) I should have thrown a club at it, as per my contingencies. The 'ready to throw an animal' is what to do if none of the contingencies apply, which is why it's listed as the main tactic. And in r6... Why exactly did the bison ignore the closer opponent? Even a celestial bison is um... very far from intelligent enough to attack a caster through a meat-wall shield. Hell, a good deal of int 10 NPCs aren't that smart. You don't have to change anything if you don't want to, as my shot at this indeed, extremely small, but I'd appreciate it if you at least consider these questions in regards to any future fights you run. |
| TheMagister09-07-07, 02:34 PM | this is certainly possible, but: he won't be flatfooted, since he's already aware that there is an enemy. since they turn material before attacking, they get no bonus. Sorry to sound rude, but don't you guys READ?! It's right there in the monster description! well, i guess thats the main problem. the outside-arena stacks for all spiders? then you should this only on the injured ones. ;) It should be 10 rounds cumulative for each monster seperately. It's the only thing that makes sense. |
| whitebaron09-07-07, 02:35 PM | Um...read the monster description? Unless Elrick can see invisible, he's caught flat-footed each time they shift back to the material. It's the phase spider's speciality. no, thats only partially true. in a normal environment, phase spiders grab you out of nowhere, without you expecting them, thats why you are flat-footed. they don't have any special attacks while ethereal, they turn material before they attack, so you won't be flat-footed. |
| Eamane09-07-07, 02:38 PM | Hmm. RAW, the no flat-footed is correct, I think. The druid already knows they are there, so while it is a 'surprise' that they pop out no where, it isn't a 'oh, I'm in combat' surprise. RAI? They should gain the flat-footed effect of blinking since that is exactly what they are doing mechanically. The line between RAW and RAI is generally in the pitlord's hands, which has already decided in this case. |
| TheMagister09-07-07, 02:38 PM | no, thats only partially true. in a normal environment, phase spiders grab you out of nowhere, without you expecting them, thats why you are flat-footed. they don't have any special attacks while ethereal, they turn material before they attack, so you won't be flat-footed. If this is true, then I've been burned by phase spiders for as long as I can remember. |
| TelinArtho09-07-07, 02:39 PM | Well TM - even if that did work the way you are suggesting - it would be of very limited use with the 10 round limit coming into play - and I certainly wouldn't be able to rewrite tactics to correct it (though certain rolls would need to be checked). Still - I don't think it really would work that way. Yes an ethereal phase spider could use it to catch someone flat-footed - ie - get a surprise round, but after initiative is rolled, the opponent would not be denied his dex bonus (well - as soon as his initiative came up anyway). |
| TheMagister09-07-07, 02:39 PM | Hmm. RAW, the no flat-footed is correct, I think. The druid already knows they are there, so while it is a 'surprise' that they pop out no where, it isn't a 'oh, I'm in combat' surprise. RAI? They should gain the flat-footed effect of blinking since that is exactly what they are doing mechanically. The line between RAW and RAI is generally in the pitlord's hands, which has already decided in this case. Hell, it's BETTER than blinking, because it's totally controlled and there's no miss chance! |
| TheMagister09-07-07, 02:41 PM | Well TM - even if that did work the way you are suggesting - it would be of very limited use with the 10 round limit coming into play - and I certainly wouldn't be able to rewrite tactics to correct it (though certain rolls would need to be checked). Still - I don't think it really would work that way. Yes an ethereal phase spider could use it to catch someone flat-footed - ie - get a surprise round, but after initiative is rolled, the opponent would not be denied his dex bonus (well - as soon as his initiative came up anyway). {Shrug} I don't know why I'm so ticked. Anything that makes those bastards less of a pain in the arse I should be in favor of. I used to hate 'em so much I wouldn't even use 'em if I was DM-ing. Thanks for answering my questions. TM |
| whitebaron09-07-07, 02:59 PM | And in r6... Why exactly did the bison ignore the closer opponent? Even a celestial bison is um... very far from intelligent enough to attack a caster through a meat-wall shield. Hell, a good deal of int 10 NPCs aren't that smart. You don't have to change anything if you don't want to, as my shot at this indeed, extremely small, but I'd appreciate it if you at least consider these questions in regards to any future fights you run. as for the bison: it smelled the evil karma within and the wolverine never ever really posed a threat. i always thought celestials should have detect evil as ability... why they don't have it, i don't know. (paladins get it for free at will, and creatures residing in the plane of good don't get it? seems strange) as for continuing differently: i missed the d10 hd of the magical beast (gives +5 overall to the bison), so it has even more hp left. the wolverine will do some damage, and keep the bison for around 3 rounds. if you want me to, i can give the bison a decision roll any time it sees 2 opponents, as AoO are not really a matter that concerns a beast with that thick a hide. It should be 10 rounds cumulative for each monster seperately. It's the only thing that makes sense. i don't know the exact rule here, so i just guessed. as for phase spiders: they for sure are painful - but they are not _that_ good, else their cr would be much higher. flat footed is defined as getting caught unaware... if you know there's someone, and it pops up before it does something, you're definitely not unaware . since dnd has no sighting-rules, you autospot, and thus are not unaware of the coming attack. in other systems, this might give sneak etc., in dnd, it just prevents you from doing any actions while its ethereal (aka every round) |
| Eamane09-07-07, 03:03 PM | as for the bison: it smelled the evil karma within and the wolverine never ever really posed a threat. i always thought celestials should have detect evil as ability... why they don't have it, i don't know. (paladins get it for free at will, and creatures residing in the plane of good don't get it? seems strange) as for continuing differently: i missed the d10 hd of the magical beast (gives +5 overall to the bison), so it has even more hp left. the wolverine will do some damage, and keep the bison for around 3 rounds. if you want me to, i can give the bison a decision roll any time it sees 2 opponents, as AoO are not really a matter that concerns a beast with that thick a hide. My point is, even if AoOs are no concern (How does it know the wolverine is no threat? It's a predator and an enemy! It doesn't know it's not a threat.); it's simply not smart enough to take advantage of that. It's tactics reflect that: Stomp anything it sees. Well, it sees the wolverine and it's closer. So why go past it? No reason. And detecting evil would be cute, but as you say it doesn't have that ability. If it feels anything it fights is evil, isn't it more likely to use the Smite Evil on the animals it's fighting before it gets to Dajeus anyways? Playing a super-intelligent creature is always difficult for DMs, but sometimes playing a stupid creature can be just as hard because it requires consistently making bad decisions. |
| whitebaron09-07-07, 03:09 PM | Playing a super-intelligent creature is always difficult for DMs, but sometimes playing a stupid creature can be just as hard because it requires consistently making bad decisions. my point on this is, that animals shouldn't even be in the arena, since their natural reation to fight would be flight. it wouldn't go looking for an opponent, but search for herbs and grass to feed on. it would feel terribly lonely and the last thing on its mind would be to harm anything. so any insufficient intelligent animal in the arena would be a sitting duck, waiting to be shot or fleeing most of the time, and thus losing to delay-rules. so you really need to reflect something into animals, which aren't even intelligent, as they even get to write tactics?! |
| TelinArtho09-07-07, 03:11 PM | Pitlords should be writing full tactics for monster fights. Tactics that are one-liners will only cause trouble in the end. That the bison in this case has an Int of 3 doesn't make a difference. The pitlord should, at the least, include tactics including priorities and what to do in specific instances that could creep up (grappling, trips, avoidance, etc). |
| whitebaron09-07-07, 03:21 PM | Pitlords should be writing full tactics for monster fights. Tactics that are one-liners will only cause trouble in the end. That the bison in this case has an Int of 3 doesn't make a difference. The pitlord should, at the least, include tactics including priorities and what to do in specific instances that could creep up (grappling, trips, avoidance, etc). well, i could write to always search for the other char, ignore all summons or allies, use a move action after i get attacked by another animal that has more attacks then me, etc. but is this really how it should be done? using metagame information to write tactics just doesn't seem right to me. |
| Eamane09-07-07, 03:29 PM | well, i could write to always search for the other char, ignore all summons or allies, use a move action after i get attacked by another animal that has more attacks then me, etc. but is this really how it should be done? That is your call, but in a word; No. What I'm saying is, your current tactics don't allow for the kind of sophisticated maneuvering that it did. If you submitted sophisticated tactics I would also call foul as it doesn't have sufficient intelligence to 1. plan it or 2. even if someone else planned for it, carry it out. You have very basic tactics and a very intelligent combat action, which don't mix, hence my pointing them out with the intention of you changing them. The longer I look at this fight, the more likely it seems to me that it should be changed. I should have another two attacks before r6, then who knows how long the wolverine will last, given its 28 hitpoints and +4 con after it gets hit (another 6 hps, which will also boost it's damage to 1d4+4, which will only fail to damage on a 1) Hit-points: The celestial template specifically states that hit-dice are not recalculated, so it doesn't have more hit-points. |
| TelinArtho09-07-07, 03:30 PM | As a pitlord - it is in your best interest to have clear, concise tactics. When you are developing tactics for monster fights, you are allowed to look at the player's sheet - so you should know the basic situations that will come up. I don't think anyone is expecting overly-complex tactics, but having specific statements to deal with the basics (how to handle allies, summons, grapples, trips, concentration situations) will make your life much easier. And yes - pitlords should be writing real tactics for their monster fights. |
| Zevox09-07-07, 03:33 PM | @ templer10 - Tactics for Arden Tarmik (vs Gakhnalak Stronjaw & Balthazar Piscou a Griffon) have been PMed. I'm pretty confident about that one - neither Gak nor the Griffon can measure up to Arden on their own, and I think they'll have a tough time of it even together, and their allies are pretty well useless. Zevox |
| whitebaron09-07-07, 03:36 PM | ok, so i have two things here. an elder, who tells me i should use any information i can get to write a devastating tactic. and a player, who would call it a foul if i did so. so what to do? - i always thought that you should do appropriate tactics for the creature, and thus, i feel like the poor bison is severely misplaced in the arena. |
| Sjiggie09-07-07, 03:40 PM | I always look at the Int of the animal. I've run fight wich involved skeleton without an int score so they would just attack anything they would see and in another occassion when I run an adept wich had a normal Int score I wrote normal tactics as I would do for any of mine gladiators. I generally look if it can develop tactics of its own if not it will use his best mean of attacks to damage his opponent. |
| Eamane09-07-07, 03:42 PM | ok, so i have two things here. an elder, who tells me i should use any information i can get to write a devastating tactic. and a player, who would call it a foul if i did so. so what to do? - i always thought that you should do appropriate tactics for the creature, and thus, i feel like the poor bison is severely misplaced in the arena. Clear and concise don't have to be devastating. A clear and concise tactic for the bison would be something like what follows (I've refrained from doing this before since... it's not my place to write tactics for my opponent =/) Starting position: Front and center. Synopsis: Hunt for opponent (clockwise, or towards sound if heard), then charge. Priorities: Attack the closest target. If multiple targets are equally close, attack the one I've attacked already. If I haven't attacked any, determine target randomly. Smite evil use: Animals (other than the fiendish variety) arn't evil, so don't use it on anything that is using it's forelimbs to move. Is that complex? Not really. Is it clear what it wants to do at any given time? I'd think so. I clearly wouldn't object to something along these lines. But you shouldn't take my word for it, it's not my place to propose my opponents tactics. |
| TelinArtho09-07-07, 03:42 PM | I'm not talking about writing a "devastating tactic" - I am talking about writing tactics to cover the basics for lower intelligence creatures. For lower intelligence creatures, the main purpose of the arena should still be there - in order to survive it must defeat opponent x. It gets to know who opponent x is, x's allies, x's general abilities, etc. Therefore - the creature should be given the opportunity to describe what it will do in those basic situations. If we don't have that ability - then yes - non-intelligent and "low" intelligence creatures would have to be removed from the monster lists. Even with somewhat intelligent tactics (which are probably more based on instinct - ie wisdom), animals and templated animals at the lower ECLs are still some of the easiest to handle. |
| templer1009-07-07, 03:43 PM | ok, so i have two things here. an elder, who tells me i should use any information i can get to write a devastating tactic. and a player, who would call it a foul if i did so. so what to do? - i always thought that you should do appropriate tactics for the creature, and thus, i feel like the poor bison is severely misplaced in the arena. FOr animals and no int- i generaly Do 1 liners if it's a strait melee animal and use relevent abilities if it has it (imp grab etc etc) But for intelleigent i generaly write decent tacitcs but nothing 2 fancy since most monsters are stronger then the avrage gladiator in same CR. For classed mosnters i write the best tactics i can since they are much waker then same level gladiator. those are just the guidelines i use so use it or not - up 2 you. |
| whitebaron09-07-07, 03:47 PM | I'm not talking about writing a "devastating tactic" - I am talking about writing tactics to cover the basics for lower intelligence creatures. in this case, i'd do the simplest tactics available, which is in fact devastating. concentrate on the main foe and kill it. easy, no need to be intelligent to only attack 1 and ignore the rest. but i thought the arena should at least in some ways represent the characteristics of a monster - which can't be done for non-predators... |
| hogarth09-07-07, 03:50 PM | @ templer10 - Tactics for Arden Tarmik (vs Gakhnalak Stronjaw & Balthazar Piscou a Griffon) have been PMed. I'm pretty confident about that one - neither Gak nor the Griffon can measure up to Arden on their own, and I think they'll have a tough time of it even together, and their allies are pretty well useless. May Arden's enervations be plentiful and inopportune. :) |
| whitebaron09-07-07, 03:55 PM | i just went over the rules again, there is not even a simple sentence about monster tactics in there. so it all seems to boil down on "decide for your own", which is generally a bad thing as rules go. if i have to do tactics with my personal int, that can be done by the monsters int, it will be much stronger. if i have to do tactics with the monsters int, it likely will loose all the time. so none of these has anything else than a bad taste /feeling to me... |
| Zevox09-07-07, 03:56 PM | May Arden's enervations be plentiful and inopportune. :) Yeah yeah, sorry if I don't have much respect for foes I can kill with only one attack that has almost no possibility of missing :P . Zevox |
| MindWandererB09-07-07, 03:57 PM | @ templer10 - Tactics for Arden Tarmik (vs Gakhnalak Stronjaw & Balthazar Piscou a Griffon) have been PMed. I'm pretty confident about that one - neither Gak nor the Griffon can measure up to Arden on their own, and I think they'll have a tough time of it even together, and their allies are pretty well useless. Zevox And our tactics are now away as well. It will indeed be a challenge, and much will depend on whether we predicted your tactics correctly. If not... we may need quite a bit of luck. |
| Eamane09-07-07, 03:57 PM | in this case, i'd do the simplest tactics available, which is in fact devastating. concentrate on the main foe and kill it. easy, no need to be intelligent to only attack 1 and ignore the rest. but i thought the arena should at least in some ways represent the characteristics of a monster - which can't be done for non-predators... Which is where we disagree. I feel that is an highly intelligent thing to do, given your average intelligence monster (kobolds, orcs, etc) generally don't do that unless directed to do so by a smarter tactician. That is of course, in table-top. In an arena, perhaps everything is topsy-turvy and a creature with int 3 can recognize a true opponent and who to attack and who to not attack. But I certainly wouldn't pitlord it so. Of course, it's natural that I should disagree, given it's me thats on the line, eh? |
| whitebaron09-07-07, 04:02 PM | well, it all jumps down to the "how should monster tactics be written"? which is nowhere to be found. since i am allowed to play my characters as i want it, even if they are dumb to the bone, i guess the line would be more like "do any tactic you like and the animal is capable to do" - a handle animal is capable to attack only one opponent, and ignore the others - so is an animal fight in the arena like fighting vs a handled animal that gets instructions within the trick-range as free action? + mwb's opinion would be greatly appreciated on this. |
| MindWandererB09-07-07, 04:13 PM | This is actually the kind of discussion I prefer to stay out of, when possible. If it becomes an admin thing--an official set of guidelines to be posted in the rules, for instance--I'll get involved (and it should go to the council). But on things like this that are so much judgment... well, I have more productive ways to spend my limited time and energy. Unless my character is involved, of course. :) |
| whitebaron09-07-07, 04:26 PM | This is actually the kind of discussion I prefer to stay out of, when possible. If it becomes an admin thing--an official set of guidelines to be posted in the rules, for instance--I'll get involved (and it should go to the council). But on things like this that are so much judgment... well, I have more productive ways to spend my limited time and energy. Unless my character is involved, of course. :) it's not about personal judgement. it's about how you are supposed to do monster's tactics as pitlord, and what you are allowed to do or what you should do. to take the celestial bison vs. phrenic evil barbarian example. i know that one hit ends this fight. maybe two, if he's lucky. so should i as pitlord be allowed or required to write tactics like i'd do for a character, even if it is completely out of character for the animal, and far beyond its normal intellectual properties? this is not only about personal flavor or style. its also about CR and their application to the arena. if an else stupid animal is played as intelligently as i can figure it out, most likely it will win the fight, since normally its other (increased) stats make up for the lacking fight-intelligence. @: since there's currently a discussion starting in the council, i'd say i'll wait for whatever the outcome of the council-posts is. |
| templer1009-08-07, 02:38 PM | Maya vs Yorick is done (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=13711662&postcount=1296) |
| Rauul09-08-07, 03:35 PM | @: since there's currently a discussion starting in the council, i'd say i'll wait for whatever the outcome of the council-posts is. Little problem with that... Sometimes the elders will take a month to decide something.. Not being mean.. but they get pulled off track at times.. :) Maybe a little complicated but you could always do an int check d20+- thier Int modifer to see if they would do an act, thats outside thier basic tactics os find and kill.. |
| MindWandererB09-08-07, 04:17 PM | Maya vs Yorick is done (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=13711662&postcount=1296) I see I'll have to define "lull" better in the future. And I forgot to check exactly how wide that lava was--forgot it was only 5 feet. Although Maya's Jump modifier is wrong--her armor slows her down, making it a -7. Still not smart. |
| whitebaron09-08-07, 04:41 PM | really sorry, rauul - the dice went completely against you. snaga vs sleeping beauty is up. |
| Rauul09-08-07, 05:44 PM | really sorry, rauul - the dice went completely against you. snaga vs sleeping beauty is up. Will rolls will forever be my weakness till i get some bonuses.. TY for the run... |
| hogarth09-08-07, 10:07 PM | Ryer Ord Star vs. Verren FireStarter is finished. If anyone has questions, comments, or concerns, let me know. |
| Eamane09-08-07, 11:33 PM | Gradak Tumblebelly vs Petyr Darry is up here (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=13716735&postcount=1299). Note that I didn't say finished, I still need to count up the arrows. Also, many of the numbers in the roller are slightly off due me being forgetful of things (like cover bonuses to AC), but the results in the fight itself should always reflect the truth of the matter. |
| Taureus_Drakken09-09-07, 02:42 AM | Wooly vs Shugo-zact is up here. (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=13707334&postcount=1295) The roller was crazy this week. Let me know if you spot anything amiss. ¬Taureus¬ |
| whitebaron09-09-07, 03:43 AM | Ryer Ord Star vs. Verren FireStarter is finished. If anyone has questions, comments, or concerns, let me know. i missed the wand of magic missile - seems to be acquired between the fights 3+4. ;) and twice max damage was way too much. as a side note, i should have started in the other corner of my square, but this is not important. Wooly vs Shugo-zact is up here. (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=13707334&postcount=1295) The roller was crazy this week. Let me know if you spot anything amiss. ¬Taureus¬ well, dice luck... what can i say. btw: can anyone point out to me the place of the exact rules when dealing with scrolls and how many hands you need to have free? i somehow feel that having a scroll in one hand and having the other one free for somatic components is !$§%/ up. I guess, there are no real rules for this, just indications that it might be done like that. |
| Salrantol09-09-07, 08:26 AM | Spell Completion: This is the activation method for scrolls. A scroll is a spell that is mostly finished. The preparation is done for the caster, so no preparation time is needed beforehand as with normal spellcasting. All that’s left to do is perform the finishing parts of the spellcasting (the final gestures, words, and so on). To use a spell completion item safely, a character must be of high enough level in the right class to cast the spell already. If he can’t already cast the spell, there’s a chance he’ll make a mistake. Activating a spell completion item is a standard action and provokes attacks of opportunity exactly as casting a spell does.Note that a spell with no somatic components can be cast from a scroll without a hand free. |
| whitebaron09-09-07, 08:58 AM | Note that a spell with no somatic components can be cast from a scroll without a hand free. hmm, this still doesn't clearly state you cannot do the movement with your hand holding the scroll, but as i've been told before, that's the coco-interpretation of this. it is somehow strange, that the material components are already within the scrolls, but the gestures have still to be provided. i always thought, you read the scroll, and that's about it. one hand free for reading it, done. |
| hogarth09-09-07, 09:26 AM | as a side note, i should have started in the other corner of my square, but this is not important. Hmm...to me, "right corner" means "east corner". Did you mean "right corner (Verren's right, assuming that he's facing the centre of the arena)"? |
| whitebaron09-09-07, 10:47 AM | Hmm...to me, "right corner" means "east corner". Did you mean "right corner (Verren's right, assuming that he's facing the centre of the arena)"? right corner always is related to the facing of the person, so front right = south-west corner for box 1, nw for 2, ne for 3, se for 4. or how else could you start in box 2 or 4 front right - top right is certainly not the same. especially with the going counter-clockwise, starting in east square and then moving to west, seems like no good choice. but as i already said, this is not important. |
| hogarth09-09-07, 12:09 PM | right corner always is related to the facing of the person. Well, there is no facing in D&D 3.5. Maybe "clockwise" and "counterclockwise" are less ambiguous. |
| Macbrea09-09-07, 12:17 PM | @templer10: On the Relanex fight can I get you to add in his Political Career for +34% bonus to xp and gold. It should make the match worth 1206xp, 2010gp |
| whitebaron09-09-07, 12:24 PM | Well, there is no facing in D&D 3.5. Maybe "clockwise" and "counterclockwise" are less ambiguous. well, as per the rules, yes. but i don't see anyone facing (if they could, they would) anywhere else than towards the middle. why should they, that's where the action is about to take place. |
| lonewolf09-09-07, 02:53 PM | Longshot vs Halfdragon Triceratops is up. In retrospect, on the forest map I probably should have rerolled the huge monster. |
| templer1009-09-07, 03:09 PM | Longshot vs Halfdragon Triceratops is up. In retrospect, on the forest map I probably should have rerolled the huge monster. Hey- thanks for the run - i think rewards are wrong - 28% rewards bonus-22.2222% ally penalty means 5.78% bonus 3300X1.0578=3490 XP also- memorph used a stone of share pain. |
| lonewolf09-09-07, 04:01 PM | Hey- thanks for the run - i think rewards are wrong - 28% rewards bonus-22.2222% ally penalty means 5.78% bonus 3300X1.0578=3490 XP also- memorph used a stone of share pain. fixed |
| Callix09-10-07, 03:28 AM | Eamane: What's Petyr's d20 roll in the setup? If that's moved down, either Gradak's or Petyr's first shot is a hit. Not sure whose, but the confirmation roll would then miss and the fight return to normal. If that's Petyr's hit, he would win on average damage rolls. If not, it'd speed up his end. Either way, it affects the fight. |
| Eamane09-10-07, 03:48 AM | Eamane: What's Petyr's d20 roll in the setup? If that's moved down, either Gradak's or Petyr's first shot is a hit. Not sure whose, but the confirmation roll would then miss and the fight return to normal. If that's Petyr's hit, he would win on average damage rolls. If not, it'd speed up his end. Either way, it affects the fight. It was an errant roll accidentally entered when I resumed the fight after a break (hence it being in round 0, which is the default). As it was an incomplete roll and I was about 2 pages into the roll results, I decided to discard it rather than page-back and find out the result. But since you remind me, I'll do the ammunition survival rolls now. Edit: And done. Gradak recovered 12 of his 19 missing arrows, Petyr got 4 of his 9 missing bullets back. Fight has been updated with 3FC information blocks in the conclusion. |
| Callix09-10-07, 04:57 AM | In that case, it's fine. Sorry to bother you about it. |
| Eamane09-10-07, 05:56 AM | In that case, it's fine. Sorry to bother you about it. No problem. I'm always open to discussion on my fights, otherwise I might as well not check the board after posting them for the week. neh? ;) |
| templer1009-10-07, 05:28 PM | Gakhnalak + gryphon VS arden is done (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=13732742&postcount=1301)- the real fight took 2 rounds the - rest- Me getting annoyed with 2 many grapple rolls... p.s if any mistakes ill correct tommarow. |
| MindWandererB09-10-07, 10:00 PM | Gakhnalak + gryphon VS arden is done (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=13732742&postcount=1301)- the real fight took 2 rounds the - rest- Me getting annoyed with 2 many grapple rolls... p.s if any mistakes ill correct tommarow. I have no problem. We gambled that Arden would go with ranged combat, and it failed to pay off. Just one question: prone underwater... is it even possible to attack someone in that situation? I'd think they'd have total cover. |
| Erithmu09-11-07, 01:29 AM | Ryu vs Denth Smash and Grab ... |
| templer1009-11-07, 01:50 AM | I have no problem. We gambled that Arden would go with ranged combat, and it failed to pay off. Just one question: prone underwater... is it even possible to attack someone in that situation? I'd think they'd have total cover. this is pretty shallow water here - i think Improved cover is enough for it. Also - For the life of me i didnt get that Whole slugging 15 feet per round in the water thing Why didnt you just head to the swamp CLOSE to the water - even if you were right and he went for ranged at worst you would have lost 1 round and then you could have hidden in the water. |
| Erithmu09-11-07, 02:12 AM | 2Fist vs Esme More smash and grab. |
| Eamane09-11-07, 03:33 AM | Krusk vs Maeglin is up here (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=13741566&postcount=1304). A lucky barbarian vs a servant of the Drowning Deep. Which has more power, a fish out of the sea or a mighty orc warrior with rippling thews of pure rage? |
| mucki09-11-07, 06:07 AM | Thanks for the run Eamane. |
| whitebaron09-11-07, 06:30 AM | 2Fist vs Esme More smash and grab. well, there is nothing else to await from this char... |
| hogarth09-11-07, 06:51 AM | Ryu vs Denth Smash and Grab ... One minor comment -- I think you might've forgotten to apply the mephit's DR 5/magic. |
| Sjiggie09-11-07, 07:35 AM | Can someone take over the fight: Ralein Dreamstriker vs Wroth Kortek I won't be able to finish it before the deadline and maybe not even before the next pairings. I'm still working on the all vs all from last week. Here are the tactics: My first fight with Wroth; curious to see how things go. Please note: Lighting only applies to ECL5+, so no penalties from bright light. Start in front center of square, hoping to gain LoS to two other squares, holding wand of expeditious retreat and shield, prone. Goals: Debuff and hope that evens the melee odds. Offensive plan: Doom, Summon Monster I (Fiendish monster spider, small) when close enough to him (within 60', make it as close to him as possible), spider nets him (repeat until successful, then move to melee), use wand of ray of enfeeblement until hit, then close and melee him until one of us dies. Rd 1: Expeditious retreat from wand, stow wand, stand Rd 2: Draw wand of ray of enfeeblement, cast Doom if he's within range; otherwise ready to cast Doom when he comes into range. Rd 3: Each round, single move to max range for doom (130'), cast doom within range, or ready action to cast doom when he is within range. Once doom is cast (whether or not it works), close for SMI [ideally within 30' to allow summoning monster right near him; if not possible, just get to within 60' to start summoning]; SMI for fiendish small monstrous spider. Spider's actions are: Web until successful, then close and melee, using Smite Good on first melee attack [flank if possible, don't delay any of the above to do so] Once spider is summoned (or SMI fails), use wand of RoE repeatedly until it hits him. Then stow wand, draw morningstar [note: poisoned], close and melee him until one of us dies. FIENDISH MONSTROUS SPIDER, SMALL Small Magical Beast (Extraplanar) Hit Dice: 1d8 (4 hp) Initiative:+3 Speed: 30 ft. (6 squares), climb 20 ft. Armor Class: 14 (+1 size, +3 Dex), touch 14, flat-footed 11 Base Attack/Grapple: +0/-6 Attack: Bite +4 melee (1d4-2 plus poison) Full Attack: Bite +4 melee (1d4-2 plus poison) Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft. Special Attacks: Poison, web, Smite Good 1/day (+1 damage) Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., tremorsense 60 ft., vermin traits, Cold and Fire Resistance 5, Spell Resistance 6 Saves: Fort +2, Ref +3, Will +0 Abilities: Str 7, Dex 17, Con 10, Int 3, Wis 10, Cha 2 Skills: Climb +11, Hide +11*, Jump -2*, Spot +4* Feats: Weapon FinesseB For poison, web, see SRD or MM Notes: --Always use obstacles for cover when approaching if at all possible, but don't sacrifice the goal of closing to specific ranges as noted above --Always 5' step to avoid AoOs if possible --Please don't forget secondary saves vs. poison --Please note if his strength drops he may become encumbered, which reduces not only speed but also max dex bonus to AC [to +3]; this stacks with penalties from reduced dex [from entangling in web/net/tanglefoot], and with penalties from doom, and being entangled in general. I'm seeing at this point Wroth may struggle, as even if everything goes well, at best, it becomes a roughly even fight... that doesn't bode well. Good luck, and please PM me any questions! Thanks for pitlording, -e Note: I forgot to denote as used the medium spider venom applied as prebuff, as well as the black adder venom. I will fix that after the fight Thanks for pitlording, but... Ouch. Wand of Exp. Retreat, Ray of Enfeeblement, poisons and summons? Better use my high AC and to-hit to my advantage. Start front and centre, bow drawn, mind blade imbued and dismissed. Wroth is my dodge target, so he needs a 20 to hit me with the crossbow, or a 14 with a ray. Move out immediately, heading towards the centre. If I see him, stop moving and start shooting. If I don't, try to hide in the centre and snipe him. It's +4 on his spot to -9 on my hide, but you never know. Once he's aware of me, my tactics depend on him. If he's still got two wands out, or he has his crossbow out, start a ranged battle. Shoot at him, then single-move away. Don't end a move within 50ft of him while using these tactics. Continue until he's dead or he switches weapons. If he's got the morningstar out, shoot at him if he can't charge me. If I don't see him before his first turn, assume he has Expeditious Retreat up until proven otherwise. Once he's within his charge range (100ft with Exp. Retreat, 40ft without), drop the bow, draw a mind blade and ready an attack for if an opponent comes within reach. Melee from here, using move actions to renew Psychic Strike as needed. If he doesn't close, move towards him and ready until I'm within charge range. Use CLW potions when below 10hp. Attack summons if and only if they are the only melee targets available. If he goes invisible, remember that I still get spot checks vs DC 20 if he moves, and a +2 Listen against his -3 Move Silently. If I can pinpopint him, I'll bear the 50% miss chance with ranged weapons, but I won't give him a flat-footed melee attack. Aside from that, try to break LOS from last known position, then move to new hiding spots. Thanks again, and sorry for the mammoth tactics. |
| Sjiggie09-11-07, 08:21 AM | Looks like I can't finish the Free for all before the deadline today but it will be up before the next pairings. Sorry for the inconvenience. -Sjiggie |
| Salrantol09-11-07, 08:40 AM | 2Fist vs Esme More smash and grab.Salrantol: I didn't stow the wand as you wouldn't have gotten it back out in the grapple (Opposed Grap check to draw a light weapon in a grapple).You seem to have missed the point of stowing the wand--it was to use the scroll, the average damage of which would be enough to knock him unconscious after he tried to grapple me. |
| Erithmu09-11-07, 09:36 AM | One minor comment -- I think you might've forgotten to apply the mephit's DR 5/magic. I did ... doesn't make a difference 9Subdual + 9-5 still staggers the creature (due to subdual) and it is in a grapple ... so first action it tries to make will have it go into KO land |
| Erithmu09-11-07, 09:44 AM | You seem to have missed the point of stowing the wand--it was to use the scroll, the average damage of which would be enough to knock him unconscious after he tried to grapple me. Edited: I rolled the Scorching Ray instead of that lass MM, you didn't kill him, and then you die on the next hit in rnd6 still (technically that is a crit and I need to confirm it as well for another 1d6+4) ... No change. |
| whitebaron09-11-07, 10:00 AM | well, dice luck on the first two rolls with mm, bad luck with the scorching ray... it could have been a draw on average damage, since gwerdan would not have backed down. ;) once you're in the grapple, without weapon, its over. the chances to draw a weapon are meager at most, and to escape the grapple... well... +2 vs +16... |
| Salrantol09-11-07, 10:20 AM | Right, but if I get in the grapple with you having that much HP left, it's over anyway--there's no way I'm getting enough damage out of CL1 magic missiles to take you down before you KO me. |
| whitebaron09-11-07, 10:22 AM | Right, but if I get in the grapple with you having that much HP left, it's over anyway--there's no way I'm getting enough damage out of CL1 magic missiles to take you down before you KO me. right, this was your best shot. and i was only lucky... ranged magic is actually a problem to me... hp are not as high as i would want them(due to LA), and i don't want to buy some costly vigor items... |
| TelinArtho09-11-07, 12:28 PM | Looks like I can't finish the Free for all before the deadline today but it will be up before the next pairings. Sorry for the inconvenience. -Sjiggie I have to say I am concerned about how the rolls are looking - since I see a number of rolls that look like Bulgar should be hitting with and yet no damage rolls with them... of course, I can't really be sure without seeing the fight - but its all I have to go with right now. |
| templer1009-11-07, 12:35 PM | I have to say I am concerned about how the rolls are looking - since I see a number of rolls that look like Bulgar should be hitting with and yet no damage rolls with them... of course, I can't really be sure without seeing the fight - but its all I have to go with right now. iam pretty concerned 2 - i see several rolls that should have hit for liara. |
| hogarth09-11-07, 12:58 PM | Gakhnalak + gryphon VS arden is done (http://forums.gleemax.com/showpost.php?p=13732742&postcount=1301)- the real fight took 2 rounds the - rest- Me getting annoyed with 2 many grapple rolls... p.s if any mistakes ill correct tommarow. I noticed a few mistakes, but nothing that could turn the tide. If only the Hideous Laughter had gone off before Mr. Strongjaw's unfortunate demise... |
| TelinArtho09-11-07, 02:34 PM | Kervan Sheharath (MindWandererB) vs Lord Lorian (templer10) is up. |
| Eluria09-11-07, 04:04 PM | Can someone take over the fight: Ralein Dreamstriker vs Wroth Kortek I won't be able to finish it before the deadline and maybe not even before the next pairings. I'm still working on the all vs all from last week. Here are the tactics: My first fight with Wroth; curious to see how things go. Please note: Lighting only applies to ECL5+, so no penalties from bright light. Start in front center of square, hoping to gain LoS to two other squares, holding wand of expeditious retreat and shield, prone. Goals: Debuff and hope that evens the melee odds. Offensive plan: Doom, Summon Monster I (Fiendish monster spider, small) when close enough to him (within 60', make it as close to him as possible), spider nets him (repeat until successful, then move to melee), use wand of ray of enfeeblement until hit, then close and melee him until one of us dies. Rd 1: Expeditious retreat from wand, stow wand, stand Rd 2: Draw wand of ray of enfeeblement, cast Doom if he's within range; otherwise ready to cast Doom when he comes into range. Rd 3: Each round, single move to max range for doom (130'), cast doom within range, or ready action to cast doom when he is within range. Once doom is cast (whether or not it works), close for SMI [ideally within 30' to allow summoning monster right near him; if not possible, just get to within 60' to start summoning]; SMI for fiendish small monstrous spider. Spider's actions are: Web until successful, then close and melee, using Smite Good on first melee attack [flank if possible, don't delay any of the above to do so] Once spider is summoned (or SMI fails), use wand of RoE repeatedly until it hits him. Then stow wand, draw morningstar [note: poisoned], close and melee him until one of us dies. FIENDISH MONSTROUS SPIDER, SMALL Small Magical Beast (Extraplanar) Hit Dice: 1d8 (4 hp) Initiative:+3 Speed: 30 ft. (6 squares), climb 20 ft. Armor Class: 14 (+1 size, +3 Dex), touch 14, flat-footed 11 Base Attack/Grapple: +0/-6 Attack: Bite +4 melee (1d4-2 plus poison) Full Attack: Bite +4 melee (1d4-2 plus poison) Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft. Special Attacks: Poison, web, Smite Good 1/day (+1 damage) Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., tremorsense 60 ft., vermin traits, Cold and Fire Resistance 5, Spell Resistance 6 Saves: Fort +2, Ref +3, Will +0 Abilities: Str 7, Dex 17, Con 10, Int 3, Wis 10, Cha 2 Skills: Climb +11, Hide +11*, Jump -2*, Spot +4* Feats: Weapon FinesseB For poison, web, see SRD or MM Notes: --Always use obstacles for cover when approaching if at all possible, but don't sacrifice the goal of closing to specific ranges as noted above --Always 5' step to avoid AoOs if possible --Please don't forget secondary saves vs. poison --Please note if his strength drops he may become encumbered, which reduces not only speed but also max dex bonus to AC [to +3]; this stacks with penalties from reduced dex [from entangling in web/net/tanglefoot], and with penalties from doom, and being entangled in general. I'm seeing at this point Wroth may struggle, as even if everything goes well, at best, it becomes a roughly even fight... that doesn't bode well. Good luck, and please PM me any questions! Thanks for pitlording, -e Note: I forgot to denote as used the medium spider venom applied as prebuff, as well as the black adder venom. I will fix that after the fight Thanks for pitlording, but... Ouch. Wand of Exp. Retreat, Ray of Enfeeblement, poisons and summons? Better use my high AC and to-hit to my advantage. Start front and centre, bow drawn, mind blade imbued and dismissed. Wroth is my dodge target, so he needs a 20 to hit me with the crossbow, or a 14 with a ray. Move out immediately, heading towards the centre. If I see him, stop moving and start shooting. If I don't, try to hide in the centre and snipe him. It's +4 on his spot to -9 on my hide, but you never know. Once he's aware of me, my tactics depend on him. If he's still got two wands out, or he has his crossbow out, start a ranged battle. Shoot at him, then single-move away. Don't end a move within 50ft of him while using these tactics. Continue until he's dead or he switches weapons. If he's got the morningstar out, shoot at him if he can't charge me. If I don't see him before his first turn, assume he has Expeditious Retreat up until proven otherwise. Once he's within his charge range (100ft with Exp. Retreat, 40ft without), drop the bow, draw a mind blade and ready an attack for if an opponent comes within reach. Melee from here, using move actions to renew Psychic Strike as needed. If he doesn't close, move towards him and ready until I'm within charge range. Use CLW potions when below 10hp. Attack summons if and only if they are the only melee targets available. If he goes invisible, remember that I still get spot checks vs DC 20 if he moves, and a +2 Listen against his -3 Move Silently. If I can pinpopint him, I'll bear the 50% miss chance with ranged weapons, but I won't give him a flat-footed melee attack. Aside from that, try to break LOS from last known position, then move to new hiding spots. Thanks again, and sorry for the mammoth tactics. Bumping Sjiggie's request here; obviously it's late, but if anyone has time to run this fight, I'd love to not get it held over. Thanks! |
| Taureus_Drakken09-11-07, 04:51 PM | I would rather not have my miniquest held over another week. Is there any way that someone can step in and finish it? ¬Taureus¬ |
| Sjiggie09-12-07, 05:52 AM | I have to say I am concerned about how the rolls are looking - since I see a number of rolls that look like Bulgar should be hitting with and yet no damage rolls with them... of course, I can't really be sure without seeing the fight - but its all I have to go with right now. iam pretty concerned 2 - i see several rolls that should have hit for liara. Sorry guys but your rolls didn't hit I double checked it |
| templer1009-12-07, 05:58 AM | Sorry guys but your rolls didn't hit I double checked it a result of 29 on the roller didnt hit?.... if you say so (round 18). p.s. - you will finish it before Edit deadline i hope? |
| Sjiggie09-12-07, 06:06 AM | Yes it doesn't hit I'm working on it now so when it is finished (before the deadline) you can look it up |
| TelinArtho09-12-07, 10:15 AM | I see a couple of things that I would like to see altered if the fight is edited (it wouldn't change the result as far as I can tell - but if other edits are going in - I would like to have it included): In round 6, Enoch doesn't seem to spot Bulgar before Bulgar shoots, so he shouldn't have his dex bonus to AC. AC10+5(armor)+1(shield)+3(deflection (SoF))+6(natural (AS))+4 (shield (shield spell)) = 28. Looks to me that it should be a hit. Also, once Enoch is close in with Liara - my priority of targets should have switched accordingly. |
| Erithmu09-12-07, 10:20 AM | I see a couple of things that I would like to see altered if the fight is edited (it wouldn't change the result as far as I can tell - but if other edits are going in - I would like to have it included): In round 6, Enoch doesn't seem to spot Bulgar before Bulgar shoots, so he shouldn't have his dex bonus to AC. AC10+5(armor)+1(shield)+3(deflection (SoF))+6(natural (AS))+4 (shield (shield spell)) = 28. Looks to me that it should be a hit. Also, once Enoch is close in with Liara - my priority of targets should have switched accordingly.I think you also get +2 to your attacks from being considered 'invisible' Also I think Enoch has to be w/in 40ft of Bulgar to attack him due to the light spell and vision issues. |
| TelinArtho09-12-07, 10:30 AM | You only get a +2 when invisible or when your opponent cannot see at all (not just when someone is hidden and sniping). Good point on the latter, but I don't think that will make much difference either... Bulgar can't reliably hit that AC and Magic missile tears through him... |
| Erithmu09-12-07, 10:37 AM | You only get a +2 when invisible or when your opponent cannot see at all (not just when someone is hidden and sniping). Good point on the latter, but I don't think that will make much difference either... Bulgar can't reliably hit that AC and Magic missile tears through him...What I'm saying is that Enoch can't see beyond 40 ft (light radius) so effectively Bulgar is invisible to Enoch. |
| Salrantol09-12-07, 02:44 PM | @Sjiggie: Can you link to the setup in the FFA? That's a long way to dig back to find it.... |