| Post/Author/DateTime | Post |
|---|---|
| Sindorin02-17-05, 12:53 PM | The deadline is in 3 hours, folks, then pairings will be made. It will be a bit more crunched than normal (one day less for tactic writing), so please make sure your tactics are sent as promptly and thoroughly as possible (the thorough part seems to be something the devil of luck wishes me to work on). In other news... umm... *dances* |
| Land Outcast02-17-05, 02:20 PM | Hey people a small question, lets suppose I've got a 3rd level wizard with intelligence +4, thus spells prepared= 4/3/2/+1/+1 and I also have empower spell, could I, let's say... empower scorching ray with my bonus 4th level slot... sounds eeeeevil, but... is it possible? Stares at Sindorin's dance... |
| Jindl02-17-05, 02:29 PM | Hey people a small question, lets suppose I've got a 3rd level wizard with intelligence +4, thus spells prepared= 4/3/2/+1/+1 and I also have empower spell, could I, let's say... empower scorching ray with my bonus 4th level slot... sounds eeeeevil, but... is it possible? Stares at Sindorin's dance... You don't gain access to your 3rd and 4th level bonus slots until you can cast 3rd and 4th level spells. So you can actually only prepare: 4/2+b/1+b And you would have 7/3=2.33 -> 3 spell levels available to cast during your fight. -Jindl |
| spasheridan02-17-05, 02:30 PM | @Land- In as few words as possible... No. |
| T'Var02-17-05, 02:31 PM | Hey people a small question, lets suppose I've got a 3rd level wizard with intelligence +4, thus spells prepared= 4/3/2/+1/+1 and I also have empower spell, could I, let's say... empower scorching ray with my bonus 4th level slot... sounds eeeeevil, but... is it possible? Stares at Sindorin's dance... umm well since your only 3rd lvl you dont have a 4th lvl spell slot so no your spells prepared would look like: 4/4/3. not: 4/3/2/+1/+1 EDIT Grrr! Grrr! at the fast fingered Jindl |
| Dalton Onestone02-17-05, 02:37 PM | spells prepared= 4/3/2/+1/+1 If you look at the tables of spell slots for bards or rangers, you quickly see that "0" and "-" don't mean the same thing. |
| Land Outcast02-17-05, 02:40 PM | You sure, I mean, the idea arose from the Epic level handbook and A feat that allows you to have higher spell slots as bonus slots. (I understood the purpose of the slots was to metamagic spells up, if not, what would you do with a 13th lvl slot?) |
| Land Outcast02-17-05, 02:43 PM | Found the feat (epic): improved spell capacity |
| T'Var02-17-05, 02:44 PM | You sure, I mean, the idea arose from the Epic level handbook and A feat that allows you to have higher spell slots as bonus slots. (I understood the purpose of the slots was to metamagic spells up, if not, what would you do with a 13th lvl slot?) so use anything from the Epic level book 99.9999% you have to be..............Epic Level. (epic): improved spell capacity this means you have to be Epic to be able to take it |
| Huan02-17-05, 02:47 PM | @Land So, refresh the spellcasting rules, keep in mind the cap on spell slots per fight, and good luck in your debut match. :) @Jindl and Splasheridan Man, it IS a bit confusing when you guys post one after another (sometimes, when scanning posts quickly, you can identify who's post is who's by their pic) ... but, I guess that makes me easy to pick out of a crowd, heh heh :cool: |
| Land Outcast02-17-05, 02:48 PM | I'm not that dumb, epic feat can be taken by who?... Epic character But I just made me think, as by normal rules those estra slots would be useless. @Huan: Tnx |
| Jindl02-17-05, 02:50 PM | @Jindl and Splasheridan Man, it IS a bit confusing when you guys post one after another (sometimes, when scanning posts quickly, you can identify who's post is who's by their pic) ... but, I guess that makes me easy to pick out of a crowd, heh heh :cool: Well, they say that mimicry is the highest form of flattery. (And I like to think that Splash saw how cool my avatar was before he chose it for himself ;) |
| Land Outcast02-17-05, 02:56 PM | Just hope I don't have to fight something psionic, I'm just now opening the SRD to know bout them... Learn bout 'em, if not... "Died by poor tactics, he seemed not to know what a wielder could do" |
| spasheridan02-17-05, 03:33 PM | Well, they say that mimicry is the highest form of flattery. (And I like to think that Splash saw how cool my avatar was before he chose it for himself ;) NOW Jindl.. we both joined in Aug 03, so maybe you are mimicing me. I'm so flattered! :D |
| SnarkHunter02-17-05, 03:57 PM | I can think of only one way to settle this dispute: Steel. Cage. Match. Yes. Oh my yes. |
| T'Var02-17-05, 04:00 PM | Two men enter...One man leaves Two men enter...One man leaves Two men enter...One man leaves Two men enter...One man leaves Two men enter...One man leaves Two men enter...One man leaves Two men enter...One man leaves Welcome....to....CoCo Dome |
| Ayatoshi02-17-05, 04:58 PM | If the fights haven't been done I'd like to add Ikari and Sainghai, my new chara to the list yes I know that Ikariu has the wrong xp and that it should be 41oo |
| SnarkHunter02-17-05, 05:07 PM | Don't forget to PM the pitlords. |
| OdinTheReaper02-17-05, 05:31 PM | is it too late to edit..i just got off work (from 7am-515pm, eastern time zone) |
| Dalton Onestone02-17-05, 05:34 PM | You could hedge your bets and post an edited version here. |
| T'Var02-17-05, 05:38 PM | is it too late to edit..i just got off work (from 7am-515pm, eastern time zone) eastern time is 5 hours behind GMT so that would put it just past 10pm, ergo yes |
| OdinTheReaper02-17-05, 05:56 PM | Well ill post it anyways just in case they make an exception: Vyncent Elrikk "The Crimson Alchemist" Gender: Male; Race: Elf Medium, 6'1" tall; 185 lbs.; age not sure yet DarkBrown hair; red eyes; white skin Alignment: Chaotic Good Class: Level 3 Transmuter (wizard) Speaks:Common, Elven. Bonus Languages: Draconic, Gnoll, Gnome, Goblin, Orc, Sylvan STILL WORKING ON THIS +0 STR 10 (2) +4 DEX 18 (10) (+2, racial) +0 CON 10 (4) (-2, racial) +4 INT 18 (16) +0 WIS 10 (2) +0 CHA 10 (2) HP: 9 (4 + 2.5*2 + 0*3) AC: 14 Initiative:+4 (0+4 dex) Speed: 30 ft. Base Attack Bonus: +1 Grapple: +1 Wizard’s Spellbook: 0th: All cantrips except prohibited schools Enchantment & Necromancy 1: Magic Weapon, Expeditious Retreat, Magic Missile, Color Spray, Mage Armor, Shield 2: Fox's Cunning, Scorching Ray Spells per Day: 5/4/3 (4+1t/2+1t+1b/1+1t+1b) Total Spell Levels: 4+6=10, 10/3= Spell levels usable in fight: 4 Memorized spells: (transmutation spell) (spell focus bonus +2) DC 14 (16) Oth:Mage Hand, Flare, Ray of Frost, Resistance, Read Magic DC 15 (17) 1st:Expeditious Retreat, Magic Missle, Mage Armor, Color Spray DC 16 (18) 2nd: Scorching Ray, Scorching Ray, Fox's Cunning Saves: +1 Fortitude (1+0 con) +5 Reflex (1+4 dex) +3 Will (3+0 wis) Attacks: +2 melee, MW Rapier (+1) 1d6, crit 18-20 +6 MW Composite Longbow (+1) 1d8, crit x3, 110ft range Skills: +10 Spot (6/2 Wizard +2 racial, +3 familiar, in light, +2 alertness) +7 Listen (6/2 Wizard +2 racial +2 alertness ) Knowledge Arcana (6 Wizard + 4 Intelligence) +12 Spellcraft (6 Wizard + 4 Intelligence + 2 Synergy) +7 Ride (6/2 Wizard + 4 Dexterity) +3 Handle Animal (6/2 Wizard) +10 Craft Bowmaking (6 Wizard + 4 Intelligence) +6 Concentration (6 Wizard) Feats: (Wizard 1)Scribe Scroll (Wizard Bonus) Summon Familiar (Level 1) Greater Spell Focus (Evocation) (Level 3) Spell Focus (Evocation) Prebuffs: Spells memorized and ready to use. Scrolls deciphered with Read Magic. Weapons: MW Rapier (belt) 320gp MW Composite Longbow (left shoulder) 400gp Equipment: Traveller's outfit <free> Wizard’s Spellbook <free> (left at home) Spell Components Pouch 5gp (belt) Potion: Hide From Animals 50gp Quiver w/40 arrows (right shoulder) 2gp Scrolls: See Invisiblity 150gp Protection From Arrows 150gp Keen Edge 375gp Magic Missle (CL9) x2 450gp Fireball 375gp Invisibility 150gp Racial Traits: +2 Dexterity, –2 Constitution. Medium: As Medium creatures, elves have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size. Elf base land speed is 30 feet. Immunity to magic sleep effects, and a +2 racial saving throw bonus against enchantment spells or effects. Low-Light Vision: An elf can see twice as far as a human in starlight, moonlight, torchlight, and similar conditions of poor illumination. She retains the ability to distinguish color and detail under these conditions. Weapon Proficiency: Elves receive the Martial Weapon Proficiency feats for the longsword, rapier, longbow (including composite longbow), and shortbow (including composite shortbow) as bonus feats. +2 racial bonus on Listen, Search, and Spot checks. An elf who merely passes within 5 feet of a secret or concealed door is entitled to a Search check to notice it as if she were actively looking for it. Automatic Languages: Common and Elven. Bonus Languages: Draconic, Gnoll, Gnome, Goblin, Orc, and Sylvan. Favored Class: Wizard. A multiclass elf ’s wizard class does not count when determining whether she takes an experience point penalty for multiclassing. Allies: Will name in tactics Heavy Warhorse 400gp Bit and Bridle 2gp Military Saddle 20gp Warhorse, Heavy Large Animal Hit Dice: 4d8+12 (30 hp) Initiative: +1 Speed: 50 ft. (10 squares) Armor Class: 14 (–1 size, +1 Dex, +4 natural), touch 10, flat-footed 13 Base Attack/Grapple: +3/+11 Attack: Hoof +6 melee (1d6+4) Full Attack: 2 hooves +6 melee (1d6+4) and bite +1 melee (1d4+2) Space/Reach: 10 ft./5 ft. Special Attacks: — Special Qualities: Low-light vision, scent Saves: Fort +7, Ref +5, Will +2 Abilities: Str 18, Dex 13, Con 17, Int 2, Wis 13, Cha 6 Skills: Listen +5, Spot +4 Feats: Endurance, Run Environment: Temperate plains Organization: Domesticated Challenge Rating: 2 Advancement: — Level Adjustment: — These animals are similar to heavy horses but are trained and bred for strength and aggression. A heavy warhorse can fight while carrying a rider, but the rider cannot also attack unless he or she succeeds on a Ride check. Carrying Capacity: A light load for a heavy warhorse is up to 300 pounds; a medium load, 301–600 pounds; and a heavy load, 601–900 pounds. A heavy warhorse can drag 4,500 pounds. Familiar: Will give name in tactics Suntail Hawk (consider it a hawk) 100gp Tiny Animal Hit Dice: 1d8 (4 hp) Initiative: +3 Speed: 10 ft. (2 squares), fly 60 ft. (average) Armor Class: 17 (+2 size, +3 Dex, +2 natural), touch 15, flat-footed 14 Base Attack/Grapple: +0/–10 Attack: Talons +5 melee (1d4–2) Full Attack: Talons +5 melee (1d4–2) Space/Reach: 2-1/2 ft./0 ft. Special Attacks: — Special Qualities: Low-light vision Saves: Fort +2, Ref +5, Will +2 Abilities: Str 6, Dex 17, Con 10, Int 2, Wis 14, Cha 6 Skills: Listen +2, Spot +14 Feats: Weapon Finesse Environment: Temperate forests Organization: Solitary or pair Challenge Rating: 1/3 Advancement: — Level Adjustment: — These creatures are similar to eagles but slightly smaller: 1 to 2 feet long, with wingspans of 6 feet or less. Combat: Hawks combine both talons into a single attack. Skills: Hawks have a +8 racial bonus on Spot checks. Other Possessions: Gold Remaining: 51gp Gold Spent: 2949gp Total Gold: 3000gp Experience: Total: 3300exp Next Level: 6000exp Items Used: Background: WILL COME LATER Fight Results: 0-0 |
| Snommelp02-17-05, 06:12 PM | A wizard? Hah! I hope he is paired with Snomm, so that he might learn to fear The Waist-High Fist! |
| Dalton Onestone02-17-05, 06:14 PM | Odin, It's 3200 XP, not 3300. The gold looks close to OK, although it would be helpful if, for example, you subtotaled the gold in each category. |
| Pitlords02-17-05, 06:23 PM | PAIRINGS DONE! For our newbies and also for some of our older members: Study your foe, send your tactics to your pitlord, and hope for the best! Tactics must be sent till friday; pitlords may begin running fights on saturday without tactics. Fights must be up till tuesday 8 AM GMT. Please run your fights early so that there is enough time to discuss. Do not edit your characters until your fights are up. Credit changes: +3: Snarkhunter, T'Var, Naerdaloth +2: Caterane, Pittbull, Jindl (yes, including WLD) +1: Cellardweller, LLMadCow, Sindorin, Huan, Einzelgaenger, Arstimis, MadCowTemplate, Odin the Reaper, +0: Beldin, Kaigan -1: Snommelp Some notes: "No mounts" requests are very difficult to fulfill, if at all. I had to check every paired gladiator to check for mounts which took me almost half an hour, and there was only one fight (coincidently). Since I don't think mounts involve advanced knowledge of the rules, mount requests cannot be fulfilled. That might change in the future when mounts cost XP and gold. Odin and Piuro, please send me a PM wether you want to continue to run fights without the request. Evram has been rolled out so if Sindorin corrects the mistakes on his sheet and Snark agrees, I can pair the two of you. Write me a PM. Odin and Jindl, if you ready your characters I can pair you up. Write a PM. Good fight, good night! |
| cellardweller02-17-05, 06:24 PM | I can think of only one way to settle this dispute: Steel. Cage. Match. Yes. Oh my yes. And here I thought you would be in favour of a dance off. |
| Sindorin02-17-05, 06:27 PM | Ceres was fixed and I sent a PM. |
| cellardweller02-17-05, 06:36 PM | Tactics status Janelle - Sent via email Damon - Sent via email Moonmoon (init "7"+X) - recieved Elder (init "6"+X) - recieved |
| Pitlords02-17-05, 06:38 PM | Ceres Solus the Vagabond (Sindorin) vs Evram the Soulless (SnarkHunter): Jindl has been added to the Roster. I hope Jindl and Snark are ok with that. Credits: Snark -1, Jindl+1 |
| SnarkHunter02-17-05, 07:32 PM | That's fine by me. Working on tactics now. Edit1: Forwarded Moon's tactics to Celler. |
| Jindl02-17-05, 07:36 PM | Yeah, I'll find the time somewhere ;) Tactics for the Elder forwarded to cellardweller. |
| Jindl02-17-05, 07:40 PM | Ceres was fixed and I sent a PM. Looks good now, although you should only have 66 gp left (not 78). You'll probably want to change the bio too, unless the "evil in his blood" is from the human side... (;) I just like giving you a difficult time, Sin!!) |
| Sindorin02-17-05, 07:45 PM | Looks good now, although you should only have 66 gp left (not 78). You'll probably want to change the bio too, unless the "evil in his blood" is from the human side... (;) I just like giving you a difficult time, Sin!!) Yeah I know, I am just glad you guys are letting me have Ceres active this week. At first I was very frustrated because I thought I had done it all right and I thought it was a potent build... even though he still may yet be... {evil laugh}. In terms of his bio, yes, it needs work now... he not a blue anymore, he bronze. |
| SnarkHunter02-17-05, 07:58 PM | Tactics for Rose sent, working on Buddhas. |
| Naerdaloth02-17-05, 08:06 PM | Tactics for Zak PMd to Snark |
| Jindl02-17-05, 08:18 PM | Odin and Jindl, if you ready your characters I can pair you up. Write a PM. Okay, I'm working on something. Should be up soon. |
| Caterane02-17-05, 08:24 PM | Tactics for Uh-men-ta-rhymster sent to Pittbull and tactics for Mer-Man sent to Huan; I promise I'll get a better picture for my seahorse :D |
| SnarkHunter02-17-05, 08:26 PM | Recieved Zak's tactics, and sent Buddha's only Evram's to go a go-go now. |
| Dalton Onestone02-17-05, 08:27 PM | @Khaz_Gu: If you have a chance, could you please post accurate links for Suggang's fights? Edit: Never mind. I found all four. But it would be a courtesy to your next opponent to fix the links. |
| Megrim_Lord02-17-05, 08:31 PM | Tactics for Kai sent to OdintheReaper via PM |
| Naerdaloth02-17-05, 08:34 PM | Tactics for Uh-men-ta-rhymster sent to Pittbull and tactics for Mer-Man sent to Huan; I promise I'll get a better picture for my seahorse :D heheh, I always thought it was um-en-tay-ry-em-ster, now is it uh-men-ta-rhyme-ster or rim-ster? lol.. all important information we've always wanted to know.. @_@ |
| LLMadCow02-17-05, 08:39 PM | McTemplate has been busy with work, but I can say this much: Brandt should have been paired this week: All of the violations are simply issues with understanding the character sheet and the fact that he missed typing 1 number. All the items that have been listed were self crafted PRIOR to character creation and do not need time to be crafted. If you count them all in this manner you will find that the numbers add up fine. Please pair him. McTemplate will be able to attest to this shortly. |
| Dalton Onestone02-17-05, 08:49 PM | @Cat (hey -- that rhymes!): When you have a chance, could you please roll init for GrandElf's fight? Thanks! |
| SnarkHunter02-17-05, 08:57 PM | And Evram's tactics are out. Now what else did I have to do...ah yes...homework. :rolleyes:. |
| OdinTheReaper02-17-05, 09:17 PM | AAHHHHH I MISSED A TON!!!!!!! i just got back from eating. Okay i will pm my character sheet (edited) now. @Megrim: Tactics recieved Question: When are tactics due? And when are fights due? |
| Jindl02-17-05, 09:23 PM | @Odin - I think Cat wanted you to go ahead and post your PC on the Characters of Gladius thread, then PM him so he can link it. Tactics are due Friday (tomorrow). Fights are due Monday (and considered late on Tuesday). -Jindl |
| Kaigan02-17-05, 09:24 PM | Tactics Information: Sent Tactics: -Tactics for Aeluath Dryearraheal: Sent to Sindorin via PM -Tactics for Risal Atess: Sent to MadCowTemplate via PM -Tactics for Tianis: Sent to LLMadCow via PM -Tactics for Rayos Atess: Sent to Huan via PM Received Tactics: -No tactics received from Beldin for Tethtain Flammenläufer -No tactics received from Zepher for Kiyo Zephlyn -No tactics received from Beldin for Inihe Rotblume -No tactics received from Huan for Rook Devange Fights will be up probably Saturday, and hopefully with a story. |
| OdinTheReaper02-17-05, 09:27 PM | @Odin - I think Cat wanted you to go ahead and post your PC on the Characters of Gladius thread, then PM him so he can link it. Tactics are due Friday (tomorrow). Fights are due Monday (and considered late on Tuesday). -Jindl My character is in the thread..I also sent the sheet to the pitlords account. okay thanks for the time stuff. It was a busy day. EDIT: Also who is my new pc fighting? Who will my pitlord be? |
| Land Outcast02-17-05, 09:28 PM | Tactics sent to Arstimis. |
| Dalton Onestone02-17-05, 09:53 PM | Tactics Information: Sent Tactics: -Tactics for Aeluath Dryearraheal: Sent to Sindorin via PM -Tactics for Risal Atess: Sent to MadCowTemplate via PM -Tactics for Tianis: Sent to LLMadCow via PM -Tactics for Rayos Atess: Sent to Huan via PM Received Tactics: -No tactics received from Beldin for Tethtain Flammenläufer -No tactics received from Zepher for Kiyo Zephlyn -No tactics received from Beldin for Inihe Rotblume -No tactics received from Huan for Rook Devange Fights will be up probably Saturday, and hopefully with a story. Wow. I see why you don't have time to run the Dawn of a New Empire game! |
| Kaigan02-17-05, 10:10 PM | Lol, don't worry dalton, It'll be up and going again on saturday. I'm just tweaking somethings, and making things more interesting than I originally planned. As well as some climatic changes in my story. Lol. Believe me, it will be fun. |
| Dalton Onestone02-17-05, 10:29 PM | Lol, don't worry dalton, It'll be up and going again on saturday. I'm just tweaking somethings, and making things more interesting than I originally planned. As well as some climatic changes in my story. Lol. Believe me, it will be fun. Great! Meanwhile, Rolgar keeps looking at that carriage that's scrolled off the bottom of the screen, and wondering why it suddenly became invisible. :) |
| Sindorin02-17-05, 10:39 PM | Tactics for both of my hoodlums have been sent to Jindl and Beldin. I have recieved Kaigan's tactics... |
| Jindl02-17-05, 10:44 PM | My character is in the thread..I also sent the sheet to the pitlords account. okay thanks for the time stuff. It was a busy day. EDIT: Also who is my new pc fighting? Who will my pitlord be? You'll be fighting my pc, Anna. Cat will assign a pitlord. |
| Huan02-17-05, 10:45 PM | Tactics for MerMan (Caterane) and Rayos (Kaigan) have been recieved thank you both. @Kaigan Tactics for Rook sent. |
| Jindl02-17-05, 10:45 PM | Tactics recieved for Evram and for the erroneous half-dragon ;). |
| OdinTheReaper02-17-05, 10:46 PM | @jindl: Okay sounds good EDIT: Where is Anna's character sheet? i cannot find it @cat: either post my pitlord here or pm me |
| vipergtsmk02-17-05, 11:30 PM | Tactics have been sent! Cat--Sorry about your request for emailed tactics I completely forgot untill after I sent them I'll write it on my hand for future reference ;) ! |
| Jindl02-17-05, 11:37 PM | @jindl: Okay sounds good EDIT: Where is Anna's character sheet? i cannot find it @cat: either post my pitlord here or pm me Here's a link: Anna |
| Kaigan02-18-05, 12:15 AM | Tactics Information: Received Tactics: -No tactics received from Beldin for Tethtain Flammenläufer -No tactics received from Zepher for Kiyo Zephlyn -No tactics received from Beldin for Inihe Rotblume -Tactics received from Huan for Rook Devange Still awaiting others. |
| OdinTheReaper02-18-05, 12:41 AM | @vipergts: Tactics for Derth recieved..... @both fighters: I will start running the fight tommorrow night after work EDIT: @Tvar: I will have my tactics in as soon as i get a chance tommorrow...well in Florida it would be today...anyways i have work from 6am till like 2pm at the latest so ill probably get to posting tactics by 6pm (nap time incorporated). |
| Dalton Onestone02-18-05, 02:15 AM | @Cat -- Kwerrock tactics sent by email. |
| Einzelgaenger02-18-05, 02:17 AM | Tactics for Rose sent, working on Buddhas. said tactics recieved, not by other guy yet tho |
| Dalton Onestone02-18-05, 02:30 AM | Elishar's char sheet is riddled with errors, as noted in the violations thread. It would be helpful to me to see a corrected version, perhaps posted in this thread. |
| Pittbull02-18-05, 03:12 AM | @Jindl and Huan: Both tactics for my gladiators, Boraxx and KoRn,have been sent via PM. Thank you! |
| xanadu02-18-05, 03:32 AM | @T'Var - sent tactics for both my guys. Any questions please pm me. Thanks! |
| Arstimis02-18-05, 05:54 AM | Tactics recieved from Land Outcast Tactics for both characters will be sent to T'var in 6-7 hours. School is starting now, and that will be my lunch break. |
| Land Outcast02-18-05, 08:26 AM | Sent tactics confirmation and additions to Arstimis. |
| Huan02-18-05, 11:01 AM | @Pittbull KoRn's tactics received, thank you. Last person I need tactics from is Oz. |
| Sindorin02-18-05, 11:33 AM | Tactics recieved for Evram and for the erroneous half-dragon ;). Erroneous, eh? Anna's skate tatoo should be 100 gp since it is personal ranged! wah hahahah! :D |
| Beldin02-18-05, 11:34 AM | @Neardaloth: Hakatri's have been sent via E-mail. @Sindorin: tactics received. Tactics for my other Gladiators will be sent this evening. |
| Jindl02-18-05, 11:38 AM | Anna's skate tatoo should be 100 gp since it is personal ranged! wah hahahah! :D Um, check again: Skate Psychoportation Level: Psion/wilder 1, psychic warrior 1 Display: Material and visual Manifesting Time: 1 standard action Range: Personal or touch; see text Target: You or one willing creature or one unattended object (total weight up to 100 lb./level); see text Duration: 1 min./level (D) Saving Throw: None Power Resistance: Yes (harmless, object) Power Points: 1 You, another willing creature, or an unattended object can slide along solid ground as if on smooth ice. If you manifest skate on yourself or another creature, the subject of the power retains equilibrium by mental desire alone, allowing her to gracefully skate along the ground, turn, or stop suddenly as desired. The skater’s land speed increases by 15 feet. (This adjustment is treated as an enhancement bonus.) As with any effect that increases speed, this power affects the subject’s maximum jumping distance. Tattoo's with a range of touch cost the normal 50 gp x Power Level x Manifester Level = 50 x1 x1 = 50 gp for Skate. ;) |
| Snommelp02-18-05, 11:44 AM | Tactics sent to T'Var. Addendum to tactics sent to T'Var. Anything else I belatedly think of will be sent to T'Var when I think of it, unless I'm in class and have no computer accesss. |
| Sindorin02-18-05, 11:44 AM | Oh my goodness. :rolleyes: :D |
| Zepher02-18-05, 11:53 AM | Tactics for Kiyo and Razor have been sent to their respective pitlords. |
| Arstimis02-18-05, 12:46 PM | Sorry T'Var, they hardly gave us anytime for lunch, so I am going to have to wait 4-5 more hours before I will have a chance to get my tactics done and to you....sorry again |
| Dalton Onestone02-18-05, 01:18 PM | @Cat -- I estimate that Elishar has spent about 4850 gp of the 4500 gp he has available. So if you take away one of his 375 gp scrolls, I'll be content. They are Summon Monster III, Fireball, and Lightning Bolt. Since he's an evoker and has used scrolls of Fireball before, I suggest you leave him with that one, and take away one of the others. |
| Sindorin02-18-05, 02:03 PM | Tactics for Janelle Werabrook and Aeluath Dryearraheal have been received. The fight will be run later today, tomorrow, and then I will probably write a story in hopes of getting out of the red... |
| spasheridan02-18-05, 02:26 PM | @LLMadCow- tactics for Fyhir are sent. PM me if you have any questions. @ da elders: If you need any more pitlords I'll throw my hat into the ring to do a single match each week. Once I get the hang of it I'll offer to do more. Starting with the next matches though, I'm busy this week. Thanks! |
| Ayatoshi02-18-05, 02:36 PM | Tactics sent to Einzelgaenger |
| Beldin02-18-05, 03:32 PM | @Kaigan: Tactics for Tethtain have been sent via E-Mail. @Kaigan: Tactics for Inihe have been sent to you, too. |
| Naerdaloth02-18-05, 04:24 PM | Hakatri's tactics recieved, still missing Indri's |
| Pitlords02-18-05, 05:16 PM | You'll be fighting my pc, Anna. Cat will assign a pitlord. Anna (Jindl) vs Vyncent Elrikk (Odin theReaper): Ayatoshi has been added to the Roster. Ayatoshi +1 credit @ALL: The credit display has been changed to numbers instead of an army of ++++.... Thanks to Jindl for this great idea! @Naer: I'll send them tomorow; sorry for the delay. @Viper: No problem. @Spasheridan: Send me your email adress and I will add you to the Pitlord list @Dalton: I'll inform you which scroll Viper is going to delete. @LLMadCow: Please link your quest to your sheet |
| T'Var02-18-05, 06:26 PM | Anna (Jindl) vs Vyncent Elrikk (Odin theReaper): Ayatoshi has been added to the Roster. Ayatoshi +1 credit @ALL: The credit display has been changed to numbers instead of an army of ++++.... Thanks to Jindl for this great idea! awww....but I liked the army of +'s they make me feel more manly |
| Caterane02-18-05, 06:38 PM | awww....but I liked the army of +'s they make me feel more manly If you are + addicted, imagine they reflect your age |
| Dalton Onestone02-18-05, 07:06 PM | @Cat: Please also be so kind as to roll init for GrandElf vs. Elishar. Thanks! |
| Caterane02-18-05, 07:11 PM | @Cat: Please also be so kind as to roll init for GrandElf vs. Elishar. Thanks! Grandelf 20+3 = 23 Elishar 13+3 = 16 rolls (http://krisinchico.brinkster.net/searchroll.asp?username=Grandelf-Elishar#148382) |
| Aramil Dunskar02-18-05, 09:22 PM | @Beldin: Tatics sent for Grakk -Aramil |
| Dalton Onestone02-18-05, 09:44 PM | @Dalton: I'll inform you which scroll Viper is going to delete. OK, thanks. I'll wait patiently. |
| Ayatoshi02-18-05, 10:05 PM | @Pitlords: I can't pitlord the fight this week for i am leaving for California in like 18 hours so if you could assign it to someone else please sorry :( But hey I'M GOING TO CALI ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! |
| Huan02-18-05, 10:16 PM | @Ayatoshi I can take the fight off of your hands. |
| OdinTheReaper02-18-05, 10:44 PM | So ill go ahead and send them to you....im writing them now huan...btw thanks a lot i appreciate it |
| Arstimis02-18-05, 10:50 PM | All tactics recieved from the 2 gladiators I am Pitlording for. Both set of tactics sent to T'Var for Kara Cadone and Arthemus Dak'kon |
| Sindorin02-18-05, 11:23 PM | I am able to pick up a fight if anyone needs one taken off of their hands. I managed to be somewhat efficient with the one assigned to me. |
| OdinTheReaper02-18-05, 11:28 PM | @huan: Vyncent tactics sent If you dont end up running my fight...will you please send my tactics and sheet to the pitlord? If not then i hope i will be able to sent it in time. thanks @t'var: Odins tactics sent |
| Dalton Onestone02-18-05, 11:56 PM | A couple of thoughts on the Janelle fight. 1. Is a 1 an automatic failure on a Ride check in combat? 2. I don't see that a Ride check to negate a hit on your horse is a DC 20 check. Rather, the DC is the attack roll that hit the horse, perhaps +1. 3. I don't see how a wand of CLW can heal by 10 on a single use. |
| Sindorin02-19-05, 12:09 AM | A couple of thoughts on the Janelle fight. 1. Is a 1 an automatic failure on a Ride check in combat? 2. I don't see that a Ride check to negate a hit on your horse is a DC 20 check. Rather, the DC is the attack roll that hit the horse, perhaps +1. 3. I don't see how a wand of CLW can heal by 10 on a single use. 1. I'm pretty sure a natural one is an automatic failure on any skill check. 2. The attack roll WAS a natural 20. 3. Well, the way I figured, the wand had to have been crafted by at least CL5, the description of CLW says it heals 1d8 + 1/level, therefore the fifth level crafter applied that to the healing. If this is wrong, please let me know what it should have been for the benefit of my knowledge. |
| Jindl02-19-05, 12:21 AM | 1. I'm pretty sure a natural one is an automatic failure on any skill check. 2. The attack roll WAS a natural 20. 3. Well, the way I figured, the wand had to have been crafted by at least CL5, the description of CLW says it heals 1d8 + 1/level, therefore the fifth level crafter applied that to the healing. If this is wrong, please let me know what it should have been for the benefit of my knowledge. 1. Auto success and failure only applies to attack rolls and saving throws. It does not apply to skill checks. 2. Irrelevant. The hit can still be deflected by Mounted Combat. 3. Just becuase Craft Wand requires CL5 as a feat, does not mean all wands are at least CL5. His wand is CL1 (which is why it cost 750 x1 x1 = 750 gp.) On the bright side, none of these things changed the outcome :D One more thing to remember: If the mount withdraws, the rider still provokes an AoO if he does anything other than withdraw as well (becuase he is also leaving a threatened area). -Jindl |
| Jindl02-19-05, 12:22 AM | @Huan - Brief tactics sent for Anna. I have some RP to send to you for her, if you are interested in writing a story. |
| Sindorin02-19-05, 12:25 AM | 1. Auto success and failure only applies to attack rolls and saving throws. It does not apply to skill checks. 2. Irrelevant. The hit can still be deflected by Mounted Combat. 3. Just becuase Craft Wand requires CL5 as a feat, does not mean all wands are at least CL5. His wand is CL1 (which is why it cost 750 x1 x1 = 750 gp.) On the bright side, none of these things changed the outcome :D One more thing to remember: If the mount withdraws, the rider still provokes an AoO if he does anything other than withdraw as well (becuase he is also leaving a threatened area). -Jindl Gotcha. I was aware that the horse's withdrawing would cause the rider to provoke, however since Aeluath was using his/her bow and had just fired, I realized that reloading would cause her own AoO. It did not seem possible. |
| OdinTheReaper02-19-05, 12:28 AM | @huan: Depending on when you run the fight i can send you some rp and names for the familiar and ally tommorrow, if you are interested in some rp and a story |
| Kaigan02-19-05, 12:36 AM | Tactics Information: Received Tactics: -Tactics received from Beldin for Tethtain Flammenläufer -Tactics received from Zepher for Kiyo Zephlyn -Tactics received from Beldin for Inihe Rotblume -Tactics received from Huan for Rook Devange All tactics received, fights should be up sometime tomorrow. @Sindorin: Aeiou is a guy :D |
| Dalton Onestone02-19-05, 12:40 AM | 2. The attack roll WAS a natural 20. Yes, but the modifiers should have been added in for the full attack score. So the DC was 28, and the Ride check was only 26. The feat is described as, in effect, raising the horse's AC to the level of the Ride check. Come to think of it, that also suggests that maybe a Ride check shouldn't be allowed to negate a critical hit against a horse no matter what the rolls are. |
| Sindorin02-19-05, 12:52 AM | Yes, but the modifiers should have been added in for the full attack score. So the DC was 28, and the Ride check was only 26. The feat is described as, in effect, raising the horse's AC to the level of the Ride check. Come to think of it, that also suggests that maybe a Ride check shouldn't be allowed to negate a critical hit against a horse no matter what the rolls are. Okay, then the rules are very unclear. I read them as I go to make sure I get them right, and it said that the DC to negate the hit to the mount is the attack ROLL... I think I see where I was wrong - I took the die roll without the modifier thinking that it was the 'roll' i was in search of. I figure now that the 'roll' they want is the die roll plus the modifier. |
| Dalton Onestone02-19-05, 01:02 AM | Okay, then the rules are very unclear. You think? :D :D :D :D :D |
| Pitlords02-19-05, 04:30 AM | Anna vs Vyncent has been reassigned to Huan. Ayatoshi -1 credit, Huan+1 credit |
| Huan02-19-05, 10:04 AM | Tactics recived from everyone ... I will run all fights today @Jindl Yes, I would like some RP, please (Of course I will write a story ;) ). |
| Caterane02-19-05, 10:12 AM | Kwerrock the Quiet vs Suggang the Noisy is up. @Dalton: Still waiting on tactics for Grandelf. Please send them asap! |
| Dalton Onestone02-19-05, 02:04 PM | @Dalton: Still waiting on tactics for Grandelf. Please send them asap! As per earlier discussion in this thread, I was hoping you'd first tell me which scroll he was giving up!!! |
| Caterane02-19-05, 02:34 PM | That's for Viper to decide. If he doesn't pick one, I will let you know just before I run the fight. |
| Dalton Onestone02-19-05, 02:41 PM | That's for Viper to decide. If he doesn't pick one, I will let you know just before I run the fight. OK. I'll come up with two sets of tactics then, one under each assumption. |
| Caterane02-19-05, 02:45 PM | @Dalton: hold on; I've compiled a PM for viper. @Viper: anyhow your PM box doesn't work. I'll post it here: Hi Viper, check this post and these violations (also found on the violations thread) Scorching ray Hp and skills Pricing errors Miscellaneous XP mistakes Wealth error Please correct these mistakes after your fight is up. I will run it asap. For now I need to know which Scroll you want to delete for this fight. Please reply asap so that we can proceed with the fight. Thanks Cat |
| Dalton Onestone02-19-05, 02:48 PM | Kwerrock the Quiet vs Suggang the Noisy is up. @Dalton: Still waiting on tactics for Grandelf. Please send them asap! Well, glad to end his winning streak. Thanks! Way to wroll those high CdG scores! Now I hope I don't also end Elishar's losing streak ... Two clarification for future reference: 1. Does the fact that he was Readying his arrows make any difference vs. Deflect Arrows, or was it still a certainty that he couldn't hit? 2. I think you had one of his arrows destroy a Mirror Image image. Were you saying Mirror Image's protection got applied before Deflect Arrows', or were you saying something else? Thanks! |
| Caterane02-19-05, 02:56 PM | I considered that aswell. When do you apply deflect arrows. If your touch AC gets hit (because if your armor blocks it, the arrow is already past your hand)? What if your mirror image gets hit? The answer is pretty clear here. The PHB says "when you would normally be hit" and I am going to do the Motherbast here and go by the very word. You only deflect right before I would roll damage. |
| Snommelp02-19-05, 03:02 PM | Deflect Arrows only comes into play if you would be hit. Normally, there's only one of you, so the pitlord will just make it an automatic miss. With the mirror images, however, the pitlord has to forst see which you the arrow strikes at before applying Deflect Arrows. For a readied action, it's harder. Technically, Deflect Arrows should work since that's the way it's worded, but on the other hand your hands are currently occupied with spellcasting. It could go either way, but I for one would allow deflection, with maybe a Concentration roll to save the spell. |
| Einzelgaenger02-19-05, 03:05 PM | Tactics sent to Einzelgaenger Recieved |
| Dalton Onestone02-19-05, 03:08 PM | For a readied action, it's harder. Technically, Deflect Arrows should work since that's the way it's worded, but on the other hand your hands are currently occupied with spellcasting. It could go either way, but I for one would allow deflection, with maybe a Concentration roll to save the spell. It's very clear that spellcasting only requires one hand. Thus, as long as the spell is being cast from memory rather than a scroll, I'd think there's no conflict between Deflect Arrows and spellcasting. As for Readying an arrow vs. a scroll -- interesting tactic. Certainly if there's a Concentration check it should be at a lower DC than if you were actually hit and taking damage. |
| Snommelp02-19-05, 03:43 PM | It's very clear that spellcasting only requires one hand. Thus, as long as the spell is being cast from memory rather than a scroll, I'd think there's no conflict between Deflect Arrows and spellcasting.Right, one-handed Somatic components. I should have known that; it's only logical, considering scroll usage. As for Readying an arrow vs. a scroll -- interesting tactic. Certainly if there's a Concentration check it should be at a lower DC than if you were actually hit and taking damage.I'd put it at 10, the DC listed for vigorous motion (moving mount, bouncing wagon, &c). |
| Dalton Onestone02-19-05, 03:57 PM | @Cat -- GrandElf tactics sent by email, at least up to the point that it doesn't matter which scroll he kept. |
| Dalton Onestone02-19-05, 04:51 PM | @Cat -- I also sent a short addendum or two. Sorry. At least they're SHORT. |
| Caterane02-19-05, 08:18 PM | I thought I better run the fight before I get another ten pages from Dalton; for the sake of both of us :D Is Elishar going to achieve his first victory? Find out here |
| Dalton Onestone02-19-05, 10:14 PM | @Cat: 1. Thanks for running the fight! 2. Ouch re my tactics. I thought Celestial creatures understood Common. Now I'm not even sure what I was mixing them up with. 3. (From an unused part of Elishar's tactics): Is a ranged touch attack like a touch attack? Can you Share it with your familiar? Can you CdG with it? 4. Even for a spell that can be Shared with your familiar, you can't simultaneously CdG a Sleeping victim with two copies, right? Because they wouldn't be simultaneous, and a simultaneous CdG has to be truly simultaneous or else the victim wakes up inbetween. |
| Huan02-19-05, 10:46 PM | Bare-bones (and many bones, indeed) of Rayos Atess vs Oz Savage (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5486531) is up. Short version: High Attack vs High Endurance ... who won out? It was fairly straightforward, and mostly up to the dice as to who won. |
| LLMadCow02-20-05, 02:12 AM | Bare-bones (and many bones, indeed) of Rayos Atess vs Oz Savage (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5486531) is up. Short version: High Attack vs High Endurance ... who won out? It was fairly straightforward, and mostly up to the dice as to who won. Short of a bombardment, Oz had enough ability to heal that he could have gone on. I am not going to request a re-run, but Oz has a Wand of CLW and my request in the tactics were that he heal as needed, but use the potions first. I just wanted them out of my inventory prior to using the wand. So, 50 more CLW later ... you see what I mean? When you use the mount as cover, does the mount take damage from the hit? If so, was this recorded? |
| Huan02-20-05, 09:33 AM | @LLMadCow Thank you for understanding. Indeed I saw the wand, but the flow of the fight was fast growing against you. After all, he had 100 arrows and all he had to do was roll above a 10 to hit (not to mention his arrows could outdo the healing from the wand), while you were constantly shooting beyond range and could only hit with a natural 20 (not to mention you only had 40 arrows). 50 rounds later I imagine you would be out of arrows, used up some of your wand, and Rayos would be getting tired of the waltz of fire, retreat, dodge. In retropect, Rayos could have used his Rapid Shot with ease, but he speficially decided against it (though doing so would have surely have hurt you more and would have made the wand useless). ...But, if you would like, I could run 50+ reiterations of him firing and his wolf attacking, and you firing/healing until one of you won for sure. (I would not bother to keep track of the postion since he would always out-range you.) ... who knows, maybe we can shoot to break the longest fight record... ;) As far as using the mount as cover, it does not say that the mount takes damage. I imagine it is the sort of thing where you fire at him, he leans way over to the side, and your arrow whizzes overhead. |
| LLMadCow02-20-05, 11:54 AM | I was always under the impression that the idea was like hiding behind a rock. The rock itself is protecting you. So, if I miss by the difference between what your AC is and the cover bonus provided by the rock, the arrow bounces off of the rock. In this case, the rock is your horse and thus has an arrow lodged in it's side. However, this is where the Mounted Combat Feat comes into play since you can make a ride check to try to negate the hit. I could be wrong. Maybe this is something more to investigate. |
| Sindorin02-20-05, 12:08 PM | What exactly is done when you use mounted combat to negate a hit to your mount? |
| T'Var02-20-05, 12:54 PM | What exactly is done when you use mounted combat to negate a hit to your mount? after a attack is successful against the mount, the rider rolls his Ride skill. if the result of the ride still is better than the mounts AC you use the ride check as its AC for the successful attack i.e. Bob attacks and Hits Davids mount. David has the option to roll his ride check to replace his mounts AC with the Ride check roll, for that one attack the ride check, which is now the mounts AC for 1 attack, can negate the attack if Bobs attack does not hit the mounts New Ride check AC |
| Pittbull02-20-05, 03:40 PM | Fight "Uhmentarymster vs Razor" (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5490451&postcount=1299) is posted. @LL: Cover from horses is used the same as the -4 penalty while shooting into melee, there isn't a chance to hit your friend too. It's a little bit abstract, but the main point is that the archer aims exactly his target and doesn't shoot if he isn't sure. |
| Huan02-20-05, 03:46 PM | @Pittbull In round 2 of Uhmentarymster vs Razor, Uhmentarymster casts Sleep. Sleep takes a round to cast, so it won't affect Razor until the beginning of Uhmentarymster's next turn. So, Razor still gets to do something. |
| Caterane02-20-05, 04:39 PM | Yes, sleep is a fullround action but since Zepher's way was blocked by obstacles and he cannot get Uhmentarymster with a single move if he rides away, and he didn't write to flee if I cast a fullround spell, this won't change anything. |
| SnarkHunter02-20-05, 05:01 PM | Re: Cover vs. ranged attacks: there's a variant rule in the DMG for hitting the cover, but we've never used it. Also Dune Vs. Zaqh is up. (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=5490969#post5490969) The winner used violence. Rolls are here (http://krisinchico.brinkster.net/searchroll.asp?username=DuneZaqh#148695) . |
| Pittbull02-20-05, 05:54 PM | @Huan: Thanks for the hint, I forgot this, but as Cat mentioned this wouldn't change the fight. Fight "Damon vs. Flower" (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5491320&postcount=1301) is posted. Has been pretty difficult to run, please let me know if there are some mistakes. |
| Huan02-20-05, 06:38 PM | Bare-bones of KoRn vs Mer-Man (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5491663) is up. Short version: A series of bad rolls for both sides. Quite possibly an upset, but what surprised me most was how it ended ... death by AoO... |
| Dalton Onestone02-20-05, 07:52 PM | Bare-bones of KoRn vs Mer-Man (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5491663) is up. Short version: A series of bad rolls for both sides. Quite possibly an upset, but what surprised me most was how it ended ... death by AoO... 1d12 + 6 + 2d6 = 31 points of damage? I don't quite get that. Or am I underestimating what all was added in to the attack? |
| Huan02-20-05, 08:37 PM | He's expanded, remember? A 1d12 axe jumps to 3d6 ... It's also the reason why he got an AoO in the first place. Breaking it down: 14 Str + 4 Animal Affinity + 2 Expansion = 20 Str => +5 mod x 1.5 (two-handed) = 7 Str dmg His AoO did 3d6 + 7 + 2d6 (Deepcrystal) dmg. |
| Sindorin02-20-05, 08:43 PM | after a attack is successful against the mount, the rider rolls his Ride skill. if the result of the ride still is better than the mounts AC you use the ride check as its AC for the successful attack i.e. Bob attacks and Hits Davids mount. David has the option to roll his ride check to replace his mounts AC with the Ride check roll, for that one attack the ride check, which is now the mounts AC for 1 attack, can negate the attack if Bobs attack does not hit the mounts New Ride check AC Yes, I figured. I just wasn't sure what happens 'visually'. |
| T'Var02-20-05, 08:51 PM | Yes, I figured. I just wasn't sure what happens 'visually'. Ahhh well basicly you grab the reigns of your mount and jurk up suddenly, rearing the mount on his hind legs and it flays its front hoofs around knocking the weapon away from actually hitting least thats how I see it |
| Sindorin02-20-05, 08:56 PM | It's an interesting point to ponder. I don't object to any rules about it though, it just seems like it may be a bit much to say that "that one hit when he rapid shot at my horse, the crit, that one doesn't make it..." Um, well it should because it hit the horse's vitals... Oh well. Weird rules. |
| Dalton Onestone02-20-05, 09:08 PM | Expansion. Right. Oops. Thanks. |
| Arstimis02-20-05, 09:11 PM | It's an interesting point to ponder. I don't object to any rules about it though, it just seems like it may be a bit much to say that "that one hit when he rapid shot at my horse, the crit, that one doesn't make it..." Um, well it should because it hit the horse's vitals... Oh well. Weird rules. I always thought of Mounted Combat visually as being the rider pulls the reigns moving the horse out of the way, kinda like the way T'Var saw it |
| T'Var02-20-05, 09:24 PM | It's an interesting point to ponder. I don't object to any rules about it though, it just seems like it may be a bit much to say that "that one hit when he rapid shot at my horse, the crit, that one doesn't make it..." Um, well it should because it hit the horse's vitals... Oh well. Weird rules. well how it works is say if he is rapid shot. the first one hits. the rider must declare if he wants to use the feat to negate it. if he desides not to use the feat at that time, that one hit deals dmg as normal then the second attack is done. if the second attack missed, the rider cannot go back and say he wants to negate the one that hit. you have to choose at the time of each attack, not after all attacks have been rolled |
| Sindorin02-20-05, 09:41 PM | oh. duh. *sheepish* either way, I could imagine the disappointment on a young bowman's face as his arrow flies true to the horse's throat and suddenly it gets knocked away. Quite effective. |
| Kaigan02-21-05, 12:06 AM | Well Inihe Rotblume vs. Rook Devange is up. Who wins? Go look. And I hope you like the light hearted story. |
| MadCowTemplate02-21-05, 12:25 AM | I just wanted to assure all that I am alive and I am going to run my Risel vs Zubair fight. (This is especially important to those who have known my name for a while back. I did NOT fall off the earth, again.) |
| spasheridan02-21-05, 02:05 AM | @Huan: Thanks for the hint, I forgot this, but as Cat mentioned this wouldn't change the fight. Well... Would Ulhnmanye need to make concentration checks on round 2 and round 3 to cast while riding the horse? If Razor runs away on rnd 2 (out of range of the spell), can Ulhnmanye direct the horse towards razor WHILE casting the spell?? I mean, can you take a free action DURING the full round action of casting sleep to make the horse run a specific way? If Razor move-moves towards ulhnmanye, on ulhmanyes turn he's still casting a spell, does that provoke an AoO that Razor can attack with to force another concentrate check? How many HD did sleep knock out? If Razor runs during rnd 2 to base Ulhnmanye, Would it have hit the horse and the familiar 1st? WOuld there be enough HD left to knock out Razor? Razor has 2 ranks in spell craft (psi craft) so he should be able to take some actions based on what spell is being cast. Rnd 1 postions Light warhorse (x-4/y-16) 22/22 Razor (x+5/y-14) 36/36 skate (1min) Rnd 2: Light warhorse (x-4/y-16) 22/22 Razor (x+5/y-14) 36/36 skate (1min), sleeping (4min) Looks to me like at the end of rnd 1 they were 45 or 50 feet apart. Looks like Razor had a move of 55. If Unmanye doesn't move on Rnd 2 then Razor can close and attack on rnd 2 before the spell goes off. Not to be a jerk... but I think it does make a differance that the spell has a 1 round casting time. I'm new in CoC so please let me know if I'm out of line here.. |
| Pittbull02-21-05, 02:25 AM | Looks to me like at the end of rnd 1 they were 45 or 50 feet apart. Looks like Razor had a move of 55. If Unmanye [Uhmentarymster] doesn't move on Rnd 2 then Razor can close and attack on rnd 2 before the spell goes off. Ok, this results out off a mistake I made, but I didn't changed it yesterday. My mistake was to forget to cast sleep is a full-round-action. If I woul have known that I would never place Uhmentarymster so close to Razor, because he does not need to (spell-range: 140ft.) A player should not be punished for a pitlord's mistake, so I said that does not matter and didn't changed the fight. All in all only one roll decides this battle, the will-save against sleep. Razor failed this one and lost the match. If Razor runs away on rnd 2 (out of range of the spell), can Ulhnmanye [Uhmentarymster] direct the horse towards razor WHILE casting the spell?? I mean, can you take a free action DURING the full round action of casting sleep to make the horse run a specific way? You can guide your horse in a specifc way, but making more than a single-move requires concentration-checks. Ragarding the full-round-problem: It's possible to rapid-shoot from a horse, this feat requires a f-r-action too. :) |
| Dalton Onestone02-21-05, 02:31 AM | Well Inihe Rotblume vs. Rook Devange is up. Who wins? Go look. And I hope you like the light hearted story. There was a minor error in Huan's stated tactics, although it didn't come into play in the bout. Contrary to what he said, the DC of a scroll is NOT affected by whether or not you crafted it yourself. It still assumes the minimum ability score needed to get the spell off (which would be 11 and hence +0 bonus for Color Spray, for a total DC of 10+CL+0=11). |
| spasheridan02-21-05, 03:24 AM | Ok, this results out off a mistake I made, but I didn't changed it yesterday. My mistake was to forget to cast sleep is a full-round-action. If I woul have known that I would never place Uhmentarymster so close to Razor, because he does not need to (spell-range: 140ft.) A player should not be punished for a pitlord's mistake, so I said that does not matter and didn't changed the fight. All in all only one roll decides this battle, the will-save against sleep. Razor failed this one and lost the match. Problem is that Uhmen needs to close a bit on rnd 2 to get LOS for the spell and to make sure that the Razor can't run out of range. Razor doesn't say that he'd flee a sleep spell, but Uhmen doesn't know that. BUT there's a big diff between 50 ft away (where they were) and 100 ft away (where they could be). With that big ol int of 23 Uhmen would probably place himself optimally. You can guide your horse in a specifc way, but making more than a single-move requires concentration-checks. Ragarding the full-round-problem: It's possible to rapid-shoot from a horse, this feat requires a f-r-action too. :) Not sure about this. The differance between taking a full attack and a full round action is perty big. See, in the rapid shot cast you're turn is: (RND 1) Free action (guide with knees), Full Attack Where the sleep spell goes (RND 1) Free action (guide with knees), Start Spell (make concentration check to cast on moving horse?) (RND 1) target gets to move (RND 2) Free Action (guide with Knees), Finish casting spell (make concentration check to cast on moving horse?) See.. you start casting the spell, the target gets to go... and then you finish the spell. If you weren't mounted you couldn't move before you finish the spell, it's the 1st thing that happens on your turn. SO I figure that you can't move the horse on the 2nd round before you finish the spell as well. My only point is that Razor has ranks in psi craft so he has a chance to ID the spell and take appropriate action.. knowing he can't charge the target, does he sit there in LOS and range and pray he makes the save or does he run away / break LOS to avoid the spell.. PS- You still need to roll the 2d4 for how many HD get hit with the sleep spell. If you roll a 2 then the spell fails because Razor has 3 HD. PPS- To direct a mount as a free action requires a ride check... Uhmene doesn't have any ranks in ride... these checks should be rolled as well. |
| Dalton Onestone02-21-05, 03:46 AM | @Spasheridan, You're far off on that dice part for the Sleep spell. The actual text is: A sleep spell causes a magical slumber to come upon 4 Hit Dice of creatures. Creatures with the fewest HD are affected first. You were probably mixing it up with Hypnotism, which works more the way you were describing. As for a full round spell letting somebody run out of range or LOS, I think not, but I'll let somebody else explain why you're wrong (just in case you're really right and I'm the one who's wrong). |
| spasheridan02-21-05, 04:07 AM | oops. You're right, my offline copy of the SRD seems to be a jumbled mess of editions, the online one says what you said. Thanks! I hate to be a stickler... but I am a stickler! I think that Uhmene is getting a bit of a soft touch on his bouts because he has such an intimdating tactic ... sleep DC 19 is nasty! A PC with such a hyperfocused strength has paid a big price in lacking a well rounded defense system. The lack of a well rounded PC shows up most at low levels, before spells can cover the glaring holes that a 7 str and 10 con give. It's up to the pitlords to make sure that we showcase the strength of these single focus builds as well as show the flaws in them. THen again.. the players need to send in tactics that exploit flaws... which brings it all back to me being a stickler. I'll try and keep it in check. |
| Caterane02-21-05, 04:10 AM | @Spash: Razor was at (4/-14). That's in the open. To name one example: Uhmentarymster (with his Int 23 ;) ) could ride to (3/28). That makes sure that Razor can neither attack me nor run out of sight (running needs to be in a straight line and sleep is an area spell; no LOS needed) nor could he escape with a double move. That position is the best I would get anyway so Uhmentarymster wouldn't wait for a (non-existant) better opportunity and since Razor didn't want to run away when I cast sleep, he would come close. @Huan: Just one thing with the Merman vs Korn fight. I don't get your positions from round 6 on. If Merman has cover relative to Korn, he doesn't get an AoO nor does he hit Ac30 (cover). Your coordinates however say that I am in the open, something I didn't want. |
| Pittbull02-21-05, 04:23 AM | Per request of Cat I changed my last post, it contained a hint how to prepare against sleep: Nimm einfach Schutz vor Gutem!! :D |
| Caterane02-21-05, 04:29 AM | Pssst, Peter, entferne lieber das letzte Posting bevor es jemand sieht LOL |
| spasheridan02-21-05, 05:03 AM | @Spash: Razor was at (4/-14). That's in the open. To name one example: Uhmentarymster (with his Int 23 ;) ) could ride to (3/28). That makes sure that Razor can neither attack me nor run out of sight (running needs to be in a straight line and sleep is an area spell; no LOS needed) nor could he escape with a double move. That position is the best I would get anyway so Uhmentarymster wouldn't wait for a (non-existant) better opportunity and since Razor didn't want to run away when I cast sleep, he would come close. Which requires a ride check (DC5) or else you spend a move action driving the horse. AND if you fail the ride check you can't start casting the spell that round. Moving from (-4/-16) to (3/28) is 7 & 44 squares, or 135 feet, or a run action for the horse. THis requires a DC 15 concentration check or the spell fails. So did casting from the scroll for that matter, but only a DC 10 check. With his speed of 55 it would be a simple matter to move / move to (-6/-30). Thats what... 58 squares and 9 sqaures between for a total distance of 300 feet? On rnd 3 you finish the spell and have no target. I see the no need for LOS, just a need of knowing where he is. I'm just trying to keep things honest! I'm sure that Uhmenye (darn I'll never spell that right!) knows how to position himself for the spell. It's just a tough job vs an opponent with that much speed. And considering the lack of ranks in ride and the distinct possibility of failed concentration checks while running the horse.... and I think the best D against sleep is to hold a 2 HD riding dog. Wake him up after the sleep spell nocks them out and then use him as a living shield against the next one. But the potion idea is a good one as well. |
| Caterane02-21-05, 05:17 AM | Just to make sure no one gets this wrong: Protection from good does NOT make you immune to sleep. It merely provides a +2 bonus to your saves if that's what Pittbull means. |
| T'Var02-21-05, 08:43 AM | @Huan: Just one thing with the Merman vs Korn fight. I don't get your positions from round 6 on. If Merman has cover relative to Korn, he doesn't get an AoO nor does he hit Ac30 (cover). Your coordinates however say that I am in the open, something I didn't want. Umm having cover doesnt prevent an AoO (well total cover would of course but not normal cover) |
| Caterane02-21-05, 08:49 AM | Umm having cover doesnt prevent an AoO (well total cover would of course but not normal cover) I (and the SRD) disagree: Excerpt from the SRD: Combat modifiers (http://www.wizards.com/d20/files/v35/CombatII.rtf) Cover and Attacks of Opportunity: You can’t execute an attack of opportunity against an opponent with cover relative to you. |
| Huan02-21-05, 09:53 AM | @Huan: Just one thing with the Merman vs Korn fight. I don't get your positions from round 6 on. If Merman has cover relative to Korn, he doesn't get an AoO nor does he hit Ac30 (cover). Your coordinates however say that I am in the open, something I didn't want. You are complety correct. In Round 6, when KoRN had you in a corner, when you dashed around said corner, you provoked the AoO when you had half-cover, therefore, KoRn could not have taken it. However, the reason I had you in the open for that one (albeit fatal) round was to intiate your strategy of keeping a distance and hitting KoRn with arrows. Unfortunately, you could not shake KoRn off, since he had done a lucky job of sneaking up to your face (Your horse had no way of detecting him, as you know, and you happened to roll really low for spot/listen checks). At the time, where you were was the most fortified spot in the arena. However, once KoRn started combat, you had 4 choices, 1) Stay and fight (which you told me not to do in the KoRn-visible portion of your tactics), 2) Stay and defend (I did not think you wished to risk a hit with your HP), 3) Run towards the side into the open (bad choice since you would be moving farther from your horse), 4) Run downwards into the open, evade AoO, mount horse, and resume tactics. I opted for choice 4, thinking it to be the most advantageous. However, by pure coincidence, KoRn, despite his lowered speed, could still get to where you and your horse were in a single move (by taking a more direct path, not the AoO dodging one you did), thus still moving right next to you. Now, here is the next part: You mounted your horse (not an AoO-provoking action, so you were now on the fringe of his threatened space.) Next, as per your plan, you bolted from him, and moving from the threatened square is what provoked the AoO. KoRn knew that he would not be able to catch you after this, so he put everything in a last shot attack that actually hit. Even if you did not move, and stayed to sunder his bow (like in the other part of your tactics), KoRn would still have gotten an AoO on you. Staying and fighting was an optinon, but he still would have had another chance to attack you. Within all this, the chance to use your cover as mount (which would have saved you) was taken, but unfortunately botched. His reach simply had you pinned, and the dice were not on your side. Either way, the part about moving in the open was so you could dodge KoRn in the round before, and get to a spot where you could mount and ride off (remember, you horse was way on the other side of the arena after searching futilily for KoRn). Calling it to where you and KoRn were, in the fortified area, was too risky. (KoRn would have gotten an AoO on it, and he might have killed it). NOTE: Phew, good thing for German to English translator sites, now I can understand what you and Pittbull are saying. ;) |
| Pittbull02-21-05, 09:56 AM | NOTE: Phew, good thing for German to English translator sites, now I can understand what you and Pittbull are saying. Damn it, you got us! ;) :D @Cat: Do you understand Bavarian? :D |
| Caterane02-21-05, 10:11 AM | @Huan: well I can't really comment that because according to your positions Korn isn't even in melee with me. Let's assume he based me -> I withdraw (no AoO because of cover) to a position where I either have cover aswell or where he cannot reach me at all. My speed is 40 opposed to Korn's 20 so I should be able to get away from him now that he has used up his invisibility and mount the horse where it is safe. Moving to another obstacle provides me again with cover so that I (again) wouldn't get an AoO. That's a safe way to escape melee with the much slower Korn. I also want to point out that I did nothing but move during the round and should get my +4 dodge bonus from total defense, as written in my tactic. Please look over this again and correct it if possible but don't go to great lengths. I don't want to rob Pittbull of his victory :) @Pittbull: Jo moi, di weneds ah rausfinna. (I once had a girlfriend from Bavaria) |
| Pittbull02-21-05, 10:15 AM | @Pittbull: Jo moi, di weneds ah rausfinna. Oh yeah! I would like to have a translation, from Huan's internet-source!! :D :D ;) :thumbsup: |
| Huan02-21-05, 10:18 AM | @Huan: well I can't really comment that because according to your positions Korn isn't even in melee with me. Let's assume he based me -> I withdraw (no AoO because of cover) to a position where I either have cover aswell or where he cannot reach me at all. My speed is 40 opposed to Korn's 20 so I should be able to get away from him now that he has used up his invisibility and mount the horse where it is safe. Moving to another obstacle provides me again with cover so that I (again) wouldn't get an AoO. That's a safe way to escape melee with the much slower Korn. I also want to point out that I did nothing but move during the round and should get my +4 dodge bonus from total defense, as written in my tactic. Please look over this again and correct it if possible but don't go to great lengths. I don't want to rob Pittbull of his victory :) @Pittbull: Jo moi, di weneds ah rausfinna. (I once had a girlfriend from Bavaria) base speed 40? It has 30 on your sheet... |
| Caterane02-21-05, 10:23 AM | Oh sorry, confused it with my next level lol Still, 60ft double move is better than 40ft. Or run away (no AoO because of cover) for 120ft in a direction Korn can't run aswell because of the obstacles. And there's my cover comment. And what about the total defense bonus? @Pittbull: Better not. It might coincidently produce something that violates the CoC :D |
| Huan02-21-05, 10:33 AM | Well, the full defense action you took would have worn off round 6. If you DID do full defense in Round 6 (and thus been able to dodge the hit in Round 7), you would have been able to escape with no problem, but would not have been able to call your horse (or double move, much less run). In hindsight, running in round 6 with the cover blocking any AoOs would have been the best bet, but it did not occur to me while obeying your specific tatics religiously. @PIttbull Yeah, when I translated it ... rather interesting result. Almost made me disbelieve the translator. |
| Pittbull02-21-05, 10:35 AM | And what about the total defense bonus? @Cat: Isn't total defense a full-round-action[EDIT: STANDART-ACTION]? Using this, you cannot double-move. @Huan: You don't need to spend your whole time on this fight. If you believe KoRn gets him, I'm fine with that, if you believe Mer-Man can keep up the distance, I'll also accept it. So, no worries. :) |
| Kaigan02-21-05, 12:36 PM | Tethtain vs. Kiyo is up. Please scan for errors. |
| Dalton Onestone02-21-05, 01:08 PM | Pssst, Peter, entferne lieber das letzte Posting bevor es jemand sieht LOL Auch die Postings haben jetzt Augen??? |
| Sindorin02-21-05, 02:21 PM | Ehrlich, Ich weiss nicht warum wir sind Deutsch sprechen... das SRD ist auf Englisch geschreibt... aber Cat und Pittbull, habt ihr es auf Deutsch? |
| Caterane02-21-05, 02:29 PM | Some players in my group have the german version. Powerattack for example is "Heftiger Angriff" and Cleave is "Durchziehen". Yeah, that sounds damn cool. :cool: |
| xanadu02-21-05, 02:53 PM | "Hinterhaltige Angriff" (Sneak Attack) and "Blitzstrahl" (lightning bolt) have offically replaced the English versions here :) Cat, is a German version of the SRD available online anywhere? |
| Sindorin02-21-05, 03:05 PM | Heh, yes, now that we have gotten way off topic... There are still lots of fights that haven't been posted. I hope everyone is on track! I do know there was a brief period over the weekend where the boards were down... it was very short... anyway. I am just wondering how my fights went this week, what with the deadline being soon. |
| spasheridan02-21-05, 03:07 PM | Tethtain vs. Kiyo is up. Please scan for errors. For spotting purposes ... you forgot to take distance mods into account. That one time that Tethtain spotted Kino... Tethtan would have failed because of distance mods. You also forgot Move SIlent rolls. Tethtain could have determined direction that Kino was to close distance with listen rolls. Keep distance mods in mind as well. Kino, if he was planning on sniping, would have probably moved back every round as Tethtain was closing. He would have made a single 15 ft move every rnd so he had no penalties to his hide or move silent. |
| Huan02-21-05, 03:23 PM | I am rerunning the KoRn vs Mer-Man fight from the beginning of round 6 on grounds that neither KoRn's attack nor Mer-Man's escape were completely per tactics. |
| xanadu02-21-05, 04:14 PM | You also forgot Move SIlent rolls. Tethtain could have determined direction that Kino was to close distance with listen rolls. Keep distance mods in mind as well. But Kiyo was standing still... Kino, if he was planning on sniping, would have probably moved back every round as Tethtain was closing. He would have made a single 15 ft move every rnd so he had no penalties to his hide or move silent. I dunno. He has no move silently skill, was far from the enemy, and already near the edge of the map. Tethtain just got a lucky spot check. Also, he did not say move back until aftersniping him. I'd rather have the pitlord follow tactics unless something anticpated happens which forces them to improvise. |
| spasheridan02-21-05, 04:24 PM | But Kiyo was standing still... Yeah, but he moved on rnd 1 at least and he was using tatoos and powers. I dunno. He has no move silently skill, was far from the enemy, and already near the edge of the map. Tethtain just got a lucky spot check. Also, he did not say move back until aftersniping him. I'd rather have the pitlord follow tactics unless something anticpated happens which forces them to improvise. Some of the tactics: 5) Now, if he still has not spotted me, snipe at him with the bow. (remember, he is denied dex), then move back. 6) Keep moving so he cannot charge (there is an obstacle in the way between us), and keep moving back while firing arrows at him. 7) If you HAVE to enter melee, grapple him the first chance you get. Once grappled, use grapple checks to inflict dmg. Note how he mentions that he wants to keep moving so no charge is possible and how he wants to avoid melee. Sounds like the basic assumption is to keep maximum effective range and obstacles between them at all times. Especially if the opponent starts to close. BUT you're right, he didn't specificly say to move away until he starts sniping. |
| Caterane02-21-05, 05:25 PM | "Hinterhaltige Angriff" (Sneak Attack) and "Blitzstrahl" (lightning bolt) have offically replaced the English versions here :) Cat, is a German version of the SRD available online anywhere? Hinterhaeltiger Angriff. (or Hinterhältiger if you have the ä but ae is the same) No, not that I know of. But I'm sure I can translate most of the terms appropriately. |
| Kaigan02-21-05, 06:06 PM | Yeah, but he moved on rnd 1 at least and he was using tatoos and powers. Some of the tactics: Note how he mentions that he wants to keep moving so no charge is possible and how he wants to avoid melee. Sounds like the basic assumption is to keep maximum effective range and obstacles between them at all times. Especially if the opponent starts to close. BUT you're right, he didn't specificly say to move away until he starts sniping. I didn't need to roll a move silently on round 1. There was no way for Teth to hear that. Most of the tattoos that he used and powers were auditory, so yes, I should have rolled listen checks there, I didn't because Teth was readying his action vs. Spotting. No where in his tactics did it say to what to do under conditions of hearing anything. Now in the case of Teth spotting Kiyo, I did the roll, but I wasn't even sure if I needed to, as the power, defensive precognition has a visual display when manifesting, so if anything Teth would have seen that. But in the event that Teth didn't spot Kiyo, the fight would have only been prolonged a little longer, as Teth would move closer and closer, then Kiyo would snipe, whcih Teth would probably see, then Teth would chase down Kiyo, resulting in the same outcome. Kiyo only had a base speed of 30, while Teth had his horse, and Kiyo only stated movements for charging, but Teth didn't need to. So the fight will come out the same in both instances, I believe. If someone disagrees strongly with me, then please state so I can discuss it. |
| spasheridan02-21-05, 06:15 PM | But in the event that Teth didn't spot Kiyo, the fight would have only been prolonged a little longer, as Teth would move closer and closer, then Kiyo would snipe, whcih Teth would probably see, then Teth would chase down Kiyo, resulting in the same outcome. Kiyo only had a base speed of 30, while Teth had his horse, and Kiyo only stated movements for charging, but Teth didn't need to. Sure, the listen checks were just a little extra that doesn't mean much. But the spot checks were key. If Kioyo keeps a distance of 100 ft between him and Teth then all of Teh's spot checks are at -10. So a spot (+6 for Teth, -10 for distance so -4 to the roll) vs a Hide (+6 +10 chameleon -20 for snipe = -4 to the roll) gives a 50 /50 that the sniper remains hidden. Increasing the distance to 110 ft means that it's -5 spot vs -4 hide. There's a good chance that Teth CAN'T spot the sniper now and can't close to the sniper... and this could give Kioyo a few hits that could be the differance between win and loss. |
| Naerdaloth02-21-05, 06:18 PM | Indri vs. Hakatri posted. Things were going one way.. some botched rolls vs seemingly harmless DCs later... things went the other way.. |
| spasheridan02-21-05, 06:36 PM | Indri vs. Hakatri posted. Things were going one way.. some botched rolls vs seemingly harmless DCs later... things went the other way.. A few things to note: Round 1: Indri needs to make a concentration check DC 10 to manifest force screen while riding the horse Round 2: Indri needs to make a concentration check DC 10 to manifest force screen while riding the horse Round 3: Why doesn't Indri's mount make an attack as well this round? Why doesn't Hak's mount make an attack this round? Round 4: Again, why don't the mounts atack this round? Round 5: Ride checks DC 15 or else you take d6 damage from falling off the mount, both players. |
| Kaigan02-21-05, 06:41 PM | Sure, the listen checks were just a little extra that doesn't mean much. But the spot checks were key. If Kioyo keeps a distance of 100 ft between him and Teth then all of Teh's spot checks are at -10. So a spot (+6 for Teth, -10 for distance so -4 to the roll) vs a Hide (+6 +10 chameleon -20 for snipe = -4 to the roll) gives a 50 /50 that the sniper remains hidden. Increasing the distance to 110 ft means that it's -5 spot vs -4 hide. There's a good chance that Teth CAN'T spot the sniper now and can't close to the sniper... and this could give Kioyo a few hits that could be the differance between win and loss. The thing is that he wasn't 100 feet away, by the time he had would have started sniping, Teth would have been within 40, besides, I could also say that, oh Teth could hear where Kiyo is, so he'll move towards the sound, so that when he does spot Kiyo, he'll be really close say, 10ft. |
| Caterane02-21-05, 06:52 PM | Not to forget that neither Hakatri nor Indri will be prone if their horses die thus no AoO's. Wow Spash, it's not only the avatar you have in common with Jindl. Perhaps we should make this avatar mandatory for everyone :D |
| Sindorin02-21-05, 07:18 PM | I have retired Sokai. |
| Naerdaloth02-21-05, 07:20 PM | About the Concentration: Fair enough, i just didnt think it applied because they were psilike abilities opposed to actual manifesting. Round 3: Indri's horse didnt attack because he just moved into melee, didnt think it applied. Haks horse didnt attack 1) he made several actions besides just attacking himself, 2) his tactics didnt mention it. Round 4: Indri used the crawling tattoo, which isnt attacking, so i wasnt sure if the horse could still attack while Indri acted (the tattoo isnt attacking, so the DC 10 Ride usage wouldnt apply Regardless Im going to be rerunning from Round 4 on, so Beldin and Caterane please refrain from updating sheets/roster. To note, I'm using brand new rolls so dont be surprised to see like everything thrown out and rearranged. |
| spasheridan02-21-05, 07:26 PM | The thing is that he wasn't 100 feet away, by the time he had would have started sniping, Teth would have been within 40, besides, I could also say that, oh Teth could hear where Kiyo is, so he'll move towards the sound, so that when he does spot Kiyo, he'll be really close say, 10ft. Sorry Kaigan. You asked for a look at your match... I think my main points are: 1) Keep distance mods in mind for spot / listen 2) Consider moving both PCs 3) Listen checks to direct Teth towards the target if he can't spot him. Auditory: A bass-pitched hum issues from the manifester’s vicinity or in the vicinity of the power’s subject (manifester’s choice), eerily akin to many deep-pitched voices. The sound grows in a second from hardly noticeable to as loud as a shout strident enough to be heard within 100 feet. At the manifester’s option, the instantaneous sound can be so soft that it can be heard only within 15 feet with a successful DC 10 Listen check. Some powers describe unique auditory displays. It's a bit unfair to have Kiyo just sit there while Teth closes every round, and it looks like Kiyo can be very very quite if he wants. @Caterane: Does Jindl nitpick as bad as I do?? @Naerdaloth: Round 3: Indri's horse didnt attack because he just moved into melee, didnt think it applied. Haks horse didnt attack 1) he made several actions besides just attacking himself, 2) his tactics didnt mention it. It's a warhorse, it'll attack whomever is attacking it's owner. THis is just the warhorse's instinctive behavrior |
| Jindl02-21-05, 07:33 PM | @Caterane: Does Jindl nitpick as bad as I do?? I used too, but now I'm too lazy :P |
| xanadu02-21-05, 07:52 PM | I have retired Sokai. Why? It is not like Sokai was doing badly :confused: |
| LLMadCow02-21-05, 08:09 PM | Re: Cover vs. ranged attacks: there's a variant rule in the DMG for hitting the cover, but we've never used it. Also Dune Vs. Zaqh is up. (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?p=5490969#post5490969) The winner used violence. Rolls are here (http://krisinchico.brinkster.net/searchroll.asp?username=DuneZaqh#148695) . DUNEWALKER LIVES! Please do finish the fight from where it ended, but first let me explain everything and express why he lives! For starters, at the point which Dunwealker moves to engage Zaqh, they are now adjacent to each other and the lance can longer be used for attack! Lance: A lance deals double damage when used from the back of a charging mount. It has reach, so you can strike opponents 10 feet away with it, but you can’t use it against an adjacent foe. While mounted, you can wield a lance with one hand. The horse can attack DW, and land a hit, but DW is still VERY alive and ready to continue battle. So, I do look forward to a proper conclusion to the battle. Thanks! LL |
| Jindl02-21-05, 08:17 PM | DUNEWALKER LIVES! Please do finish the fight from where it ended, but first let me explain everything and express why he lives! For starters, at the point which Dunwealker moves to engage Zaqh, they are now adjacent to each other and the lance can longer be used for attack! The horse can attack DW, and land a hit, but DW is still VERY alive and ready to continue battle. So, I do look forward to a proper conclusion to the battle. Thanks! LL Sorry, but your premise is incorrect. From the Rules of the Game - All about Mounts (Part One): A mount and rider share the same space on the battlefield. For all game purposes, you and your mount function as a single unit on the battlefield. Your mount continues to use its own space and reach while carrying you. You effectively use your mount's space and your own reach (or whatever extended reach your weapon gives you) while mounted. While you're mounted, any attack that can reach a square in the space you and your mount jointly occupy can affect you or your mount (it doesn't make a difference which square). Likewise, you measure your reach for your melee attacks and the range for your ranged attacks from any square you and your mount jointly occupy. You don't get cover from your mount unless you use the Ride skill to get it, and your mount doesn't block your attacks and provide your foes with cover. He can measure his reach with the lance from the back 5 ft squares of his space, and his foe is not provided cover from his mount. So while mounted, it is possible to attack adjacent foes with a lance. As a note: The Rules of the Game - All about Mounts now contains an explanation on grappling mounted characters... |
| LLMadCow02-21-05, 08:34 PM | Sorry, but your premise is incorrect. From the Rules of the Game - All about Mounts (Part One): He can measure his reach with the lance from the back 5 ft squares of his space, and his foe is not provided cover from his mount. So while mounted, it is possible to attack adjacent foes with a lance. As a note: The Rules of the Game - All about Mounts now contains an explanation on grappling mounted characters... That quote is enough to establish the proper reach for a variety of situations, but it says nothing about negating the adjacent foe issue. |
| Jindl02-21-05, 08:45 PM | That quote is enough to establish the proper reach for a variety of situations, but it says nothing about negating the adjacent foe issue. Please look again. If you are mounted, your space is (X) and your adjacent foe is (y): 1...5 . . XXy . XX . 5 Since you can pick any 1 of the squares that make up your space to determine reach to your opponent, you can choose the square at (3,3). This square meets the lance's criteria of 10 ft reach to your opponent at (5,3). The text continues to say that your mount does not provide the foe cover, so the square at (4,3) does not interfere with your attack. Thus you can use a 10 ft reach weapon while adjacent if you are mounted on a creature larger than medium size. -Jindl |
| LLMadCow02-21-05, 09:03 PM | Please look again. If you are mounted, your space is (X) and your adjacent foe is (y): 1...5 . . XXy . XX . 5 Since you can pick any 1 of the squares that make up your space to determine reach to your opponent, you can choose the square at (3,3). This square meets the lance's criteria of 10 ft reach to your opponent at (5,3). The text continues to say that your mount does not provide the foe cover, so the square at (4,3) does not interfere with your attack. Thus you can use a 10 ft reach weapon while adjacent if you are mounted on a creature larger than medium size. -Jindl I agree that he can reach the square, but NOTHING changes the fact that a lance cannot be used against an adjacent foe. You could tell me that the lance is 5' long, but when it says cannot be used against an adjacent foe, the rule means it cannot be used against an adjacent foe. It's not like the rule was written against people who want to run around with a lance while not mounted.... The rule was written for mounted characters and very specifically says it cannot attack adjacent foes. Great, everything you have quoted says that while mounted he has some awesome reach, but still cannot attack adjacent characters. |
| Snommelp02-21-05, 09:15 PM | @ T'Var: I guess you didn't get the Addendum to my tactics. It said that if Snomm got hit with one of the big Magic Missiles, he would use a healing potion or two. I'm not going to blame you for ignoring tactics you didn't get, though. I do wonder how you didn't get it though. My PM box says I sent it. Perhaps something strange was happening with the PM system at that time? |
| Dalton Onestone02-21-05, 09:32 PM | It's not like the rule was written against people who want to run around with a lance while not mounted.... The rule was written for mounted characters and very specifically says it cannot attack adjacent foes. I don't think that's so obvious. Perhaps it was written for people who want to run around with a guisarme while not mounted. Saying you can't consider yourself as being on the side of the mount that's 10 ft. from the opponent rather than the one that's 5 ft. from the opponent would lead to a lot of weirdnesses. |
| spasheridan02-21-05, 09:42 PM | @T'Var: In the match between Odin and The Buddha... something to note. From the SRD If You’re Pinned by an Opponent When an opponent has pinned you, you are held immobile (but not helpless) for 1 round. While you’re pinned, you take a –4 penalty to your AC against opponents other than the one pinning you. At your opponent’s option, you may also be unable to speak. On your turn, you can try to escape the pin by making an opposed grapple check in place of an attack. You can make an Escape Artist check in place of your grapple check if you want, but this requires a standard action. If you win, you escape the pin, but you’re still grappling. How did Odin CDG his opponent when The BUddhawas not helpless? Am I missing something about these whip tokens? Round 3 Odin commands the whip to pin Buddha [Whip 12+15=27 vs 18+1=19 success] which the whip does easily. Odin begins to CDG Buddha provoking an AoO from Sutra [Hoof 18+6=24 vs AC 20 hit] 4+4=8dmg [CDG dmg 5+6+4+15=30dmg] [Fort save 15+2=17 vs DC 40 fail] Buddha dies CDG is a full round action, so: Sutra gets an attack on his go on rnd 3 On Rnd 4 the whip has to KEEP the pin, the Odin has to finish the CDG, and Sutra gets another AoO BUT, it doesn't matter becaue the pin doesn't make you helpless so a CDG is illegal. |
| SnarkHunter02-21-05, 09:46 PM | @LL sorry I didn't make onething clear but Dunewalker actually did attack from 10ft away. See, the powerful build allows him to weild a weapon 1 size larger then normal. As I understood it, a large sized weapon provides the weilder with 10ft of reach with that weapon. This is similar to using a reach weapon, except that like a large creature the Half Giant is able to attack creatures standing 5ft away as well. Make sense? @T'Var, a pinned creature is not helpless, they cannot be CDGed. Not that Buddha's in the best situation there but you should prolly get that straight anyway. Edit: Very fast Jindl...as always :) Edit 2: When trying to manifest in the grapple whynot use one of the psionic focuses and succede automaticly? |
| LLMadCow02-21-05, 09:54 PM | I don't think that's so obvious. Perhaps it was written for people who want to run around with a guisarme while not mounted. Saying you can't consider yourself as being on the side of the mount that's 10 ft. from the opponent rather than the one that's 5 ft. from the opponent would lead to a lot of weirdnesses. Here is what I am saying: move all you want, all you do is extend the distance you can attack in all directions. NOTHING states that this extra reach NEGATES the rule about not being able to attack adjacent to you. You show me where it says that it negates the 'cannot attack adjacent foes' part and you win a cookie. |
| Dalton Onestone02-21-05, 09:57 PM | You show me where it says that it negates the 'cannot attack adjacent foes' part and you win a cookie. It says that you can regard yourself as not being adjacent for the purpose of determining reach. And reach is a core part of the concept of which squares you can and can't attack, as in the phrase "reach weapon." |
| LLMadCow02-21-05, 09:57 PM | @LL sorry I didn't make onething clear but Dunewalker actually did attack from 10ft away. See, the powerful build allows him to weild a weapon 1 size larger then normal. As I understood it, a large sized weapon provides the weilder with 10ft of reach with that weapon. This is similar to using a reach weapon, except that like a large creature the Half Giant is able to attack creatures standing 5ft away as well. Make sense? Nope. Sorry. Powerful Build: The physical stature of half-giants lets them function in many ways as if they were one size category larger. Whenever a half-giant is subject to a size modifier or special size modifier for an opposed check (such as during grapple checks, bull rush attempts, and trip attempts), the half-giant is treated as one size larger if doing so is advantageous to him. A half-giant is also considered to be one size larger when determining whether a creature’s special attacks based on size (such as improved grab or swallow whole) can affect him. A half-giant can use weapons designed for a creature one size larger without penalty. However, his space and reach remain those of a creature of his actual size. The benefits of this racial trait stack with the effects of powers, abilities, and spells that change the subject’s size category. |
| Dalton Onestone02-21-05, 09:59 PM | Didn't Dunewalker get his expanded reach from Expanding himself, or am I getting my fights mixed up? |
| LLMadCow02-21-05, 10:01 PM | It says that you can regard yourself as not being adjacent for the purpose of determining reach. And reach is a core part of the concept of which squares yo can and can't attack, as in the phrase "reach weapon." It DOES NOT use the word adjacent anywhere in the current quote. It does say you can attack from another square to reach further, but it does not say this negates the issue of adjacent foes. |
| LLMadCow02-21-05, 10:02 PM | Didn't Dunewalker get his expanded reach from Expanding himself, or am I getting my fights mixed up? Dunewalker is a Half-Giant Ranger 2 / Barbarian 1 - No expansion here my friend. Edit: Also no special/supernatural abilities, potions, scrolls, tattoos, powerstones, powers and/or spells were used to achieve the use of Large sized weapons; Half-Giants have the racial ability to use larger weapons without the benefit of extra reach. |
| LLMadCow02-21-05, 10:37 PM | I have looked over everything that has been posted, and I still say that Dunewalker is alive and well and the fight should be completed. For all game purposes, you and your mount function as a single unit on the battlefield. Your mount continues to use its own space and reach while carrying you. You effectively use your mount's space and your own reach (or whatever extended reach your weapon gives you) while mounted. While you're mounted, any attack that can reach a square in the space you and your mount jointly occupy can affect you or your mount (it doesn't make a difference which square). Likewise, you measure your reach for your melee attacks and the range for your ranged attacks from any square you and your mount jointly occupy. You don't get cover from your mount unless you use the Ride skill to get it, and your mount doesn't block your attacks and provide your foes with cover. What this is saying is that for attack purposes you and your mount are one unit. So, if you have a reach weapon, you can attack ANY creature that is within 10' of your mount. This does not mean that you can attack foes that are adjacent if the weapon you are holding specifically says that you cannot attack adjacent foes. |
| Jindl02-21-05, 10:40 PM | Edit: Very fast Jindl...as always :) I think you mean Spasheridan. I understand though. When you see a cool avatar making knowledgeable statements very quickly, you automatically think Jindl, right? ;) |
| spasheridan02-21-05, 10:41 PM | @ Jindl: We really need a cage match for the icon.... :D |
| Jindl02-21-05, 10:42 PM | @LL - What you are missing is that the passage I quoted says you determine reach from any one square of your space. Since you can determine reach from a square 10 ft from your foe, the foe is not adjacent to that square, and thus the lance can be used against him. Determining reach means all aspects of reach, including the section negating adjacent attack. |
| Huan02-21-05, 10:46 PM | Bare-bones of Anna vs Vyncent (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5501776) is up. Short version: Scary how some ranged attacks can be. Before anyone asks, YES there was a line of sight between attacks, despite cover (a clear, unbroken line COULD be drawn from a corner of one square to the corner of another). |
| Jindl02-21-05, 10:46 PM | Short version: Scary how some ranged attacks can be. Before anyone asks, YES there was a line of sight between attacks, despite cover (a clear, unbroken line COULD be drawn from a corner of one square to the corner of another). Introducing the long range true sniper. (that's short for true striking archer :D) @Huan - Just in case anyone wants to see them, please add the pm I sent you negating the use of poison in Anna's tactics. |
| spasheridan02-21-05, 10:48 PM | What this is saying is that for attack purposes you and your mount are one unit. So, if you have a reach weapon, you can attack [U]ANY creature[/] that is within 10' of your mount. This does not mean that you can attack foes that are adjacent if the weapon you are holding specifically says that you cannot attack adjacent foes. I don't see the battle, but could the mount have done a full attack, 5 ft back, and then have the rider smash with the lance? That would have the same rolls and have the same outcome... BTW, LL, did you finish the fight for Fyhir yet? |
| Jindl02-21-05, 10:51 PM | I think I agree with LLMadcow here. For most purposes, when mounted, you become the size of your mount. This includes determining where you are for reach weapons. I don't see the battle, but could the mount have done a full attack, 5 ft back, and then have the rider smash with the lance? That would have the same rolls and have the same outcome... The attack in question was the end of a charge. Follow the link here (http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20050125a) and have a look at how Skip Williams explains it. Now, I don't always agree with his rulings, but the Rule's of the Game are accepted as Official here, just like the FAQ and Errata (although the latter two are given priority). |
| LLMadCow02-21-05, 10:52 PM | @LL - What you are missing is that the passage I quoted says you determine reach from any one square of your space. Since you can determine reach from a square 10 ft from your foe, the foe is not adjacent to that square, and thus the lance can be used against him. Determining reach means all aspects of reach, including the section negating adjacent attack. That is fine if that is how you understand that ruling, but remember that everything you have quoted is NOT in the SRD 3.5, is NOT in the Core Rulebooks and has NOT been approved or even voted on by the Council of Elders or the GMs; considering all of this and EVERYTHING else I have mentioned I have a VERY sound arguement in requesting a re-run. |
| Huan02-21-05, 10:54 PM | @Jindl & anyone else Right, here it is: But about the poison...I will go along with your tactics, but here is what I read: Code of Conduct: A paladin must be of lawful good alignment and loses all class abilities if she ever willingly commits an evil act. Additionally, a paladin’s code requires that she respect legitimate authority, act with honor (not lying, not cheating, not using poison, and so forth), help those in need (provided they do not use the help for evil or chaotic ends), and punish those who harm or threaten innocents. Okay, so I learned something new today. Well, that's a bit of a build mistake, huh? Don't use the poison (in fact, refund it for me since Anna cannot use it, and make a note of it in red on her sheet). Hopefully she can deal 9 hps of damage without the posion :weep: |
| LLMadCow02-21-05, 10:56 PM | I don't see the battle, but could the mount have done a full attack, 5 ft back, and then have the rider smash with the lance? That would have the same rolls and have the same outcome... BTW, LL, did you finish the fight for Fyhir yet? I am working on my fights. They will likely be late. I had previously requested no fights, but that was forgotten. I have been working on the fights, but I have been having to redo some things. I am not trying to post fights that have issues and just have to be rerun, so I am taking my time. Sorry if they are late, real life issues have been overwhelming me. |
| Arstimis02-21-05, 11:00 PM | I am with you there LL. My computer decided to stop working friday, saturday and most of sunday, so i have just now been able to get to the fight...but im hoping to get it done tonight... |
| Snommelp02-21-05, 11:17 PM | @ T'Var: I guess you didn't get the Addendum to my tactics. It said that if Snomm got hit with one of the big Magic Missiles, he would use a healing potion or two. I'm not going to blame you for ignoring tactics you didn't get, though. I do wonder how you didn't get it though. My PM box says I sent it. Perhaps something strange was happening with the PM system at that time? Call me what you will, but I'm hoping for some kind of verification one way or the other for this. I was sure I sent that Addendum, but it didn't show up in Snomm's tactics... and now I'm getting paranoid and thinking maybe T'Var missed this earlier post because of the lance debate. Speaking of the lance debate, I have to agree with MadCow. It's in both the SRD and the PHB: "[A lance] has reach, so you can strike opponents 10 feet away with it, but you can't use it against an adjacent foe." If you strike from the far end of your horse's squares, then you fit the first part but not the second, since you are still adjacent. As for the implied proposal that they just forgot mounted combat: right before that it mentions double damage from a charging mount. It seems ridiculous to assume that they would be thinking about mounted combat in the first (and third) sentence(s) and completely forget about it during the second. |
| Sindorin02-22-05, 12:11 AM | Why? It is not like Sokai was doing badly :confused: I don't know, it just seems like he always has to get really lucky to do well. I probably won't retire him, I'll probably just sit him out a week because he lost... I've been having bad luck with the dice in this place lately. |
| T'Var02-22-05, 01:17 AM | Call me what you will, but I'm hoping for some kind of verification one way or the other for this. I was sure I sent that Addendum, but it didn't show up in Snomm's tactics... and now I'm getting paranoid and thinking maybe T'Var missed this earlier post because of the lance debate. Ya i did miss your earlier post, also I dont know what happened but I didnt get any add on to your tactics. I trust you though, sometimes PMs dont go even though they say they did. I can re-run it with you drinking the potions if you want, let me know |
| Snommelp02-22-05, 01:55 AM | Ya i did miss your earlier post, also I dont know what happened but I didnt get any add on to your tactics. I trust you though, sometimes PMs dont go even though they say they did. I can re-run it with you drinking the potions if you want, let me know That's ok, it probably wouldn't matter too much anyways. Even if I drank my way up to full health, he still had another Magic Missile, and a horse too. I'll just level up next week instead. |
| cellardweller02-22-05, 01:59 AM | That is fine if that is how you understand that ruling, but remember that everything you have quoted is NOT in the SRD 3.5, is NOT in the Core Rulebooks and has NOT been approved or even voted on by the Council of Elders or the GMs; considering all of this and EVERYTHING else I have mentioned I have a VERY sound arguement in requesting a re-run. The rules of the game articles have always been part of the CoCo hierarchy of rules it states clearly what happens. Likewise, you measure your reach for your melee attacks and the range for your ranged attacks from any square you and your mount jointly occupy. You don't get cover from your mount unless you use the Ride skill to get it, and your mount doesn't block your attacks and provide your foes with cover. This does not conflict with the rule that you cannot attack an adjacent square because you are not attacking from an adjacent square. This is also consistent with the way cover is determined. Such a creature can choose any square that it occupies to determine if an opponent has cover against its melee attacks. |
| Snommelp02-22-05, 02:04 AM | Ah, but although you can choose to measure your reach from any of the squares, you are still occupying all four squares. Is this not so? |
| spasheridan02-22-05, 02:18 AM | @Cellardweller: Quick question on the last fight: Round 7 The elder readies his scroll and hopes the 3rd time will be a charm while sunrise attacks ("12"+6=18 vs AC18, ride "10"+12=22 negated, "14"+6=20, "6"+6=10, "9"+1=10 vs AC18) Monk bane attacks ("16"+4=20 vs AC18) finally downing the other horse (ride "8"+4=12 vs DC15, "4" damage), Moonmoon follows up (miss chance "38") but only catches air). Elder's readied action is triggered once more (CL "16"+1=17 vs DC10, "4"+"1"+"2"+"1"+"4"+5=17 damage) Skymoon 17/34 (-16,-15) Protection from Good (11) Monkbane 16/30 Eniolissaryn 23/11 (-14,-15) Invisible, Vigor Sunrise dying SO, this round, Elder goes first and readies an action while his mount attacks. Skymoon attacks and triggers the readied action. The readied action is an attack, ergo the invis dropd. THe readied action is also a casting of a spell, triggering an AoO. WHere's the AoO? And wouldn't the previous rounds attempt to read the scroll have triggered AoO as well? THe MM goes before the attack, ergo when skymoon attacks invis is gone, and the miss chance is ignored. Does the horse attack first and have to deal with the miss chance or does the rider go first? Without the miss chance I believe the elder goes down... Round 8 The elder steps back, draws a second scroll and unleashes its magics (CL "15"+1=16 vs DC10, "4"+"2"+"3"+"3"+"2"+5=19, Stay in saddle "97" stays put) Monkbane feels his beloved master go limp and is enraged, he steps forward and lets the nasty two-legger have it ("11"+6=18 vs AC11, "2"+4=6, "13"+6=19 vs AC11, "5"+4=9, "10"+1=11 vs AC11, "3"+1=4) Skymoon ("93") stabalises Skymoon -2/34 (-16,-15) Protection from Good (11) Monkbane 16/30 Eniolissaryn 4/11 (-14,-15) Invisible Sunrise 1/30 You didn't move Elder this round, but you probably should have, Elder, now visible, would have incurred an AoO for casting. Moving the mount requires ride check and a concentration check to cast the spell from a moving mount. Moving the mount may also provoke an AoO so.... |
| cellardweller02-22-05, 02:25 AM | SO, this round, Elder goes first and readies an action while his mount attacks. Skymoon attacks and triggers the readied action. The readied action is an attack, ergo the invis dropd. THe readied action is also a casting of a spell, triggering an AoO. WHere's the AoO? And wouldn't the previous rounds attempt to read the scroll have triggered AoO as well? He is still invisible until the spell completes - no AoO from concealment. THe MM goes before the attack, ergo when skymoon attacks invis is gone, and the miss chance is ignored. Does the horse attack first and have to deal with the miss chance or does the rider go first? Without the miss chance I believe the elder goes down... Spell was readied on completion of the standard action (best choice). Spell doesn't happen until after Skymoon misses. The horse and rider use exactly the same initiative score so they happen at the same time. You didn't move Elder this round, but you probably should have, Elder, now visible, would have incurred an AoO for casting. True - Defesive cast concentration "14"+enough vs DC15. |
| cellardweller02-22-05, 02:34 AM | Ah, but although you can choose to measure your reach from any of the squares, you are still occupying all four squares. Is this not so? I see it as a Schrolinger's cat type scenario. Much like an electron, the rider exists in all it's mounts squares until it is "observered". At that instant the rider reverts to a medium creature. Admittedly this is an "interpretation" of the rules, but it is the only one that can fit all the rules. The interpretation that you are using conflicts with the rule in the RoG article. |
| cellardweller02-22-05, 02:44 AM | True - Defesive cast concentration "14"+enough vs DC15. He would still have drawn an AoO for drawing the scroll, but it is not clear from the Elder's sheet whether they are multiple spells on the same scroll or 4 seperate scrolls. I'm going to have to trust Jindl's honor and ask him which. If they are on the same scroll, result stands as he doesn't need to draw. If they are separate, the Elder is probably going to lose. [Edit]Edited the fight assuming that they were seperate scrolls and the result was the the same. |
| Einzelgaenger02-22-05, 03:04 AM | Aureus vs Rose is up. |
| spasheridan02-22-05, 03:18 AM | Spell was readied on completion of the standard action (best choice). Spell doesn't happen until after Skymoon misses. The horse and rider use exactly the same initiative score so they happen at the same time. Eldar has a choice. Either go before skymoon OR go after him on rnd 7... the readied action can interrupt the attack (and let the attack hit him w/out invis) or he can go after the attack, setting his init to after skymoon. IF Elder takes the 2nd option, which seems to contradict his tactics, then Skymoon goes 1st on rnd 8 and gets some swings in on the now visible mage. Basicly Eldar can't take 2 turns in a row, skymoon gets to go between them. His "between" turn is either on rnd 7 or on rnd 8, and both he and his horse are going to get a full rnd of smashing on the visible mage. |
| cellardweller02-22-05, 03:33 AM | Eldar has a choice. Either go before skymoon OR go after him on rnd 7... the readied action can interrupt the attack (and let the attack hit him w/out invis) or he can go after the attack, setting his init to after skymoon. IF Elder takes the 2nd option, which seems to contradict his tactics, then Skymoon goes 1st on rnd 8 and gets some swings in on the now visible mage. Basicly Eldar can't take 2 turns in a row, skymoon gets to go between them. His "between" turn is either on rnd 7 or on rnd 8, and both he and his horse are going to get a full rnd of smashing on the visible mage. You can ready a standard action, a move action, or a free action. To do so, specify the action you will take and the conditions under which you will take it. Then, any time before your next action, you may take the readied action in response to that condition. The condition was "Skymoon completes his standard action" Your initiative result changes. For the rest of the encounter, your initiative result is the count on which you took the readied action, and you act immediately ahead of the character whose action triggered your readied action. Skymoon completing his attack triggered the readied action, so now the Elder resets to being just before Skymoon. Its all rules jiggery-pokery but still perfectly legal. |
| spasheridan02-22-05, 03:46 AM | All I can say is... WOW I find it... highly weird... that there's a way to get 2 turns in a row. Basicly the ruling hinges on allowing the end of an action to be before the end of your turn. IF you can take an action after I finish my action but before the end of my turn then you're readied action has interupted my turn and you can reset to before me on the next round. IMO the more reasonable interpertation would be that the end of an action IS the end of your turn, so you can either trigger your readied action before my action or after my turn. But I bow before the superior rules Kung Fu. |
| Jindl02-22-05, 09:49 AM | He would still have drawn an AoO for drawing the scroll, but it is not clear from the Elder's sheet whether they are multiple spells on the same scroll or 4 seperate scrolls. I'm going to have to trust Jindl's honor and ask him which. I have two ways of writing that I have multiple castings of the same scroll. One way is to put the multiplier before the word "scroll", Such as 2x scroll: cure serious wounds. This indicates that they are seperate scrolls. The other way is to put the multiplier before the spell, such as scroll: 4x cure light wounds. This indicates that all 4 spells are on the same scroll. (Please see JotHF's character sheet for the 2 examples above). In this case, it was written "scroll: 4x magic missile (CL9)", so yes, all 4 spells are on the same scroll. |
| Jindl02-22-05, 09:56 AM | I want to apologize to Pittbull, T'Var, Snarkhunter, and Sindorin for the lateness of the fights I am running for your characters. The fights will be up today. Sorry guys. |
| Pittbull02-22-05, 10:01 AM | I want to apologize to Pittbull, T'Var, Snarkhunter, and Sindorin for the lateness of the fights I am running for your characters. The fights will be up today. Sorry guys. Don't worry! Take your time! :) |
| Huan02-22-05, 10:51 AM | Re-run of Mer-Man vs KoRn (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5491663) is up. Barring no objections, working furiously on those stories... |
| Pittbull02-22-05, 11:04 AM | Re-run of Mer-Man vs KoRn (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5491663) is up. Barring no objections, working furiously on those stories... Giving him no cover nor using one of his force-screen-stones, was not so nice and I don't under why he regains his focus for a ranged-battle. But I hate reruns and won't ask for one. This fight should be regarded as finished. Well, let's see, what's happen next week. :( Edit: Why is KoRn's ranged attack only +3? It should 5+1Precognition, offense=6-1size-1(dex-decrease)=+4 ! And..., dismissing the expansion would have been intellegent, KoRn Int is 14. Sorry, but he seemed to me like puppet. Again, this no request for a rerun. |
| Arstimis02-22-05, 11:40 AM | @T'Var: First... How in the world did my horse with a 75 ft movement get trapped by animals with 50ft and slower movement? Also, please tell me anywhere in my tactics that i said to draw a melee weapon? That is the worst thing you could have done for me. And I could have swore my tactics said do not pay attention to the animals shoot at The Ripper. Please tell me im wrong there so I wont have to request a rerun for a badly run fight.... oh, and if that isnt bad enough Arthemus's AC is not 21...its 27 for the fight after round 3. [10 +7(dex) +4(inertial armor) +4(force screen) +2(protection from law) =27] and against touch attacks it would be 19 (not that it mattered against touch attacks) To Sum it Up: If you would have followed my tactics just like i said them. Then i would have never spurred my horse, I would have continued to shoot arrows for 5th round and beyond. But i guess im the kinda guy that no one has to follow tactics for.....it happens alot Here's the link...if anyone wants to look at it and try to say im in the wrong. http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5490174&postcount=1298 |
| Huan02-22-05, 11:51 AM | Giving him no cover nor using one of his force-screen-stones, was not so nice and I don't under why he regains his focus for a ranged-battle. But I hate reruns and won't ask for one. This fight should be regarded as finished. Well, let's see, what's happen next week. :( Edit: Why is KoRn's ranged attack only +3? It should 5+1=6-1size-1(dex-decrease)=+4 Precognition, offense! I'm sorry, you are right about the attack (unfortunately, you still would not have been able to hit except on a 20). I had you refocus only for the Speed of Thought. As for the lack of Force Screen, I cannot say anything except that when a person tells me to "improvise" for them, I generally stay away from their expendables unless they tell me what I am allowed to use (I don't want to get burned for "wasting it", but I end up getting burned for not using it, anyway ... *sigh* I can't win) |
| Arstimis02-22-05, 12:04 PM | In other, more joyful news, my fights done...sorry about the lateness, but as i said before, my computer was down friday, saturday, and most of sunday Gabriel vs Dorian (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5505324&postcount=1314) |
| Pittbull02-22-05, 12:24 PM | I'm sorry, you are right about the attack (unfortunately, you still would not have been able to hit except on a 20). I had you refocus only for the Speed of Thought. As for the lack of Force Screen, I cannot say anything except that when a person tells me to "improvise" for them, I generally stay away from their expendables unless they tell me what I am allowed to use (I don't want to get burned for "wasting it", but I end up getting burned for not using it, anyway ... *sigh* I can't win) No problem mate! Usually I write: " You can use my equipment as you like.", but must have forgotten that. I have no concerns and no problems, this fight wasn't so good, but next time it'll be better. We are here to have fun and learn exiting tricks. Cat's tactic to wait in total-defense was realy great, I liked that. Thank you,for spending so much time on it. :) |
| Sindorin02-22-05, 12:43 PM | I want to apologize to Pittbull, T'Var, Snarkhunter, and Sindorin for the lateness of the fights I am running for your characters. The fights will be up today. Sorry guys. No problem here, Jindl, I've enjoyed trying to debate about pointless stuff that I'm always wrong about while waiting for the result. :) |
| KerlanRayne02-22-05, 01:25 PM | Reposted Later. |
| SnarkHunter02-22-05, 01:26 PM | Aureus vs Rose is up. Spurs of riding: 50gp ride check 1+13=14) and fails (+2 tool bonus from saddle only for staying in saddle) Since AC vs. the second crit confirm was 23 I think it failed. |
| T'Var02-22-05, 01:36 PM | @T'Var: First... How in the world did my horse with a 75 ft movement get trapped by animals with 50ft and slower movement? Also, please tell me anywhere in my tactics that i said to draw a melee weapon? That is the worst thing you could have done for me. And I could have swore my tactics said do not pay attention to the animals shoot at The Ripper. Please tell me im wrong there so I wont have to request a rerun for a badly run fight.... oh, and if that isnt bad enough Arthemus's AC is not 21...its 27 for the fight after round 3. [10 +7(dex) +4(inertial armor) +4(force screen) +2(protection from law) =27] and against touch attacks it would be 19 (not that it mattered against touch attacks) To Sum it Up: If you would have followed my tactics just like i said them. Then i would have never spurred my horse, I would have continued to shoot arrows for 5th round and beyond. But i guess im the kinda guy that no one has to follow tactics for.....it happens alot Horrible fight...but i guess im going to have to get used to it with the newer Pitlords..... Here's the link...if anyone wants to look at it and try to say im in the wrong. http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5490174&postcount=1298 careful boy, I havent unloaded in quite a while and one more comment about 'newer' and i'll rip you a new one as for your movement issues, YOU told ME in your tactics which square you wanted to be at round by round, so I put you there. just so happens that dog, horse and then hippogriff could all double move and get into a threating position in your last position Round 1 Viger, round 2 Skate, Round 3 Force Screen by your tactics....thats AC 21 ya dink Round 4 you wanted to be at 3, 16 so I put you there, the animals were able to make it there from there last position. also you noticed the summoning so i chose the protection over the IA because it would negate summoned attacks vs you. also the Protection only gives you AC bonus vs that Alinment and since all opponents in this fight were TN all it would have done was stop the hippogriff from killing you in one round Round 5 Your horse was ripped to shreads and that hippogriff could double move anywere you went Round 6 you nolonger had a mount...would you really want to have a bow out and provoke 3 AoOs every time you fired? or maybe I should have used the other weapon which you had no feats for? Oh ya thats right, you failed to realize you need +1bab to have ANY of the feats you chose... Not to menion you DID ignore the animals didnt attack them once, which may be another reason they ripped you a new one So 'To sum it up' You wish it I dish it. you have it in your tactics to be at a certain grid point at a certain round I put you there. Write better tactics or alt tactics when your horse dies |
| KerlanRayne02-22-05, 01:40 PM | @MadCowTemplate: Problems with the fight. Tanglefoot bag has a range increment of 10 feet, so that attack would have ben at -10 for range and the ride check would have negated it. Why didn't my PC do anything while Uday was retreating? Guiding him is a free action and he can still act. He could have used entangle again, or scraped off the goo, or attacked again, or used wand of cure light wounds. Why did he just sit there? How did opponent crit with a roll of 13? Crits use the roll before all modifiers. Why didn't he try to get cover from attacks with a ride check? KerlanRayne |
| Jindl02-22-05, 02:11 PM | @T'Var: First... How in the world did my horse with a 75 ft movement get trapped by animals with 50ft and slower movement? Also, please tell me anywhere in my tactics that i said to draw a melee weapon? That is the worst thing you could have done for me. And I could have swore my tactics said do not pay attention to the animals shoot at The Ripper. Please tell me im wrong there so I wont have to request a rerun for a badly run fight.... oh, and if that isnt bad enough Arthemus's AC is not 21...its 27 for the fight after round 3. [10 +7(dex) +4(inertial armor) +4(force screen) +2(protection from law) =27] and against touch attacks it would be 19 (not that it mattered against touch attacks) To Sum it Up: If you would have followed my tactics just like i said them. Then i would have never spurred my horse, I would have continued to shoot arrows for 5th round and beyond. But i guess im the kinda guy that no one has to follow tactics for.....it happens alot Horrible fight...but i guess im going to have to get used to it with the newer Pitlords..... Here's the link...if anyone wants to look at it and try to say im in the wrong. http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5490174&postcount=1298 careful boy, I havent unloaded in quite a while and one more comment about 'newer' and i'll rip you a new one as for your movement issues, YOU told ME in your tactics which square you wanted to be at round by round, so I put you there. just so happens that dog, horse and then hippogriff could all double move and get into a threating position in your last position Round 1 Viger, round 2 Skate, Round 3 Force Screen by your tactics....thats AC 21 ya dink Round 4 you wanted to be at 3, 16 so I put you there, the animals were able to make it there from there last position. also you noticed the summoning so i chose the protection over the IA because it would negate summoned attacks vs you. also the Protection only gives you AC bonus vs that Alinment and since all opponents in this fight were TN all it would have done was stop the hippogriff from killing you in one round Round 5 Your horse was ripped to shreads and that hippogriff could double move anywere you went Round 6 you nolonger had a mount...would you really want to have a bow out and provoke 3 AoOs every time you fired? So 'To sum it up' You wish it I dish it. you have it in your tactics to be at a certain grid point at a certain round I put you there. Write better tactics or alt tactics when your horse dies @T'Var + Arstimis - As an Elder, I just wanted to comment on this fight and your posts. @Arti, I can understand why T'Var is upset. Your initial post about the fight did attack him directly. This seems to be a common thing when you are unhappy about how a fight was ran. I hope you'll try taking a gentler approach in the future. Look at how Pittbull voiced his concerns to Huan this week, and how Huan reacted. I think you would have more success if you took the same approach. Okay, so now that I've told everybody to play nice, lets look at the actual issues in the fight: 1. If you choose to incorporate target locations to move to into your tactics, then the Pitlord is supposed to follow your tactics and move you there. So I think T'Var was acting correctly when he moved you to the exact space you requested, even though it didn't use all of your mount's movement and left you vulnerable to attack. I would suggest not listing specific grid locations in the future, and instead just mention a movement strategy (such as "stay more than 60 ft away" or "evade melee" or etc.) 2. Regarding having your character draw a melee weapon, I think T'Var probably did you a favor by adapting your tactics. With your mount dead and you surrounded in melee, switching to a melee weapon is preferable to provoking multiple AoO's. Although if you wish, I'm sure T'Var could adapt the end of the fight to have you shoot + provoke. 3. I think Arti is correct about the AC, and this is one of the primary things I would fix if I was the pitlord. In Rnd 3, Arthemus used force screen. That made his AC 25 (10 +7 dex +4 armor +4 shield). I think T'Var may have thought that it took an action to initiate the inertial armor. Actually, it is a githzerai special ability that's always on, so Arthemus should have gained the +4 armor bonus from inertial armor during the whole fight. When Arthemus drinks the potion: protection from law, his AC gains another +2 deflection bonus vs lawful creatures, making it AC 25/27 vs law. I think this has the largest impact on the fight, because with an AC that high, Arthemus can risk provoking AoO's to continue using his bow (as discussed in #2 above). Before I finish adding my 2 cps, I again want to stress that you both should be a lot more diplomatic in your responses on this thread. Before Sindorin was the Official Thread Opener, I used to end the opening post of this thread with a simple "BE NICE !! Seems like maybe we need to start doing that again. |
| T'Var02-22-05, 02:19 PM | 3. I think Arti is correct about the AC, and this is one of the primary things I would fix if I was the pitlord. In Rnd 3, Arthemus used force screen. That made his AC 25 (10 +7 dex +4 armor +4 shield). I think T'Var may have thought that it took an action to initiate the inertial armor. Actually, it is a githzerai special ability that's always on, so Arthemus should have gained the +4 armor bonus from inertial armor during the whole fight. When Arthemus drinks the potion: protection from law, his AC gains another +2 deflection bonus vs lawful creatures, making it AC 25/27 vs law. I think this has the largest impact on the fight, because with an AC that high, Arthemus can risk provoking AoO's to continue using his bow (as discussed in #2 above). Before I finish adding my 2 cps, I again want to stress that you both should be a lot more diplomatic in your responses on this thread. Before Sindorin was the Official Thread Opener, I used to end the opening post of this thread with a simple "BE NICE !! Seems like maybe we need to start doing that again. Sorry I did not know that IA was always running I'll re-run it on that fact as it does add 4ac. and Ill keep his bow out, he wants the AoO's he can have them. However again I dont appologize for my comments, You attack me I will respond in kind. |
| Jindl02-22-05, 02:26 PM | @T'Var - Not to add more work to you, but did you see this post earlier (I think it was on pg 7)? @T'Var: In the match between Odin and The Buddha... something to note. From the SRD If You’re Pinned by an Opponent When an opponent has pinned you, you are held immobile (but not helpless) for 1 round. While you’re pinned, you take a –4 penalty to your AC against opponents other than the one pinning you. At your opponent’s option, you may also be unable to speak. On your turn, you can try to escape the pin by making an opposed grapple check in place of an attack. You can make an Escape Artist check in place of your grapple check if you want, but this requires a standard action. If you win, you escape the pin, but you’re still grappling. How did Odin CDG his opponent when The BUddhawas not helpless? Am I missing something about these whip tokens? Round 3 Odin commands the whip to pin Buddha [Whip 12+15=27 vs 18+1=19 success] which the whip does easily. Odin begins to CDG Buddha provoking an AoO from Sutra [Hoof 18+6=24 vs AC 20 hit] 4+4=8dmg [CDG dmg 5+6+4+15=30dmg] [Fort save 15+2=17 vs DC 40 fail] Buddha dies CDG is a full round action, so: Sutra gets an attack on his go on rnd 3 On Rnd 4 the whip has to KEEP the pin, the Odin has to finish the CDG, and Sutra gets another AoO BUT, it doesn't matter becaue the pin doesn't make you helpless so a CDG is illegal. |
| T'Var02-22-05, 02:30 PM | @T'Var - Not to add more work to you, but did you see this post earlier (I think it was on pg 7)? ahh No I didnt. hmm thought immoble was..well...immoble. Ok looks like i got 2 to re-run |
| Sindorin02-22-05, 02:36 PM | Before I finish adding my 2 cps, I again want to stress that you both should be a lot more diplomatic in your responses on this thread. Before Sindorin was the Official Thread Opener, I used to end the opening post of this thread with a simple "BE NICE !! Seems like maybe we need to start doing that again. Sounds like a good idea... I'll make sure to do that when I make it tomorrow. |
| OdinTheReaper02-22-05, 02:38 PM | Can someone please tell me the statistics or information on smokesticks.....i cannot find them...... @the combatants: The fight will be up by tonight and im sorry its later than everyone elses but its been hectic this week at my house. |
| OdinTheReaper02-22-05, 02:39 PM | Also will someone post the potion of invisiblity, just so i know im doing it right....thanks |
| Sindorin02-22-05, 02:45 PM | Can someone please tell me the statistics or information on smokesticks.....i cannot find them...... @the combatants: The fight will be up by tonight and im sorry its later than everyone elses but its been hectic this week at my house. Smokestick: This alchemically treated wooden stick instantly creates thick, opaque smoke when ignited. The smoke fills a 10- foot cube (treat the effect as a fog cloud spell, except that a moderate or stronger wind dissipates the smoke in 1 round). The stick is consumed after 1 round, and the smoke dissipates naturally. The potion of Invisibility will be treated as a minimum Invisibility spell - thus it is Caster Level 3 and lasts for three minutes. Invisibility Illusion (Glamer) Level: Brd 2, Sor/Wiz 2, Trickery 2 Components: V, S, M/DF Casting Time: 1 standard action Range: Personal or touch Target: You or a creature or object weighing no more than 100 lb./level Duration: 1 min./level (D) Saving Throw: Will negates (harmless) or Will negates (harmless, object) Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless) or Yes (harmless, object) The creature or object touched becomes invisible, vanishing from sight, even from darkvision. If the recipient is a creature carrying gear, that vanishes, too. If you cast the spell on someone else, neither you nor your allies can see the subject, unless you can normally see invisible things or you employ magic to do so. Items dropped or put down by an invisible creature become visible; items picked up disappear if tucked into the clothing or pouches worn by the creature. Light, however, never becomes invisible, although a source of light can become so (thus, the effect is that of a light with no visible source). Any part of an item that the subject carries but that extends more than 10 feet from it becomes visible. Of course, the subject is not magically silenced, and certain other conditions can render the recipient detectable (such as stepping in a puddle). The spell ends if the subject attacks any creature. For purposes of this spell, an attack includes any spell targeting a foe or whose area or effect includes a foe. (Exactly who is a foe depends on the invisible character’s perceptions.) Actions directed at unattended objects do not break the spell. Causing harm indirectly is not an attack. Thus, an invisible being can open doors, talk, eat, climb stairs, summon monsters and have them attack, cut the ropes holding a rope bridge while enemies are on the bridge, remotely trigger traps, open a portcullis to release attack dogs, and so forth. If the subject attacks directly, however, it immediately becomes visible along with all its gear. Spells such as bless that specifically affect allies but not foes are not attacks for this purpose, even when they include foes in their area. Invisibility can be made permanent (on objects only) with a permanency spell. Arcane Material Component: An eyelash encased in a bit of gum arabic. Basically once they drink the potion it is like that spell is cast on the person. Invisible: Visually undetectable. An invisible creature gains a +2 bonus on attack rolls against sighted opponents, and ignores its opponents’ Dexterity bonuses to AC (if any). (See Invisibility, under Special Abilities.) Sorry I wasn't home much yesterday or I would have been able to help more, I had class all day and then band rehearsal most of last night... I was pooped, I tried to stay up and wait for you but I had class early this morning too. |
| OdinTheReaper02-22-05, 03:36 PM | 1 min = 1 round right? |
| T'Var02-22-05, 03:37 PM | 1 min = 1 round right? 1 round = 6 seconds 1 minute = 10 rounds |
| OdinTheReaper02-22-05, 03:40 PM | Thanks. I just noticed something. I know why my fight is late now.....i thought it said they were due at 8pm.....it said 8am....CRAP...my bad |
| Arstimis02-22-05, 05:23 PM | First off, I want to say sorry. My day started off pretty bad, only a couple hours of sleep...so..ya, sorry T'Var Second, Thanks for rerunning it. Yes that was my point I didnt mind risking the AoO because my Ac was so high and I had a pretty good chance to hit him with my attacks. Yes i realize i had illegal feats, I told you that in PM's. That is also why i didnt mention making melee attacks in my tactics at all. Thought it better I play a little handicapped since i made that mistake. |
| OdinTheReaper02-22-05, 05:41 PM | @: vipergts and Megrim: I am posting the fight now. Sorry it took so long but this fight took FOREVER to run....ask Sindorin. |
| Dalton Onestone02-22-05, 06:06 PM | Pretty basic problem on the Dorian fight -- Hide From Animals works against all sensing -- hearing, smelling, seeing, anything. Until the effect of the potion ends (via time or an attack), animals don't perceive him at all. |
| OdinTheReaper02-22-05, 06:48 PM | DERTH VS KAI RAE is posted. Geez. I still cant beleive i thought the deadline was in the PM....im so dissapointed. |
| T'Var02-22-05, 06:56 PM | Odin vs Buddha fixed, only lasted 1 round longer |
| OdinTheReaper02-22-05, 07:04 PM | @Huan: question...why wasnt Vyncent making spot/listen checks? EDIT: nevermind you did Also @ anyone: what exactly does true strike do? because obviously it hit me even with protection from arrows. |
| Dalton Onestone02-22-05, 07:08 PM | Also @ anyone: what exactly does true strike do? because obviously it hit me even with protection from arrows. +20 to the attack roll, and may disregard some concealment bonuses as well. Don't you have a link to the SRD yourself? It doesn't negate Protection From Arrows; however, that Protection isn't absolute. |
| spasheridan02-22-05, 07:10 PM | Also @ anyone: what exactly does true strike do? because obviously it hit me even with protection from arrows. Protection from arrows protects you from non-magical arrows. If someone uses say.. an oil of magic weapon on their bow.. then the arrows from the bow will go right through the protection from arrows. |
| Dalton Onestone02-22-05, 07:15 PM | DERTH VS KAI RAE is posted. Geez. I still cant beleive i thought the deadline was in the PM....im so dissapointed. Speaking of confusing -- it looks like he was making all those listen checks, not missing them. Or did you write the DCs to the left of the "vs." and the rolls to the right? |
| OdinTheReaper02-22-05, 07:19 PM | Yeah thats what i did....im sorry im just unbelievably busy and stressed...i havent even got to edit my two characters sheets yet. Oh and thanks i understand now. I do have the SRD but it takes me forever to find things. |
| Megrim_Lord02-22-05, 07:28 PM | Odin: I have a few issues to address, and I think I would like a rerun. first of all let me start out by quoting Kai's tactics then I will go from there Kai will do his best to avoid direct combat with Derth, using his thrown mindblade in conjunction with Psychic Strike to cause damage. If he needs cover to run and recuperate, Kai will use a smokestick to obscure his position and take cover in the nearest possible spot and quaff a CLW (or two if heavily damaged). This tactic as well as running will be employed if Derth flies into a rage. If Derth uses his potion of invisibility Kai will immediately use the above tactic also. When Derth exhausts his rage and becomes fatigued, Kai will go on the offensive, imbuing his mindblade with psychic strike if necessary or possible, and charging with the Reckless Offense and Psychic Weapon feats active (expending his psionic focus. Kai will then continue his attacks until he sustains 8 or more damage, in which case he will flee for cover and use more healing potions when required. Should Derth employ his elixir of fire breath, Kai will dive for cover or use a smoke stick to obscure Derth's vision , while retaliating with his own alchemist fires. In the event Derth tries to hide from Kai, he will seek cover himself and wait for Derth to make the first move. If at any time Derth hides or flees, and Kai can attain high ground through reasonable jumping, he will do so and lob acid flasks if he can catch a glimpse of the orc. Firstly, If you were confused by the way my tactics were written, you should have asked me to clarify, because you had more than ample time to do so. Secondly, looking at the arena map, there are several possible areas where taking cover is a fesible tactic which is what I meant when I said take cover (i.e. Kai would use the smokestick to obscure his position and then physically RUN for the nearest point in which cover could be achieved). Furthermore you had Kai pursue and attack when I said to RUN if derth used the invis pot or went into a rage. And, after kai sustained the large amount of damage, I said that he would run for cover and heal, you had him keep fighting. Also, hiding/fleeing from Kai was also implying invisibility, so Kai should have been playing it safe, not blitzkrieging an invisible opponent like a retarded 7 year old on a sugar high. Also, just wondering, with our starting positions being what they are, and with that big structure in the middle of the arena, how the hell did we get so close so fast? Now, honestly, since you didn't understand my tactics, if you had asked me for clarification, and I still lost, Then I'd be ok with it, but If there's one thing I don't like, It's suffering because of someone elses's mistake. No offense meant by any of this, I'm just really particular about these sort of things |
| Dalton Onestone02-22-05, 07:30 PM | I do have the SRD but it takes me forever to find things. http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/spells.htm All the spells in alphabetical order. You can find things near-instantly. In general, that site is super-fast for 90%+ of everything you'd ever look in the SRD for. The rest does require some poking around, but it's all there. |
| T'Var02-22-05, 07:30 PM | Art vs Ripper fixed. ended same time, though Art did much more dmg to Ripper though. AoO proved his downfall |
| Dalton Onestone02-22-05, 07:31 PM | Megrim_Lord (or anybody) -- how does one gladiator know when the other has entered a rage? Should there maybe be a fairly easy Sense Motive check for that? |
| spasheridan02-22-05, 07:35 PM | Megrim_Lord (or anybody) -- how does one gladiator know when the other has entered a rage? Should there maybe be a fairly easy Sense Motive check for that? I would imagine the froth at the mouth, the cartoon steam coming from the ears, and the blood rising to head / eyes creating a nice pinkish palor would be the first clue. Then the inchoherent screaming could be a good 2nd clue. My question is how an in6 wis 8 gladiator manages to follow even simple tactics. :) |
| Huan02-22-05, 07:40 PM | @Odin Protection of Arrows grants you DR 10/magic versus arrow. Anna made all of her arrows magic via the Oil of Magic Weapon she applied, so it broke your DR. The Spot/Listen modifier from distance alone was +23-20 (depends on the round). With Listen, Anna was behind cover and standing still, so that is about a DC 20 check right there (ad hoc 15 for standing still trying to be quiet + 5 behind thick cover) before the distance mod is applied. As far as spotting, Anna was hiding every round, and the additional distance modifier made it impossible for you to beat. It wasn't that I was ignoring Vyncent's detection actions, it was that it was even though he tried, he never would have been able to beat it, even on a natural 20. Really, that was the whole idea behind Jindl's sniping plan. |
| OdinTheReaper02-22-05, 07:41 PM | @Megrim: You know what....Derth did go invisible...but THERE WAS NO WAY THAT KAI KNEW THAT...also he never went into a rage. Another thing he didnt attack an invisible target....he became visible when he attacked. Also you never said to do anything after you dropped the smoke stick....all he would have to do if you ran away is to go through after you. You never told me what to do after you dropped the stick. I was trying to have you listen for him so that you knew where he was WHICH KAI DIDNT. Since he didnt know what direction Derth would be coming from, i didnt know what to do since derth would have kept firing until you came out from the smoke....even if you were behind cover he would have just came after you. You didnt stand a chance in a ranged battle...he had you beat in range with his xbow and at 30 ft (throw mindblade) he could just move forward and attack you with fire breath. You didnt get so close so fast either....he would have kept moving till he found you...yeah what about the thing in the center? you never told me where to move...forward, backward, towards the center...im also not trying to be mean but like i keep saying...I AM STRESSED OUT so give me a freakin break. If I reran this it would be tommorrow or even the next day until it got posted because i am busy...i tried to get it done earlier but well that didnt work out how i planned. Im sorry if i seem to be going off on you but im usually not like this. Put it this way..being at my house sucks. I have to get off line now though so i wont get to read the reply until later on. @viper: Oh i forgot to put why i didnt use mage armor....It will not stack with your full plate armor so it would have been a waste so i didnt have you use it. |
| Dalton Onestone02-22-05, 07:59 PM | @Odin, Didn't his tactics specifically say that he wanted to head for the nearest cover after lighting his smokesticks? |
| Megrim_Lord02-22-05, 08:15 PM | @Megrim: You know what....Derth did go invisible...but THERE WAS NO WAY THAT KAI KNEW THAT...also he never went into a rage. Another thing he didnt attack an invisible target....he became visible when he attacked. Also you never said to do anything after you dropped the smoke stick....all he would have to do if you ran away is to go through after you. You never told me what to do after you dropped the stick. I was trying to have you listen for him so that you knew where he was WHICH KAI DIDNT. Since he didnt know what direction Derth would be coming from, i didnt know what to do since derth would have kept firing until you came out from the smoke....even if you were behind cover he would have just came after you. You didnt stand a chance in a ranged battle...he had you beat in range with his xbow and at 30 ft (throw mindblade) he could just move forward and attack you with fire breath. You didnt get so close so fast either....he would have kept moving till he found you...yeah what about the thing in the center? you never told me where to move...forward, backward, towards the center...im also not trying to be mean but like i keep saying...I AM STRESSED OUT so give me a freakin break. If I reran this it would be tommorrow or even the next day until it got posted because i am busy...i tried to get it done earlier but well that didnt work out how i planned. Im sorry if i seem to be going off on you but im usually not like this. Put it this way..being at my house sucks. I have to get off line now though so i wont get to read the reply until later on. @viper: Oh i forgot to put why i didnt use mage armor....It will not stack with your full plate armor so it would have been a waste so i didnt have you use it. Actually, my tactics stated that after the smokestick is dropped kai would run for cover in the nearest possible area Also, I must have missed the part where it said he was visible, but if he was, why didn't Kai use Psionic Weapon as well? (or did he and I missed it?) Since there can be only 2 combatants at a time, wouldn't it be rather obvious he was invisible once he didn't see anything? One more thing, I move faster than him, so all I needed to do was keep moving and I'd outmove him before he could get me. Plus as I mentioned you didn't even attempt to have him run and heal Also, about the charging thing, although I did say that was how I wanted to deal damage, the first line also said to try and avoid direct combat with Derth. Like I said, if my tactics were unclear or confusing, you should have said so and said why I'm not trying to get on your case, really, I just get obsessive about these things. If it will make things easier on you I can resend my tactics in a form that will hopefully be clearer to you. @ Spash: I wondered that too @ Odin: If you are/were stressed out because of home life, why didn't you hand off the fight? I mean there's no sense adding to your stress with a lawyer like me on your back :D |
| Megrim_Lord02-22-05, 08:18 PM | oh, and one last nitpick: at the beginning of the fight, Kai shouldn't have had to waste an action on manifesting his mindblade, as it is listed under prefight actions :D |
| Arstimis02-22-05, 08:37 PM | Art vs Ripper fixed. ended same time, though Art did much more dmg to Ripper though. AoO proved his downfall Thank you again for doing this. I just have one question though. Horse attacks [Hoof 10+6+2+4=22 vs AC 25 miss][Hoof 15+6+2+4=27 vs AC 25 Hit][Bite 14+1+2+4=21 vs AC 25 miss] 2+4=6dmg what were the +4's from during the horses attack? Im sure there is a reason, so I might learn something new from you |
| T'Var02-22-05, 08:40 PM | Thank you again for doing this. I just have one question though. what were the +4's from during the horses attack? Im sure there is a reason, so I might learn something new from you ahh looks like i wrote that wrong. the horse shouldnt gain +4 but by being prone from the trip, you are at -4 ac vs melee |
| Arstimis02-22-05, 08:44 PM | Nevermind, I saw it. thanks again for rerunning the fight T'Var, and sorry for the...agressiveness? |
| Dalton Onestone02-22-05, 08:52 PM | Arstimis -- you ran the fight with Dorian, right? See above for a problem I raised with that fight. |
| Arstimis02-22-05, 08:59 PM | Pretty basic problem on the Dorian fight -- Hide From Animals works against all sensing -- hearing, smelling, seeing, anything. Until the effect of the potion ends (via time or an attack), animals don't perceive him at all. Ok, thanks a bunch for clarifying that for me. I will remember that in the futute. Just so we're both clear, that didnt matter at all in the fight because the dog never actually got to him..right? |
| OdinTheReaper02-22-05, 09:22 PM | Alright i wont be able to rerun the fight....i will forward everything to anyone who is willing to take it. Im sorry but as Megrim said this is too much for me and yes i should have said something sooner. Sindorin tried to help me but i got a full load out of left field this week. If no one will/can take it i can rerun it but it will probably come after thursday and i wouldnt want it to be so late that they will not be able to ready themselves even though its really late now. Im really sorry and i hope everyone can understand where im coming from. This wont happen again. If i cannot handle something ill just say something and if i dont understand tactics i will ask. I probably wont pitlord anyways until after spring break...maybe during the last week (about 3 weeks from now) where Sindorin, Khaz_Gu, Nanaleigh, and i will all be in the same house to where they can help me if i need it....cuz well i will bug them until they do :). EDIT: I will not be able to get online tonight...ive been having to get off the computer because my family runs the business from this computer so i have only been able to get online for an hour at a time...if that....well thanks and i apologize for being stupid |
| Dalton Onestone02-22-05, 09:48 PM | Ok, thanks a bunch for clarifying that for me. I will remember that in the futute. Just so we're both clear, that didnt matter at all in the fight because the dog never actually got to him..right? In Round 5 you said that Gabriel cast SNA II because the dog heard Dorian. What's more, you said that the specific location at which he cast it was based on Dorian having been heard by an animal. And that SNA II is what quickly killed Dorian. |
| Arstimis02-22-05, 10:01 PM | In Round 5 you said that Gabriel cast SNA II because the dog heard Dorian. What's more, you said that the specific location at which he cast it was based on Dorian having been heard by an animal. And that SNA II is what quickly killed Dorian. Oh ya...the growl. Sorry about that. I would rerun the fight. If i had any sliver of a hope that it might change things. But Davion would have came into Gabriel's Line of Site in the next couple of rounds before he had a chance to charge, and the same stuff would have happened. Oh, and the location he cast it wasnt because of the dog growling, it was because he saw Davion, but I do agree he wouldnt have seen Davion that round if the Dog had not growled and cause Gabriel to wonder down. |
| Dalton Onestone02-22-05, 10:18 PM | Oh ya...the growl. Sorry about that. I would rerun the fight. If i had any sliver of a hope that it might change things. But Davion would have came into Gabriel's Line of Site in the next couple of rounds before he had a chance to charge, and the same stuff would have happened. Oh, and the location he cast it wasnt because of the dog growling, it was because he saw Davion, but I do agree he wouldnt have seen Davion that round if the Dog had not growled and cause Gabriel to wonder down. Not my fight, so I don't have any stake in it. And I don't really understand all the sneaking rules. It sounds as if you're saying that Dorian's tactics were doomed to failure, so it all doesn't really matter. OK. But you did make a lot of other mistakes, including: 1. You said Gabriel moved and then didn't move him. 2. You couldn't have moved him anyway, since the casting was a full round action. 3. You seem to have cast the SNA at a much greater range than it actually can be cast. This allowed the hippogriff to make a full attack it's first round of existence rather than a single attack. 4. You deprived the hippogriff of an AoO when Dorian moved away from it. Given all those other errors, are you sure that Dorian would have been spotted by Gabriel before he was close enough to attack and perhaps disrupt the SNA? You're somebody who's gotten pretty insulting about imprecise pitlording here recently when you're the victim. In fact, I think you're second only to me in the vigor of your complaints. ;) |
| Huan02-22-05, 10:23 PM | In fact, I think you're second only to me in the vigor of your complaints. ;) Heh, well let's not make a competition out of that. ;) |
| Arstimis02-22-05, 10:33 PM | Not my fight, so I don't have any stake in it. And I don't really understand all the sneaking rules. It sounds as if you're saying that Dorian's tactics were doomed to failure, so it all doesn't really matter. OK. But you did make a lot of other mistakes, including: 1. You said Gabriel moved and then didn't move him. 2. You couldn't have moved him anyway, since the casting was a full round action. 3. You seem to have cast the SNA at a much greater range than it actually can be cast. This allowed the hippogriff to make a full attack it's first round of existence rather than a single attack. 4. You deprived the hippogriff of an AoO when Dorian moved away from it. Given all those other errors, are you sure that Dorian would have been spotted by Gabriel before he was close enough to attack and perhaps disrupt the SNA? You're somebody who's gotten pretty insulting about imprecise pitlording here recently when you're the victim. In fact, I think you're second only to me in the vigor of your complaints. ;) Yes, I know...that was a horrible fight for me to pitlord with so short of time And yes, i guess you could say that his tactics were doomed to failure. You might agree if you had read them. Yes, i think when i did cast the hippogriff it was too far, but it could have been cast closer, and move 50 ft and still full attack, but that would happen in a later round when Gabriel was sure to see him. Also, Gabriel wouldnt have had to move, allowing him to cast SNA II as needed. No, I do not see anyway for Dorian to have gotten to Gabriel without giving Gabriel the time needed to cast SNA II. Again, sorry for a sloppier fight than normal. It wont happen again, as i dont expect any more computer problems. Also, I have decided I will never, ever make a post like the ones i have done before, when pointing out errors in a fight |
| Naerdaloth02-22-05, 11:07 PM | I apologize for the lateness on my edits for Indri vs Hakatri, though life has caught up to me recently. I should be able to have something done tomorrow, if its not too late. |
| Dalton Onestone02-22-05, 11:10 PM | And yes, i guess you could say that his tactics were doomed to failure. You might agree if you had read them. -- I have and I don't, although let me again point out that I don't understand the current CoCo rules on sneaking. Yes, i think when i did cast the hippogriff it was too far, but it could have been cast closer, and move 50 ft and still full attack, -- Actually, if you've making a full attack, your only move can be a 5-ft step. but that would happen in a later round when Gabriel was sure to see him. Also, Gabriel wouldnt have had to move, allowing him to cast SNA II as needed. No, I do not see anyway for Dorian to have gotten to Gabriel without giving Gabriel the time needed to cast SNA II. -- If Dorian could get to within 60 feet or so before he is seen, then he has a chance for one attack, like this: Gabriel starts spell. Dorian double moves and bases him, but can't attack. Gabriel casts spell and summons hippogriff, who gets in full attack. Dorian then attacks Gabriel (with two weapons). If he doesn't kill him on that attack (which would need great dice, probably starting with a crit), then the hippogriff gets him next round. But if he hasn't based Gabriel by the time the spell finishes casting, then the hippogriff gets a full attack plus one more attack on an AoO as Dorian further chases Gabriel, which you've already established was enough to kill Dorian. So, what I think you should do is roll Dorian's one attack against Gabriel. If it doesn't work, then the current fight result is surely right. If it DOES get lucky and kills him, you probably should rerun the whole approach sequence correctly and see whether or not Dorian has a chance to get that attack off. |
| One_Winged_Angel02-22-05, 11:14 PM | Also, I have decided I will never, ever make a post like the ones i have done before, when pointing out errors in a fight Does this new found niceness extend to real life as well? ;) |
| Arstimis02-22-05, 11:19 PM | As far as I know how to run sneaking...which i could completely wrong in doing. There isnt a way for Dorian to get anything near 60 ft away without being seen. At least from the spots they are in now. Ok, I did the rolls. He would have it with the scimitar doing 12 damage, but missed with the shortsword. After that as you would say, the Hippogriff would get full attacks (after the first AoO of course) and then the dog would be attacking |
| Sindorin02-22-05, 11:24 PM | @: vipergts and Megrim: I am posting the fight now. Sorry it took so long but this fight took FOREVER to run....ask Sindorin. I will admit it is tough trying to help Odin with learning things of this game, specifically because of the reasons he has given about not being able to access computer from his home much. I have at least been trying to help him do it himself. It's just tough to guide him over the phone like it was today, and the idea of the tactics of the involved fighters both were kind of confusing for him. I'm glad everyone is being so helpful to someone new at this game. I was there in the exact so many ways. I am pretty sure everyone was, unless Jindl or Caterane and the rest of you guys were born knowing how to play D&D. I'll quote everyone from that time - "This is the best place to learn." There are people from all different backgrounds, and different playing levels. You have to be careful when critiquing/stating your views. I know we don't want to upset each other, but believe me it happens rather easily at times. So, when you want the pitlord to run each fight round by round EXACTLY HOW YOU WISH, remember to BE NICE. |
| Dalton Onestone02-22-05, 11:45 PM | As far as I know how to run sneaking...which i could completely wrong in doing. There isnt a way for Dorian to get anything near 60 ft away without being seen. At least from the spots they are in now. CoCo sneak rules are different from D&D sneak rules. I only have a faint clue as to what they actually are. Somebody else needs to look at the fight and see if you ran it by CoCo rules or not. |
| Arstimis02-22-05, 11:54 PM | CoCo sneak rules are different from D&D sneak rules. I only have a faint clue as to what they actually are. Somebody else needs to look at the fight and see if you ran it by CoCo rules or not. I wish someone would be able to point me to the CoCo sneak rules...it would probably help me in future fights But I ran it according to the Hide rules in the FAQ...so i think its right |
| Dalton Onestone02-23-05, 12:16 AM | I wish someone would be able to point me to the CoCo sneak rules...it would probably help me in future fights But I ran it according to the Hide rules in the FAQ...so i think its right I think that's exactly the pointer you needed! |
| Einzelgaenger02-23-05, 12:17 AM | Since AC vs. the second crit confirm was 23 I think it failed. what is this spurs of riding you speak of? i can't find them anywhere in the books. |
| Dalton Onestone02-23-05, 12:27 AM | what is this spurs of riding you speak of? i can't find them anywhere in the books. Look up the thread a bit to where Jindl said there's great flexibility on defining tools that give +2 circumstance bonuses to riding and/or handle animal skills. As for the existence of tools that do such things -- see the PHB/SRD, in the equipment section, which suggests that if one can conceive of a MW tool that gives such a bonus, it exists, and the price is around 50 gp unless another price is explicitly noted. |
| Pittbull02-23-05, 02:25 AM | I think that's exactly the pointer you needed! To point it clear: There are only rules for listening and spotting, but there are no official CoCo-rules for sneaking. The problem is, what to do when the sneaker has no cover or concealment anymore. Cellar told me that there is a rule that you can move 1' per skill-rank without c&c. Actualy we are dicussing to enhance this to 5' per skill-check-result/5, because sneakers have quite a problem in the CoCo to be efficient. I hope, I can help you. |
| Dalton Onestone02-23-05, 02:33 AM | I WAS aware the rule was under discussion for being changed. This is one reason I have not bothered too hard to try to understand what the current rule is. :D Changed/clarified/whatever. It's also a fine excuse for not pitlording, which I will not consider doing until those rules are firmed up. :D |
| Pittbull02-23-05, 03:04 AM | It's also a fine excuse for not pitlording, which I will not consider doing until those rules are firmed up. :D Sorry, that is no excuse for no pitlording, the current official rule is now: May the pitlord decide what to do! So , you see, it's your decission, there will be no arguments. ;) Hey, pitlording is fun!!! Believe me!! :) |
| Einzelgaenger02-23-05, 03:44 AM | Look up the thread a bit to where Jindl said there's great flexibility on defining tools that give +2 circumstance bonuses to riding and/or handle animal skills. As for the existence of tools that do such things -- see the PHB/SRD, in the equipment section, which suggests that if one can conceive of a MW tool that gives such a bonus, it exists, and the price is around 50 gp unless another price is explicitly noted. k, thx, ok, the fight shall be updated soon... |
| Sindorin02-23-05, 09:41 AM | Sorry, that is no excuse for no pitlording, the current official rule is now: May the pitlord decide what to do! So , you see, it's your decission, there will be no arguments. ;) Hey, pitlording is fun!!! Believe me!! :) I love pitlording, I agree, it is fun. However... it can be one of the most stressful things going on over one's weekend because you worry what they will say when you post the fights... we've been having more and more of that here... |
| Beldin02-23-05, 10:10 AM | @Neardaloth, if zou are going to correct the Hakatri vs Indri fight then please remember to correct these, too: Indri'ynar has no Mounted Comabat. He could not negate the hit in round 2 on his horse. So his horse would be dead in round 3 and Hakatri could use his mounted combat in round 5 to prevent the powerattack-hit from Indri'ynar. And Hakatri should rage in melee. |
| TaggIIV02-23-05, 02:24 PM | Hm, I know I've heard of their being unique COCO rules for Hiding and stuff, but I've never seen them anywhere. Just an idea, but shouldnt these obscure rules be compiled and put into one of the sticky threads? It's not really fair to apply rules that were decided on really long ago, and the only written reference of them is in an old Elders thread that is way off the first page. It's ridiculous to expect most pitlords to know them, and being able to enforce them @Beldin: Good point.. with that revelation I do not foresee a rerun changing the outcome but we will see. |
| Jindl02-23-05, 03:33 PM | Boraxx (Pittbull) vs Klaxon (T'Var) is finally up. Sorry it took so long. Its a close fight, and pretty entertaining as both combatants went after the other person's mounts. Working on Ceres vs Evram now. |
| Huan02-23-05, 03:43 PM | REALLY BRIEF: Rough draft expansions for all my stories are up EXCEPT for Indri vs Brandt (I wrote it, but I took it back, because I wish to make it really cool ;) ) I understand I will not get any credit for this fight's story, or Idri vs Brandt, but I don't care, I said I would have a story for all my fights, and I'm sticking to that. :cool: Ikari Yui vs Elishar (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5459308) These are this week's fights: Mer-Man vs KoRn (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5491663) Anna vs Vyncent (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5501776) Rayos Atess vs Oz Savage (http://boards1.wizards.com/showpost.php?p=5486531) Btw (the coloring in of dialogue will be added later tonight... I just wanted them up before pairings) |
| Jindl02-23-05, 03:51 PM | @Huan - I enjoyed the story for Anna vs the Flame Alchemist. Anna's color has always been lightblue, would you mind editing that in? |
| T'Var02-23-05, 03:54 PM | Jindl why didnt you have me drink my CMW that last round? if i would have gained average of 11hp back that would have most likely given me the 2 rounds needed to win |
| Jindl02-23-05, 04:07 PM | Jindl why didnt you have me drink my CMW that last round? if i would have gained average of 11hp back that would have most likely given me the 2 rounds needed to win He had 6 hps left, your minimum damage was 6 pts, and you only needed a 10 or better on the attack roll when using rapid shot to hit him. So it seemed like a better idea to attack twice. Also, Boraxx only needed a 11 or better to hit you, and his average damage was 10.5 pts, so that potion may not have bought you any time (you drink it and he hits you and you gain nothing). I thought you had a much better chance to go all out and hope for a single hit, since that was all that was needed to win. |
| SnarkHunter02-23-05, 04:17 PM | Boraxx (Pittbull) vs Klaxon (T'Var) is finally up. Sorry it took so long. Its a close fight, and pretty entertaining as both combatants went after the other person's mounts. Working on Ceres vs Evram now. Well...it would be nice if I could win one fight this week :confused:. |
| T'Var02-23-05, 04:23 PM | He had 6 hps left, your minimum damage was 6 pts, and you only needed a 10 or better on the attack roll when using rapid shot to hit him. So it seemed like a better idea to attack twice. Also, Boraxx only needed a 11 or better to hit you, and his average damage was 10.5 pts, so that potion may not have bought you any time (you drink it and he hits you and you gain nothing). I thought you had a much better chance to go all out and hope for a single hit, since that was all that was needed to win. i guess im fine either way. looks like a tripple loss week for me. |
| Sindorin02-23-05, 04:28 PM | Well...it would be nice if I could win one fight this week :confused:. This week has been really weird in terms of winning characters. Lots of streaks were broken... In terms of Ceres vs. Evram, whoever loses has no winners this week :rolleyes: |
| Jindl02-23-05, 04:49 PM | Ceres Solus the Vagabond (Sindorin) vs Evram the Soulless (SnarkHunter) is finished. I'm not very happy with this fight, and I think the GM's and other Elder's should have a look at it, especially the Pitlord Note I left after declaring a winner. |
| Sindorin02-23-05, 04:58 PM | Ceres Solus the Vagabond (Sindorin) vs Evram the Soulless (SnarkHunter) is finished. I'm not very happy with this fight, and I think the GM's and other Elder's should have a look at it, especially the Pitlord Note I left after declaring a winner. Good. Since I am often outspoken in debate, I decided to try a different approach. I saw a loophole in the plan to load pc's with gold - an ECL 4 would start with a LOT of gold. Earlier in the days of the previous CoCo I noticed how deadly ANYONE could be as long as they have a pegasus. I figured I would prove a point by making a gladiator. Glad to see that it may come to fruition. Tair Malek hath been avenged :) |
| spasheridan02-23-05, 04:59 PM | Wow Jindl, I don't think there have been any other 1/2 round matches yet. Whats' that... 3 seconds and DING! |
| Snommelp02-23-05, 05:04 PM | Considering the Average mobility, can the pegasus actually get that far? It's maximum turn for the round is 90 degrees, and each 45 degrees costs 5 feet. It might be possible, but I'm not sure. Also, is it flying at ground level? I'm pretty sure it can't do that, although I could be wrong. If it did any climbing, though, that's at half speed. |
| Sindorin02-23-05, 05:07 PM | I think the Pegasus needs a bit of work in respect to her base flight speed. 120 feet is a lot. Sadly this is what it says in the SRD, to fix it properly we'd have to petition to the makers of the game, or ban it like the gate spell. My own campaign once featured a pegasus and I made my own house ruling on her, she had a 40 ft. air speed when she took off, then the next round she could fly 80 ft. The massive 120 ft. base speed was reachable as she was at cruising altitude, free of obstacles, and out of combat. |
| Dalton Onestone02-23-05, 05:09 PM | And why can Ceres use his breath weapon at the end of Monyx's double move? |
| Dalton Onestone02-23-05, 05:11 PM | I'm confused too by something even more basic: If a Pegasus can only advance 120 feet (and less, given manuevering and altitude and obstacles), and a breath weapon only reaches 60 feet, how did the breath ever get to the victim? |
| Snommelp02-23-05, 05:11 PM | And why can Ceres use his breath weapon at the end of Monyx's double move? readied action loophole Ceres readies his breath weapon to go off when Evram is in range, which happens to be at the end of the double move. Although maneuvering may change the outcome. How did something with average mobility get across the arena in one round? |
| T'Var02-23-05, 05:12 PM | double moved. 120+120+60 weapon=300ft |
| Snommelp02-23-05, 05:15 PM | Nevermind. I just double-checked the mobility on my own map, and even if it climbs 10 feet instead of the 5 needed to clear the rocks, it can still get there. With only a 90 degree per-turn turn radius. |
| T'Var02-23-05, 05:17 PM | and a flying loophole is when flying at gound level, you can lands a free action and take off as a free action, so at ground level you fly to point A land(free), turn 90degrees fly(free) again to point B land(free) turn another 90degrees fly(free) again ect ect |
| Snommelp02-23-05, 05:19 PM | So you are allowed to fly at ground level? Well, then I have no ground to stand on if I try to complain about the outcome of the fight. That, and the fact that I'm not a participant, means I'll be quiet now. ...for a while, at least. |
| SnarkHunter02-23-05, 05:21 PM | I find myself liking the idear of that readied action loop hole less and less. |
| spasheridan02-23-05, 05:25 PM | I find myself liking the idear of that readied action loop hole less and less. Yeah, and how about that: WHile invisible, I ready a *ick* against you finishing your turn. You finish, I go, then I go again.. because I interupted you turn with my readied action. My aciton this round... *ick2* or drnk another potion of invis to repeat step1. Compared to that, readying to breath / shot my bow / chop you with my lance when my mount gets in range is nothing. |
| Dalton Onestone02-23-05, 05:28 PM | Sorry. Misread the ground speed for the air speed. Anyhow, I think this bout illustrates one of my main contentions -- reducing the size of the winnings is NOT enough of a barrier against abusive mounts/allies. |
| Snommelp02-23-05, 05:34 PM | WHile invisible, I ready a *ick* against you finishing your turn. You finish, I go, then I go again.. because I interupted you turn with my readied action. My aciton this round... *ick2* or drnk another potion of invis to repeat step1. Not actually a big issue, since most gladiators who can't see their opponents ready actions for when the foe becomes visible. That's an easily beaten trick. |
| Jindl02-23-05, 05:46 PM | I find myself liking the idear of that readied action loop hole less and less. As do I, and I am considering an "fix". Perhaps we should say that you and your mount must share the "ready" action, in which case you can't move on your mount after you ready. So at the most your mount could only single move if you choose to ready an action. What do you think? |
| Jindl02-23-05, 05:48 PM | I think the Pegasus needs a bit of work in respect to her base flight speed. 120 feet is a lot. Sadly this is what it says in the SRD, to fix it properly we'd have to petition to the makers of the game, or ban it like the gate spell. Well, I'm against banning the mount, becuase in a few levels, phantom steed will put a pegasus to shame. But I do think a pegasus should follow the normal ECL-2 rule, even if it was purchased instead of recruited with leadership/handle animal. Which would of course prevent use of a pegasus until ECL 6. |
| spasheridan02-23-05, 05:52 PM | As do I, and I am considering an "fix". Perhaps we should say that you and your mount must share the "ready" action, in which case you can't move on your mount after you ready. So at the most your mount could only single move if you choose to ready an action. What do you think? Would that mean I can't carge w/lance on a horse if it has to take more than a move to get there? Say I had a straight shot at the opponent but I have to spur the horse to get it there. that is a move / move + a little charge that should let me attack w/lance and hoof. I don't think that this can be replicated with a readied action because you can't charge with a readied action. BUT, this is how a mounted charge should work. AND, if you can charge on a mount then it's no dif then moving and breathing, moving and casting a spell, or moving and shooting with an arrow.. |
| Jindl02-23-05, 05:59 PM | It doesn't affect charging. What I am saying is that (with a ride check DC 5) controlling your mount is a free action that can be combined with any other action (such as charging, taking a full attack with your bow, etc). However, once you chose to ready an action, you are not allowed to take ANY actions until your ready is triggered, including the free action to control your mount. So how can you guide your mount closer to your opponent after you have used your standard action (midway through the mount's double movement) to ready an action? I think by readying an action, you should have to give up the rest of your mount's movement for the round, because you don't have the continuing free actions available to control your mount. |
| Snommelp02-23-05, 06:07 PM | Nevermind. I misread what Jindl said. Go about your business. These are not the droids you are looking for. |
| Kaigan02-23-05, 06:12 PM | I have one question. In the original CoCo, we were allowed to buy a pegasus egg, and have it trained, due to the "unlimited time" between fights. That unlimited time allows the pegasus to hatch, and grow. In LG i thought we were dealing with real time here. So how is it possible that Ceres bought a Pegausus egg, which probably hasn't hatched, and have it trained with the special cost of 1000 gp for training. It would take much longer. Just curious. |
| Snommelp02-23-05, 06:15 PM | Because Ceres is a new character, he theoretically did all of that before he came to Gladius. That means the only limitation is his own age. |
| spasheridan02-23-05, 06:19 PM | SO.. the way I see the readied action / mount issue used is this: I have a ranged wpn/spell/item/whatever, I want to attack with it at some point along the path of the mount. I rdy an action to have the attack go off along the path. Under the current rules, without a readied action, where would my attack happen? (middle of move, end of move, start of move?) having the mount do a move / move and then breathing is almost the same thing as having the mount do a charge action and lancing at the end of the charge. |
| Dalton Onestone02-23-05, 06:23 PM | once you chose to ready an action, you are not allowed to take ANY actions until your ready is triggered, Where in the rules does it say that? |
| Snommelp02-23-05, 06:24 PM | It depends on how far the mount is moving. If the mount does a single move, your attack happens at the end of the move. If the mount double moves, a ranged attack can only happen in the middle of the move, without a readied action. Melee attacks can't be made after a double move unless it's a charge or an action is readied. Note that charges are different from double moves. For example, a charge must be in a straight line. |
| xanadu02-23-05, 06:53 PM | edit: changed my mind |
| SnarkHunter02-23-05, 08:49 PM | Generally I think we should try to stick close to the current rules of the game-Skip's notes are good as far as I can see. For instance he said this week that a natural 20 can't be negated by Mounted Combat, which is kinda of what I'd always imagined (Since it always hits the ride check to negate it would be infinite). AS far as readying goes I don't think it should be allowed to override only being able to act in the middle of the movement. So if the ready action is to attack when beyond the 1/2 the mounts movement the attack should fail. |
| Dalton Onestone02-23-05, 09:01 PM | AS far as readying goes I don't think it should be allowed to override only being able to act in the middle of the movement. So if the ready action is to attack when beyond the 1/2 the mounts movement the attack should fail. I agree. Otherwise what's to keep one from Readying simply on having ridden 100 feet? Besides, Readying means shifting one's action from one part of the round to another. (It's defined as a "Special initiative action" But the ride all happens at the same point in the round. |
| Naerdaloth02-23-05, 10:06 PM | Edits for Hakatri vs. Indri all done now. Should be legit. Didnt change outcome. For the readying in middle of riding, I agree. As far as I understood it it is declaring an action to be triggered in your opponents turn when they commit to whatever you declared to be the trigger |
| Huan02-23-05, 10:09 PM | @Huan - I enjoyed the story for Anna vs the Flame Alchemist. Anna's color has always been lightblue, would you mind editing that in? Sure, but allow me to add I have plans to expand that one a little. Anna and Vyncent has such rich RP that I felt I did not do them justice. :mad: So, I put out a rough draft, but hope to expand upon it, elaborating more on their personal feelings and adding more depth (really, thank you two for sending me great quality stuff to work with). @All If you ever get me as a Pitlord, I WILL write a story for you, but know that unless you send me some RP insight, or have some sort of character bio on your sheet, I am shooting in the dark as to what your character would likely say or act. I like to take time and add depth and emphasize the Living part of 'Living Gladius'. Feel free, after atctics, to add personal issues your character has, motivations and thoughts on this fight, dialogue you want me to try to work in (whatever you want), or how you want your character to look. Time is usually not on my side, but know that 4 times out of 5, if you send me good RP, I will write a lengthier, better quality story. |
| Pittbull02-24-05, 06:27 AM | @Huan: Great story! I liked that one! :love: Thanks a lot! |
| Sindorin02-24-05, 09:10 AM | I have one question. In the original CoCo, we were allowed to buy a pegasus egg, and have it trained, due to the "unlimited time" between fights. That unlimited time allows the pegasus to hatch, and grow. In LG i thought we were dealing with real time here. So how is it possible that Ceres bought a Pegausus egg, which probably hasn't hatched, and have it trained with the special cost of 1000 gp for training. It would take much longer. Just curious. Ceres started at ECL 4 with 5400 gold. The loophole there is this: "How much time is allowed before character creation is completed?" The way I figured, real time began for Ceres at the moment of his first pairing. Thus, I was allowed to have the pegasus ready to go at the completion of character creation. There were no rules influencing this in the Living Gladius changes. This is why the egg and training are both listed under "past expenditures" on his sheet. They were both used some time ago before his coming to Gladius. |
| T'Var02-24-05, 09:18 AM | thats right. real time doesnt start until your first fight. unlimited time during creation for crafting, training, ect |
| OdinTheReaper02-24-05, 02:42 PM | @huan: thanks for writing that. It made me feel better even though i lost. @all: I think i got food poisining last night so im not feeling real good right now. |
| Megrim_Lord02-24-05, 02:59 PM | @huan: thanks for writing that. It made me feel better even though i lost. @all: I think i got food poisining last night so im not feeling real good right now. that was the three decade old cyanide capsule I poured in your soup... j/k hope you feel better soon :) |