A small problem with twins... [Archive] - Wizards Community

A small problem with twins... [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Gunz
07-25-06, 11:02 AM Here's the deal: we're a rather new group of three people. One is of course the DM, and to make things easy on both him and us, we decided to create a party of four characters, so the two players, me and my friend, both control two characters each. I deciced to play a Warlock, because I really loved that concept, and a Cleric, because a party needs one ;) . My friend plays a Ninja and a Fighter, not that that matters here. Our adventures are set in Eberron.

Now, playing two characters is rather hard roleplaying-wise, and I wanted to do something special with them. So I made them twins, Boran and Goran (they're both human, despite the name), Warlock and Cleric, identical twins, both chaotic good. Now you're probably starting to see the problem here. Since you are born a Warlock due to some kind of demonic heritage, how can it be explained that his identical twin is not a warlock? (<= for people with little time, this is the main question of this thread, the below is an attempt to explain other oddities, and I think I'm fairly succesful at that. In fact I'm quite proud of it, seeing as this is the first background I ever made, so please read it if you have the time :))

A second minor problem would be the conflicting class choices between the two brothers. For this I think I have found a solution, but help to develop that backstory is appreciated. The general idea is that as soon as it became apparent that there was some demonic aspect within Boran, Goran decided to become a kind of guidance to make sure the evil within him would not develop. As they grew older however Boran didn't seem to need nor want guidance, he kinda liked his newfound powers. He didn't become evil, but he was the type of guy that pulls pranks often, a bit of a showoff, but goodharted deep inside (something like Captain Jack Sparrow, if you will). His brother was the more serious kinda guy and didn't really enjoy his Boran's pranks and his tendency of wanting to be in the spotlights all the time. Nevertheless, he loves his brother and protected him all the time. Despite them being twins, you could see Goran (the Cleric) as being the "older brother" type.

When Boran wanted to go see the world and become an adventurer, Goran reluctantly went along and put his faith in Dol Dorn, in order to be able to protect his brother at all times. In the party this now results in Boran being the flamboyant type that leaps into battle with a mischievous grin on his face. He also poses as the party's leader in public. Goran on the other hand is a more grim person, who sees the adventuring as a necessary evil. When battle comes he goes "*sigh*... Here we go again...", but then joins the fight with as much vigour and deadly effectiveness as anyone else.

I think I got pretty much everything covered now, although some things still feel like they're pulled in just to make the thing work... And of course there is that big problem of identical twings being warlock and non-warlock. Anyone have any idea how this could be explained? That really is still the biggest issue here.
Cadfael_Gieddan
07-25-06, 11:07 AM Fraternal twins instead of identical works. They can still look extremely similar, but maybe the genes weren't passed on to the one.
Syltorian
07-25-06, 12:20 PM Perhaps the warlock had some misadventure in the past that left him with his powers. Perhaps they are the result of a fiendish possession that got exorcised, but still left him with parts of the fiend's powers? His cleric brother might even have helped him get rid of the actual fiend, but the exorcist made an error in the ritual. Alternatively, it might be the result of a curse. A fiend (or other evil or chaotic creature) might have given these powers to your warlock to lead him into temptation. Power corrupts, after all, and the fact that people tend to distrust them might help the "dark side" to claim anyone who holds the warlock's powers.

Then, of course, there could be all the nice planar and magical incidents that happen in Eberron. Perhaps something went wrong when he was exploring a tomb or other ancient site, and some wild magic got lose. Perhaps he was too close to the Mourning that day in Olarune 994. Or he was too near a spell or other effect gone wrong during (and because of) a coterminous plane. Thelanis, with its connections to arcane magic might work; as might Kythri. Of course, all these would mean he does not get his talents of a fiend, which warlock does not necessarily require as far as I am aware (don't they mention fey, too? Might be wrong, have only once briefly seen the book).

Then, of course, they could both have been warlocks. The cleric brother just somehow managed to purge himself, or lost this talent during an incident as mentioned above. He is now free of the taint of the fiends, but that does not mean he was not born with it. This might reinforce his need to guide his brother, since he knows it is possible to get rid of the taint, which his brother sees as a boon.

Lastly... this raises an interesting question in Eberron. Are identical twins of a dragonmarked house going to manifest the same dragonmark, or is the process still essentially random? If it is random, which I would tend to believe it is - the Prophecy cares only partially about genetics - you might treat the warlock's powers in the same way, perhaps as an aberrant mark of the power of the War of the Mark (which will get you killed by one of thirteen dragonmarked houses, and might get Vol and Tarkanan interested), or merely decide that the power is essentially random and magical, not genetical. Maybe it affects only the eldest son (the first born, even if it is by seconds), or the Seventh Son (again, by seconds difference). Or, as this is Eberron, the thirteenth son born to that line from whatever event triggered this...
Gunz
07-25-06, 12:20 PM Fraternal twins instead of identical works. They can still look extremely similar, but maybe the genes weren't passed on to the one.
Kind of stupid I hadn't thought of that one... Come to think of it, that might also explain why their stats differ so greatly (appart from height and weight, which are almost identical ;) ).

Good idea, thanks!

EDIT: And whoa, brilliant things there Syltorian. I like the Aberrant Dragonmark route, and my DM might like it too :) Though it becomes a bit hard to explain why he hasn't been killed then if he's that much of a showoff... Still, some very interesting ideas there, thank you :)
keropie
07-25-06, 12:37 PM It's easy... it's called 'magic.' There's no reason to presuppose that socererous ability strictly flows down genetic material, nor dragonmarks. And identical twins can have very different stats, both physically and mentally.
Need_A_Life
07-26-06, 02:20 AM Well, warlocks are supplemental material and therefore not the dominant class, which they would be if it was a dominant gene that was past on through the ages.

While the Silver Flame would be a great unknown, the Eldritch Flame would he hip!

One choose to be a priest, the other embraced powers passed on to him by fey/dragons/devils/demons/game masters/furry rabbits with big nasty teeth/etc.
remmun
07-27-06, 02:41 PM or perhap your twins are born with difrent abilities for a reason. the warlock could be weaker than his brother and seek to gain power by any means nessisary, thus he has been imbued with demonic powers in exchange for some kind of service. maybe he must sacrifice an animal twice a week, the demon could have some sort of control over him and thus some of his decisions, while moraly wrong for a good character, must be made to preserve his powers.

kind of a rastlin and cameron relationship.
Gallameed
07-29-06, 09:47 AM Maybe in the past, one of the twins parents made an awful deal of some kind with a fiend before the twins were ever even a twinkle in their fathers eye, and the ''price'' the parent had to pay was the fiend blessing the mothers ''first born son with its unholy mark...''

However the parents were shocked to discover a second baby boys head/feet appear after the first was born! As if the gods of light were balancing things out?

Hey, and make sure that the second born ''cleric to be'' son was born feet first as this is said to be the sign of a healer.
Nived
07-30-06, 01:43 AM It obviously takes effort to be a Warlock. If it didn't it would be a Template, not a Class.

Consider it this way, they both had the potential to become Warlocks, they both have the earmarks. Maybe the Cleric brother can do something like make his hand glow (no mechanical effect) the same color as his Warlock brother's Arcane Blasts (or whatever they're called). However that's about all he can do, he can't blast, and he can't invoke, because he's never really tried, not real focus, not real effort anyway.

The one brother just focused on that ability, and managed to figure out how to channel it. The other... for whatever reason, decided not to, refused to explore those abilities. Thus he'll never get a handle on them, and never be able to use them in any significant way.
remmun
07-31-06, 01:13 AM Consider it this way, they both had the potential to become Warlocks, they both have the earmarks. Maybe the Cleric brother can do something like make his hand glow (no mechanical effect) the same color as his Warlock brother's Arcane Blasts (or whatever they're called). However that's about all he can do, he can't blast, and he can't invoke, because he's never really tried, not real focus, not real effort anyway.

The one brother just focused on that ability, and managed to figure out how to channel it. The other... for whatever reason, decided not to, refused to explore those abilities. Thus he'll never get a handle on them, and never be able to use them in any significant way.

a different take on this idea might be that the blue glow of the cleric's hand is a sign that he is casting a divine spell. and that all his divine spells make his hand glow blue while all his brother's arcane spells make his hand glow red.

that's just my take on it

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Gunz 07-25-06, 11:02 AM	Here's the deal: we're a rather new group of three people. One is of course the DM, and to make things easy on both him and us, we decided to create a party of four characters, so the two players, me and my friend, both control two characters each. I deciced to play a Warlock, because I really loved that concept, and a Cleric, because a party needs one ;) . My friend plays a Ninja and a Fighter, not that that matters here. Our adventures are set in Eberron. Now, playing two characters is rather hard roleplaying-wise, and I wanted to do something special with them. So I made them twins, Boran and Goran (they're both human, despite the name), Warlock and Cleric, identical twins, both chaotic good. Now you're probably starting to see the problem here. Since you are born a Warlock due to some kind of demonic heritage, how can it be explained that his identical twin is not a warlock? (<= for people with little time, this is the main question of this thread, the below is an attempt to explain other oddities, and I think I'm fairly succesful at that. In fact I'm quite proud of it, seeing as this is the first background I ever made, so please read it if you have the time :)) A second minor problem would be the conflicting class choices between the two brothers. For this I think I have found a solution, but help to develop that backstory is appreciated. The general idea is that as soon as it became apparent that there was some demonic aspect within Boran, Goran decided to become a kind of guidance to make sure the evil within him would not develop. As they grew older however Boran didn't seem to need nor want guidance, he kinda liked his newfound powers. He didn't become evil, but he was the type of guy that pulls pranks often, a bit of a showoff, but goodharted deep inside (something like Captain Jack Sparrow, if you will). His brother was the more serious kinda guy and didn't really enjoy his Boran's pranks and his tendency of wanting to be in the spotlights all the time. Nevertheless, he loves his brother and protected him all the time. Despite them being twins, you could see Goran (the Cleric) as being the "older brother" type. When Boran wanted to go see the world and become an adventurer, Goran reluctantly went along and put his faith in Dol Dorn, in order to be able to protect his brother at all times. In the party this now results in Boran being the flamboyant type that leaps into battle with a mischievous grin on his face. He also poses as the party's leader in public. Goran on the other hand is a more grim person, who sees the adventuring as a necessary evil. When battle comes he goes "sigh... Here we go again...", but then joins the fight with as much vigour and deadly effectiveness as anyone else. I think I got pretty much everything covered now, although some things still feel like they're pulled in just to make the thing work... And of course there is that big problem of identical twings being warlock and non-warlock. Anyone have any idea how this could be explained? That really is still the biggest issue here.
Cadfael_Gieddan 07-25-06, 11:07 AM	Fraternal twins instead of identical works. They can still look extremely similar, but maybe the genes weren't passed on to the one.
Syltorian 07-25-06, 12:20 PM	Perhaps the warlock had some misadventure in the past that left him with his powers. Perhaps they are the result of a fiendish possession that got exorcised, but still left him with parts of the fiend's powers? His cleric brother might even have helped him get rid of the actual fiend, but the exorcist made an error in the ritual. Alternatively, it might be the result of a curse. A fiend (or other evil or chaotic creature) might have given these powers to your warlock to lead him into temptation. Power corrupts, after all, and the fact that people tend to distrust them might help the "dark side" to claim anyone who holds the warlock's powers. Then, of course, there could be all the nice planar and magical incidents that happen in Eberron. Perhaps something went wrong when he was exploring a tomb or other ancient site, and some wild magic got lose. Perhaps he was too close to the Mourning that day in Olarune 994. Or he was too near a spell or other effect gone wrong during (and because of) a coterminous plane. Thelanis, with its connections to arcane magic might work; as might Kythri. Of course, all these would mean he does not get his talents of a fiend, which warlock does not necessarily require as far as I am aware (don't they mention fey, too? Might be wrong, have only once briefly seen the book). Then, of course, they could both have been warlocks. The cleric brother just somehow managed to purge himself, or lost this talent during an incident as mentioned above. He is now free of the taint of the fiends, but that does not mean he was not born with it. This might reinforce his need to guide his brother, since he knows it is possible to get rid of the taint, which his brother sees as a boon. Lastly... this raises an interesting question in Eberron. Are identical twins of a dragonmarked house going to manifest the same dragonmark, or is the process still essentially random? If it is random, which I would tend to believe it is - the Prophecy cares only partially about genetics - you might treat the warlock's powers in the same way, perhaps as an aberrant mark of the power of the War of the Mark (which will get you killed by one of thirteen dragonmarked houses, and might get Vol and Tarkanan interested), or merely decide that the power is essentially random and magical, not genetical. Maybe it affects only the eldest son (the first born, even if it is by seconds), or the Seventh Son (again, by seconds difference). Or, as this is Eberron, the thirteenth son born to that line from whatever event triggered this...
Gunz 07-25-06, 12:20 PM	Fraternal twins instead of identical works. They can still look extremely similar, but maybe the genes weren't passed on to the one. Kind of stupid I hadn't thought of that one... Come to think of it, that might also explain why their stats differ so greatly (appart from height and weight, which are almost identical ;) ). Good idea, thanks! EDIT: And whoa, brilliant things there Syltorian. I like the Aberrant Dragonmark route, and my DM might like it too :) Though it becomes a bit hard to explain why he hasn't been killed then if he's that much of a showoff... Still, some very interesting ideas there, thank you :)
keropie 07-25-06, 12:37 PM	It's easy... it's called 'magic.' There's no reason to presuppose that socererous ability strictly flows down genetic material, nor dragonmarks. And identical twins can have very different stats, both physically and mentally.
Need_A_Life 07-26-06, 02:20 AM	Well, warlocks are supplemental material and therefore not the dominant class, which they would be if it was a dominant gene that was past on through the ages. While the Silver Flame would be a great unknown, the Eldritch Flame would he hip! One choose to be a priest, the other embraced powers passed on to him by fey/dragons/devils/demons/game masters/furry rabbits with big nasty teeth/etc.
remmun 07-27-06, 02:41 PM	or perhap your twins are born with difrent abilities for a reason. the warlock could be weaker than his brother and seek to gain power by any means nessisary, thus he has been imbued with demonic powers in exchange for some kind of service. maybe he must sacrifice an animal twice a week, the demon could have some sort of control over him and thus some of his decisions, while moraly wrong for a good character, must be made to preserve his powers. kind of a rastlin and cameron relationship.
Gallameed 07-29-06, 09:47 AM	Maybe in the past, one of the twins parents made an awful deal of some kind with a fiend before the twins were ever even a twinkle in their fathers eye, and the ''price'' the parent had to pay was the fiend blessing the mothers ''first born son with its unholy mark...'' However the parents were shocked to discover a second baby boys head/feet appear after the first was born! As if the gods of light were balancing things out? Hey, and make sure that the second born ''cleric to be'' son was born feet first as this is said to be the sign of a healer.
Nived 07-30-06, 01:43 AM	It obviously takes effort to be a Warlock. If it didn't it would be a Template, not a Class. Consider it this way, they both had the potential to become Warlocks, they both have the earmarks. Maybe the Cleric brother can do something like make his hand glow (no mechanical effect) the same color as his Warlock brother's Arcane Blasts (or whatever they're called). However that's about all he can do, he can't blast, and he can't invoke, because he's never really tried, not real focus, not real effort anyway. The one brother just focused on that ability, and managed to figure out how to channel it. The other... for whatever reason, decided not to, refused to explore those abilities. Thus he'll never get a handle on them, and never be able to use them in any significant way.
remmun 07-31-06, 01:13 AM	Consider it this way, they both had the potential to become Warlocks, they both have the earmarks. Maybe the Cleric brother can do something like make his hand glow (no mechanical effect) the same color as his Warlock brother's Arcane Blasts (or whatever they're called). However that's about all he can do, he can't blast, and he can't invoke, because he's never really tried, not real focus, not real effort anyway. The one brother just focused on that ability, and managed to figure out how to channel it. The other... for whatever reason, decided not to, refused to explore those abilities. Thus he'll never get a handle on them, and never be able to use them in any significant way. a different take on this idea might be that the blue glow of the cleric's hand is a sign that he is casting a divine spell. and that all his divine spells make his hand glow blue while all his brother's arcane spells make his hand glow red. that's just my take on it