How to make a Paladin into a Blackguard? [Archive] - Wizards Community

How to make a Paladin into a Blackguard? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Raven Dark
02-05-06, 02:28 AM My friends and I are starting a new Forgotten Realms campaign in a few days and we spent some time this evening developing an evil 6th-level party ready to tackle the infamous Undermountain.

So far we have a Human Ranger/Fallen Paladin (aspiring Blackguard), a Kenku Enchanter/Shadow Adept, and a Tiefling Rogue/Ranger (headed into CaveLord). There will be a fourth character which is as yet undecided.

So far the backgrounds work something like this: My enchanter was exiled from Skullport due to a failed scheme of some kind. She hopes to regain her position (a well-off slaver) by plundering Undermountain and using its resources to defeat the enemies who exiled her. After being exiled she took a short trip to the surface world where she encountered the paladin. Using her magical enchantments, she caused the paladin to commit a horrific act of some sort--thereby causing him to fall. The paladin came to believe that the crime was so horrible that there was no hope of redemption. My enchanter feeds off of this and manipulates the Pally into becoming a bodygaurd/pawn/apprentice of sorts.

Think of the relationship between Anakin and the Emporer in Episode III. That's what our characters have.

The tiefling is a greedy mercenary of a guide of the Underdark who operates out of Skullport. He also happens to be the only contact my enchanter can still trust. He is, suffice to say, the closest thing to a friend my character has. My character manipulates him into coming into Undermountain with her in search of riches. Basically our group is based on safety in numbers--safety for me. :evillaugh

What I need help with is this: What aweful deed could I have had the paladin commit that would convince him in HIS mind that there is no hope of redemption? How could I better manipulate him into the party? We were thinking of patricide maybe, but if I caused the pally to kill his daughter, why would he adventure with me? The simple fact that the Tiefling in the party allows the paladin to meet the blackguard's roleplaying requirement is really neat too.

We need more development on the reason the paladin fell and why he doesn't retaliate against my character. If we can get advice on making the rest of the group background better we would be grateful.

Thans in advance.
Lyinginbedmon
02-05-06, 01:30 PM Well, I would say just about anything from Nana (http://manga.clone-army.org/nana.php?page=1&lang=), but mostly I would imagine that a Paladin might lose all hope in redemption after seeing an outwardly good character perform an extremely evil act.

Perhaps the local cleric of Pelor takes a trip to an icey region, and isn't heard from for weeks after a snowstorm blows in. The Paladin goes to see if she's alright, and when he arrives she greets him as if the storm never hit, but all the schools are closed, and they're using small toys as kindling in the small fishing village she's visiting. He looks around a bit, and finds all the fishing holes have completely frozen over, too much for the fisherman to crack through. But, he helps save a few of the villagers from a rampaging group of barbarian halflings (Go with me on this for now). So, he's invited to a grand banquet to celebrate their surviving the storm, and he finds that they are serving their own children as the main course, the food supply having been cut off. Not only that, but he discovers that the barbarians weren't halflings at all, but children that managed to escape the slaughter.
Blackavar
02-05-06, 04:45 PM If you can find some way to make him personally kill his own friends, family, loved one's, etc., I think that would be best. I know one story (rather long, so I'll leave out most of it) where a paladin's younger sister was made into a vampire, his sister killed his parents, and then he had to kill her (he later had to also kill his wife when she was made into a vampire). The paladin became a blackgaurd. While I doubt you could get the vampire part here, you might convince him that a friend/family member/loved one had commited an unspeakable crime, then have him track down said friend/family member/loved one and kill him/her, then reveal that he/she was innocent (not letting him ever meet you in person, of course).
bassist33333
02-05-06, 05:37 PM You could have some sort of traumatic event. How about maybe him finding his brother or cousin sleeping with his wife and in a blind rage he kills both of them. Then he realizes what he's done and he wants to ressurect them so he takes up necromancy in order to save both of them. After a bit of necromancy training he ressurects them, but falsely so they're just skeletons. He hates himself for a while, but then he starts thinking about changing himself and ends up worshipping Nerull (god of death, grim-reaper-esque guy).

Or maybe you could just make it as simple as Nerull or maybe Wee Jas coming and speaking to him. Maybe his family is killed by a tornado and he wasn't there because he was preforming a mission for Pelor (or whatever god he worships as a paladin). He throws down his armor and weapons and mopes for a long time, until he is visited by the manifestation of an evil god, who tells him he's been on the wrong path and if he joins the ranks of the evil god, he can be rewarded in many ways.

Some way, he must be religiously touched.
Raven Dark
02-06-06, 02:13 AM How about this idea? Does it sound good?

Valaelas has always wanted power and riches. To this end she is constantly scheming. Lately however, one of her many schemes came to light in the worst way and she was forced to abandon Skullport for her own safety. Due to this unfortunate turn of events she has decided to find some other method of obtaining power. Having grown up on the fantastic rumors and stories of Undermountain, she happens to be very knowledgeable of the dangers and riches therein. She believes that by trying her hand at plundering its dungeon depths she might find some means of destroying her enemies. In this way she hopes to gain back her lost position in Skullport—and with any luck, she will also find enough treasure to make up for the suffering she has already had to endure.

Fearing her powers wouldn’t be enough for the horrors of Undermountain, she began a search for a powerful individual she could easily control. Her short-lived search came to an end with the human paladin, Jason. Valaelas the Black used her powerful enchantments to befriend the paladin and soon set up an elaborate scheme that ended with the death of Jason’s only daughter, the deaths of several of Torm’s leading clerics, and the fall of a mighty hero to the forces of evil.

Using her magic, Valaelas struck Jason’s daughter with a terrible and wasting disease. She then pretended to help in the attempts to find a cure all the while implicating Jason’s own church for her own heinous act. By using a combination of forged documents, charms, and magical suggestions, Valaelas was able to not only convince the paladin that his own church was responsible for his daughter’s debilitating death, but to incite such a rage in him that he attacked and killed the head of the temple as well as several fellow disciples of Torm.

With the paladin’s fall also came exile. As a criminal and an excommunicated paladin, Jason had nowhere to go, no one to turn to—no one except his one remaining “friend” Valaelas.

Ever since, Valaelas has manipulated Jason’s grief and rage into something she can use—a powerful new apprentice and aspiring blackguard in the service of Shar. Valaelas can’t teach divine magic, but that is of little consequence as all she need do now is show Jason the right doors to open and leave Shar to take care of the rest.

Soon, her new apprentice will be ready and he and Valaelas, along with an assortment of other “pawns,” will be ready to tackle Undermountain.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Raven Dark 02-05-06, 02:28 AM	My friends and I are starting a new Forgotten Realms campaign in a few days and we spent some time this evening developing an evil 6th-level party ready to tackle the infamous Undermountain. So far we have a Human Ranger/Fallen Paladin (aspiring Blackguard), a Kenku Enchanter/Shadow Adept, and a Tiefling Rogue/Ranger (headed into CaveLord). There will be a fourth character which is as yet undecided. So far the backgrounds work something like this: My enchanter was exiled from Skullport due to a failed scheme of some kind. She hopes to regain her position (a well-off slaver) by plundering Undermountain and using its resources to defeat the enemies who exiled her. After being exiled she took a short trip to the surface world where she encountered the paladin. Using her magical enchantments, she caused the paladin to commit a horrific act of some sort--thereby causing him to fall. The paladin came to believe that the crime was so horrible that there was no hope of redemption. My enchanter feeds off of this and manipulates the Pally into becoming a bodygaurd/pawn/apprentice of sorts. Think of the relationship between Anakin and the Emporer in Episode III. That's what our characters have. The tiefling is a greedy mercenary of a guide of the Underdark who operates out of Skullport. He also happens to be the only contact my enchanter can still trust. He is, suffice to say, the closest thing to a friend my character has. My character manipulates him into coming into Undermountain with her in search of riches. Basically our group is based on safety in numbers--safety for me. :evillaugh What I need help with is this: What aweful deed could I have had the paladin commit that would convince him in HIS mind that there is no hope of redemption? How could I better manipulate him into the party? We were thinking of patricide maybe, but if I caused the pally to kill his daughter, why would he adventure with me? The simple fact that the Tiefling in the party allows the paladin to meet the blackguard's roleplaying requirement is really neat too. We need more development on the reason the paladin fell and why he doesn't retaliate against my character. If we can get advice on making the rest of the group background better we would be grateful. Thans in advance.
Lyinginbedmon 02-05-06, 01:30 PM	Well, I would say just about anything from Nana (http://manga.clone-army.org/nana.php?page=1&lang=), but mostly I would imagine that a Paladin might lose all hope in redemption after seeing an outwardly good character perform an extremely evil act. Perhaps the local cleric of Pelor takes a trip to an icey region, and isn't heard from for weeks after a snowstorm blows in. The Paladin goes to see if she's alright, and when he arrives she greets him as if the storm never hit, but all the schools are closed, and they're using small toys as kindling in the small fishing village she's visiting. He looks around a bit, and finds all the fishing holes have completely frozen over, too much for the fisherman to crack through. But, he helps save a few of the villagers from a rampaging group of barbarian halflings (Go with me on this for now). So, he's invited to a grand banquet to celebrate their surviving the storm, and he finds that they are serving their own children as the main course, the food supply having been cut off. Not only that, but he discovers that the barbarians weren't halflings at all, but children that managed to escape the slaughter.
Blackavar 02-05-06, 04:45 PM	If you can find some way to make him personally kill his own friends, family, loved one's, etc., I think that would be best. I know one story (rather long, so I'll leave out most of it) where a paladin's younger sister was made into a vampire, his sister killed his parents, and then he had to kill her (he later had to also kill his wife when she was made into a vampire). The paladin became a blackgaurd. While I doubt you could get the vampire part here, you might convince him that a friend/family member/loved one had commited an unspeakable crime, then have him track down said friend/family member/loved one and kill him/her, then reveal that he/she was innocent (not letting him ever meet you in person, of course).
bassist33333 02-05-06, 05:37 PM	You could have some sort of traumatic event. How about maybe him finding his brother or cousin sleeping with his wife and in a blind rage he kills both of them. Then he realizes what he's done and he wants to ressurect them so he takes up necromancy in order to save both of them. After a bit of necromancy training he ressurects them, but falsely so they're just skeletons. He hates himself for a while, but then he starts thinking about changing himself and ends up worshipping Nerull (god of death, grim-reaper-esque guy). Or maybe you could just make it as simple as Nerull or maybe Wee Jas coming and speaking to him. Maybe his family is killed by a tornado and he wasn't there because he was preforming a mission for Pelor (or whatever god he worships as a paladin). He throws down his armor and weapons and mopes for a long time, until he is visited by the manifestation of an evil god, who tells him he's been on the wrong path and if he joins the ranks of the evil god, he can be rewarded in many ways. Some way, he must be religiously touched.
Raven Dark 02-06-06, 02:13 AM	How about this idea? Does it sound good? Valaelas has always wanted power and riches. To this end she is constantly scheming. Lately however, one of her many schemes came to light in the worst way and she was forced to abandon Skullport for her own safety. Due to this unfortunate turn of events she has decided to find some other method of obtaining power. Having grown up on the fantastic rumors and stories of Undermountain, she happens to be very knowledgeable of the dangers and riches therein. She believes that by trying her hand at plundering its dungeon depths she might find some means of destroying her enemies. In this way she hopes to gain back her lost position in Skullport—and with any luck, she will also find enough treasure to make up for the suffering she has already had to endure. Fearing her powers wouldn’t be enough for the horrors of Undermountain, she began a search for a powerful individual she could easily control. Her short-lived search came to an end with the human paladin, Jason. Valaelas the Black used her powerful enchantments to befriend the paladin and soon set up an elaborate scheme that ended with the death of Jason’s only daughter, the deaths of several of Torm’s leading clerics, and the fall of a mighty hero to the forces of evil. Using her magic, Valaelas struck Jason’s daughter with a terrible and wasting disease. She then pretended to help in the attempts to find a cure all the while implicating Jason’s own church for her own heinous act. By using a combination of forged documents, charms, and magical suggestions, Valaelas was able to not only convince the paladin that his own church was responsible for his daughter’s debilitating death, but to incite such a rage in him that he attacked and killed the head of the temple as well as several fellow disciples of Torm. With the paladin’s fall also came exile. As a criminal and an excommunicated paladin, Jason had nowhere to go, no one to turn to—no one except his one remaining “friend” Valaelas. Ever since, Valaelas has manipulated Jason’s grief and rage into something she can use—a powerful new apprentice and aspiring blackguard in the service of Shar. Valaelas can’t teach divine magic, but that is of little consequence as all she need do now is show Jason the right doors to open and leave Shar to take care of the rest. Soon, her new apprentice will be ready and he and Valaelas, along with an assortment of other “pawns,” will be ready to tackle Undermountain.