Post/Author/DateTime	Post
meto30 09-12-07, 03:49 PM	Hello. This is my first ever thread. I'm a fantasy enthusiast new to DnD. I've been introduced to DnD by a fellow raider in my WoW Kharazhan raid team, and all I know about DnD is from tidbits from the fellow raider and my experience from playing the Neverwinter Nights CRPG from Atari. I'm planning on becoming a DM, and I've gathered a few fantasy enthusiasts in my school campus to participate, but my rullbooks haven't arrived yet (it takes 32 days for the books to arrive at South Korea, would you believe it), and so I decided to flesh up some nice stories and NPCs before I go on. From my knowledge I've been able to create some rough drafts... but I've stumbled on one NPC who is crucial to the story. Here's a quick view of behaviors. History is left out, but I'll include them as hidden text at the end of this post. The NPC is a male human sorcerer. He is by his standards a good-inclined gentleman, and a man of honor. He has a strong philosophy of what is good and lawful, and he adheres to them sternly. However, his sense of right and wrong is quite shocking to other NPCs (this is one of the major factors in the interaction of this NPC with PCs). He is a open supporter of stern and draconian measures for keeping disorderly citizens in line. He has never done charity in his life, and detests all sorts of charitable acts. In fact, he thinks charity is a crime, and sometimes threatens those who commit themselves to the aid of the poor. He believes that the poor and the helpless are not to be helped, but rather be taught and trained so they can escape their current misery. That is, not give the beggar fish, but teach him to fish. His measures are forceful - he drags unwilling people into his program and punishes those who cannot follow his lead. He has used his magical prowess to pursue and punish some bandits and thieves around his town. While doing so he has tortured, maimed, blackmailed, cheated, killed, and kidnapped a large number of people, many of them innocent. Somehow he was never convicted of crime. (This part of history needs work, and advice on this would be welcome) He has a number of loyal servants who were previously beggars or petty criminals who have come to see things his way. Beggars he accused of weakness and whipped them into shape, and criminals he threatned to surrender. All of them he has supported well, and now the servants have families of their own and a fruitfull life. However he is swift for retribution on traitors, and all servants know this. Some of them will express their outright fear of the man to the PCs. He is tolerant of enmity towards him, and thinks of his critics as 'poor misguided people who have been misled to think so'. He swears an oath every morning to 'enlighten' people around him, mostly by forcefull means. He forgives often, especially when people succumb to his threats. He treats those who have kneeled to him kindly, supporting them, and advising them on what is good, and what is right. He does not forget enmity, however, and when someone he has turned to his side betrays him, the payback is a slow painful death, horrible as possible. He dislikes racism. He understands that people think in different ways, and is quite knowledgeable in foreign customs. It is just that he deems anything that contradicts his code as wrong. He knows and understands the differences. He does not condone them. He believes he must consort to all means possible to bring the people to the light of justice he believes in. He deems himself to be a crusader who sacrifices himself to save others. He is sure his evil deeds will be forgiven by his god. sorry, that was a long list, and I know it. This is probably THE most important NPC in the game I'm planning, and so I've done a lot of work. First I've wanted to make a typical LG, but while making tweaks and twists, I ended up with this. I think this character will make interesting results, especially since this guy is filled with hypocricy. The problem is, I can't sort this character. I don't think he is LG... but not CG either... no, I just can't decide. below is history. Highlight to see text. The game is set on Forgotten Realms Setting, but is tweaked a little bit to fit in my story. I'm planning on setting up a long campaign with this game as the first chapter. Most of the game will play in Waterdeep and Neverwinter. The NPC appears midway along the game, and congratulates the PC party's progress in breaking a weapon smuggling ring. The Story breaks from there, PCs deciding to either work for the Masked Lords, the NPC, or a Chaotic Neutral Warlock who is trying to remove the clandestine operation for his own needs. He has recently moved to Waterdeep, and has supporters across the city and the surrounding countryside. He has a minor but not negligible political influence in the city, and is a thorn on the side to the Council of the Masked Lords. (the game story has a lot to do with the Council's decision to get rid of him although having no strong evidence of evil-doing) Although being considered an annoyance, the NPC himself supports the city government fully and praises its success in keeping the city ordered and safe. He supports himself by means unknown. Many of his enemies believe he is involved in some sort of smuggling operations. (He is actually not doing anything criminal, and how he keeps himself and his supporters well is revealed near the end of the game) He says that he worships Torm, but many people, especially those who themselves worship Torm, find this hard to believe. Actually, they're true - he does not worship Torm. He doesn't worship anyone in the Faerunian Pantheon. He believes in some other strange god whose identity is hidden all along the game. I'm planning on revealing this in some later games.
jagggar 09-12-07, 04:54 PM	First I've wanted to make a typical LG, but while making tweaks and twists, I ended up with this. I think this character will make interesting results, especially since this guy is filled with hypocricy. The problem is, I can't sort this character. I don't think he is LG... but not CG either... no, I just can't decide. Have you thought of looking at the other end of the spectrum? To me, parts of your description just scream Lawful Evil. At his best, he's Lawful Neutral. Though, that may be stretching it. If you believe Lawful would not put the ends before the means ("Well, we do want the bandits gone, but kidnapping is illegal so we shan't do that to find them"), then he's likely Neutral Evil. He has used his magical prowess to pursue and punish some bandits and thieves around his town. While doing so he has tortured, maimed, blackmailed, cheated, killed, and kidnapped a large number of people, many of them innocent. Somehow he was never convicted of crime. (This part of history needs work, and advice on this would be welcome) This for example screams LE. Someone who was Good would make an effort to make sure they weren't harming the innocent and would probably feel bad afterwards if they found out they did.. As to why he wasn't convicted, a few ideas: He was working for the law enforcement in the first place and they turned a blind eye. Those in charge became convinced that his methods were the best and therefore not wrong. He was powerful enough that those who wanted to oppose him didn't for fear of being his next target. If you're worried about making him evil for fear of the players using a detect spell and deciding to kill him just because he's evil, you can give him a ring of undetectable alignment for 2000 gp. It shouldn't be much of a problem for him to afford since you said you planned to introduce him midway through the campaign. Don't know if I helped any.
Woodforsheep 09-12-07, 05:18 PM	That screams LN to me. From the SRD (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/article/srd35): A lawful neutral character acts as law, tradition, or a personal code directs her. [] She may believe in personal order and live by a code or standard...[] Lawful neutral is the best alignment you can be because it means you are reliable and honorable without being a zealot. Bolding is mine. Remember, lawful doesn't neccesarily mean the laws of the society their in. LN or LE are pretty abberrant character types. Until you get your rulebooks, peruse the SRD. It will help. Of course, YMMV.
meto30 09-13-07, 12:53 AM	Thanks for the advice. Listening to the two ideas, I think LN would be a better choice, not because it fits the char better, but because then PCs would have a lot of freedom in their interactions. I shall talk with the fellow raider on this, but I think he would agree. I really like the idea of his 'hiding' his mind... A new facet of hypocricy for players to explore. I thank jaggar for his advice on hiding alignments. If you're worried about making him evil for fear of the players using a detect spell and deciding to kill him just because he's evil, you can give him a ring of undetectable alignment for 2000 gp. It shouldn't be much of a problem for him to afford since you said you planned to introduce him midway through the campaign. thanks for the information. Also, I will read through the SRD. Thanks, Woodforsheep. On jaggar's advice on reasons for the NPC's apparent immunity to conviction, I don't think the first option would work - I personally find it difficult for the law enforcement agencies of Waterdeep would go as far as let this man into their fold. All I know of Waterdeep is shallow knowledge, though, and maybe I'm wrong. But the second option is attractive. Maybe one of the marshals came to believe in the NPC's ideas and became his secret supporter. By the way, just for the fun of it, I will tell my players that the NPC looks like Al Pacino when he was playing Michael Corleone in Godfather Part III. That would be fun, especially since I already have a strong personallity to base my char on. But maybe that'll restrict me to the Don's character - no, I'd have to do this, I'm not a full-fledged DM yet, so I better be on the safe side.
Daxen 09-19-07, 06:24 PM	This character could be called LN but I would inform the player that they are teatering precariously on evil. And in truth it would be DM Fiat. This guy is a Zealot, he believes that his way is right and all other's are wrong. His methods are evil, his motives are incomprehensible, he has little to no concern of the well fare of others, he wants order. A want for order combined with an unchecked ego leads to tyranical power. I am willing to bet that his loyal followers dare not oppose is will for fear of the consequences. LE is not as abherant in society as we would like to believe. It is best described as the dominion of the strong over the weak. His definitions of strength may not be those typically held by the majority, but he shows a preference for the self reliant, the dilligent and those willing to make there lot in life better, so much so that giving them any aid whatsoever is tantamount to sin or treason. In example I offer a quote that I could see this man saying, upon approaching one of his followers giving a coin to a beggar. "Do not teach that weakling to rely upon your strength, he will grow strong or he will die. If he grows strong by your hand you will grow weaker for it. Upon extending your hand to pull him up you show your willingness to be dragged down. Through charity you foster the growth of parasites, and I shall not be surrounded by those thus infected. Join him in the gutter!" *kick* This man is evil. He and anyone else can attempt to justify it however they want to, but seeing these actions a Paladin would attempt a smite on him, and in my opinion it would work swimmingly.
Starcloud 09-20-07, 02:15 AM	"He is a open supporter of stern and draconian measures for keeping disorderly citizens in line." - Lawful "... While doing so he has tortured, maimed, blackmailed, cheated, killed, and kidnapped a large number of people, many of them innocent." - Evil Yes, as written, he is definitely Lawful Evil.
BlackWeasel 09-22-07, 03:04 AM	Yeah I reckon he is LE