Need help fleshing out this villain [Archive] - Wizards Community

Need help fleshing out this villain [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Demonwolf
06-29-06, 01:10 AM I'm looking for further creative suggestions with this character I came up with using this idea (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=659950), so if anyone has any opinions or ideas, they'd be much appreciated. My players for my upcoming Waterdeep game, don't read this. Keep in mind that I'm not just looking for help with the mentioned issues: If you have any other suggestions of opinions, please share.

Garrou Erelauth, CE Wild Elf

An aging elven dilettante who spent his life in Waterdeep away from the traditions of his people, Garrou was raised by his adoptive human noble parents after spending the formative years of his life traumatically being shifted from one negligent/abusive foster parent to the next, which gradually led to a certain degree of sociopathy. He spent the first century of his life living the freewheeling, impulsive and adventurous life of the typical dandyish human noble scion, and thanks to his insight, was a master manipulator and more often than not succeeded in getting exactly what he sought.

However, he was eventually confronted with the choice of maturing and taking on the responsibilities of aristocracy, or allowing his hedonism to be his downfall, and like many of his fellows, he chose the latter. However, while his habits were hedonistic even by the standards of his peers, he did not fall to overdose, bankruptcy, a loss of reputation or any other pitfall of the indulgent, thanks to his natural cunning, insight and centuries of experience. His savvy allowed him to satisfy his drug addictions, sexual fetishes and adventurous impulses with political, physical and financial impunity, and he often boasts of having experienced every high known to man or elf.

As he aged, he became more and more desensitized to the highs that excited him in his youth and requires much more now in his fourth century of life. He now operates many a criminal organization and secretly funds evil-aligned religious bodies and organized crime groups throughout the city in exchange for a steady flow of slaves, mood-altering chemicals and reliable resurrections following highs that his body cannot endure. In addition, he also craves the highs of fear, conquest and manipulation- one of his favorite pastimes is to test his own ability to get away with criminal activities, leading him to commit more and more brazen acts of depravity for their own sake.

My main question is about what class he should be and how he'd play out mechanically.

But there are also a couple of other issues. One is that if I run him as a villain, the campaign would almost be exclusively restricted to Dock Ward and Skullport (ie the bad, illegal and impoverished sides of Waterdeep) but I imagine this char's estate would be in much more prosperous surroundings, and I'm not sure how to make it so that he conveys a very real presence in the two sub-cities. I don't want to just make him have a wide range of influence, I want him to actually be there, especially since a BBEG battle culminating with him would cause a little atmospheric conflict if it was set in a noble district.

My next issue is for ideas for his super-henchman (well, henchwoman). She'd be an all-purpose slave, a bodyguard, assassin, secretary, servant and concubine. She'd also be a mentally enslaved aasimar, paladin, half-celestial, celestial or some other innately good creature for the sake of added depravity. Finally, she'd be a shapechanger who takes on whatever form he wishes of her for an obvious reason, and this is where the issue comes up; I think it effectively conveys both his complete objectification of her and her complete acceptance of it, but I want to make that clear to the players in a subtle and tasteful way, without descending into the realm of tentacle anime, and I'm not entirely sure how to do that.

The other issue regarding her is the cause and means of her enslavement. I'm thinking a pact made with or favor performed by some creature or character who can mentally enslave others, but I'm not sure who's capable of doing that.
guru7892
06-29-06, 04:30 AM My thoughts and questions]My main question is about what class he should be and how he'd play out mechanically. the npc class aristocrat is obvious(30%), but conisder a heavey dose of rouge(50%) with a spash(3-5) of cleric or sorcerer, consider 1-2 levels in fighter, barbarian, or even ranger.

aristocrat5/rouge7/clericORsorcerer3,fighterORbarbarainORra nger1

But there are also a couple of other issues. One is that if I run him as a villain, the campaign would almost be exclusively restricted to Dock Ward and Skullport (ie the bad, illegal and impoverished sides of Waterdeep) but I imagine this char's estate would be in much more prosperous surroundings, and I'm not sure how to make it so that he conveys a very real presence in the two sub-cities. I don't want to just make him have a wide range of influence, I want him to actually be there, especially since a BBEG battle culminating with him would cause a little atmospheric conflict if it was set in a noble district.
here is where you get to **** with things(mostly with your players).
The PC's should meet their arch enemy and his old freinds at certain nobel parties, games, or such. Places heavely gaurded where direct assasination would make them be prosecuted. it would probably be good to have the players be hired at the more 'noble' parts of the city. this is probably a good place for teh final battle to take place and then the very one-sided leagal struggle can take place where the henchmen learns she was manipulated by an evil corrupt man. This makes a good closing for the story and allows time to wrap up some lose ends.

Have the fights take place at more in the seedy districts. This will build tension as the players have an apperntly easy strike at their target, but they can't reach. They have to fight on his turf to win.

you can also allow some RP stuff in seedy areas to build tension aswell. a SINGLE assasination attempt in the noble area is also a good idea.

My next issue is for ideas for his super-henchman (well, henchwoman). She'd be an all-purpose slave, a bodyguard, assassin, secretary, servant and concubine. She'd also be a mentally enslaved aasimar, paladin, half-celestial, celestial or some other innately good creature for the sake of added depravity. Finally, she'd be a shapechanger who takes on whatever form he wishes of her for an obvious reason, and this is where the issue comes up; I think it effectively conveys both his complete objectification of her and her complete acceptance of it, but I want to make that clear to the players in a subtle and tasteful way, without descending into the realm of tentacle anime, and I'm not entirely sure how to do that.
This is VERY hard to find for me. I would take it in another direction:

Human
psion10/rogue5/assassin5 (aristocrat3/psion9/rouge5/assassin4)

I would have the npc be CG, and sympathetic toward the druglord. Prehaps she is an aristocrat herself. The truth is that Garrou is manipulating her with words and his love. This is VERY ironic because she is a psion (acually,any psionic class works).

The other issue regarding her is the cause and means of her enslavement. I'm thinking a pact made with or favor performed by some creature or character who can mentally enslave others, but I'm not sure who's capable of doing that.
mind flayer is the obvious choice.
as a matter of fact, put a teifling psion in there with a mind-flayer apprentice if you want to **** with the player more.

psyclogical notes: This person hates humans; they are constantly seen as his antagonist.
this person probably has no reason to feel equal with humans, he probably manipulates and patronizes them like animals or pets.

most of his hate will probably be directed toward nobles, due to his previous status,rejection and beatings.
Kazzaroth Pan'theon
06-29-06, 11:08 AM Also note that elven nobles are NOT allowed in Waterdeep politics, so he must be treated as foreign visitor not as local in law wise (the grander noble houses would irk and would had tried kill the bastard themselves). So there would be one sided law enforcement favouring players so long any Tyr priest is not running it :P.

So, somesort older version and much more hedonistic Elaith Craulnober? What is his stand about this guy? Or this guy relative of his who is working under him by running sepparated crime ring in Skullport and live in luxury as merchant prince in Waterdeep?! Anycase my advice would go to give the guy Psionic Rogue levels, descriped here; http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040723b

I would advice following build; Psycic Rogue 7/Shadowmind 5 (PrC from Complete Adventurer in pg74). You can decide what other levels it would have (suggest continue in the PrC) but my point would be that our noble here has picked Psionic version of Charm Person and is able manifest it so that the duration is days long (10 days, save DC 15 + Int mod) and can affect outsiders (if we keep on theme that his cohort is charmed good outsider).

Also our guy haves rogues skill selection, 4d6 sneak attack and knows two 3lvl psionic powers, knows Read Toughts and Cloud Mind thanks being Shadowmind (these two comes as extra powers). My suggestion would go pick Telekinetic Force and Concealing Amorpha (Greater) as 3lvl powers from psionic rogue list and you can pick some other power from 2lvl from any psionic list in 12lvl if you want some more offensive powers but I would suggest to remain subtle and use only Expand Knowlegde to learn the psionic verison of Charm Person (and this you can pick in earliest in 6lvl).

What comes to shapechanging outsider, my suggestion would go to Aasimar Sorcerror, or elf half-celestial sorcerror who knows Alter Self spell or Polymorph spell (around 4-10 class levels, depending how tough you want make her). Also ironically a elf whit Otherwordly feat (which makes person a outsider) whit good alignment and being sorcerror would do rulewise the same :P.
Demonwolf
06-29-06, 11:53 AM Ugh, totally forgot about Waterdhavian nobility's discrimination against elves. Making him a merchant prince would probably work just as well, though. (Better, actually.)

Also, probably should have mentioned this is an ECL 5 campaign, although I'll probably end up taking the characters to level 8 or so, meaning the EL of the party would around 11 or 12 at that point.

She'd reveal her true and divine form once freed from his influence, which is one of the big reasons I wanted to do the shapechanger, besides the obvious potential as a villain mechanically. I just think that's such a perfectly disturbing revelation. You can't get much more evil than physically violating a celestial creature to that extent. Doing the misguided CG doesn't make her as sympathetic of a villain, imo. Also, considering warshaper.
Kazzaroth Pan'theon
06-30-06, 09:51 PM Wel...if you want go PRETTY far whit the shapeshifting celestial I would advice pick Eladrin whit enough levels in sorcerror or as special personall power shapeshift more mortal being as spell-alike ability. Note that the Psionic Charm may work on her whit some chance.
Sands_Of_Chaos
07-01-06, 04:28 AM Well, it seems like you've got some very promising ideas, but, please allow me to perhaps spin a tale about my thoughts on your dillemas. First of all, this character of yours seems like a very thought out man, albiet perhaps a tad overly-risque. However, you should remember that trouble tends to follow in evil's path, and need not be restricted to hoods and slums.

Secondly, that lady of the evening your lad is in possesion of could have attained such a deal through transaction from a dealer not too unknown from his type of life. Think about it, people are bought and sold on a daily basis, perhaps this little number simply has had a tad more preping before being pervayed on the streets like a piece of meat.

I can only hope that my words have somehow helped you reach a conclusion to what you want to do with your path.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Demonwolf 06-29-06, 01:10 AM	I'm looking for further creative suggestions with this character I came up with using this idea (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=659950), so if anyone has any opinions or ideas, they'd be much appreciated. My players for my upcoming Waterdeep game, don't read this. Keep in mind that I'm not just looking for help with the mentioned issues: If you have any other suggestions of opinions, please share. Garrou Erelauth, CE Wild Elf An aging elven dilettante who spent his life in Waterdeep away from the traditions of his people, Garrou was raised by his adoptive human noble parents after spending the formative years of his life traumatically being shifted from one negligent/abusive foster parent to the next, which gradually led to a certain degree of sociopathy. He spent the first century of his life living the freewheeling, impulsive and adventurous life of the typical dandyish human noble scion, and thanks to his insight, was a master manipulator and more often than not succeeded in getting exactly what he sought. However, he was eventually confronted with the choice of maturing and taking on the responsibilities of aristocracy, or allowing his hedonism to be his downfall, and like many of his fellows, he chose the latter. However, while his habits were hedonistic even by the standards of his peers, he did not fall to overdose, bankruptcy, a loss of reputation or any other pitfall of the indulgent, thanks to his natural cunning, insight and centuries of experience. His savvy allowed him to satisfy his drug addictions, sexual fetishes and adventurous impulses with political, physical and financial impunity, and he often boasts of having experienced every high known to man or elf. As he aged, he became more and more desensitized to the highs that excited him in his youth and requires much more now in his fourth century of life. He now operates many a criminal organization and secretly funds evil-aligned religious bodies and organized crime groups throughout the city in exchange for a steady flow of slaves, mood-altering chemicals and reliable resurrections following highs that his body cannot endure. In addition, he also craves the highs of fear, conquest and manipulation- one of his favorite pastimes is to test his own ability to get away with criminal activities, leading him to commit more and more brazen acts of depravity for their own sake. My main question is about what class he should be and how he'd play out mechanically. But there are also a couple of other issues. One is that if I run him as a villain, the campaign would almost be exclusively restricted to Dock Ward and Skullport (ie the bad, illegal and impoverished sides of Waterdeep) but I imagine this char's estate would be in much more prosperous surroundings, and I'm not sure how to make it so that he conveys a very real presence in the two sub-cities. I don't want to just make him have a wide range of influence, I want him to actually be there, especially since a BBEG battle culminating with him would cause a little atmospheric conflict if it was set in a noble district. My next issue is for ideas for his super-henchman (well, henchwoman). She'd be an all-purpose slave, a bodyguard, assassin, secretary, servant and concubine. She'd also be a mentally enslaved aasimar, paladin, half-celestial, celestial or some other innately good creature for the sake of added depravity. Finally, she'd be a shapechanger who takes on whatever form he wishes of her for an obvious reason, and this is where the issue comes up; I think it effectively conveys both his complete objectification of her and her complete acceptance of it, but I want to make that clear to the players in a subtle and tasteful way, without descending into the realm of tentacle anime, and I'm not entirely sure how to do that. The other issue regarding her is the cause and means of her enslavement. I'm thinking a pact made with or favor performed by some creature or character who can mentally enslave others, but I'm not sure who's capable of doing that.
guru7892 06-29-06, 04:30 AM	My thoughts and questions]My main question is about what class he should be and how he'd play out mechanically. the npc class aristocrat is obvious(30%), but conisder a heavey dose of rouge(50%) with a spash(3-5) of cleric or sorcerer, consider 1-2 levels in fighter, barbarian, or even ranger. aristocrat5/rouge7/clericORsorcerer3,fighterORbarbarainORra nger1 But there are also a couple of other issues. One is that if I run him as a villain, the campaign would almost be exclusively restricted to Dock Ward and Skullport (ie the bad, illegal and impoverished sides of Waterdeep) but I imagine this char's estate would be in much more prosperous surroundings, and I'm not sure how to make it so that he conveys a very real presence in the two sub-cities. I don't want to just make him have a wide range of influence, I want him to actually be there, especially since a BBEG battle culminating with him would cause a little atmospheric conflict if it was set in a noble district. here is where you get to ** with things(mostly with your players). The PC's should meet their arch enemy and his old freinds at certain nobel parties, games, or such. Places heavely gaurded where direct assasination would make them be prosecuted. it would probably be good to have the players be hired at the more 'noble' parts of the city. this is probably a good place for teh final battle to take place and then the very one-sided leagal struggle can take place where the henchmen learns she was manipulated by an evil corrupt man. This makes a good closing for the story and allows time to wrap up some lose ends. Have the fights take place at more in the seedy districts. This will build tension as the players have an apperntly easy strike at their target, but they can't reach. They have to fight on his turf to win. you can also allow some RP stuff in seedy areas to build tension aswell. a SINGLE assasination attempt in the noble area is also a good idea. My next issue is for ideas for his super-henchman (well, henchwoman). She'd be an all-purpose slave, a bodyguard, assassin, secretary, servant and concubine. She'd also be a mentally enslaved aasimar, paladin, half-celestial, celestial or some other innately good creature for the sake of added depravity. Finally, she'd be a shapechanger who takes on whatever form he wishes of her for an obvious reason, and this is where the issue comes up; I think it effectively conveys both his complete objectification of her and her complete acceptance of it, but I want to make that clear to the players in a subtle and tasteful way, without descending into the realm of tentacle anime, and I'm not entirely sure how to do that. This is VERY hard to find for me. I would take it in another direction: Human psion10/rogue5/assassin5 (aristocrat3/psion9/rouge5/assassin4) I would have the npc be CG, and sympathetic toward the druglord. Prehaps she is an aristocrat herself. The truth is that Garrou is manipulating her with words and his love. This is VERY ironic because she is a psion (acually,any psionic class works). The other issue regarding her is the cause and means of her enslavement. I'm thinking a pact made with or favor performed by some creature or character who can mentally enslave others, but I'm not sure who's capable of doing that. mind flayer is the obvious choice. as a matter of fact, put a teifling psion in there with a mind-flayer apprentice if you want to ** with the player more. psyclogical notes: This person hates humans; they are constantly seen as his antagonist. this person probably has no reason to feel equal with humans, he probably manipulates and patronizes them like animals or pets. most of his hate will probably be directed toward nobles, due to his previous status,rejection and beatings.
Kazzaroth Pan'theon 06-29-06, 11:08 AM	Also note that elven nobles are NOT allowed in Waterdeep politics, so he must be treated as foreign visitor not as local in law wise (the grander noble houses would irk and would had tried kill the bastard themselves). So there would be one sided law enforcement favouring players so long any Tyr priest is not running it :P. So, somesort older version and much more hedonistic Elaith Craulnober? What is his stand about this guy? Or this guy relative of his who is working under him by running sepparated crime ring in Skullport and live in luxury as merchant prince in Waterdeep?! Anycase my advice would go to give the guy Psionic Rogue levels, descriped here; http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040723b I would advice following build; Psycic Rogue 7/Shadowmind 5 (PrC from Complete Adventurer in pg74). You can decide what other levels it would have (suggest continue in the PrC) but my point would be that our noble here has picked Psionic version of Charm Person and is able manifest it so that the duration is days long (10 days, save DC 15 + Int mod) and can affect outsiders (if we keep on theme that his cohort is charmed good outsider). Also our guy haves rogues skill selection, 4d6 sneak attack and knows two 3lvl psionic powers, knows Read Toughts and Cloud Mind thanks being Shadowmind (these two comes as extra powers). My suggestion would go pick Telekinetic Force and Concealing Amorpha (Greater) as 3lvl powers from psionic rogue list and you can pick some other power from 2lvl from any psionic list in 12lvl if you want some more offensive powers but I would suggest to remain subtle and use only Expand Knowlegde to learn the psionic verison of Charm Person (and this you can pick in earliest in 6lvl). What comes to shapechanging outsider, my suggestion would go to Aasimar Sorcerror, or elf half-celestial sorcerror who knows Alter Self spell or Polymorph spell (around 4-10 class levels, depending how tough you want make her). Also ironically a elf whit Otherwordly feat (which makes person a outsider) whit good alignment and being sorcerror would do rulewise the same :P.
Demonwolf 06-29-06, 11:53 AM	Ugh, totally forgot about Waterdhavian nobility's discrimination against elves. Making him a merchant prince would probably work just as well, though. (Better, actually.) Also, probably should have mentioned this is an ECL 5 campaign, although I'll probably end up taking the characters to level 8 or so, meaning the EL of the party would around 11 or 12 at that point. She'd reveal her true and divine form once freed from his influence, which is one of the big reasons I wanted to do the shapechanger, besides the obvious potential as a villain mechanically. I just think that's such a perfectly disturbing revelation. You can't get much more evil than physically violating a celestial creature to that extent. Doing the misguided CG doesn't make her as sympathetic of a villain, imo. Also, considering warshaper.
Kazzaroth Pan'theon 06-30-06, 09:51 PM	Wel...if you want go PRETTY far whit the shapeshifting celestial I would advice pick Eladrin whit enough levels in sorcerror or as special personall power shapeshift more mortal being as spell-alike ability. Note that the Psionic Charm may work on her whit some chance.
Sands_Of_Chaos 07-01-06, 04:28 AM	Well, it seems like you've got some very promising ideas, but, please allow me to perhaps spin a tale about my thoughts on your dillemas. First of all, this character of yours seems like a very thought out man, albiet perhaps a tad overly-risque. However, you should remember that trouble tends to follow in evil's path, and need not be restricted to hoods and slums. Secondly, that lady of the evening your lad is in possesion of could have attained such a deal through transaction from a dealer not too unknown from his type of life. Think about it, people are bought and sold on a daily basis, perhaps this little number simply has had a tad more preping before being pervayed on the streets like a piece of meat. I can only hope that my words have somehow helped you reach a conclusion to what you want to do with your path.