Silver Flame ritual signs of outward holiness and feudal backgrounds [Archive] - Wizards Community

Silver Flame ritual signs of outward holiness and feudal backgrounds [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
JulesCARV
11-15-05, 12:43 AM Hi. New here, and know very little about Eberron: I'm working on developing a character who is trying to be a Silver Flame paladin. He hasn't quite gotten it yet (I'm starting my character off as the equivalent of a "fallen" paladin: i.e. paladin proficiencies, but no detect evil, aura of good, or other paladin special abilities. Except instead of being fallen, mine is a never-was paladin, though maybe he'll eventually become one once he internalizes real selflessness). He used to be chaotic evil (in a sorta mild way: he didn't kill anyone, but he seduced and abandoned girls without a thought for their feelings, hung out with the wrong crowd, lied, played a few malicious pranks, etc). Anyway, before the start of the game, he's on the road to penetance, and has by this point progressed from chaotic evil to lawful neutral status. His innate character is still kind of contemptuous of others, resentful, and judgmental, but he tries really, really hard to be good.

Anyway, if the Silver Flame has any outward signs of holiness, I'd like him to practice as many of these as possible. What does the Silver Flame consider to be outwardly good behavior? I don't want some sort of deep character change for the better, like "humility" or "selflessness": I just want a bunch of annoying little rituals that are supposed to be holy ;). (for example, vows of chastity, sticking to a vegetarian/Kosher/whatever diet, not drinking alcohol, giving money regularly to the church hierarchy, not gambling, etc.)

Another question: my character is supposed to come from a kinda-feudal background. Basically, his daddy is an elf lord, his mommy was a human maid, he's a bastard, and his stepmommy hates seeing him and being reminded that her husband cheated on her (I realize that this makes him a half-elf born of an elf and human, somewhat unusual in Eberron, where most half-elves have half-elf parents, grandparents, etc, but whatever). These aren't supposed to be powerful dukes of large regions, or anything: I want his dad to be the lord of, maybe, a burgh of 5,000-15,000 people or so: bigger than a village, but still rather pastoral. My GM suggested that Thrane or Aundair would be the best backgrounds for him. Also, my character is supposed to come from a vaguely Gallic background (e.g. he comes from the town of Alvegny, he's named Jean-Paul d'Alvegny, his elven father is named Jacques Goreaux, etc). Do you think Aundair would be the best country of origin for him, or what?

Thanks.

EDIT: I just realized that I posted this on a general character development board, not an Eberron-specific character development board. I got confused, because I got here via the Eberron boards portal. Anyway, any help is still welcome, but I think I'll also split this message in two and post the "what Silver Flame rituals can I give my character" part in the "Magic, Deities, and Cosmology" board and the "what's a good feudal background" in the "People and Places" board.
Good Agnostic
11-25-05, 06:22 PM There really haven't been any official supplements regarding the rituals of any of the Eberron faiths.

I will say, however, that many people see the Silver Flame as a not so disguised knock off of the Catholic Church. Talk to your DM. I'd rule that if you wanted, you could just pick whatever rituals of the medieval Catholic Church and use them. Priests take vows of chastity and poverty. They pray alot. They tithe. They know all the saints and pray to them for specifics. They comfort the sick and dying. They perform rituals such as mass and the seven sacraments (baptism, first communion, confirmation, marriage, ordination, eucharist, last rites). They talk about God all the time - weaving Him into all kinds of discussions, etc.

So, the recovering badboy will assume all of these affectations, even though his heart isn't really into yet. Talking about God, going to the orphanage, visiting the sick, praying by their bedside, etc.

When does he go from LN to LG? What is his trigger? There are lots of possibilities. Hope your DM has fun with it, because you sound like a great player.
JulesCARV
12-07-05, 01:46 AM Thank you for your reply, Good Agnostic.

I found out what the trigger was tonight.

After an unpleasant shifter attack, Jean-Paul Alvegny (not D'Alvegny, because that would make him dragonmarked, someone in another forum told me, and he's not) was lying on the ground with -1 hp, unconscious, and our goblin ninja (variant of rogue, I think), Likha, was at -7 hp or something. None of our other party members could really heal, and our artificer's magic wand (which could cast magic missile OR cure light wounds at 1d4 + 1 healing or damage, but he had to roll a d100 and get over 20 or something to get the right one) wasn't working. So the DM pulled a little Deus Ex Machina, and had Tira Miron visit me while I was unconscious, and she showed me how I wasn't really following the Silver Flame, because I was focused on my own pride, purity, and righteousness, rather than doing good selflessly for its own sake. At first, I had JP argue with her, but then realize that that was exactly the pride she was referring to. JP then realized that he couldn't really redeem himself: only the Silver Flame could redeem him (note: I kinda think that the idea that none of us are good enough to really be good autonomously, and that we can only achieve goodness by surrendering ourselves to a higher power is kinda BS, but it fits my character's "rehab morality"). All his wounds were healed, his eyes (temporarily) glowed with silver fire, and he temporarily gained super laying-of-hands healing powers (temporarily, because he's still level 1), which he used to save the ninja. He also shifted to LG, and became a full paladin.

I think that the "redemption" story came mostly because our party was in a tight fix with two members down and dying, and JP's experience solved all those problems.

Now I'm going to have to figure out how to play a paladin who's actually LG, rather than a jerk who's trying half-successfully to be good. I hadn't expected the transformation to come this soon in the game.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
JulesCARV 11-15-05, 12:43 AM	Hi. New here, and know very little about Eberron: I'm working on developing a character who is trying to be a Silver Flame paladin. He hasn't quite gotten it yet (I'm starting my character off as the equivalent of a "fallen" paladin: i.e. paladin proficiencies, but no detect evil, aura of good, or other paladin special abilities. Except instead of being fallen, mine is a never-was paladin, though maybe he'll eventually become one once he internalizes real selflessness). He used to be chaotic evil (in a sorta mild way: he didn't kill anyone, but he seduced and abandoned girls without a thought for their feelings, hung out with the wrong crowd, lied, played a few malicious pranks, etc). Anyway, before the start of the game, he's on the road to penetance, and has by this point progressed from chaotic evil to lawful neutral status. His innate character is still kind of contemptuous of others, resentful, and judgmental, but he tries really, really hard to be good. Anyway, if the Silver Flame has any outward signs of holiness, I'd like him to practice as many of these as possible. What does the Silver Flame consider to be outwardly good behavior? I don't want some sort of deep character change for the better, like "humility" or "selflessness": I just want a bunch of annoying little rituals that are supposed to be holy ;). (for example, vows of chastity, sticking to a vegetarian/Kosher/whatever diet, not drinking alcohol, giving money regularly to the church hierarchy, not gambling, etc.) Another question: my character is supposed to come from a kinda-feudal background. Basically, his daddy is an elf lord, his mommy was a human maid, he's a bastard, and his stepmommy hates seeing him and being reminded that her husband cheated on her (I realize that this makes him a half-elf born of an elf and human, somewhat unusual in Eberron, where most half-elves have half-elf parents, grandparents, etc, but whatever). These aren't supposed to be powerful dukes of large regions, or anything: I want his dad to be the lord of, maybe, a burgh of 5,000-15,000 people or so: bigger than a village, but still rather pastoral. My GM suggested that Thrane or Aundair would be the best backgrounds for him. Also, my character is supposed to come from a vaguely Gallic background (e.g. he comes from the town of Alvegny, he's named Jean-Paul d'Alvegny, his elven father is named Jacques Goreaux, etc). Do you think Aundair would be the best country of origin for him, or what? Thanks. EDIT: I just realized that I posted this on a general character development board, not an Eberron-specific character development board. I got confused, because I got here via the Eberron boards portal. Anyway, any help is still welcome, but I think I'll also split this message in two and post the "what Silver Flame rituals can I give my character" part in the "Magic, Deities, and Cosmology" board and the "what's a good feudal background" in the "People and Places" board.
Good Agnostic 11-25-05, 06:22 PM	There really haven't been any official supplements regarding the rituals of any of the Eberron faiths. I will say, however, that many people see the Silver Flame as a not so disguised knock off of the Catholic Church. Talk to your DM. I'd rule that if you wanted, you could just pick whatever rituals of the medieval Catholic Church and use them. Priests take vows of chastity and poverty. They pray alot. They tithe. They know all the saints and pray to them for specifics. They comfort the sick and dying. They perform rituals such as mass and the seven sacraments (baptism, first communion, confirmation, marriage, ordination, eucharist, last rites). They talk about God all the time - weaving Him into all kinds of discussions, etc. So, the recovering badboy will assume all of these affectations, even though his heart isn't really into yet. Talking about God, going to the orphanage, visiting the sick, praying by their bedside, etc. When does he go from LN to LG? What is his trigger? There are lots of possibilities. Hope your DM has fun with it, because you sound like a great player.
JulesCARV 12-07-05, 01:46 AM	Thank you for your reply, Good Agnostic. I found out what the trigger was tonight. After an unpleasant shifter attack, Jean-Paul Alvegny (not D'Alvegny, because that would make him dragonmarked, someone in another forum told me, and he's not) was lying on the ground with -1 hp, unconscious, and our goblin ninja (variant of rogue, I think), Likha, was at -7 hp or something. None of our other party members could really heal, and our artificer's magic wand (which could cast magic missile OR cure light wounds at 1d4 + 1 healing or damage, but he had to roll a d100 and get over 20 or something to get the right one) wasn't working. So the DM pulled a little Deus Ex Machina, and had Tira Miron visit me while I was unconscious, and she showed me how I wasn't really following the Silver Flame, because I was focused on my own pride, purity, and righteousness, rather than doing good selflessly for its own sake. At first, I had JP argue with her, but then realize that that was exactly the pride she was referring to. JP then realized that he couldn't really redeem himself: only the Silver Flame could redeem him (note: I kinda think that the idea that none of us are good enough to really be good autonomously, and that we can only achieve goodness by surrendering ourselves to a higher power is kinda BS, but it fits my character's "rehab morality"). All his wounds were healed, his eyes (temporarily) glowed with silver fire, and he temporarily gained super laying-of-hands healing powers (temporarily, because he's still level 1), which he used to save the ninja. He also shifted to LG, and became a full paladin. I think that the "redemption" story came mostly because our party was in a tight fix with two members down and dying, and JP's experience solved all those problems. Now I'm going to have to figure out how to play a paladin who's actually LG, rather than a jerk who's trying half-successfully to be good. I hadn't expected the transformation to come this soon in the game.