Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Goth 09-12-03, 09:12 PM	No flames, please, but I appreciate any comment be it a thumbs up or constructive criticism. :) Basically, I'm having trouble wrapping my mind around a good druid concept that takes the character someplace different without deviating from the fact that he is a nature lover. I came up with this. Twins, identical, were born to a noble household. While there mother was pregnant with them, the parents had the twins blessed with the flow of magic in their veins, allowing them a stronger bond with the Weave (Feat: Spell casting prodigy, this is FR setting.) The children were born, and as they grew, each began to show inclinations. One began to take to the study of the arcane, the other the study of divine powers. One loved the city, the other the wilderness... you get the idea. They hadn't begun to actually cast magic until they were 14 or so. While the arcane wanted power, and included in that was lordship of the house, the other wanted nothing to do with any of it, and would often sleep outside the estate, learning more and more about the land and the life in it. Holding the lordship of the estate and all things that go with it means being the charge (owner) of a powerful magical artifact that is a family heirloom (need to work out the details of this, but a prerequisite of using it is a LOT of caster levels before it can be used without harm.) The druidic brother had no use or desire for the thing, or the family lands, for that matter. But the arcane brother wanted both, and as quick as possible. As time went on, the arcane brother began to dabble (secretly) in the power of the undead. The family knew nothing about this, and the young man was still not far along. Still, he kept tomes that were not bought or read by his family. Tomes involving necromancy. The arcane brother also began to use his keep (allowance, more or less), saving up to buy his friends within the FireKnives. As the idea of a member in place of a noble's household was attractive to the FireKnives, they agreed to make "accidents" happen to the parents, leaving the two sons to figure out which of them would take control of the House. The druidic brother would have simply let the other have it, except that he found out about the necromantic books, and then found evidence that his brother was involved in the murder of his parents. The druidic brother had to flee, and he lived on his own for about a year, surviving on small tasks he could perform for coin, and what he could do in the wilderness. He needed more training, and aside from his anger for his parents' death, he knew he had to get the artifact from his brother before he was able to use it for evil purposes. He joined of all things, a large mercenary band, because he could learn quickly among the ranks of elder druid, and he had the power of numbers in the mercenary troupe, if his brother ever found out where he was. In essence, he is a "tarzan" type character. The young noble who wants nothing more than to live in the wilds, but must find his way back into civilization to defeat his brother. He has a wild streak in him, and it shows, but he is not the typical "draped in leafs, walking and talking with the plants, and hugging the trees type druid. He leans much more towards the animal kingdom, and patterns his attacks and philosophies off the beasts, and the wild nature of the storms. Comments are always welcome. I just wanted a sounding board on this one. Thanks.
spike spiegel 09-12-03, 11:20 PM	One question...are you starting these characters at 1st level? Just seems to me that they have already done a whole lot before every really doing anything. Just one of my pet peeves when people write this incredibly elaborate history with their characters doing all these incredible deeds when their characters are only 1st level...
Goth 09-13-03, 06:16 AM	Yes, level 1, but even though a LOT has happened to them, most of it is not really their doing, or is more prep work for later development. Case in point, the arcane brother has gotten a hold of some necromancy books, but he isn't powerful enough to use them yet, just take in some of the ABCs of necromancy. The deaths of their parents was the doing of the FireKnives, not the son. He simply made friends who knew friends, and it was to their advantage to put this kid in a place of power, since he is young, and pretty much someone they could keep in check. Both of the kids have had teachings to get them their first levels. the druid brother has been on his own for some time, but as much as he hates the idea, he can't really support himself entirely in the wild (the animals are aggressive, after all. He's supported himself by working odd jobs and the like. So, really, even though the events have been going on for some time, all their achievements are due to personality and non-class actions so to speak, not levels.
Kharne 09-13-03, 10:41 PM	Sounds like an interesting concept Goth. Are you playing 3.0 or 3.5? If 3.5, you might want to make a tweak to Spellcasting Prodigy so that it doesn't give you the benefit of one feat (Spell Focus) in all schools rather than just 1 AND add to the spells per day of the character. The way my group has balanced it out is to have it effect only spells per day and have no effect on DCs. What about having the arcane brother tap the Shadow Weave rather than it merely being necromantic? One thing it might be good for you to go ahead thinking about is whether your character would feel the responsibility to take up the mantle of rulership once his brother has been defeated. It might be something worth playing out as the game progresses since the character would probably realize that the people his parents ruled would turn to him for guidance as the next in line and the person who saved them. Alternatively, if you wanted the character to not have to worry about the leadership, it might be worthwhile to have the parents indisposed rather than dead. It might be interesting if the Fireknives simply took the parents and are keeping them as insurance in case their pawn ever gets out of line (they could remove him and return the parents to the throne). Anyway...i'm starting to ramble...really i'm just spit-balling here. I think you realized that you had a pretty well thought out concept before you came here but wanted to at least give you the 2 cents you were asking for ;)
Goth 09-14-03, 07:18 AM	Kharne, Thanks for the input. Really, you gave the sort of advice I was looking for. Yes, I thought the character through, but honestly, I've never played a class that has an alignment restriction, and a certain mentality, and frankly, I've already had to discard two ideas because they just didn't seem right for a druid (First idea, he was bedine; wouldn't exactly sit well with magic with the background I gave him. Second idea was to add the Feral template. Bad idea. I didn't want the villagers hunting him everytime he tried to walk into the local tavern. heheh.) It's very hard to make a druid I would want to play. I like the concept of being a force of nature. I have a problem with the mentality that comes with the class. Seems ... restricting, for lack of a better word for it, having to take up the "forest protector who wears leaves and would rather hug a tree than a human" attitude, and only that attitude. So, I ran this idea here as sort of a check, to make sure I'm not stepping out of the bounds of what a druid is. Could you explain a bit more about the Spell Casting Prodigy thing? Was there errata that I wasn't aware of, or is there some sort of trick to alter it some? The Shadow Weave is a great idea. I'll look into it more. The reason I thought about necromancy is for the whole Life vs. Death Theme, which I will probably keep, but as a whole, my group has never explored the Shadow Weave concept. I will probably see about working that in, now that it's been brought to mind. :) As for the idea of taking up the mantle of leadership, that's something I'm looking forward to exploring with this guy. :)
Kharne 09-14-03, 06:52 PM	It doesn't seem in the least to me that you are stepping out of bounds at all on what a Druid is like. I can generally get my mind around any of the classes...but druid really seems to give me trouble as well. The one time I played a druid...I made my character a worshipper of Chauntea so that I could have him be trying to straddle the line between working the land and leaving as it is and straddling the line between people and nature. I think i'm probably way to much of a people person to really comprehend the concept behind the hard-core druids :P I hadn't caught on to your life vs death theme...but I really like it. It could really work quite well and brings just a bit more to the behind-the-scenes part of the game for you and your fellow gamers to appreciate. As far as my comments about Spellcasting Prodigy...it really depends on whether you are playing 3.0 or 3.5. In 3.0 Spellcasting Prodigy gave you a net of +1 DC to spells from all of your schools and bonus spells as if your int/wis/chr were two points higher. Compared to 3.0 Spell Focus, where you recieved a +2 DC to only one school of spells, it may or may not be balanced. I definitely believe that it was a bit unbalanced since, in my opinion, the +1 DC in all schools is so much better than the +2 DC in one school...not to mention the bonus spells. Heh, this may or may not apply to sorcerers...since they often focus on one school anyway. ;) In 3.5, the Spell Focus feat only gives you a +1 to DCs from one school...the +1 to DCs in all schools from Spellcasting Prodigy is, in my opinion, obviously imbalanced...and then you tack the bonus spells onto this...it is just too much. Removing the bonus spells wouldn't balance the feats at all considering the +1DC to ONE school vs +1 DC to ALL schools is where the feat balance breaks down here. The way that my group has balanced Spellcasting Prodigy with 3.5 is to remove the bonus to DCs from the feat. The character will still recieve the bonus spells as if their spellcasting stat is two points higher...reflecting an innate talent at whatever type of magic the character uses. Well, hope this jumble of comments makes sense...let me know if it doesn't :cool:
Goth 09-15-03, 09:45 PM	Whoah. Really, I didn't even think to compare those two feats. That really is unbalanced in either versions, unless you consider that they stack. Some feats seem ridiculous to me, such as Great Fortitude, because you only get +2 to your con save, when you can pick a much more useful feat and get an item that raises your con by 4. (Granted, not the best option, but I consider feats precious, precious commodities, especially after being spoiled with a fighter.) But, if someone really wanted to up their fortitude, they can pick this AND a couple of other feats, along with the items, so their save can get up there. Maybe the designers meant the feat with that in mind. That being said, I agree that in comparison, Spellcasting Prodigy FAR outdoes Focus. Anyway, thanks for clearing that up, friend. And again, thanks for the input. :) By the way, I wonder if there's ANYONE who's taken a feat that raises hitpoints, and hitpoints alone. heheh
Kharne 09-16-03, 12:38 AM	Toughness? Heh, noone in our group ever took it before we house ruled it to +1 hit point/level and even then, only one person has taken it. Then again...I haven't seen a Dwarven Defender come out of my players yet either :P
Morka 09-16-03, 10:06 AM	Reminds me of the story of the Iron Mask. You know, when the king Louis XIV was replaced by his twin brother Philippe? A little suggestion for the "arcane brother": since he studied hard while the "nature brother" was wandering in the forest, he could very well be 3 level higher. Perhaps powerful enough to control the dead body of his father... I don't know the nobility rules in this region, perhaps you only need to kill the father, and play the mother as a dumb woman who protect the arcane brother because he is probe, compared to the more chaotic "nature brother"...