Balance Me! a Spell Point Dillema [Archive] - Wizards Community

Balance Me! a Spell Point Dillema [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
dragoonmac
06-01-07, 08:02 PM So, for my homebrew campaign setting I'm planning on using a variant on the spell points system, found here http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/spellPoints.htm

Now, that seems all right and good but I have a problem. I want to use a "Mana Die" to determine the amount of spell points a caster gets each level (modified by their key ability modifier). With no limits on spells per day however, this system gets bogged down quickly (even using a d8 for prime casters, d6 for hybrids, d4 for classes that get access to spells at later levels). Low levels get way more spells than can be healthy, while it does eventually balance at high levels.

The system I came up with to attempt to balance this was
0 Level - 1
1 Level - 5
2 Level - 15
3 Level - 30
4 Level - 40
5 Level - 55
6 Level - 70
7 Level - 80
8 Level - 90
9 Level - 100

but, that leads to a new problem. It balances well at low levels, but at high levels (18-20) it is exceedingly difficult to cast high level spells, unless there is a possibly unhealthy amount of powergaming on each classes key ability.

So, anyone have a better idea?
Cinanev
06-02-07, 05:38 AM Let's see how Mana Die would work as compared to the existing system.

Get Mana Die for each level advance plus ability modifier. Normally this would be a set point progression based on character level plus bonus from spell levels gained. A prime caster gets a d8 per level and say has a +2 modifier for 1d8+2 per level. At level 1 this gives him say 10 points and then an average of 6 points each level up for 10-16-22-28-34-40-46-53-60-63 for levels 1 through 10 (min 46 maximum 107, up to 200+ max spell points by level 20). Normally the same character would get 2-4-7-11-16-24-33-44-56-72 without getting bonuses from additional spell levels gained which could easily double this (and push well over 300-400 points by level 20).

That would indicate that Mana Die can work, but with some modifications to spell costs to balance low to high. Although this puts the Mana Die castor at about half the spell points he would have had he used the standard spell points variant. Maybe upping to d10/d8/d6 or even d12/d8/d6 Mana Die... I am assuming that the rest of the spell point rules would othewise be followed.

Spell Cost:
0 Level - 1
1 Level - 3
2 Level - 5
3 Level - 7
4 Level - 9
5 Level - 11
6 Level - 13
7 Level - 15
8 Level - 17
9 Level - 19

This means a level 1 wizard would be able to cast 10 cantrips (0-level) or 3 spells (1-level) or 4 cantrips and 2 spells which roughly matches what he should be able to do anyway under the standard rules or even the spell point variant, and it doesn't penalize high spell level casting too much.
Lina_Inverse
06-08-07, 06:13 AM Don't use a mana die. The fact we roll hitpoints is bad enough.

Imagine being the wizard who rolled 1 at every level.
Rhialto
06-11-07, 09:42 AM Don't use a mana die. The fact we roll hitpoints is bad enough.

Imagine being the wizard who rolled 1 at every level.

You could always ask your GM to let you rename him to Rincewind.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
dragoonmac 06-01-07, 08:02 PM	So, for my homebrew campaign setting I'm planning on using a variant on the spell points system, found here http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/magic/spellPoints.htm Now, that seems all right and good but I have a problem. I want to use a "Mana Die" to determine the amount of spell points a caster gets each level (modified by their key ability modifier). With no limits on spells per day however, this system gets bogged down quickly (even using a d8 for prime casters, d6 for hybrids, d4 for classes that get access to spells at later levels). Low levels get way more spells than can be healthy, while it does eventually balance at high levels. The system I came up with to attempt to balance this was 0 Level - 1 1 Level - 5 2 Level - 15 3 Level - 30 4 Level - 40 5 Level - 55 6 Level - 70 7 Level - 80 8 Level - 90 9 Level - 100 but, that leads to a new problem. It balances well at low levels, but at high levels (18-20) it is exceedingly difficult to cast high level spells, unless there is a possibly unhealthy amount of powergaming on each classes key ability. So, anyone have a better idea?
Cinanev 06-02-07, 05:38 AM	Let's see how Mana Die would work as compared to the existing system. Get Mana Die for each level advance plus ability modifier. Normally this would be a set point progression based on character level plus bonus from spell levels gained. A prime caster gets a d8 per level and say has a +2 modifier for 1d8+2 per level. At level 1 this gives him say 10 points and then an average of 6 points each level up for 10-16-22-28-34-40-46-53-60-63 for levels 1 through 10 (min 46 maximum 107, up to 200+ max spell points by level 20). Normally the same character would get 2-4-7-11-16-24-33-44-56-72 without getting bonuses from additional spell levels gained which could easily double this (and push well over 300-400 points by level 20). That would indicate that Mana Die can work, but with some modifications to spell costs to balance low to high. Although this puts the Mana Die castor at about half the spell points he would have had he used the standard spell points variant. Maybe upping to d10/d8/d6 or even d12/d8/d6 Mana Die... I am assuming that the rest of the spell point rules would othewise be followed. Spell Cost: 0 Level - 1 1 Level - 3 2 Level - 5 3 Level - 7 4 Level - 9 5 Level - 11 6 Level - 13 7 Level - 15 8 Level - 17 9 Level - 19 This means a level 1 wizard would be able to cast 10 cantrips (0-level) or 3 spells (1-level) or 4 cantrips and 2 spells which roughly matches what he should be able to do anyway under the standard rules or even the spell point variant, and it doesn't penalize high spell level casting too much.
Lina_Inverse 06-08-07, 06:13 AM	Don't use a mana die. The fact we roll hitpoints is bad enough. Imagine being the wizard who rolled 1 at every level.
Rhialto 06-11-07, 09:42 AM	Don't use a mana die. The fact we roll hitpoints is bad enough. Imagine being the wizard who rolled 1 at every level. You could always ask your GM to let you rename him to Rincewind.